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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: April 25th, 2009 – Part 3

Posted in IRC Logs at 1:57 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz


Enter the IRC channel now

To use your own IRC client, join channel #boycottnovell in FreeNode.

_Hicham_ that it open source Apr 25 17:21
seller_liar magentar: are you sure? C is very old Apr 25 17:21
magentar they have a python api Apr 25 17:21
_Hicham_ sellar_liar : C is very old? Apr 25 17:21
ushimitsudoki1 I use rhythmbox and suits me quite well. There might be value in seeing what set of features (if any) that Banshee provides that Rhythmbox does not. Apr 25 17:22
seller_liar no hicham , porting banshee to python is a good strategical thing to weaken mono troll Apr 25 17:22
seller_liar and relicense in gplv3 is good too Apr 25 17:22
magentar seller_liar, what makes you say rhythmbox is abandoned. version 0.12 was released one month ago Apr 25 17:23
_Hicham_ sellar_liar : u have to wait for Google to speed up python Apr 25 17:23
seller_liar ushimitsudoki1: But distro devs worries about maintenance and bugs,not features Apr 25 17:23
_Hicham_ great sellar_liar Apr 25 17:23
_Hicham_ u have some weird concepts Apr 25 17:23
ushimitsudoki1 seller_liar: no they don’t. ubuntu (for better or for worse, usually worse) cares about features. That’s the distro I’m talking about right now. Apr 25 17:24
seller_liar _Hicham_: why? Apr 25 17:24
_Hicham_ who doesn’t care about features? Apr 25 17:24
_Hicham_ there is no bugs without features Apr 25 17:24
_Hicham_ no smoke without fire Apr 25 17:24
seller_liar _Hicham_: sorry a mistake.What I was trying to say is Apr 25 17:24
seller_liar _Hicham_: Distrto devs not worry about ONLY features ,but bugs and maintenance too Apr 25 17:25
seller_liar Make a choose: Apr 25 17:27
seller_liar Make a choice Apr 25 17:27
seller_liar Port gnome-do or banshee of hell? Apr 25 17:27
seller_liar I will learn python and starts porting Apr 25 17:27
_Hicham_ sellar_liar : now u r saying sthg good Apr 25 17:29
_Hicham_ that is a positive action Apr 25 17:29
seller_liar _Hicham_: what? Apr 25 17:29
_Hicham_ go ahead Apr 25 17:30
seller_liar seller_liar: the purpose of porting is destroy mono trolls and spread gplv3 Apr 25 17:30
seller_liar the next thing ,I’m writing is the possible future  dangers Apr 25 17:35
seller_liar for example : Apr 25 17:35
seller_liar monotorrent and gnome-do Apr 25 17:35
trmanco a made a post about mono apps Apr 25 17:36
seller_liar please give me the link Apr 25 17:37
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trmanco seller_liar, http://open-mania.com/2008/0… Apr 25 17:38
trmanco but I gave no alternatives Apr 25 17:38
seller_liar trmanco: you can create a list of criticisms about every opensource app Apr 25 17:40
seller_liar what we in bn was trying to do Apr 25 17:40
seller_liar http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php?tit… Apr 25 17:40
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trmanco seller_liar, what do you mean? Apr 25 17:42
trmanco there is another replacement for tomboy Apr 25 17:43
seller_liar trmanco: Fazer uma lista de pontos negativos sobre uma app Apr 25 17:43
trmanco ah ok Apr 25 17:43
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trmanco oh wait Apr 25 17:44
trmanco it isn’t a replacement, it’s a reinforcement for mono -> http://live.gnome.org/Tasque Apr 25 17:45
trmanco tomboy recommends this, I’ve always thought there was something fishy, tomboy recommended a non mono app, but it isn’t, it’s c#’ed Apr 25 17:45
seller_liar trmanco: Q. Why are you using C#/Mono  A. It ROCKS! Essentially, rapid development with C# is easy. It’s relatively easy for newcomers to come in (provided we’ve coded well enough). Apr 25 17:46
seller_liar Tasque is another mono troll Apr 25 17:47
seller_liar seller_liar: There are a lot of ideas to  improve mono page in bn wiki Apr 25 17:48
seller_liar Like mono vs dotgnu Apr 25 17:49
trmanco hehe Apr 25 17:49
trmanco gotgnu is dead Apr 25 17:49
trmanco oops Apr 25 17:49
seller_liar trmanco: nono, Dotgnu is well developed in cvs Apr 25 17:49
trmanco it is? Apr 25 17:49
trmanco hmm… might be confusing it with something else Apr 25 17:50
seller_liar seller_liar: yes, dotgnu is very slow to make a release ,but there development in cvs Apr 25 17:50
seller_liar trmanco: : yes, dotgnu is very slow to make a release ,but there development in cvs Apr 25 17:51
trmanco yeah I guess you’re right -> http://cvs.savannah.gnu.org/vi… Apr 25 17:52
seller_liar trmanco: But mono vs dotgnu is not a technical comparation, What I was thinking is a ethical comparation Apr 25 17:52
