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08.16.08

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 15th, 2008 – Part II

Posted in IRC Logs at 10:04 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz

Enter the IRC channel now

twitter It would be nice if M$ bought all the Linux companies they are ruining. Aug 15 15:02
schestowitz I’m not sure. The important thing at the time (last year) was to warn those who consider selling out. Aug 15 15:04
_Doug_ I do belive that’s the long term plan steveO has for Novell .. Aug 15 15:04
twitter Didn’t Mepis also take the M$ deal? Aug 15 15:04
twitter They have an ugly MOD to go along with that, if they did. Aug 15 15:05
schestowitz Showing them that Linspire was dying for example (someone told me this privately a long time ago) would have them scared of the ‘benefits’ of Microsoft ‘protection’. Aug 15 15:05
schestowitz MEPIS??? No. Aug 15 15:05
_Doug_ “If a guy walks into a shop and says: ‘It’s an unsafe neighborhood, why don’t you pay me 20 bucks and I’ll make sure you’re okay,’ that’s illegal. It’s racketeering” Aug 15 15:06
_Doug_ Mark Shuttleworth quote .. Aug 15 15:06
twitter Good.  This sort of confirms that.  http://www.linux-watch.com/ne… Aug 15 15:09
_Doug_ GPL defended in court Aug 15 15:09
twitter I could swear I read something. Aug 15 15:10
_Doug_ http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/2008081… Aug 15 15:10
*_Doug has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) Aug 15 15:11
twitter Funny, the article I just linked to contains that Shuttleworth quote. Aug 15 15:11
schestowitz Woodford launched his attack on the deal quietly, “I believe that Xandros can do an excellent job of representing Microsoft’s interests in the Linux market. And I’m sure that the Xandros VCs are happy with the deal they made with Microsoft.” Aug 15 15:13
_Doug_ got to step out , be back in twenty minutes Aug 15 15:13
*_Doug_ has quit () Aug 15 15:13
schestowitz Warming up to his theme, Woodford continued, “So far Microsoft hasn’t revealed any legitimate claims of intellectual property infringement. Their strategy appears to be to coerce weak players in the Open Source space to fold. This is reminiscent of the play made by SCO a few years ago, which some say was financed by Microsoft. Maybe that was just their trial run.” Aug 15 15:13
twitter It’s one thing to say that and another to stick to your guns when offered millions of dollars. Aug 15 15:16
schestowitz But he didn’t sell out, did he? Aug 15 15:16
schestowitz Microsoft paid Novell a third of a billion plus ‘benefits’ Aug 15 15:17
twitter I can’t find anything saying he sold out. Aug 15 15:18
twitter For a while, Mepis had an ugly message of the day about the GPL “oddly” restricting freedom. Aug 15 15:22
twitter It was kind of a shock because the old message was normal and nice, “The Magic of MEPIS TM Aug 15 15:23
twitter Most of the programs included with MEPIS Linux products are freely Aug 15 15:23
twitter redistributable; the exact distribution terms for each program Aug 15 15:23
twitter are described in the individual files in /usr/share/doc/*/copyright Aug 15 15:23
twitter Unless otherwise stated in an official EULA, Aug 15 15:23
twitter MEPIS Linux products come with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY, Aug 15 15:23
twitter to the extent permitted by applicable law.” Aug 15 15:23
schestowitz With brute force they can market themselves using Malda’s /. and then take Asay et al to enough free lunches and trips until they earn seats on the OSI, later to persuade companies to port/optimise for Windows. That may be the plan anyway. Aug 15 15:24
schestowitz Warren seems to be focused on other things these days. He tried building upon Ubuntu, went back to Debian and SJVN is one of the few who give status reports. Aug 15 15:25
twitter Here’s the MOD that bugged me, “Many of the programs included with MEPIS Linux products are GPL licensed to Aug 15 15:28
twitter give you the right to use that software but oddly limits your right to share or redistribute the software.” Aug 15 15:28
schestowitz What about Vector? http://vectorlinux.com/product… Aug 15 15:29
schestowitz Or Linux XP with *chuckle* activation keys. Aug 15 15:30
twitter I don’t know about Vector. Aug 15 15:31
schestowitz The marketing people from Microsoft flog vapourware now: http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2… The troll that mentioned it, BTW, is definitely one from COLA based on what he said. Gary, Funkenbusch or Scott… Munchkins be damned. Aug 15 15:33
MinceR vector costs too much :> Aug 15 15:44
schestowitz It’s not the cost that’s a problem. Vector seems like a nice distro and I don’t know how redistribution is handled for the paid version. Aug 15 15:45
