IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: July 28th, 2009

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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: AT&T apologises for unblocking 4chan http://notnews.today.com/?p=573 #4chan #attJul 28 00:08
EDavidBurgApologizes for unblocking it, or blocking it in the first place?Jul 28 00:08
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schestowitzgnJul 28 00:11
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fewaGot Solar Panels? Utility Wants To Charge You For Not Using Their Energy http://consumerist.com/5323004/got-solar-panels-utility-wants-to-charge-you-for-not-using-their-energyJul 28 00:26
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EDavidBurgso what's the general consensus here on MS Linux code submission?Jul 28 00:39
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tessier__EDavidBurg: It's GPL so not much can go wrong with the code in particular but it's clearly an effort to get everyone onto hyper-v which only runs with Windows management.Jul 28 00:40
fewabut APIs that do what they want are already in the kernelJul 28 00:47
fewathere is no reason to clutter the kernelJul 28 00:47
EDavidBurgWell, they might be able to make it work better and faster because they have access to the code that they're making it integrate with and can consult with the authors and documentors of said code.Jul 28 00:50
twitterThey got busted with a GPL violation and it took them 2 years to comply.Jul 28 00:50
EDavidBurgBut, I'm not very familiar with what they're codingJul 28 00:51
twitterI no more want to run GNU/Linux on to of a M$ VM than I want to run Windows.Jul 28 00:51
twitterSo, thanks but no thanks for the modules.Jul 28 00:51
EDavidBurgThey were more aimed at people using windows servers already but who wanted to use features only found on linux. So, to keep them from switching to native linux, MS is making linux work better with their systemJul 28 00:53
EDavidBurg90% of software for me is "thanks but no thanks", as I don't need it.Jul 28 00:54
twitterCome to dinner, said the spider to the fly.Jul 28 00:54
EDavidBurgSpiders can trap flies. Isn't the point of the GPL that no one can trap linux?Jul 28 00:55
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twitterSee ACPI for previous abuse.Jul 28 00:55
twitterhttp://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/183403Jul 28 00:56
fewathread here http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.kernel/867190Jul 28 00:57
balzacI'll have to write a stinging rebuttal to Linus Torvalds againJul 28 01:03
balzac"I think the Microsoft hatred is a disease." Linus TorvaldsJul 28 01:03
balzacThere are ?extremists? in the free software world, but that?s one major reason why I don?t call what I do ?free software? any more. I don?t want to be associated with the people for whom it?s about exclusion and hatred.?Jul 28 01:04
balzacLinus TorvaldsJul 28 01:04
EDavidBurgThought that one might rile you guys upJul 28 01:04
balzacHe keeps using language like "hatred"Jul 28 01:04
balzacand "extremists"Jul 28 01:04
balzacWhere on GNU.org or FSF.org does it say "We hate Microsoft"?Jul 28 01:04
balzacRichard Stallman is not a haterJul 28 01:05
balzacbut Linus Torvalds often denigrates and disparages his elder, the venerable Richard StallmanJul 28 01:05
balzacIs it because Linus Torvalds is trying to marginalize Richard Stallman out of an impulse of greed?Jul 28 01:05
balzacWhy is he always attacking the reputation, misrepresenting Richard Stallman and the purpose of the FSF?Jul 28 01:06
balzacIt's probably disingenuous and profit-motivated.Jul 28 01:06
balzacEDavidBurg: as you can see, I'm not "riled up", but I'm committed to the defense of the Free Software brand and the stated purpose of the GNU GPL Preamble.Jul 28 01:07
balzacPublic misrepresentation must be challenged.Jul 28 01:07
balzacThe stakes are too high to allow the venerable GNU project to be used as a punching bag or a whipping boy for greedy corporate types.Jul 28 01:08
EDavidBurgWhat he's saying is, that some people take this stuff too seriously and have lost their focusJul 28 01:08
balzacWell, I've confronted such a person here directly.Jul 28 01:09
EDavidBurgThey're out there "fighting the good fight" and focusing on "the bad guys" instead of just making and using good software, and being content with that.Jul 28 01:09
balzacBut people like that don't represent BoycottNovell, nor do they represent the FSF.Jul 28 01:09
balzacEDavidBurg: it's not about good software.Jul 28 01:09
balzachave you ever visited fsf.org ?Jul 28 01:09
EDavidBurgbalzac: I'm glad you can admit thatJul 28 01:09
balzacyeeshJul 28 01:09
balzacit's about something much more important.Jul 28 01:10
EDavidBurgWho wants good software when there's a crusade to fight?Jul 28 01:10
balzacfreedomJul 28 01:10
balzacnot a crusade.Jul 28 01:10
balzacit's defense of what already belongs to us.Jul 28 01:10
balzaccontrol of our own computers.Jul 28 01:10
balzacit's sharing with others the freedom they never even knew they could have, because of companies like Microsoft.Jul 28 01:11
balzacThe resistance to Microsoft is noble.Jul 28 01:11
balzacand it is not hatred.Jul 28 01:11
EDavidBurg...Jul 28 01:11
EDavidBurgDo you know how many times I've heard someone say they hate MS?Jul 28 01:11
balzacI don't care.Jul 28 01:12
EDavidBurgand defame windows and anything else associated with them?Jul 28 01:12