seller_liar for example ,dotgnu does not have a patent deal and other confidencial deal with ms Apr 25 17:53
seller_liar dotgnu is agains ms api domination Apr 25 17:53
seller_liar dotgnu does not focus in interoperability , dotgnu does noit even use asp.net Apr 25 17:54
seller_liar dot gnu uses a webserver called dgee Apr 25 17:54
seller_liar seller_liar: all documentation of dotgnu is free to anyone Apr 25 17:54
seller_liar all documentation of dotgnu is free to anyone Apr 25 17:54
seller_liar mono is not Apr 25 17:54
seller_liar novell have confidencial documentation envolving moonlight and sometimes mono Apr 25 17:55
seller_liar seller_liar: dotgnu uses good lgpl2.1 licence with addition classpath permission in other files Apr 25 17:55
seller_liar dotgnu uses good lgpl2.1 licence with addition classpath permission in other files Apr 25 17:55
seller_liar moonlight uses a old lgpl2 licence without “any later version” clause and have a additonal restriction about embbeded tech Apr 25 17:56
seller_liar do you see differences? Apr 25 17:57
seller_liar dot gnu tries to be a free software project Apr 25 17:57
seller_liar mono tries to be “open-source” project Apr 25 17:57
trmanco I know the dangers of mono Apr 25 17:57
trmanco :-p Apr 25 17:57
seller_liar but we can do a comparation using dotgnu and mono Apr 25 17:58
seller_liar and show what’s wrong with mono based on these comparations Apr 25 17:58
trmanco mono is all wrong, even by design Apr 25 17:59
seller_liar Yes, but we must to do a wiki page and put theses comparation in mono section Apr 25 18:00
seller_liar microsoft can use documentation to gives extra advantages to mono ,but not to dotgnu Apr 25 18:03
seller_liar mono can be a slave for microsoft do destroy alternatives .net implementation Apr 25 18:05
seller_liar for example dotgnu Apr 25 18:05
trmanco it’s already doing that Apr 25 18:05
trmanco it’s like a lock-in Apr 25 18:06
seller_liar Yes, that is Apr 25 18:06
trmanco or a lock out Apr 25 18:06
trmanco just like directx is to opengl (sort of) Apr 25 18:06
seller_liar please , if possible ,do a article comparing mono and dotgnu Apr 25 18:07
trmanco try and get the game industry to use only directx for games, and that way the other platforms become obsolete Apr 25 18:07
trmanco seller_liar, where? Apr 25 18:07
seller_liar in your site Apr 25 18:07
seller_liar and after put here in bn wiki Apr 25 18:07
trmanco sure, I’ll try and make one during the next weak Apr 25 18:08
seller_liar ok thanks Apr 25 18:08
trmanco but lets keep in touch, só that you can give me some ideas to what to write about Apr 25 18:08
trmanco during the next weak Apr 25 18:08
trmanco brb Apr 25 18:08
seller_liar ok Apr 25 18:09
seller_liar You can do a table comparing dotgnu and mono Apr 25 18:09
seller_liar and after you can do a conclusion about this Apr 25 18:09
seller_liar schestowitz: We can destroy mono logo Apr 25 18:12
seller_liar for example , we can add vampire teeth to monkey mono logo Apr 25 18:13
seller_liar and change the eye for perverse eyes… Apr 25 18:13
seller_liar and put a description text: Apr 25 18:13
seller_liar Vampiring gnome and free software community Apr 25 18:13
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amarsh04 Eruaran, 4 corners page on abc.net.au has a news tips link, but one would need some good pointers to ms buying out governments and educational institutions in .au for them to run with it Apr 25 18:22
Eruaran Four Corners is not limited to Australian news only Apr 25 18:24
seller_liar I was thinking …. Apr 25 18:25
seller_liar If someday ubuntu gets too dependant ,the last hope is improve dotgnu Apr 25 18:25
amarsh04 true Eruaran, but having some pointers to .au governments and educational institutions excluding free software in favour of ms monoculture would help make a strong case for change Apr 25 18:26
Eruaran Four Corners is Australia’s most respected television journalism program. Apr 25 18:26
Eruaran I have already included some information on local market distortions Apr 25 18:26
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amarsh04 for it to be a successful Four Corners programme it would have to help trigger changes of process within the organisations it covers (resignations, opening up) Apr 25 18:28
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amarsh04 4 corners would be a good program to cover ms leaning on governments worldwide Apr 25 18:31
Omar87 I really don’t know, people, but I’m starting to believe, that the vast majority of the WorldWideWeb’s most bloated websites I’ve ever came across are built with A(ASS)P.NET.. Apr 25 18:36
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Omar87 Does anybody agree with me? Apr 25 18:38
seller_liar Omar87: about what? Apr 25 18:38
