| schestowitz |
see you. |
Jun 04 11:41 |
| ZiggyFish |
schestowitz: before he sent them to me he did ask if, openoffice could read them. |
Jun 04 11:41 |
| ZiggyFish |
PetoKraus: see ya |
Jun 04 11:42 |
| schestowitz |
This puts burden on OOo devs to do MOOX instead of adding new features. |
Jun 04 11:42 |
| schestowitz |
That’s what IBM warned about too. |
Jun 04 11:42 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft: “let everyone run after us. We’ll just INNOV~1″ |
Jun 04 11:43 |
| ZiggyFish |
lol |
Jun 04 11:43 |
| ZiggyFish |
schestowitz: I must use that on the forums I go to. |
Jun 04 11:44 |
| schestowitz |
OOXML? |
Jun 04 11:45 |
| ZiggyFish |
schestowitz: I do a lot of hobby OS development  |
Jun 04 11:45 |
| schestowitz |
Ah, OK. |
Jun 04 11:45 |
| ZiggyFish |
no the ‘Microsoft: “let everyone run after us. We’ll just INNOV~1″‘ line |
Jun 04 11:45 |
| schestowitz |
Well, it’s true that Microsoft just catches up in reality: hypervisors, word processors (before domination), browsers. They are also IPocrites. They used to whine about swpatents. |
Jun 04 11:46 |
| ZiggyFish |
the current sig is: Rule one when dealing with Microsoft, they’re lying and while you’re listening to the their lies your attention is being diverted while they burn down your house and kidnap your children. |
Jun 04 11:47 |
| ZiggyFish |
schestowitz: yeah. And they do in it such a way that people think that it’s their innverations |
Jun 04 11:48 |
| schestowitz |
Well, XBox burned some houses down (one recently) and Gates had to attend a testimony |
Jun 04 11:49 |
| schestowitz |
One incident claims that a baby was killed by this. |
Jun 04 11:49 |
| ZiggyFish |
lol. |
Jun 04 11:49 |
| schestowitz |
People have short memory spans. Young people know nothing. My brother things that the window UI thingie is all Windows and Microsoft and everything else is a ripoff. |
Jun 04 11:51 |
| schestowitz |
Office suies? They are all “Microsoft Office clones”, apparently. |
Jun 04 11:51 |
| schestowitz |
suites |
Jun 04 11:51 |
| ZiggyFish |
lol, well he got one part right, Microsoft is a ripoff |
Jun 04 11:51 |
| schestowitz |
I’ll be off for a few moments. Just posting many links in BN.com |
Jun 04 11:52 |
| ZiggyFish |
oh, k, it’s 9pm here, so I’ll be off soon |
Jun 04 11:52 |
| schestowitz |
Australia? |
Jun 04 11:54 |
| ZiggyFish |
yeah |
Jun 04 11:54 |
| ZiggyFish |
Queensland to be exact |
Jun 04 11:54 |
| schestowitz |
Cool. |
Jun 04 11:55 |
| ZiggyFish |
anyway I’m off for the night. see ya |
Jun 04 11:56 |
| *akf (i=akf@unaffiliated/akf) has joined #boycottnovell |
Jun 04 11:59 |
| schestowitz |
hey, akf. |
Jun 04 11:59 |
| *akf is just listening… |
Jun 04 12:00 |
| schestowitz |
I’m about to post a big bunch of links. Some big wins for us. |
Jun 04 12:00 |
| akf |
heard about Vienna, as it seems they dump GNU/Linux for Vista, just because of one single program |
Jun 04 12:04 |
| schestowitz |
4 migrations in Germany though. |
Jun 04 12:12 |
| schestowitz |
Vista’s successor was almost called Vienna, IIRC. |
Jun 04 12:12 |
| PetoKraus |
akf: what is the one single program? |
Jun 04 12:13 |
| schestowitz |
This news about Vienna goes back months ago _in a sense_. Someone up there might be cosy with Redmond. |
Jun 04 12:13 |
| akf |
the articles don’t say which program, but only that it just runs with IE  |
Jun 04 12:14 |
| schestowitz |
IE works in GNU/Linux ‘better’ than on Windows. Multiple versions at the same time even. Never tried it. |
Jun 04 12:15 |
| schestowitz |
Speaking of which, it’s suspected that in the Czech Republic Microsoft gave the government discounts in exchange for the OOXML vote change. |
Jun 04 12:19 |
| PetoKraus |
that’s old news, isn’t it |
Jun 04 12:20 |
| schestowitz |
Sort of. I found this out in a press release (the smoking gun) a week ago and sent it also to PJ who wrote an article. |
Jun 04 12:23 |
| PetoKraus |
it’s funny to see what two target groups use ubuntu |
Jun 04 12:40 |
| PetoKraus |
beginners, and power-users, who don’t need something more configurable, but stable working running system without much hassle. |
Jun 04 12:41 |
| ZiggyFish |
anyway see ya all tomorrow |
Jun 04 12:49 |
| *ZiggyFish has quit (”Ex-Chat”) |
Jun 04 12:49 |
| schestowitz |
I don’t know if power users prefer Ubuntu. If I had more CDs lying about, then my home PC would run something else. Before the Novell deal it has SuSE on it. |
Jun 04 12:58 |
| PetoKraus |
i am talking about the users of ubuntu |
Jun 04 13:00 |
| PetoKraus |
what i mean, if all power-users used ubuntu, there won’t be any gentoo, or slackware, right? |
Jun 04 13:00 |
| PetoKraus |
why do you think ASUS picked Xandros? |
Jun 04 13:03 |
| PetoKraus |
i mean, when they wanted patent covered distro, there’s still SuSE |
Jun 04 13:03 |
| schestowitz |
Get a load of this: http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary… |
Jun 04 13:13 |
| schestowitz |
I don’t know why Xandros was chosen, but like Ubuntu it uses Debian. |
Jun 04 13:14 |
| schestowitz |
Asus doesn’t pay Microsoft (yet), Xandros told me |
Jun 04 13:14 |
| *baijum has quit (”Ex-Chat”) |
Jun 04 13:17 |
| PetoKraus |
nice! |
Jun 04 13:19 |
| *jbh has quit (”leaving”) |
Jun 04 13:22 |
| cyberorg |