balzacWindows is inferior software.Jul 28 01:12
EDavidBurgI thought it wasn't about good or bad software.Jul 28 01:12
balzacbut windows advocates prefer to focus on the emotion, not what matters.Jul 28 01:12
balzacit's not the main thingJul 28 01:12
balzacbut man have I been having a better time since I quit using windows.Jul 28 01:13
balzacno more flakey OS for me.Jul 28 01:13
EDavidBurgThat's all good and dandy; so have I. But there's no need to go to the lengths that many free software advocates have.Jul 28 01:13
balzacRMS is the one who makes the official rhetoric of the Free Software FoundationJul 28 01:14
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balzacWe will not have our reputation smeared by sock-puppetsJul 28 01:14
balzacThis conversation is reminding me I better watch this intern who may be at the office tomorrow.Jul 28 01:16
balzacHe's indoctrinated.Jul 28 01:16
EDavidBurgWe wouldn't want him thinking bad thoughts, would we?Jul 28 01:16
EDavidBurgNot in this fight for freedom...Jul 28 01:16
balzacIf he can't comprehend the value of computer user's autonomy and the reason for the strong software communities and user's groups, I won't waste my time.Jul 28 01:16
EDavidBurgNo, that would be a grave error indeed!Jul 28 01:16
balzacNo, but I won't have my business undermined by a Microsoftie.Jul 28 01:17
EDavidBurgUndermined? How?Jul 28 01:17
balzacIt would be a grave error to trust someone who is already ideologically indoctrinated against software freedom.Jul 28 01:17
balzacThere are many ways this intern could become a problem for me down the road.Jul 28 01:18
balzacInterfering with other sub-contractors, for example.Jul 28 01:18
EDavidBurgWhat work are you doing, and in what ways would his ideological differences in regards to free software undermine your work?Jul 28 01:18
balzacI insist each person who will be employed by me does not use Windows as their primary OS.Jul 28 01:18
balzacIn every way.Jul 28 01:18
balzacFurthermore, I prefer GNU-licensed software.Jul 28 01:19
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balzacIf an employee doesn't understand the value of the stated purpose of the GNU licenses, they're either dense, stubborn, indoctrinated, but definitely not employable.Jul 28 01:19
EDavidBurgbalzac: what type of work are you doing?Jul 28 01:20
balzacDevelompent and consulting.Jul 28 01:20
EDavidBurgSo, let me get this straight: Because someone does not agree with your stated opinion on free software, they must be dense and unemployable?Jul 28 01:22
EDavidBurgAnd they're the one who is indoctrinated?Jul 28 01:22
balzacNo, you didn't get it straight. You got it twisted.Jul 28 01:22
balzacComputer user's freedom and autonomy - it matters. If you want security, you cannot use windows.Jul 28 01:23
balzacIf an empoyee refuses to understand the basics of security, autonomy, and freedom to operate their computer as they wish, they can't work for me.Jul 28 01:24
balzacIt's really basic.Jul 28 01:24
balzacPeople have to be indoctrinated to give up control to other administrators and programmersJul 28 01:25
EDavidBurgYou say "understand the basics of" but what you seem to mean is "agree with my opinions on"Jul 28 01:25
balzacpeople have to lose their indoctrination to see things as they are, and to retain their full rights as computer users.Jul 28 01:25
EDavidBurgYou're starting with the premise that you are correct, and that all other opinions must come from those who are not as enlightened as youJul 28 01:25
balzacWrong. That's not my premise.Jul 28 01:26
EDavidBurgYou believe you are not indoctrinated?Jul 28 01:26
EDavidBurgYou're refusing employment to those who disagree with a license. A document. A doctrine, if you will.Jul 28 01:26
balzacIt's an objective fact that I'm correct in my understanding.Jul 28 01:26
EDavidBurgIf that's not indoctrination, I don't know what is.Jul 28 01:26
balzacI won't. It's not a doctrine. It's a license.Jul 28 01:27
balzacIt's very directly effective on how software published under the license will affect users and programmers.Jul 28 01:27
balzacYou don't know what indoctrination is.Jul 28 01:28
EDavidBurgIt's a license whose preamble sets out the FSF's ideological stance on free software.Jul 28 01:28
balzacThank goodness it does.Jul 28 01:28
EDavidBurgIs that not a doctrine?Jul 28 01:28
balzacWhen every other license either attacks your freedom or remains indifferent to it.Jul 28 01:28
EDavidBurgA doctrine is a codified ideological stance...Jul 28 01:29
balzacindifference is not bad, and not always good.Jul 28 01:29
balzacI'm not here to mince words and argue about interpretations of words.Jul 28 01:29
balzacI will not employ someone who will undermine my business.Jul 28 01:29
twitterI have some idea of that, Windows and M$ defame themselves-> EDavidBurg: and defame windows and anything else associated with them?Jul 28 01:29
balzacAnd I'll look at them with a keen and skeptical eye.Jul 28 01:29
twitterhttp://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/182053Jul 28 01:29
balzacAnd I'll send this intern away so he won't waste my time if he can't comprehend such a simple thing on the first day.Jul 28 01:30
twitterbut really, I'm not interested in being "riled up" by some kind of M$ trollJul 28 01:30
EDavidBurgbalzac: you know, when people do that in the government, it's called corruptionJul 28 01:30
balzacwhat?Jul 28 01:30
