| _Goblin | lol.. | Jun 20 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| _Goblin | thats like buying a Porche and making it look like a Lada. | Jun 20 00:00 |
| schestowitz | Yeah. | Jun 20 00:02 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] It's better with Linux http://ping.fm/nRDAs | Jun 20 00:02 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Valve To Launch Native Linux Game In July? http://ping.fm/Uj4JL | Jun 20 00:02 | |
| schestowitz | Well, don't insult Lada | Jun 20 00:02 |
| *DaemonXP thinks KDE is imitation Vista to begin with | Jun 20 00:02 | |
| _Goblin | yeah, youre right... | Jun 20 00:02 |
| _Goblin | roy that is... | Jun 20 00:02 |
| schestowitz | Hehe. | Jun 20 00:02 |
| schestowitz | Yeah, I wondered | Jun 20 00:02 |
| DaemonXP | http://img41.imageshack.us/img41/1294/54312631.png | Jun 20 00:02 |
| _Goblin | or maybe Vista is an imitation of KDE | Jun 20 00:02 |
| DaemonXP | one such passage | Jun 20 00:02 |
| *schestowitz thinks DaemonXP can be flushed again | Jun 20 00:02 | |
| DaemonXP | 1:17 on Disturbed's Meaning of Life | Jun 20 00:02 |
| DaemonXP | :D | Jun 20 00:03 |
| schestowitz | Trolling quotient is high | Jun 20 00:03 |
| schestowitz | KDE4 was designed in 05/06 | Jun 20 00:03 |
| schestowitz | Before the Vistaster | Jun 20 00:03 |
| _Goblin | troll or not...God damn it, I cant help but like DaemonXP. | Jun 20 00:03 |
| *DaemonXP encodes schestowitz in Protected WMA and deletes the license | Jun 20 00:03 | |
| DaemonXP | :) | Jun 20 00:03 |
| schestowitz | By that logic, Apple 'stole' from Sun | Jun 20 00:03 |
| schestowitz | And KDE 3 too is a "Windows copy" | Jun 20 00:04 |
| DaemonXP | the look for Vista was basically decided | Jun 20 00:04 |
| DaemonXP | while KDE was deciding | Jun 20 00:04 |
| schestowitz | Because it has a place where you click to browse programs | Jun 20 00:04 |
| _Goblin | Windows 95 copied Workbench 1.3 | Jun 20 00:04 |
| DaemonXP | so I think it heavily influenced a lot of KDE | Jun 20 00:04 |
| schestowitz | But you don't need to do Vendor name->program name->readme.txt... | Jun 20 00:04 |
| DaemonXP | it's clear that every distro that tries to mimic Windows uses KDE | Jun 20 00:04 |
| DaemonXP | some even proudly exclaim it works like Windows | Jun 20 00:05 |
| DaemonXP | (Mandriva) | Jun 20 00:05 |
| _Goblin | I think Gnome is far more Windows like.... | Jun 20 00:05 |
| DaemonXP | some doll it up to be more like Windows | Jun 20 00:05 |
| DaemonXP | (iMagicOS) :P | Jun 20 00:05 |
| _Goblin | oh wait, it is...it is infected with Mono. | Jun 20 00:05 |
| DaemonXP | Mono is not part of GNOME | Jun 20 00:05 |
| _Goblin | I know... | Jun 20 00:05 |
| DaemonXP | it's a Novell extension that lots of distros use | Jun 20 00:05 |
| _Goblin | but its packaged (in the case of Ubuntu) with Mono apps. | Jun 20 00:06 |
| _Goblin | or am I wrong? | Jun 20 00:06 |
| _Goblin | ;) | Jun 20 00:06 |
| DaemonXP | so since Ubuntu ships GNOME that must mean that GNOME officially endorses everything Ubuntu does | Jun 20 00:06 |
| DaemonXP | rig:P | Jun 20 00:06 |
| DaemonXP | errr | Jun 20 00:06 |
| DaemonXP | following that logic that is | Jun 20 00:06 |
| _Goblin | no...but since my experience of Gnome is with Ubuntu only...i think its the most windows like (for me anyway) | Jun 20 00:07 |
| DaemonXP | GNOME has never officially blessed Mono AFAIK | Jun 20 00:07 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] fds -> "Buraka already has too many friends." raio do facebook... | Jun 20 00:07 | |
| DaemonXP | if they had the hots for it, they'd ship with Banshee and F-Spot | Jun 20 00:07 |
| DaemonXP | instead of gthumb and Rhythmbox | Jun 20 00:07 |
| DaemonXP | the "official" GNOME is not really like Ubuntu has it set up | Jun 20 00:08 |
| DaemonXP | Ubuntu rigged it to humor Windows users | Jun 20 00:08 |
| DaemonXP | like most distros do | Jun 20 00:08 |
| _Goblin | To be fair, Im not really interested in the rights and wrongs of Mono, since I always prefered the "simple" menu display (when I was using Windows at home) Gnome is far more Windows like to me..... | Jun 20 00:08 |
| DaemonXP | but GNOME is very much its own thing | Jun 20 00:08 |
| _Goblin | Ive never had the displeasure of Vista at home (only at work) so to me Gnome is more of a reminder of a darker chapter in my PC history. | Jun 20 00:09 |
| DaemonXP | I think Debian's GNOME is the closest I've seen any distro get to the vanilla setup | Jun 20 00:09 |
| _Goblin | Gentoo is on my main rig, and Ive recently replaced the family PC with Mandriva (it was previously Ubuntu) | Jun 20 00:10 |
| _Goblin | thats not because of the Mono issue, its to do with the immature way some of its dev community acted when a legitimate question/concern was put to them. | Jun 20 00:10 |
| schestowitz | China recruits volunteer net porn police < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/06/19/china_to_recruit_internet_supervision_army/ > | Jun 20 00:11 |
| DaemonXP | Mandriva is probably my favorite | Jun 20 00:11 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, gentoo,,mandriva..beyond obvious differences what do you really like best | Jun 20 00:11 |
| DaemonXP | they're the only ones who aren't using theirs as a loss leader or a playground for new buggy software | Jun 20 00:11 |
| *neighborlee leans manddriva..always love urpmf,,mcc,,etc. | Jun 20 00:11 | |
| DaemonXP | or some community project that tells you to RTFM | Jun 20 00:12 |
| _Goblin | I would like to act l337 and say Gentoo, but if Im honest, its Mandriva | Jun 20 00:12 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] http://ping.fm/V2sde To Microsoft, it's not enough telling them what hardware they are allowed to use. | Jun 20 00:12 | |
| DaemonXP | even when the problem you are experiencing is not explained anywhere | Jun 20 00:12 |
| neighborlee | but hey fedora ..they got guts can't say that without mentioning them | Jun 20 00:12 |
| neighborlee | DaemonXP, yes and ive fought against that for ages..I dont think enough do. | Jun 20 00:13 |
| neighborlee | it can be seen to be 'kewl' to say rtfm...ego boost. | Jun 20 00:13 |
| _Goblin | I am using AROS more though...very impressed.... | Jun 20 00:13 |
| neighborlee | no idea about aros | Jun 20 00:13 |
| _Goblin | Its an AmigaOS project... | Jun 20 00:14 |
| neighborlee | ic yes | Jun 20 00:15 |
| _Goblin | probably due to me still being stuck in the A500 days.... | Jun 20 00:16 |
| neighborlee | not that bad of a thing ;)) | Jun 20 00:16 |
| neighborlee | honestly..pretty dain kewl even by todays standards. | Jun 20 00:16 |
| neighborlee | I miss mine | Jun 20 00:16 |
| _Goblin | happy times... | Jun 20 00:16 |
| neighborlee | no monitor.. | Jun 20 00:16 |
| neighborlee | very happy | Jun 20 00:16 |
| _Goblin | Devpac 2, Argasm, Dpaint | Jun 20 00:16 |
| _Goblin | staple diet of the Amiga coder... | Jun 20 00:17 |
| DaemonXP | the only time you run into trouble with MP3 is with a 5.1 channel track | Jun 20 00:17 |
| neighborlee | I had dpaint anyway | Jun 20 00:17 |
| neighborlee | oh and some 3d app | Jun 20 00:17 |
| DaemonXP | like on DVD-A | Jun 20 00:17 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Gordon Brown discovers Web, says the darnest things? http://ping.fm/z9LQW | Jun 20 00:17 | |
| _Goblin | and who can forget Xcopy! | Jun 20 00:17 |
| DaemonXP | you have to switch to MPEG 2 Layer 3 | Jun 20 00:17 |
| DaemonXP | and that can only go to 160k | Jun 20 00:17 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, true ;) | Jun 20 00:17 |
| DaemonXP | :D | Jun 20 00:17 |
| neighborlee | lovely ;) | Jun 20 00:17 |
| _Goblin | Software failure task held - Guru Meditation 1243324893243.... | Jun 20 00:17 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, one of my favorite games was battle squadron | Jun 20 00:18 |
| DaemonXP | encoders default to MPEG 1 layer 3 | Jun 20 00:18 |
| DaemonXP | so they can go to 320k | Jun 20 00:18 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, colorful..lots of action..fun.. | Jun 20 00:18 |
| DaemonXP | but that limits you to two channels | Jun 20 00:18 |
| DaemonXP | :) | Jun 20 00:18 |
| _Goblin | I was a Dungeon Master fan! | Jun 20 00:18 |
| neighborlee | challenging ;) | Jun 20 00:18 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, ah yes that one too.. | Jun 20 00:18 |
| _Goblin | and Space Ace was impressive.... | Jun 20 00:18 |
| neighborlee | DaemonXP, I just never had time really to get into audio tech stuff | Jun 20 00:18 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, quite yes | Jun 20 00:18 |
| _Goblin | neighborlee: Were you ever into the demoscene? | Jun 20 00:19 |
| DaemonXP | MP3 is defined in MPEG 1 and 2, AAC is defined in MPEG 2 and 4 | Jun 20 00:19 |
| neighborlee | _Goblin, no idea, so I guess not ;)) | Jun 20 00:19 |
| DaemonXP | but ideally you will use MPEG-4 | Jun 20 00:19 |
| DaemonXP | which can support up to 48 channels | Jun 20 00:19 |
| DaemonXP | hehe | Jun 20 00:19 |
| _Goblin | ah...I was going to name drop....shame...you stole my thunder. | Jun 20 00:20 |
| neighborlee | lol | Jun 20 00:20 |
| DaemonXP | every channel needs bandwidth, so usually you're best served by 2 channel Joint Stereo | Jun 20 00:20 |
| DaemonXP | (instead of regular Stereo) | Jun 20 00:20 |
| DaemonXP | which is why I have no idea why Microsoft was bragging about WMA Pro being able to use an "unlimited number" of channels | Jun 20 00:21 |
| DaemonXP | it still needs to find the bandwidth for them somewhere | Jun 20 00:21 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "You don’t often publish something for the sake of it Daniel. This is a bit thin don’t you reckon." http://ping.fm/sU18I RD is kaput(ish ... | Jun 20 00:22 | |
| DaemonXP | god I love marketing | Jun 20 00:22 |
| *ugufjhfj (n=ugufjhfj@modemcable213.226-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 00:26 | |
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| DaemonXP | SoundKonverter is a full fledged WMA encoder for Linux provided you have the full version of XINE :D | Jun 20 00:33 |
| DaemonXP | supports all the features of Microsoft's encoder | Jun 20 00:34 |
| yuhong | BN just posted another article that refers to the "Vista 7 Security Cannot be Fixed" article. | Jun 20 00:34 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/19/get-the-facts-ie/ | Jun 20 00:35 |
| yuhong | The one that inspired this IRC converstation about Linux boot-time rootkits. | Jun 20 00:36 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/irc-log-26052009.html | Jun 20 00:37 |
| yuhong | schestowitz: Did you read this IRC log? | Jun 20 00:39 |
| *yuhong has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.11/2009060310]") | Jun 20 00:41 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've just just got my palm Tungsten working with JPilot, a year after I had set up this machine. | Jun 20 00:42 | |
| DaemonXP | heh, 3079 kbps and 96 Khz | Jun 20 00:44 |
| DaemonXP | :) | Jun 20 00:44 |
| DaemonXP | in FLAC | Jun 20 00:44 |
| *DaemonXP decides to unpack it to WAV | Jun 20 00:45 | |
| DaemonXP | hmmm | Jun 20 00:46 |
| DaemonXP | my WAV writer can only go to 48 Khz | Jun 20 00:46 |
| DaemonXP | never noticed that before | Jun 20 00:46 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] IMO Follow Friday is a cheap way to get extra followers. I see some users benefit greatly from it. Shame it how they attract people. | Jun 20 00:47 | |
| DaemonXP | and Lame errors out | Jun 20 00:47 |
| DaemonXP | hmmm | Jun 20 00:47 |
| DaemonXP | this could be tricky | Jun 20 00:47 |
| neighborlee | when I get all settled I dowant to get more into audio | Jun 20 00:49 |
| DaemonXP | I got this from vinyl | Jun 20 00:49 |
| DaemonXP | I may run it through the pop and click remover | Jun 20 00:49 |
| _Goblin | Playing around with Zenwalk at the moment on a laptop... | Jun 20 00:52 |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@41.248.130.175) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 00:56 | |
| _Hicham_ | Hi All! | Jun 20 00:56 |
| _Hicham_ | why is the room silent? | Jun 20 00:57 |
| _Hicham_ | where are u all? | Jun 20 00:57 |
| MinceR | because the trolls have lessened my interest in it | Jun 20 00:57 |
| MinceR | and made meaningful discussion impossible. | Jun 20 00:57 |
| _Hicham_ | well, we don't have a lot of trolls in here | Jun 20 00:57 |
| _Hicham_ | just small trolls | Jun 20 00:58 |
| MinceR | ("troll" is an optimistic assessment, they might very well be just genuine idiots.) | Jun 20 00:58 |
| _Hicham_ | not big ones | Jun 20 00:58 |
| _Hicham_ | maybe Ballmer comes here from time to time | Jun 20 00:58 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz is famous all over the world | Jun 20 00:58 |
| MinceR | nah, ballmer would never get on irc, as it doesn't include a chair-throwing feature | Jun 20 00:59 |
| MinceR | also, they've declared irc dead when they "invented" m$n im. | Jun 20 00:59 |
| MinceR | (and by "invented" i mean "copied from icq") | Jun 20 00:59 |
| *schestowitz has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)) | Jun 20 00:42 | |
| *BNc has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Jun 20 00:42 | |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz is still in here? | Jun 20 00:43 |
| _Hicham_ | he just left | Jun 20 00:43 |
| **** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Jun 20 01:05:50 2009 | ||
| *Now talking on #boycottnovell | Jun 20 01:05 | |
| *Topic for #boycottnovell is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged] | Jun 20 01:05 | |
| *Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Fri Jun 12 17:24:05 2009 | Jun 20 01:05 | |
| -ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channel | Jun 20 01:05 | |
| _Hicham_ | wb Don schestowitz | Jun 20 01:06 |
| *ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitz | Jun 20 01:06 | |
| *BNc (n=twitfolk@cg131a.halls.manchester.ac.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 01:07 | |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : where r u ? | Jun 20 01:08 |
| _Hicham_ | wow | Jun 20 01:09 |
| _Hicham_ | what is happening to this channel? | Jun 20 01:09 |
| ugufjhfj | :/ | Jun 20 01:10 |
| _Goblin | Maybe too many lines of communication to keep tabs on them all? | Jun 20 01:11 |
| _Hicham_ | howdy _Goblin? | Jun 20 01:12 |
| _Goblin | hi! | Jun 20 01:12 |
| _Hicham_ | are u back home? | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Goblin | yep! | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Hicham_ | no XP netbook? | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Goblin | and back with my beloved Linux! | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Hicham_ | what distro are u on? | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Goblin | Gentoo/Mandriva | Jun 20 01:13 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: testing stuff | Jun 20 01:13 |
| schestowitz | housework | Jun 20 01:13 |
| _Goblin | Mandriva at the moment. | Jun 20 01:14 |
| _Hicham_ | _Goblin : would u help testing a package? | Jun 20 01:14 |
| _Goblin | yep sure! | Jun 20 01:14 |
| _Hicham_ | this package introduces conflicts with all mono packages | Jun 20 01:14 |
| _Hicham_ | so install it, and try to add a mono package | Jun 20 01:14 |
| _Hicham_ | ok? | Jun 20 01:15 |
| _Goblin | ok np. | Jun 20 01:15 |
| DaemonXP | _Goblin: http://rapidshare.de/files/47595843/Inside_The_Fire.7z.html | Jun 20 01:15 |
| _Hicham_ | DaemonXP : r u on linux now? | Jun 20 01:15 |
| DaemonXP | tell me where in that track the MP3 fails to keep up with the quality of the FLAC | Jun 20 01:15 |
| DaemonXP | I made a 30 second sample | Jun 20 01:15 |
| schestowitz | HDD to External HDD (USB 2) @ 20mbytes/sex | Jun 20 01:16 |
| schestowitz | sec | Jun 20 01:16 |
| _Goblin | downloading...gotta wait 60secs | Jun 20 01:16 |
| _Hicham_ | http://rapidshare.com/files/246471682/mononono-0.0.1-1.noarch.rpm.html | Jun 20 01:16 |
| _Goblin | for the free download... | Jun 20 01:16 |
| _Hicham_ | _Goblin : there u go | Jun 20 01:16 |
| DaemonXP | the MP3 was LAME 3.98.2 at VBR 0 | Jun 20 01:16 |
| _Hicham_ | DaemonXP : would test that package plz? | Jun 20 01:16 |
| DaemonXP | got better than 3.5:1 compression over the FLAC | Jun 20 01:17 |
| DaemonXP | and sounds the same to me | Jun 20 01:17 |
| _Hicham_ | fucking DaemonXP, does nothing good | Jun 20 01:17 |
| DaemonXP | hehe | Jun 20 01:18 |
| _Hicham_ | just messing around all day | Jun 20 01:18 |
| _Goblin | got it... Its 130am here so Ill give it a run first thing in the morning...Ill be back saturday evening and give you my results....got work in morning :( | Jun 20 01:19 |
| _Goblin | gn all. | Jun 20 01:19 |
| *_Goblin has quit ("Lost terminal") | Jun 20 01:19 | |
| _Hicham_ | so DaemonXP, r u gonna test the package? | Jun 20 01:19 |
| DaemonXP | LAME averages 275k on that passage and AoTuv vorbis averages 272 | Jun 20 01:22 |
| DaemonXP | they both make similar bit allocation decisions | Jun 20 01:22 |
| DaemonXP | it's obvious that most of Vorbis came around based on what LAME was doing back around 2000 | Jun 20 01:23 |
| DaemonXP | when is the last time that free software invented a category of software | Jun 20 01:23 |
| DaemonXP | rather than mimic exiting implementations? | Jun 20 01:23 |
| DaemonXP | *existing | Jun 20 01:24 |
| DaemonXP | cause I have never seen it happen | Jun 20 01:24 |
| ugufjhfj | ---> Obama Taps IBM Open Source Advocate For USPTO | Jun 20 01:24 |
| DaemonXP | they pretty much wait until proprietary software has been around a while, has worked out all the implementation problems and design mistakes | Jun 20 01:24 |
| DaemonXP | then base theirs on a copy of what's out there at that point | Jun 20 01:25 |
| DaemonXP | Vorbis and Linux are textbook examples of that | Jun 20 01:25 |
| DaemonXP | 10-20 or so years into the development of their proprietary counterparts they're made in the image of whatever format they didn't invent | Jun 20 01:26 |
| DaemonXP | that's how I usually explain GNU..."Instead of breaking the bars and burning down the jail, they implemented their own mockup jail in the image of their former captors" | Jun 20 01:28 |
| DaemonXP | free software made Microsoft possible | Jun 20 01:29 |
| DaemonXP | because Linux and 386BSD destroyed USL which was the only thing that could have stopped Microsoft | Jun 20 01:29 |
| DaemonXP | they didn't end proprietary software, thanks to them it's even worse now than it used to be | Jun 20 01:30 |
| *pepper (i=638723b5@gateway/web/freenode/x-16d90b5b896d11b3) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 01:31 | |
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| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : r u still here? | Jun 20 01:33 |
| schestowitz | Yes, what's up? | Jun 20 01:33 |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: who's that? | Jun 20 01:33 |
| schestowitz | Not Irving, right? | Jun 20 01:34 |
| schestowitz | The USPTO guy is no friend | Jun 20 01:34 |
| schestowitz | The candidate | Jun 20 01:34 |
| schestowitz | None of them are | Jun 20 01:34 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I think that u better kick out some elements from this channel | Jun 20 01:36 |
| _Hicham_ | to keep it clean | Jun 20 01:36 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!*n=none@*.hsd1.in.comcast.net | Jun 20 01:36 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked DaemonXP from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 01:36 | |
| _Hicham_ | thanks schestowitz | Jun 20 01:37 |
| schestowitz | He was warned before | Jun 20 01:37 |
| _Hicham_ | let him calm down | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | Kicked twice today, warned that the third time it would be a ban | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | Yes | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | I'll remove that a while later | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | The first day he showed here he was foaming off the mouth | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | Drove people nuts | Jun 20 01:38 |