schestowitz, you must consider putting opensuse 11.0 in it, we(community) work really hard on it |
Jun 04 13:27 |
| cyberorg |
boycott sled if you wish  |
Jun 04 13:28 |
| schestowitz |
I know. |
Jun 04 13:30 |
| schestowitz |
That’s why I try to occasionally show the positives of OpenSUSE (on Saturdays), hoping that the developers will disengage from the Novell deal, even if it means forking the Novell project. The bright side of it is that OSUSE devs help other distros too. |
Jun 04 13:32 |
| schestowitz |
As it stands, Microsoft has already sunk its teeth onto OpenSUSE. Watch the analysis of the pledge from last year (on Groklaw). They just want “brains for sale”. |
Jun 04 13:32 |
| cyberorg |
schestowitz, our concentration is to create really great distro for users and the one that we enjoy using, and we are bunch of really nice people you know  |
Jun 04 13:33 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, but legal stuff won’t escape you. |
Jun 04 13:33 |
| cyberorg |
so far i haven’t been approached by anything M$ |
Jun 04 13:33 |
| cyberorg |
as long as there are stuff that is GPL and things are open source it wont bother us |
Jun 04 13:34 |
| schestowitz |
Stallman once said: “Geeks like to think that they can ignore politics, you can leave politics alone, but politics won’t leave you alone.” |
Jun 04 13:34 |
| schestowitz |
Same with lawyers, and I am not one. |
Jun 04 13:35 |
| cyberorg |
no matter what anyone does politics has been around for a very long time and is going to be there, so we’ll just get on with what we do best |
Jun 04 13:37 |
| PetoKraus |
schestowitz: i like the part on gentoo, in that report |
Jun 04 13:39 |
| *pinkstormtrooper (i=pinkstor@gateway/tor/x-1ac3028c039eaf04) has joined #boycottnovell |
Jun 04 13:44 |
| schestowitz |
cyberorg, I agree, but keep an eye on Novell because they want to use Microsoft to take control. Let me find you a must-read. |
Jun 04 13:44 |
| PetoKraus |
:D |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
fuck anyone who sides with microsoft |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| schestowitz |
http://www.groklaw.net/articlebasic.ph… Internalise the bits further down. |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| schestowitz |
Watch the language please. |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
ballmer is one example of the mind fuck corporations use to perpetuate their consolidation |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth! |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
they use humor and eccentricity to hide the truth!!!!! |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| PetoKraus |
uhm |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
why? |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
is it past the ballmer bedtime? |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| PetoKraus |
there is one twitter on facebook |
Jun 04 13:45 |
| PetoKraus |
you remind me of him |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| PetoKraus |
*slashdot |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
perhaps it’s time for some egg mcmuffins and cozy lizard night hats? |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
fuck facebook |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
bunch of people throwing away their privacy to cia |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
just like myspace |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
fucking sheep |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| PetoKraus |
nice to meet you, i think |
Jun 04 13:46 |
| cozub |
wtf? |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
they all have the IQs of anally raped llamas with chicken feet |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
I spit on microsoft |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
schestowitz is it true you’re joining microsoft? |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| schestowitz |
No. |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
I heard you were baiting MS to show them your marketing skills |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| cozub |
rotfl ) |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
so you could be hired by them and reap the benefits of a ballmer french kiss and pelvis thrust |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| PetoKraus |
was there a rumour saying that? |
Jun 04 13:47 |
| cozub |
I think pinkstormtrooper just went bananas |
Jun 04 13:48 |
| PetoKraus |
i’d love to read it |
Jun 04 13:48 |
| schestowitz |
I wonder if it’s the same person who was here on Monday to poison the well. |
Jun 04 13:48 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
I bet the drool pools at ballmer’s feet when his lizard head penis slides out, the size of a small, annoying canary, with the fragrance of kelp. I bet his eyes roll back and his tongue turns into an omlette textured slipper shaped widget while his voice turns metallic and his pelvis turns black while his penis shoots out a cloud of silverfish |
Jun 04 13:49 |
| schestowitz |
They occasionally get them in /. and Groklaw too. |
Jun 04 13:49 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
that’s what I bet |
Jun 04 13:49 |
| schestowitz |
pinkstormtrooper, you’re just here to troll, methinks. |
