IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: May 26th, 2009

MinceRit would still remain as multifaceted as it already isMay 26 00:00
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MinceRso you could have the bloat if you wanted and you could avoid it if you wantedMay 26 00:00
MinceRand you could run all the popular apps on it either wayMay 26 00:00
_GoblinKeep in mind that many Windows users dont want to take the time to learn something new....May 26 00:00
MinceRthey're out of luck, considering that xp is deadMay 26 00:00
_GoblinCould you imagine the forums flooded with comments such as "Why cant I get the spinning cube to work, like I saw on Youtube"May 26 00:01
_GoblinWhat I would like to see is a more equal balance.May 26 00:01
MinceRaren't they already flooded?May 26 00:01
MinceRi imagine we could still set up elitist forumsMay 26 00:01
MinceRi already had an idea of implementing a barrier that only lets through people in the know -- for irc, for exampleMay 26 00:02
_GoblinI had the elitist debate with someone else, I dont think its elitist wanting (what I would have said in the 90's) lamers getting into Linux, its just they have to want to learn it and not expect everything handed to them on a plate....May 26 00:02
_Goblin* not wanting..May 26 00:03
MinceRactually, AROS can do antialiased truetype fonts tooMay 26 00:03
_Goblingive the liveCD a go....like I say, for a UAE station its great.May 26 00:03
MinceRi wouldn't mind even that -- eventually there will be companies that will hand them everything on a plateMay 26 00:04
MinceRfor a price.May 26 00:04
MinceRas long as hw and sw developers consider my platform important, i'll probably be happy.May 26 00:04
_Goblinbut then wouldn't that simply create a situation that we have now?May 26 00:04
MinceRit wouldn'tMay 26 00:04
MinceRbecause the dominant platform won't be a heap of design flaws implemented badlyMay 26 00:04
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MinceRand it will be compatible and interoperableMay 26 00:05
MinceRplus it will be founded on free software, which adds a lot of advantages on its ownMay 26 00:06
_Goblintrue, but as Microsoft have shown, you can sell anything and whilst the platform may be Linux, it will be flashy GUI's and one click operations that attract users.  This ethos could dominate just as Windows has done and be just as harmful to innovation...IMOMay 26 00:06
MinceRi can still choose my session manager, window manager, panel, file manager, etc. separately -- and the apps i run over themMay 26 00:07
_Goblinagreed, but it would have to be supported by anti-trust legislation...May 26 00:07
MinceRand it will still have to support a modular designMay 26 00:07
MinceRapplication designers won't be able to make assumptions about what the window manager is, for exampleMay 26 00:08
MinceRprobably there will be no more desire to skin each app differently eitherMay 26 00:08
MinceR(there's no point of the user can switch gui styles at will)May 26 00:09
MinceRs/of/if/May 26 00:09
MinceRthings can get ugly if a single stack ("distro") gains dominance, but even then it will be better than windows ever could be.May 26 00:10
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_Goblinsome very good points...Maybe I have a little snobbery of my own in respect of Linux...May 26 00:11
_GoblinHowever I still stick by my theory that a balanced market share between Linux/Windows platform would be better for innovation as the two compete with each other.May 26 00:11
_Hicham_Windows doesn't create anythingMay 26 00:12
_Hicham_you are wrong about thatMay 26 00:12
_Hicham_creativity come from the Linux sideMay 26 00:12
_Goblintrue.  Thats not what I meant....May 26 00:12
MinceRwindows never competesMay 26 00:12
MinceRit just tries to make competition impossibleMay 26 00:12
_GoblinIf Linux sets the benchmark and Windows immitates, Linux comes back with more creativity (and the same would apply for FOSS in general)May 26 00:13
schestowitz_Goblin: mistake thereMay 26 00:13
schestowitzGNOME vs KDEMay 26 00:13
schestowitzGrub and LiloMay 26 00:13
schestowitz32-bit and 64-bitMay 26 00:13
schestowitzARM vs x86May 26 00:14
schestowitzAndroid vs LinuxMay 26 00:14
MinceRi think for healthy competition we'll have to look to *bsd (unless they're consumed by their frustration), proprietary unix, and smaller projects like aros and haikuMay 26 00:14
schestowitzBSD vs LinuxMay 26 00:14
schestowitzThere's ALWAYS competitionMay 26 00:14
schestowitzgnote vs TomboyMay 26 00:14
_Goblintrue, cant argue with those examples...however...May 26 00:14
_GoblinlolMay 26 00:14
schestowitzThere's no real danger of monocultureMay 26 00:14
MinceRcrApple won't do either because they don't even know what a computer is forMay 26 00:14
schestowitzGNU GPL is a phenomenon, not a companyMay 26 00:14
schestowitzIt's a set of rulesMay 26 00:14
schestowitzIt's like saying that having 'democracy' (pseudo of course) all over the world is a dangerMay 26 00:15
MinceReven distros compete against each otherMay 26 00:15
MinceRand do things differentlyMay 26 00:15
_Hicham_Linux promotes competitionMay 26 00:15
_Hicham_schestowitz vs NovellMay 26 00:16
MinceRlolMay 26 00:16
schestowitzSouth Korea denounces nuke test http://cnnwire.blogs.cnn.com/2009/05/25/south-korea-denounces-norths-nuke-test/May 26 00:16
_Goblinok...point made...but I think that competition from a "completely outside source" is far better for innovation.  KDE v GNOME means nothing to average users who have been brought up on Windows...the average user (who we want to introduce to Linux) is going to be thinking in terms of Windows, so the innovation comes distro side as they try to "sell it" to users who have been brought up with Microsoft (IMO)May 26 00:16
MinceRwe do have completely outside sourcesMay 26 00:16
MinceRthey even want to competeMay 26 00:17
MinceRand the average user probably will think in terms of what brand computer they bought with preinstalled whateverMay 26 00:17
_Hicham_MS way is bad competitionMay 26 00:17
_Hicham_they are kicking under the beltMay 26 00:17
schestowitzYes, they compete:  http://www.eff.org/press/archives/2009/04/27May 26 00:18
schestowitzNot by making better products thoughMay 26 00:18
_Goblinvery true Hicham, but doesnt it show how strong Linux is?May 26 00:18
_GoblinWe are still here.  Microsoft has not been sucessful.May 26 00:18
MinceRthe war is not overMay 26 00:18
_GoblinHow much stronger do you think Linux is, because of the cheap and underhanded tactics its alleged MS employ?May 26 00:19
MinceRnot at allMay 26 00:19
schestowitzWe know better nowMay 26 00:19
_Hicham_I can't browse BN with FF3.5beta5May 26 00:19
MinceRthose tactics only damage everyone and everything, except m$May 26 00:19
schestowitz_Hicham_: why?May 26 00:19
_Hicham_I have to use ChromiumMay 26 00:19
_Hicham_the problem that I told uMay 26 00:19
_Hicham_high CPU usageMay 26 00:20
_GoblinMinceR, so how come now more than ever more people are switching to Linux?May 26 00:20
_Hicham_I disabled JSMay 26 00:20
_Hicham_JavaMay 26 00:20
_Hicham_nothing changedMay 26 00:20
MinceR_Goblin: m$'s grip on the industry is slippingMay 26 00:20
_Hicham_seems something related to new experimental GeckoMay 26 00:20
MinceR_Goblin: they've built everything over the ill-gotten monopoly of windows, which is dyingMay 26 00:20
MinceRwith it, everything else is going awayMay 26 00:20
_GoblinI think the tactics of MS have been a launchpad for Linux popularity...May 26 00:20
MinceRand they can't regain itMay 26 00:20
MinceRcompared to what?May 26 00:21
MinceRwithout m$, GNU/Linux could have gained popularity a lot fasterMay 26 00:21
MinceRthe real challenges were never about technical merit hereMay 26 00:21
MinceRrather, beating the roadblocks put up by m$May 26 00:21
schestowitz_Hicham_: did you try opening just one page? Same outcome?May 26 00:21
_Goblinfor example...the gifting of bloggers, the failure of Vista, the MS arrogance...the fact that users will no longer blame themselves for flaws in the Windows platform.May 26 00:21
schestowitzMaybe it's the Ogg embedments?May 26 00:22
MinceR(threatening and bribing OEMs, bribing politicians, legal issues, FUD, etc.)May 26 00:22
_Hicham_schestowitz : no it is not oggMay 26 00:22
MinceR_Goblin: who did users blame before m$?May 26 00:22
_Hicham_it is not even xulrunner-1.9.1May 26 00:22
_Hicham_it is firefox itselfMay 26 00:22
_Hicham_something weirdMay 26 00:22
schestowitzWeirdMay 26 00:22
schestowitzYeah..May 26 00:22
_Hicham_it is a weird bugMay 26 00:23
_Goblinwhat?May 26 00:23
_Hicham_coz Epiphany uses the same xulrunnerMay 26 00:23
_Hicham_Chromium is much fasterMay 26 00:23
_Hicham_hell faster on BNMay 26 00:23
MinceR_Goblin: did users blame themselves for flaws in the OS and apps before the IBM PC?May 26 00:23
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MinceRalso, consider the case when a GNU/Linux still in early development suffices only for some tasks and not for othersMay 26 00:24
MinceRconsider that a m$-controlled environment was very detrimental for mixed deploymentsMay 26 00:24
MinceRfor example, what a windows install does to dual bootingMay 26 00:24
MinceR(overwriting the MBR, bluescreening upon seeing the partition table)May 26 00:24
schestowitzWTF? I wget ff and it gets me the exe fileMay 26 00:24
_Goblinsorry..missed that original comment...I think users blamed themselves for issues with MS products, since they took it as fact that MS would never release a buggy piece of software..May 26 00:24
MinceRi'm not sure about that -- the way i see it is that m$ lowered the standards of quality severelyMay 26 00:25
MinceRpeople believe it's normal for an IT system to be utterly unreliableMay 26 00:25
_GoblinMS was very good (IMO) at shifting the blame.  I believe the catalyist for the realization by users that maybe the problem was infact with Microsoft was ME not Vista.  Vista merely reinforced that opinion.May 26 00:25
MinceRpeople believe rebooting is just business as usualMay 26 00:25
_Goblinvery true...May 26 00:26
_GoblinSlow operation, malware, memory leaks are all considered "occupational hazzards" by Windows users.May 26 00:26
schestowitzI'm installing ff3.5 nowMay 26 00:28
_GoblinI dont think my #!CBL distro has given me any issues..May 26 00:28
MinceRi've had issues on all platforms i've usedMay 26 00:28
MinceRbut lesser ones on GNU/LinuxMay 26 00:28
MinceRand they could be worked around for the most partMay 26 00:28
_GoblinI've been very lucky...May 26 00:29
MinceRwith windows, there's usually no way aroundMay 26 00:29
MinceRit just does what it wants and all i can do is sit and curse.May 26 00:29
_Goblinthere is a workaround, its easy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVbf9tOGwnoMay 26 00:31
_Hicham_schestowitz : is there Firefox3.5beta5 in Mandriva?May 26 00:32
MinceRlolMay 26 00:33
schestowitzHoly c*. FF3.5 scrolls so slowly I could screamMay 26 00:35
_Hicham_you see?May 26 00:36
_Hicham_do u think I should file a bug to Mozilla?May 26 00:37
schestowitz_Hicham_: I can run both nowMay 26 00:39
schestowitzFor testing purpoisesMay 26 00:39
schestowitzBN worked fine in FF3.5 beta4May 26 00:39
schestowitzI had issues with plugins (I have over 20) and another site of mine -- slow scrollingMay 26 00:39
schestowitz_Hicham_: yes, tell them about slow scrollingMay 26 00:40
schestowitzGive URL examplesMay 26 00:40
_Hicham_slow is a real problemMay 26 00:40
_Hicham_slow scrolling makes me go nutMay 26 00:40
schestowitzYes, makes it impossible to cope withMay 26 00:40
_Hicham_with high CPU usageMay 26 00:40
_Hicham_there is no feedback on the terminalMay 26 00:41
_Hicham_even with debugging symbolsMay 26 00:41
MinceRgnMay 26 00:42
schestowitzgnMay 26 00:43
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_GoblingnMay 26 00:43
_Hicham_wb taconeMay 26 00:45
MinceR(flash) (video) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2GyGv-RqFM&feature=relatedMay 26 00:45
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the_mad_hatterRoy, comment on Groklaw has an old "Best of Usenet" post that's pretty funnyMay 26 00:49
the_mad_hatterhttp://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090523231352189#c758248May 26 00:49
the_mad_hatterMicrosoft Food for WindowsMay 26 00:49
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MinceRMicrosoft® World™ for Widows™May 26 00:51
the_mad_hatterHere's the link to the post in alt.best.of.internetMay 26 00:51
the_mad_hatterhttp://groups.google.com/group/alt.best.of.internet/browse_thread/thread/fab6117ba519d49e/830e395da5ceaf76?hl=en&q=Microsoft+Food+for+Windows#830e395da5ceaf76May 26 00:51
the_mad_hatterWidows? wow.May 26 00:51
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_Hicham_1Hi oiaohmMay 26 00:57
tessierheh...I had never seen that Microsoft Food thing either.May 26 00:57
_Hicham_1schestowitz : https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=100951May 26 00:58
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oiaohmVLC is going to get timeshifting.May 26 00:59
_Hicham_I don't use VLC anymoreMay 26 01:00
_Hicham_because of its Qt interfaceMay 26 01:00
_Hicham_there is an ongoing project to create a GTK interfaceMay 26 01:00
_Hicham_but it has stalledMay 26 01:01
oiaohmReally when it comes to GTK there are not many good media players.May 26 01:01
_Hicham_GNOME MplayerMay 26 01:02
_Hicham_the front-end to MPlayerMay 26 01:02
_Hicham_and it is very well integrated into GNOMEMay 26 01:02
_Hicham_and it has a browser plugin : gecko-mediaplayerMay 26 01:03
_Hicham_It would have been nice to use Gstreamer for all appsMay 26 01:03
_Hicham_but totem is crappyMay 26 01:03
oiaohmhttp://smplayer.sourceforge.net/  kinda nicer and its not the only one when it comes to front ends that is like that _Hicham_May 26 01:03
_Hicham_and its developer (Bastien Nocera ) do not seem concernedMay 26 01:03
taconethe most stupid post i ever wrote made to the digg frontpageMay 26 01:04
taconeit makes sense...May 26 01:04
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oiaohmThere seams to be design issues in the gtk camp with media players.May 26 01:04
_Hicham_what design issues?May 26 01:04
oiaohmMaking the interface simple to use by mouse _Hicham_May 26 01:05
_Hicham_you mean the right click menu?May 26 01:05
oiaohmLot of the gtk ones skip when not in full screen having buttons to click on to play stop and the like.   Layout of right click menu also can be a mess.  Lot are also using non dockable playlists so no prevention from windows overlap.May 26 01:09
oiaohmAll interface design issues _Hicham_May 26 01:09
oiaohmI really don't know what makes QT applications different that lots of those issues don't happen.May 26 01:10
_Hicham_did u use GNOME MPlayer?May 26 01:10
oiaohmYes before ending up going to kmplayer than to smplayerMay 26 01:11
oiaohmthan/thenMay 26 01:11
_Hicham_which version of GNOME Mplayer?May 26 01:12
_Hicham_0.9.x ?May 26 01:12
oiaohmIt was back in the 0.6.x ie last year.May 26 01:14
_Hicham_normalMay 26 01:14
_Hicham_it has improved a lot since thenMay 26 01:14
oiaohmIt kinda required to.May 26 01:15
_Hicham_it was a small projectMay 26 01:15
_Hicham_but it would have been nice if there is more work on GstreameMay 26 01:16
_Hicham_Gstreamer is a nice frameworkMay 26 01:16
oiaohmHave they made there control buttons a decent size to see.May 26 01:16
_Hicham_it is the equivalent of DirectShow/DirectSoundMay 26 01:17
_Hicham_yesMay 26 01:17
_Hicham_I am gonna give u a screenshotMay 26 01:17
oiaohmLot of my media players I like control with left click.May 26 01:17
_Hicham_u mean for pause/play?May 26 01:18
oiaohmaccessing and altering playlist skiping tracks removing track...  Basically all the genneral usage.May 26 01:20