twitter*** twitter ignores EDavidBurg troll.Jul 28 01:30
EDavidBurgtwitter: when have I said anything positive about MS?Jul 28 01:30
EDavidBurgtwitter: In fact I explicitly stated that I do not use it.Jul 28 01:31
balzacyou're saying a small business owner doesn't have the right to choose who to employ?Jul 28 01:31
balzacYou think I'm legally obligated to hire a person who would sell me out?Jul 28 01:31
balzacSounds like Microsoft logic.Jul 28 01:31
EDavidBurgbalzac: I'm not saying that. I'm saying you need to lighten up.Jul 28 01:31
balzacNo dude, I already have a light-hearted attitude towards Microsoft.Jul 28 01:32
balzacJust not on the success of my business.Jul 28 01:32
balzacI must succeed.Jul 28 01:32
EDavidBurgWe haven't been talking about microsoft for a while.Jul 28 01:32
balzacI laugh at Steve Ballmer's antics, I read Bill Gates latest article without resentment.Jul 28 01:32
balzacBut I resist.Jul 28 01:32
balzacIt's because I don't hate Microsoft, nor do I hate Microsoft employees.Jul 28 01:33
balzacI don't hate my friend's dad.Jul 28 01:33
balzacI don't hate myself for having used it for years.Jul 28 01:33
balzacI never hated microsoft, but I've been frustrated and deprived of my freedom as a computer user by Microsoft's archaic licenses.Jul 28 01:34
balzacSo I don't appreciate Linus Torvald's smear of the Free Software community.Jul 28 01:34
EDavidBurgHe wasn't maligning the free software community, he was saying that there are people who get way too worked up about it and hate microsoftJul 28 01:36
EDavidBurgA lot of those people gravitate towards the FSF because some of their beliefs overlapJul 28 01:36
EDavidBurgHe never said "The FSF is a bunch of MS hating, mouth breathing extremists"Jul 28 01:37
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cubezzzI never use windows for personal use, it's just not goodJul 28 01:54
cubezzzI have logical non-emotional reasons for not using itJul 28 01:54
twitterThere are logical, non emotional reasons free software is better than Windows.Jul 28 01:55
twitterand many, many reasons to never trust M$Jul 28 01:56
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EDavidBurgI have a logical, non emotional reason for not using it, too. 1) I don't like it as much as alternatives 2) It doesn't do what I wantJul 28 01:58
balzacEDavidBurg: he was maligning the free software community. He mentioned "Free Software" by name.Jul 28 01:58
cubezzzwell, for me, it just borks up too much :)Jul 28 01:58
cubezzzI enjoy programming, FOSS is just way more appealing to meJul 28 01:59
balzacWhenever the Free Software brand is attacked by a proponent of the Open Source brand, I'm comfortable retaliating just to preserve our brand recognition.Jul 28 01:59
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balzacOpen Source is a pale imitation of the original Free Software.Jul 28 02:00
tessier__FOSS lets you share and show off with your friends. I've never been able to share anything I coded for a job. :(Jul 28 02:00
tessier__FOSS lets me actually show off some code at interviews too.Jul 28 02:00
balzac[[F]] -OSSJul 28 02:00
cubezzzyeah, it can give you some street cred :)Jul 28 02:00
balzacI'm going to stop speaking of "open source" in a favorable light.Jul 28 02:00
tessier__We need a hot chick with big tits who knows how to cut through the pedantic bullshit to show people the benefits of Freedmo.Jul 28 02:01
tessier__FreedomJul 28 02:01
tessier__RMS and balaz just aren't cutting it. :(Jul 28 02:01
tessier__balzacJul 28 02:01
balzacyeah, the FSF needs booth babesJul 28 02:01
tessier__This keyboard is weird.Jul 28 02:01
cubezzzit's really the OEM'sJul 28 02:01
cubezzzand the storesJul 28 02:01
balzactessier__: I'm doing a fine job and RMS is too. But I'm an enforcer, not an enticer.Jul 28 02:01
tessier__Being stinky, ugly, and annoying do not make for good salespeople.Jul 28 02:01
cubezzzwhat do you get at the store, you get windows 99.9% of the timeJul 28 02:01
twitteroperator error - > tessier__: This keyboard is weird.Jul 28 02:02
EDavidBurgbalzac: notice the caps. Free Software is the FSF. "free software" is the movement at large.Jul 28 02:02
balzacBooth babes would be a good addition, but they can't replace someone who retaliates against attacks on the brand.Jul 28 02:02
tessier__balzac: You are a gadfly, nothing more.Jul 28 02:02
balzacYou can't replace Roy schestowitz with a booth babe.Jul 28 02:02
balzactessier__: who the fuck are you?Jul 28 02:02
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twitterBill Gates seems to have done well -> tessier__: Being stinky, ugly, and annoying do not make for good salespeople.Jul 28 02:02
balzacI'm not doing sales, I'm doing retaliation. Those are two different modes.Jul 28 02:03
tessier__twitter: No, he is not a salesman. He has huge teams of hot sales and marketing people to spread his message.Jul 28 02:03
cubezzzpeople are waking up, I've converted many win boxes to Linux this year. it seems to be gaining momentumJul 28 02:03
balzactessier__: who are you?Jul 28 02:03
balzaccalling me a gadfly?Jul 28 02:03
tessier__balzac: You know or can easily find out who I am. It's not like I hide it.Jul 28 02:03
balzacI'm Paul GaskinJul 28 02:03
tessier__I am Tracy Reed.Jul 28 02:03
balzacMy website is: http://www.disruptech.comJul 28 02:03
tessier__http://tracyreed.orgJul 28 02:03
balzacI'm an IT professionalJul 28 02:03