Omar87 seller_liar: I’m starting to believe, that the vast majority of the WorldWideWeb’s most bloated websites I’ve ever came across are built with A(ASS)P.NET.. Apr 25 18:38
seller_liar We can’t follow the world Apr 25 18:39
seller_liar We need to find our way, and .. Apr 25 18:39
Omar87 seller_liar: What do you mean? Apr 25 18:39
seller_liar remember 95% of world does not worry about ethics Apr 25 18:40
seller_liar Omar87: We can change this if we promote ethics for world Apr 25 18:40
Omar87 seller_liar: Exactly, that’s right, I agree. But what does it have to do with my point? Apr 25 18:40
seller_liar ASP.net is controlled by a monopolist company Apr 25 18:41
Omar87 seller_liar: Yes. Apr 25 18:41
seller_liar If people have more ethics , people does not use asp.net Apr 25 18:41
seller_liar even if asp.net is more powerful Apr 25 18:41
seller_liar To change world ,we need to put ethics over power Apr 25 18:42
seller_liar Free software try to teach this , but opensource destroy this idea Apr 25 18:43
trmanco Omar87, I do Apr 25 18:45
seller_liar I’m writing a paper about ethics and how to improve ethics, but It’s not complete Apr 25 18:45
trmanco they are not only bloated, but slow as crap too Apr 25 18:46
trmanco it’s the .NET fail (C) Apr 25 18:46
amarsh04 ABC story about web page accesses being less than 90 percent ms mentions apple and netbooks but not linux or free software http://www.abc.net.au/rn/breakf… Apr 25 18:47
trmanco isn’t abc american? Apr 25 18:47
amarsh04 Australian Broadcasting Corporation – .au government funded but independent of .au government Apr 25 18:48
amarsh04 ms employing an anthropologist (who has since left, a google search on her name might be good for the ex-microsofters links): http://www.abc.net.au/rn/bydesi… Apr 25 18:49
trmanco ah ok Apr 25 18:49
trmanco http://fullcirclemagazine.org/issue-24 Apr 25 19:04
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Eruaran I will review my request in the morning before sending it. Apr 25 19:29
Eruaran Its late and I’m tired… I don’t want to send anything thats nonsensical. Apr 25 19:29
amarsh04 fair enough Eruaran Apr 25 19:31
Eruaran I’ll give them a link to the ECIS paper Apr 25 19:33
Eruaran Its compelling reading Apr 25 19:33
Eruaran It should be required reading for all IT students in school ;) Apr 25 19:35
amarsh04 also for any history, understanding the dominant forces (East India companies anyone?) is important Apr 25 19:38
amarsh04 a bit like knowing that the Titanic’s radio operators were Marconi employees, not White Star Line employees Apr 25 19:39
trmanco who here uses jabber? Apr 25 19:57
schestowitz Hi, I’m back Apr 25 20:01
schestowitz I don’t know about warping Mono logo too much Apr 25 20:01
schestowitz Marti made a vampire of the monkey Apr 25 20:01
trmanco schestowitz, you have a lot to catch-up Apr 25 20:01
schestowitz But if we post such defaces stuff we won’t be treated well by the press Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz Like Roughly Drafted Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz If you deface people’s faces and such…. Apr 25 20:02
seller_liar schestowitz: Yes, this is true Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz If you work around it, then I see it as different Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz Like turning “mono” to “monopoly” Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz Or putting MS logo on the mono logo Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz That’s more gentle IMHO Apr 25 20:02
schestowitz I was advised by people not to be ‘hardcore’ on insulting projects Apr 25 20:03
seller_liar trmanco: explain to schestowitz about dotgnu and mono comparison Apr 25 20:03
schestowitz Nor people Apr 25 20:03
schestowitz seller_liar: you know it pretty well Apr 25 20:03
schestowitz You could type it in the wiki as you did, noy just here Apr 25 20:03
schestowitz We have posts about it in BN also Apr 25 20:03
schestowitz So it’s not necessary to start from scratch Apr 25 20:03
seller_liar schestowitz: ok Apr 25 20:04
schestowitz In the summer I’ll write LOADS Apr 25 20:04
trmanco seller_liar, I’m sure he knows the differences Apr 25 20:04
trmanco he probably know more than I do Apr 25 20:04
trmanco knows Apr 25 20:04
schestowitz Michael is in Italy..  http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php… Apr 25 20:07
schestowitz Dina Bass, who is close to Microsoft, span the company’s results in Bloomberg Apr 25 20:16
schestowitz How predictable. Apr 25 20:16
schestowitz We have Microsoft E-mails about her interactions Apr 25 20:16
Omar87 seller_liar: By the way, Opensource is actually a part of FreeSoftware, but it cannot be separated from it. Because treating OpenSource as a stand-alone concept, like you said, can be the best recipe for disaster. Apr 25 20:17