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oiaohmhttp://smplayer.sourceforge.net/images/screenshots/playlist_embedded3.jpg  << Look at bar under menu.   Along it.  folder , disk ,url opens.  Full screen and compat mode, Snapshot button added by developer for bug reporting, info on what is playing, playlist on and off,  and configure.May 26 01:27
oiaohmWith it for most usage you don't touch the menu bar or right click menus.May 26 01:27
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yuhongOn the matter of Ballnux and GNU/Linux, during the GPLv3 drafting process, I once read a rationale document from the FSF saying that SLES should be called "SUSE GNU/Linux Enterprise Server".May 26 01:30
yuhongHere it is:May 26 01:31
yuhonghttp://gplv3.fsf.org/gpl3-dd3-rationale.pdfMay 26 01:31
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oiaohmTrue SUSE could have chosen the BSD stack.May 26 01:32
yuhong Yes, and in fact there is Debian/kFreeBSD and Debian/kNetBSD.May 26 01:34
yuhongBut BN uses Ballnux to refer to SUSE and friends and GNU/Linux to refer to all others.May 26 01:34
yuhongI just want to point this out.May 26 01:34
yuhongSo I just want to point this out.May 26 01:35
oiaohmGPLv3 is on lots of key bits.May 26 01:35
yuhongYep.May 26 01:36
yuhongIncluding the MS/Novell deal.May 26 01:36
yuhongBTW, reading about MS visits was interesting, because I live near there, but never visited MS.May 26 01:37
oiaohmRead GPLv3 carefully.May 26 01:37
oiaohmIt realy does not allow MS/Novell to rewrite there deal.May 26 01:38
yuhongYep.May 26 01:38
yuhongI know.May 26 01:38
oiaohmOnly deals created before a particular date apply.May 26 01:38
oiaohmIt also does not allow Novell to renew.May 26 01:38
yuhongBut that is beside the point.May 26 01:38
oiaohmSo 5 years after GPLv3 crunch.May 26 01:39
yuhongGood.May 26 01:39
yuhongIt was in a footnote, BTW.May 26 01:40
oiaohm28 March 2007  Its not that far off.May 26 01:41
oiaohm28 March 2012May 26 01:41
yuhongThis is a GNU/Linux distribution, and is properly called SUSE GNU/Linux EnterpriseMay 26 01:41
yuhongServer.May 26 01:41
yuhong"This is a GNU/Linux distribution, and is properly called SUSE GNU/Linux Enterprise Server."May 26 01:42
yuhongGood also.May 26 01:42
yuhongBut that is besides my point.May 26 01:42
oiaohmLinus does does not agree with the GNU tittle.May 26 01:43
yuhongI know.May 26 01:43
oiaohmSince a linux distribution is make up of programs from all different sources.May 26 01:43
yuhongYep.May 26 01:43
oiaohmHe classes is as kinda disrespectiful to other licences.May 26 01:43
oiaohmI agree with him on that.May 26 01:43
tessierI wish people weren't so dismissive of freedom when it comes to software.May 26 01:44
tessierThey just don't see it as a big deal.May 26 01:44
tessierInstead they prefer to be "pragmatic"May 26 01:44
tessierWhich is like a pessimist saying that they are a realist.May 26 01:44
yuhongI know.May 26 01:44
oiaohmtessier: freedom without tools to do you work is not freedom.May 26 01:44
twitteror a slave saying that things can never be differentMay 26 01:44
yuhongBTW, I mentioned this before, but after reading about IBM, Oracle, Google on open source, I feel this is worth mentioning again.May 26 01:45
yuhonghttp://www.interopnews.com/analysis/has-open-source-jumped-the-shark.htmlMay 26 01:45
twitterlooks like a troll to me.May 26 01:45
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yuhongWhy?May 26 01:45
yuhongIt does have some issues.May 26 01:45
twitter"jumped the shark"May 26 01:45
twitterthat's a really old, worn out buzzwordMay 26 01:46
twitterthe analysis is likely to be equally staleMay 26 01:46
twitterand it's simply wrong, free software is better now than ever.May 26 01:47
oiaohmIBM and Orcale submit huge stacks of code to open source.May 26 01:47
oiaohmOk they also do closed source work.May 26 01:47
oiaohmSo what they respect Open Source licences they are free do make a profit.May 26 01:47
twittereveryone who uses free software commercially should be sharing what they doMay 26 01:48
twitterthey make plenty of money without violating people's freedomMay 26 01:48
yuhongYep.May 26 01:48
oiaohmOrcale and IBM both follow standards are much as they can even in there closed source programs.May 26 01:49
yuhongYep.May 26 01:49
yuhongODF, for example.May 26 01:49
twitterIt is cheaper to cooperateMay 26 01:50
oiaohmSo trying to avoid vendor locking that takes away users freedom to access there data.May 26 01:50
yuhongFor example, I have read article on BN saying that Google is a closed source company because of the AGPL issues.May 26 01:50
oiaohmOk IBM and Orcale not what some people would like ie sharing everything.May 26 01:51
yuhongI know.May 26 01:51
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oiaohmBut I am fare happier with either IBM or Orcale compared to MS or Apple.May 26 01:51
yuhongAgreed also.May 26 01:51
oiaohmWe are not going to get a perfect world.May 26 01:51
yuhongOf course not.May 26 01:52
oiaohmWe have to get a decent one.May 26 01:52
yuhongYep.May 26 01:52
yuhongBut I have read article on BN saying that Google is a closed source company because of the AGPL issues.May 26 01:52
oiaohmWhere persons right to access there own created data exists.May 26 01:52
oiaohmFrom what ever system they like.May 26 01:52
yuhongYep.May 26 01:52
yuhongAs well as on IBM and Oracle.May 26 01:52
oiaohmThat of course does not excude closed source.May 26 01:53
yuhongOf course not.May 26 01:53
yuhongI also read articles on BN on how Oracle harms MySQL.May 26 01:53
yuhongSo I thought this would be an interesting read.May 26 01:53
oiaohmBiggest mistake we could do is make companies like IBM and Oracle as evil because they don't share.May 26 01:53
yuhongYep.May 26 01:54
oiaohmWe all know the cooperation savings in development.   Money people at each will have to work it out in time.May 26 01:54
yuhongYep.May 26 01:54
oiaohmMost important thing is freedom of data.   Its more important than freedom of source.May 26 01:56
oiaohmReason a program can be only source and that is the only program on earth that can read the data.May 26 01:56
yuhongYep.May 26 01:56
oiaohmSo it can be just as bad in some cases as vendor locking for some companies.May 26 01:56
yuhongYep.May 26 01:56
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yuhongOn church and state separation and Ziff Davis, I don't really get it.May 26 01:58
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/03/16/ziff-davis-and-microsoft/May 26 01:58
oiaohmMS has done a lot of this.May 26 01:59
oiaohmIts called buying the press yuhong.May 26 01:59
yuhongYep.May 26 01:59
oiaohmSimpler things where tried here.May 26 02:00
yuhongAnd I have read this before:May 26 02:00
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/02/08/microsoft-evilness-galore/May 26 02:00
oiaohmWe have a tv show called media watch.May 26 02:00
oiaohmRun by the goverment tv channel.May 26 02:00
yuhongBut I don't really get how the church and state separation is breached.May 26 02:00
oiaohmThey kinda inspect the media looking for where money has broken the law.May 26 02:01
oiaohmWe had what was called cash for comment case here.May 26 02:01
yuhongI am downloading the pdf in hope to see more on this.May 26 02:01
oiaohmWhere advertises were paying to control what radio operators were saying.May 26 02:01
oiaohmwhen not clearly defined as advertising.May 26 02:01
yuhongI know.May 26 02:02
oiaohmThis is breach of what church and state separation is classed as.May 26 02:02
yuhongYep.May 26 02:02
oiaohmBoth should have there own ideas not directly controlling the other.May 26 02:02
yuhongYep.May 26 02:03
oiaohmIe church controlling state is bad.May 26 02:03
yuhongYep.May 26 02:03
oiaohmand state controlling church is bad.May 26 02:03
yuhongYep.May 26 02:03
yuhongBut this BN page donMay 26 02:03
yuhongBut this BN page don't say much about breaching church and state.May 26 02:03
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/02/08/microsoft-evilness-galore/May 26 02:03
yuhongI am downloading the PDF.May 26 02:04
yuhongWhat I don't get is how *MS* breaches church and statMay 26 02:04
oiaohmBN is a release for schestowitz who collects documents.May 26 02:04
yuhongYep.May 26 02:04
oiaohmMS has gone as far as reviewing media articals before they are released yuhongMay 26 02:05
yuhongYep.May 26 02:05
oiaohmSo the media was no longer independant.May 26 02:05
yuhongYep.May 26 02:05
oiaohmmedia ie is ment to be independant.May 26 02:05
yuhongYep.May 26 02:05
oiaohmOther than advertising.May 26 02:05
yuhongYep.May 26 02:06
oiaohmSo it falls under the legal of breach of church and state.May 26 02:06
oiaohmOld laws.May 26 02:06
oiaohmwriten before media companies existed and the two biggest groups where church and state.May 26 02:06
oiaohmEven before the existance of big companies.May 26 02:07
oiaohmLaw becomes a history leason at times.May 26 02:07
yuhongFrom http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/what-happened-gutsMay 26 02:08
yuhong"Of one thing I am fairly certain. Microsoft all but eliminated mainstream software competition. As a result, Microsoft became the primary source of advertising revenue for mainstream publications. You don't bite the hand that feeds you."May 26 02:08
yuhongWhich led me to wonder what happens if say Red Hat tried to advertise in IDG.May 26 02:09
oiaohmRedhat has.May 26 02:10
oiaohmStill did not change the bias.May 26 02:10
yuhongWhy?May 26 02:11
oiaohmMicrosoft has gone the step deeper in.May 26 02:11
yuhongI get it now.May 26 02:11
oiaohmPeople don't understand the harm a company can do by placing its past staff in other companies.May 26 02:11
yuhongYep.May 26 02:12
yuhongI know.May 26 02:12
oiaohmYou get someone highly protectitve of MS and get them inside you have a highly bias media.May 26 02:12
oiaohmSome media companies these days are culling those staff.May 26 02:12
yuhongI get it now, and it is not limited to media companies.May 26 02:12
oiaohmEmbrace Extended ExtigusihMay 26 02:13
yuhongYep.May 26 02:13
oiaohmThe tripple EEE designed by MS.May 26 02:13
yuhongIMO, extending ODF is better than OOXML IMO.May 26 02:13
oiaohmShould be highly illegal.May 26 02:13
yuhongBut the ODF implemention in Office 2007 SP2 is bad.May 26 02:14
oiaohmSo is 2007 implementation of OOXMLMay 26 02:14
yuhongBTW, can you give me some names of former MS executives in IDG?May 26 02:14
oiaohmIt fails the spec test too.May 26 02:14
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yuhongI want to do some research on this.May 26 02:14
oiaohmschestowitz is the better person on trackig of stuff.May 26 02:14
yuhongYep.May 26 02:15
oiaohmI am more just aware of what is going on.  schestowitz is useful.May 26 02:15
oiaohmOk some of his articals go over the top.May 26 02:15
oiaohmbut the documentation collection is the most valable thing schestowitz provides.May 26 02:16
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oiaohmParticularly when you think you are being attacked by a company.May 26 02:16
oiaohmHistory is handy to work out what an attacker will do next.May 26 02:16
yuhongAgreed, for example, the articles on Google/AGPL and Oracle/MySQL are some of why I was pointing out that link in the first place.May 26 02:17
yuhongOn software patents being fundmentally flawed and should be abolishedMay 26 02:18
oiaohmPatents are a whole are not running as they attented.May 26 02:18
oiaohmPatents were ment to provide access to tech not restrict it.May 26 02:18
yuhongYep, I was talking about abolishing of software patents.May 26 02:19
oiaohmMedical patents on dna are worse.May 26 02:19
yuhongThe fundemental problem is that licensing is tied to the business model of non-free software.May 26 02:20
oiaohmAnd stuff like that does kill people.May 26 02:20
yuhongWhich is in turn depended on artificial scarcity.May 26 02:20
oiaohmSoftware patents I want gone but they are not the more harmful.May 26 02:20
yuhongWhich is fundementally flawed, and not just for software.May 26 02:20
oiaohmPatent system need to be reformed to how it was ment to work.May 26 02:21
oiaohmIf someone lives in a poor area and cannot aford the drugs and the drugs can be made cheeply patent holder should have to take a pay cut so poor people can afford it.May 26 02:21
yuhongAnother example is that last IRC session, I talked about Linux boot-time rootkits.May 26 02:21
oiaohmLinux at this stage is open to boot-time root kits.May 26 02:22
yuhongThat was motiviated by an article saying that 7's security is fundementally flawed.May 26 02:22
oiaohmTPM is being added to the Linux kernel yuhongMay 26 02:22
yuhongYep as well as Windows.May 26 02:22
oiaohmLinux kernel can also be placed in the bios chip.May 26 02:22
oiaohmOut of reach.May 26 02:23
yuhongGuess my reaction when I read that the only base of that accusion is a Windows boot-time rootkit.May 26 02:23
oiaohmIf you need a Linux system hardened against boot time you remove the device side of it.May 26 02:23
yuhongYep.May 26 02:23
oiaohmIf you cannot change boot devices how in hell are you going to get in.May 26 02:24
oiaohmNormal distributions against windows 7 attacks I will give you are open to it.May 26 02:24
oiaohmHarded to hell distributions where bios really don't exist the Linux kernel is basically the bios chip is solid.May 26 02:25
yuhongYep.May 26 02:25
oiaohmMS was trying to claim it was as strong as super hardered Linux's.May 26 02:25
oiaohmIts simply not.May 26 02:25
yuhongAnyway finally I have that article I mentioned.May 26 02:26
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/23/vista-7-cannot-be-fixed/May 26 02:26
oiaohmLinux guys want to pull MS into motherboard embeded.May 26 02:26
oiaohmIf we can get MS in there we have them dead.May 26 02:26
yuhongYep.May 26 02:27
oiaohmI don't see MS living on 1 cent a copy.May 26 02:27
yuhongYep.May 26 02:27
yuhongIt says "Vista 7 Security “Cannot be Fixed. It’s a Design Problem.”.May 26 02:27
twitterOhm, you seem to be a big fan of X.  Here's a nice article that Roy pointed to about it.  http://wiki.debian.org/XStrikeForce/InputHotplugGuideMay 26 02:27
twitterenjoy :)May 26 02:28
oiaohmBeen following that work for 4 years now.  twitter most of those alterations are coming from the MPX project by the way twitter.May 26 02:29
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yuhongGuess my reaction when I read that the only base of that accusion is was Windows boot-time rootkit.May 26 02:29
yuhongCalled "VBootkit 2.0".May 26 02:29
twitterIf you have been following that for 4 years, how can you complain of "bit rot" and nothing happening?May 26 02:30
twitterLooks like very active development to me.May 26 02:30
yuhonghttp://www.networkworld.com/news/2009/042309-researchers-show-how-to-take.htmlMay 26 02:30
oiaohmReally vista could be fixed but you are looking about maybe a billion or 2 in code alteration.May 26 02:30
twitterI already knew that there had been lots of improvement from simply using the software over 10 years, so I thought you were full of FUD.  Now I know for sure.May 26 02:31
oiaohmtwitter: there is a problem.  Why did like proper multi X11 support fail to get main line for a long time even that the framework for it was designed in 1996.May 26 02:32
oiaohmThere has been major maintainer ship issues in X11 twitter.    Since Intel taken a interest and provided someone to truely care for it things have gone ahead in leaps and bounds.May 26 02:33
oiaohmLooking at X11 history teachers you some important lesons.  Looking at Linux kernel BKL mistake also teachs you some important leason.May 26 02:34
oiaohmIt got to the point with the Linux BKL that no one really knew what it was doing due to code neglect.   Project can have new features added yet have core parts bit rotting.May 26 02:35
oiaohmSame was true inside X11.   Really in 2004 should of the internals of X11 still been processing on a single thread using virtual multithreading.  Ie not using the OS provided mult threading twitter.May 26 02:36