tessier__So now you know who is calling you a gadfly.Jul 28 02:03
twitteryou are full of shit tessier___Jul 28 02:04
tessier__Professionals generally don't go around making enemies of the people you want to convert to your side.Jul 28 02:04
tessier__twitter: eh?Jul 28 02:04
twitterI don't think Tracy Reed is rude like you are being.Jul 28 02:04
tessier__I've never been anything but sweet talked by any MS person I have met in person.Jul 28 02:04
balzactessier__: I want to bring people to my side, or failing that, marginalize them.Jul 28 02:05
tessier__twitter: How have I been rude?Jul 28 02:05
balzacbig deal.Jul 28 02:05
twitter*** twitter ignores fake tessierJul 28 02:05
tessier__hehJul 28 02:05
twitterhttp://www.rotten.com/library/bio/business/bill-gates/Jul 28 02:05
tessier__I'm identified to this nick. I'm pretty sure I'm not a fake tessier.Jul 28 02:05
balzactessier__: you praise Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman on your website.Jul 28 02:06
balzacYou seem reasonable, but not entirely accurate in your account of things.Jul 28 02:06
twitter->   The photo [mug shot] also unintentionally captures classic Gates: completely wrecked hair, terrible looking clothes, generally slovenly appearance, and two glazed eyes staring out past thick glasses. This image changed very little over the bulk of Gates' career, with the shower taps running at much less frequency than the money taps. It should also be noted that this isn't some heaping of sour grapes from the gutter staring upJul 28 02:06
balzac"Linus Torvalds wrote the Linux kernel but Richard M Stallman made it Free."Jul 28 02:07
twitterStinky, ewwww.Jul 28 02:07
balzacWell, actually RMS made the license first. Linus Torvalds chose the license. The license facilitated a developer community. Linus wrote about 2% of the kernel code.Jul 28 02:07
balzacSo you exaggerate Linus Torvald's work relative to RMS' workJul 28 02:08
balzacand you call GNU/Linux just "Linux"Jul 28 02:08
cubezzzcompiler was pretty importantJul 28 02:08
balzacYou're not egregious as some people who completely and deliberately ignore RMS, but you still don't give him full credit.Jul 28 02:08
balzacI'm glad you emphasize freedom.Jul 28 02:09
balzacBut slightly disappointed you think I'm a "gadfly".Jul 28 02:09
balzacI suppose it's because I criticize Linus Torvalds who maligns the Free Software community by using words like "extremist" and "hateful" to describe it.Jul 28 02:10
tessier__balzac: You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. It's cliche but it's true.Jul 28 02:11
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tessier__I don't agree with Linux that the FSF is extremist or hateful.Jul 28 02:12
tessier__I wish he would align himself more with FSF.Jul 28 02:12
twitterATT is full of shit about DDoS attacks or caring.  Every US ISP is a major source of spam and DDoS because so many people use M$ Windows.Jul 28 02:15
twitterOS News has been trolly lately. ->(01:49:43 PM) schestowitz: Here's the type of stuff that had me dump OS News.Jul 28 02:16
twitterha, non free software fail.  Windows won't fix that problem. -> goblin_: reason for fail:  Almost immediately I had to get my hands dirty with the command line to get the NVidia drivers working.Jul 28 02:17
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cubezzzthe internet is a mess and a big part of that is Microsoft's faultJul 28 02:27
cubezzzproprietary protocols for various things ... I'm sure you all have read the halloween documentsJul 28 02:28
cubezzzthese rogue security programs floating around, they're just nastyJul 28 02:31
twitterThe messier parts of the internet exterminate themselves.Jul 28 02:37
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twitterDrop box?  Why not just run Apache?Jul 28 02:39
twitterand OpenSSH?Jul 28 02:39
twitterApache - works with any OS that also has a browser.Jul 28 02:39
twitteror wgetJul 28 02:39
twitterAh!  Ars.  So many words, so little understanding.  http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/07/pirate-partys-copyright-reform-cannon-could-sink-copyleft.arsJul 28 02:44
twitterRMS is not worried about the license, he's worried about the freedom it protects.Jul 28 02:45
twitterThe code escrow does not protect against patents and Tivoization, which both negate the [already low] value of having source code to currently non free software.Jul 28 02:46
twitterSoftware freedom is a thing that society should protect with positive laws.Jul 28 02:47
twitterThe Pirate Party already wants to get rid of DRM and software patents, but they need to do that first before they gut copyleft.Jul 28 02:49
twitterPeople should make laws against non free software practices.  A company that Tivoises free software robs both the community and their customers, it is a public offense, aka a crime.Jul 28 02:51
balzactessier__: tell that to Linus Torvalds. He has a much higher profile than I do and he's always spraying vinager at RMS.Jul 28 02:53
balzacSoftware patents are completely absurd.Jul 28 02:55
balzacI'm quite proud of the Swedish Pirate Party.Jul 28 02:55
balzacI don't think DRM can be gotten rid of, nor should be gotten rid of by law.Jul 28 02:55
balzacBut patents should not be applicable to software.Jul 28 02:55
balzacNor should patents be allowed to freeze up the innovation in the design of circuits where the circuit pattern has effectively become a physical manifestation of some common idea.Jul 28 02:57