schestowitz “…Microsoft reaffirmed plans to eliminate as many as 5,000 jobs” Apr 25 20:18
schestowitz Turns out profit fell by 33%, not 32 or 30 like others reported Apr 25 20:18
schestowitz Microsoft tried to spin its way out of it Apr 25 20:19
schestowitz Lackeys like Bass helped them Apr 25 20:19
Omar87 seller_liar: However, even Free Software needs some sort of management. For example, on the road, you are totally free to drive a car as long as you are authorized to do that (e.g: well trained on driving and have a legal official license), but you are not allowed to cross the red light or exceed a certain speed limit, because this might get you and/or other people hurt. Apr 25 20:21
schestowitz Nice analogy Apr 25 20:21
Omar87 schestowitz: Thanks. :) Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz Hehe. Vista news in the past week: 2 Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz LOL Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz Let check Vista7 Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz “Microsoft reaffirmed plans to eliminate as many as 5,000 jobs” Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz YEah… according to Microsoft. Apr 25 20:22
schestowitz The company which is supposedly supported by dead people Apr 25 20:23
schestowitz Not followed it Apr 25 20:23
schestowitz IDG ‘article’ Apr 25 20:23
schestowitz Forbes: Forget Vista < http://www.forbes.com/2009/04/21/… > Apr 25 20:23
schestowitz The article is pro-MS BS though Apr 25 20:25
schestowitz Recites the Microsoft party lines and packs damage control Apr 25 20:25
schestowitz 17 results for win7 Apr 25 20:25
schestowitz The vapourware Apr 25 20:25
schestowitz Versus 2 for the real product Apr 25 20:26
amarsh04 schestowitz, did you see my mention of a now ex-ms anthropologist Anne Kirah Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz “Microsoft Leaks Windows 7 RC Date — Before May 5 – Slashdot” Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz How can Microsoft LEAK something? Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz Some other person can LEAK Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz Microsoft can only announce Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz It’s more of their PR nonsense Apr 25 20:28
schestowitz amarsh04: I haven’t, where? Apr 25 20:29
seller_liar Omar87: I know, but novell opensource way is not really opensource Apr 25 20:29
seller_liar Omar87: Novell opensource way is destructive Apr 25 20:30
amarsh04 found it on an abc.net.au web-ste: http://www.abc.net.au/rn/byd… – a Google search on her name shows that she no longer works for ms apparently Apr 25 20:31
Omar87 seller_liar: Yes, indeed. Which is why I said what I said. Apr 25 20:31
schestowitz seller_liar: Novell is not an open source company Apr 25 20:31
schestowitz Ask Novell Apr 25 20:31
schestowitz It’ll tell you Apr 25 20:31
schestowitz It’s a “mixed source” company Apr 25 20:31
schestowitz They bought SUSE hoping it would serve as a ramp to selling  non-Free lockin Apr 25 20:32
Omar87 schestowitz: Which is worse than Proprietary, lol. :) Apr 25 20:32
schestowitz Like Sentinel, Platespin etc Apr 25 20:32
schestowitz Omar87: Oracle does something similar Apr 25 20:32
seller_liar Why not follow the model of redhat or sun? Apr 25 20:32
schestowitz seller_liar: too much baggage Apr 25 20:32
schestowitz Novell cut the air supply of netware Apr 25 20:32
schestowitz I just got mail about it hours ago Apr 25 20:32
seller_liar about what? Apr 25 20:33
Omar87 seller_liar: Unfortunately, Sun is an Oracle property now.. -_- Apr 25 20:33
schestowitz “It might be worth finding out how Novell is dealing with apparent EOL of its main product.  Is it staying open source and steering its former customers to Samba, or is it simply yet another sales front for M$?” Apr 25 20:33
schestowitz I wondered the same thing. Apr 25 20:33
schestowitz “Could sound it out by floating the message that Samba is in some cases a drop-in replacement for Netware or Windows Server.” Apr 25 20:33
schestowitz Any idea what Novell plans for netware migration? Apr 25 20:33
amarsh04 Novell previously claimed that it would support IPX for 100 years Apr 25 20:34
seller_liar to go for suEse “linux” Apr 25 20:34
seller_liar and use commercial support for mono Apr 25 20:34
schestowitz http://www.informationweek.com/news/windows… (Windows 7: 83% Of Businesses Won’t Deploy Next Year) Apr 25 20:35
seller_liar look Apr 25 20:35
seller_liar http://www.mono-project.com/n… Apr 25 20:35
seller_liar suEse in action! Apr 25 20:35
Omar87 Damn! Suse is such a great distro., too bad it’s owned by such an evil company. Apr 25 20:35