Jun 04 13:49 |
| cozub |
schestowitz: the style looks similar |
Jun 04 13:49 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
schestowitz, no I am a keeper of the faith |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| schestowitz |
I know. |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
but I had to joke about you once schestowitz |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| cozub |
that being said, IRC is full of weirdos (just look at me )… |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
to test the water |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| schestowitz |
Please speak politely then. |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, you like my style? |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, kneel before me then |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, worship now at 1/2 the price |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| cozub |
pinkstormtrooper: don’t exaggerate |
Jun 04 13:50 |
| cozub |
or kick your butt for free… |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
ok schestowitz |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
sorry for being a nigger |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
I can’t help it |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
it’s my nigger nature |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, halos form around every body part of mine |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, they extend to the heights and the depths |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| schestowitz |
We’ll have to ban you. |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| cozub |
schestowitz: it might be time to terminate him |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
cozub, you humans are creatures of filth |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
every single human |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
filthy rotten greasy humans |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| cozub |
lol |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on pinkstormtroope!*@* |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
see how they leak |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| pinkstormtrooper |
aren’t they leaky? |
Jun 04 13:51 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!i=pinkstor@*gateway/tor/x-1ac3028c039eaf04 |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| *schestowitz has kicked pinkstormtrooper from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| *jbh (n=jonharpe@c-75-69-164-155.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| *akf dankt |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| jbh |
ubuntu is shipping a lot of kernel updates lately |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| jbh |
seems like every day I have to reboot |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| *cyberorg (n=cyberorg@opensuse/member/Cyberorg) has left #boycottnovell (”Leaving”) |
Jun 04 13:52 |
| PetoKraus |
on /. it’s not occasionally |
Jun 04 13:53 |
| schestowitz |
The trolling? They cleaned up in 2006 |
Jun 04 13:53 |
| schestowitz |
If people shove the homophobic stuff, the necrophilia, the ugly pictures and insult people, then they dissipate it all. |
Jun 04 13:54 |
| schestowitz |
They do plenty of that in COLA, which is unmoderated. |
Jun 04 13:54 |
| jbh |
that’s why I don’t do newsgroups anymore |
Jun 04 13:55 |
| jbh |
so few people continue these days anyway, they’ve moved on to other forms of communication |
Jun 04 13:55 |
| schestowitz |
Recently they began exposing people’s addresses and phone numbers out in public, then attacked them with slander in the header (subject lines). It’s a form of intimidation. |
Jun 04 13:56 |
| jbh |
typically ones that are or can be moderated |
Jun 04 13:56 |
| schestowitz |
And BTW, some of them are associated with Microsoft. Some are former Microsoft employees or partners. It’s gross. |
Jun 04 13:57 |
| jbh |
http://gburt.blogspot.com/20… |
Jun 04 13:58 |
| jbh |
that makes me laugh |
Jun 04 13:58 |
| jbh |
I should probably stop aggregating planetgnome |
Jun 04 13:58 |
| schestowitz |
Some time ago I noticed they want to make it a video player as well. |
Jun 04 13:58 |
| schestowitz |
The trouble would be DRM+Mono(Banshee ) on people’s PCs. |
Jun 04 13:59 |
| jbh |
yea, I saw that too |
Jun 04 13:59 |
| PetoKraus |
banshee? isn’t that the mono flagship useless app? |
Jun 04 13:59 |
| schestowitz |
It’s a bit like the urgency list / priorities of the FSF. In this case it’s a question of what needs swapping with a Mono equiv. |
Jun 04 13:59 |
| jbh |
what frustrates me most is that most of my friends use banshee |
Jun 04 14:00 |
| schestowitz |
OpenSUSE installer: “Please select one from: 1) KDE; 2) KDE4; 3) GNOME; 4)MONOME” |
Jun 04 14:01 |
| jbh |
hah |
Jun 04 14:01 |
| PetoKraus |
why would you use banshee |
Jun 04 14:02 |
| PetoKraus |
there are such good alternatives |
Jun 04 14:02 |
| jbh |
yea, I use rythmbox |
Jun 04 14:02 |
| PetoKraus |
Amarok. Rhythmbox. that E-something done in python |
Jun 04 14:03 |
| PetoKraus |
and finally Quodlibet |
Jun 04 14:03 |
| schestowitz |
I’m on XMMS and Amarok (work and home, respectively) |