oiaohmMost likely those two are the tip of a very large iceberg that we all need to keep our eyes open for.  To protect the long term future.  twitter.May 26 02:37
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oiaohmMS most likely has equal evils inside as well.May 26 02:38
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oiaohmDifference here twitter I know that feature adds don't mean bit rot in key areas of the code base is not happening.May 26 02:39
oiaohmtwitter: I am a history studing person.  I learn leasons from it.  Failure to do so only dooms us to repeating mistakes.May 26 02:46
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twitteryou are a troll, ohm.  the place to talk about xorg is on the developer boards with people who both know and are interested in improvements.  you bring up things you call problems here to make trouble, nothing more.May 26 03:04
oiaohmtwitter: I see you as a zellot.May 26 03:06
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twitterSo why do you hang out here?May 26 03:06
oiaohmtwitter:  Who will keep on saying things are prefect.  You call me a troll simply because i don't agree with that look in the world.May 26 03:07
oiaohmI want open source to improve.  twitter I do give feed back into projects for that reason.May 26 03:07
twitterDon't try to redefine what I said.May 26 03:07
twitteryou want to make trouble.May 26 03:07
oiaohmDid you not see the survey on Linux usage.May 26 03:08
twitterNo, I did not.May 26 03:08
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twitterDid you conduct one?May 26 03:09
twitterThat would be interesting.May 26 03:09
oiaohmhttp://ldn.linuxfoundation.org/node/27455  << No I did not.May 26 03:09
oiaohmThis is a true and open survey.May 26 03:10
oiaohmThere are areas of Linux that need work.  Making out there is not you are setting self up for failure.May 26 03:10
twitter"  Avoid users who feel they must have (or really should have) Windows to do their jobs."May 26 03:10
oiaohmGet enough converted most do follow.May 26 03:11
twitter"Some users .. may be emotionally or practically wedded to Windows,” said Dale Vile, research director, Freeform Dynamics. “The trick is to avoid getting distracted by these"May 26 03:11
oiaohmThe gaps is what blocks 100 percent conversion at times twitter.May 26 03:11
twitterI'd say the way to move on desktop GNU/Linux is to avoid and ignore the fanboys.May 26 03:12
twitterPeople like you will always find faults.May 26 03:12
twitterBut it's BS, and needs to be ignored.May 26 03:12
oiaohmNote the really should have.May 26 03:12
oiaohmThere are cases were people simply cannot do there job without windows.May 26 03:13
twitterAs RMS said years ago, you can't get north by going east.May 26 03:13
oiaohmMost caused by outside entities to company.May 26 03:13
twitterIt's easy enough to avoid the 1% of desktop users who are emotionally or practically dependent on Windows.  The rest will be happy with the result.May 26 03:14
oiaohmSaying Linux is perfect for everything has those 1% fighting you.May 26 03:14
oiaohmCompared to targeted deployment were it suits.  Where that 1 percent leaves you alone.May 26 03:15
twitterDon't try to redefine the things I say, ohm.May 26 03:15
twitterI say GNU/Linux is better, not perfect.May 26 03:15
oiaohmProblem is it not better in all cases.May 26 03:15
oiaohmThey will take better as perfect.May 26 03:15
oiaohmAnd they will skin you.May 26 03:16
twitterThe 1% will fight no matter what.  They need to be left with the dinky crap they love until they see reality.May 26 03:16
oiaohmTruely no.May 26 03:16
oiaohmIf you don't attack them.  You can do the convert without there arguments.May 26 03:16
twitterPeople like you will always say that, and I think I'm tired of listening to your bullshit.May 26 03:16
oiaohmProblem is its not bullshit.   It what you got to do so deployments happen.May 26 03:17
oiaohmRemember a riot only needs a few people to set it off.May 26 03:17
oiaohmThat is basically what happens if you handled it wrong.  That 1percent will get like 60 percent of them up in arms with you if you don't watch how you handle it.May 26 03:19
oiaohmLot of cases that ends with the idea of migration to Linux scrapped.  So failure.May 26 03:19
oiaohmBest riot bomb they have is why should we have to learn anything new.  You and I know that when you change between windows you have to learn a lot more.    Its simpler to be upfront deploy where fits.May 26 03:23
oiaohmAlso the areas where it don't fit reasons why we all should be focused on finding some solution twitter.May 26 03:23
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oiaohmMy goals the hopeful 100 percent remove from networks I work with twitter.May 26 03:26
oiaohmWindows licencing is a pain in the ass I don't want to deal with.May 26 03:27
oiaohmBy the way those mobile user problems they point to in that survey are some of my largest headaches.May 26 03:34
oiaohmMost likely unit to get infected with something is a laptop.   Its also the hardest to make running linux to intergrate back into a business network.   Something that really does need improving.May 26 03:42
twittermy laptop does not get infected and does not have any problem "integrating" with networks that don't run M$ crap.May 26 03:43
oiaohmBusiness networks where documents have to be synced back onto central server.May 26 03:44
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oiaohmSame with login information and the like twitter.May 26 03:46
twitterthat should be easyMay 26 03:46
oiaohmI knowMay 26 03:46
oiaohmshould is the word.May 26 03:46
twitterbut the drag is Windows, so why not throw it out?May 26 03:46
oiaohmJust do the pratical of it some time.   There are a lot of things that make the intergration of a system that connects and disconnects from network lot harder than it should be.May 26 03:48
twitterI'm sure Red Hat and IBM have it all figured out, thanksMay 26 03:51
oiaohmNeither do yet.May 26 03:51
twitterLOLMay 26 03:51
oiaohmI have no problems paying for Linux to get rid of windows by the way.May 26 03:51
oiaohmWork on Linux has been highly server focused.  Little things like connecting and disconnect a laptop from network has kinda been over looked.May 26 03:52
oiaohmthose little things hurt when trying to migrate everyone.May 26 03:52
oiaohmOf course Linux will catch up twitter.May 26 03:54
twitterI did not notice any problems at LSU's Linux lab.  You are full of FUD.May 26 03:55
oiaohmHow were they doing the sync then.May 26 03:56
oiaohmMaybe they have a method I missed.May 26 03:57
oiaohmMost likely others have as well twitter.May 26 03:58
twitterI use grsync myself.  I did not notice what LSU did.May 26 03:59
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oiaohmThat normally ends up in hell.May 26 04:00
twittersync has been solved for decades in the unix world.May 26 04:00
oiaohmUser are use to alter there profile and it auto sync.May 26 04:00
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oiaohmNo moving files between directories or syncing on there part.   Ie it just happens.May 26 04:01
twittersure thing, ohm.May 26 04:01
neighborleeanymore news about ECMA verification ? ;)May 26 04:01
neighborleeIc ant google atm..im installing gentoo < notes to self..kill friends>May 26 04:01
neighborleelolMay 26 04:02
oiaohmThat not having a nice neat way of doing it way they use to gets more reistance trying to migrate them.  twitter.  I hope cachefs and other techs will provide better auto syncing directories.May 26 04:03
oiaohmSo making migration of moble users more doable without as much reistance twitter.May 26 04:03
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oiaohmGets even more tricky with business laptops to twitter.  Were user logins laptop onto network so there user is now added to the laptop and the user can now disconnect that laptop from network and use it independant.May 26 04:10
oiaohmSmall but annoying sync hole.May 26 04:10
oiaohmAlso gets fun that these people expect sync to be happing real time in background when connected to network as well.  Yes extreamly fun to setup in windows. twitter.May 26 04:16
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schestowitztessier: is there mail configured for the VM? The previous account had mail notifications dispatched through WordPress, but in the VM it's returns to root's mail file with an error.May 26 07:09
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tessierschestowitz: Ah, right. I think you mentioned that once before. I will configure it.May 26 07:17
schestowitzAh, OK :-) I thought you'd done something already. Never harms to recheck. BTW, how should I keep copies of the DBs safe (off server)?May 26 07:18
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tessierI would suggest writing a cron job to do a mysqldump every night and copy them off somewhere safe. Maybe do a nightly rsync of your whole homedir or something.May 26 07:30
schestowitzThanks.May 26 07:31
schestowitzI tried mysqldump --user boycottn_wki –password=xxxxxx boycottn_wki > ~/wikidatabase_1.dumpMay 26 07:31
schestowitzDo I need root?May 26 07:31
schestowitzOT: Nokia's Linux-based N900 is coming: http://pocketnow.com/index.php?a=portal_detail&t=news&id=7461 http://blogs.zdnet.com/mobile-gadgeteer/?p=1805May 26 07:31
schestowitz"The distributed denial-of-service (DDoS) attack payload targeted SCO Group, a Unix vendor now famous for running itself into the ground making tremendously bad business decisions like trying to sue IBM on the strength of copyright claims related to Linux kernel source code." http://www.zdnetasia.com/techguide/security/0,39044901,62054348,00.htmMay 26 07:35
tessierYou should not need rootMay 26 07:42
tessiertry --password or just -p and it should prompt you for the pwMay 26 07:42
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schestowitzOh, I see...May 26 07:45
schestowitzLet me tryMay 26 07:45
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schestowitzI notice that it does scp but not rsyncMay 26 07:45
schestowitzNever mind, got it working too :-)May 26 07:46
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schestowitztessier: just to be sure, is it user boycottn_wki and DB boycottn_wki ?May 26 07:49
schestowitzOh I see...May 26 07:59
schestowitzUsername wrongMay 26 07:59
oiaohmI wish I could say person using wrong username was uncommon.May 26 08:08
schestowitztessier: thanks! I got it all working -- db dumps and rsyncMay 26 08:11
schestowitzoiaohm: my Palm record was wrongMay 26 08:11
schestowitzI went into the settings files (PHP) with the vars and saw thisMay 26 08:11
schestowitzoiaohm: it won't accept –password=<pw>May 26 08:13
oiaohmI have a list of reasons wrong usernames users have told me over time.   So far dog ate it is not on there yet.May 26 08:16
schestowitzAny idea why --password won't work?May 26 08:17
oiaohmClosest is flushed it.May 26 08:17
schestowitzOh waitMay 26 08:17
schestowitzI think I found out whyMay 26 08:18
schestowitzTake like half a minute to make a dump of 240MB of WordPress :-)May 26 08:19
oiaohmI guess pests are leaving you alone schestowitz.May 26 08:20
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schestowitzIt would seem soMay 26 08:32
schestowitzhttp://www.techradar.com/news/software/operating-systems/up-close-and-personal-with-debian-5-0-596821 "Judge Rules Dorm Room Search for Evidence of Prank Email Illegal"May 26 08:38
schestowitzbblMay 26 08:38
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oiaohmschestowitz: I think you just crossed links and text.May 26 08:49
schestowitzWhere?May 26 08:53
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oiaohmThe techradar line message you did just before schestowitz.   I don't see what a review of debian has to do with Judg Rules Dorm Room Search for emailMay 26 08:57
oiaohmIe in here schestowitzMay 26 08:58
schestowitzoiaohm: oh, oopsMay 26 09:00
schestowitzBTW, crontab does not like input without EOF that's a newlineMay 26 09:00
oiaohmDepends on the cron in use.  Most don't like that.May 26 09:07
schestowitzAnyway, I've put it all in scripts and cronsMay 26 09:09
schestowitzTo reduce account maintainableMay 26 09:09
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MinceRgeekingsMay 26 09:48
oiaohmhttp://www.itwire.com/content/view/25240/1103/  Even some of the strongest stick in mud MS supporters are softing there location schestowitzMay 26 09:52
taconehttp://www.stefanoforenza.com/shuttleworths-take-on-ubuntu-one-trademark-issue/comment-page-1/#comment-34256May 26 09:54
taconei got a new friend todayMay 26 09:54
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*mib_pq3eiw is now known as _Hicham_May 26 10:20
_Hicham_Good Morning All!May 26 10:20
ushimitsudoki1howdyMay 26 10:21
_Hicham_I am fine samuraiMay 26 10:28
_Hicham_is there any karate?May 26 10:28
_Hicham_any katas?May 26 10:28
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oiaohmschestowitz: is it me or news is very light today.May 26 11:14
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_Hicham_no one in here?May 26 11:19
oiaohmI am hear.May 26 11:19
oiaohmProblem is I am not finding much interesting news to talk about.May 26 11:20
oiaohmhttp://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090523231352189  The closest to interesting so far _Hicham_May 26 11:21
schestowitztacone: where?May 26 11:25
schestowitzI thought MarkS had commentedMay 26 11:25
schestowitzoiaohm: Memorial Day=slow newsMay 26 11:25
oiaohmOk don't have that holiday here.May 26 11:25
schestowitzYeahMay 26 11:25
schestowitzBank Holiday in the UK tooMay 26 11:26
oiaohmEven the australian news is slow.May 26 11:26
schestowitzSo English-speaking press will come from SA and AUMay 26 11:26
taconehttp://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2009/05/qosmio-transformer-05-25-09.jpghttp://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2009/05/qosmio-transformer-05-25-09.jpgMay 26 11:26
_Hicham_what Memorial Day?May 26 11:26
oiaohmThere is that talk about Ubuntu supporting google android binaries.May 26 11:26
taconeschestowitz: i've got my first hater (mono-fan)May 26 11:26
schestowitzhttp://www.groklaw.net/comment.php?mode=display&sid=20090523231352189&title=the+bradsi+and+billg+emails&type=article&order=&hideanonymous=0&pid=758214#c758233May 26 11:27
schestowitz"I think I see now how companies that partner withMay 26 11:27
schestowitzMicrosoft end up road kill. Microsoft makesMay 26 11:27
schestowitzstatements the partners think mean X but they areMay 26 11:27
schestowitzphrased so carefully they could also mean Y or Z,May 26 11:27
schestowitzand lo and behold, they end up meaning Y, andMay 26 11:27
schestowitzpresto, road kill, all those who relied on meaningMay 26 11:27
schestowitzX."May 26 11:27
oiaohmhttp://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnovellcollab/default.mspx  Give him this page and tell your hate to start reading the agreements taconeMay 26 11:27
taconei'm not even trying to deal with him. that's not the place to discuss about monoMay 26 11:28
taconehe commented on a Ubuntu One post, not on a mono oneMay 26 11:28
taconeand he suggested iFolder. whahahaahahha :) funny.May 26 11:28
schestowitz"Gates Claims to not be Familiar with Normal E-Mail Conventions?May 26 11:29
schestowitz    Q. This convention of using asterisks around words, is that because bold didn't exist in E-mails at the time?May 26 11:29
schestowitz    A. I don't know.May 26 11:29
schestowitz    Q. You've never seen that convention of putting asterisks around words during this time period?May 26 11:29
schestowitz    A. Mostly people use capitals, capital R, capital E, capital A, like that.May 26 11:29
schestowitz    Q. So the asterisks around a word mean nothing to you?May 26 11:29
schestowitz    A. They tend to call that word out.May 26 11:29
schestowitz"May 26 11:29
schestowitzSenile or insanely dishonestMay 26 11:29