schestowitz VistaDB. ? Apr 25 20:36
schestowitz “The Enterprise Mono Extension provides access to both commercial and open source databases including Microsoft’s SQL server, Oracle, PostgresSQL, MySQL, Sqlite and VistaDB. “ Apr 25 20:36
seller_liar look ,,the first example of Opensource is….. Apr 25 20:36
seller_liar M$ sql server! Apr 25 20:36
seller_liar Oh ,I have forgotten “commercial and opensource” Apr 25 20:37
Omar87 seller_liar: Which is not MS’es invention by the way. :) Apr 25 20:37
seller_liar Why use Ms sql server as first example Apr 25 20:37
MinceR well, it was open source while it was ingres Apr 25 20:37
Omar87 seller_liar: Wait, SQL Server was igres?? Apr 25 20:38
MinceR what’s great about suse? Apr 25 20:38
seller_liar novell loves to publish microsoft software Apr 25 20:38
MinceR Omar87: it’s derived from ingres Apr 25 20:38
Omar87 ingres** Apr 25 20:38
schestowitz MinceR: ugly reptiles Apr 25 20:38
MinceR just like most rdbms-es out there Apr 25 20:38
schestowitz Ask benJIman Apr 25 20:38
MinceR read the WP article ;) Apr 25 20:38
schestowitz Which one? Apr 25 20:39
schestowitz SUSE/Ballmer has a lot in common with Ballmer Apr 25 20:39
schestowitz Long tongues, changing colours Apr 25 20:39
schestowitz For the chameleon anyway Apr 25 20:39
benJIman Sybase iirc. Apr 25 20:41
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benJIman MinceR: It’s not an rdbms, neither arenpostgres or mysql. Apr 25 20:42
schestowitz Jessica Mintz – REDMOND, Wash – Microsoft’s shill at AP Apr 25 20:43
Omar87 benJIman: They are not relational dbms? Apr 25 20:43
schestowitz They make news out of nothing Apr 25 20:43
schestowitz More PR, never mind the link Apr 25 20:43
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benJIman Omar87: They’re not relational, no. Apr 25 20:45
Omar87 benJIman: Then what are they? Apr 25 20:45
benJIman Pseudo-relational dbmses. Apr 25 20:46
seller_liar hey roy you need to set plans for bn Apr 25 20:48
seller_liar For example  , reorder all wiki Apr 25 20:48
schestowitz Microsoft Taps Former IBM Tools Exec for Security Job < http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Application-D… > Apr 25 20:52
schestowitz Beware of IBM too. It’s also evil, it just doesn’t attack FOSS Apr 25 20:52
schestowitz seller_liar: yes, we definitely need lots of work Apr 25 20:52
schestowitz The front page of the Wiki is read like 1k times a day Apr 25 20:53
MinceR benJIman: they’re pseudo because they allow you to deviate from the theory nobody uses, right? :> Apr 25 20:53
schestowitz So it would be valuable to create a good index of posts Apr 25 20:53
schestowitz I plan to do it at some stage with your help Apr 25 20:53
schestowitz Groklaw did that some years ago too with help of readers Apr 25 20:53
seller_liar I have updated bn mission Apr 25 20:54
seller_liar look Apr 25 20:54
seller_liar http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/in… Apr 25 20:54
schestowitz Microsoft co-founder Paul Allen and the bankruptcy of his company is still in the headline Apr 25 20:55
schestowitz seller_liar: cool. Apr 25 20:55
seller_liar Paul Allen is a stupid guy Apr 25 20:56
seller_liar He has some disease .Paul allen does not understand the real meanning of life Apr 25 20:56
schestowitz Image added: http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php?t… Apr 25 20:59
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/wik… Apr 25 20:59
schestowitz I don’t want to spend much time on the Wiki just yet tough because I still invest just limited time in BN. Later on I’ll start picking up pace Apr 25 21:00
seller_liar ok ,don t worry . Apr 25 21:00
schestowitz It’s not hard to do all this, just a matter of time :-) Apr 25 21:02
schestowitz The only thing to rush is keeping up with news Apr 25 21:02
schestowitz Microsoft has no output Apr 25 21:02
benJIman MinceR: Because it’s impossible to comply with the theory. Apr 25 21:02
schestowitz The US depression brought things to a halt pretty much Apr 25 21:02
schestowitz The ‘poor’ journalists struiggle to find things to write about (is what I was told) Apr 25 21:03
schestowitz They jumped all over the Sun/Oracle deal because it’s ACTUAL news Apr 25 21:03
schestowitz Jason Stamper: “Did Oracle acquire Sun to stop Microsoft buying it?” Apr 25 21:05
schestowitz What a silly idea. Apr 25 21:05
schestowitz Not even FTC would allow it Apr 25 21:05
schestowitz http://www.businessreviewonline.com/blog/a… Apr 25 21:05
schestowitz Lawsuit settled over death of Matthew Ammon, a Microsoft lawyer killed in a Bellevue crane collapse < http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/techt… > Apr 25 21:13
seller_liar haha Apr 25 21:13
seller_liar look Apr 25 21:13