Jun 04 14:03 |
| jbh |
I used to use xmms, and still do on occassion |
Jun 04 14:03 |
| jbh |
but I have problems with utf8 filenames |
Jun 04 14:04 |
| jbh |
with xmms |
Jun 04 14:04 |
| schestowitz |
Just in: “Novell joins Microsoft in Anti-Linux FUD” ( http://alexvalentine.org/?p=594 ) |
Jun 04 14:04 |
| PetoKraus |
exaile |
Jun 04 14:04 |
| jbh |
hah |
Jun 04 14:06 |
| schestowitz |
“unpaid Linux” |
Jun 04 14:06 |
| schestowitz |
“Blech! Those nasty cheap thingies” |
Jun 04 14:06 |
| schestowitz |
Susan Hauser spouted out that FUD in OStatic last week. |
Jun 04 14:07 |
| schestowitz |
They try to ‘tame’ the GNU. Pay up now (for patents, to Microsoft). |
Jun 04 14:07 |
| PetoKraus |
duh i see a project |
Jun 04 14:08 |
| PetoKraus |
let’s make paid phone support |
Jun 04 14:08 |
| PetoKraus |
generic, for linux |
Jun 04 14:08 |
| schestowitz |
That already exists. |
Jun 04 14:08 |
| PetoKraus |
good |
Jun 04 14:09 |
| schestowitz |
That’s why it’s FUD |
Jun 04 14:09 |
| Eruaran |
hello |
Jun 04 14:09 |
| schestowitz |
It’s also why there’s money in Free software. Microsoft’s profits are nothing compared to that of its ecosystem as a whole, including all the malware ‘experts’. |
Jun 04 14:09 |
| Eruaran |
Does the Suse that Novell distributes still default to KDE ? |
Jun 04 14:10 |
| schestowitz |
Hi <Eruaran> |
Jun 04 14:10 |
| Eruaran |
hi |
Jun 04 14:10 |
| schestowitz |
No, it has a triange for choice. |
Jun 04 14:10 |
| jbh |
did it ever default to kde? |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| schestowitz |
I can find you a screenshot if you want. They try to make it an equal treatment for the DEs. |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| Eruaran |
cause if its not already KDE 4 will soon be GPLv3 |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| schestowitz |
jbh: yes. |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| Eruaran |
And Microsoft participates in the distribution of Suse |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| schestowitz |
SUSE was (almost) all KDE in the past |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| jbh |
I meant after novell purchased suse |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| jbh |
not before |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| schestowitz |
Novell never talks to clients about GPLv3 |
Jun 04 14:11 |
| schestowitz |
Pj jokes about it. |
Jun 04 14:12 |
| PetoKraus |
lol, roy, did you read the last comment? |
Jun 04 14:12 |
| schestowitz |
Novell will just try to hide the long-term issues associated with choosing Ballnux |
Jun 04 14:12 |
| PetoKraus |
http://alexvalentine.org/?p=594#comment-61198 |
Jun 04 14:12 |
| schestowitz |
I haven’t, yet. |
Jun 04 14:12 |
| Eruaran |
If Microsoft remains involved in the distribution of Suse and Suse goes KDE 4.1, Microsoft won’t be able to rattle the patent sabre |
Jun 04 14:13 |
| schestowitz |
GNOME came about to the installer and SLED around 2005 (late 2005, IIRC). |
Jun 04 14:13 |
| Eruaran |
And a Suse without KDE isn’t Suse any more |
Jun 04 14:13 |
| schestowitz |
The comment: ‘When your boss asks “what’s the status of situation-x” it’s always easier to say “I have placed a call to Novell support and they are looking into it” than say “I checked the online forums and I have no idea what’s going on”.’ |
Jun 04 14:14 |
| schestowitz |
I think it’s more complicated with KDE/GNOME. |
Jun 04 14:15 |
| schestowitz |
It’ll take a while for KDE to go GPLv3 wholly. There are many non-KDE packages as well. |
Jun 04 14:15 |
| schestowitz |
IANAL. |
Jun 04 14:15 |
| Eruaran |
While the guy who is waiting for Novell support is still waiting, ubottu will already have given me enough information for me to say to the boss, “the situation will soon be history”. |
Jun 04 14:16 |
| *Eruaran looks at ficticious guy waiting for Novell support and says, “noob”. |
Jun 04 14:17 |
| schestowitz |
“Ubuntu,” said the boss, “what on earth is that?!?!?” We need a brand name. |
Jun 04 14:17 |
| *Eruaran turns back on ficticious boss and walks away… boss hears the word “noob” uttered. |
Jun 04 14:18 |
| Eruaran |
:P |
Jun 04 14:18 |
| schestowitz |
Coupons and brochures. The suits dig coupons and brochures. |
Jun 04 14:18 |
| schestowitz |
Must have paper for intangible assets (read: imaginary property) |
Jun 04 14:19 |
| Eruaran |
It may take a while for all of KDE to go GPLv3, but sooner or later Novell and Microsoft will be left out in the cold. |
Jun 04 14:20 |
| jbh |
doesn’t the gpl3 have a clause that allows novell to ship gpl3 anyway? |
Jun 04 14:21 |
| Eruaran |
Its the only protection from poison patent bombs. |
Jun 04 14:21 |
| schestowitz |
Novell is getting weaker. Some readers in Linux Today say so too, so it will end up having less influence. The days of Linspire seem numbered (someone who knows the management there thinks so). |
Jun 04 14:21 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, jbh, that’s what I thought too, but PJ insists otherwise. |
Jun 04 14:22 |
| jbh |
ah |
Jun 04 14:22 |
| schestowitz |
And the GLLv3 too is no cure for patent trolls, some of whom Microsoft has (Nathan Myrvold and others) |
Jun 04 14:22 |
| jbh |
I’d be surprised if opensuse11 didn’t have gpl3 software |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| Eruaran |