| _Hicham_ | he is just a crazy person | Jun 20 01:38 |
| schestowitz | Canadian Politicians Want To Pass Internet Snooping Legislation < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090619/1338065294.shtml > | Jun 20 01:39 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: lonely one | Jun 20 01:39 |
| ugufjhfj | David Kappos, a VP and general counsel at IBM | Jun 20 01:39 |
| *DaemonXP (n=DaemonXP@c-67-173-86-85.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 01:39 | |
| schestowitz | Provoking for attention | Jun 20 01:39 |
| DaemonXP | what the hell was that for? | Jun 20 01:39 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!n=DaemonXP@*.hsd1.in.comcast.net | Jun 20 01:39 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked DaemonXP from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 01:39 | |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: he's no friend of FOSS, AFAIK | Jun 20 01:40 |
| _Hicham_ | yes, he wants some attention | Jun 20 01:40 |
| _Hicham_ | that is very true | Jun 20 01:40 |
| schestowitz | See http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/05/what-bilski-means-to-ibm-ms/ | Jun 20 01:40 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/11/ibm-and-software-patents/ | Jun 20 01:40 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I mailed the package to the original mononono creator | Jun 20 01:40 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/05/tomtom-settlement-with-microsoft/ | Jun 20 01:40 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2008/11/01/patent-problems-overview/ | Jun 20 01:40 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2008/06/27/uspto-braindead-examples/ | Jun 20 01:41 |
| ugufjhfj | http://www.uspto.gov/main/homepagenews/2009jun19.htm | Jun 20 01:41 |
| schestowitz | Kappos is in all those posts | Jun 20 01:41 |
| schestowitz | I feel bad for ryan | Jun 20 01:41 |
| schestowitz | Now he'll play with the cat, not with irc | Jun 20 01:41 |
| schestowitz | Maybe drive his cat nuts | Jun 20 01:41 |
| schestowitz | Talking about compressions and all | Jun 20 01:42 |
| schestowitz | The cat will jump out the window | Jun 20 01:42 |
| ugufjhfj | Specifically, Kappos manages IBM’s patent and trademark portfolios – protecting and licensing intellectual property worldwide. | Jun 20 01:42 |
| ugufjhfj | that sound no good... | Jun 20 01:43 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I feel bad for him too | Jun 20 01:43 |
| _Hicham_ | better let him calm down | Jun 20 01:43 |
| _Hicham_ | until he got back to usual | Jun 20 01:43 |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: of course not | Jun 20 01:45 |
| schestowitz | But I see it's only nomination | Jun 20 01:46 |
| schestowitz | So that's no news | Jun 20 01:46 |
| schestowitz | Has he actually been chosen? | Jun 20 01:46 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: *ping* | Jun 20 01:46 |
| schestowitz | The Constitutional Problems With The Award In The Jammie Thomas Case < http://techdirt.com/articles/20090618/1950315285.shtml > | Jun 20 01:46 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[astralknight] Microsoft's greed is speeding up its demise: http://digg.com/d1uKrP?t | Jun 20 01:52 | |
| ugufjhfj | Windows 7 released the same month than Ubuntu Karmic :) | Jun 20 02:00 |
| schestowitz | Yes | Jun 20 02:04 |
| schestowitz | But it's the financial results that had them time it like that | Jun 20 02:04 |
| schestowitz | Last time they did the same | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | Earnings down 32% the day after 9.04 was released | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | They want Vista7 to overshadow the horrible news of the results | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | it'll be ugly this July | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | Then again in October | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | ANyway, good night | Jun 20 02:05 |
| schestowitz | 2am here | Jun 20 02:05 |
| ugufjhfj | good night | Jun 20 02:07 |
| ugufjhfj | 21:33 here :P | Jun 20 02:07 |
| _Hicham_ | gn schestowitz | Jun 20 02:09 |
| ugufjhfj | Baldmer this funny guy | Jun 20 02:09 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[astralknight] Linux on Netbooks: The Smoking Gun: http://digg.com/d1uL3j?t | Jun 20 03:02 | |
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| http://www.crn.com/security/218100385;jsessionid=BIWD1I5GZJRSGQSNDLOSKH0CJUNN2JVN | Jun 20 04:33 | |
| turn over all your user nyms and passwords! | Jun 20 04:33 | |
| ha | Jun 20 04:33 | |
| too cheap to buy the data like "reputable" big companies do. | Jun 20 04:34 | |
| shoulda, coulda, woulda. Ballmer BS's a friendly crowd http://www.businessweek.com/innovate/next/archives/2009/06/microsoft_ceo_b.html | Jun 20 04:44 | |
| neighborlee | twitter, was really good to see on fedora forum , at least from seeming two people , one of which is community manager, that indeed mono will be gone from fedora 12.. | Jun 20 04:46 |
| Ballmer, "I don't think we're in a recession. I think we're resetting the economy. This is the new normal." Yeah! Firing thousands of your employees in a 10% unemployment market. | Jun 20 04:47 | |
| That is good news, neighborlee. | Jun 20 04:47 | |
| neighborlee | sure is | Jun 20 04:47 |
| Ballmer "We've got our mojo going now. We're rolling. We're the little engine that could." | Jun 20 04:47 | |
| little? | Jun 20 04:47 | |
| could what? | Jun 20 04:48 | |
| neighborlee | LOL | Jun 20 04:48 |
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| "Anyone hoping to monetize software directly is at risk." - Good, selling binaries was a stupid thing to begin with. http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10268180-16.html | Jun 20 04:55 | |
| Good riddance. | Jun 20 04:55 | |
| Welcome to GNU Mexico. http://dthomasdigital.wordpress.com/2009/06/16/ill-be-calling-it-gnulinux-for-now-on/ | Jun 20 04:58 | |
| It's not where Miguel is from. | Jun 20 05:01 | |
| GL has a bust http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090619161307529 | Jun 20 05:08 | |
| we all knew it but it's nice to have such a direct accusation from an industry leader. | Jun 20 05:10 | |
| The funny thing is that M$ is not providing them sales. | Jun 20 05:10 | |
| Amazon brings parts of the Kindle to GPL compliance? http://www.fsdaily.com/EndUser/No_Amazon_did_not_release_all_of_the_Swindles_source_code | Jun 20 05:13 | |
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| ziggyfish | nice | Jun 20 05:30 |
| *amarsh04 can't reach www.groklaw.net or ibiblio.org at the moment /-: | Jun 20 05:40 | |
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| fewa | amarsh04, same | Jun 20 06:04 |
| amarsh04 | back up now | Jun 20 06:19 |
| fewa | geeze crappy sites with infinite loop js | Jun 20 06:34 |
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| fewa | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GN0T9K64HJI QUALCOMMVlog - Smartbook Introduction (snapdragon) | Jun 20 07:17 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Novell says no plans to sell itself http://ping.fm/BOyZL | Jun 20 08:47 | |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Red Hat unit expects 100% revenue jump for fiscal 2010 http://bit.ly/18Z1OL *_revenue_jump_for_fiscal_2010 | Jun 20 08:52 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "KDE4 is *NOT* a progressive improvement on a previous version. It's a COMPLETE REWRITE. " http://ping.fm/gQqbG | Jun 20 08:57 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[tacone] #canonical solved the issue with !ubuntu Satanic Edition the right way. Digg ! http://tinyurl.com/lg2afq | Jun 20 09:07 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[tacone] http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssTechMediaTelecomNews/idUSN1946639920090619 #Novell won't sell. Really. | Jun 20 09:12 | |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Success Stories of Gradual Move to GNU/Linux in Academis, Commerce http://ping.fm/wCYxy http://ping.fm/hdU6T | Jun 20 09:37 | |
| schestowitz | "thanks! again! it's like a ritual now when installing a new ubuntu - install - set it up the way i like it - google "opensourcerer remove mono 9.04" - feel better." http://www.theopensourcerer.com/2009/04/23/how-to-remove-mono-from-ubuntu-904-jaunty-jackalope/#comments | Jun 20 09:39 |
| *maxstirner (n=user@xdsl-87-78-71-176.netcologne.de) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 09:41 | |
| schestowitz | Mountain bike site 'compromised' http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/highlands_and_islands/8109806.stm | Jun 20 09:43 |
| maxstirner | http://www.gnu.org/fry/ <- stephen fry the thinker | Jun 20 09:43 |
| schestowitz | Probably not newsworthy. | Jun 20 09:43 |
| schestowitz | Oh | Jun 20 09:43 |
| schestowitz | I meant the bike site | Jun 20 09:43 |
| maxstirner | http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2009/jun/19/stephen-fry-iphone-3gs-review <- stephen fry the ipod fanboy | Jun 20 09:44 |
| schestowitz | Sites get compromise a lot | Jun 20 09:44 |
| schestowitz | maxstirner: yes, he moved to twitter | Jun 20 09:44 |
| maxstirner | its an injected redirect of sorts? | Jun 20 09:44 |
| schestowitz | Hardly blogs anymore | Jun 20 09:44 |
| schestowitz | He uses some Linux in the house. | Jun 20 09:44 |
| maxstirner | i think he's a charmer, i really enjoyed his tv series about manic depression | Jun 20 09:44 |
| schestowitz | macabe: Novell is in serious trouble | Jun 20 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Debt and all | Jun 20 09:45 |
| maxstirner | he was just winding me up with his ipod 3XGPS++ review on the guardian there ;) | Jun 20 09:45 |
| schestowitz | I suppose you saw the smears in BN... also from the Mono crowd which lies to try and damage our name. | Jun 20 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Watch out for what Novell does not | Jun 20 09:45 |
| schestowitz | http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssTechMediaTelecomNews/idUSN1946639920090619 | Jun 20 09:46 |
| schestowitz | Yesterday we banned daemonfc | Jun 20 09:46 |
| maxstirner | Novell says no plans to sell itself | Jun 20 09:46 |
| maxstirner | :D | Jun 20 09:46 |
| schestowitz | We have too many provocatuer around here | Jun 20 09:46 |
| maxstirner | funny | Jun 20 09:46 |
| schestowitz | And they try to ruin us | Jun 20 09:46 |
| maxstirner | you banned him? | Jun 20 09:46 |
| maxstirner | are the logs out yet? | Jun 20 09:46 |
| schestowitz | _Mutex_ is gone too, fortunately | Jun 20 09:46 |
| schestowitz | maxstirner: I'll put them out now | Jun 20 09:47 |
| schestowitz | Hold ob | Jun 20 09:47 |
| maxstirner | ok | Jun 20 09:47 |
| schestowitz | *on | Jun 20 09:47 |
| maxstirner | "As a Windows developer (former, now, thank God!), we totally avoided the registry. It made our application so much more portable... you could drag our folder from one computer to another, without re-installing, and walla, it would run JUST FINE." | Jun 20 09:47 |
| schestowitz | Weird... | Jun 20 09:53 |
| schestowitz | My bash_history got emptied | Jun 20 09:53 |
| schestowitz | No idea why | Jun 20 09:53 |
| schestowitz | Maybe I deleted it by accident last night | Jun 20 09:54 |
| maxstirner | i've had that before.. | Jun 20 09:54 |
| maxstirner | eery ;) | Jun 20 09:54 |
| schestowitz | Maybe it flushes? | Jun 20 09:54 |
| maxstirner | that's what i thought | Jun 20 09:54 |
| maxstirner | bit of research i guess | Jun 20 09:54 |
| schestowitz | I have too many commands I rely on for being in bash history | Jun 20 09:54 |
| schestowitz | I never write them down aside... big mistake | Jun 20 09:55 |
| maxstirner | yes exactly, ctrl-R all the way | Jun 20 09:55 |
| schestowitz | My backups are all compressed | Jun 20 09:55 |
| schestowitz | Not worth pulling it from a backup | Jun 20 09:55 |
| maxstirner | good idea though | Jun 20 09:55 |
| maxstirner | if you know what hte file is you could just go in there | Jun 20 09:55 |
| schestowitz | Here are the logs: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/irc-log-19062009/ | Jun 20 09:56 |
| maxstirner | thanks | Jun 20 09:57 |
| schestowitz | I hadn't noticed until yesterday that my logs wrongly said "May" | Jun 20 09:57 |
| maxstirner | where was the error? irc server date? | Jun 20 09:57 |
| schestowitz | Which error? | Jun 20 09:58 |
| maxstirner | with the dates on teh logs | Jun 20 09:58 |
| schestowitz | mibbit is down and out now | Jun 20 09:58 |
| maxstirner | "This latest version of Microsoft's browser leapfrogs its closest competition..." Gralla, Computer World | Jun 20 09:58 |
| schestowitz | Freenode got tired of it | Jun 20 09:58 |
| maxstirner | this great :D | Jun 20 09:58 |
| schestowitz | Gralla is a Microsoft shill | Jun 20 09:59 |
| schestowitz | Ignore him | Jun 20 09:59 |
| schestowitz | He's very blatant about it too | Jun 20 09:59 |
| maxstirner | i would assume so | Jun 20 09:59 |
| maxstirner | IE is dead imagewise | Jun 20 09:59 |
| maxstirner | noone in their right mind would write that sort of thing | Jun 20 10:00 |
| maxstirner | schestowitz: so daemon was just flooding the channel with his nonsense? | Jun 20 10:02 |
| maxstirner | when did you ban them? | Jun 20 10:03 |
| schestowitz | People told me to | Jun 20 10:05 |
| schestowitz | Even those who fed him | Jun 20 10:05 |
| maxstirner | I do feel your non-censored site stance is vital, but if you see the irc channel as a working tool & they're just stealing your time all day | Jun 20 10:06 |
| maxstirner | ,,, | Jun 20 10:06 |
| tacone | ah, the good old "daemon stop trolling" | Jun 20 10:08 |
| tacone | many times it was just a non-sense accusation. | Jun 20 10:08 |
| schestowitz | I'm not quite following.. | Jun 20 10:09 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Amarok 2.2 Already on Its Way http://ping.fm/K9Bfe | Jun 20 10:12 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Demonstration of the Power of Themes in GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/RWLoZ | Jun 20 10:17 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Exploration of Distributions of GNU/Linux Other Than Ubuntu http://ping.fm/B6V5a http://ping.fm/V0Gz0 | Jun 20 10:22 | |
| *Omar871 (n=omar@79.173.248.11.go.com.jo) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 10:22 | |
| schestowitz | Hey, Omar871, can you vote for this? http://www.fsdaily.com/Opposition/Reader_s_Article_What_Makes_Microsoft_s_Business_Unethical | Jun 20 10:23 |
| Omar871 | Hi Roy. | Jun 20 10:23 |
| schestowitz | It's a good article on Microsoft's behaviour | Jun 20 10:23 |
| Omar871 | Sure! :D | Jun 20 10:24 |
| schestowitz | Did you find another python host? | Jun 20 10:24 |
| schestowitz | I thought about spreading that post, but it's not very Linux-related | Jun 20 10:24 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] [News] PCLinuxOS with Xfce is Coming http://ping.fm/WNfBh | Jun 20 10:27 | |
| *tacone has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Jun 20 10:29 | |
| maxstirner | does yahoo mail really not work on firefox/linux or is it just me? | Jun 20 10:36 |
| schestowitz | I've not used it since 2001 | Jun 20 10:36 |
| schestowitz | When they dropped POP3 | Jun 20 10:36 |
| schestowitz | [Unless you pay] | Jun 20 10:37 |
| maxstirner | it just doesnt display anything for me | Jun 20 10:37 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] GNU/Linux Has the Advantage of the Crowds http://ping.fm/zGJON | Jun 20 10:37 | |
| schestowitz | maxstirner: JS? | Jun 20 10:39 |
| schestowitz | Iceweasel? | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Try masking | Jun 20 10:40 |
| maxstirner | swiftfox | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | that would be it | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | I heard about 'unfamiliar' browsers being mistreated at Yahoo! | Jun 20 10:40 |
| maxstirner | change browser string on browser? | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Yahoo mail won't do Iceweasel | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Cause of HTTP headers | Jun 20 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Ye | Jun 20 10:41 |
| schestowitz | Yeah | Jun 20 10:41 |
| maxstirner | actually :D i've just disabled adblock et voilà ;) | Jun 20 10:41 |
| maxstirner | thanks for the input anyhow | Jun 20 10:41 |
| schestowitz | Someone said it here in IRC | Jun 20 10:41 |
| maxstirner | user agent Firefox/3.0.4pre (Swiftfox) | Jun 20 10:41 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Palm Pre Source Code for Linux Components is Released http://ping.fm/iqNjG | Jun 20 10:42 | |
| schestowitz | maxstirner: Cartle Bartz don't like !! | Jun 20 10:43 |
| schestowitz | You need to use Ballmie's browser | Jun 20 10:44 |
| schestowitz | And maybe find the treasure | Jun 20 10:44 |
| schestowitz | Be conformist | Jun 20 10:44 |
| maxstirner | :D | Jun 20 10:44 |
| schestowitz | use activeX | Jun 20 10:44 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Advice for Advocacy of Free Software http://ping.fm/Kccll | Jun 20 10:52 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Firefox 3.5 Now in Release Candidate 2, New Icon Finalised http://ping.fm/RZB5S http://ping.fm/seC4u | Jun 20 10:52 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Examples of Business Success with Free Software http://ping.fm/xfNkW | Jun 20 10:52 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] PostgreSQL 8.4 Now in Release Candidate Phase http://ping.fm/Yn9B2 | Jun 20 10:52 | |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] SFLC Released New Audiocast About the Jacobsen v. Katzer Case http://ping.fm/Fd3b7 | Jun 20 10:57 | |
| kentma | mornin' all | Jun 20 11:01 |
| gnutz | Good morning | Jun 20 11:02 |
| kentma | gnutz - great nym :-) | Jun 20 11:02 |
| gnutz | Thanks | Jun 20 11:02 |
| schestowitz | Heh. | Jun 20 11:02 |
| schestowitz | Didn't notice | Jun 20 11:03 |
| trmanco | lol | Jun 20 11:03 |
| schestowitz | kentma: daemon is out | Jun 20 11:03 |
| trmanco | daemon? | Jun 20 11:03 |
| schestowitz | XP/MDV/FC | Jun 20 11:03 |
| kentma | schestowitz: I spotted the absence. banned? | Jun 20 11:03 |
| schestowitz | He got warned | Jun 20 11:03 |
| schestowitz | kicked 3 times, didn't change behaviour | Jun 20 11:03 |
| kentma | I saw the warnings. | Jun 20 11:03 |
| kentma | a familiar pattern, sadly. | Jun 20 11:03 |
| kentma | things must be very tough in Redmond-land now, so I imagine most of the lower-end troops are very edgy, nervous and stressed - we can expect to see this spill over into their shilling activities, I think. | Jun 20 11:04 |
| kentma | wow -just seen the Archos 10 Ubuntu - amazing. | Jun 20 11:05 |
| gnutz | Yep...the MSFT news lately has been nothing short of ridiculous. | Jun 20 11:06 |
| schestowitz | kentma: yes, lots of attacks on us recently | Jun 20 11:06 |
| schestowitz | They put inflammatory stuff out there 'on our behalf' | Jun 20 11:06 |
| schestowitz | I now understand why PJ ignores so many E-mails from strangers | Jun 20 11:07 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft has a smear against her too | Jun 20 11:07 |
| kentma | schestowitz: you, me, we, others will get the blame for MS's problems. It's always difficult for people to look into the mirror to see their problems. | Jun 20 11:07 |
| schestowitz | Even DIRECTLY from Microsoft employees sometimes | Jun 20 11:07 |
| schestowitz | gnutz: wait for more | Jun 20 11:07 |
| schestowitz | I have good posts | Jun 20 11:07 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] MAFIAA Resorts to Blackmail http://ping.fm/Q8u9b | Jun 20 11:07 | |