seller_liar http://beranger.org/v3/wordpress/ Apr 25 21:13
schestowitz seller_liar: he’s using Linux again Apr 25 21:13
schestowitz I told you Apr 25 21:13
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seller_liar but look about mono! Apr 25 21:13
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seller_liar “To please Roy(and myself)” Apr 25 21:14
schestowitz I see…… :-) Apr 25 21:14
MinceR benJIman: so you’re complaining because i used a term the way it’s used instead of in a way that would be useless. Apr 25 21:18
MinceR way to go. ;) Apr 25 21:19
MinceR next time you’ll be telling me that no programming language is turing-complete because you don’t have infinite memory. :> Apr 25 21:19
schestowitz Wall Street Journal: “Microsoft 3Q Net Down 32% On PC, Server Market Weakness” Apr 25 21:20
schestowitz I’m too lazy to do more posts about it Apr 25 21:20
schestowitz I don’t feel as though it’s needed, is it? Apr 25 21:20
schestowitz In prior mquarter it was harder to show that Microsoft was going down, which is was Apr 25 21:20
schestowitz It was concealing; this time not well enough (since a108) Apr 25 21:20
schestowitz Wintel press headline: “Microsoft Disappoints.” Apr 25 21:26
seller_liar the last openbsd version critiques microsoft-intel ACPI Apr 25 21:27
seller_liar http://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#45 Apr 25 21:28
schestowitz Wow. Many cuts at Microsoft this week. Apr 25 21:30
schestowitz Cancellations Apr 25 21:30
schestowitz Microsoft cuts CSR spend across Europe http://www.prweek.com/uk/sectors/… Apr 25 21:30
schestowitz Microsoft Cancels 2009 BI Conference, Schedules It For Every Two Years http://www.crn.com/software/217000139;… Apr 25 21:30
schestowitz Microsoft calls off summer picnic, cites need to reduce expenses http://www.techflash.com/microsoft/Micr… Apr 25 21:30
schestowitz All in a matter _of days_ Apr 25 21:31
schestowitz Who is Bill Rigby? Apr 25 21:32
trmanco Windows Bugs Never Truly Squashed: http://www.pcworld.com/article/163857/w… Apr 25 21:32
schestowitz Richard Waters, as usual, plays alone with the Microsoft party line in the Financial Tiems Apr 25 21:33
schestowitz Hehe Apr 25 21:33
schestowitz Funny typo there. Apr 25 21:33
schestowitz TIE-MS Apr 25 21:33
schestowitz Times Apr 25 21:33
schestowitz (ties with Microsoft) Apr 25 21:33
Balrog someone I know wants to license a program under a non-copyleft license. Apr 25 21:34
Balrog what’s best to use? Apr 25 21:34
Balrog New BSD? MIT? Apache? Apr 25 21:35
schestowitz Microsoft Origami is dead too now: Microsoft Origami site to fold by end of April http://www.slashgear.com/micro… Apr 25 21:36
Balrog schestowitz: what should I recommend? Apr 25 21:36
Balrog he specifically wants non-copyleft Apr 25 21:37
schestowitz Why? Apr 25 21:37
schestowitz Ask why Apr 25 21:37
schestowitz It’s reconcilable. Apr 25 21:37
Balrog “For all intents and purposes anyone has my permission to do with the code as you wish.” Apr 25 21:37
Balrog << right now the code is “Copyright all rights reserved” Apr 25 21:37
schestowitz Balrog: tell him he’d be ripped off for “Rape me”-type licence Apr 25 21:37
Balrog which means that’s not true. Apr 25 21:37
schestowitz Balrog: so he’s confused Apr 25 21:38
schestowitz Maybe not sure that BSD is almost like public domain Apr 25 21:38
Balrog it’s unlikely that anyone would use this code Apr 25 21:38
Balrog it’s a 68K mac emulator Apr 25 21:38
schestowitz make it gplv3 Apr 25 21:38
schestowitz it attarcts some devs Apr 25 21:38
Balrog he doesn’t want copyleft, specifically Apr 25 21:38
schestowitz At least the FOSS ones Apr 25 21:38
Balrog I know, but it’s hard to convince some people Apr 25 21:39
Balrog my problem is that ‘All right reserved” != open source Apr 25 21:39
Balrog and therefore I can’t use it for anything … others have complained. He is confused, obviously, and this is why probably it would be best just to go with a public-domain style license Apr 25 21:40
schestowitz The MS shill Jim Goldman shows up again Apr 25 21:41
schestowitz He meets with MS execs Apr 25 21:41
schestowitz Now he’s propping them up, as usual Apr 25 21:41
schestowitz http://www.cnbc.com/id/30368861 Apr 25 21:41
schestowitz I’m sick and tired with Hollywood type ‘news’ media glamorizing bad people Apr 25 21:41
schestowitz Balrog: tell him this Apr 25 21:42
schestowitz Most popular licence on Earath is GPL Apr 25 21:42
schestowitz So many developers have already decided Apr 25 21:42
schestowitz Unlike Windows, the GPL doesn’t get lumped into PCs by OEMs :-) Apr 25 21:42
schestowitz So it’s an actual choice Apr 25 21:42
Balrog schestowitz: as much as I’d like to, I can’t convince him to use GPL. BSD-style is ok because it’s GPL compatible Apr 25 21:42