Novell is a pariah in the community… unless you’re Miguel de Icaza and friends… but they’re living in a land of fairies and a benevolent harmless fluffy cuddly Ballmerization |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| schestowitz |
There’s no ‘IP condom’ as long as that disease called swpatents is out there. |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| Eruaran |
At least it has a clause which can be argued in court |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| schestowitz |
OpenOffice 3.0 (nightly and beta) is LGPLv3 |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| Eruaran |
Which M$ knows about |
Jun 04 14:23 |
| Eruaran |
M$ knows that legal action over patents whilst remaining involved in the distribution of GPLv3 code is a violation, and their huff and puff wont change that. |
Jun 04 14:25 |
| schestowitz |
They don’t need legal action though. They have a stick to wave and some trolls, just in case they need them (and can hide the money trail). They failed with SCO. |
Jun 04 14:25 |
| Eruaran |
If they claim the simply don’t recognize it, then we can all claim we simply don’t recognize Microsoft’s EULA’s. |
Jun 04 14:26 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft would laugh. |
Jun 04 14:26 |
| Eruaran |
So would Eben Moglen |
Jun 04 14:26 |
| schestowitz |
Watch how it snubbed the FSF around July last year, thinking that it’s above the law and GPLv3 does not apply to it. |
Jun 04 14:26 |
| Eruaran |
Probably becuase they believe no one can last enough round with them in court. |
Jun 04 14:27 |
| Eruaran |
*rounds |
Jun 04 14:28 |
| Eruaran |
But Ballmer is a king who must pay his subjects to wave the flag. |
Jun 04 14:28 |
| Eruaran |
That is why they will fail. |
Jun 04 14:28 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft is very hubris-infected. Asay spoke to them and sort of told me. Ballmer is a lost cause. The man is MAD. |
Jun 04 14:28 |
| schestowitz |
Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| Eruaran |
I noticed the deal with HP over Windows Live Search. |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| Eruaran |
Same old same old… |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, yes. |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| schestowitz |
Mikey needs to buy some market share. |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| Eruaran |
Microsoft doesn’t know how to compete. |
Jun 04 14:29 |
| schestowitz |
“What would you like for XMas, baby Ballmer?” Ballmer: market share; f* kill Google. Please. |
Jun 04 14:30 |
| Eruaran |
It only knows to look for a way to monopolize, to leverage its market share on the desktop. |
Jun 04 14:30 |
| schestowitz |
Bill Gates: “”Microsoft looks at new ideas, they don’t evaluate whether the idea will move the industry forward, they ask, ‘how will it help us sell more copies of Windows?’”" |
Jun 04 14:31 |
| Eruaran |
Once upon a time it might mean something… but today this latest move looks rather Mikey Mouse… do they really think a deal with HP to make WLS default on HP’s PC’s will make headway against Google ? |
Jun 04 14:31 |
| Eruaran |
Well they dropped the ball with Vista |
Jun 04 14:32 |
| schestowitz |
H-P is part of the Trust. |
Jun 04 14:32 |
| schestowitz |
O/ses become less relevant and Microsoft knows it. |
Jun 04 14:32 |
| schestowitz |
It wants it both ways: 1) Get Silverlight out there (Web ceases to be commodity); 2) Promote Live as a portal. |
Jun 04 14:32 |
| Eruaran |
New terms, old tricks. |
Jun 04 14:33 |
| schestowitz |
This I don’t understand: http://www.linux.com/feature/136463 So Linux.com is now promoting blobs? And Mac SDKs? |
Jun 04 14:33 |
| *Eruaran looks |
Jun 04 14:34 |
| Eruaran |
more about getting around it |
Jun 04 14:39 |
| schestowitz |
I haven’t really read it (just the bottom part on the FSF’s take) |
Jun 04 14:39 |
| schestowitz |
The mention is advertising though, no matter what it contains, IMHO. |
Jun 04 14:39 |
| schestowitz |
Remember this: Linux.com needs to give the spotlight to OHA and LiMO. |
Jun 04 14:40 |
| schestowitz |
LiMo needs devs. Android needs apps. |
Jun 04 14:40 |
| Eruaran |
I really don’t agree with developers who waste time and effort on hacking closed platforms when there are open ones available. And I think it devalues the community, which is much bigger than Apple. |
Jun 04 14:41 |
| PetoKraus |
but if you know it’s possible to have Xbox running linux, why not hack it? |
Jun 04 14:42 |
| schestowitz |
Why buy it in the first place? |
Jun 04 14:43 |
| PetoKraus |
well |
Jun 04 14:44 |
| PetoKraus |
by the time, it was nice cost-performance-noise deal |
Jun 04 14:44 |
| schestowitz |
I was told several times that even if Microsoft sells these at a loss, the sales help Microsoft because it uses it as a selling point to independent game makers (boasting high numbers) |
Jun 04 14:44 |
| PetoKraus |
i don’t have one. |
Jun 04 14:44 |
| PetoKraus |
moreover, if you get one now, it’s trough ebay mostly |
Jun 04 14:45 |
| PetoKraus |
which helps only the other guy wanting to get rid of his crappy hardware |
Jun 04 14:45 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, recycling hardware. Scares the hardware vendors, who conspired with Microsoft around Vista RTM time (Intel at the least). |