| schestowitz | Someone also mailed me details about hired shills | Jun 20 11:07 |
| kentma | Someone ran a campaign against me about 2-3 years ago - it was really nasty, but I kept completely quiet about it and it finally subsided. | Jun 20 11:08 |
| schestowitz | It's all become too obvious because they become slack and sloppy | Jun 20 11:08 |
| schestowitz | kentma: Net based? | Jun 20 11:08 |
| schestowitz | Of whisper campaign? | Jun 20 11:08 |
| schestowitz | Like the whole 'penis genre' against generals and leaders? | Jun 20 11:08 |
| kentma | schestowitz: very much, yes. It was a mix, emails, subscriptions to all manner of sh*t, postings, emails into work areas and so on, mailing lists, you name it, it was there. | Jun 20 11:09 |
| kentma | If you recall I was "outed" around then, although it has to be said, I never tried to hide my identity, so that was a bit of a flop. | Jun 20 11:09 |
| fewa | PJ? | Jun 20 11:09 |
| *ThistleWeb (n=gordon@87.113.136.180) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 11:10 | |
| schestowitz | kentma: a friend of mine has something similar happening | Jun 20 11:10 |
| schestowitz | Some crazy stalker in her 60s is behind it | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | E-mail threats and stuff | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | Very ugly | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | he came to me for advice cause he knows I got the same type of abuse | Jun 20 11:11 |
| kentma | it's really unpleasant, to be honest, but there isn't a great deal you can do about it. | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | Yes | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | I am smeared by the Mono people now | Jun 20 11:11 |
| schestowitz | False accusations | Jun 20 11:11 |
| kentma | There is a pretty fundamental point on freedom versus policing here. | Jun 20 11:11 |
| ThistleWeb | who'd have thought a free bus pass could be a danger to someone's health? | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | They are determined to shoot the messenger | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | Nothing else worked | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | Mono is in trouble | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | Miguel sort of admits this | Jun 20 11:12 |
| kentma | Sadly, the people who abuse freedom are usually doing so for personal, financial, gain. | Jun 20 11:12 |
| fewa | Its a last ditch effort at a old tactic | Jun 20 11:12 |
| kentma | Mono is an abomination. | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | We're the best known place for criticism of Mono, so they want to steal its legitimacy | Jun 20 11:12 |
| kentma | It should never have happened. | Jun 20 11:12 |
| schestowitz | Sadly for them, it has the opposite effect | Jun 20 11:13 |
| schestowitz | Many people realise they try to hide something | Jun 20 11:13 |
| schestowitz | So it only attracts them to studying of this debate | Jun 20 11:13 |
| kentma | It doesn't take a great deal of effort to identify what's going on in Mono. | Jun 20 11:13 |
| schestowitz | The whole Mono thing totally spilled over 15 weeks ago | Jun 20 11:13 |
| gnutz | It's like the distro vendors are either ignoring potential complications arising from Mono, or they're purposely trying to start a patent war. | Jun 20 11:13 |
| schestowitz | 1.5 | Jun 20 11:13 |
| kentma | It was a thinly disguised "Q" ship sailing into the Gnu seas. | Jun 20 11:13 |
| schestowitz | kentma: just watch how the pro-MS folks promote Mono | Jun 20 11:14 |
| schestowitz | if that's not revealing, what is? | Jun 20 11:14 |
| schestowitz | It's not just patent | Jun 20 11:14 |
| kentma | I agree... anything the shills promote loudly is almost certainly bad for freedom. | Jun 20 11:14 |
| fewa | a patent war could be a mixed bad | Jun 20 11:14 |
| schestowitz | It's API dominmation | Jun 20 11:14 |
| fewa | *bag | Jun 20 11:14 |
| ThistleWeb | I wonder if the end result of the mono / linux debate will be that a few distros who have it will be the minor ones with a handfull of users, where all the large user base ones will shun it | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | The trolls can be helpful | Jun 20 11:15 |
| kentma | Software patents are still not legit here, though, in spite of everything tried. The real battle is to ensure that this situation remains. | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | They tell you hot|cold | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Take Novell for exampler | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Waltham IPs attacked me | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Cause I get too warm | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Novell is in huge debt | Jun 20 11:15 |
| fewa | they are not neccicarily trolls when they are gett $$ | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Analysts has JUST said they might sell the business | Jun 20 11:15 |
| ThistleWeb | all the distros linux peeps use and recomend for others will be those who have refused mono | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | And they negotiate selling parts of it already | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | Novell is dying | Jun 20 11:15 |
| kentma | schestowitz: agreed... when you get close, then the screams begin, like when we were commenting on MS's extremely poor financial state a few months back in Cola - the screams were *really* loud - very warm! | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | And BN is showing some pretexts | Jun 20 11:15 |
| schestowitz | kentma: yes | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | And I was right | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | MS borrows money now | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | And nobody apologised to me | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | Same with gates Foundry | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | The trolls give up | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | When you show them the scams | Jun 20 11:16 |
| schestowitz | And now, thanks to BN, it's more of a common knowledge in Linux companies | Jun 20 11:16 |
| kentma | As the fog clears, the it becomes impossible to to pretend that your or their vision is clouded - the truth becomes too visible for even the most Funkenbuschy of the trolls. | Jun 20 11:17 |
| kentma | If Novell had taken on Red Hat as a distributor offering support, particularly with their remaining Netware customer base, they'd probably have been fine now. | Jun 20 11:18 |
| schestowitz | Well.. wait. | Jun 20 11:18 |
| schestowitz | But.. | Jun 20 11:18 |
| schestowitz | "Idiots can be defeated but they never admit it." --Richard Stallman | Jun 20 11:18 |
| schestowitz | Omar871 quoted this recently | Jun 20 11:18 |
| schestowitz | IOW, silence means you win the debate | Jun 20 11:18 |
| kentma | But, they, like Sco, found the promise of MS money (via the vouchers) to tempting. Unfortunately, anything which looks "too good to be true" usually is. Including Microsoft vouchers for SuSE. | Jun 20 11:19 |
| fewa | only if you yourself are truly right | Jun 20 11:19 |
| gnutz | First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. | Jun 20 11:19 |
| ThistleWeb | some peeps argue their case from a premade angle, their mission is to convince others, not listen to the issues | Jun 20 11:19 |
| kentma | schestowitz: some Idiots, though, just never realise facts... try explaining basic transport networking to packet networking people - they, mostly, have never learnt, or at least never understood, Shannon. Debate is a total waste of time... | Jun 20 11:20 |
| fewa | thats called envangilization | Jun 20 11:20 |
| ThistleWeb | peeps who seek a solution will listen to the issues and be willing to change their perceptions if something new is opened to them | Jun 20 11:20 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: agreed, but most people actually have quite different agenda | Jun 20 11:20 |
| fewa | their own personal best interest | Jun 20 11:20 |
| ThistleWeb | what I used to do with peeps who'd come into our yahoo room and start a fight was to simply ignore them, rather than respond | Jun 20 11:21 |
| ThistleWeb | any response at all means they win, they seek arguments | Jun 20 11:21 |
| schestowitz | fewa: I have an exposition of MS twitter "envangilization" | Jun 20 11:21 |
| schestowitz | Someone mailed me | Jun 20 11:21 |
| schestowitz | I'll post it in a few hours | Jun 20 11:21 |
| schestowitz | The "envangilization" got aggressive | Jun 20 11:22 |
| schestowitz | They now attack FOSS companies | Jun 20 11:22 |
| schestowitz | Like the one I heard from | Jun 20 11:22 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: providing a platform for shills and trolls is usually a bad idea. The best thing to do is almost invariably to avoid them, ignore them, and merely present facts. | Jun 20 11:22 |
| ThistleWeb | they expect you to feel insulted and feel the need to defend yourself, which kinda backfires when you simply ignore them, let them scream, shout, insult and threaten all they like | Jun 20 11:22 |
| fewa | *evangelization | Jun 20 11:22 |
| kentma | if you respond to them, it gives them legitimacy, and an opportunity to keep spouting their malicious vitriol.# | Jun 20 11:22 |
| fewa | If you are right there is no reason to defend yourself to accusations | Jun 20 11:23 |
| ThistleWeb | kentma: exactly | Jun 20 11:23 |
| ThistleWeb | that was always my position, ignore them | Jun 20 11:23 |
| kentma | fewa: indeed! | Jun 20 11:23 |
| fewa | you would only respond if you doubted your own views | Jun 20 11:23 |
| ThistleWeb | peeps can be mistaken, they can be misled, they can seek debate and conversation | Jun 20 11:23 |
| fewa | unles they themselves proove that they truly believe you are wrong, and they they give in to actually listening | Jun 20 11:23 |
| kentma | fewa: perhaps, but there is another angle here, which is a human nature thing - almost a need to be socially accepted in a group. | Jun 20 11:23 |
| fewa | you have to wait till they actually want to hear what you will say | Jun 20 11:24 |
| kentma | fewa: so, if there is something about which you are 100% certain, and you feel it's very important, but some else disagrees, the natural tendency is to state your case in order to "share" your reasonable and sensible viewpoint. | Jun 20 11:24 |
| fewa | kentma, very true | Jun 20 11:24 |
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| fewa | but you have to know they have a serious opinion first | Jun 20 11:25 |
| fewa | you can call their emotional bluff | Jun 20 11:25 |
| fewa | of course this is harder/differnt over the internet | Jun 20 11:25 |
| ThistleWeb | I usually point out that someones first statement is so judgemental, that they are so closed minded that the claim that they come for debate or conversation is a blatant lie | Jun 20 11:25 |
| kentma | fewa: I completely agree with you, but I'm considering how their approach works, noting that usually it's quite effective - most people get drawn into these things, and one has to learn to avoid that - it's not a natural response, at least, not for me, anyway. | Jun 20 11:25 |
| ThistleWeb | everyone has emotional buttons | Jun 20 11:26 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: quite - but that's something you presumably had to learn to do? | Jun 20 11:26 |
| fewa | kentma, its harder to alianate someone in a virtual context, as you already feel exposed | Jun 20 11:26 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: my mother knows all of mine... | Jun 20 11:26 |
| kentma | fewa: sorry, I didn't grasp that point? | Jun 20 11:27 |
| ThistleWeb | some know their buttons and (mostly) have the self control to know they are being pushed. A lot of the time I can sense that, but sometimes I can't, I'm only human | Jun 20 11:27 |
| ThistleWeb | some like pushing others buttons | Jun 20 11:27 |
| ThistleWeb | I don't think its a very good way of discussing a subject personally | Jun 20 11:27 |
| fewa | I just think it takes some getting use to to notice if someone on the internet is serious or not, as a new platform the naive assumption is to take everyone at face value | Jun 20 11:27 |
| fewa | and then learn by experience | Jun 20 11:27 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: age is great for this. I'm now in my mid 40s, and far more difficult to provoke than I was as young, angry, arrogant, self-confident intellectual usually right man :-) | Jun 20 11:27 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: it depends on the agenda. Most debating tactics are emotional rather than rational. | Jun 20 11:28 |
| ThistleWeb | kentma: yeah it does take maturity to stand back and say "well, if that's what you think, so be it" and step away from the debate | Jun 20 11:28 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: indeed :-) | Jun 20 11:28 |
| fewa | its also takes self-confidence | Jun 20 11:29 |
| ThistleWeb | try not to respond with the same tactics | Jun 20 11:29 |
| fewa | in knowing that you are right | Jun 20 11:29 |
| ThistleWeb | if everyone did that in here, we'd all be calling everyone else a troll | Jun 20 11:29 |
| kentma | I'm still arrogant and self-confident, but not so angry and can often hide the arrogance hehe ... | Jun 20 11:29 |
| ThistleWeb | the internet is a learning experience, gradually you learn that people are people, and can all do their own thing, many of whom will have their internet hard-ass persona | Jun 20 11:30 |
| ThistleWeb | many will try to weave a web of lies to mess with peeps | Jun 20 11:30 |
| ThistleWeb | believing they are anonymous and it's only a laugh | Jun 20 11:31 |
| kentma | Yeah... I've been on the net since the pre-web days, it's been a fascinating few decades hehe... | Jun 20 11:31 |
| ThistleWeb | the more people online, the more of each persuasion there are | Jun 20 11:31 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: the number of people I've seen "exposed" has been amazing - which is why I never tried to hide my identity. | Jun 20 11:31 |
| fewa | not neccicarily | Jun 20 11:32 |
| fewa | when something becomes mainstream a civility creaps in..... | Jun 20 11:32 |
| ThistleWeb | the bigger the city, the higher number of rapes / murders etc | Jun 20 11:32 |
| fewa | and brings with it fears, censorship, government, etc | Jun 20 11:32 |
| ThistleWeb | same percentage, just more total peeps = more victims / perpetrators | Jun 20 11:32 |
| kentma | ThistleWeb: cities provide an environment which will effectively screen anti-social behaviour which small communities will not tolerate. | Jun 20 11:33 |
| fewa | kentma, excellent observation | Jun 20 11:33 |
| kentma | fewa: thanks :-) | Jun 20 11:33 |
| ThistleWeb | kentma: it can be, it's just not being done yet, at OSP level | Jun 20 11:33 |
| schestowitz | kentma: did you see Tony? | Jun 20 11:33 |
| ThistleWeb | ISP | Jun 20 11:33 |
| schestowitz | They not abuse a semi-blinded man | Jun 20 11:33 |
| ThistleWeb | which is a very slippery slope | Jun 20 11:34 |
| fewa | introverts are more productive in cities, but more at risk | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | For 'daring' to install Linux for people | Jun 20 11:34 |
| kentma | schestowitz: Tony? | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | Death threats, exposing who he is | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | Tony(UK) | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | So polite | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | And they attack him, too | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | "7" as well | Jun 20 11:34 |
| kentma | oh, nasty nasty. | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | Bullying | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | I see it outside COLA too | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | There are testimonies too | Jun 20 11:34 |
| kentma | They spread their sh1t everywhere. | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | Like Bray and his wife | Jun 20 11:34 |
| schestowitz | This is a company run by or assisted by thugs | Jun 20 11:34 |
| kentma | It's a terrible tactic, and I genuinely believe the perpetrators ought to be in jail for what they are doing. | Jun 20 11:35 |
| kentma | But, in pushing in that direction, we deliver to MS what they want - a controlled and policed internet. | Jun 20 11:35 |
| kentma | So, MS deliberately abuse the net in order to force policing in order to improve their business prospects. | Jun 20 11:36 |
| kentma | In fact, I don't think I'd ever realised that quite so lucidly before. There's an article in there for BN, I suspect! | Jun 20 11:36 |
| kentma | anyway, no2 son has just returned from France, so I must go to say hello and all that. | Jun 20 11:37 |
| *ThistleWeb has gone for groceries, back later | Jun 20 11:38 | |
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| schestowitz | Financial Crisis Revisited- The Astroturf < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gACEVoqT7cY > | Jun 20 11:39 |
| schestowitz | kentma: the police won't step up | Jun 20 11:39 |
| schestowitz | They are too busy with shoplifters and stuff | Jun 20 11:39 |
| schestowitz | They would not help me when DDOS attacks were persistent against us | Jun 20 11:40 |
| schestowitz | kentma: an article on what? | Jun 20 11:40 |
| schestowitz | This is an ongoing issue I cover there a lot. So there's no news here. | Jun 20 11:40 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] This is funny: http://ping.fm/Ag8lB (The Financial Crisis Explained) | Jun 20 11:47 | |
| maxstirner | that IS funny :D | Jun 20 12:05 |
| schestowitz | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QG5ag1BmB1A&feature=related | Jun 20 12:06 |
| schestowitz | maxstirner: it turns something sad to humour | Jun 20 12:06 |
| maxstirner | satire is good for spiritual health ;) | Jun 20 12:07 |
| schestowitz | I can't helping thinking of companies like Novlel | Jun 20 12:07 |
| schestowitz | Remember Hovsepian's bonus? | Jun 20 12:07 |
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| schestowitz | $6 million for 2008 | Jun 20 12:07 |
| maxstirner | nope | Jun 20 12:07 |
| schestowitz | And the company drowns | Jun 20 12:07 |
| maxstirner | really | Jun 20 12:07 |
| schestowitz | Like 100 germany SUSE devs fired | Jun 20 12:07 |
| schestowitz | So that Ronnie can get his millions in bonuses before the company drowns or gets sold by pieces | Jun 20 12:07 |
| maxstirner | i see.. not following the details.. typical for managerial class takeover of public limited companies | Jun 20 12:08 |
| schestowitz | Yanks say "foreclosures" consistenyly, not repossession | Jun 20 12:08 |
| schestowitz | What amuses me is how they make nightmare scenarios sound decent | Jun 20 12:08 |
| schestowitz | repossession | Jun 20 12:08 |
| schestowitz | To whom????? | Jun 20 12:08 |
| maxstirner | shareholder value not all that special, but thats what you get if you want to own the means of production and not bother with management | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Meltdows->Bailout->Stimulus | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | It's all in the use of words | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Debt->Credit->money | Jun 20 12:09 |
| maxstirner | the PR wording has been super, the (US-)americans have been doing some fantastic orwellian work | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Yeah | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | I got some E-mails about it last night | Jun 20 12:09 |
| maxstirner | warfare terminology has been great as well | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Appalling | Jun 20 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Which warfare? | Jun 20 12:10 |