MinceR well, i can’t afford to pay for it if i want to handle support (mostly) myself (and i do) Aug 15 15:47
schestowitz CIOL teaches Linux users how to ‘root’ their distro. :-( http://www.ciol.com/Developer/Open-Source… Aug 15 15:52
schestowitz I think I’ve just figured out what messed about with my Perl script the other day. I was doing a quick ‘man chown’ and got warned about chars. I then realised that my fancy .bashrc may be the cause. I wonder if that stupid fancy stuff is what had me baffled for hours, trying to figure out the weird chars’ cause. Default bash doesn’t seem to suffer from this. Aug 15 15:59
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twitter Glad you figured it out. Aug 15 16:08
_Doug figured what out ? Aug 15 16:09
schestowitz Some character issue in bash. Aug 15 16:10
schestowitz I haven’t tested it yet. I’ll try in the future though. Aug 15 16:10
_Doug man bash .. :) Aug 15 16:10
twitter about ciol, ugh.  That’s too easy and nasty. Aug 15 16:12
twitter Funny how they used the M$ homepage as a demonstration.  It’s not like anything else will work. Aug 15 16:12
schestowitz CIOL does a lot of pro-Microsoft coverage, but this isn’t a good example of it. Actually, a lot of the Indian press is like that. Aug 15 16:13
twitter Ah, I see you need loonlight first, so it’s not like firefox alone does it. Aug 15 16:14
schestowitz Loonlight requires No-no. Aug 15 16:15
schestowitz ISO is rubbing Microsoft’s back again. Trying to wash off the corruption… http://www.noooxml.org/forum/t-8… Aug 15 16:40
*_Doug (n=emacsuse@193.122.47.146) has left #boycottnovell Aug 15 16:55
twitter looks Aug 15 17:05
schestowitz Will post it to BN in a moment. Aug 15 17:07
schestowitz Posted. Aug 15 17:09
kentma1 ISO is making no friends at all at the moment.  Do they have any relevance left?  If they’re just going to do what Microsoft says, they serve no purpose at all, and might as well be shut down. Aug 15 17:14
schestowitz Some ISO people lefy. Aug 15 17:16
kentma1 Ah, interesting, they invented some new rules in order to do their cover up – isn’t corruption great! Aug 15 17:16
schestowitz *left Aug 15 17:16
schestowitz Yes. Aug 15 17:16
schestowitz Microsoft hired ECMA, which changed the rules on the go to usher OOXML. Amazing, no? Aug 15 17:16
schestowitz Even Convenor Alex Brown shuffled the rules to allow OOXML’s entry. It’s like a circus of corrupt fools. Aug 15 17:17
kentma1 ECMA have always been an industry rubber-stamping body though.  ECMA should not be able to submit proposals to ISO, it’s a recipe for corruption. Aug 15 17:17
trmanco for how long has the corruption from microsoft been going on? Aug 15 17:19
schestowitz Year+ Aug 15 17:19
schestowitz Prior to ECMA+ISO saga, there was MA. Aug 15 17:20
trmanco ok, I thought it had been going on for a lot longer Aug 15 17:20
schestowitz twitter: one of these ‘eye on Microsoft’ posts made the FP of Free Software Daily, so I might as well continue with it. I’ll do another one today. Aug 15 17:24
twitter Just put ” ISO Kicks Out Appeals.” on firehose.  See one other mention that points back to iso pages. Aug 15 17:26
twitter Is there enough news already?  Bad M$, bad! Aug 15 17:29
schestowitz The danger is that MSFTers (as one friend of mine calls them) will present this in Slashdot as though ISO and Microsoft are saints. This happened in /. before. Can’t recall when or what it was. Aug 15 17:30
schestowitz I can vividly recall Slashdot angering some people by doing the damage control /for/ ISO and Microsoft pretty much. I wish I remembered the details. Aug 15 17:30
schestowitz twitter: what do you mean by “enough news”? I’ll post links later. Just been busy with some things I hate today… and my neck is still killing me (been injured for almost a week). Aug 15 17:31
twitter The one story I saw was posted at 9AM CST and they were not happy.  http://slashdot.org/firehose… Aug 15 17:31
twitter Sorry to hear about the pain in the neck, those are always are a pain in the neck. Aug 15 17:32
schestowitz I don’t like the headline. It’s also not correct. Aug 15 17:32
schestowitz Yeah, my pain is a recursive one. Aug 15 17:33
twitter I was wondering what you had dug up since the other day, that’s all. Aug 15 17:33
twitter Your pain is a byword for annoyance. Aug 15 17:33
twitter I’ll get to see it soon enough :) Aug 15 17:34
schestowitz Yes. Maybe later. I need to talk to my mother again. Family matters are still personal (especially since some trolls bend them to use them against you), but anyway… Aug 15 17:35
twitter Take care of yourself. Aug 15 17:36