oiaohmhttp://www.microsoft.com/interop/msnovellcollab/community.mspx  This one in particular if you ever plan to make a profit you are screwed.May 26 11:29
schestowitzYes, "community"May 26 11:30
schestowitz"Microsoft’s Patent Pledge for Non-Compensated Developers"May 26 11:30
schestowitz" Many software developers, often referred to as “hobbyists,” write code not with the expectation of making money, but because they enjoy solving technical challenges and participating in a community of enthusiasts who recognize and encourage one another’s talents."May 26 11:31
schestowitzGot that, ushimitsudoki1 ?May 26 11:31
schestowitzHobbyisysMay 26 11:31
oiaohmMono in most distributions bare open-suse and suse is outside MS agreement.May 26 11:31
schestowitzTo Microsoft, OpenSUSE is only allowed as a hobbyMay 26 11:31
taconethis ubuntu uds has hot topics. may karmic koala be good release, or something newer to some extent ?May 26 11:31
schestowitzOTherwise you're a criminal who 'steals' from Microsoft's mind shareMay 26 11:31
oiaohmMono has flaws technically and legally.May 26 11:32
oiaohmYou are better to mess with java.May 26 11:32
oiaohmThat only have flaws technically.May 26 11:32
schestowitzoiaohm: more from Microsoft fans: http://www.itwire.com/content/view/25229/1023/May 26 11:33
schestowitz"Microsoft can attempt to be a sumo with Kumo, have a fling with Bing, but in search Google will remain king. Ouch - sorry about that, it's late at night here. "May 26 11:33
schestowitzAnyway, oiaohm , the covenants and all are old newsMay 26 11:34
schestowitz2006..May 26 11:34
schestowitzLots of it in BN archivesMay 26 11:34
schestowitzAlmost 6500 posts now :-DMay 26 11:35
taconewowMay 26 11:35
schestowitzAndreas Schneider: csync with sftp support http://blog.cynapses.org/2009/05/26/csync-with-sftp-support/May 26 11:35
schestowitztacone: I used to think that over 1000 in my own blog was a LOTMay 26 11:35
schestowitzAnd now in BN we do about 100/weekMay 26 11:36
oiaohmThey are new news to a lot of mono fans.May 26 11:36
schestowitzWhat's where traffic comes from. We have heaps of material, some exclusiveMay 26 11:36
taconei am at 150May 26 11:36
schestowitzI like my own blog for personal use, like a journalMay 26 11:37
oiaohmBasically tacone every time you get a mono fan ask them to explain there way out of the MS patents.May 26 11:37
taconeschestowitz: and i made the digg front page this night, btw. with the dumbest post i ever wrote.May 26 11:37
schestowitzI use it to check some stuff sometimes. Like my mail methods. scripts, etc.May 26 11:37
schestowitzoiaohm does the sameMay 26 11:37
schestowitzWriting in a blog tidily instead of some personal hidden files and scriptsMay 26 11:37
taconeoiaohm: that was just a random hater. he didn't even know what the ifolder homepage isMay 26 11:37
taconehttp://www.stefanoforenza.com/shuttleworths-take-on-ubuntu-one-trademark-issue/comment-page-1/#comment-34256May 26 11:37
schestowitzI did the same thing with researchMay 26 11:37
schestowitzI can look up very old experiments I was doing and share date or methods with peopleMay 26 11:38
schestowitzMy thesis template is used by thousandsMay 26 11:38
oiaohmI did thing it was good mono patent problem made it onto itwire.May 26 11:39
_Hicham_can I use ur template schestowitz for my thesis too?May 26 11:39
schestowitzHow to Convert RHEL 5 to CentOS 5 < http://www.unixmen.com/linux-tutorials/documentations-a-howto/213-how-to-jul-convert-rhel-5-to-centos-5 >May 26 11:39
schestowitz_Hicham_: sureMay 26 11:39
schestowitzIt's LyXMay 26 11:40
_Hicham_why convert RHEL to CentOS?May 26 11:40
schestowitzoiaohm: mono issues become common knowledgeMay 26 11:40
schestowitz_Hicham_: why not?May 26 11:40
_Hicham_I don't knowMay 26 11:40
schestowitzWe did this in BNMay 26 11:40
schestowitzLast weekMay 26 11:40
_Hicham_that is bad for RedHatMay 26 11:40
schestowitzExpensive for someMay 26 11:40
schestowitzFor companies that need to show receipts RHEL would be goodMay 26 11:41
schestowitzTo them, it's supporting the companyMay 26 11:41
_Hicham_RHEL support is greatMay 26 11:41
schestowitzTo others support is less than neededMay 26 11:41
_Hicham_who would not buy such great support?May 26 11:41
schestowitztessier, for example, is a superb adminMay 26 11:41
_Hicham_do u use CentOS?May 26 11:41
schestowitzYesMay 26 11:41
oiaohmSome cases you don't need it _Hicham_May 26 11:41
schestowitz[boycottn@boycottnovell ~]$ uname -aMay 26 11:42
schestowitzLinux boycottnovell 2.6.18-128.el5xen #1 SMP Wed Jan 21 11:12:42 EST 2009 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/LinuxMay 26 11:42
_Hicham_I know, like ur case oiaohmMay 26 11:42
oiaohmI pay for redhat sometimes.May 26 11:42
_Hicham_schestowitz : u r running a virtual machine?May 26 11:42
schestowitzYesMay 26 11:42
oiaohmOther times I use Centos or https://www.scientificlinux.org/ insteadMay 26 11:43
oiaohmBoth are Redhat based.May 26 11:43
_Hicham_to protect from DDOS?May 26 11:43
schestowitzThere's slso xos and startcomMay 26 11:43
schestowitzAnd Unbreakable and maybe whitebox?May 26 11:43
schestowitz_Hicham_: yes,. separationMay 26 11:43
oiaohmscientific linux since its run by cern works very will.May 26 11:43
schestowitzFermilinuxMay 26 11:44
_Hicham_schestowitz : did u install any anti-ddos solution?May 26 11:45
schestowitzThe Android Momentum Continues < http://ostatic.com/blog/the-android-momentum-continues >May 26 11:45
oiaohmRedhat licences you pay per active machine.May 26 11:46
oiaohmFor some rolls you can manage well you are better to remove the redhat licence and put it on a machine that needs it.May 26 11:47
_Hicham_SchestowitzOS, best OS in the worldMay 26 11:47
oiaohmThere is no such thing as the best OS.May 26 11:47
oiaohmJust the one that sux's the least for a particular job.May 26 11:47
schestowitzEcoles: l'informatique en logiciels libres Paru le Vendredi 22 Mai 2009  < http://www.lecourrier.ch/index.php?name=NewsPaper&file=article&sid=442501 >May 26 11:54
schestowitz"On ne va pas changer une Ferrari pour une 2CV juste parce qu'elle est open source.» La démarche entreprise au niveau du DIP s'inscrit dans un cadre plus vaste, à savoir une migration progressive de l'informatique de l'Etat vers des logiciels libres. Bien des serveurs informatiques de l'administration cantonale tournent déjà avec GNU/Linux, la plate-forme la plus adaptée pour cette informatique gérée par des professionnels."May 26 11:55
oiaohmOk don't have a clue what that says.May 26 11:56
schestowitzStart-up built on free (libre) software: http://www.boston.com/business/technology/articles/2009/05/26/start_up_built_on_free_software/May 26 11:56
schestowitzoiaohm: _Hicham_ would knowMay 26 11:56
schestowitzUbuntu Picks Up X Input 2 Support In PPA < http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzI4OA >May 26 11:58
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taconeschestowitz: many hot topics in the current ubuntu udsMay 26 12:01
taconeandroid 2 ways support. cloud integration, appcenter and much more.May 26 12:01
taconei wonder how much of all that ham will ever be cooked for real.May 26 12:01
schestowitzWho knows...TMay 26 12:02
schestowitzThis morning I wonder if Ubuntu will be dethroned by another distroMay 26 12:02
schestowitzThen, many articles about "Ubuntu" will lose connection with "Linux:May 26 12:02
schestowitzbrbMay 26 12:02
taconeubuntu these days seems about embracing and extending. i hope that they'll never try to extinguish (but I don't think they will)May 26 12:03
*mib_15442y is now known as Ap0g33May 26 12:09
Ap0g33I hope ubuntu to be extinguish ASAPMay 26 12:10
Ap0g33Canonical dont like Free Software as they show...May 26 12:11
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mib_0tt4yiHelloMay 26 12:12
*mib_0tt4yi is now known as EruaranMay 26 12:12
Ap0g33helloMay 26 12:12
EruaranI don't think I've ever been more disgusted and angry at the state of IT and education in Australia... ever.May 26 12:13
EruaranToday the blatant nepotism and conflicts of interest (corruption) has reached a new levelMay 26 12:13
EruaranEspecially in New South WalesMay 26 12:14
EruaranHave a look at this:May 26 12:14
Eruaranhttp://www.australianit.news.com.au/story/0,24897,25542322-15306,00.htmlMay 26 12:14
EruaranThey won't use Linux but they'll voluntarily become beta testers for MicrosoftMay 26 12:15
EruaranAnd make our children beta testers for Microsoft as well as part of their corporate advertising slogMay 26 12:15
EruaranBut wait there's moreMay 26 12:16
schestowitzWTF?May 26 12:16
EruaranWho's that supplying the netbooksMay 26 12:16
schestowitzThis is indeed disgustingMay 26 12:16
EruaranWhy its LENOVO of courseMay 26 12:16
schestowitzThey give them VistaMay 26 12:16
schestowitzAt Linux's expenseMay 26 12:16
schestowitzLenovo is sort of dyingMay 26 12:16
schestowitzProfits down very sharplyMay 26 12:16
schestowitzAnd MS execsMay 26 12:16
EruaranBed buddies with MSMay 26 12:16
schestowitz[OT] George Carlin - The Earth < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=948Nm34arfA&feature=related >May 26 12:16
EruaranThey reject the top flight Linux distro's and then they willingly agree to become Microsoft guinea pigs and test bunniesMay 26 12:17
EruaranDo I smell CORRUPTION ?May 26 12:18
Ap0g33yesMay 26 12:18
EruaranMoney changing hands...May 26 12:18
Ap0g33probably... see an example http://www.eweekeurope.co.uk/news/red-hat-sues-switzerland-over-microsoft-monopoly-965May 26 12:18
EruaranUbuntu is not good enough but Windows 7 is ????May 26 12:18
Eruaranlike WTFMay 26 12:18
EruaranAnd of course Adobe is in on it as wellMay 26 12:19
EruaranWho the F&@#! let them join the Linux foundation ?May 26 12:19
Ap0g33I am not sure if canonical can give the same support as M$...May 26 12:20
Ap0g33IBM should have a desktop distro to compete with M$May 26 12:21
schestowitzEruaran: Microsoft does similar things in Spain right now.May 26 12:22
schestowitzI will make a post later]May 26 12:22
schestowitzITAsuaralia has been interviewing many MS employees and executives recentlyMay 26 12:23
schestowitzThey rarely cover LinuxMay 26 12:23
schestowitzWhich company owns it?May 26 12:23
schestowitzI'm only asking.May 26 12:23
Ap0g33what distro they should choose? ubuntu is release every 6 months (imagine if they need to install all OSs every 6 moths)May 26 12:23
schestowitzBecause in the US the media companies (NBC for example) are funded and run by companies that make refrigerators (GE), so they'll encourage blind consumptionMay 26 12:23
Ap0g33Red Hat is looking just to serversMay 26 12:23
schestowitzamarsh04: LTSMay 26 12:24
schestowitzOops. Ap0g33May 26 12:24
schestowitz3 yearsMay 26 12:24
schestowitz Tehran blocks access to Facebook < http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/8065578.stm >. Good! I hate Facebook :-)(May 26 12:24
EruaranIt is nothing short of sheer brinkmanship, disgusting corruption, and child abuse. Making our children corporate beta testers for Microsoft and offering kickbacks to schools who adopt and push Microsoft software.May 26 12:25
schestowitzBut it's the same in other areasMay 26 12:26
schestowitzMany schools are training camps for companiesMay 26 12:26
schestowitzThey manufacture recruitmwent creiteriaMay 26 12:26
schestowitzBetter known as marks or gradesMay 26 12:26
EruaranI can't express how utterly disgusted I am.May 26 12:27
schestowitzhttp://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-technology/yahoos-departing-cfo-to-get-18m-in-severance-20090523-bijn.htmlMay 26 12:27
schestowitzUh oh... Oh oh..May 26 12:27
schestowitzWHo replaces him?May 26 12:28
schestowitzMS cronies?May 26 12:28
schestowitzFiesta: Cuban bloggers start revolution  < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137470/cuban-bloggers-start-revolution >May 26 12:28
schestowitzEruaran: the kids should prrotestMay 26 12:28
schestowitzLike in IndiaMay 26 12:28
schestowitzLet me find photosMay 26 12:28
schestowitzMicrosoft uses the laptops schemes arround the world to addict kidsMay 26 12:28
schestowitzThis time in SpainMay 26 12:28
schestowitzHere: May 26 12:29
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/05/down-with-microsoft-children-protest/WMay 26 12:29
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/05/down-with-microsoft-children-protest/May 26 12:29
schestowitzWatch the photosMay 26 12:29
EruaranMicrosoft is colluding with netbook hardware vendors to deny customer choice and protect profits: http://www.infoworld.com/d/windows/microsoft-and-great-netbook-price-fixing-scam-2009-520May 26 12:29
schestowitzEruaran: watch those photos. They use BN graphics that I made :-)May 26 12:32
Eruaran:)May 26 12:34
schestowitztessier: http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137461/ibm-invest-vietnam (IBM to invest in Vietnam )May 26 12:34
schestowitzWhy do companies do this?May 26 12:34
schestowitzPeople should take Free software and control their ITMay 26 12:34
schestowitzEnough of this colonialismMay 26 12:34
schestowitzThen they set up junk like "Microsoft Australia" to pretend it's a local companyMay 26 12:35
schestowitzNork nuke quite a lot less powerful than Hiroshima < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/26/nork_nuke_test/ >May 26 12:40
schestowitzEruaran: I can quote you on the netbooks, right?May 26 12:44
EruaransureMay 26 12:47
EruaranIt reeks of collusionMay 26 12:48
schestowitz"How was 'Sarah' so quick off the mark in noticing your comment. One ofMay 26 12:48
schestowitzthe BN monitors/stalkers much have contacted her directly. Unless sheMay 26 12:48
schestowitzdon't have anything to do with CAI, or is some paid blogger. (They doMay 26 12:48
schestowitzhire on pretend bloggers you know..."May 26 12:48
EruaranCollusion in which our children are used.May 26 12:48
schestowitzWe get some nasty trolls nowMay 26 12:48
schestowitz"'The silly thing is that Computer Aid has always been very much inMay 26 12:49
schestowitzfavour of linux. Just a couple of examples:', SaraMay 26 12:49
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/24/computer-aid-international-versus-olpc/May 26 12:49
schestowitz"Roberts said that organisations in Nigeria and Namibia have alreadyMay 26 12:49
schestowitzbegun to place important education systems onto an open-sourceMay 26 12:49
schestowitzoperating platform""May 26 12:49
schestowitz12 Oct 2004 ...May 26 12:50
schestowitzhttp://www.computing.co.uk/computing/features/2072448/old-pcs-lease-life-developing-worldMay 26 12:50
schestowitzRoy, a simple enough question is, how may Linuxes does/did CAI shipMay 26 12:50
schestowitzsince 2004. Remember they barcode everything. They do make a lovelyMay 26 12:50
schestowitzwebsite though.May 26 12:50
schestowitzAccording to this they 'spend' about £500,000 on personnel, a littleMay 26 12:50
schestowitzless than on shipping and warehousing ..May 26 12:50
schestowitzhttp://www.computeraid.org/pdffiles/AnnRev06-07.pdfMay 26 12:50
taconeschestowitz: http://foundation.gnome.org/elections/2009/candidates.htmlMay 26 12:50
taconeFiguiere: "I have been involved with Free Software for a decade or so, mostly working on the application side: AbiWord, gnote, etc. "May 26 12:51
taconelol !May 26 12:51
schestowitz5. Hubert Figuiere!May 26 12:51
schestowitzYesMay 26 12:51
schestowitzYou beat me to it!May 26 12:51
schestowitz6. Jorge CastroMay 26 12:51
schestowitzYou were not sure how pro-Mono he was...May 26 12:51
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schestowitz10. Vincent UntzMay 26 12:52
schestowitzAffiliation: NovellMay 26 12:52
schestowitz9. Srinivasa RagavanMay 26 12:52
schestowitzAffiliation: NovellMay 26 12:52
schestowitzWould it annoy Hubert if we promoted him?May 26 12:52
schestowitzSome people in GNOME do not like BNMay 26 12:53
taconealso Jorge Castro from CanonicalMay 26 12:53
taconeschestowitz: i believe soMay 26 12:53
taconei wouldn't promote him, if I were in youMay 26 12:53