| schestowitz | I can't think of examples | Jun 20 12:10 |
| schestowitz | Smart bombs? | Jun 20 12:10 |
| maxstirner | iraq/afghanistan/operation freedom operation crusade | Jun 20 12:10 |
| maxstirner | all that yes | Jun 20 12:10 |
| maxstirner | sometimes its just plain dumb or funny | Jun 20 12:10 |
| schestowitz | Kill many people=smart | Jun 20 12:10 |
| schestowitz | Suspect->combatant | Jun 20 12:10 |
| maxstirner | the financial crisis is full of great examples as you rightly say | Jun 20 12:11 |
| fewa | despite what people might convince themselves the government does not have the people in their interest | Jun 20 12:11 |
| fewa | they will only work for you if you make it in their interest | Jun 20 12:11 |
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| fewa | http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=afYsmJyngAXQ&refer=home http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601068&sid=a.GJvNfWtCX0&refer=economy | Jun 20 12:12 |
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| schestowitz | fewa: he hates patents too | Jun 20 12:13 |
| maxstirner | cash for trash :D | Jun 20 12:13 |
| schestowitz | He's gonna work nearby now | Jun 20 12:13 |
| fewa | hes a economist i have trust in | Jun 20 12:13 |
| schestowitz | He slammed patents | Jun 20 12:13 |
| fewa | won his nobel for debunking the myth of free markets | Jun 20 12:13 |
| schestowitz | They'd hate him in the intellectual monopolies cartel | Jun 20 12:13 |
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| fewa | Information asymmetry | Jun 20 12:15 |
| fewa | lol @ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_o4IcNbfPMA | Jun 20 12:17 |
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| *schestowitz looks | Jun 20 12:22 | |
| fewa | thats the one you posted | Jun 20 12:22 |
| fewa | i think | Jun 20 12:22 |
| schestowitz | Yeah. I wish YouTube URLs were more inforative | Jun 20 12:24 |
| schestowitz | They stay backware compatible with old URLs | Jun 20 12:24 |
| schestowitz | *ward | Jun 20 12:24 |
| fewa | they arnt bad | Jun 20 12:25 |
| fewa | you can always add comments | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | I've just posted links i BN | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | I'll do some posts | Jun 20 12:25 |
| fewa | but links fundaentally only kneed to be keys | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | You can also deep link | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | #t=180 or something like that | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | I can't recall the syntax for sure | Jun 20 12:25 |
| fewa | i never got that to work | Jun 20 12:25 |
| fewa | but yeah thats cool | Jun 20 12:25 |
| schestowitz | It does, but it needs remembering | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | Like an Easter egg | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | I used it some months ago to show people how Steve Jobs behave | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | *haves | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | How he wants to share the market only with MS | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | As they did with Safari charts, the OOXML fiasco and more | Jun 20 12:26 |
| schestowitz | Apple has many fans out there, so I'm careful not to bash them | Jun 20 12:27 |
| schestowitz | But they are blinded by the logo, not seeing malice | Jun 20 12:27 |
| maxstirner | their marketing is very good | Jun 20 12:27 |
| schestowitz | The FSF makes no friends by criticising APple | Jun 20 12:27 |
| fewa | they understand the market much better than microsoft | Jun 20 12:27 |
| maxstirner | i read an article the other day about their product placement strategies | Jun 20 12:27 |
| fewa | or on the other hard, they are also in a much more lienent position, able to pounce | Jun 20 12:28 |
| schestowitz | If Apple started attacking Linux directly, then it would require more direct exposure | Jun 20 12:28 |
| schestowitz | But right now it's MS that does what it called "Jihad" | Jun 20 12:28 |
| fewa | as their customers dont demand backwards compatibility etc | Jun 20 12:28 |
| maxstirner | they benefit from the There Is No Alternative to MS rubbish -> nice margins for something that actually works | Jun 20 12:28 |
| schestowitz | So we need to treat them | Jun 20 12:28 |
| schestowitz | Daily links: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/firefox-rc2-songbird-12/ | Jun 20 12:29 |
| schestowitz | Let's start with MS exodus | Jun 20 12:29 |
| fewa | Apple is also approaching a tipping point, where lock-in is their only way to increase market position | Jun 20 12:29 |
| schestowitz | They are collapsing | Jun 20 12:29 |
| schestowitz | fewa: wexactly | Jun 20 12:29 |
| fewa | This is where microsoft was for many years, | Jun 20 12:29 |
| schestowitz | Not approaching | Jun 20 12:29 |
| schestowitz | Already there in DRM | Jun 20 12:30 |
| fewa | made them lazy and arrogent | Jun 20 12:30 |
| fewa | does the <video> spec support streaming pipes? | Jun 20 12:37 |
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| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: ty for the heads up on the xfce pclinux in the links post | Jun 20 12:47 |
| ThistleWeb | I may just give that a try later on | Jun 20 12:47 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: they get kde4 too | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | last I heard SAM was almost dead | Jun 20 12:48 |
| schestowitz | Yeah | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | last version was 2007 | Jun 20 12:48 |
| schestowitz | No word in ages | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | that was a good lil distro | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | I liked sam | Jun 20 12:48 |
| schestowitz | Not was | Jun 20 12:48 |
| schestowitz | You can pick it up and carry on | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | I couldnt get it to install though | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | the installer always froze on me | Jun 20 12:48 |
| ThistleWeb | but it was nice in live mode | Jun 20 12:49 |
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| *schestowitz needs more xtensive royalty-free gallery of sunked ship | Jun 20 12:49 | |
| ThistleWeb | is this pheonix the rising of sam? | Jun 20 12:49 |
| schestowitz | *sunken (I'm doing a visual theme on Microsoft exodus) | Jun 20 12:49 |
| ThistleWeb | come to think of it, pclinux had a bit of a break but theyre back with a new 2009 too | Jun 20 12:50 |
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| _Hicham_ | Hi All! | Jun 20 12:51 |
| ThistleWeb | hey _Hicham_ | Jun 20 12:52 |
| _Hicham_ | howdy? | Jun 20 12:53 |
| *ThistleWeb is always keen to explore a new xfce distro ;) | Jun 20 12:55 | |
| ThistleWeb | not thought about the pclinux peeps in ages | Jun 20 12:55 |
| ThistleWeb | I notice some quotes from the RIAA in the latest Jamie Tomas trial "most people settle out of court for smaller fines, we're always willing to settle out of court" | Jun 20 12:57 |
| ThistleWeb | in other words, just paying the protection money is better all round | Jun 20 12:58 |
| schestowitz | Morning, senor _Hicham_ | Jun 20 13:02 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: good biz model | Jun 20 13:03 |
| schestowitz | Like MS with patent royalties | Jun 20 13:03 |
| schestowitz | "Most OEMs (or TomToms) settle out of court for smaller fines, we're always willing to settle out of court" | Jun 20 13:03 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: as long as you have a big enough fist, people will do anything to avoid being hit | Jun 20 13:03 |
| schestowitz | yes | Jun 20 13:03 |
| schestowitz | Like with the days of Std Oil | Jun 20 13:04 |
| schestowitz | They need to crack down on MAFIAA | Jun 20 13:04 |
| schestowitz | It's an illegal conspiracy of rich companies | Jun 20 13:04 |
| schestowitz | “DRM is nearly always the result of a conspiracy of companies to restrict the technology available to the public. Such conspiracy should be a crime, and the executives responsible for it should be sentenced to prison.” --Richard Stallman | Jun 20 13:04 |
| fewa | ThistleWeb, problem is that they are fighting against their customers | Jun 20 13:04 |
| ThistleWeb | yep, a protection racket is a protection racket, even if it's done by FTSE 100 multi-nationals | Jun 20 13:05 |
| fewa | its just usually done against enemys, not customers | Jun 20 13:06 |
| fewa | they are biting the hand that feeds them | Jun 20 13:07 |
| fewa | its a loosing proposiition | Jun 20 13:07 |
| _Hicham_ | what do u think of Iran crisis? | Jun 20 13:07 |
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| fewa | good coverage here: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/06/13/iran-demonstrations-viole_n_215189.html | Jun 20 13:08 |
| _Goblin | good afternoon.....something wrong here.....saturday, its sunny and Im still at work. | Jun 20 13:08 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: Freedom of speech helps here | Jun 20 13:08 |
| schestowitz | I don't do politics, but I think if technology facilities expression, then it should be encouraged | Jun 20 13:09 |
| schestowitz | Proxies and all for access to Wikipedia and stuff (not that it's banned) | Jun 20 13:09 |
| schestowitz | The worst thing is when something vile happens and no-one is able to report it | Jun 20 13:09 |
| _Hicham_ | but do u think that elections in Iran haven't been done properly? | Jun 20 13:10 |
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| _Hicham_ | wb senor tacone | Jun 20 13:11 |
| _Hicham_ | senor tacone uses Mac | Jun 20 13:11 |
| ThistleWeb | _Hicham_: "properly" from who's point of view? The ruling party who decided they'd rather stay in power TYVM | Jun 20 13:11 |
| tacone | hey | Jun 20 13:11 |
| tacone | yes, I'm probably a spy. | Jun 20 13:11 |
| fewa | _Hicham_, those detail will appear soon enough | Jun 20 13:12 |
| ThistleWeb | from their point of view it did go properly | Jun 20 13:12 |
| _Hicham_ | tacone : why there was no objections when Bush got re-elected? | Jun 20 13:12 |
| _Hicham_ | so Ahmadi Najad is a dictator now? | Jun 20 13:13 |
| _Hicham_ | because he got re-elected? | Jun 20 13:13 |
| tacone | _Hicham_: ? | Jun 20 13:13 |
| _Hicham_ | tacone : sorry | Jun 20 13:14 |
| _Hicham_ | this question is not to u specifically | Jun 20 13:14 |
| ThistleWeb | Bush won his first ellection when he was re-ellected | Jun 20 13:14 |
| ThistleWeb | he only stole his first term | Jun 20 13:14 |
| _Hicham_ | and there was no protests | Jun 20 13:15 |
| _Hicham_ | this is just FUD | Jun 20 13:15 |
| _Hicham_ | from the US | Jun 20 13:15 |
| _Hicham_ | they want all governments to be with them | Jun 20 13:15 |
| _Hicham_ | otherwise, they gonna split them internally | Jun 20 13:16 |
| _Hicham_ | old game | Jun 20 13:16 |
| _Hicham_ | i wish i was living in a country where the president has balls | Jun 20 13:16 |
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| _Hicham_ | like iran and venezuela | Jun 20 13:17 |
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| ThistleWeb | bbl | Jun 20 13:28 |
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| schestowitz | Well, Bush won the second term because of propaganda | Jun 20 13:32 |
| schestowitz | So he never was elected really | Jun 20 13:32 |
| schestowitz | Second term was "to get the job done" | Jun 20 13:32 |
| schestowitz | But _Hicham_, they HAVE to like Bush | Jun 20 13:33 |
| schestowitz | He was the parent of the world | Jun 20 13:33 |
| schestowitz | The 10 commandments instruct you to love thy parents | Jun 20 13:33 |
| schestowitz | If you don't like the president in the US, then it's borderline treasonous. It's seen in a negative light anyway, with the exception of very bad leaders like Bush | Jun 20 13:34 |
| schestowitz | It's hard to say negative things about Obama at this stage | Jun 20 13:34 |
| schestowitz | With Bush it was openly permitted | Jun 20 13:34 |
| schestowitz | Obama still have some karma and mojo left | Jun 20 13:35 |
| fewa | yes, all Faux news is being trasonous, along with all the other republicans | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | Nope | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | It's not | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | It IS the nation's agenda to many | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | Depends what you perceive as the goal | Jun 20 13:35 |
| fewa | they claim that he is invalid | Jun 20 13:35 |
| fewa | the whole birth certificate BS | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | If it's world domination, then fine | Jun 20 13:35 |
| fewa | and he actually got the vote | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | Look back at principles on which the nation was foundded | Jun 20 13:35 |
| schestowitz | It was hardly concealed | Jun 20 13:35 |
| MinceR | yay, no more daemon :) | Jun 20 13:36 |
| schestowitz | Signal++; | Jun 20 13:36 |
| schestowitz | Noise--; | Jun 20 13:36 |
| fewa | noise--; | Jun 20 13:36 |
| schestowitz | Beat me to it | Jun 20 13:36 |
| schestowitz | /me/you/ | Jun 20 13:36 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The Rumours May be True: Novell’s Financial Officer Talks About Selling Parts of Novell < http://ping.fm/YHbyu > | Jun 20 13:42 | |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I am gonna buy SUSE | Jun 20 13:45 |
| ugufjhfj | lol | Jun 20 13:45 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : and we will run it together | Jun 20 13:46 |
| ugufjhfj | buy SCO UnixWare instead | Jun 20 13:47 |
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| fewa | by xandros with patent protection | Jun 20 13:51 |
| fewa | SCO_MS OS | Jun 20 13:52 |
| _Hicham_ | yes, schestowitz will be the patents holder | Jun 20 13:52 |
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| schestowitz | Patents? No, thanks. | Jun 20 14:22 |
| schestowitz | Good for lawyers, waste of money to engineers | Jun 20 14:22 |
| schestowitz | Patents are the new slavery | Jun 20 14:22 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Does Microsoft Blackmail Sub-notebooks Vendors? < http://ping.fm/1inhT > | Jun 20 14:22 | |
| schestowitz | Passe | Jun 20 14:22 |
| Omar871 | Hello there folks. | Jun 20 14:22 |
| Omar871 | schestowitz: Tomorrow, me and my friend will meet for lunch and discuss the to-be-established open source/open content society. | Jun 20 14:24 |
| Omar871 | schestowitz: I suggested we name it Jordan's Intellectual Freedom Society, since it's not gonna me software oriented. It's also gonna include support for open content, CreativeCommons.. etc. | Jun 20 14:26 |
| schestowitz | What was the acronym of that group again? | Jun 20 14:53 |
| schestowitz | JUST | Jun 20 14:54 |
| schestowitz | Installation Festival in JUST http://www.just.edu.jo/opensource/article.php?id=41 | Jun 20 14:54 |
| schestowitz | I've spread this link in quite a few place.. just didn't remember the acronym | Jun 20 14:54 |
| schestowitz | JIFS is not a good acronym | Jun 20 14:54 |
| schestowitz | Sounds like JIFFA | Jun 20 14:55 |
| fewa | http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/9172/1245456677307.jpg | Jun 20 14:57 |
| MinceR | lol | Jun 20 14:58 |
| Omar871, you might consider joining forces with the Free Culture movement. Here's an example, http://vt.freeculture.org/ | Jun 20 15:02 | |
| schestowitz | fewa: Dow Load | Jun 20 15:06 |
| fewa | lol | Jun 20 15:06 |
| fewa | its not mine | Jun 20 15:06 |
| schestowitz | It's very good | Jun 20 15:06 |
| schestowitz | Maybe they should put the price of ink cartridge next to it | Jun 20 15:07 |
| schestowitz | One dead relative=bottle of ink | Jun 20 15:07 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Whisper Campaigns Against Gnote < http://ping.fm/ytKne > | Jun 20 15:07 | |
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| MinceR | "...in order to change a human being into this." [holds up a Duracell battery] | Jun 20 15:10 |
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| Catching up with last night, I think there's a story in the "compromised" bike site. | Jun 20 15:47 | |
| There's a long history of Google FUD that should be blowing up in M$'s face right now. | Jun 20 15:47 | |
| Instead they try to spin that history in their favor but it's so twisted that it's prime to collapse. | Jun 20 15:48 | |
| The bike site story in the BBC is an example of it. The operative question is, "What is badware?" | Jun 20 15:49 | |
| It's usually Win32 poison, but why does BBC not mention Windows? | Jun 20 15:49 | |
| Why does http://www.stopbadware.org/ not mention Windows as prominently as Windows malware is? | Jun 20 15:50 | |
| If stopbadware really believed, " We invite you to join our community, to help reduce the impact of badware and to regain control of our computers," they would tell you to install free software instead of FUDing Google and giving the false impression that the internet can ever be safe for Windows. | Jun 20 15:52 | |
| There is no mention of Microsoft Windows on this page. http://www.stopbadware.org/home/badware | Jun 20 15:54 | |
| It is only tangentially mentioned here http://www.stopbadware.org/home/badware_remove | Jun 20 15:55 | |
| " Add/Remove Programs" is windows specific. | Jun 20 15:56 | |
| Sites and organizations that help to make life on Windows easier, or at least appear to be easier, are part of the malware problem not the solution. Free software is the malware solution. | Jun 20 15:57 | |
| Here we go, StopBadware is all about windows protection. http://www.stopbadware.org/home/security | Jun 20 16:01 | |
| " It may also be useful to search through your site’s source code and look for links to unknown sites, especially if the links are to executable files. Executable files include files with extensions such as .exe, .bat, .cmd, .scr, and .pif" | Jun 20 16:01 | |
| Please. | Jun 20 16:01 | |
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| M$ has been twisting the Windows Malware issue to it's favor for decades. A few months ago, I installed a copy of DOS 6 from floppies. There in the 15 year old advertising screens were promises that this new version of DOS would keep the user safe from viruses and data corruption. | Jun 20 16:08 | |
| M$ has always tried to paint their competitors as dirty, harmful to the user's computer. Like DRDOS, OS/2, etc. | Jun 20 16:09 | |
| Today, the FUD drum beats "Google serves unsafe links!" | Jun 20 16:09 | |
| The only thing all of this FUD really has in common is it's source and the thing harmed, M$ and M$ software. | Jun 20 16:10 | |
| It points to a 20 year history of insecure and untrustworthy computing from M$, not anyone else. | Jun 20 16:10 | |
| MinceR | what in DOS 6 was supposed to help the situation? | Jun 20 16:11 |
| They did not really say. | Jun 20 16:11 | |
| MinceR | :) | Jun 20 16:11 |
| They just promised "features" | Jun 20 16:11 | |
| MinceR | it's Microsoft® Magical Handwaving™ Technology! | Jun 20 16:11 |
| Comes with every version. | Jun 20 16:12 | |
| MinceR | indeed | Jun 20 16:12 |
| Somehow, it never works. | Jun 20 16:12 | |
| Every version is the "most secure ever" but malware always nails it as well as every previous version listed because it's the same old code. | Jun 20 16:13 | |
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| schestowitz | More Microsoft AstroTurfing (aka ‘Technical Evangelism’) in Twitter < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/microsoft-astroturf-te-twitter/ > | Jun 20 16:15 |
| schestowitz | Hey, wallc | Jun 20 16:15 |
| What's incredible is how they have wrapped up so much pretend effort by others to solve the problem. I like this write up about it, http://www.securityabsurdity.com/failure.php | Jun 20 16:16 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Microsoft AstroTurfing (aka ‘Technical Evangelism’) in Twitter < http://ping.fm/oUELw > | Jun 20 16:17 | |