balzacSome patents make sense, some are just grabbing an obvious idea everyone already knew about and trying to tax others.Jul 28 02:57
balzacRMS is right about his response to the Pirate Party's 5 year copyright proposal.Jul 28 03:01
balzacThe 5 year copyright seems uneccessaryJul 28 03:02
balzacand too shortJul 28 03:02
balzacSeems like the Pirate Party has some very young people doing their thinking.Jul 28 03:02
balzac5 years goes by very quicklyJul 28 03:03
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twitterNice Xandros pages, Roy!Jul 28 03:04
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tessierbalzac: Their rep to congress/assembly/whatever is middle-agedJul 28 03:32
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twitterah yes, something fun http://t16web.lanl.gov/Kawano/gnuplot/index-e.htmlJul 28 03:41
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cjbalzac: indeed.  Reagan's changes in the early 80s did not help the system, unless you have an extra million dollars sitting aroundJul 28 05:01
Diablo-D3hehJul 28 05:02
Diablo-D3no president's changes have ever helpedJul 28 05:02
Diablo-D3they only delay the inevitableJul 28 05:02
Diablo-D3the morons will inherit the earthJul 28 05:02
BlackDogthey have a good chior thought !!!Jul 28 05:03
Diablo-D3...Jul 28 05:06
*Diablo-D3 double facepalmsJul 28 05:06
Diablo-D3alsoJul 28 06:09
Diablo-D3microsoft has officially announced win7 rtmJul 28 06:09
BlackDogthe "release to morons" version :DJul 28 06:15
Diablo-D3heheheheJul 28 06:15
tessierheheJul 28 06:16
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MinceR:)Jul 28 06:31
BlackDogI was goign to say "release to masicists" but I cant spell thatJul 28 06:35
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MinceRmasochistsJul 28 06:50
MinceRbut morons works tooJul 28 06:51
MinceRbetter, in factJul 28 06:51
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schestowitzHeyJul 28 07:05
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tessier__schestowitz: HiJul 28 07:24
schestowitzHi there. I see balzac  has been rudeJul 28 07:30
schestowitzSomeone has just mailed me some secrets about the inside of VMware.. :-)Jul 28 07:32
schestowitztessier: high load... 17Jul 28 07:37
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tessier__Indeed.Jul 28 07:59
tessier__Seems to come in spikes.Jul 28 07:59
tessier__I don't know why.Jul 28 07:59
tessier__A few times a day.Jul 28 07:59
tessier__I think the SAN behind it all is far from optimal. Fixing that might help. Otherwise I don't know what can be done aside from reducing the database load by implementing some more caching.Jul 28 08:00
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Fact Checking? UK Paper Simply Takes The Word Of Guy Who Claims WiFi Allergy < http://ping.fm/u8Ole Checking? UK Paper Simply Takes The ...Jul 28 08:04
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KrensoHelloJul 28 08:30
KrensoHave you read figuere post about gnote and his motivationsJul 28 08:31
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Krensohttp://www.figuiere.net/hub/blog/?2009/07/27/680-why-i-did-write-gnoteJul 28 08:32
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Wants to Give RAND Terms to Free Software http://ping.fm/49SNDJul 28 08:34
schestowitzI knew why he did it, let's see what he says nowJul 28 08:35
schestowitz"Even though I'd love to have help, I definitely will maintain it as long as I can. The next release will have a boatload of features and fixes, including D-Bus support, etc. It is all in git. One has to admit the pace as slowed down recently because I have been working on other things, including AbiWord and Niepce."Jul 28 08:36
KrensoI think he made gnote as revengeJul 28 08:40
Diablo-D3RREEVVEEEN--wait, what?Jul 28 08:40
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Krensowhat is the case with transJul 28 08:56
Krensocore vs etc corpJul 28 08:57
schestowitzJul 28 08:22:24 <Krenso>and now somebody from novell had a conversation with himJul 28 08:57
schestowitzJul 28 08:22:50 <Diablo-D3>shit, what the fuck do I have to do to get a conversation with novellJul 28 08:57
schestowitzJul 28 08:23:05 <Krenso>and he hopes to get back to novell or some other companyJul 28 08:57
schestowitzUnlikelyJul 28 08:57
schestowitzBut he's not a Mono guyJul 28 08:57
schestowitzHe probably adapted it for his needs because "he was bored"Jul 28 08:58
schestowitzBoredom and merits of C++ is what he claimed to be the reason beforeJul 28 08:58
Krensoafter you are fired, you create something which competes with you employer's productJul 28 08:59
KrensoBoredom? maybeJul 28 09:00
Krenso*yourJul 28 09:00
schestowitzNot alwaysJul 28 09:04
schestowitzBut it's possibleJul 28 09:04
schestowitzLuc from RadeonHD still contributes to it after being firedJul 28 09:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Linus Torvalds’ Attitude Towards Free Software is Not News http://ping.fm/nzDqoJul 28 09:06
KrensoMs can brake promise? http://www.law.com/jsp/ihc/PubArticleIHC.jsp?id=1202432431633Jul 28 09:08
KrensoI don't understand what are the implications for monoJul 28 09:09
Krensofrom this tomecore vs etc corp caseJul 28 09:09
schestowitzMicrosoft's trap may not workJul 28 09:10
schestowitzCP footnotes/fine prints can work against themJul 28 09:11
fewaWhat they are doing is estoppelJul 28 09:13