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schestowitztacone: I was not going toMay 26 12:53
taconeI'd just post the news with no further comments, an informational only post.May 26 12:53
schestowitzGnote is another matterMay 26 12:53
schestowitzFor technical reasonsMay 26 12:53
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mib_03w0b1yo, homeboyMay 26 12:54
schestowitzYo, what's up?May 26 12:55
mib_03w0b1not much, what's this chabout ?May 26 12:55
mib_03w0b1chan aboutMay 26 12:55
mib_03w0b1anyone seen 'the wire' on tv, needs subtitles ...May 26 12:56
mib_03w0b1yo, ma n*****s .. :)May 26 12:56
mib_03w0b1time to 'change up' ...May 26 12:56
mib_03w0b1IRC is blocked here .. bummerMay 26 12:57
taconefiguiere's is the worst candidacy mail of them allMay 26 12:58
mib_03w0b1candidacy mail ?May 26 12:58
taconehttp://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2009-May/msg00035.htmlMay 26 12:59
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schestowitzEruaran: smell the PR:May 26 13:01
schestowitz""We've agreed with Microsoft to participate in their first wave program and the netbooks that are on trial at the moment -- there's about 400 of them -- have all got Windows 7 on them. The kids love it," NSW Department of Education and Training (DET) chief information officer Stephen Wilson said."May 26 13:01
schestowitzaka Microsoft lunch table attendantMay 26 13:01
schestowitztacone: yes, somewhat oddMay 26 13:01
schestowitzLaziness..May 26 13:01
taconeperhaps being a little naiveMay 26 13:02
taconeor hopeless attempt (he's unemploeyed)May 26 13:02
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mib_9emom9yo mu african americans, wasupMay 26 13:09
*schestowitz writes about AsutraliaMay 26 13:10
mib_9emom9Australia ?May 26 13:10
schestowitztacone: said he was boredMay 26 13:10
schestowitzWhen he started gnoteMay 26 13:10
schestowitzmib_9emom9: yes, a new post comingMay 26 13:10
taconeyes, he was bored because unemployement. That was months ago. I don't know if he's still unemployedMay 26 13:11
mib_9emom9gtg, class is starting ...May 26 13:12
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schestowitztacone: it says "no affiliation"May 26 13:15
taconeschestowitz: right.May 26 13:15
taconeblogosphere: http://scottnesbitt.net/ubuntublog/?p=444 (gnote review)May 26 13:15
tacone(unrelated)May 26 13:16
oiaohmThere is a lot worse here schestowitz.May 26 13:17
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EruaranEverything Stephen Wilson says, sounds like he's reading from a script given to him by Microsoft Marketing.May 26 13:27
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oiaohmIts the old logic you will not get fired for buying and supporting X.May 26 13:35
oiaohmMany companies have been X through history.May 26 13:36
schestowitzMicrosoft’s Latest Netbooks Collusion and Attack on Spanish and Australian Education < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/26/spanish-and-australian-education-collusion/ >May 26 13:36
schestowitzEruaran: and later they send shills to /,.May 26 13:37
schestowitzI saw thisMay 26 13:37
schestowitzWhen my EDGI articles made the front pageMay 26 13:37
schestowitzThe Microsoft shills will say "Linux is bad etc etc"May 26 13:37
schestowitzSo that educators who read this will say "Windows is the only choice"May 26 13:37
schestowitz"Linux is all command-line, it violate MS patents, etc etc"May 26 13:38
schestowitzThat sums up the Microsoft guerrilla pretty muchMay 26 13:38
schestowitzOnly last week I found out that Steve Ballmer married one of those guerrillasMay 26 13:38
schestowitz A woman from Waggener EndstromMay 26 13:38
schestowitzA car salesman (classic liars) and AstroTurfing agency. What a match made in heaven...May 26 13:39
schestowitzIt showMay 26 13:39
schestowitzIt showsMay 26 13:39
schestowitzSteve Ballmer: " "My children - in many dimensions they're as poorly behaved as many other children, but at least on this dimension I've got my kids brainwashed: You don't use Google, and you don't use an iPod.""May 26 13:39
schestowitzSo it's like they have their own Waggener Endstrom and care salespeople at home telling lies, too :-) :-)May 26 13:39
schestowitz"I've got my kids brainwashed" --Steve BallmerMay 26 13:40
schestowitzTink about itMay 26 13:40
schestowitzHow many parents would say thisMay 26 13:40
schestowitz"I've got my kids brainwashed"May 26 13:40
schestowitzThat being the case...May 26 13:40
schestowitzWhy would he not brainwash employees and customers too?May 26 13:40
schestowitzFreud spins in his grave..May 26 13:41
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schestowitzI'm guessing the origin of the word brainwash is very npleasant too. War tactics and maybe Soviet methods for deleting people's memory. I'm not sure... and he uses this to talk about what he does to his kids, his bl00dMay 26 13:42
oiaohmYou are only scraping a small surface of this.  http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/software/soa/Linux-marches-on-Microsoft-in-NSW/0,130061733,139247791,00.htm?feed=pt_governmentMay 26 13:42
oiaohmNovell is in every major Australia department schestowitzMay 26 13:43
schestowitzNo silly snide remark, either.May 26 13:43
schestowitzHe said this to CNNMay 26 13:43
schestowitz"I've got my kids brainwashed"May 26 13:43
oiaohmNow most of them only support ie as interfacing browser.May 26 13:43
oiaohmThis game in Australia is a lot deeper than you are seeing schestowitz.May 26 13:44
schestowitzleave a commentMay 26 13:44
oiaohmI will be putting teogther a artical in this.May 26 13:45
EruaranMicrosoft is not hindered by the US DOJ or the EU EC in Australia. And look at them go, unfettered, blatant and unperterbed.May 26 13:45
oiaohmWe really need some others to start looking deeper as well.   It a closed loop.May 26 13:46
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oiaohmIf you cannot operate business without Windows.   Schools must teach windows.May 26 13:46
EruaranSchools should educate...May 26 13:47
EruaranNot indoctrinateMay 26 13:47
oiaohmIts a closed loop.May 26 13:47
oiaohmOne feeding the other EruaranMay 26 13:47
EruaranWhen I was in school I never used WindowsMay 26 13:47
EruaranIt didn't hurt meMay 26 13:47
oiaohmI wounder how many other countries are effected this way.May 26 13:47
EruaranWhen I did have to do a course using Microsoft Office, I was the guy who made the lecturer redundant by showing fellow students how to help themselves and learn without the teacherMay 26 13:48
EruaranIf I hadn't used MS Office how did I do that ?May 26 13:48
EruaranThe answer is simpleMay 26 13:49
EruaranEducationMay 26 13:49
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EruaranI was already familiar with Word processors, spreadsheets etc.May 26 13:49
oiaohmYou sound like me.   Eruaran.   I had to learn how to repair computers because I cannot hand write.May 26 13:49
Eruaranoiaohm: my handwriting is not so good eitherMay 26 13:50
oiaohmAnd was in a rural school without computer techs near by.May 26 13:50
EruaranI suffer from a writing stutterMay 26 13:50
oiaohmI am in my 30~May 26 13:50
Eruaranmeans my hand seizes up and I can't write an "e" for exampleMay 26 13:50
oiaohmSo when I went through school we did word perfect.May 26 13:51
EruaranIt started when I was 16May 26 13:51
EruaranBut I type around 50wpmMay 26 13:51
oiaohmMy hands lack the physical strenth to hold pens well.May 26 13:51
oiaohmI can type up to 75 wpm.May 26 13:51
EruaranohMay 26 13:51
EruaranPWNEDMay 26 13:51
Eruaran:PMay 26 13:51
oiaohmNote age might be a factor.May 26 13:52
oiaohmI have got slowly faster.May 26 13:52
Eruaran75 is fastMay 26 13:52
oiaohmI started off in high school with a typing speed of 25 words per min.May 26 13:52
oiaohmOk end of high school.May 26 13:53
oiaohmI have kinda being slowly gaining speed since.May 26 13:53
oiaohmIf I follow my releation trends I will get upto about 95 to 110 at some point.May 26 13:53
EruaranniceMay 26 13:54
oiaohmI guess you are younger than me.May 26 13:54
schestowitzJust a moment. Got an update from SpainMay 26 13:54
oiaohmSo you have a few years to catch the speed up.May 26 13:54
EruaranI'm 37May 26 13:54
EruaranI'm a slowpoke :'(May 26 13:54
oiaohmI am 32.May 26 13:55
Eruaranmind youMay 26 13:55
EruaranI haven't been typing all that timeMay 26 13:55
oiaohmI have been.May 26 13:55
EruaranI left IT around 97May 26 13:55
oiaohmSince I cannot even write notes I can read latter.May 26 13:55
EruaranAnd didn't come back to it till a couple of years agoMay 26 13:55
EruaranHardly typed at all for about 10 yearsMay 26 13:55
oiaohmSo you can write notes for your self?May 26 13:55
EruaranI can't write notesMay 26 13:56
EruaranI scribbleMay 26 13:56
oiaohmReadable scribble?May 26 13:56
oiaohmMine is not readable to me.May 26 13:56
Eruaranit is barely readableMay 26 13:56
EruaranI have to translate for othersMay 26 13:56
oiaohmUnless I write at about 1 word per min.May 26 13:56
oiaohmAs I say I am basically forced to type.May 26 13:57
EruaranyepMay 26 13:57
oiaohmSo have been my releations.May 26 13:57
EruaranI can't writeMay 26 13:57
EruaranMy grandma couldn't eitherMay 26 13:57
Eruaransimilar writing tooMay 26 13:57
Eruaranand my brother cant writeMay 26 13:57
oiaohmIts dna.May 26 13:57
Eruaranbut my mum and sister are very neatMay 26 13:57
oiaohmMine is a defect that means I look about 6 to 10 years younger than my age.May 26 13:58
EruaranI wouldn't mind such a 'defect' ;)May 26 13:58
oiaohmThere is a lot of things you give up for that.May 26 13:58
oiaohmLike the means to lift heavy objects without risking dislocating something.May 26 13:59
EruaranI had a babyface till I was about 32May 26 13:59
EruaranahMay 26 13:59
oiaohmPlaying all forms of contact sports is out.May 26 13:59
EruaranokMay 26 13:59
oiaohmIt suxs basically.May 26 13:59
Eruaranat the end of the dayMay 26 13:59
Eruaranyou have at least the consolationMay 26 14:00
oiaohmAnd until you get past 30 you might just happen to have a extra defect that you could die in under 1 min.May 26 14:00
Eruaranof saying to friendsMay 26 14:00
Eruaran"But I'm PRETTIER than you"May 26 14:00
EruaranohMay 26 14:00
Eruaranthat could be a bit problematicMay 26 14:00
Eruarandying does cramp ones style a bitMay 26 14:01
Eruaran;)May 26 14:01
EruaranbbsMay 26 14:01
Eruarangot to head homeMay 26 14:01
Eruaranand fix this notebook I borkedMay 26 14:01
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schestowitzBill Gates Uses Malaria to Attack GNU/< Linux http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/26/malaria-to-attack-gnu-linux-spain/ >May 26 14:05
*schestowitz hates writing on paperMay 26 14:06
schestowitzI write on paper only when I sign something or write a cheque, which is rare (I have chequebooks)May 26 14:07
schestowitz /s/have/hate/May 26 14:07
oiaohmHows spian's no ie webbrowser support on there  web sites.May 26 14:08
oiaohmto do business.May 26 14:08
schestowitzI don't knowMay 26 14:09
schestowitzI'd have to askMay 26 14:09
oiaohmI am wondering if its the same closed loop as here.May 26 14:09
schestowitzSomeone from Spain looks out for us... and looks /at/ some detailsMay 26 14:09
schestowitzoiaohm: see latest postMay 26 14:09
oiaohmTell them to test the sites.May 26 14:09
schestowitzI wrote about thisMay 26 14:09
schestowitz"Interoperability"May 26 14:09
schestowitzMicrosoft corrupts itMay 26 14:09
schestowitzOn purposeMay 26 14:09
schestowitz"It comes from above"May 26 14:09
schestowitzMaybe Godwin comes here, but..May 26 14:10
oiaohmI have a lot here that claim netscape 6 compadiblely but that don't work.May 26 14:10
schestowitzAnyway, to ruin HTML, ODF, OpenDoc... everything that enables non-Windows platforms to be viableMay 26 14:10
schestowitzECIS filed complaint over that in isolationMay 26 14:10
oiaohmCreate a closed loop.May 26 14:10
oiaohmIf you have the tax office.May 26 14:10
schestowitzAs long as people are already in itMay 26 14:10
oiaohmYou have business.May 26 14:10
schestowitzOnce they escape the loop then Microsoft is shut and f*edMay 26 14:10
oiaohmIf you have business you have eductaion.May 26 14:11
schestowitzBecause in a world of ODF, who would bother with .DOC or OOXML?May 26 14:11
oiaohmall are interlinked.May 26 14:11
schestowitzWho would make sites IE-only?May 26 14:11
oiaohmAustralian tax office for regestering business names.May 26 14:11
oiaohmWhat you kinda need todo so you can operate as a business.May 26 14:11
schestowitzYupMay 26 14:12
schestowitzLet me do some news linksMay 26 14:12
schestowitzSlow day for many, BN can deliver nonethelessMay 26 14:12
oiaohmThis is why I am wondering if spain is affected the same way.May 26 14:12
oiaohmWe might find a big evil global trend behind the countries sticking to MS.May 26 14:13
schestowitzi think more along an uproarMay 26 14:14
schestowitzSame as in the financial sectorMay 26 14:15
schestowitzLots of popular strugglesMay 26 14:15
schestowitzYou need to fuel this with informationMay 26 14:15
schestowitzJust watch how many people in  Spain are reacting angrily to this and how awareness of GNU rises as human rights get taken away (not just in the United States)May 26 14:16
oiaohmAustralian eductaion use surveys of what businesses are using in software to justify there selections of software as well.May 26 14:17
oiaohmIe closed loop.May 26 14:17
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oiaohmhttp://www.ato.gov.au/individuals/content.asp?doc=/content/73931.htm  The australian tax site recommendations to do the 2008 tax return for individuals or small businesses without windows schestowitzMay 26 14:24
schestowitzLinux desktops easier to install than expected http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137464/linux-desktops-easier-install-expectedMay 26 14:26
schestowitzoiaohm: didn't they work on porting desktop client to Linux and Mac OS X?May 26 14:27
schestowitzI think they canned itMay 26 14:27
oiaohmIt was wrong.May 26 14:28
oiaohmThey released the beta canned it due to too much demard for it.May 26 14:28
schestowitzToo much?May 26 14:30
schestowitzYou mean too little?May 26 14:30
schestowitzEither way, THEY ARE NOT A BUSINESSMay 26 14:31
schestowitzThere is no DEMANDMay 26 14:31
schestowitzOr ROIMay 26 14:31
schestowitzThis is about serving citizensMay 26 14:31
schestowitzWithout discriminationMay 26 14:31
schestowitzShould they also stop serving blind people?May 26 14:31
schestowitzBecause of "demand issues"?May 26 14:31
schestowitzHow about deaf people?May 26 14:31
schestowitzOr ethical minorities?May 26 14:31
schestowitzIt's not hard to make things work for everyoneMay 26 14:32
schestowitzJava: write once, run everywhereMay 26 14:32
schestowitzHTML+CSS = screenreaders supportedMay 26 14:32
schestowitzI say, "Linux users should stop paying tax"May 26 14:32
schestowitzUntil the "Tax Office" decides that not only "Windows users" are "people"May 26 14:33
oiaohmThe file server providing the beta crashed.May 26 14:33
schestowitzSo?May 26 14:33
oiaohmIe too much demard.May 26 14:33
schestowitzOKMay 26 14:33
schestowitzSo they must sort if out ASAPMay 26 14:33
oiaohmThey just closed the beta.May 26 14:33
schestowitzOne server to a country with like 30 million people?May 26 14:33
schestowitzThey are not even TRYING :-)May 26 14:33
schestowitzoiaohm: oh, I see..May 26 14:34
schestowitzSo it's still on.May 26 14:34
schestowitzGood.May 26 14:34
oiaohmDon't know.May 26 14:34
schestowitzSam Varghese wrote about it months agoMay 26 14:34
schestowitzI thought they had given upMay 26 14:34
oiaohmBy the way Novell has the support contract for the Australian tax office.May 26 14:34
oiaohmSo the sever should have been able to be made big enough.May 26 14:34
oiaohmThere has been zero news on its progress since they closed the beta.May 26 14:35
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schestowitzoiaohm: when was that?May 26 14:38