| uh oh, looks like securityabsurdity is gone. | Jun 20 16:18 | |
| schestowitz | 'm off for a while. | Jun 20 16:19 |
| later | Jun 20 16:20 | |
| Security absurdity only lasted for 2 years. | Jun 20 16:20 | |
| let's look at the wayback machine. | Jun 20 16:21 | |
| ah ha, http://web.archive.org/web/20060520062137/http://www.securityabsurdity.com/failure.php | Jun 20 16:22 | |
| Mentions Windows explicitly and notes that even the most diligent user will be screwed because it takes more time to download patches than it does to get owned on the net. | Jun 20 16:23 | |
| It's a shame that anyone believes the never ending stream of Windows patches does any good. | Jun 20 16:24 | |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] There's a time to get the heck off Twitter. http://bit.ly/W9saS (note blank expression and Apple logo) | Jun 20 16:27 | |
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| _Hicham_ | Hi All! | Jun 20 16:31 |
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| neighborlee | hi there ;0- | Jun 20 16:34 |
| _Hicham_ | how r u neighborlee? | Jun 20 16:34 |
| neighborlee | very nice thx, and you ? ;) < we got buried in rain last night, but my garden wuves me so meh> ;)) | Jun 20 16:34 |
| neighborlee | so does my rain barrel...:) | Jun 20 16:35 |
| _Hicham_ | r u on linux now? | Jun 20 16:36 |
| neighborlee | no , but I can be at moments notice ;) | Jun 20 16:37 |
| neighborlee | I can reboot into fedora right now | Jun 20 16:37 |
| neighborlee | brb | Jun 20 16:37 |
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| neighborlee | _Hicham_, okie | Jun 20 16:40 |
| _Hicham_ | would u test a package? | Jun 20 16:41 |
| neighborlee | sure nuf | Jun 20 16:42 |
| Omar871 | Hi there folks. :) | Jun 20 16:43 |
| Omar871 | Guys, I'd like to take your opinions for something. | Jun 20 16:44 |
| neighborlee | hi there omar | Jun 20 16:44 |
| neighborlee | ;) | Jun 20 16:44 |
| Omar871 | Me and my friends are working on establishing a new society in Jordan. | Jun 20 16:44 |
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| Omar871 | It will be open source oriented, but will also support open content, Creative Commons.. etc. | Jun 20 16:45 |
| Omar871 | So, what would be an appropriate name for it. | Jun 20 16:46 |
| Omar871 | My friends go for "Jordan Open Source Association", and I recommended that the name includes both Free and Open Source Software, so we're not sure yet. | Jun 20 16:47 |
| Omar871 | So, any suggestions from you will be highly recommended. ;) | Jun 20 16:47 |
| Omar871 | And highly appreciated too. :D | Jun 20 16:48 |
| Omar871 | hey there neighborlee. ^^ | Jun 20 16:48 |
| Hmm, Omar871, did you miss the Free Culture suggestion above? | Jun 20 16:49 | |
| You should avoid the ever more diluted term "open source" and use free instead. | Jun 20 16:50 | |
| Of course, you should also use your knowledge of your own culture to chose what works. Friends of mine from Jordan have talked longing about an original free state of men. People without borders and rules. I do not know what they refer to but that might be helpful to you. | Jun 20 16:52 | |
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| Omar871 | twitter: That's exactly what I recommended. But they just don't seem to listen. -_- | Jun 20 16:59 |
| Surely you have friends who do listen, Omar871? | Jun 20 17:00 | |
| Is there a branch of the FSF there? | Jun 20 17:00 | |
| Omar871 | I don't think so. | Jun 20 17:00 |
| Do you have the time to start such a thing? | Jun 20 17:01 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: Yeah, I guess so. Actually, I'm not the main founder, but I'm one of the main participants. | Jun 20 17:02 |
| Well, party on. Just don't sign off on things that violate your principles. | Jun 20 17:03 | |
| Put your thoughts into publication and work for freedom the best you can. | Jun 20 17:03 | |
| Your organization will get it in time. | Jun 20 17:04 | |
| neighborlee | _Hicham_, did we lose you ;0-0 ;) | Jun 20 17:07 |
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| Omar871 | twitter: How about "Jordan's Free Culture Society" Or "Jordan's Intellectual Freedom Society"? | Jun 20 17:09 |
| Both sound fine to me. It will be what you and your friends make it. | Jun 20 17:10 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: I know, but I'm also looking for some feedback. :) | Jun 20 17:11 |
| I like the Free Culture name because there is already an organization doing just that which you can join and get help from. They have a formal process for establishing new chapters. If their goals fit yours, I think you should do just that. | Jun 20 17:12 | |
| neighborlee | rebooting-fedora update | Jun 20 17:15 |
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| Omar871 | twitter: Can you tell me more about them? | Jun 20 17:16 |
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| Omar871 | brb in a couple o' minutes. | Jun 20 17:16 |
| Omar871, mail here newgroup@freeculture.org | Jun 20 17:17 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: thanks | Jun 20 17:21 |
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| you are welcome. The web site lists other chapters, http://freeculture.org/ | Jun 20 17:22 | |
| be patient and find out what you can on your own, it takes them a while to respond to email. | Jun 20 17:25 | |
| ick, the Florida group used the term "intellectual property" | Jun 20 17:26 | |
| sigh, there seems to be a lot of that http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Afreeculture.org+%22intellectual+property%22&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 | Jun 20 17:30 | |
| the only organization that gets things consistently right is the Free Software Foundation. | Jun 20 17:30 | |
| contrast http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&q=site%3Afsf.org+%22intellectual+property%22&aq=o&oq=&aqi= | Jun 20 17:31 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[astralknight] Official Firefox 3.5 Icon Files: http://digg.com/d1uNZ6?t | Jun 20 17:32 | |
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| ah ha, http://groups.fsf.org/wiki/Main_Page | Jun 20 17:37 | |
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| The thing I like about the Free Culture groups is that they focus on the fun parts of software freedom, the flower of freedom is culture. | Jun 20 17:44 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: True. | Jun 20 17:44 |
| They promote free music, movies and all the good things that flow from free software and free networks. It is very appealing. | Jun 20 17:44 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: However, here in Jordan, there's so very much to be done. | Jun 20 17:45 |
| There is much to be done everywhere. :) | Jun 20 17:45 | |
| Omar871 | twitter: lol. :) | Jun 20 17:45 |
| Omar871 | twitter: Yeah. :D | Jun 20 17:45 |
| US companies, sadly, have lead the way for oppressors everywhere. | Jun 20 17:45 | |
| So, there's even more to be done here. | Jun 20 17:46 | |
| GNU and FSF have laid the foundations of free societies, but that work is not as appealing as the results. In short, taking about software all the time is boring. | Jun 20 17:47 | |
| For most people that is.... | Jun 20 17:47 | |
| bbl | Jun 20 17:50 | |
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| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: what module do you use to have the IRC channel on the wordpress page? | Jun 20 18:26 |
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| schestowitz | From MS Jack: "All operating systems are leaky, and there's a fair chance Windows 7 is less leaky than either Mac OS X or GNU/Linux (which is more than a kernel)., It certainly has more advanced security features than either of those. | Jun 20 19:00 |
| schestowitz | http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2009/jun/19/microsoft-morro-beta-test?commentpage=1 | Jun 20 19:00 |
| schestowitz | Cha-ching.. Ballmer pays MS Jack... | Jun 20 19:00 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: watch page source | Jun 20 19:02 |
| schestowitz | It's an iframe | Jun 20 19:02 |
| ThistleWeb | k | Jun 20 19:03 |
| ThistleWeb | I tried it for the first time earlier, popped in as Jimbo for a few mins | Jun 20 19:03 |
| ThistleWeb | nobody said anything | Jun 20 19:03 |
| ThistleWeb | including me | Jun 20 19:03 |
| ThistleWeb | it looks quite decent | Jun 20 19:04 |
| ThistleWeb | for an embedded client | Jun 20 19:04 |
| ThistleWeb | ahh webchat | Jun 20 19:07 |
| schestowitz | It's GPLv2-ed | Jun 20 19:07 |
| schestowitz | I have it on my server too | Jun 20 19:07 |
| schestowitz | But I run it off freenode.net for now | Jun 20 19:07 |
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| ThistleWeb | I have a drupal project that I'm still conceptualising which would be great to have an embedded IRC client for those (mostly Windows users) who have never heard of IRC to join in | Jun 20 19:08 |
| schestowitz | MS trolls me. | Jun 20 19:08 |
| ThistleWeb | I spent ages looking through wordpress.org to find what plugin you used, never thought of an iframe | Jun 20 19:08 |
| schestowitz | https://twitter.com/jlundstocholm/status/2255405897 "jlundstocholm@aristippus303 @al3xbrown I'll be there (with bells on). What about our American friends? (@schestowitz, take it away) #sc34" | Jun 20 19:08 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: mibbit is now blocked | Jun 20 19:09 |
| schestowitz | brb | Jun 20 19:09 |
| ThistleWeb | blocked in what way? from being embedded? | Jun 20 19:09 |
| Good Grief. Widows 7, most secure OS ever. What nerve. | Jun 20 19:10 | |
| Someone hit the Jack Bott. | Jun 20 19:11 | |
| I don't see the quoted text, shestowitz, could Jack have pulled it already? | Jun 20 19:15 | |
| MinceR | widows :D | Jun 20 19:18 |
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| schestowitz | twitter: maybe | Jun 20 19:23 |
| schestowitz | Someone mailed it to me. | Jun 20 19:23 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft Widows | Jun 20 19:23 |
| schestowitz | "Hope"... "Unity'... "Change"...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNpNzDoH1II | Jun 20 19:24 |
| schestowitz | "When the House of Commons finally published details of MP expenses online, the public may have been left wondering how much more money has been wasted on a fruitless effort to censor the details held in individual claims. " When the House of Commons finally published details of MP expenses online, the public may have been left wondering how much more money has been wasted on a fruitless effort to censor the details held in individ | Jun 20 19:26 |
| schestowitz | ual claims. | Jun 20 19:26 |
| schestowitz | http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/06/20/bungled_expenses_censorship/ | Jun 20 19:26 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: is your name Hansen? :-) "Hansen calls his creation "Slowloris - the low bandwidth yet greedy and poisonous HTTP client."" http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/06/20/apache_dos_flaw/ | Jun 20 19:27 |
| MinceR | nope | Jun 20 19:31 |
| MinceR | why don't you have a seat over there? | Jun 20 19:32 |
| MinceR | :> | Jun 20 19:32 |
| Why am I reading that idiot, Ed Bott? " I noticed that the scanning engine throttled its use of the CPU to 50% or less, which lessened its impact on other tasks." What a funny way of saying anti-virus eats half of your CPU. | Jun 20 19:33 | |
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| MinceR | or that it's running on a dual-core system and it is single-threaded so it only manages to eat one of the two cores? :> | Jun 20 19:34 |
| comments are funny. "Apple users need antivirus software like they need a hole in the head. After all these | Jun 20 19:35 | |
| years, there still is not a self replicating virus ..." | Jun 20 19:35 | |
| MinceR | a hole in their head, such as the mouth? :> | Jun 20 19:36 |
| MinceR | i wish they didn't have such holes in their heads. | Jun 20 19:36 |
| schestowitz | is this really Norris commenting here? http://blogs.computerworld.com/sco_rises_from_the_dead | Jun 20 19:37 |
| ThistleWeb | chuck? | Jun 20 19:37 |
| schestowitz | Nope | Jun 20 19:37 |
| schestowitz | Chuck is not so corrupt | Jun 20 19:37 |
| schestowitz | Norris narcotics Inc. | Jun 20 19:38 |
| schestowitz | Anyway, I've asked PJ.. | Jun 20 19:38 |
| schestowitz | Novell is also a mess.. http://www.financialnewsusa.com/news/novell-announces | Jun 20 19:39 |
| Ed Bott is showing Vista snap shots touting transparency. I think M$ shills are smarting from widespread screen shots from free software that look better. Vista is so ugly. | Jun 20 19:40 | |
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| ThistleWeb | "ugly" is in the eye of the beholder | Jun 20 19:41 |
| here's a series of pictures some smarty pants put onto the Vista section of bay img. http://bayimg.com/kAHHhAabc | Jun 20 19:41 | |
| schestowitz | MOG: "SCO Rises Phoenix-Like" | Jun 20 19:41 |
| ThistleWeb | Vista's eye candy comes at a hellava resource cost though | Jun 20 19:41 |
| schestowitz | Mandriva looks nicer | Jun 20 19:42 |
| schestowitz | Just put some extras on it | Jun 20 19:42 |
| ThistleWeb | from all accounts, it's limited in it's customisability | Jun 20 19:42 |
| schestowitz | Vista7 crashes if you mess with some display settings | Jun 20 19:42 |
| dog poop looks better than Vista. | Jun 20 19:42 | |
| ThistleWeb | I guess, so is Compwiz, it's limits are just much farther out that you'd really be going something to reach them | Jun 20 19:42 |
| I'm sure Vista 7 will crash all by itself. | Jun 20 19:43 | |
| schestowitz | Well, it's Windows | Jun 20 19:43 |
| schestowitz | It's a matter of heredity | Jun 20 19:43 |
| ThistleWeb | compwiz is a great tool for showing how bad Aero is, for a fraction of the hardware, you get better eye candy | Jun 20 19:44 |
| ThistleWeb | and it's free | Jun 20 19:44 |
| ThistleWeb | that's how a multi-billion dollar R&D budget competes with a group of geeks building their own solutions | Jun 20 19:44 |
| schestowitz | ThomasNet Industrial Newsroom is a wart in Yahoo! and Google News | Jun 20 19:45 |
| schestowitz | They repost old PR | Jun 20 19:45 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: it's also light | Jun 20 19:45 |
| ThistleWeb | exactly | Jun 20 19:45 |
| ThistleWeb | side by side on new enough hardware to run Aero, Compwiz will fly | Jun 20 19:46 |
| ThistleWeb | switch that comparision downwards to lower hadware and compwiz will still fly while Aero starts to puff and wheeze | Jun 20 19:46 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft admits Vista screwed - report http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=37125 | Jun 20 19:47 |
| *schestowitz tires to find another good INQ story | Jun 20 19:47 | |
| ah, about time they did that | Jun 20 19:48 | |
| ThistleWeb | even on new hardware, why would you want to dedicate a huge chunk of resources for eye candy? Yes it looks cool but is it really worth that? At least with compwiz you can have the eye candy without dedicating a huge chunk of RAM | Jun 20 19:48 |
| schestowitz | Never mind, I can't find it | Jun 20 19:48 |
| schestowitz | it's an article where they say MS got nervous by 3D desktop in Linux in 2006 | Jun 20 19:49 |
| schestowitz | http://www.techworld.com/opsys/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=9579 (Acer: PC industry 'disappointed' with Vista) | Jun 20 19:49 |
| http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/177855 | Jun 20 19:49 | |
| the Acer story is there along with everyone else in the industry. | Jun 20 19:49 | |
| M$ hates it when GNU/Linux looks good. | Jun 20 19:50 | |
| Just look what they did when Intel made free software for their graphics chips. M$ blew them right out of the market. | Jun 20 19:50 | |
| Wrecked them in XP and had their crowning "Vista Capable" blow. | Jun 20 19:51 | |
| SanDisk also hated Vista and delayed production of SSDs over it. | Jun 20 19:52 | |
| Heh, watch the lie in that Techworld article, " HP, Dell, Lenovo and Toshiba have continued offering XP-equipped machines, but these are generally aimed at consumers or small businesses, not large corporate clients." It was totally opposite - no large clients bit on Vista it was all "consumer" dump. | Jun 20 19:54 | |
| I wonder if more developers are still working on GNU/Linux than Vista. http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/203152 | Jun 20 19:58 | |
| Now that Vista is dead for Vista 7, I'm sure there are. | Jun 20 19:58 | |
| How much money is anyone going to waste on developer tools for an OS that failed when they could join the free software party instead? | Jun 20 20:00 | |
| ugufjhfj | sure | Jun 20 20:00 |
| ThistleWeb | I'm thinking Windows 7 will be what Vista should have been | Jun 20 20:00 |
| ThistleWeb | but it still won't matter that much | Jun 20 20:00 |
| ugufjhfj | crippleware -> No Wallpaper Swapping in Win 7 SE | Jun 20 20:01 |
| ThistleWeb | Microsoft need to introduce added features to entice peeps to buy a more expensive licence, first it was a 3 app limit which was sadly dropped due to a common-sense-cloud passing over Redmond, now it's the unchangeable look | Jun 20 20:02 |
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| MinceR | 205446 <@schestowitz> Chuck is not so corrupt | Jun 20 20:05 |
| MinceR | yes he is. | Jun 20 20:05 |
| schestowitz | hehe. Watch this picture of Soros... look like he's having a mental cockup: http://seekingalpha.com/article/144245-george-soros-likes-bonds | Jun 20 20:06 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: morally corrupt? | Jun 20 20:06 |
| MinceR | it would seem so. | Jun 20 20:07 |
| schestowitz | twitter 's list of Vista failure is handy | Jun 20 20:07 |
| MinceR | he's a republican christian fundamentalist. | Jun 20 20:07 |
| schestowitz | Many people I see link to it, sometimes by E-mail | Jun 20 20:07 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Naaa... | Jun 20 20:07 |
| schestowitz | He probably voted for NRA or smething | Jun 20 20:07 |
| ThistleWeb | MinceR: AKA a headcase | Jun 20 20:07 |
| MinceR | iirc he promoted one of the republican candidates before mccain beat him | Jun 20 20:08 |
| MinceR | ThistleWeb: indeed. | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | >> | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | <ThistleWeb> I'm thinking Windows 7 will be what Vista should have been | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | What was LH supposed to be like? | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | Longhorn? | Jun 20 20:08 |
| MinceR | i have no issue with NRA's goal though, as far as i know what it is. | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | Not sucky? | Jun 20 20:08 |
| MinceR | vista7 will have winfs? | Jun 20 20:08 |
| schestowitz | Nope, no SOAP either | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | No fast boot | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Nothing! | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Vistaster2 | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Sorry | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Vistaster7 | Jun 20 20:09 |
| MinceR | or vista sp7 | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | No | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | it makes it sound matyre | Jun 20 20:09 |
| MinceR | lol | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | *mature | Jun 20 20:09 |
| ThistleWeb | from what I heard about Windows 7, a lot of the driver issues have been fixed, it's had the benefit of the Vista sp patches so it's more stable, but they added a lot of the bloat back into later RC versions and have announced it will require the same resources as Vista | Jun 20 20:09 |