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Balrog plus this is very low-profile software that not many people care about (except those writing this kind of software) Apr 25 21:43
schestowitz GPL means, I give my work to you and I expect you and others tobe equally generous Apr 25 21:43
Balrog I know. Apr 25 21:43
Balrog he doesn’t seem to care about that Apr 25 21:44
schestowitz I don’t feel qualifies to make recommendation on this type of licences Apr 25 21:45
schestowitz And I don’t want to say anything based on misconceptions or gut feeling. Apr 25 21:46
seller_liar OpenBsd people call Ibm of The “Open Source Friendly liar” Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz It is Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz But not one that attacks us Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz GOogle too has its flaws Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz IBM likes Eclipse licence Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz Google loves Apache Apr 25 21:46
schestowitz Goole HATES AGPLv* Apr 25 21:46
seller_liar all opensource devs are liars Apr 25 21:46
Balrog yeah, I know … Apr 25 21:47
MinceR the biggest flaw of google is that it exists Apr 25 21:47
MinceR seller_liar: explain. Apr 25 21:47
seller_liar MinceR: OpenSource looks for profits Apr 25 21:47
MinceR ..and? Apr 25 21:48
seller_liar MinceR: Sharing is more important than ethics Apr 25 21:48
MinceR not all of it though Apr 25 21:48
MinceR yes, some of them says that Apr 25 21:48
schestowitz I am still seeing older articles about MS layoffs Apr 25 21:48
schestowitz I very much doubt they will last Apr 25 21:48
schestowitz They said they would sack more Apr 25 21:48
schestowitz analysts said the same Apr 25 21:48
schestowitz Profits down 33% Apr 25 21:49
seller_liar MinceR: Opensource share code only to monetize code Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz And like Novell they delay the inevitable Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz seller_liar: opensoue doesn’t mean no  profit Apr 25 21:49
seller_liar when the code is sufficiently powerful , opensource devs tries do mix with proprietary things Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz See GNU manifesto Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz People need to make a living Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz They can cater for users of free software Apr 25 21:49
seller_liar I know , but opensource only thinks in profit Apr 25 21:49
schestowitz I was paid to write GPL s/w Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz Which I  enjoyed very much Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz I write code I OWN (well, in the GPL sense) Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz And make a living Apr 25 21:50
seller_liar There are as difference to live well developing software and get rich to developing software Apr 25 21:50
MinceR i doubt ESR shares all their stuff only to monetize it Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz seller_liar: open source != FS Apr 25 21:50
MinceR especially his INTERCAL compiler ;) Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz Don’t mix the two Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz I don’t fancy open source Apr 25 21:50
schestowitz I’m not fond of the “open core” BS that’s floating now Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz Making OSS just a PR thing Apr 25 21:51
seller_liar opensource people likes power Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz Cheapening of coding Apr 25 21:51
MinceR “open core”? Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz MinceR: don’t ask Apr 25 21:51
seller_liar to more precise= powerful software ,a lot of money and another powerfulk things Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz See this morning’s post Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz About MS EEE Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz seller_liar: Mozilla? Apr 25 21:51
schestowitz Mozilla has no millionaires Apr 25 21:52
schestowitz But they make great sw and make a livbing Apr 25 21:52
schestowitz Nothing wrong with that Apr 25 21:52
seller_liar free software priority is ethics = ethical software, ethics, quality of life Apr 25 21:52
schestowitz seller_liar: agreed Apr 25 21:52
schestowitz I don’t sacrifice for FS to promote some IBM Apr 25 21:52
schestowitz Some Apple fans spend (waste) their life helping billionaires like Jobs. Apr 25 21:53
schestowitz Which amuses me every time :-D Apr 25 21:53
seller_liar schestowitz: Yes ,although some values are discarded like proprietary plugins Apr 25 21:53