oiaohmhttp://www.zdnet.com.au/news/software/soa/Macs-Linux-to-wait-as-ATO-tenders-e-tax/0,130061733,339293572,00.htm?feed=pt_linux  I know this is a zdnet link this backs up want I am going to say.May 26 14:39
oiaohmOver 8 months ago since they closed the beta schestowitz.May 26 14:39
EruaranIm'May 26 14:39
EruaranI'm backMay 26 14:39
oiaohmThe software for the e-tax system has been written in a mix of Delphi, VB, C++, C# and VB.NET, with the user application being mainly in Delphi, which the ATO would like to maintain. << That is the client we used for 2008May 26 14:39
oiaohmCan you think of a worse combination of languages for a tax return program schestowitz.May 26 14:40
EruaranPythinMay 26 14:41
EruaranIt should be done in PythonMay 26 14:41
Eruaran:DMay 26 14:41
oiaohmReally could not make it much worse.May 26 14:41
EruaranThe Au Govt will release a Linux client when Duke Nukem Forever is releasedMay 26 14:42
schestowitzHeheMay 26 14:44
schestowitzOr call the whole thing offMay 26 14:44
schestowitzAnd be sued, like * RealmsMay 26 14:44
schestowitz(Can't recall the name)May 26 14:44
oiaohmIts basically getting to that point.May 26 14:44
oiaohmThat they only possiable solution will be to sue the goverment.May 26 14:44
oiaohmYou can now see why I say you are not looking deep enough schestowitz.May 26 14:45
oiaohmThere is no reason for a Tax office to be OS selective.May 26 14:45
oiaohmIf spain and other countries have the same problem that is where the attack needs to be.May 26 14:46
EruaranIt wouldn't surprise me if the government announced it was going to exclusively use MS-ODFMay 26 14:46
oiaohmCurrently the goverment standard is rtf.May 26 14:46
oiaohmYes old rtf.May 26 14:46
EruaranAnd I'm sure they'd throw in the word "interoperability" for kicksMay 26 14:46
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oiaohmYepMay 26 14:47
schestowitzHehe.May 26 14:47
schestowitzThey should be suedMay 26 14:47
schestowitzBoth them and the collaborators at MicrosoftMay 26 14:47
schestowitzMS never got published for the OOXML crimesMay 26 14:47
schestowitzThe commission falsely said it would deal with itMay 26 14:47
schestowitzIt collected evidence of crimeMay 26 14:48
schestowitzWhat now?May 26 14:48
schestowitzDisgustingMay 26 14:48
Eruaranthe whole 'closed loop' thing must be brokenMay 26 14:48
EruaranWhen I was in high school... let me see, we had... at least four different computer platforms in use at the schoolMay 26 14:49
EruaranAnd more that we actually used if you count friends who had Amiga'sMay 26 14:50
Eruaran(yes I'm getting old)May 26 14:50
oiaohmhttp://www.ato.gov.au/smsf/content.asp?doc=/content/00157275.htm&page=6&H6=&pc=001/135/021/001/001&mnu=40689&mfp=001/135&st=&cy=1  << its not the tax office cannot do it.May 26 14:51
oiaohmThey will do it for super companyes support Linux.May 26 14:52
oiaohmTax is one of the important things to be free.  Remember the two things in this live you have a hard time avoiding.  Death and Taxs.May 26 14:55
EruaranGives whole new meaning to "Microsoft tax"May 26 14:59
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oiaohmHave not got to the best bit yet.May 26 14:59
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schestowitz<mib_orzd35> Some news for you:  http://nzoss.org.nz/news/2009/g2009-disasterMay 26 15:02
schestowitz<mib_orzd35> looks like a MS deal in New Zealand has collapsed.May 26 15:02
schestowitzI will repost thisMay 26 15:03
schestowitzFirst links though..May 26 15:03
oiaohmYou do know under australian tax law you can claim back software used to generate tax return including the OS its running on.   Its in the decutions.May 26 15:03
oiaohmSo effectively Australian goverent is screwing up there income.May 26 15:04
oiaohmNot supporting open source software.  I guess a lot of other countries are like this too.May 26 15:04
oiaohmAgree this is a little bigger than what you have been looking a lot lately schestowitz.May 26 15:05
schestowitzDo you have an article about it?May 26 15:07
schestowitzYou should blog all this, then I can linkMay 26 15:07
schestowitzUse the IRC logMay 26 15:07
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oiaohmI have been putting the notes toegether on this schestowitz.May 26 15:08
oiaohmSo far writing the complete document is going to be fun.May 26 15:09
oiaohmFrom the spain with the education I am wondering if this is wider spreed than just my local country.May 26 15:09
oiaohmThis is the artical I was planing have fully sorted for the upcoming weekend schestowitz.May 26 15:12
oiaohmJust from reading your site I started wondering if I was not being broad enough.May 26 15:13
schestowitzWe need this stuff organisedMay 26 15:14
schestowitzEventually in Wiki on themes pagesMay 26 15:14
schestowitzNext month I'll organiseMay 26 15:14
schestowitzPer country tooMay 26 15:14
schestowitzSubheadings like education, public sector, then evidenceMay 26 15:14
oiaohmTax office is a really important one.May 26 15:16
oiaohmYou need them todo business in lots of countries.May 26 15:16
oiaohmMore currect would be a survey to find out what countries you can do everything a business needs to do with the goverment without needing closed source software.May 26 15:17
oiaohmThat cracked and open source can grow roots in busineses.May 26 15:18
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oiaohmI am off to bed.May 26 15:21
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Omar87Hi allMay 26 15:45
Omar87So what's goin' on between M$ and Novell lately?May 26 15:45
schestowitzHeyMay 26 15:48
schestowitzOmar87: not muchMay 26 15:48
schestowitzResults due soonMay 26 15:48
schestowitzAnalysts are not fearfulMay 26 15:48
schestowitzI saw no contract for Novell (SUSE), so expect a splatMay 26 15:48
Omar87http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090523231352189May 26 15:48
schestowitzMaybe a better-than-expectations splatMay 26 15:48
schestowitzA splat nonethelessMay 26 15:48
schestowitzOmar87: oh, *that*May 26 15:49
Omar87It seems to me as thought the allies are now turning against each other.May 26 15:49
schestowitzI see your best buddy Bill is out there looking for charities and kiddies :-)May 26 15:49
schestowitzOmar87: no, old court caseMay 26 15:49
taconehere I am, writing the most boring post of webblogging historyMay 26 15:53
taconesicMay 26 15:53
mtnd3wGuess who's gonna win Ubuntu's default media player?May 26 15:58
mtnd3wBansheeMay 26 15:59
schestowitzReally?May 26 16:02
schestowitzAny URL?May 26 16:02
schestowitzWho is pushing for it?May 26 16:02
schestowitzJo?May 26 16:02
schestowitztacone: yes,, that happens sometimesMay 26 16:02
schestowitzYou must spit it out anyway once you get startedMay 26 16:02
schestowitzit's not like it goes to a peer-reviewed journal where it will be rejectedMay 26 16:03
mtnd3wthe only two are being debated are Rhythmbox & BansheeMay 26 16:06
mtnd3wBanshee has a lot of spamers behind itMay 26 16:06
mtnd3wwhich makes it looks like the Ubuntu community is behind it.May 26 16:06
taconeshould be discussed at the udsMay 26 16:10
taconeand the uds is nowMay 26 16:10
schestowitzbanshee is NovellMay 26 16:10
schestowitzMaybe Novell is running its squad againMay 26 16:10
taconethere are gobby documents out thereMay 26 16:10
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taconei'll try to give a look to them later.May 26 16:10
taconei don't think that's something officially scheduled for discussionMay 26 16:10
taconesee you laterMay 26 16:10
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2007/09/30/novell-patrol/May 26 16:11
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schestowitzNew Zealand’s Freedom Fighters Defeat Microsoft’s Latest ‘Colonisations Directive’ < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/26/microsoft-nz-colonisation-kaput/ >May 26 16:19
mtnd3wLook at this guy: "anyone who thinks exaile is a viable option as the default !ubuntu music player must be insane. banshee or rhythmbox are the only ones"May 26 16:24
*schestowitz prefers AmarokMay 26 16:25
*MinceR prefers AudaciousMay 26 16:25
mtnd3wamarok, is fantasticMay 26 16:28
mtnd3wbut they're discussion for the gnome environmentMay 26 16:28
schestowitzhttp://www.vm.fi/vm/en/04_publications_and_documents/01_publications/04_public_management/20031015Recomm/65051.pdf I'm not sure how to bring it into current discussion.May 26 16:29
schestowitzmacabe_: yes, I know.May 26 16:29
schestowitzI used xmms for many yearsMay 26 16:29
schestowitzGTK AFAIKMay 26 16:29
schestowitzBut that's Exhaile now?May 26 16:30
schestowitzI also used Rhythmbox a few times.May 26 16:30
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mtnd3wAudacious is a good option too, but Banshee shouldn't be on the discussion tableMay 26 16:31
mtnd3wjust on the merit of it's performance, it's lackingMay 26 16:32
schestowitzGnote Gets Positive Reviews, Its Developer Runs for GNOME Foundation’s Board of Directors < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/26/gnote-positive-reviews/ >May 26 16:35
schestowitzmtnd3w: well, that's mono jitMay 26 16:36
schestowitzAlso, there's lots in terms of space bloat May 26 16:36
schestowitzUbuntu should knock out the Mono, free up space and pick Mono-free appsMay 26 16:37
mtnd3wlolMay 26 16:38
mtnd3wexactly, there are so many alternativesMay 26 16:38
benJImanBanshee leaves rythembox in the dust performanecwise with a large collection.May 26 16:40
mtnd3wtrollMay 26 16:40
benJImanIt's one of the few players that can cope with playlists with tens of thousands of tracks. Amarok fails too.May 26 16:40
mtnd3wlast time i fired up banshee, it died while trying to scan my libraryMay 26 16:41
schestowitzmtnd3w: he isMay 26 16:44
schestowitzbenJIman is an opensuse guy lurking hereMay 26 16:44
mtnd3wthat's what Ubuntu will becomeMay 26 16:45
mtnd3wOpenSuSeMay 26 16:45
benJImanClearly people who have a different point of view are trolls.May 26 16:45
mtnd3wif it keeps ignoring performance guidlinesMay 26 16:45
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mtnd3wOpenSuSe is filled with lagging appsMay 26 16:45
mtnd3wbenJIman: give Exaile a try, plus the thing about Amarok is it's in a Qt environment, you always get weird performance when you mix environmentsMay 26 16:46
Aondoare there any benchmarks on the talking case of performance between the mediaplayers?May 26 16:46
schestowitzOT: Capitalism Hits the Fan: A Lecture on the Economic Meltdown - Preview < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M8ZH1ejtIFo >May 26 16:50
schestowitzIt's not just a performance thing; what about features, control (e.g. Novell), patents, etc.?May 26 16:51
Aondoyes, i just asked since this seemed to be the pressing issue for benJIman.May 26 16:52
mtnd3wAondo: Rythmbox is written is C always superior than the pseudo language Banshee is written inMay 26 16:54
mtnd3wExaile is written in Python also better than C#MonoMay 26 16:54
schestowitzMichael Moore < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlMYzLlQ0n4&NR=1 >May 26 16:56
MinceRstrange, i mix toolkits and environments all the time and get weird performance only rarelyMay 26 16:57
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mtnd3wschestowitz: Great video on Michael MooreMay 26 17:04
mtnd3whe nails it, it's socialism when it comes to losses for the corporationsMay 26 17:05
schestowitzhttp://techdirt.com/articles/20090525/1542304998.shtml Swedish Judge In Charge Of Determining Bias Of Pirate Bay Judge Removed... For BiasMay 26 17:10
schestowitzmtnd3w: it's tought loveMay 26 17:10
schestowitzmtnd3w: it's tough loveMay 26 17:10
schestowitzLove for themMay 26 17:10
schestowitztough for the restMay 26 17:10
schestowitzMinceR: they want consistencyMay 26 17:12
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DaemonFCI'm watching California's ruling on Proposition HateMay 26 17:34
DaemonFCwatching for it anywayMay 26 17:34
DaemonFCso far no newsMay 26 17:34
schestowitzWhat is this?May 26 17:36
DaemonFC?May 26 17:36
schestowitzI can imagine.May 26 17:36
schestowitzThose rules that criminalise hate or speech containing hateMay 26 17:36
schestowitzThe UN proposed rules that censor religious disdainMay 26 17:37
DaemonFCTo see if the United States of KKK (Republicans/Christians) can have their way stand up to judicial reviewMay 26 17:37
schestowitzI recently learned also that the gay population in the US is also criminalised in like 20 statesMay 26 17:37
DaemonFCno, not criminalizedMay 26 17:37
schestowitzWhile I'm not gay, it's appalling to see how religious or fanatic some LEGISLATOR become.May 26 17:37
DaemonFCthose laws were state to state, most were repealed by 2003, whe the supreme court struck down the rest of themMay 26 17:38
DaemonFCin Lawrence vs. TexasMay 26 17:38
schestowitzWhat if the more superficial types ran the country and economy?May 26 17:38
DaemonFCit's just a divisive issue, they know that they can keep more of their "followers" in line by demonizing a minorityMay 26 17:38
DaemonFCno different than racial segregation in the mid 20th centuryMay 26 17:39
schestowitzOutsourcing the 'enemy'May 26 17:39
schestowitzOopsMay 26 17:39
schestowitzRather, making ones home rather than awayMay 26 17:39
DaemonFCthey'll find people to hate, it's what they doMay 26 17:39
DaemonFCit's all they doMay 26 17:39
DaemonFCit keeps them in powerMay 26 17:39
schestowitzThe ones to protect (never be to seen as enemies are those 'in charge')May 26 17:39
schestowitzDvision can come from within (clash of ethnicities and other separable traits)May 26 17:40
schestowitzElse you declare war against outside forcesMay 26 17:40
schestowitzThe methods used to control the population in one's own land are spookily similar to ones used beyond enemy territoryMay 26 17:41
DaemonFCwell, internal enemy (gays, muslims, Mexicans) and external enemies (Most of the middle east and central and south America  that we want cheap oil from)May 26 17:41
schestowitzIOW, citizens are treated like an  enemy, especially once they recognise what is going on and disseminate information about itMay 26 17:41
DaemonFCthey stay in power by convincing people that they're always under attackMay 26 17:41
schestowitzWell, we areMay 26 17:42
schestowitzUnder attackMay 26 17:42
schestowitzBut not from /those/ people they nameMay 26 17:42
DaemonFCwith Hitler, it was the Jews as the internal enemyMay 26 17:42
schestowitzRather, by a feudalistic structureMay 26 17:42
DaemonFCgovernments change, but they use the same liesMay 26 17:42
DaemonFCthe Republicans use gays in the same mannerMay 26 17:42
schestowitzWage slavery to some, with stagnant wages for decades so that corporations can buy moreMay 26 17:42
DaemonFCyeah, the price of everything goes up, your wage stays the same, then that's if you're lucky eough to still be workingMay 26 17:43
DaemonFC;)May 26 17:43
schestowitzYeah.May 26 17:43
schestowitzInflation is a wonderful thingMay 26 17:44
schestowitzYou take people's wages downMay 26 17:44
schestowitzAnd they don't even noticeMay 26 17:44
schestowitzPart of class warMay 26 17:44
DaemonFCinflation and taxesMay 26 17:44
DaemonFCthis cap and trade thing is a massive tax that will be passed down to consumersMay 26 17:44
schestowitzAnd those depriving people of wages then lend money to the very same people, to be paid back (with interest)May 26 17:44
DaemonFCto take away their buying powerMay 26 17:44
DaemonFCwe have to cut our emissions even though no other country in the world doesMay 26 17:45
DaemonFCeven though smog clouds from China float across the ocean and end up over the United StatesMay 26 17:45
DaemonFCit's a ruseMay 26 17:45
DaemonFCthe Chinese are now the biggest source of pollution in the worldMay 26 17:46
DaemonFCthey don't give a shit what they burn or how much damage it doesMay 26 17:46
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schestowitzDaemonFC: population there is like 5 times bigger, tooMay 26 17:46