| MinceR | how can something with the word "windows" or "vista" in its name sound mature? :> | Jun 20 20:09 |
| schestowitz | VIsta 7 to Vista is what New Coke is to Classic | Jun 20 20:10 |
| schestowitz | IOW, it can be even more edgy | Jun 20 20:10 |
| ThistleWeb | the lighter RC was a kinda PR stunt to get people thinking it's faster | Jun 20 20:10 |
| schestowitz | Vista 7 is immature and flaky | Jun 20 20:10 |
| schestowitz | Only an idiot would touch the thing before SPs | Jun 20 20:10 |
| ThistleWeb | but they left out a lot of stuff they knew would be added later | Jun 20 20:10 |
| schestowitz | It could be worse than Vista SP2 based on predictability | Jun 20 20:10 |
| MinceR | no coke can be as vile as windows :> | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | It's for hobbyists | Jun 20 20:11 |
| MinceR | and i'm saying that as someone who prefers pepsi | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | Gals like Chris Pirillo | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | Who sink kumbayah and change undies when Windows comes out | Jun 20 20:11 |
| MinceR | (but i drink very little cola nowadays) | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | *sing | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | The UsefulIdiots | Jun 20 20:11 |
| schestowitz | Pepsi, cola... whatever... water+sugar+acid | Jun 20 20:12 |
| MinceR | a little more than that | Jun 20 20:12 |
| schestowitz | Make your own pison | Jun 20 20:12 |
| schestowitz | Caffeine still? | Jun 20 20:12 |
| MinceR | colorant, flavor | Jun 20 20:12 |
| MinceR | yes, caffeine | Jun 20 20:12 |
| MinceR | an important ingredient | Jun 20 20:12 |
| schestowitz | Additives like colours | Jun 20 20:12 |
| schestowitz | yaya. | Jun 20 20:12 |
| *MinceR makes his own psion | Jun 20 20:12 | |
| schestowitz | Yay. Colouring materials | Jun 20 20:12 |
| ThistleWeb | set aside those who make their livings from an OS and it's eccosphere, I can see why peeps love and defend Macs, BSD, Linux and FOSS but I can't understand why people actually defend Windows and Microsoft | Jun 20 20:12 |
| schestowitz | That's what the body loves digesting | Jun 20 20:12 |
| MinceR | well, caramel is a common colorant in cola, afaik | Jun 20 20:13 |
| MinceR | not sure if it needs others | Jun 20 20:13 |
| schestowitz | They used to have cocaine in it | Jun 20 20:13 |
| MinceR | indeed | Jun 20 20:13 |
| schestowitz | To claim the patients down | Jun 20 20:13 |
| schestowitz | Had people done that today they'd be in prison | Jun 20 20:14 |
| schestowitz | But let's pretend we don't know history | Jun 20 20:14 |
| schestowitz | Then it was tobacco | Jun 20 20:14 |
| MinceR | people failed to notice the dangers of substances many times | Jun 20 20:14 |
| MinceR | for example, i've read recently that tallium was used as a depilator | Jun 20 20:14 |
| MinceR | also, for a while, radioactive matter was considered some sort of universal medicine | Jun 20 20:15 |
| ThistleWeb | it is sad that tobacco and alcahol do more damage than a lot of other substances, but both are socially acceptable, legal and (the key word) taxable | Jun 20 20:15 |
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| MinceR | indeed | Jun 20 20:15 |
| ThistleWeb | tobacco is VERY addictive, I spent most of my adult life addicted to it | Jun 20 20:16 |
| MinceR | the main point is that western culture had got accustomed to their use | Jun 20 20:16 |
| ThistleWeb | plenty of illegal drugs are less addictive | Jun 20 20:16 |
| MinceR | as opposed to, say, marijuana | Jun 20 20:16 |
| ThistleWeb | alcahol is used in many ceremonies | Jun 20 20:16 |
| MinceR | all cultures have their own narcotics | Jun 20 20:16 |
| MinceR | used in ceremonies and stuff | Jun 20 20:16 |
| ThistleWeb | stoners don't start fights | Jun 20 20:18 |
| ThistleWeb | they're too wasted | Jun 20 20:18 |
| ThistleWeb | and aimable | Jun 20 20:18 |
| ThistleWeb | legalise dope and cut down on street violence | Jun 20 20:18 |
| ThistleWeb | increase profits for munchy shops | Jun 20 20:19 |
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| ThistleWeb | any outlet that sells sweeties, crisps, soda etc will do a booming trade | Jun 20 20:19 |
| ThistleWeb | mind you, there'd be a knock on effect for obesity | Jun 20 20:20 |
| Wow, has it already been five months since KDE 4 was stable enough to show on the street as much better than Vista? http://boycottnovell.com/2009/02/06/kde4-vista-7/ | Jun 20 20:22 | |
| It must be time to move to testing. | Jun 20 20:23 | |
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| schestowitz | Novell seems to be preparing to sell part of itself, confirming what I heard weeks ago http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aFQ5F8K1WAp8 | Jun 20 20:29 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : let's buy SUSE | Jun 20 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Who would? | Jun 20 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Cisco? | Jun 20 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Citrix? | Jun 20 20:30 |
| _Hicham_ | me and you | Jun 20 20:30 |
| schestowitz | That's a scary thought | Jun 20 20:30 |
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| _Hicham_ | what do u mean? SUSE is better with Novell? | Jun 20 20:31 |
| schestowitz | It's covenant-encumbered | Jun 20 20:33 |
| schestowitz | Use OpenSUSE | Jun 20 20:33 |
| schestowitz | Fork it | Jun 20 20:33 |
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| _Mutex_ | "Taiwanese OEMs would love an alternative to Windows, but the sale comes first, before production. The chicken comes first. And since the chicken belongs to Microsoft, the penguin is helpless here." | Jun 20 20:36 |
| _Mutex_ | there you go, "the sale comes first". | Jun 20 20:36 |
| _Mutex_ | "covenant-encumbered" whats that mean ? | Jun 20 20:39 |
| _Mutex_ | anyone ? | Jun 20 20:41 |
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| ThistleWeb | _Mutex_: it means there's a corporate agreement protecting it's users from Microsoft's lawyers | Jun 20 20:51 |
| _Hicham_ | so schestowitz and I are both protected | Jun 20 20:52 |
| _Hicham_ | because we are users of SUSE | Jun 20 20:52 |
| ThistleWeb | I wouldn't be surprised if Mono was legal on distros who'd paid Microsoft their fees | Jun 20 20:52 |
| ThistleWeb | so it's legal on SLED and openSUSE | Jun 20 20:52 |
| ThistleWeb | or Xandros or Linspire (if they still exist) | Jun 20 20:52 |
| _Hicham_ | ok, I will use Mono only on openSUSE | Jun 20 20:53 |
| _Hicham_ | that way I am not infringing the law | Jun 20 20:54 |
| ThistleWeb | not law, Microsoft agreements | Jun 20 20:54 |
| _Hicham_ | ok | Jun 20 20:55 |
| _Hicham_ | so it is safe to use Mono on openSUSE? | Jun 20 20:55 |
| ThistleWeb | vendors who put Linux on pre-installs, will be pressured to put Microsoft approved distros on, since they've paid Microsoft for being allowed to use Linux | Jun 20 20:56 |
| _Hicham_ | Great | Jun 20 20:57 |
| ThistleWeb | if you really need mono for something and want to cover your ass as much as possible then openSUSE may be the best bet | Jun 20 20:57 |
| _Hicham_ | that way Microsoft will gain more control | Jun 20 20:57 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: Gordon Brown teases: "I could walk away from office tomorrow" http://is.gd/17CPy | Jun 20 20:57 | |
| _Hicham_ | that is what I doing | Jun 20 20:57 |
| _Hicham_ | I am wondering if such great .NET programs (like NHC) could be ported to linux using Mono | Jun 20 20:58 |
| ThistleWeb | no idea | Jun 20 20:59 |
| _Hicham_ | Mono can be beneficial to Linux | Jun 20 20:59 |
| _Hicham_ | only with full .NET compatibility | Jun 20 20:59 |
| ThistleWeb | Mono fits a need, if you have that need then great | Jun 20 21:00 |
| _Hicham_ | for software vendors, it might be a great choice | Jun 20 21:01 |
| ThistleWeb | it really should be a temporary solution until you can move that ,net app you rely on, onto a cross platform alternative | Jun 20 21:01 |
| _Hicham_ | since a lot of software makers are turning toward .NET | Jun 20 21:01 |
| ThistleWeb | I pity them | Jun 20 21:01 |
| _Hicham_ | .Mono is cross platform | Jun 20 21:02 |
| _Hicham_ | it has binding GTK and QT | Jun 20 21:02 |
| _Hicham_ | it can run Java | Jun 20 21:02 |
| _Hicham_ | ikvm virtual machine | Jun 20 21:03 |
| ThistleWeb | mono is on permanant catchup to .net | Jun 20 21:03 |
| _Hicham_ | like OpenJDK with Sun JRE | Jun 20 21:04 |
| ThistleWeb | if we allow it to gain traction, or even worse become part of the core Gnome etc we're screwed | Jun 20 21:04 |
| _Mutex_ | thats like saying gcc is on permanant catchup to C (makes no sense). | Jun 20 21:04 |
| _Goblin | hello all... | Jun 20 21:04 |
| ThistleWeb | eventually Microsoft will take .net in legal directions mono cant go | Jun 20 21:04 |
| _Hicham_ | Hi _Goblin! | Jun 20 21:04 |
| _Goblin | Hi mate. installing your package shortly | Jun 20 21:05 |
| _Hicham_ | ok, thanks | Jun 20 21:05 |
| _Goblin | Im first just doing a quick install of Zenwalk 6 | Jun 20 21:05 |
| ThistleWeb | which means stuff will break in mono and devs will end up going back to Windows rather than port all their mono work over to a proper cross platform framework | Jun 20 21:05 |
| ThistleWeb | it has to reverse engineer .net updates | Jun 20 21:05 |
| ThistleWeb | unless they can include new features at the same time, it will be playing catchup | Jun 20 21:06 |
| ThistleWeb | Microsoft will lead mono by the nose | Jun 20 21:06 |
| ThistleWeb | if Mono inovate and do stuff on their own, Microsoft wont implement it | Jun 20 21:06 |
| ThistleWeb | to stay compatible | Jun 20 21:06 |
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| _Mutex_ | it's GPL code, so if you dont like mono how it is, like any GPL code you are quite within your rights to modifiy the code, after all is that not the reason why you love your GPL so much ? | Jun 20 21:07 |
| ThistleWeb | Microsoft thrives on uncompatibility | Jun 20 21:07 |
| _Mutex_ | so whats your problem ? | Jun 20 21:07 |
| ThistleWeb | of course you are, but it's designed to be an implementation of .net | Jun 20 21:07 |
| ThistleWeb | which means it has to be as close to .net as it can | Jun 20 21:07 |
| MinceR | _Mutex_: fyi, your bullshit "arguments" haven't magically become true during the last 24 hours | Jun 20 21:07 |
| _Mutex_ | mabey it is, but its your right to make it whatever YOU want it to be, | Jun 20 21:08 |
| ThistleWeb | Microsoft wont help them | Jun 20 21:08 |
| ThistleWeb | they have to reverse engineer Microsoft's updates | Jun 20 21:08 |
| ThistleWeb | which means they will be behind in implementing them | Jun 20 21:08 |
| _Mutex_ | Sorry MinceR, if you dont "get" the GPL, thats not my problem, and you can point me to any "bullshit" please ? | Jun 20 21:08 |
| _Mutex_ | otherwise, its you dishing the cowdung | Jun 20 21:09 |
| MinceR | _Mutex_: i've explained it to you at least twice. now go troll elsewhere. | Jun 20 21:09 |
| ThistleWeb | they wont be able to choose which features to add, because the aim of the game is to be as close as possible, so they have no choice but to be lead by the nose by Microsoft | Jun 20 21:09 |
| _Mutex_ | well one more time wont hurt you then,, ok go im listening :) | Jun 20 21:09 |
| _Mutex_ | or dont you have anything (again). | Jun 20 21:09 |
| ThistleWeb | eventually Microsoft are going to start adding hooks into specific windows only proprietary code | Jun 20 21:09 |
| ThistleWeb | which mono won't be able (legally) to implement | Jun 20 21:10 |
| ThistleWeb | or they will for a price | Jun 20 21:10 |
| ThistleWeb | so it becomes incompatible | Jun 20 21:10 |
| ThistleWeb | .net apps break in mono | Jun 20 21:10 |
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| _Hicham_ | Mr Icaza doesn't have a problem with that | Jun 20 21:10 |
| ThistleWeb | because these features are missing | Jun 20 21:10 |
| _Mutex_ | is MS doing to do this into the GPL'd code ThistleWeb ? | Jun 20 21:10 |
| yuhong | http://linux.slashdot.org/story/09/06/19/1937210/State-of-Sound-Development-On-Linux-Not-So-Sorry-After-All | Jun 20 21:10 |
| _Hicham_ | as long as he is paid | Jun 20 21:10 |
| ThistleWeb | they dont have to | Jun 20 21:11 |
| _Mutex_ | they do if they are going to modify Mono, its its GPL.. | Jun 20 21:11 |
| _Mutex_ | as you know | Jun 20 21:11 |
| yuhong | I heard that Vista sound sucks as well. | Jun 20 21:11 |
| ThistleWeb | if they make updates to .net which hook into Windows ONLY apis | Jun 20 21:11 |
| yuhong | So I wonder how Linux sound really compare to Vista sound. | Jun 20 21:11 |
| _Hicham_ | Vista also is using PulseAudio (j/k) | Jun 20 21:12 |
| yuhong | http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1275379&cid=28397627 | Jun 20 21:12 |
| ThistleWeb | for mono to follow, it makes the linux mono more incompatible because it cant implement those | Jun 20 21:12 |
| _Hicham_ | they implemented a lot of Windows only | Jun 20 21:12 |
| _Hicham_ | like libgdiplus | Jun 20 21:12 |
| _Mutex_ | ok whatever, dont use it because of something that MIGHT happen sometimes in the future, and dont use Linux Kernel for the same reason then :) | Jun 20 21:13 |
| ThistleWeb | if .net introduces more calls to proprietary Microsoft code, mono can;t follow without infringing on that IP | Jun 20 21:13 |
| _Mutex_ | its your choice, if your that paranoid | Jun 20 21:13 |
| schestowitz | /ignore _Mutex_ if you don't want to feed trolls | Jun 20 21:13 |
| _Mutex_ | LOL or answer simple questions | Jun 20 21:13 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: yeah I'm losing patience | Jun 20 21:13 |
| _Hicham_ | trolls are sometimes good schestowitz | Jun 20 21:13 |
| MinceR | i've lost patience. | Jun 20 21:13 |
| MinceR | _Hicham_: yes, trolls are good...to kickban. | Jun 20 21:14 |
| _Mutex_ | yes, they bring some logic into it, | Jun 20 21:14 |
| ThistleWeb | I've explained twice over and he;'s still unable to grasp it | Jun 20 21:14 |
| _Hicham_ | I am basically against kicking/banning people | Jun 20 21:14 |
| MinceR | he'll ask again and again and pretend nothing happened. | Jun 20 21:14 |
| _Mutex_ | but if you dont like to think about normal logical arguments, then go for it ignore away. | Jun 20 21:14 |
| _Hicham_ | I support freedom of speech | Jun 20 21:14 |
| MinceR | _Hicham_: i'm basically against letting trolls crapflood a channel into uselessness. | Jun 20 21:14 |
| _Mutex_ | I just ask until i get an answer, | Jun 20 21:14 |
| ThistleWeb | either willingly, or mentally unable to do so | Jun 20 21:14 |
| MinceR | _Hicham_: why don't you support the freedom of speech of nontrolls then? :> | Jun 20 21:15 |
| _Mutex_ | Usually MinceR with you, nothing has happend, | Jun 20 21:15 |
| _Hicham_ | MinceR : I support the freedom of speech of everyone | Jun 20 21:15 |
| _Mutex_ | so do I. | Jun 20 21:15 |
| _Hicham_ | vive Freedom | Jun 20 21:15 |
| _Mutex_ | its sad that some dont, but thats their problem | Jun 20 21:16 |
| _Mutex_ | I dont care about closed minds, I just dont want them to pollute me. | Jun 20 21:16 |
| ThistleWeb | one more time, in simple terms. If the feature you need to implement in a cross platform way is a proprietary Microsoft Windows-only api, how can you do this without infringing on their IP under the GPL? | Jun 20 21:16 |
| _Hicham_ | GPL doesn't allow linking to non GPL code | Jun 20 21:17 |
| _Mutex_ | you know thats question does not make any sense, read it a few times, your saying, "if something is proprietary, how can you do it under the GPL" that makes no sense. | Jun 20 21:18 |
| _Mutex_ | and the GPL does allow linking to non-GPL code. | Jun 20 21:18 |
| ThistleWeb | this is where Microsoft have you by the nuts | Jun 20 21:19 |
| ThistleWeb | they let you build, lead you by the nose then take the lead project places you can't go | Jun 20 21:19 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: trolls are not good | Jun 20 21:19 |
| ThistleWeb | making yours broken | Jun 20 21:19 |
| schestowitz | The discussion is better when it's not focused on distractyion | Jun 20 21:19 |
| ThistleWeb | embrace, extend, extinguish | Jun 20 21:19 |
| schestowitz | Just as in Daily Kos they don't discuss whether or not Bush sucks | Jun 20 21:19 |
| _Mutex_ | good catch phrase | Jun 20 21:19 |
| yuhong | http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1275379&cid=28397627 | Jun 20 21:20 |
| schestowitz | It's an consensus | Jun 20 21:20 |
| schestowitz | So they move on to important things. | Jun 20 21:20 |
| yuhong | I think you should read that slashdot comment. | Jun 20 21:20 |
| schestowitz | And right now we have two trolls here | Jun 20 21:20 |
| schestowitz | Ryan is out | Jun 20 21:20 |
| _Mutex_ | are you accusing me of being a troll, OK point me to where I have "trolled" | Jun 20 21:20 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: I don't need you to come to BN to extol the virtues of a criminal company | Jun 20 21:21 |
| schestowitz | Just as Daniel Eran doesn't require you | Jun 20 21:21 |
| _Mutex_ | its amazing you ask a simple question and because they cant give a normal and sensible answer your a "troll". | Jun 20 21:21 |
| schestowitz | He runs a Mac site | Jun 20 21:21 |
| schestowitz | Not for Microsoft marketers/fan to tilt his discussion | Jun 20 21:21 |
| schestowitz | Anyway, back to work... | Jun 20 21:21 |
| ThistleWeb | _Mutex_: we've explained it now 3 times and your STILL unable to grasp it | Jun 20 21:22 |
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| ThistleWeb | time to ignore methinks, you're not worth my time | Jun 20 21:22 |
| yuhong | Indeed, I just recently posted this comment | Jun 20 21:22 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/16/business-unethical-ms/comment-page-1/#comment-67213 | Jun 20 21:22 |
| _Hicham_ | wb Senor tacone | Jun 20 21:23 |
| _Hicham_ | I think I need a cooling pad | Jun 20 21:23 |
| schestowitz | Senor _Hicham_ , you're the aqcisition manager | Jun 20 21:23 |
| _Mutex_ | we'll im sorry, but the way you explain its is terrible, and your "argument" is not just weak but its non-existant, its not i "dont get it" there is nothing to get. but thats your opinion, so dont use it or whine about it | Jun 20 21:23 |
| schestowitz | Sniff around that NOVL thing, will ya? ;-) | Jun 20 21:23 |
| schestowitz | *acquisition | Jun 20 21:23 |
| yuhong | Where I said I agree with BN on MS being criminals. | Jun 20 21:23 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : for sure | Jun 20 21:23 |
| _Hicham_ | we will buy SUSE | Jun 20 21:24 |
| _Hicham_ | and clean it up from mono | Jun 20 21:24 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!n=IceChat7@58.165.174.* | Jun 20 21:24 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked _Mutex_ from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 21:24 | |
| MinceR | \o/ | Jun 20 21:24 |
| tacone | _Hicham_: that would be like buying whisky and cleaning it out from alchool | Jun 20 21:25 |
| yuhong | On slashdot, read this: | Jun 20 21:25 |
| yuhong | http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1275379&cid=28397627 | Jun 20 21:26 |
| tacone | the bottle will end up containing just 2 inches of brown rubbish | Jun 20 21:26 |
| *lusers (i=3aa5aea4@gateway/web/freenode/x-6c341fe56f6136e4) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:27 | |
| yuhong | After you read this link, compare these two pages again: | Jun 20 21:27 |
| MinceR | tacone: :D | Jun 20 21:27 |
| yuhong | http://meta.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=345907&cid=21186633 | Jun 20 21:27 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/2008/03/10/slashdot-tagging-tweak/ | Jun 20 21:27 |
| yuhong | I am trying to make a point about slashdot here. | Jun 20 21:28 |