Jun 04 14:47 |
| PetoKraus |
yeah. I hate myself for buying intel |
Jun 04 14:47 |
| PetoKraus |
let’s say i was young and inexperienced |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| cozub |
well, on the other hand, intell provides decent X drivers… |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| schestowitz |
Intel is killing AMD at the moment. |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| schestowitz |
Some others rise from the east though. |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| schestowitz |
Intel is worse than Microsoft in certain ways. |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| PetoKraus |
schestowitz: but is the few percent of performance really needed? |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| schestowitz |
But people don’t see and /use/ their chips, so they can’t understand it. |
Jun 04 14:48 |
| schestowitz |
Price-fixing has gone on for ages. |
Jun 04 14:49 |
| schestowitz |
For servers maybe. |
Jun 04 14:49 |
| PetoKraus |
opterons are GOOD |
Jun 04 14:49 |
| schestowitz |
My PCs (all of them) are around 2GHz. |
Jun 04 14:49 |
| schestowitz |
The CPU speed that is. |
Jun 04 14:49 |
| *indianwarlord (i=war@gateway/tor/x-f145b8e364ba31ab) has joined #boycottnovell |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| PetoKraus |
yep |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| Eruaran |
AMD are doing ok |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| Eruaran |
I was talking to someone from AMD last weel |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| Eruaran |
*week |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| PetoKraus |
I hope Puma will be good… |
Jun 04 14:50 |
| Eruaran |
They’re not sitting still |
Jun 04 14:51 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, but the workforce shrinks. |
Jun 04 14:51 |
| PetoKraus |
the main problem i see is |
Jun 04 14:51 |
| PetoKraus |
there was nothing new from AMD for so long |
Jun 04 14:51 |
| Eruaran |
People were predicting AMD’s doom back when Intel brought out the 486. |
Jun 04 14:52 |
| PetoKraus |
Intel has released Dual Core’s, AMD Turion’s, and then Intel Core 2 Duos and the newer Penryn Core 2 duos |
Jun 04 14:52 |
| PetoKraus |
slap me for using that ‘ |
Jun 04 14:52 |
| Eruaran |
AMD/ATI has a raft of new products coming out this year |
Jun 04 14:52 |
| PetoKraus |
yeah. That’s what i hope will be their saver |
Jun 04 14:52 |
| schestowitz |
Sadly, Novell is a pal of AMD |
Jun 04 14:54 |
| schestowitz |
They have all sorts of sponsorships and collabs’. |
Jun 04 14:54 |
| PetoKraus |
the 780 chipset is marvelous… if i was buying a machine right now, desktop, i’d definitely go for X3 phenom and that 780g chipset… |
Jun 04 14:54 |
| PetoKraus |
what can you do, roy…. |
Jun 04 14:54 |
| PetoKraus |
but they are open-sourcing the ATI chipsets… |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| Eruaran |
I think for AMD, Novell is more of a client |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| PetoKraus |
there’s limited, but functional 3D already available |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| PetoKraus |
open-sourced, i mean |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| PetoKraus |
and is developed by novell…. |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| Eruaran |
if its open it can be developed by anyone |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| indianwarlord |
FUCK YOU MICROSOFT COLLABORATORS YOU THINK YOUR HANDS ARE CLEAN BUT YOU ARE GOING TO SEE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN PEOPLE COLLABORATE WITH THE DARK ANUS OF MICROSOFT |
Jun 04 14:56 |
| *indianwarlord has quit (”Leaving”) |
Jun 04 14:57 |
| schestowitz |
Maybe the same troll? |
Jun 04 14:57 |
| Eruaran |
And drunk ? |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| PetoKraus |
there goes the tor traffic |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| schestowitz |
Maybe paid. |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| Eruaran |
Cause that wasn’t very coherent |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| *akf has quit (”leaving”) |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| schestowitz |
Poison piills. |
Jun 04 14:58 |
| Eruaran |
something funny happened today at work |
Jun 04 14:59 |
| Eruaran |
one of the guys skyped me saying ubuntu crashed after booting with new ati drivers |
Jun 04 15:00 |
| Eruaran |
then a minute later |
Jun 04 15:00 |
| Eruaran |
he skypes me again saying it wasnt the OS, his graphics card was actually a bit stuffed |
Jun 04 15:00 |
| Eruaran |
worked perfectly with a new card |
Jun 04 15:01 |
| schestowitz |
It’s easy to blame ‘foreign’ things. |
Jun 04 15:01 |
| schestowitz |
Many Linux newbies blame Linux for not working seamlessly with iPods. |
Jun 04 15:01 |
| schestowitz |
Just spotted in ZDNet Between the Lines (BTL) a short moment ago. |
Jun 04 15:02 |
| schestowitz |
“Oh noes! The winmodem! Me [sic] iPod!!111″ |
Jun 04 15:02 |
| Eruaran |
Had a customer at work who’s notbook hard drive got raped by Norton |
Jun 04 15:03 |
| Eruaran |
Nothing would read it |
Jun 04 15:03 |
| Eruaran |