fewa*is barred by estoppelJul 28 09:13
fewaIf it can be shown that they purposefully misrepresented what they were doingJul 28 09:16
fewato entrapJul 28 09:16
BlackDogthey wouldl have to break the promise firstJul 28 09:17
fewaIf it indeed was a promise then they cant break it, as it was legally bindingJul 28 09:17
BlackDogthats rightJul 28 09:18
fewaif it doesn't cover what they say it covers, then they are barred by estoppel from suing on those issues which they liedJul 28 09:18
BlackDogthats right, if they break their promise, they can, but not beforeJul 28 09:19
fewaBlackDog, wrongJul 28 09:19
BlackDogestoppel is breaking a promise you make, not making a promise you might or could break.Jul 28 09:20
BlackDogyou have to do the crime before  you do the time.Jul 28 09:20
fewaIn general, estoppel protects an aggrieved party, if the counter-party induced an expectation from the aggrieved party, and the aggrieved party reasonably relied on the expectation and would suffer detriment if the expectation is not met.Jul 28 09:21
fewaGo back to spin schoolJul 28 09:21
BlackDogthats right , you are right, that expectation is the promise you speak of, the breaking would be the agreiving part. again you still have to break the rule (the promise) or falsly represent before you are liable.Jul 28 09:22
fewaBlackDog, wrong, stop putting words in my mouthJul 28 09:23
BlackDogok, tell me what you would charge them for if they have not broken the promise ?Jul 28 09:23
fewaestopple is a defenseJul 28 09:23
schestowitzBte, MutexJul 28 09:27
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] GNU/Linux is Shrinking Microsoft’s Margins http://ping.fm/j8HOIJul 28 09:27
*schestowitz sets ban on *!*@121.213.206.105Jul 28 09:27
*schestowitz has kicked BlackDog from #boycottnovell (schestowitz)Jul 28 09:27
schestowitzIt's Mutex againJul 28 09:28
schestowitzHe'll back back with a new identityJul 28 09:28
fewayepJul 28 09:28
schestowitzApple and death...... http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/27/foxconn_badmouths_dead_engineer/Jul 28 09:34
KrensoIt's defence against expectations, not against braking the promise?Jul 28 09:34
fewaMainly against promisesJul 28 09:34
fewabut creating an expectation is a form of promiseJul 28 09:34
fewaif its explicitJul 28 09:34
fewabut promises would moreso be ruled by contracts?Jul 28 09:35
schestowitzhttp://blogs.nashvillescene.com/pitw/steve-jobs-wtf.jpgJul 28 09:35
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fewaschestowitz, ugh, and foxconn is in the pocket of MSFT tooJul 28 09:37
martinjh99Roy if your about congrats on 7000 posts...Jul 28 09:37
fewathat whole bad ACPI fiascoJul 28 09:37
schestowitzfewa: no, many companiesJul 28 09:38
schestowitzfoxconn is )huge_Jul 28 09:38
schestowitzmartinjh99: thanksJul 28 09:38
martinjh99Have learnt a bit too...  :)Jul 28 09:38
schestowitzMicrosfy hasn'tJul 28 09:38
schestowitz*microsoftJul 28 09:39
schestowitzIt just learns how to pretendJul 28 09:39
martinjh99usually more details about what Ive been hearing in the news or read abouot on groklaw...Jul 28 09:39
fewawell yes this ACPI thing even came directly from BillG's emailJul 28 09:39
schestowitzhttp://antitrust.slated.org/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011607/3000/PX03020.pdfJul 28 09:42
schestowitzI have a follow-on post about that soon.Jul 28 09:42
schestowitzhttp://antitrust.slated.org/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011607/7000/PX07255.pdf Gates: "What do we want in cameras for metadata and UI? What do we want relative to device discovery? (hopefully patented stuff)."Jul 28 09:42
martinjh99Roy cant download that first pdf... 403 errorJul 28 09:43
schestowitzwallclimber helps me fetch the textJul 28 09:43
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The News Goes 3D on YouTube < http://ping.fm/JEEtC >Jul 28 09:43
schestowitzmartinjh99: works from hereJul 28 09:43
fewahttp://xkcd.com/612/Jul 28 09:44
martinjh99Using Quassel IRC on KDE... Cant do it from FF either...Jul 28 09:44
martinjh99in fact the whole site / is 403 for me...Jul 28 09:45
schestowitzmartinjh99: ahhhhhhhhJul 28 09:45
fewasweet i need to find some 3d glassesJul 28 09:45
schestowitzMust be phormJul 28 09:45
schestowitzSLated.org bans Phorm-infected ISPsJul 28 09:45
schestowitzYour ISP is BritishJul 28 09:46
schestowitzMaybe it's Phorm-infectedJul 28 09:46
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schestowitzAlso, I think Slated.org bans IEJul 28 09:46
martinjh99Yes Virgin... I guess thats the case then :( How about a mirror somewhere else...Jul 28 09:46
schestowitzBut that's probably not the reason in this caseJul 28 09:46
schestowitzYes, Virgin is Phorm-infectedJul 28 09:46
schestowitzThis means that Virgin customers are disadvantages by Virgins's greed for people's browsing habit (illegal)Jul 28 09:47
martinjh99True...Jul 28 09:47
schestowitz*disadvantaged , *habitsJul 28 09:47
fewaBransonJul 28 09:47
schestowitzhttps://www.dephormation.org.uk/?page=7Jul 28 09:48
schestowitzhttp://www.dephormation.org.uk/images/bt_total_spyware_blocked.pngJul 28 09:48
schestowitzhttp://www.dephormation.org.uk/images/kt_blocked.pngJul 28 09:48
schestowitzNow they go on Dabs.. https://www.dephormation.org.uk/images/boycottdabs.gifJul 28 09:49
martinjh99Bit of a pain in the ass thoughJul 28 09:50
schestowitzfewa: progress bar is a patentJul 28 09:50
schestowitzNot Microsoft'sJul 28 09:50