schestowitzWell, depending on whose numbers you go byMay 26 17:46
schestowitzChina too does not count many people in existenceMay 26 17:46
DaemonFCdoesn't really matter, if they wanted cleaner fuels they could use thoseMay 26 17:47
schestowitzIt's not a fight over climateMay 26 17:47
DaemonFCbut then their manufacturing costs would go upMay 26 17:47
schestowitzIt's over human civilisationMay 26 17:47
DaemonFCand the Western countries would go buy things from India more and moreMay 26 17:47
schestowitzTrying to maintain large population and gene expansionMay 26 17:47
schestowitzChina has at least tried to control it. Does population size decrease yet|?May 26 17:47
DaemonFCunfortunately, most governments view endless reproduction as some kind of a human rightMay 26 17:47
schestowitzCheaper fuels..May 26 17:47
schestowitzAnother issueMay 26 17:48
schestowitzWe burn 'fossil fuels'May 26 17:48
schestowitzThese will run out within decadesMay 26 17:48
schestowitzIn a matter of 100 yearsMay 26 17:48
schestowitzwith 7% increase per year that's a doubling rate/decadeMay 26 17:48
DaemonFCsoonerMay 26 17:48
schestowitzThen you move to another source of burnable somethingMay 26 17:48
DaemonFCThe Saudi's are lying about how much they haveMay 26 17:48
DaemonFCI'd say no more than 30 yearsMay 26 17:48
schestowitzDead animals that chew or produce cell from sun energy will run outMay 26 17:49
schestowitzThen what?May 26 17:49
DaemonFC"Don't ask how much we have, we'll FIND MORE......SOMEWHERE"May 26 17:49
DaemonFCis the standard lineMay 26 17:49
schestowitzHumans (homo sapients) are like this bacteria in a petri dish that grow massively overnightMay 26 17:49
schestowitzTripling per 100 yearsMay 26 17:49
schestowitzTiny timeframe genealogically.May 26 17:50
schestowitzDaemonFC:  re: "Don't ask how much we have, we'll FIND MORE......SOMEWHERE"May 26 17:50
schestowitzSounds like loan mentalityMay 26 17:50
schestowitz"We'll get another credit card"May 26 17:50
DaemonFCa single bacteria is not dangerousMay 26 17:50
schestowitzThen it ends up like a Ponzi schemeMay 26 17:50
DaemonFCexcept in its ability to endlessly reproduceMay 26 17:50
schestowitzRunning to overnight loan shopsMay 26 17:51
schestowitzWell, it does reproduceMay 26 17:51
schestowitzElse it would not existMay 26 17:51
schestowitzIt's DarwinianMay 26 17:51
schestowitzAs biologists will put it grosslyMay 26 17:51
DaemonFCpersonally I think that people should be allowed to freeze semen then be sterilizedMay 26 17:51
DaemonFCyou'd see population stabilizeMay 26 17:51
schestowitzSomething along the lines of, "the human body is just a tool for genes to replicate themselves"May 26 17:52
schestowitzThat's from a purely scientific and nihilistic POVMay 26 17:52
DaemonFCinstinct short circuits higher thoughtMay 26 17:52
DaemonFCthat's where violence and sexual drive come fromMay 26 17:52
schestowitzYeMay 26 17:53
schestowitzYesMay 26 17:53
schestowitzAnimal instictsMay 26 17:53
schestowitzwithout them we're a weak chainMay 26 17:53
DaemonFCwould be nice if we could engineer the legacy programming outMay 26 17:53
schestowitzIt would not workMay 26 17:55
schestowitzYou then leave those who are reprogrammed to become a dying breed, extinctMay 26 17:55
schestowitzSome cultures have 10 kidsMay 26 17:55
DaemonFCthe UN wants western countries to hemorrhage jobs and money to the 3rd worldMay 26 17:57
DaemonFCas a form of population controlMay 26 17:57
taconehttp://www2.apebox.org/wordpress/?p=105May 26 17:57
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schestowitz"I want to thank Seb, Jorge ..."May 26 18:00
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schestowitz"I owe Jorge Castro a beer."May 26 18:00
schestowitzMOTUMay 26 18:00
schestowitz"Monobuntu"May 26 18:00
taconeno banshee for nowMay 26 18:01
taconei have to collect gobby notesMay 26 18:01
taconei'm not on linux right now, sadlyMay 26 18:01
schestowitzBN discussed in Spain: http://www.burbuja.info/inmobiliaria/burbuja-inmobiliaria/113006-bill-gates-visita-hoy-zapatero.htmlMay 26 18:03
taconeurgh...May 26 18:07
taconei read badlyMay 26 18:07
taconeRhythmbox will remain default “library” player in Karmic - UNLESS a list of specific blockers mentioned in the Gobby notes is fixed, at which point Banshee would become the default.May 26 18:07
mtnd3wwhat is gobby notes?May 26 18:08
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DaemonFCuggh, I need a hair cut, oil change, and prescription refill :pMay 26 18:12
DaemonFCWalmart it is :PMay 26 18:12
MinceRtoday's wtf moment was brought to you by ibm >> http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/05/26/159249&from=rssMay 26 18:17
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schestowitzL33t INVENT~1May 26 18:27
trmancohttp://dibani.org/index.php?post/2009/05/26/Micorsoft-uses-GPL-V3-software-to-promote-windows-against-LinuxMay 26 18:30
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schestowitzDefending Against Movie-Plot Threats with Movie Characters < http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/05/defending_again.html >May 26 19:03
schestowitz"In 2004, I wrote about the prevalence of secret questions as backup passwords. The problem is that the answers to these "secret questions" are often much easier to guess than random passwords. Mother's maiden name isn't very secret." http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/05/secret_question.htmlMay 26 19:04
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neighborleeoh hey guys..friend checked for me on ubuntu forums, and im told there is yet NO reply about my ecma question...May 26 19:09
neighborleeschestowitz: interseting if so..surprised I admit that I am.May 26 19:09
neighborleeschestowitz: you can verify..post would be under m y name and ecma topicMay 26 19:09
schestowitzThans.May 26 19:11
neighborleenpMay 26 19:11
neighborleeI would check myself, but atm im semi stuck in gentoo install so its harder to do so..considering atm im stuck using LINKS LOL ;))May 26 19:12
neighborleeEEK <dont ask why im even bothering..so pushy friends insistence I try  it again> hahaMay 26 19:12
mtnd3wlol this was hilarious: "Micorsoft uses GPL V3 software to promote windows against Linux"May 26 19:14
neighborleeoooooooook ;))May 26 19:14
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schestowitzGuy Sues Guinness For Naming Him The Most Litigious Person In The World < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090525/1449164996.shtml >May 26 19:35
mtnd3wwow this is a crazy video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9jHqndf9Kx4May 26 19:36
schestowitzNiceMay 26 19:40
schestowitzBut I lack contextMay 26 19:40
schestowitzWhat's Going on With CircuitCity.com? < http://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/04/10/whats-going-on-with-circuitcitycom >May 26 19:40
schestowitzSo CircuitCity goes to graveyards while GM and others get socialism (bailed out). Does that depend on how many cronies each company has in govt?May 26 19:41
neighborleeI thought GM was goingto bankruptcy court..May 26 19:42
schestowitzWhen?May 26 19:43
mtnd3wwhat are some benefits for hardware companies when they favor certain software vendors?May 26 19:43
MinceRdiscounts on licensing, bribesMay 26 19:44
schestowitzHP recalls another 15,000 laptop batteries < http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/nm/tc_nm/storytext/us_china_hp_recall/32141669/SIG=10pih0eam;_ylt=AlVi0poGPXddhpj1pIn2dT3iS5A5/*http://www.aqsiq.gov.cn >May 26 19:44
MinceRsometimes even exclusive dealsMay 26 19:44
MinceRor, in the case of m$, not having license costs raisedMay 26 19:44
mtnd3wthey get a better bulk deal from microsoft?May 26 19:45
MinceRindeedMay 26 19:45
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mtnd3wok so a company like asusMay 26 19:45
MinceRat least that's what i've readMay 26 19:45
mtnd3wwho's been doing good with gnu/linuxMay 26 19:45
mtnd3wand all of a sudden microsoft comes inMay 26 19:45
mtnd3wwhat do they offer asusMay 26 19:45
mtnd3wto dilute the whole market for linux, i'm talking specifically on the netbooksMay 26 19:46
MinceRnot raising the price of windows licenses fourfold, for exampleMay 26 19:46
schestowitzCollusion: Microsoft fiddling with netbook licences < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137474/microsoft-fiddling-netbook-licences >May 26 19:46
mtnd3woh okMay 26 19:46
MinceRhopefully we'll soon get to the point where the OEM can just say "fuck you, we'll go all-linux then"May 26 19:47
schestowitzhttp://www.paidcontent.org/entry/419-the-man-who-owns-livesearch.com/ (The Man Who Owns LiveSearch.com (No, He Doesn’t Work For Microsoft)May 26 19:48
schestowitz)May 26 19:48
schestowitzMinceR: we're already at this pointMay 26 19:49
schestowitzMS then offers them kickbacks (bribes)May 26 19:49
schestowitzWhich is why Microsoft's profits are down over 30%May 26 19:49
schestowitzIt is not sustainabilityMay 26 19:49
MinceRyet none of the major OEMs stood up against themMay 26 19:49
schestowitzNever mind the fact that it is /criminal/, but no-one seems to be enforcing the lawMay 26 19:49
schestowitzMinceR: some didMay 26 19:49
schestowitzSome still doMay 26 19:49
MinceRwho did?May 26 19:49
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schestowitzCheck out the criminals from Intel again:May 26 19:50
schestowitzhttp://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1137475/intel-cajoles-microsoft-limit-netbook-screen-sizeMay 26 19:50
schestowitzIt's all about screwing us, the customersMay 26 19:50
schestowitzBunch of cartelsMay 26 19:50
schestowitzIntel bribes OEMs like Dell $billions May 26 19:50
schestowitzThere must be regulation in this marketMay 26 19:50
schestowitzNone of that "fre market" malarkeyMay 26 19:51
schestowitzAnd the "invisible" hand nonsense... yes, it's,invisible... because it does not existMay 26 19:51
MinceRthis is not "free market"May 26 19:51
schestowitzIt isMay 26 19:51
schestowitzFree to do what they wishMay 26 19:51
MinceRno, it isn'tMay 26 19:51
schestowitzThe "Invisible Hand" will regulateMay 26 19:51
MinceRit's controlled by the few who have a lot of moneyMay 26 19:51
schestowitzThat's what THEY mean by "free"May 26 19:51
schestowitzMinceR: yesMay 26 19:52
mtnd3wschestowitz: you need to write an article giving examples of how Dell, Asus, OLPC had the linux netbooks market derailedMay 26 19:52
MinceRlet people arm themselves and shoot these bastardsMay 26 19:52
schestowitzThat means free marketMay 26 19:52
mtnd3wthis inquirer article is really true for DellMay 26 19:52
schestowitzFree markets do not contradict concentration of powerMay 26 19:52
mtnd3wi remember when Dell first started selling linux based PCs they did the same price strategy that would benefit microsoft salesMay 26 19:52
schestowitzmtnd3w: we did lots os articlesMay 26 19:52
schestowitzWe need indexed of theseMay 26 19:53
schestowitzmtnd3w: they still doMay 26 19:53
mtnd3wmost linux users are just too happy "oh they support linux, i love them!"May 26 19:53
mtnd3wthey don't understand the broader scopeMay 26 19:53
mtnd3woh ok, i'll search your site thenMay 26 19:54
mtnd3wyou're right they still do, the whole studio laptops came way too lateMay 26 19:55
schestowitzXPS?May 26 19:56
mtnd3wyes! that tooMay 26 19:56
schestowitzThey should rename it LX-P or somethingMay 26 19:56
mtnd3wlolMay 26 19:56
schestowitzSockpuppeting British politico resigns from Wikisupremecourt < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/26/wikipedia_westminster_councillor/ >May 26 19:57
schestowitzNet closes on NZ bank error fugitives < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/05/26/nz_overdraft_fugitives/ > Ha!May 26 19:58
schestowitzThe Register is like Star TrekMay 26 19:59
schestowitzThere's a New Generation of writersMay 26 19:59
schestowitzMostly some kind of Microsoft cronies where the publication's reach suits themMay 26 19:59
schestowitzThe Microsoft deal ruined The Register for the most partMay 26 20:00
mtnd3wschestowitz: you know what majority of the linux mainstream users won't say anything against IntelMay 26 20:00
schestowitzHahaMay 26 20:00
schestowitzI know...May 26 20:00
mtnd3wbecause of the whole moblin coolaidMay 26 20:00
schestowitzMy bro-in-law also works for IntelMay 26 20:00
schestowitzIntel=scumMay 26 20:00
schestowitzThey should be embargoedMay 26 20:00
schestowitzSame with Nokia BTWMay 26 20:00
schestowitzBringing software patents to the UKMay 26 20:00
schestowitzBut kids are busy singing praises of Maemo, Qt, and other nonsenseMay 26 20:01
schestowitzForgetting also the Ogg debacleMay 26 20:01
mtnd3wit's like the whole Apple/Mac crowdMay 26 20:01
schestowitzhttp://www.w3.org/2007/08/video/positions/Nokia.pdfMay 26 20:01
schestowitzApple tooMay 26 20:01
schestowitzNovell...May 26 20:01
schestowitzIBM...May 26 20:02
schestowitzSun...May 26 20:02
schestowitzThe level of offense just variesMay 26 20:02
schestowitzMany people have short memory span or limited sightMay 26 20:02
schestowitzLike failing to see how IBM is puking out its filthy software patentsMay 26 20:02
mtnd3wthey were rejecting the open video audio codecs for html5 right?May 26 20:02
schestowitzYesMay 26 20:03
schestowitzNo DRM.. poor sodsMay 26 20:03
mtnd3whahMay 26 20:03
schestowitzAlso issues of patents, which Ogg proudly proclaims it has none of.May 26 20:03
schestowitzNokia has bad applesMay 26 20:04
schestowitzLike this guyMay 26 20:04
schestowitzHe worked for Microsoft, now NokiaMay 26 20:04
schestowitzyay! Psystar Files for Bankruptcy, Ch. 11 < http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090526125156347  >May 26 20:06
schestowitzUp to no good from the start...May 26 20:06
schestowitzAt least they don't need to services those Linux boxes they soldMay 26 20:06
schestowitzObama Set to Create A Cybersecurity Czar With Broad Mandate < http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/25/AR2009052502104.html > OBAMMA the servant of our times... corporate interests and CZAR... you'd think you live in Prussia with such terminology, wouldn't you?May 26 20:08
mtnd3wObama and Biden have a history of pro corporationsMay 26 20:10
mtnd3wspecially Joe Biden, he's the reason PGP encryption was invented right?May 26 20:10
mtnd3wbecause he wanted to pass legislation about PC data not having any privacy protectionMay 26 20:11
schestowitzI didn't know thatMay 26 20:11
schestowitzHe seems like a non-techie technocrat who thinks following the money is following the best for the countryMay 26 20:12
mtnd3wlet me try to find you an article, my memory is vagueMay 26 20:12
schestowitzBut he's small poptatoesMay 26 20:12
schestowitzBut he's small potatoesMay 26 20:12
schestowitzObama likesiwse. It's other people who matter more and pass their guidance to the 'faces', the 'fronts'May 26 20:12
mtnd3where it is:May 26 20:13
mtnd3w"Joe Biden's pro-RIAA, pro-FBI tech voting record" http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10024163-38.htmlMay 26 20:13
schestowitzSub will explore undersea borders < http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8064225.stm > Planting flags at the bottom of oceans. Why??May 26 20:14
schestowitzmtnd3w: yes, I knew a year agoMay 26 20:15
schestowitzRMS caught up laterMay 26 20:15
schestowitzBut, mtnd3w, these people don't matter muchMay 26 20:15
schestowitzIt's the people they bring with them who doMay 26 20:15
schestowitzAnd both left and right have great overlap. You just need to check campaign fundingMay 26 20:15
schestowitzSame people, same lobbyists SOMETIMES, but usually some of the same companies looking out for themselvesMay 26 20:16
schestowitzNot being bitter, just stating the obviousMay 26 20:16
schestowitzBut the illusion of "Obama is our king" still plagues the average XBox junkie who watches BamaBiden on  TV all dayMay 26 20:16