schestowitz There’s nothing negative about it. I was just explaining the management of time. Aug 15 17:40
*_Doug (n=emacsuse@193.122.47.146) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 15 17:42
schestowitz There are always those ‘geniuses’ who are suddenly certain about the # of FOSS installations. Here’s a new example: . “It has a loyal following. Yet, at the end of the day, it still finds itself being used on a paltry 1-2% of the desktop computer market.” http://www.pcmech.com/article/why-lin… Aug 15 17:44
schestowitz That stuff I put in Digg the other day (FP) is used here:  http://www.linuxloop.com/news/2008/08/14/li… “Gartner says that Linux’s market share is 4%, putting it about even with the Mac.” Aug 15 17:45
MinceR people should care about the installed base more than the market share. Aug 15 17:47
MinceR (well, obviously not when they’re making profits off sold licenses, but afaik installed base is a better indicator of adoption) Aug 15 17:48
schestowitz Yes, but also about potential and sustainability. Numbers are not the same as power/function or even Freedom. Sacrificing Freedom (free as in libre)  for numbers is not winning. Aug 15 17:48
schestowitz In Microsoft’s case, everything is counted by IDC and Gartner in terms of revenue (also on servers) because it makes the statistics more favourable to proprietary software. Aug 15 17:49
MinceR yet even IDC and Gartner reveal numbers more favorable than the ones trolls keep quoting :) Aug 15 17:51
schestowitz See http://boycottnovell.com/2007/12/08/idc… . Gartner might get some angry phonecalls from Ballmer (based on The Register’s podcast) for daring to reveal Linux details in a way that’s unapproved by the funder (Gates and Microsoft invest in them). Aug 15 17:52
MinceR yeah, Gartner has already lost any credibility with their TCO FUD Aug 15 17:56
MinceR i didn’t know about IDC FUD, i’ll read up on that Aug 15 17:57
schestowitz If Microsoft puts money on the tables of all the ‘talking points’ (Oracle does this too, I suspect), then it can police perception. Aug 15 17:57
schestowitz This one from the news shows why they do this and parrot the “1%” big lie: “I’ve talked to the folks at Nero about their commercial Linux offerings, and they made it clear that Linux needs to be more broadly accepted as a consumer platform before third-party app sales for Linux will take off.” ( from http://www.informationweek.com/blog/mai… ) Aug 15 17:59
schestowitz MinceR: A better post might be this: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/15/… Aug 15 18:01
schestowitz Good news. Rambus hits the wstebasket: http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer… “And what might those be? Litigation and cry baby tactics against more productive innovative companies that do honest engineering and production work that actually make real products that benefit people. Rambus what is your illness? Go away. “ Aug 15 18:10
schestowitz Busted. Another Microsoft AstroTurf agency: http://www.webpronews.com/topnew… Aug 15 18:23
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twitter If Garner says 4%, it’s at least 8%. Aug 15 18:49
schestowitz I have some refs if you want them… Aug 15 18:49
twitter OK Aug 15 18:50
schestowitz http://groups.google.com/group/comp… Aug 15 18:58
schestowitz The references are below the night, some with highlights using carets. Aug 15 18:59
twitter Thanks.  OpenDot has an ISO slam.  http://opendotdotdot.blogspot.com/200… Aug 15 19:01
*_Doug (n=emacsuse@193.122.47.146) has left #boycottnovell Aug 15 19:03
schestowitz It’s nice to see something you can point at and say “watch it. *That’s* corruption.” Aug 15 19:04
schestowitz I’ll post something later about the alleged OOXML briberies (of non-profits) in India. Tens of thousands of them… for OOXML. The MD of Microsoft India apparently quit because it this, but now it seems possible that she got fired. Microsoft India committed lots of other jaw-dropping  crimes. I just need to align the evidnece better. Aug 15 19:06
schestowitz Here is a perfect and timely example that’s both a criticism of CIOL *and* Gartner (Frost and Sullivan are the same time of medal-for-money operation in India): http://www.ciol.com/News/News-Rep… Aug 15 19:12
neighborlee schestowitz, oh btw..fedora 10 also has no mono on livecd..9 didn’t either but I have no idea about dvd Aug 15 19:15
neighborlee schestowitz, not sure whats up with this as I dont recall seeing any recent postings from redhat/fedora bout this, but its a nice trend anyway ;-0 Aug 15 19:15
schestowitz Cool. Yes, we looked at F9. Aug 15 19:16
schestowitz Some people who liked Mono used as an excuse the volatility of a live CD (why take notes?), but the same goes for anything with a “save” function. Aug 15 19:17