schestowitzMicrosoft gave the progress bar a bad name thoughJul 28 09:50
schestowitzmartinjh99: not my choiceJul 28 09:50
martinjh99Not saying it is Roy just saying in general...Jul 28 09:51
schestowitzI don't block anything.... I ad a little button for IE users to choose a better browser and move to GNU/Linux thoughJul 28 09:51
Ngwow those dephormation htaccess rules are pretty harshJul 28 09:51
taconehttp://www.figuiere.net/hub/blog/?2009/07/27/680-why-i-did-write-gnoteJul 28 09:51
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schestowitzNg: the idea is that people are annoyed, then learn why it is caused (most people know nothing) and then shout at the ISPJul 28 09:52
schestowitzIt might be the only effective wayJul 28 09:52
schestowitztacone: Red Hat should hire him to port f-spot or somethingJul 28 09:52
taconefspot ?Jul 28 09:53
schestowitz"It's not a fork... it's a hub"Jul 28 09:53
taconefspot is probably worthless, since solang birthJul 28 09:53
schestowitzYeah..Jul 28 09:53
schestowitzJust sayin'....Jul 28 09:53
taconeand fspot is deprecatedJul 28 09:53
taconenobody works on it anymoreJul 28 09:53
taconethat's the reason they're rebasing it on banshee.Jul 28 09:54
taconethe sad reality is that tomboy aside.. there's nothing to port anymore.Jul 28 09:55
taconebanshee is the equivalent of rhythmboxJul 28 09:55
taconewhat else ?Jul 28 09:55
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schestowitzSome people fancy gnome-doJul 28 10:02
MinceRi doJul 28 10:02
MinceRespecially the files and folders plugin :>Jul 28 10:02
taconeah, yes, gnome-doJul 28 10:03
schestowitzDe Icaza also developed a whole raft of "hello World" 'applicstions' in MonoJul 28 10:03
taconeyes, that may be desiderableJul 28 10:03
MinceRunfortunately the debian package seems to lack both plugins and the configuration dialogJul 28 10:03
MinceRmaybe it's an ancient versionJul 28 10:03
schestowitzMono has some users.. now, if only it could attract actual developers other than Novell employees...Jul 28 10:03
taconeoh shall HelloIcazas be ported ? :)Jul 28 10:03
Muttleytacone: strange, last commit to f-spot git was 20 hours agoJul 28 10:03
Krenso20 hours is not muchJul 28 10:04
taconeMuttley: yes, i exaggeratedJul 28 10:04
MuttleyclearlyJul 28 10:04
schestowitz"commit #37622: changed stimestamp"Jul 28 10:04
KrensoMaybe there are no big commits, becase they feel it has everythinh they wantedJul 28 10:05
MinceRsomeone who knows x programming well should port gnome-doJul 28 10:05
Krensohow is solang development?Jul 28 10:05
Muttleyalso they aren't rewriting all of f-spot in banshee, just the part that manages filesJul 28 10:05
Muttleythe idea being that f-spot can concentrate on photo manipulationJul 28 10:05
schestowitzfewa: was it you who spoke of Ozone? http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/jul/26/climate-change-obama-administrationJul 28 10:05
MinceRhm, actually i do have plugins installed and they don't showJul 28 10:06
taconeKrenso: no, I don't think f-spot it's active. a good reason to re-implement it on bansheeJul 28 10:06
schestowitzBlack professor in race row arrest accepts Obama's invitation for a beer < http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/25/obama-race-row-professor-beer >Jul 28 10:07
taconeMuttley: nice clarificationJul 28 10:07
fewaschestowitz, yeah i was trying to get the originals of thoseJul 28 10:07
fewathere are a bunch of comparisons like thatJul 28 10:07
Muttleythe idea with banshee platform is that it become a framework for storing media. then you have clients connect and do their stuffJul 28 10:07
fewabut i cant find them in high def on the NOAA siteJul 28 10:07
Muttleyso you can have a movie player client, an f-spot client, a music player clientJul 28 10:07
Muttleythey don't have to care about storing and managing the mediaJul 28 10:08
Muttleypersonally I think it's a great ideaJul 28 10:08
MinceRand a word processor client and a spreadsheet clientJul 28 10:08
fewawhat a wholesome abuse of "classified" lablesJul 28 10:08
schestowitzLike Netscape NavigatorJul 28 10:08
MinceRwe already have a framework for storing media that works very well, it's called the "file system" :>Jul 28 10:08
schestowitzJust hold on while it starts... get coffeeJul 28 10:08
taconeif that's true (photo manipulation) i wouldn't hope to see results soonJul 28 10:09
taconenot if f-spot doesn't receives more funding, at least.Jul 28 10:09
fewaMinceR, yep, anyone who tries to replace the file system is nutsJul 28 10:09
MuttleyMinceR: and if you're happy with that it's fine with meJul 28 10:09
MuttleyI want something slightly more advancedJul 28 10:09
fewayou can add a database to the file systems, but keeping the system is importantJul 28 10:09
MinceRi think it should be extended, not replacedJul 28 10:09
Muttleyluckily the joy of open source is that I can use the programs I like and you can use the ones you likeJul 28 10:09
fewaie indexingJul 28 10:09
KrensoMinceR, but file systems don't support metadat (id3, exif etc)Jul 28 10:09
MinceRyes they doJul 28 10:09
fewathe internet is one big file system, with database indexesJul 28 10:10
MinceRextended attributes and the likeJul 28 10:10
MinceRor you could add a database, index the files with it and write queries in the vfsJul 28 10:10
MinceRthen any app would be able to make arbitrary queriesJul 28 10:10