| yuhong | Do you get the point now? | Jun 20 21:28 |
| lusers | Fucking stupid LUSERS, get scared shen someone asks even simple questions, But BIG bad ROY, has to kill free speech and protect his biased following so they cant answer even the most simple questions, against your precious hate talk, THE CULT OF ROY, the perpetual schoolie bludger. | Jun 20 21:29 |
| MinceR | yuhong: /. has been overrun by crApple and m$ fanboys/astroturfers. | Jun 20 21:29 |
| yuhong | I know, but have you read this: | Jun 20 21:30 |
| yuhong | http://meta.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=345907&cid=21186633 | Jun 20 21:30 |
| ThistleWeb | _Mutex_ we're not scared of answering simple questions, only annoyed at having answered them at least 3 times over, such a simpleton STILL can;t grasp it | Jun 20 21:30 |
| MinceR | ThistleWeb: he's been kickbanned already (thankfully) | Jun 20 21:31 |
| ThistleWeb | but congrats for showing your true colours, maybe all it needed was a push to get you to show them. It does explain whether it was willfull uncomprehnsion | Jun 20 21:31 |
| ThistleWeb | under the _Mutex_ name yes | Jun 20 21:32 |
| yuhong | I want you to read both links because I am trying to make a point here. | Jun 20 21:32 |
| lusers | you must be scared, or you would not of acted like a 2 fucking year old and had me kicked, | Jun 20 21:32 |
| yuhong | Notice the similarities and differences between the two pages. | Jun 20 21:32 |
| ThistleWeb | _Mutex_is lusers | Jun 20 21:32 |
| lusers | so much for free speech, what a joke right ROY. | Jun 20 21:33 |
| _Goblin | Scared of what? What have I missed? | Jun 20 21:33 |
| *_Hicham_ has quit ("Leaving.") | Jun 20 21:33 | |
| ThistleWeb | you missed someone willfulyy try not to grasp a simple concept despite being explained at least 3 times | Jun 20 21:33 |
| ThistleWeb | then get pissy | Jun 20 21:33 |
| ThistleWeb | get banned, and return under a new name | Jun 20 21:33 |
| yuhong | If you notice the similarities and differences, you will get my point. | Jun 20 21:34 |
| _Goblin | oh. Saw that 1000's of times by the MS faithful on other sites....I thought I'd missed something good. | Jun 20 21:34 |
| lusers | I read and responded to what you said,. I made it clear it did not make sense and anyone else reading that would agree, | Jun 20 21:34 |
| ThistleWeb | like I said, it answers the question of whether it's genuine uncomprehension of a concept or intentional trolling | Jun 20 21:34 |
| lusers | you cant mix proprietary and GPL, you know it and so do it | Jun 20 21:34 |
| _Goblin | I love a good troll. | Jun 20 21:34 |
| MinceR | ThistleWeb: you're right, i didn't notice it. | Jun 20 21:34 |
| lusers | but I was not allwed to discuss my point becase ROY did not agree with me, so he shut me down. | Jun 20 21:35 |
| MinceR | lusers: you don't have a point | Jun 20 21:35 |
| lusers | like the little boy not getting his way. | Jun 20 21:35 |
| MinceR | lusers: you're also evading a ban which is ban-worthy in most places. | Jun 20 21:35 |
| ThistleWeb | MinceR: yeah I spotted the obvious when he arrived, I was just waiting for the first comment to confirm it | Jun 20 21:35 |
| _Goblin | Lusers: You cant mix anti-matter and matter either....it overloads the warp engines. | Jun 20 21:35 |
| MinceR | ThistleWeb: well, he's confirmed it already | Jun 20 21:35 |
| MinceR | 225147 < lusers> but I was not allwed to discuss my point becase ROY did not agree with me, so he shut me down. | Jun 20 21:35 |
| *dlmarti (n=David@dsl092-055-171.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:35 | |
| yuhong | Do you get my point now? | Jun 20 21:36 |
| lusers | he asked a question asking how can you mix proprietary and GPL I say there were not the same, he did not o"get it" ROY kicked me like a spoilt boy. | Jun 20 21:36 |
| ThistleWeb | lusers we DID explain it, it's not out fault you're not menatlly equiped to be able to understand it | Jun 20 21:37 |
| lusers | ROY unblock me so I can use my client please, | Jun 20 21:37 |
| ThistleWeb | our* | Jun 20 21:37 |
| _Goblin | Im sure thats not right. I don't disagree with proprietary (and do mix) yet Roy has never kicked me. | Jun 20 21:37 |
| lusers | yes, but you probably dont ask hard questions he does not like | Jun 20 21:37 |
| _Goblin | of course....silly me. | Jun 20 21:37 |
| lusers | ROY why are you scared of fair and intelligent debate ?? | Jun 20 21:38 |
| schestowitz | I see it as disruption | Jun 20 21:38 |
| lusers | Why Do I scare you so ? | Jun 20 21:38 |
| schestowitz | Trolling is intended to do this | Jun 20 21:39 |
| ThistleWeb | intelligent? lmao do you assume you're in that category? | Jun 20 21:39 |
| _Goblin | agreed... | Jun 20 21:39 |
| schestowitz | To disrupt or annoy people | Jun 20 21:39 |
| schestowitz | In the wrong forum | Jun 20 21:39 |
| _Goblin | Roy....seems your'e popular this week.... | Jun 20 21:39 |
| lusers | Oh fair debabe on a subject is disruptive ok, sure | Jun 20 21:39 |
| schestowitz | If I go to MS forums to challenge them on their turf, then I troll | Jun 20 21:39 |
| lusers | Is it disruptive because you have trouble providing clear accurate responses to them ? | Jun 20 21:39 |
| ThistleWeb | methinks it's time to ignore _Mutex_ under each new name he arrives | Jun 20 21:40 |
| lusers | So to come here you have to be biased ??? | Jun 20 21:40 |
| schestowitz | lusers: good name | Jun 20 21:40 |
| schestowitz | lusers: you come from a site called linsux | Jun 20 21:40 |
| schestowitz | It's slef explanatory | Jun 20 21:40 |
| lusers | Never been to that site, | Jun 20 21:40 |
| schestowitz | You are a troublemaker | Jun 20 21:40 |
| schestowitz | It's draining people's time | Jun 20 21:40 |
| lusers | answer the question ROY do you HAVE to be biased to come here ? | Jun 20 21:41 |
| schestowitz | Bogging down the debate | Jun 20 21:41 |
| ThistleWeb | certainly a troublemaker in the last hour or so | Jun 20 21:41 |
| schestowitz | Go back to linusux please | Jun 20 21:41 |
| lusers | with rational questions,,, ok,, fair enough | Jun 20 21:41 |
| schestowitz | Go have fun in the small community whose focus is "why Linux sucks" | Jun 20 21:41 |
| lusers | I dont think linux sux, but I now know you do, | Jun 20 21:41 |
| lusers | why dont you like free speech ? | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | I do | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | Not when it's trolling | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | I never ban people | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | Unless they repeatedly troll | Jun 20 21:42 |
| yuhong | Yep, BN don't censor, but they do mark comments. | Jun 20 21:42 |
| lusers | you baned me, | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | In which case I know what purpose they have | Jun 20 21:42 |
| lusers | so you also lie ? | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: we no longer mark comments | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | We have a rating system for people to use | Jun 20 21:42 |
| schestowitz | Yes, you're banned | Jun 20 21:43 |
| schestowitz | You admitted trolling | Jun 20 21:43 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-6c341fe56f6136e4 | Jun 20 21:43 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked lusers from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 21:43 | |
| *ROYBOY (i=3aa5aea4@gateway/web/freenode/x-92c2c8f7876a7127) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:43 | |
| yuhong | BTW, I asked to compare the two pages above about slashdot. | Jun 20 21:43 |
| ThistleWeb | he's back | Jun 20 21:43 |
| ROYBOY | Its funny, you hate free speech so much roy | Jun 20 21:43 |
| ThistleWeb | wait for it | Jun 20 21:44 |
| ThistleWeb | there ya go | Jun 20 21:44 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: you asked like 6 times | Jun 20 21:44 |
| ROYBOY | at least its publicly loged for all to see | Jun 20 21:44 |
| ThistleWeb | yes, your trolling is | Jun 20 21:44 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-92c2c8f7876a7127 | Jun 20 21:44 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked ROYBOY from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 21:44 | |
| yuhong | Yep, and that was because I was trying to make a point about slashdot. | Jun 20 21:44 |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@41.249.48.44) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:44 | |
| schestowitz | I banned "Roy" :-) | Jun 20 21:44 |
| _Goblin | lol | Jun 20 21:44 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: all roys are troublemakers | Jun 20 21:44 |
| yuhong | Do you get my point about slashdot now. | Jun 20 21:44 |
| *toys (i=3aa5aea4@gateway/web/freenode/x-87d20bf39167a898) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:44 | |
| ThistleWeb | and again | Jun 20 21:45 |
| schestowitz | If he shows up with the nick "a football" it would be fun | Jun 20 21:45 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-87d20bf39167a898 | Jun 20 21:45 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked toys from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 21:45 | |
| schestowitz | See? | Jun 20 21:45 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : no banning plz | Jun 20 21:45 |
| schestowitz | That's why Feenode lies | Jun 20 21:45 |
| schestowitz | Mibbit was not the problem | Jun 20 21:45 |
| _Hicham_ | we need more freedom | Jun 20 21:45 |
| schestowitz | It's the same with their own service | Jun 20 21:45 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: I'd suggest waiting for the first comment, just to be sure it's him | Jun 20 21:45 |
| *pboard (i=3aa5aea4@gateway/web/freenode/x-13b4f648c741075a) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:45 | |
| ThistleWeb | no replies though | Jun 20 21:45 |
| yuhong | Yep, looking like they are trying to change nicknames. | Jun 20 21:45 |
| _Hicham_ | who have been kicked? | Jun 20 21:45 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-13b4f648c741075a | Jun 20 21:46 | |
| *schestowitz has kicked pboard from #boycottnovell (schestowitz) | Jun 20 21:46 | |
| desu | schestowitz: why not ban *!i=3aa5aea4@* ? | Jun 20 21:46 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: it's hex IP | Jun 20 21:46 |
| schestowitz | It's the same person | Jun 20 21:46 |
| ThistleWeb | k | Jun 20 21:46 |
| *schestowitz sets ban on *!i=3aa5aea4@* | Jun 20 21:46 | |
| yuhong | Looks like it is IRC abuse. | Jun 20 21:46 |
| _Hicham_ | great idea | Jun 20 21:47 |
| ThistleWeb | so if that hex IP is banned, he's now screwed | Jun 20 21:47 |
| schestowitz | 58.165.174.164 | Jun 20 21:47 |
| ThistleWeb | that right? | Jun 20 21:47 |
| desu | and you should probably remove the other IP-based mibbit bans, since there might be legitimate users on those IPs :/ (and since he has dynamic IP, most probably he isn't getting back those IPs for a while) | Jun 20 21:47 |
| yuhong | I am not exactly familiar with IRC, but yea it is abuse. | Jun 20 21:47 |
| ThistleWeb | I'm still new to IRC too, which is partly why I like xchat | Jun 20 21:47 |
| schestowitz | CPE-58-165-174-164.nsw.bigpond.net.au | Jun 20 21:47 |
| schestowitz | We have other trolls from bigpond | Jun 20 21:48 |
| schestowitz | Darryl | Jun 20 21:48 |
| schestowitz | Banned by LinuxToday | Jun 20 21:48 |
| schestowitz | ubertroll | Jun 20 21:48 |
| schestowitz | Abrasive, abusive | Jun 20 21:48 |
| yuhong | Anyway, what do you think after comparing the BN page I pointed out with the slashdot comment I pointed out. | Jun 20 21:49 |
| ThistleWeb | bet he's sitting at his PC fuming that he can't get back in to continue to disrupt us | Jun 20 21:50 |
| yuhong | On the matter of hex and other IP forms, IE once had a security vulerablity relating to this: | Jun 20 21:50 |
| yuhong | http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/Bulletin/MS98-016.mspx | Jun 20 21:50 |
| _Hicham_ | no one can disrupt this channel | Jun 20 21:50 |
| _Hicham_ | we are all with schestowitz | Jun 20 21:51 |
| _Hicham_ | vive schestowitz | Jun 20 21:51 |
| ThistleWeb | I work on a case by case basis | Jun 20 21:51 |
| yuhong | Anyway, now you have banned this trolling IP, now what do you think after comparing the BN page I pointed to with the slashdot comment I pointed to? | Jun 20 21:51 |
| *dlmarti has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Jun 20 21:52 | |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: I thought you'd be angry for blocking Ryan | Jun 20 21:52 |
| yuhong | There is a point I am trying to make here. | Jun 20 21:52 |
| schestowitz | BTW, I'm writing about your work on mononono at the moment | Jun 20 21:52 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: you're like a broken radio | Jun 20 21:52 |
| schestowitz | You've said this for a week | Jun 20 21:52 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I feel bad for DaemonRyan | Jun 20 21:52 |
| _Hicham_ | he is a sweet guy | Jun 20 21:52 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: so it's not just me then :P | Jun 20 21:53 |
| _Hicham_ | just needs some attention | Jun 20 21:53 |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!n=DaemonXP@*.hsd1.in.comcast.net | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| yuhong | Funny, but if you tell me what do you think after doing the comparison, then I will stop. | Jun 20 21:53 |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-13b4f648c741075a | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-87d20bf39167a898 | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-92c2c8f7876a7127 | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!*@*gateway/web/freenode/x-6c341fe56f6136e4 | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| *dlmarti (n=David@dsl092-055-171.phl1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| *schestowitz removes ban on *!*n=none@*.hsd1.in.comcast.net | Jun 20 21:53 | |
| ThistleWeb | let the encoding tourettes return to burst into conversations at random | Jun 20 21:54 |
| yuhong | There is a point I am trying to make, so tell me what do you think. | Jun 20 21:54 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: I've been planning to unban him. He acts better after penalty box. | Jun 20 21:54 |
| ThistleWeb | I just got annoyed with the random reports of encoding experiments, settings and results | Jun 20 21:55 |
| _Goblin | yuhong: Why not just make your point? | Jun 20 21:55 |
| yuhong | Well, notice that what the slashdot comment and the BN page is arguing is the same, but the reason is different. | Jun 20 21:56 |
| yuhong | And that is where my point is. | Jun 20 21:56 |
| _Goblin | right....thanks for that.... | Jun 20 21:57 |
| yuhong | So do you get my point now? | Jun 20 21:57 |
| _Goblin | If it will stop you repeating....yes. | Jun 20 21:57 |
| _Goblin | and may I add a jolly fine point it is too. | Jun 20 21:57 |
| _Hicham_ | the openSUSE Build Service is down | Jun 20 21:58 |
| ThistleWeb | you had a point? | Jun 20 21:58 |
| yuhong | Yes. | Jun 20 21:58 |
| ThistleWeb | lol | Jun 20 21:58 |
| _Goblin | Lol... | Jun 20 21:58 |
| yuhong | Sorry, I sometimes miss the answer. | Jun 20 21:58 |
| ThistleWeb | I'd say "do tell" in jest but it may not come over that way in chat | Jun 20 21:58 |
| _Goblin | please....youre points lovely....can you now move the subject on. | Jun 20 21:58 |
| yuhong | So I sometimes repeat without realizing there is already is a answer. | Jun 20 21:59 |
| _Goblin | ah. | Jun 20 21:59 |
| ThistleWeb | that's a cool chat up line "your points are lovely" | Jun 20 21:59 |
| _Goblin | lol | Jun 20 21:59 |
| _Goblin | never worked for me. | Jun 20 21:59 |
| yuhong | schestowitz: What do you think. | Jun 20 21:59 |
| ThistleWeb | depends on the girl I guess | Jun 20 22:00 |
| _Goblin | Im sure Roy is as impressed with your points as I am Yuhong.... | Jun 20 22:00 |
| ThistleWeb | if you give your points enough attention they may grow and become hard | Jun 20 22:01 |
| yuhong | Funny! | Jun 20 22:01 |
| _Goblin | ? | Jun 20 22:01 |
| MinceR | he might act better _after_ penalty box, but he acts best _during_ penalty box. | Jun 20 22:02 |
| ThistleWeb | damn, without some lovely points and a troll the conversation dies | Jun 20 22:06 |
| yuhong | Also read the parent article. | Jun 20 22:06 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: yes, many things are down | Jun 20 22:06 |
| yuhong | to the slashdot comment. | Jun 20 22:07 |
| schestowitz | Give me a moment and I'll show you why | Jun 20 22:07 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : ok | Jun 20 22:07 |
| yuhong | schestowitz: So, so far _Goblin get my point and calls it quite good, do you agree. | Jun 20 22:07 |
| schestowitz | _Goblin: I think yuhong is a PR agent | Jun 20 22:07 |
| schestowitz | Whether a paid of or one of the "useful idiots" | Jun 20 22:08 |
| schestowitz | I wrote about this before | Jun 20 22:08 |
| schestowitz | He does this in other MS-critical sites | Jun 20 22:08 |
| schestowitz | And he lives in Seattle | Jun 20 22:08 |
| yuhong | I don't post comments to roughly drafted anymore. | Jun 20 22:08 |
| schestowitz | Got banned? | Jun 20 22:08 |
| yuhong | And look at my recent comments. | Jun 20 22:09 |
| ThistleWeb | is that a sister campaign to "Got Milk"? | Jun 20 22:09 |
| _Goblin | Roy: What on earth for? | Jun 20 22:09 |
| _Goblin | a PR agent who "misses answers" | Jun 20 22:09 |
| _Goblin | Id suggest he gets retrained. | Jun 20 22:09 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: you avoided my question | Jun 20 22:09 |
| yuhong | I missed it, can you repeat it again? | Jun 20 22:10 |
| _Goblin | and appears to miss questions too. | Jun 20 22:10 |
| yuhong | I admit that I sometimes miss answers. | Jun 20 22:10 |
| yuhong | And sometimes that causes me to repeat. | Jun 20 22:10 |
| ThistleWeb | ahh, we need Microsoft to innovate and give us the scroll back feature | Jun 20 22:10 |
| yuhong | I was trying to make a point, and _Goblin now get it now. | Jun 20 22:11 |
| ThistleWeb | or perhaps a screen capable of showing more than a few lines of a conversation at once | Jun 20 22:11 |
| yuhong | And like it. | Jun 20 22:11 |
| yuhong | And yes I did repeat and probably missed answers. | Jun 20 22:11 |
| yuhong | I actually live in Shoreline, but that is nearby both Seattle and Redmond. | Jun 20 22:12 |
| _Goblin | I live near Luton Town FC. | Jun 20 22:13 |
| yuhong | It was a point I was trying to make about slashdot. | Jun 20 22:13 |
| _Goblin | why not make it on slashdot? | Jun 20 22:14 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: here: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/fedora-gratitude-suse/ | Jun 20 22:14 |
| schestowitz | About downtime and testing expert for mononono | Jun 20 22:15 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: you also missed questioned about connections to Microsoft | Jun 20 22:15 |
| schestowitz | And then vanished from the chat | Jun 20 22:15 |
| yuhong | Oops. | Jun 20 22:15 |
| schestowitz | That I just found too suspicious | Jun 20 22:15 |
| schestowitz | And I KNOW for a fact they employ shills | Jun 20 22:15 |
| yuhong | Sorry, I deny any connection to MS. | Jun 20 22:15 |
| schestowitz | Can you comment in RD? | Jun 20 22:16 |
| yuhong | I once did, but I don't do it anymore. | Jun 20 22:16 |
| schestowitz | Why not? | Jun 20 22:16 |
| schestowitz | Cause you got banned | Jun 20 22:16 |
| schestowitz | You AstroTurfed there | Jun 20 22:16 |
| schestowitz | Correct? | Jun 20 22:16 |
| yuhong | Well, I didn't even try to comment. | Jun 20 22:17 |
| yuhong | I don't read it everyday, you know. | Jun 20 22:17 |
| schestowitz | So "yes" | Jun 20 22:17 |
| schestowitz | You avoid the question | Jun 20 22:17 |
| ThistleWeb | you did, but dont anymore | Jun 20 22:17 |
| schestowitz | Daniel banned you | Jun 20 22:17 |