neighborlee I was appauled to hear about kde issues and mono..I really had feeling day would come though Aug 15 19:17
schestowitz In the cade of Debian, the explanation was that Mono was a “large package”, but they also considered the fact that it’s controversial when they left it out by default. Aug 15 19:17
neighborlee you know, I never use such things, I think its more of a fast trend LOL Aug 15 19:17
neighborlee I use windows alot lately, and it has no tomboy stuff as default , and somehow I get by just fine ,,I use wordpad or such if I really need to take a note..I dont get his  note       fascination := Aug 15 19:18
schestowitz I use Kate. Aug 15 19:19
neighborlee yeah Aug 15 19:19
schestowitz It has ‘tabs’ (not really tabs) Aug 15 19:19
neighborlee schestowitz, so its it really trrue, kde is really starting to embrace mono currently ? Aug 15 19:19
schestowitz It put hooks in there. Richard Dale does the bindings, but he’s just that maintainer. Aug 15 19:20
neighborlee ah ok Aug 15 19:20
neighborlee heh Aug 15 19:20
neighborlee most kde devs dont want if as I recall Aug 15 19:21
neighborlee s/if/it Aug 15 19:21
schestowitz Someone accused him of being a Microsoft mole: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/0… Aug 15 19:21
neighborlee I suspect most that   support mono in linux, are some form of a mole LOL..honestly it just doesnt make much sense to me. Aug 15 19:22
neighborlee but now with java free maybe it wont matter soon, we’ll see I guess…. Aug 15 19:23
neighborlee Ive been against mono for a very long time , before much of this errupted ;)…I saw a snake coming long ago .- Aug 15 19:23
schestowitz Yes, long ago. http://www.gnome.org/~seth/blog/mono Aug 15 19:27
neighborlee yup Aug 15 19:31
neighborlee I read that a year + ago Aug 15 19:31
schestowitz neighborlee: I am going to blog what you told me about F10. How sure are you about it? Aug 15 19:31
schestowitz Got a screenshot maybe? I have some screenshots of F10 I can find actually… Aug 15 19:31
neighborlee I can get you one no problemo ;) Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee I am positive Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee no fspot, tomboy etc. Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee and def. no beagle that I saw Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee im happy to boot into livecd right now and get you one if you like Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee its alpha 10livecd Aug 15 19:32
neighborlee ok , Ill brb then Aug 15 19:33
*neighborlee has quit (“This is my custom quit message : I am quitting now, – bye cu l8r g8r.”) Aug 15 19:33
schestowitz It seems to be on the permanent install…  http://gnuman.com/screens… Aug 15 19:33
schestowitz Index here: http://gnuman.com/screenshots.html?gi… Aug 15 19:33
twitter Slashdot has lame coverage of the story.  http://it.slashdot.org/articl… Aug 15 19:37
twitter The ISO Story. Aug 15 19:37
schestowitz ” Not subscriber, or not subscribed page” Aug 15 19:39
schestowitz I saw it earlier anyway. Stupid headline. Aug 15 19:39
twitter Yeah, someone keeps me subscribed to Slashdot.  Nice of them. Aug 15 19:41
schestowitz Did they change the headline? Aug 15 19:42
twitter They are pointing to http://www.infoworld.com/article/08/0… Aug 15 19:42
schestowitz They link directly to Microsoft’s ammunition, which they’ll rave about no doubt (for marketing purposes). Aug 15 19:42
twitter Headline is hard for me to cut and paste …. Aug 15 19:43
schestowitz Gosh, Slashdot used to have guts. It’s so spineless now. Aug 15 19:44
schestowitz SJVN suggested to me that I contact Linux.com to write for them. But they do Microsoft ads (that’s why I stopped with Jupitermedia for now) and journalism is slow, unlike blogging, which is more effective at delivering messages. Aug 15 19:44
twitter Got the first post, watch the munkins eat it. Aug 15 19:45
twitter Headline is just as spineless as the article, “ISO Rejects OOXML Protest Appeals” Aug 15 19:46
schestowitz Another troll for your mental list: Charles Cooper. he used to write less before the ZDNet editor came to CNET and he trolls in the headlines endlessly. Aug 15 19:46
schestowitz CNET and ZDNet are no more ‘news source’ than your average blog. People just use these to market themselves. Aug 15 19:46
*neighborlee (n=fedora@c-24-16-56-222.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 15 19:47
schestowitz Let’s see what GL wrote. Aug 15 19:47
schestowitz http://www.groklaw.net/art… (haven’t read it yet) Aug 15 19:48
neighborlee ok I have one, ill upload somewhere , one moment Aug 15 19:48