schestowitzSo the reality totally eludes themMay 26 20:16
schestowitzmtnd3w: can you help us with the Wiki perhaps?May 26 20:17
mtnd3wsureMay 26 20:17
schestowitzWe envision an index to better characterise companies and their acts.May 26 20:17
schestowitzYou mentioned DellMay 26 20:17
schestowitzHere's something fun to do while reading.May 26 20:18
mtnd3walrightMay 26 20:18
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/DellMay 26 20:18
schestowitzI need to parse theseMay 26 20:19
schestowitzFull textMay 26 20:19
schestowitzThen, adding posts about thisMay 26 20:19
schestowitzhttp://www.google.com/search?q=site:boycottnovell.com+dell&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8&hl=enMay 26 20:19
schestowitzIn June I will do lots of work on this, but I need help from othersMay 26 20:20
mtnd3walrightMay 26 20:20
mtnd3wso each article should have a wiki subsection?May 26 20:21
mtnd3wthis is a very good idea btw...May 26 20:22
schestowitzWhy does Carla put this non-Linux Non-Ogg stream in Linux Today...? Frugal Friday: Interop, Trade Show Kvetching, Apple Airport Express, Kickfire < http://blogs.zdnet.com/perlow/?p=10131 May 26 20:22
schestowitzmtnd3w: the ones with exhibitsMay 26 20:22
schestowitzSometimes one article fits more than one strand of exhibitsMay 26 20:22
schestowitzAnd we need to parse through many exhibitsMay 26 20:22
schestowitz Ubuntu Polishes GNU Screen < http://www.enterprisenetworkingplanet.com/_featured/article.php/3821811/ >May 26 20:23
schestowitzDell now offering Ubuntu on Studio XPS 13 notebook, but it's CRIPPLED: http://www.electronista.com/articles/09/05/25/studio.xps.13.gets.ubuntu/May 26 20:28
schestowitzNokia N810 Successor Coming Soon? < http://www.techtree.com/India/News/Nokia_N810_Successor_Coming_Soon/551-102345-893.html >May 26 20:33
taconecrippled ?May 26 20:33
schestowitzOf courseMay 26 20:33
schestowitzSays LinuxTodayMay 26 20:33
schestowitzAnd the Nokia thing, Meh. It's NoiaMay 26 20:34
schestowitz*NokiaMay 26 20:34
taconeah yes, some buy option lessMay 26 20:34
taconenothing that bad - all considererdMay 26 20:34
taconedell is still fighting to have hardware drivers and so on.May 26 20:35
taconethey're just playing safe. much better that than nothing.May 26 20:35
schestowitzOK, I guess it's not too badMay 26 20:35
taconemost unuseful blog post of the history: http://www.stefanoforenza.com/gnome-elections-meet-the-candidates/May 26 20:36
schestowitzI was never that worried about them, personally.May 26 20:36
schestowitzI wish they said more about their pact with MS and NovellMay 26 20:36
schestowitzIf they pay for mythical patents, they should be dennouncedMay 26 20:36
taconeyes, that would have been interesting.May 26 20:36
schestowitzIs Moblin encumberedMay 26 20:36
schestowitz?May 26 20:36
schestowitzSUSE+S*itelMay 26 20:37
schestowitzThat's thing about behind-closed-doors deal. You don't know because _they don't want you to know_. They want their orgy/collusion to remain discreetMay 26 20:38
schestowitzEven heard of this? Linux Unified Kernel 0.2.4   < http://forum.kde.org/linux-unified-kernel-0-2-4-t-58876.html >May 26 20:39
taconeit's downMay 26 20:41
schestowitzeWeek has just hired a known pathetic troll: Don ReisingerMay 26 20:41
schestowitzGoogle spews some random errors todayMay 26 20:43
taconeoffliningMay 26 20:47
taconebyeMay 26 20:47
schestowitz"The system includes Linux-based operational software. Users can choose the preferred data preparation scheme. " http://eetimes.eu/germany/217700050May 26 20:47
schestowitzThose with old Mac lying around can made them modern again http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/tutorials/6755/1/May 26 20:49
schestowitz*macsMay 26 20:49
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schestowitzAMD Phenom II X3 On Linux http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_phenom2_x3&num=1 May 26 20:52
schestowitzAdobe rattles the wrong tree: Adobe acts against Flash video stream recorder < http://www.h-online.com/open/Adobe-acts-against-Flash-video-stream-recorder--/news/113370 >May 26 21:01
schestowitzPriceless! : Microsoft Plays with Fire: Says Things Don't Work < http://www.computerworlduk.com/community/blogs/index.cfm?entryid=2216&blogid=14 >May 26 21:01
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schestowitzAnother Linux Phone coming...  HTC plans Android-based 'OPhone' for China < http://news.cnet.com/8301-17938_105-10248999-1.html >May 26 21:16
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schestowitzSome new KDE eye candy: http://www.junauza.com/2009/05/15-beautiful-kdm-themes.htmlMay 26 21:23
schestowitzKDE 4.3 Beta 1: A Short Preview < http://www.itnewstoday.com/?p=389 >May 26 21:23
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schestowitzHow would hiding Linux make it better? http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2009/05/invisible_linux.html;jsessionid=O35EEYOJRTIMMQSNDLPCKHSCJUNN2JVNMay 26 21:38
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schestowitzReasons for a Boss to Demand GNU/Linux from Employees < http://www.detector-pro.com/2009/05/why-your-boss-wants-you-to-use-linux.html >May 26 21:41
schestowitzShattering of the Myth That GNU/Linux Users Won't Pay for Applications < http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2009/05/netflix-where-art-thou.html >May 26 21:44
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schestowitzLinux Mint 7 Works Well Even Before Final Release < http://community.zdnet.co.uk/blog/0,1000000567,10012817o-2000498448b,00.htm >May 26 21:48
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schestowitzApplications Ecosystems Develop Around Ubuntu GNU/Linux < http://news.softpedia.com/news/Ubuntu-AppCenter-112572.shtml >May 26 21:51
taconemahMay 26 21:54
taconeidiots, they never link the sourceMay 26 21:54
schestowitzUbicom Routers Run Linux < http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS8468953219.html >May 26 21:54
schestowitztacone: you?May 26 21:54
taconeeh, yes meMay 26 21:55
taconehttp://www.stefanoforenza.com/ubuntu-appstore-in-the-workings/May 26 21:55
taconewell, they don't link anyoneMay 26 21:55
taconeparasites, they copy your tutorials,change 2 or 3 bits, and take credit.May 26 21:56
schestowitzI see...May 26 21:57
schestowitzSoftPedia, right?May 26 21:57
schestowitzCause I never got this impression from them..May 26 21:58
schestowitzAttribution is nice is the content is  copyrightedMay 26 21:58
schestowitzMy posting style is mashup-likeMay 26 21:58
taconemahMay 26 21:59
schestowitzSo I cite almost everything I say. There's always a concrete source for facts, but sometimes for speed peopel neglect thisMay 26 21:59
schestowitzThat's why I hate newspapersMay 26 21:59
taconethey're parasites. they offer download links of software, but never ever say you the software homepageMay 26 21:59
schestowitzThey stick facts and pull some without referencesMay 26 21:59
taconeyou're likely to be forced to use an old version or google by yourselfMay 26 21:59
schestowitzit would be nice to see newspapers [1] that links [2] to the facts -- not news -- that back [3] their factsMay 26 21:59
taconei got a tutorial copied almost enterely from them.May 26 22:00
schestowitzSoftPedia announces many new distrosMay 26 22:00
schestowitzThey have nice screenshots tours.May 26 22:00
schestowitzRomania-based BTWMay 26 22:00
schestowitzNot that it mattersMay 26 22:00
taconeyes, they do screen toursMay 26 22:00
taconethe rest is copied.May 26 22:00
schestowitzBut you said something like "parasites", which makes me thinks "gypsies" in my headMay 26 22:00
taconewell, they never ever pull out original content.May 26 22:01
schestowitzIt's hard to tewllMay 26 22:01
schestowitzUnless they link to itMay 26 22:01
taconeeven workswithu is betterMay 26 22:01
schestowitzThe honest ones that link are easier to 'catch'May 26 22:01
schestowitzAnd to show their inspirationMay 26 22:01
schestowitzI have a hobby of catching those who make articles out of press releasesMay 26 22:01
schestowitzSJVN does this alsoMay 26 22:01
schestowitzHeh. "Even".May 26 22:01
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schestowitzI perceive workswithu as a iittle hostileMay 26 22:02
schestowitzPatronising and usually asking just to improve things.May 26 22:02
schestowitzLittle praiseMay 26 22:02
taconei found the banshee gobby noteMay 26 22:02
taconei'll take a look laterMay 26 22:02
taconewhos sjvn ?May 26 22:03
schestowitz"Great now I can run Android, right? Not yet. I came to find out that there are many things in the Android code that rely on specific hardware features. For example, is the device powered on? Of course it is on -- we are a computer :) " http://mjfrey.blogspot.com/2009/05/hacking-android-on-ubuntu.htmlMay 26 22:03
schestowitzSteven NicholsMay 26 22:03
taconeworkswithu is trying to estabilish itself as the business ubuntu magazineMay 26 22:03
taconeso that if ubuntu catches on, they're the leaders in ubuntu IT thingsMay 26 22:03
taconethey also rarely link. but at lease they pull out things, news, and original content.May 26 22:04
taconethey're not that badMay 26 22:04
taconeubuntu android is 2 wayMay 26 22:04
taconeubuntu will run on android kernelMay 26 22:04
taconeis not just a matter of packaging android applicationsMay 26 22:04
trmancono wayMay 26 22:04
taconeno way what ?May 26 22:05
trmancoubuntu will be based on adroidMay 26 22:05
taconeubuntu will run on android kernel - i repeadMay 26 22:05
trmancoandroid*May 26 22:05
taconerepeatMay 26 22:05
taconethat's for a simple reasonMay 26 22:05
schestowitzDesktop GNU/Linux and Android Converge < http://mjfrey.blogspot.com/2009/05/hacking-android-on-ubuntu.html >May 26 22:05
taconeubuntu supports only 1-2 arm architecturesMay 26 22:05
taconeandroid supports many more.May 26 22:05
trmancotacone, the main desktop version won'tMay 26 22:05
trmancoat least I hope notMay 26 22:06
taconeno, the main desktop version won't, obviouslyMay 26 22:06
trmancothe netbook version can go with android I don't mindMay 26 22:06
taconethe kernel thing, is just a matter of convenience, to get ubuntu mobile on any arm netbook out thereMay 26 22:06
schestowitzit's just a patchsetMay 26 22:06
schestowitz A branchMay 26 22:06
schestowitzThere is no Android kernel per seMay 26 22:07
schestowitzNot more than thter is the "SUSE kernel"May 26 22:07
schestowitzTechnically it's a set of addonsMay 26 22:07
trmancoyeah I knowMay 26 22:07
schestowitzGoogle puts its changes in mainlineMay 26 22:07
schestowitzor -mmMay 26 22:07
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_Goblinbonjour!May 26 22:08
_GoblinHi all!May 26 22:08
_GoblinApparently Ive just been "exposed"....again....May 26 22:08
trmancouh?May 26 22:09
_GoblinSomeone has read Roy's IRC log at the comment I made about being in the COLA top twenty...My mistake it wasnt a top twenty...I was 37...May 26 22:09
_Goblinso this makes them think I use a handle of someone else...May 26 22:10
_Goblinits all commented on my latest post...May 26 22:10
taconebanshee http://pastebin.com/m39042b41May 26 22:10
_Goblinwhich just goes to show, theres people very interested in Roy's work.  He must be doing something right if people are prepared to go through his IRC logs.May 26 22:11
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schestowitzYo, _Goblin May 26 22:27
trmancoyeahMay 26 22:28
tacone420 diggs for the appstoreMay 26 22:28
schestowitz+1May 26 22:28
_Goblinhi Roy!May 26 22:28
_Goblinjust come back from work, reading your site now....May 26 22:29
_Goblinwheres the Cpt Kirk article?May 26 22:29
_GoblinRoy, before I forget..check out the comments on my Hadron article...someone has trawled your IRC logs and thinks they've identified me.May 26 22:30
trmancohttp://groups.google.com/group/24hoursupport.helpdesk/msg/f24824d527bb1493May 26 22:35
_GoblinA typical Vista experience?May 26 22:37
_GoblinIt certainly is godawful...May 26 22:38
trmancohehMay 26 22:38
trmancothat's just *SOME MORE* proof that PISTA sucksMay 26 22:38
schestowitz_Goblin: wait..May 26 22:39
_Goblin?May 26 22:39
schestowitzThe one with the Heise referenceMay 26 22:39
schestowitzZDNyetMay 26 22:39
_Goblinyep.May 26 22:39
schestowitzPISTA with tomato sauceMay 26 22:39
schestowitzStick a fork in it... it's FRIEDMay 26 22:40
trmancoehMay 26 22:42
schestowitztrmanco: just posted it to COLAMay 26 22:43
schestowitzMight get some reactionMay 26 22:43
_Goblinlol, yeah its good Roy, but I don't think its a patch on "To boldly blow"May 26 22:43
_Goblinor Ballmer talking about the holodeckMay 26 22:44
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_Goblinaww DaemonFC was here and never said hi :(May 26 22:45
_GoblinHe seems to have a lot of issues with keeping a connection....May 26 22:45
_Goblinmaybe thats another restriction of the Vista 7 RC?May 26 22:46
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trmancotime to go, cyaMay 26 22:46
trmancognMay 26 22:46
_GoblingnMay 26 22:48
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mib_9j16bvhi royMay 26 22:57
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schestowitz_Goblin: maybe.May 26 23:02
schestowitzHe uses all sorts of thingsMay 26 23:02
_Goblinwhats his story? has he popped up before?May 26 23:04
_Goblincomputer withMay 26 23:04
_GoblinWinXP, the software refuses to work. Uncompatible with Vista! ProgramsMay 26 23:04
_Goblinthat I computer withMay 26 23:04
_GoblinWinXP, the software refuses to work. Uncompatible with Vista! ProgramsMay 26 23:04
_Goblinsorry....May 26 23:05
_Goblinthat WONT happen again...May 26 23:05
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taconehas digg removed the shouting ?May 26 23:10
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mtnd3wEvery other post on UbuntuForums is about "how to install Moonlight" it seems like the whole of the web has made it a dependency...May 26 23:16
taconeyeah ?May 26 23:17
taconeschestowitz: http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-05-26-006-35-NW-GN-LL-0000May 26 23:17
taconelast commentMay 26 23:17
*schestowitz watches A conversation with Richard Dawkins (2/12) < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_8TO-swuX8&NR=1 >May 26 23:18
schestowitztacone: I hope they removed shouting.,I hated itMay 26 23:18
taconeseems they didMay 26 23:19
taconei can't find it anymore. can you ?May 26 23:19
schestowitzI hardly visit DiggMay 26 23:20
schestowitzBack in a moment..May 26 23:25
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Tue May 26 23:29:23 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovellMay 26 23:29
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: "Exploring the reality behind exclusionary deals with Microsoft and their subtle (yet severe) implications" [publicly logged]May 26 23:29
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Fri May 22 21:43:08 2009May 26 23:29
-ChanServ-You are not authorized to perform this operation.May 26 23:29
-ChanServ-You are not authorized to perform this operation.May 26 23:29
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channelMay 26 23:29
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitzMay 26 23:29
schestowitzMay 26 23:08:03 <tacone>http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/05/26/microsoft_new_zealand/May 26 23:31
schestowitzThanks, got it.May 26 23:31
schestowitzThere are 2 more articles I foundMay 26 23:31
*_Hicham_ (n=hicham@wana-97-245-12-196.wanamaroc.com) has joined #boycottnovellMay 26 23:32
_Hicham_Hi All!May 26 23:32
_GoblinhiMay 26 23:32
_Hicham_howdy _Goblin?May 26 23:33
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_Goblin:)May 26 23:37
schestowitzgnMay 26 23:39
_GoblingnMay 26 23:40
taconegnMay 26 23:40
taconesanity: http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/mt-preview-15cc3896917baa4ddc800fa13286595b698a149f.phpMay 26 23:57

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