seller_liar But the biggest difference in open source and free  software is Apr 25 21:53
seller_liar Free software has a purpose Apr 25 21:53
seller_liar All to be free software and ethical Apr 25 21:53
seller_liar OpenSource not Apr 25 21:53
schestowitz Yup Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz OSS – back to selfishness Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz Job must be thinking, “what a bunch of suckers. I love them” Apr 25 21:54
seller_liar Opensource does not try to enforce all software must be free Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz Depends Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz Some OSS people are FS fans Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz But they go under OSS banner Apr 25 21:54
schestowitz Like OSI’s president Apr 25 21:54
seller_liar Opensource Likes the actual system Apr 25 21:55
schestowitz I’m like friends with him Apr 25 21:55
seller_liar poverty ,luxury , excessive money , money concentratio and all Apr 25 21:55
schestowitz And he’s very pro-GNU Apr 25 21:55
schestowitz But goes under “open source” Apr 25 21:55
seller_liar This is a exception , not a rule Apr 25 21:55
seller_liar People like linus for example and sUN Microsystems are opensource entirely Apr 25 21:55
MinceR who’s OSI’s president? Apr 25 21:56
seller_liar Linus lose the real purpose of free  software Apr 25 21:56
seller_liar Linus is dreaming in a illusion of money and power Apr 25 21:56
schestowitz Fresh Layoffs Coming To Microsoft? (MSFT) The Business Insider Apr 25 21:57
schestowitz seller_liar: Linux says “open source” Apr 25 21:57
schestowitz Alan Cox says “free software Apr 25 21:57
schestowitz Cox like FSFS Apr 25 21:57
schestowitz Torvalds hates FSF IMHO Apr 25 21:57
schestowitz Analyst: More layoffs at Microsoft possible Seattle Times Apr 25 21:58
schestowitz More Microsoft job cuts rumored Puget Sound Business Journal (Seattle) Bizjournals.com Apr 25 21:58
schestowitz More Microsoft job cuts rumored Puget Sound Business Journal (Seattle) Bizjournals.com Apr 25 21:58
schestowitz paidContent.org – Analyst: More Layoffs Coming To Microsoft Apr 25 21:58
schestowitz GNU/Linux saves many hours by coming so complete: http://jkontherun.com/2009/04/19/… Apr 25 22:03
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schestowitz Microsoft crack turns out to have been a DNS-level thing: http://www.theregister.co.uk… Apr 25 22:06
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schestowitz What is Chavez doing?!? http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/h… Apr 25 22:09
schestowitz Obama hopefully reads a little bit about history from that book Hugo gave him. Apr 25 22:09
schestowitz Mandriva takes a while to load now (bloat), but I only reboot like 6 times/year. I want to try and achieve 1-year uptime. The most I ever did was 200+ days Apr 25 22:11
schestowitz What a bad week this has been for Microsoft. So many things were QUIETLY canceled/axed. Apr 25 22:12
schestowitz MS’ Web division is down 17% http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/25… Apr 25 22:24
schestowitz The big tipping point is already here (before Thurs.).  I’ll do new posts to explains this. Apr 25 22:28
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*amarsh04 finally watched http://www.youtube.com/watch?v… (the singing fish on a volvo) Apr 25 22:30
schestowitz Whao Apr 25 22:32
schestowitz Whoa Apr 25 22:32
schestowitz High res Apr 25 22:32
schestowitz Never seen this Apr 25 22:33
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amarsh04 was referenced from linuxtoday.com back around March 31… since 2D acceleration was working on my new box as of the last 24 hours or so I tried it in konqueror/Adobe flash plugin and it played fine Apr 25 22:49
schestowitz Microsoft’s Origami folds; picnic cancelled; conference cancelled; PR budget cut worldwide http://boycottnovell.com/2009/0… Apr 25 22:59
seller_liar I was thinking…. Apr 25 23:06
seller_liar There are some people against all system Apr 25 23:06
seller_liar and Other people likes some things about system Apr 25 23:07
seller_liar Free software is against all corrupt and wild system Apr 25 23:07
seller_liar Open Source is not .Sometimes is even help the corrupt system in actual world Apr 25 23:07
seller_liar The propriety of system is pervert all less powerful things than system Apr 25 23:09
seller_liar So. Apr 25 23:09
seller_liar OpenSouce is corrupted Free software Apr 25 23:09
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schestowitz Further Confirmation That Microsoft’s Big Pain Comes from GNU/Linux on Sub-notebooks http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/25/… Apr 25 23:49
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