neighborlee ill grab one from packagekit showing a search for mono returning nothing,,one sec Aug 15 19:48
schestowitz http://homembit.com/2008/08/openx… and http://www.consortiuminfo.org/stand… Aug 15 19:49
schestowitz That would be great, thanks neighborlee. Aug 15 19:49
trmanco http://www.groklaw.net/art… Aug 15 19:50
trmanco oops Aug 15 19:51
trmanco I didn’t notice that the link you sent was the same as mine :| Aug 15 19:52
schestowitz That’s cool. It’s new and I visited Groklaw just minuted after it had been published, by coincidence. Aug 15 19:53
*Tallken (n=Tallken@62.169.112.120.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 15 19:56
twitter Me too.  I figured they would have a good write up and it was OK.  The EU anti-trust bit is good and they laugh about the standard being impossible to implement. Aug 15 19:58
neighborlee schestowitz, http://imagebin.org/24331 Aug 15 19:58
twitter Is it true that the UK is about to make copyright almost as draconian as it is in the US, where people can lose their houses for sharing files?  http://slashdot.org/fir… Aug 15 19:58
twitter Nice flower. Aug 15 20:00
neighborlee heh thx ;) Aug 15 20:00
neighborlee its the gardener in me..Im a landscaper by trade ;) Aug 15 20:00
twitter :) Aug 15 20:00
neighborlee next shot ill get of menu open, showing no fspot, with gthumb in its place. Aug 15 20:01
schestowitz Tanks, neighborlee. Aug 15 20:02
schestowitz Thanks. Aug 15 20:02
neighborlee np Aug 15 20:02
schestowitz I’m going to post something later about Microsoft and ‘piracy’. Aug 15 20:04
neighborlee http://imagebin.org/24332 Aug 15 20:04
schestowitz Excellent. Aug 15 20:05
twitter I like flowers and have lots of pictures of them.  Roy, if you found my CV you can find my flowers.  You, like everyone else, are welcome to use them for non commercial purposes. Aug 15 20:05
neighborlee schestowitz, the worst imho, – or at least one of the worst is the piracy against their own people with ‘vista ready’ lol..remember that whole mess ?? ;) Aug 15 20:06
schestowitz http://www.in-forum.com/art… Aug 15 20:07
schestowitz Microsoft loves piracy, provided you’re poor and won’t pay anyway. But it whines anyone and punished the very same people who make Windows and Office widespread and thus the ‘de facto standard’. It’s insulting. Aug 15 20:08
neighborlee yup Aug 15 20:09
neighborlee oh btw mono isn’t installed by default either Aug 15 20:10
neighborlee I can get that screenie if you want as well Aug 15 20:10
schestowitz *”whine and punished” (sorry about all those typos) Aug 15 20:10
schestowitz Should say “But it whines anyway and punishes…” Aug 15 20:11
neighborlee its ok I got the idea just fine Aug 15 20:11
schestowitz neighborlee: that’s excellent. I’ll resize the pictures later (linking to full-sized versions) and post this for future reference. It’ll be valuable. Fedora also rejects Moonlight. Aug 15 20:12
neighborlee yup Aug 15 20:12
neighborlee I also follow ubuntu threads about mono..is repulsing what mono supporters try to get away with :)) Aug 15 20:12
neighborlee Im keeping them honest :) Aug 15 20:13
schestowitz Do you know why they accepted Mono in the first place? [H]omer did some studying and found out that it’s because”everyone was doing it”, so it must be ‘safe’ Aug 15 20:13
schestowitz Time to go the other way and make Mono (Novell/Microsoft) cleanup fashionable. “Why remove Mono?” “Because everyone is doing it, so it’s safe to say it’s ‘unsafe’ now”. Aug 15 20:13
neighborlee yes  Iread that on your site Aug 15 20:13
neighborlee I was astonished Aug 15 20:13
neighborlee LOL Aug 15 20:14
neighborlee I like :)) Aug 15 20:14
neighborlee brb Aug 15 20:14
schestowitz There  are Microsoft boosters that will mock Java and call . NET the second coming. They are not necessarily Linux users. They defend the monopoly. Grassroots. Aug 15 20:14
schestowitz I don’t know what Mono looked like when it was just Ximian. Were they close to Microsoft? I don’t know. But there was _NO_ covenant with a Mono deal. Microsoft execs now admit this too. And Novell called Ximian a “Red carpet” (to Microsoft). Aug 15 20:15
schestowitz Ah!! Gotcha!! Bill Snyder is a Microsoft shareholder!! http://weblog.infoworld.com/tech-bo… (See bottom). That’s the guy who keeps slamming open source in public, even in Slashdot quite recently. He’s kiting his stock, I reckon. Aug 15 20:17
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neighborlee well considering dear Miguel came from M$,,who the heck knows ;) Aug 15 20:20
neighborlee gnome might have been started as afront to kde, but who knows at the core what was going on..the whole thing stinks to me. Aug 15 20:21
neighborlee however, nothing prevents anyone from forking..im considering doing just that. Aug 15 20:21