| schestowitz | I cam't blame him | Jun 20 22:17 |
| yuhong | So, how did you know this. | Jun 20 22:17 |
| schestowitz | Here you are slinking away when exposed: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/11/09/munchkins-suspicion/ | Jun 20 22:18 |
| ThistleWeb | sounds like a politicians response, answer a different question and hope it's not noticed | Jun 20 22:18 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: I am not stupid | Jun 20 22:18 |
| yuhong | No, I am not stupid as well. | Jun 20 22:18 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft does not compensate stupid people | Jun 20 22:18 |
| schestowitz | It makes it look bad | Jun 20 22:18 |
| yuhong | True, certainly. | Jun 20 22:18 |
| schestowitz | It has folks like you in USENET too | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | The cheap ones just curse and abuse | Jun 20 22:19 |
| yuhong | True, I know. | Jun 20 22:19 |
| yuhong | And Slashdot too. | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | Duhg | Jun 20 22:19 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: I dunno, Ballmer may be the exception to that policy due to his long term buddy-buddy relationship with Billy boy | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | Duh | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | Slashdot told me | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: it's a crime in the EU | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | Since June 2008 mIIRC | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | But Microsoft doesn't care about EU law | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | MS is savingTheWorld. | Jun 20 22:19 |
| ThistleWeb | they dont care about any law | Jun 20 22:19 |
| schestowitz | Too busy to neglect PE | Jun 20 22:20 |
| yuhong | I apologize. | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | *PR | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: who hires them in Seattle? | Jun 20 22:20 |
| yuhong | What is them? | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | I know a little | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: the ones MS uses for contracts | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | They don't hire directly | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | They have Edelman, W-E, etc. | Jun 20 22:20 |
| yuhong | I am not sure. | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | W-E is Bellvue-based | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | Washington | Jun 20 22:20 |
| yuhong | I hasn't investigated. | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | Laura et al | Jun 20 22:20 |
| schestowitz | But who is encouraging _you_ to do PR? | Jun 20 22:21 |
| schestowitz | And I don't know how rewards work | Jun 20 22:21 |
| schestowitz | Sometimes it's freebies | Jun 20 22:21 |
| yuhong | No one. | Jun 20 22:21 |
| schestowitz | Which make it harder to take action | Jun 20 22:21 |
| schestowitz | >> <yuhong> So, how did you know this. | Jun 20 22:21 |
| _Hicham_ | schestowitz : I tested the package on Fedora | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | C'mon | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | Tell us | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | We don't know real names here | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | You won't get in trouble or anything | Jun 20 22:22 |
| yuhong | What is this? | Jun 20 22:22 |
| ThistleWeb | asking "how" is an admission in itself | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | Waggener? | Jun 20 22:22 |
| yuhong | What are you referring to? | Jun 20 22:22 |
| schestowitz | They have like 800 staff to hire and all | Jun 20 22:22 |
| ThistleWeb | it's saying the accusation is true, but the focus has shifted to how you found out it was true | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | The ones who do this in Slashdot, Roughly Drafted, etc. | Jun 20 22:23 |
| yuhong | Well, I don't work at any of the shills. | Jun 20 22:23 |
| _Hicham_ | Well, my real name is known | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: so how do you know them? | Jun 20 22:23 |
| yuhong | I am a student in Shorewood, which uses Macs BTW. | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | Nope | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | You use Vista | Jun 20 22:23 |
| yuhong | True, but I later set up a dual-boot. | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | Which ->>Shorewood | Jun 20 22:23 |
| schestowitz | Not you | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | Games of semantics are for the mentally feeble | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | Many shills dual-boot | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | For credibility | Jun 20 22:24 |
| yuhong | Shorewood High School | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | "I use Linux, but.." | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | Oldest trick in the book | Jun 20 22:24 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong is working for microsoft for sure | Jun 20 22:24 |
| yuhong | I am sure there are. | Jun 20 22:24 |
| _Hicham_ | he is in Seattle | Jun 20 22:24 |
| _Hicham_ | come on | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: see the URL.. http://boycottnovell.com/2008/11/09/munchkins-suspicion/ | Jun 20 22:24 |
| schestowitz | I envy Daniel Eran | Jun 20 22:25 |
| schestowitz | He just bans them from commenting | Jun 20 22:25 |
| yuhong | Well, there are many other places to work at Seattle. | Jun 20 22:25 |
| _Hicham_ | all Seattle people love MS | Jun 20 22:25 |
| schestowitz | And here I am in BN taking libel and abuse | Jun 20 22:25 |
| yuhong | Really? | Jun 20 22:25 |
| _Hicham_ | yes | Jun 20 22:25 |
| schestowitz | From Windows users (in HTTP stamps) that claim to be Linux users | Jun 20 22:25 |
| schestowitz | Usiing names of distros | Jun 20 22:25 |
| _Hicham_ | Redmond is the best campus near Seattle | Jun 20 22:25 |
| _Hicham_ | no one can deny that | Jun 20 22:25 |
| ThistleWeb | schestowitz: won't agent switching in Firefox trick the stats? | Jun 20 22:25 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: how do you know about MS PR in Slashdot | Jun 20 22:26 |
| ThistleWeb | or are there other tells? | Jun 20 22:26 |
| schestowitz | Did you meet them? | Jun 20 22:26 |
| schestowitz | COlleagues? | Jun 20 22:26 |
| _Hicham_ | they meet them in person | Jun 20 22:26 |
| _Hicham_ | in Redmond | Jun 20 22:26 |
| yuhong | I don't comment on Roughly Drafted a lot, so I didn't know I got banned, and I wouldn't care. | Jun 20 22:26 |
| schestowitz | But you did | Jun 20 22:26 |
| schestowitz | There you are confirming it | Jun 20 22:26 |
| _Hicham_ | he even takes coffee with Ballmer | Jun 20 22:26 |
| schestowitz | Maybe his wife | Jun 20 22:27 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong is an intimate friend of Ballmer | Jun 20 22:27 |
| schestowitz | Ballmer's wife of the marketing one | Jun 20 22:27 |
| schestowitz | She's from Waggener | Jun 20 22:27 |
| schestowitz | Connie | Jun 20 22:27 |
| ThistleWeb | Commie? | Jun 20 22:27 |
| ThistleWeb | oh Connie | Jun 20 22:27 |
| schestowitz | Heh | Jun 20 22:27 |
| yuhong | That is BS, or are you not referring to me? | Jun 20 22:27 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong : everything is evident | Jun 20 22:27 |
| schestowitz | ThistleWeb: Ballmer wanted to call Windows after his wife | Jun 20 22:27 |
| ThistleWeb | lol | Jun 20 22:28 |
| schestowitz | But calling something Connie OS would spoil the Linux FUD | Jun 20 22:28 |
| yuhong | Are you really referring to me, or are you referring to another shill? | Jun 20 22:28 |
| schestowitz | She too bribes Obama | Jun 20 22:28 |
| schestowitz | She, her hunsband, Melinda, Bill and Brad (Smith) | Jun 20 22:28 |
| schestowitz | They bribes Oabama | Jun 20 22:28 |
| schestowitz | BillieG is already meeting with Obama in person | Jun 20 22:28 |
| ThistleWeb | it may have been a good idea, to keep the Windows name "reasonably" reputable before Vista sunk it in recent memory | Jun 20 22:28 |
| yuhong | I know. | Jun 20 22:28 |
| _Hicham_ | Obama said that he is with Iran's Protests | Jun 20 22:29 |
| _Hicham_ | fuck those protests | Jun 20 22:29 |
| _Hicham_ | they are maid by the fucking US administration | Jun 20 22:29 |
| _Hicham_ | as always | Jun 20 22:29 |
| yuhong | I am not Connie, BTW. | Jun 20 22:29 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: cause the president doesn't pray to the west (Bush) | Jun 20 22:29 |
| tacone | yuhong: people on this channel are pretty much defensive. They have been trolled many times. | Jun 20 22:29 |
| yuhong | I know. | Jun 20 22:29 |
| _Hicham_ | Ahmadi Najad is one of the best president I have ever seen | Jun 20 22:30 |
| schestowitz | 55 years ago they overthrew a guy | Jun 20 22:30 |
| _Hicham_ | I am sad that we had frozen our diplomatic relationships | Jun 20 22:30 |
| yuhong | Now, do you think I am a shill now? | Jun 20 22:30 |
| ThistleWeb | _Hicham_: you dont get out much do you? | Jun 20 22:30 |
| schestowitz | Replaces democracy with oil supplying puppet | Jun 20 22:30 |
| schestowitz | From what I can gather | Jun 20 22:30 |
| _Hicham_ | ThistleWeb : I do | Jun 20 22:30 |
| _Hicham_ | and a lot | Jun 20 22:30 |
| _Hicham_ | just happens I am working on sthg | Jun 20 22:31 |
| _Hicham_ | and I like to come here and talk to schestowitz | Jun 20 22:31 |
| ThistleWeb | twas the "best pres" comment I was refering to | Jun 20 22:31 |
| schestowitz | Basis for comparison is limited | Jun 20 22:31 |
| ThistleWeb | he's a joke | Jun 20 22:31 |
| schestowitz | Maybe better than Bush | Jun 20 22:31 |
| schestowitz | That's an easy one to beat | Jun 20 22:31 |
| yuhong | BTW, I liked hearing what other's opinions about me being a shill is. | Jun 20 22:31 |
| schestowitz | One threatens to attack | Jun 20 22:31 |
| schestowitz | Another attacks without cause | Jun 20 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Pretexts instead | Jun 20 22:32 |
| ThistleWeb | plenty of world leaders who dont bow to the US | Jun 20 22:32 |
| schestowitz | In the far east | Jun 20 22:32 |
| ThistleWeb | plenty do so with dignity, and look after their own countries concerns | Jun 20 22:32 |
| schestowitz | I think they already brought all opposition to their knees | Jun 20 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Or grave | Jun 20 22:32 |
| yuhong | Now, back to my topic about slashdot, do you agree with _Goblin? | Jun 20 22:33 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong : are u good at Win32 programming? | Jun 20 22:33 |
| yuhong | Yes, and I am reading about Unix programming. | Jun 20 22:34 |
| yuhong | I am famlier with a little about Unix command-line programming. | Jun 20 22:34 |
| yuhong | But absolutely nothing about Qt or GTK. | Jun 20 22:34 |
| yuhong | programming | Jun 20 22:35 |
| _Hicham_ | nothing about Qt or GTK? | Jun 20 22:35 |
| yuhong | Yes. | Jun 20 22:35 |
| _Hicham_ | there are simpler than Win32 API | Jun 20 22:35 |
| _Hicham_ | a lot more simple | Jun 20 22:35 |
| _Hicham_ | did u work with MFC? | Jun 20 22:35 |
| yuhong | No, not really, though I have read about it. | Jun 20 22:35 |
| yuhong | Anyway, I like hearing Goblin and Hicham's opinions on me, and I apologize. | Jun 20 22:37 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong, we have all used Windows more or less | Jun 20 22:38 |
| _Hicham_ | but, what is bad, is when u start defending Microsoft | Jun 20 22:38 |
| yuhong | I am a student at Shorewood High School, but I liked hearing other's opinions on me. | Jun 20 22:39 |
| _Hicham_ | I understand the fact that u live near Microsoft's Campus | Jun 20 22:39 |
| yuhong | Yes, which is why material on BN on visiting MS was interesting. | Jun 20 22:40 |
| yuhong | Shoreline is the correct city. | Jun 20 22:40 |
| yuhong | BTW. | Jun 20 22:40 |
| yuhong | So what is your opinion after comparing the slashdot comment and BN article I pointed out. | Jun 20 22:41 |
| _Hicham_ | that u r still in love with MS | Jun 20 22:42 |
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| _Hicham_ | maybe u are planning to apply for a job there | Jun 20 22:42 |
| yuhong | I don't love their tactics/ | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | That's the resverse bribe | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Suck up to MS | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Then expect a job | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Many do this | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | It's a classic bribe | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Either with a job or consulting | Jun 20 22:42 |
| yuhong | Thanks. | Jun 20 22:42 |
| schestowitz | For examples, see Peter Okelly and Petter Galli | Jun 20 22:43 |
| schestowitz | The former attacked ODF, then got a job at MS | Jun 20 22:43 |
| schestowitz | Peter Galli attacks ODF in the press | Jun 20 22:43 |
| schestowitz | Not he's in MS' anti-Linux team | Jun 20 22:43 |
| yuhong | Also it was interesting to read about MS's PR tactics. | Jun 20 22:43 |
| schestowitz | It's reserve because you first shill and later get the rewards | Jun 20 22:43 |
| yuhong | I don't love their tactics. | Jun 20 22:43 |
| schestowitz | Rather than the other way around | Jun 20 22:43 |
| _Hicham_ | yuhong : why is the handle to a previous instance of a window still kept in modern WinMain function? | Jun 20 22:44 |
| yuhong | It is from 16-bit Windows, and is now NULL> | Jun 20 22:44 |
| _Hicham_ | why keep still as an argument? | Jun 20 22:45 |
| yuhong | Backward compatiblity. | Jun 20 22:45 |
| _Hicham_ | with what? | Jun 20 22:45 |
| yuhong | 16-bit Windows. | Jun 20 22:45 |
| ugufjhfj_ | HINSTANCE ! | Jun 20 22:45 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/microsoft-astroturf-te-twitter/#comments | Jun 20 22:45 |
| yuhong | Sorry, wrong one. | Jun 20 22:46 |
| yuhong | http://blogs.msdn.com/oldnewthing/archive/2004/06/15/156022.aspx | Jun 20 22:46 |
| yuhong | I don't attack Linux, BTW. | Jun 20 22:46 |
| yuhong | ODF is much better than OOXML. | Jun 20 22:47 |
| _Hicham_ | as always hack to get around real problems | Jun 20 22:49 |
| _Hicham_ | like the whole windows source code | Jun 20 22:49 |
| _Hicham_ | did u download the partial windows source code on piratebay? | Jun 20 22:49 |
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| yuhong | No. | Jun 20 22:51 |
| tacone | no surprise that source contains as much swearing as linux kernel itself. | Jun 20 22:51 |
| yuhong | Now, there is some other topics I want to discuss. | Jun 20 22:52 |
| yuhong | "[J]ust about every PR firm offers to help “manage the perception of your company in online communities” these days. What do you think that means? Astroturfing Slashdot, Youtube, etc." | Jun 20 22:53 |
| yuhong | http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/07/novellvideo-youtube-suspicion/ | Jun 20 22:53 |
| yuhong | That shows a fundemental flaw in PR. | Jun 20 22:54 |
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| yuhong | That preception can be manuplated independently of the ruth. | Jun 20 22:56 |
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| schestowitz | The AstroTurfer now leaves this same comment here: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/20/microsoft-astroturf-te-twitter/#comments | Jun 20 23:00 |
| schestowitz | I'm not sure what do about all these PR agents | Jun 20 23:00 |
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| yuhong | Now that the comparison thing is over, here is another comment from slashdot. | Jun 20 23:05 |
| yuhong | http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1275379&cid=28397627 | Jun 20 23:05 |
| yuhong | Relating to the same point I made. | Jun 20 23:06 |
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| ugufjhfj | http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/execmail/2004/10-27platformvalue.mspx | Jun 20 23:34 |
| ugufjhfj | I think it's fair to say that no other software platform has invested as much in security R&D, process improvements and customer education as we have at Microsoft. | Jun 20 23:36 |
| ugufjhfj | this part is not needed with linux | Jun 20 23:38 |
| ThistleWeb | it's not how much you spend, it's the results you get for that money | Jun 20 23:39 |
| ThistleWeb | they poured a fortune down the drain trying to break Google on search / advertising and gotten nowhere | Jun 20 23:40 |
| ugufjhfj | and this : | Jun 20 23:41 |
| ugufjhfj | According to Forrester, Microsoft had the lowest elapsed time between disclosure of a vulnerability and the release of a fix. They found that Microsoft addressed all of the 128 publicly disclosed security flaws in Windows over the 12-month period studied, and that its security updates predated major outbreaks by an average of 305 days. | Jun 20 23:41 |
| ThistleWeb | Forrester huh? That should tell it's own story | Jun 20 23:43 |
| ugufjhfj | schestowitz, what you think about forrester ? | Jun 20 23:43 |
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| schestowitz | He | Jun 20 23:47 |
| schestowitz | Forrester attacked Linux] | Jun 20 23:47 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft paid them | Jun 20 23:47 |
| schestowitz | And recently they attacked FOSS | Jun 20 23:47 |
| schestowitz | Like 2 weeks ago.. and Apple too | Jun 20 23:47 |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: most of those big analysts are crooks | Jun 20 23:48 |
| schestowitz | They know they are 'cooks' | Jun 20 23:48 |
| schestowitz | But it pays their wages | Jun 20 23:48 |
| ugufjhfj | forrester a MS subsidiary | Jun 20 23:49 |
| schestowitz | "It supports all 32-bit and 64-bit distributions of Linux-family operating systems, including Red Hat, Fedora, SUSE, openSUSE, Debian GNU, and Ubuntu. Another enhancement on the previous versions is the added support of Novell Open Enterprise Server 2 and Novell NSS, making it easier for Novell NetWare users to migrate to the new operating system." | Jun 20 23:49 |
| schestowitz | http://www.crn.in/Security-019Jun009-Kaspersky-Starts-Beta-Testing-of-Antivirus-6-for-Linux-File-Server.aspx | Jun 20 23:49 |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: is it? | Jun 20 23:49 |
| schestowitz | Linux needs AV... well, if it runs networks that have Windows now it has the task of scanning for /Windows/ viruses | Jun 20 23:50 |
| schestowitz | ugufjhfj: in a sane world, some of these 'analysts' would be reported to the FTC and shut down | Jun 20 23:50 |
| schestowitz | Next: lobbyists | Jun 20 23:50 |
| schestowitz | Then PR people | Jun 20 23:50 |
| schestowitz | Then the world would have more hope for justice. PR people also sell bad drugs and wars | Jun 20 23:51 |
| schestowitz | It's a trillion-dollar (annually) industry | Jun 20 23:51 |
| ugufjhfj | schestowitz, have you ever read this http://www.microsoft.com/mscorp/execmail/2004/10-27platformvalue.mspx ? | Jun 20 23:53 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft pays Forrester in 2005 to attack Linux | Jun 20 23:58 |
| schestowitz | *Paid | Jun 20 23:58 |
| schestowitz | Or maybe it's the same one | Jun 20 23:58 |
| schestowitz | "By Steve Ballmer, CEO, Microsoft Corporation" | Jun 20 23:59 |
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| schestowitz | "Total Cost of Ownership" | Jun 20 23:59 |
| schestowitz | That's MS' term | Jun 20 23:59 |
| schestowitz | They and Gartner came up with it | Jun 20 23:59 |
| schestowitz | To attack Linux | Jun 20 23:59 |
| schestowitz | A measure of deception | Jun 20 23:59 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is, as always, a marketing/PR company | Jun 20 23:59 |
| _Hicham_ | Total cost of ownernship of Windows is infinite | Jun 20 23:59 |
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