But I was able to force it to mount with Kubuntu |
Jun 04 15:03 |
| Eruaran |
And got data off it |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| Eruaran |
Now he’s telling his mates that Linux saved his data |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| schestowitz |
It does /more/. Tell him. |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| Eruaran |
yes |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| schestowitz |
:-) |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| Eruaran |
I gave him the CD as well |
Jun 04 15:04 |
| schestowitz |
“Linux… it’s for servers… it’s all command-line” |
Jun 04 15:05 |
| schestowitz |
The myths that spread.. |
Jun 04 15:05 |
| Eruaran |
We counter that |
Jun 04 15:05 |
| Eruaran |
Had a guy in one day telling me some Linux myths |
Jun 04 15:05 |
| Eruaran |
I just sat there saying, ‘uh huh… hmm… uh huh’ |
Jun 04 15:06 |
| schestowitz |
There’s a danger that Novell will further change perceptions. |
Jun 04 15:06 |
| Eruaran |
the boss’s wife walked over to our demo system which was behind the guy |
Jun 04 15:06 |
| Eruaran |
And she asked me, ‘the demo has linux on it doesn’t it ?’ |
Jun 04 15:07 |
| Eruaran |
I said, ‘yep’ |
Jun 04 15:07 |
| schestowitz |
There’s “Free Linux” and then there’s “SUSE”, which you MUST have to work along with Windows. |
Jun 04 15:07 |
| schestowitz |
They already do that routine against *buntu and RHT. |
Jun 04 15:07 |
| Eruaran |
the guy turned around and saw her playing with a glorious looking desktop with compiz fusion |
Jun 04 15:08 |
| Eruaran |
on a 24″ widescreen |
Jun 04 15:08 |
| schestowitz |
That Zaharov guy from iTWire is a technical journalist and a months ago he though Linux was something you install on Windows. |
Jun 04 15:08 |
| Eruaran |
The guy must have felt like an idiot |
Jun 04 15:08 |
| Eruaran |
cause everything he said was wrong and I didnt need to say a thing |
Jun 04 15:08 |
| schestowitz |
Well, one can always downgrade to Vista and do ’slip mode’ for kicks. |
Jun 04 15:09 |
| schestowitz |
flip mode |
Jun 04 15:09 |
| Eruaran |
I wonder if Asus using Splashtop gets up Ballmers nose |
Jun 04 15:11 |
| PetoKraus |
well i hope it’ll get GPL’ed |
Jun 04 15:13 |
| schestowitz |
See this recent one: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/… |
Jun 04 15:15 |
| schestowitz |
This has been brewing for a while. |
Jun 04 15:15 |
| *Eruaran reads |
Jun 04 15:18 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft press: http://www.linux.com/feed/137230 “Mickos, who’s now senior VP in Sun’s new database group, pointed to Redmond’s work with MySQL in naming Microsoft one of three companies to receive its Partner of the Year awards.” |
Jun 04 15:18 |
| schestowitz |
Mickos could fall for it. He’s not stubborn. |
Jun 04 15:19 |
| Eruaran |
Steve Ballmer and Bill Gates even with Microsoft billions don’t have enough fingers to plug all the holes… there’s an increasing amount of water getting through that monopolistic dam… |
Jun 04 15:24 |
| Eruaran |
Microsoft’s behavour will get worse before its over |
Jun 04 15:24 |
| schestowitz |
Just found: Microsoft spreads the IP ‘love’: http://news.softpedia.com/news/The-Microsoft-… |
Jun 04 15:25 |
| schestowitz |
Well, over in the EU they have just bought themselves a big lobbyist, so I can foresee this getting ugly.. There’s hope at the end. Eben Moglen: “Everybody is connected to everybody else, all data that can be shared will be shared will be shared: get used to it.” |
Jun 04 15:27 |
| Eruaran |
you know what |
Jun 04 15:27 |
| Eruaran |
that kind of thing reminds me of IBM’s attempts to change and proprietize PC hardware all those years ago |
Jun 04 15:28 |
| Eruaran |
But its even more lame |
Jun 04 15:29 |
| Eruaran |
Since when has Microsoft ever been, “As an industry leader in the design and development of computer peripherals and accessories”… ? |
Jun 04 15:29 |
| Eruaran |
Are they talking about the MS mouse ? |
Jun 04 15:30 |
| Eruaran |
Or those ergo keyboard that nobody buys ? |
Jun 04 15:30 |
| schestowitz |
They have established this before, but not in an organised fashion. ACPI is an eye opener. Other examples are Microsoft’s attempt to keep things secret. Oh! Same with Intel BTW. |
Jun 04 15:31 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft bought them. They just rebrnad them. |
Jun 04 15:32 |
| Eruaran |
hmm… though Intel was talking up MID’s running Linux again this week |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| Eruaran |
And they’ve opened up their graphics chipset API |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| PetoKraus |
ACPI? |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| schestowitz |
Don’t confuse development with acquisitions. Google does this too. They rebranded KeyHole Google Earth and now struct around all the INNOVA~1. MS Photosynth used to be more of a Linux project. |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| schestowitz |
-struct- strut |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| schestowitz |
Wait, I’ll find it for you. |
Jun 04 15:33 |
| Eruaran |
It think ulitmately Microsoft’s screwed up hardware strategy will fail. Screwing up hardware as much as they’ve screwed up their software products in order to maintain monopolistic lock-in results in stuff that doesn’t work. |