neighborlee I love gnome, but im sick of the nonsense., Aug 15 20:21
schestowitz Okay, to just make it clear, Miguel worked on UNIX, not Microsoft, but he did for an interview at Microsoft. Aug 15 20:22
schestowitz I think he worked on some browser-related things and he wanted a job at Microsoft. He got rejected by them and shortly afterwards he began GNOME. While at Microsoft he fell in love with ActiveX (no, seriously). As for the latter, well… only recently I studies who Stormy Peters is. Aug 15 20:24
neighborlee http://imagebin.org/24336 Aug 15 20:24
neighborlee add-remove showing no mono ^ Aug 15 20:24
schestowitz IIRC, she sort of cofounded GNOME with Miguel or was at least there from the start. She now works at a company that gets Microsoft sponsorship, her CEO is a former Microsoft employee, her blogroll has Microsoft employees in it and she’s in H-P (*sough cough* big Microsoft buddies). So… I don’t trust her leading GNOME. Aug 15 20:25
schestowitz Thanks, I’ve resixed some images and will post about this shortly. Aug 15 20:25
neighborlee ok kewl, np. Aug 15 20:25
neighborlee I thought I read he worked for M$ ? Aug 15 20:25
neighborlee if not I misread something ;),,but anyway Aug 15 20:26
trmanco http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/s… Aug 15 20:26
schestowitz Good links, thanks. Haven’t seen it yet. Aug 15 20:27
neighborlee ok im confused..so he worked on UNIX,,not at M$, but you later say , while he was at Miccrosoft..im very confused ;) Aug 15 20:27
neighborlee oh my gosh..not the olympics too! Aug 15 20:29
schestowitz I’d have to find the details. I think he was porting some browser technology to UNIX platforms. Aug 15 20:29
neighborlee silverlight at olympics..nasty nasty Aug 15 20:29
neighborlee but of course..its bejing! Aug 15 20:29
schestowitz (In Mexico) Aug 15 20:29
neighborlee AHHH Aug 15 20:29
schestowitz Watch the Wikipedia article (grain of salt). It’s all from memory… Aug 15 20:29
neighborlee ok kewl np Aug 15 20:30
schestowitz For some reason I think McBride here… hold on while I digg something up… Aug 15 20:30
schestowitz *dig Aug 15 20:30
neighborlee digg works too <G> Aug 15 20:30
schestowitz Ah! Found it. Aug 15 20:31
schestowitz FSDaily compared de Icaza to McBride, but I remember writing about it long ago. Here it is: http://boycottnovell.com/2007… Aug 15 20:31
neighborlee dain M$ supporters, they always try to change the target Aug 15 20:39
neighborlee like sayingif we remove mono, what about M$ double click patent Aug 15 20:40
neighborlee of which I know zero about Aug 15 20:40
neighborlee can you help with this so I can reply ? Aug 15 20:40
neighborlee http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread… Aug 15 20:40
neighborlee oh wait..what the heck..there is no patent number assigned o_0 Aug 15 20:42
neighborlee Filed:  July 12, 2002, but nothing assigned. Aug 15 20:42
schestowitz Ir wouldn’t stand in court. Too controversial and easy to shoot down. See http://boycottnovell.com/2008/05/… Aug 15 20:42
schestowitz Here you have the same situation described and the way to rebut. Aug 15 20:42
neighborlee you mean double click right? Aug 15 20:42
schestowitz Others too. On Microsoft patents: http://boycottnovell.com/2007/1… (links at the bottom)  http://boycottnovell.com/2007/10… Aug 15 20:44
neighborlee ok thx Aug 15 20:44
neighborlee These guys dont do their homework , before  posting on forums do they ;) Aug 15 20:45
neighborlee also I noticed, this directhex guy, other than ONE other topic, has only posted on nono thread :).. go figya ;) Aug 15 20:46
neighborlee most of his posts are on mono thread ;) Aug 15 20:46
schestowitz Same in Brainstorm I hear. Microsoft can game its competitors by messing about with bug reports and polls. Aug 15 20:47
schestowitz Microsoft was caught gaming polls before (e.g. against Java). The man who warned me about this is a professor who know that stuff. Aug 15 20:48
neighborlee ahhhh Aug 15 20:48
neighborlee I suspected as much anyway Aug 15 20:48
neighborlee I noted that before, on a earlier remove mono poll in ubuntu forum, that it was 60remove to 40 keep.. Aug 15 20:49
neighborlee now, this new poll is going the opposite way. Aug 15 20:49
neighborlee interesting huh Aug 15 20:49
schestowitz In open source communities, there are no recruitments and background checks. Merely anyone can stop by and influence decisions! It’s ‘insiding’. Aug 15 20:49
neighborlee however, the new poll isnt in genreal thread, its in a place most users wont even see it..thats the new ubuntu strategy Aug 15 20:50
neighborlee schestowitz, yup true Aug 15 20:50
schestowitz What’s at stake here is important because Microsoft wants to plant a Trojan in its #1 rival *and* promote .NET at Java’s expense. Aug 15 20:50
neighborlee yup Aug 15 20:50
neighborlee thankfully redhat, and now fedora finally woke the heck up Aug 15 20:51
schestowitz They have tried doing this for a decade, without success. .NET is nowhere on the net. Almost nowhere… Aug 15 20:51
neighborlee good deal Aug 15 20:51
neighborlee well now with java free ( I think), .net might have very small traction Aug 15 20:52
schestowitz Java and LAMP/Ajax still reign. With the NBC deal, they try to reverse this too, but it’s another story. Aug 15 20:52
neighborlee hm Aug 15 20:52
twitter http://en.wikipedia.org/w… ? Aug 15 20:53
schestowitz Thanks, I haven’t read enough about it at the time because I was in a hurry (time pressure) Aug 15 20:54
neighborlee hmm Aug 15 20:56
schestowitz I see at least 4 Microsofties in her blogroll: [News] Demo of Linux and X Running on Nintendo Wii Aug 15 20:56
schestowitz Oops. Here: http://www.openlogic.co… Aug 15 20:56
*neighborlee has wii,and totally loves wiitennis ;) Aug 15 21:00
neighborlee and wiifit now haha Aug 15 21:00
neighborlee I h ave played wii far more than any other console to date..though ps2 was only one I ever h ad honestly ;)) Aug 15 21:00
neighborlee but still,,bought wii last year and wiitennis still isn’t old to me ;).. Aug 15 21:00
neighborlee but anyway Aug 15 21:00
schestowitz I had this in my klipper: http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/wii-l… Aug 15 21:01
schestowitz I want to go back to playing tennis some day. I gacve my best racket to my brother. :-(( Aug 15 21:01
neighborlee bad schestowitz  :) Aug 15 21:06
neighborlee well ive played since I was like 16 Aug 15 21:06
neighborlee loved it then still do ;) Aug 15 21:06
neighborlee then I had a less known wood racket,,now I have graphite prince that I just love Aug 15 21:06
schestowitz I started when I was 15, but stopped when I finished University. Aug 15 21:07
schestowitz I blame the Internet!!!111 Aug 15 21:07
neighborlee heh Aug 15 21:14
twitter Here’s an irritating Slashdot article http://tech.slashdot.org/articl… Aug 15 21:14
neighborlee well its hot here,,I should powerdown, give computer a  chance not to overheat ;) Aug 15 21:14
neighborlee glad to help..and ill see you all latre ;)() Aug 15 21:14
*neighborlee (n=fedora@c-24-16-56-222.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) has left #boycottnovell (“Leaving”) Aug 15 21:14
twitter why do they boost mythTV on non free platforms? Aug 15 21:15
schestowitz I can’t see the article yet. What’s it about? ” Not subscriber, or not subscribed page” Aug 15 21:16
twitter Sorry, look again. Aug 15 21:18
twitter It’s about mythTV on Windows and Mac. Aug 15 21:18
schestowitz Id1ots. They also aired all those articles about Linux users moving to Macs and .NET attracting developers. Who’s making selections? And is the ‘community’ still the same? Aug 15 21:19
twitter That’s nice and all, but it’s been ages since they mentioned MythTV.  You would think there were better things to talk about than a Windows port. Aug 15 21:19
twitter My brother told me that readership is actually down.  No surprise there. Aug 15 21:20
twitter People did not go to Slashdot to keep up with M$ Products. Aug 15 21:20
schestowitz Watch this: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/05… Aug 15 21:21
twitter Oh well, I first posted it again.  :) Aug 15 21:21
schestowitz Yes, Slashdor goes down fast. Aug 15 21:21
twitter looking Aug 15 21:21
schestowitz It has gone on for a while. When I hit Digg’s FP the traffic is like 3-4 times higher. Aug 15 21:21
schestowitz It’s not just MS products, twitter, it’s also a lot of dross and it’s hardly tech. Same with Digg (post 2006) Aug 15 21:22
twitter I enjoy YRO.  Like RMS says, you can ignore politics but politics won’t ignore you. Aug 15 21:23
schestowitz Yes, I like that one too. Astronomy I care about less. The likelihood of colonies outside Earth is slim. Aug 15 21:24
twitter Still, YOU manage to find good free software articles.  Slashdot should too. Aug 15 21:24
schestowitz What do the editors use? Aug 15 21:25
twitter Slim only in our life time.  I’d prefer the US spent it’s money on that than wars. Aug 15 21:25
schestowitz I know about Roblimo, but was asked to keep my mouth shut. Aug 15 21:25
twitter Use for what? Aug 15 21:26
twitter Their desktops? Aug 15 21:26
twitter I don’t know. Aug 15 21:26
schestowitz I mean, like those Dana Blankenhorn-type WIndows users who write about FOSS for years and ‘open source’ people whose whole life is Mac, DRM, and iPhones. They don’t do as they preach. Hypocrisy and opportunism with FOSS. I don’t want to point fingers. :-) Aug 15 21:27