Jun 04 15:34 |
| Eruaran |
You end up with a black box that either doesn’t do anything people want it to do, or does things badly. |
Jun 04 15:35 |
| Eruaran |
It creates complexity that puts people off. |
Jun 04 15:36 |
| Eruaran |
Look at Vista with its DRM |
Jun 04 15:36 |
| schestowitz |
I submitted this to Digg: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Newly_leake…. |
Jun 04 15:38 |
| schestowitz |
Vista is for Hollywood, not for users or developers. |
Jun 04 15:38 |
| Eruaran |
exactly |
Jun 04 15:38 |
| Eruaran |
Gates today still sounds like a certain whiny teenager who once threatened the Homebrew Computer Club with legal action over hacking BASIC which that teen claimed was his own work… |
Jun 04 15:43 |
| Eruaran |
same scenario, larger stage |
Jun 04 15:44 |
| *anivar (n=anivar@117.192.103.195) has joined #boycottnovell |
Jun 04 15:44 |
| schestowitz |
Welcome, anivar |
Jun 04 15:44 |
| Eruaran |
That little dweeby piece of pond scum has always behaved like this, and he has always hated people who give away free software. |
Jun 04 15:45 |
| anivar |
hi schestowitz |
Jun 04 15:45 |
| schestowitz |
Gates comes from a litigious family. Dad’s a lawyer, grandpa’ a senator (think lobbying). |
Jun 04 15:45 |
| Eruaran |
Hello anivar |
Jun 04 15:45 |
| anivar |
Eruaran: hello |
Jun 04 15:46 |
| anivar |
just came to know about this channel now |
Jun 04 15:46 |
| Eruaran |
:) |
Jun 04 15:47 |
| schestowitz |
It’s only a few days old. A reader insisted that we create one. |
Jun 04 15:47 |
| *anivar waiting for a call from a Business Standard journalist on OOXML happenings |
Jun 04 15:49 |
| schestowitz |
<anivar> , are you close to the incidents or testimony sources? |
Jun 04 15:50 |
| schestowitz |
We try to make public record while people remember. |
Jun 04 15:50 |
| anivar |
schestowitz: i was part of BIS datamining committee on OOXML |
Jun 04 15:51 |
| anivar |
But I dont like to make it public |
Jun 04 15:51 |
| anivar |
I always hates works with Govt |
Jun 04 15:52 |
| anivar |
It was an Old Commitee |
Jun 04 15:53 |
| schestowitz |
Have you formally complained yet? |
Jun 04 15:54 |
| anivar |
LITD 15 was the final commitee |
Jun 04 15:54 |
| anivar |
schestowitz: About what |
Jun 04 15:54 |
| anivar |
In India OOXML process is as follows |
Jun 04 15:55 |
| schestowitz |
If the intervention by the government, which as the Bombay university professor claims was caused by Microsoft, affected you, then.. |
Jun 04 15:55 |
| anivar |
No. |
Jun 04 15:55 |
| anivar |
schestowitz: The initial review as by Wordprocessing-ML subcommittee |
Jun 04 15:55 |
| schestowitz |
Microsoft filed a complaint with consumer <something>, IIRC. |
Jun 04 15:55 |
| schestowitz |
Oh, I see. |
Jun 04 15:56 |
| anivar |
The Datamining commitee reviewd it |
Jun 04 15:56 |
| anivar |
The 200 issues listed by wordprocessing commitee was approved by datamining commitee |
Jun 04 15:57 |
| schestowitz |
Yes, I remember. |
Jun 04 15:57 |
| anivar |
LITD 15 commitee approved it unanimously and Then India voted No in Fast Track Process |
Jun 04 15:57 |
| schestowitz |
They were not addressed properly in the BRM, I gather? |
Jun 04 15:57 |
| anivar |
After that Dataming commitees role was only on examining Microsoft response on issues |
Jun 04 15:58 |
| schestowitz |
Were they all satisfactory? |
Jun 04 15:58 |
| schestowitz |
Another key issue: was there sufficient time to name all issues in a very large specification? |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| anivar |
schestowitz: Microsoft replied only to some of them |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| anivar |
it was before BRM |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| schestowitz |
I understand. |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| anivar |
The reply was mainly intended for wasting our time |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| schestowitz |
Only about 20% of the issues were discussed in the BRM. |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| schestowitz |
This happened in Italy too, if I recall correctly. |
Jun 04 15:59 |
| anivar |
for a single line critique they will send a 30 page reply contains nothing |
Jun 04 16:00 |
| schestowitz |
(referring to futile responses) |
Jun 04 16:00 |
| anivar |
And After BRM around 80 issues are remaining unresolved |
Jun 04 16:00 |
| schestowitz |
What did your commitee decide? Approve? |
Jun 04 16:01 |
| anivar |
LITD committee decided to Vote No again because of this |
Jun 04 16:01 |
| schestowitz |
Okay, I understand. |
Jun 04 16:01 |
| schestowitz |
Did anyone who was affiliated with Microsoft attend? Was the committee free of conflicting interests? |
Jun 04 16:02 |
| anivar |
And I am mainly involved with Free Software community works |
Jun 04 16:02 |
| schestowitz |
There is no conflict of interests there. Free software is tied to no company. |
Jun 04 16:03 |
| schestowitz |
…Nor to a standard. |
Jun 04 16:03 |
| schestowitz |
Have the complaints from Microsoft affected your committee? |
Jun 04 16:03 |
| anivar |
Indian Process was fairly neat. But Microsoft appealed it with Government on last minute |
Jun 04 16:03 |
| anivar |