schestowitz Many people who write about Linux are not Linux users. Aug 15 21:28
twitter That’s a shame. Aug 15 21:28
schestowitz Moreover, many who write about FOSS couldn’t care less about Freedom and penetration of FOSS. They are after  ad revenue. Aug 15 21:29
twitter That’s why I don’t read much of what they write. Aug 15 21:30
schestowitz But /who/? Do you know who to skip? I made an Index < http://boycottnovell.com/credibility-index/ > to help others. Someone asked me to make it. Aug 15 21:31
twitter Nice but it’s time for a break. Aug 15 21:31
twitter I’ll check it later, thanks. Aug 15 21:32
*libervisco (n=daniel@tuxhacker/libervisco) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 15 22:08
*trmanco_ (n=trmanco@bl5-134-184.dsl.telepac.pt) has joined #boycottnovell Aug 15 23:09
*trmanco has quit (Nick collision from services.) Aug 15 23:10
*trmanco_ is now known as trmanco Aug 15 23:10
twitter I’m back. Aug 15 23:19
twitter Want to see a nice piece of net stalking? Aug 15 23:20
schestowitz Yes, definitely. I want o document such phenomena too. Aug 15 23:20
twitter This one is personal and not one I’d like to call attention to. Aug 15 23:22
twitter my trolls on Slashdot like to out me as BRLUG member Will Hill.  That’s not something I will confirm or deny. Aug 15 23:23
twitter They also identify my accounts on the first few posts.  They got my GNUChop today and replied to it by cut and pasting a brlug comment. Aug 15 23:24
twitter compare http://mail.brlug.net/pipermail/ge… Aug 15 23:24
twitter to http://slashdot.org/comments.pl… Aug 15 23:25
twitter Nasty, isn’t it? Aug 15 23:25
twitter If what they say is true they can only know it by monitoring all of my traffic. Aug 15 23:27
schestowitz Yes, I see now. BTW, what happened to the BN link here? <p><img src=”http://boycottnovell.com/wp-con…” border=”0″ align=”left” hspace=”20″ vspace=”4″ alt=”ISO in money” /> Aug 15 23:27
schestowitz I mean here < http://slashdot.org/comments.pl… > at the top? Aug 15 23:27
schestowitz twitter: I saw this before. The trolls in COLA do this too. They sort of ‘shadow’ my activity in blogs and sites. They even pull things on the Web that I wrote years ago. Aug 15 23:28
twitter Oh, I must have missed that too.  Sorry. Aug 15 23:29
*Tallken has quit (“coffeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee”) Aug 15 23:29
twitter I saw that I messed one of the links up but not both. Aug 15 23:29
schestowitz At one point they tried to identify anonymous stuff as belonging to me. Now, apart from the weirdness of this, I can’t help but wonder why someone would spend so much time just net stalking,. People have better things to do with their lives, no? Aug 15 23:30
twitter It’s rather amazing the resources devoted to trolling isn’t it?  It’s like someone’s full time job. Aug 15 23:30
twitter Or a lot of people’s full time jobs. Aug 15 23:30
schestowitz Did you see my latest post. Watch it now. Aug 15 23:31
twitter I noticed and journaled this years ago.  http://slashdot.org/~… Aug 15 23:32
twitter going to look Aug 15 23:32
twitter Don’t forget that Chinese net cleansing link. Aug 15 23:34
schestowitz Yes, it’s cited back. It was included in the last post. When we accumulate enough agencies (I have almost 8), then I’ll build an index. Aug 15 23:37
twitter The more they pull this shit, the more angry people like us they will make. Aug 15 23:37
schestowitz Yes, but it’s equally important to get the word out. Just putting that stuff on the Web doesn’t mean it reaches people’s attention. Aug 15 23:38
schestowitz BTW, that troll who was here earlier was definitely someone from USENET who came here to haunt us. He gave it away at the end and he did this over a month ago when Tor was permitted. Aug 15 23:38
twitter People get the word the way both you and I did.  You need to get things done and someone who knows free software shows you how. Aug 15 23:39
schestowitz Heh. Another publisher has just invited me for an interview. Cool. Aug 15 23:39
*[H]omer has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) Aug 15 23:39
twitter It only takes one or two successes to pull the blinders of your eyes. Aug 15 23:40
twitter Have fun with the interview! Aug 15 23:40
twitter :) Aug 15 23:40
twitter dinner time for me. Aug 15 23:41
schestowitz Make sure you keep those stories you tell documented so that you can point t them as evidence. Someone once told me I should do this for legal reasons. Aug 15 23:41
schestowitz I’ll catch you later. Aug 15 23:41
*trmanco has quit (“I just hit the close button :)”) Aug 15 23:43
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