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Slap on the wrist for cop who assaulted paramedic < http://ping.fm/ucaxn >Jul 28 10:12
fewawahaJul 28 10:14
fewahttp://gfl.usgs.gov/Publications.shtmlJul 28 10:14
fewaslashdot found themJul 28 10:14
Krensomaybe banshee will be that: database, indexed data and queries but available through monoJul 28 10:14
MinceRand so the entire framework goes away if m$ suesJul 28 10:14
MinceRbrilliant.Jul 28 10:14
fewareally f-spot stored photos in a database?Jul 28 10:15
fewawtfJul 28 10:15
Krensono, novell will still use it. And xandros, turbolinux etc. Those who payJul 28 10:15
Muttleyfewa: no, it stored data about the photos in a databaseJul 28 10:15
MinceRafaik it stored them in some place that belonged to itJul 28 10:15
MinceRonce m$ sues, novell's usefulness will endJul 28 10:15
MinceRthere won't be a novell anymore, or at least not much of it, just like scoJul 28 10:16
fewaKrenso, thats called a racket, and its illegalJul 28 10:16
schestowitzDid anyone say gnote was anti-Mono?? http://mono-nono.com/2009/07/28/the-why-behind-gnote/Jul 28 10:16
Muttleythat's if m$ bothers suing over something that doesn't really lose them any revenueJul 28 10:16
schestowitzI wrote about the possibility of gnote getting rid of MonoJul 28 10:16
schestowitzI didn't say he started this as a revenge against Mono for legal/idealogical reasonsJul 28 10:17
MinceRthat is if m$ bothers attacking something that's eating their revenue, you mean? :>Jul 28 10:17
schestowitzThat's justa  side effectJul 28 10:17
MuttleyMinceR: how is a media platform on linux eating their revenue?Jul 28 10:17
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schestowitzKrenso: Xandros"?Jul 28 10:17
schestowitzReally?Jul 28 10:18
schestowitzLike Turbolinux they are irrelevantJul 28 10:18
MinceRMuttley: gnu/linux itself is, and they're trying to kill it with monoJul 28 10:18
MuttleyhahaJul 28 10:18
schestowitzXandros has not even released a desktop Linux in agesJul 28 10:18
Muttleyon servers maybeJul 28 10:18
Muttleyon desktops...Jul 28 10:18
MuttleygardlyJul 28 10:18
MuttleyhardlyJul 28 10:18
MinceRthe media platform is just a part of this, if your dream of replacing the file system with it happens then it can be a great part of that planJul 28 10:18
MinceRcome on, tell us how gnu/linux doesn't exist on desktopsJul 28 10:19
MinceRso that we can laugh in your faceJul 28 10:19
Muttleyis that what I said?Jul 28 10:19
MuttleynoJul 28 10:19
Muttleybut please spin my wordsJul 28 10:19
MinceRi suspected that was what you were leading towardsJul 28 10:19
schestowitzNop[eJul 28 10:19
schestowitzHe talked about XandrosJul 28 10:19
Muttleyreally?Jul 28 10:19
MinceRtrying to go ahead of the train of thought :>Jul 28 10:19
schestowitzAlmost no-one uses it on desktops nowJul 28 10:19
schestowitzXandros had that ASUS thingJul 28 10:19
MuttleyI've used a linux desktop for 9 years. I think I know about linux on desktopsJul 28 10:19
schestowitzNot desktopJul 28 10:19
schestowitzPresto... Windows-onlyJul 28 10:20
MinceRthey still have that asus thing, don't they?Jul 28 10:20
MinceRoh, rightJul 28 10:20
MinceRthough iirc they switched to some fast-boot linux thing nowJul 28 10:20
MinceR(beside windows)Jul 28 10:20
satiperaThere is an interview by Peter Day with the CEO of Red Hat on the open source business model for Global business ont the BBC World Service, I thought you may want to spread the link. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p003r602/Global_Business_Hats_off_to_Red_Hat/   For those outside the UK they will have to check the World Service schedules.Jul 28 10:20
MinceRi still think their tablet is a step backwardsJul 28 10:20
MinceRoh, presto is a fast-boot gnu/linux distro tooJul 28 10:21
MuttleyMinceR: maybe if you don't jump to the conclusion that everyone who doesn't completely agree with you is a pro-ms shill you might not get so worked upJul 28 10:21
MinceRsorry, we are routinely flooded with pro-m$ shillsJul 28 10:22
schestowitz"I say bring in Microsoft's code. But make it work not as well as it could so in the end people will opt for a Linux host. That is what Microsoft would do if it was the other way around...." http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-07-27-027-35-OP-CY-MR-0000Jul 28 10:22
MinceRthat's not a proper engineering decision, imoJul 28 10:23
MinceRtheir code should be left outJul 28 10:23
MinceRbecause there's already code that does the same thing, afaikJul 28 10:23
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schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-07-27-027-35-OP-CY-MR-0002 " Exactly my thoughts.Jul 28 10:23
schestowitzLinus is renowned for being detached from Politics -- and that's his right. As it's ours not to share his "tech über alles" philosophy.Jul 28 10:23
schestowitzThese M$-loving critters are starting to look like ticks: they don't look nice and I'm afraid of getting patent diseases from them.Jul 28 10:23
schestowitzAnd this time, I don't feel sorry to be blunt: it's past time already, after all these ad hominem attacks -- all completely unrelated to Linux.Jul 28 10:23
schestowitzAnother (related) thing: .Net is a product of M$. Pay to use it! With enough paying clients, M$ might make a Linux version. If not, it shows they don't care -- will they care about Mono?Jul 28 10:23
schestowitz"Jul 28 10:23
MinceRbut they've bought their way in already, so it's all water under the bridge nowJul 28 10:23
schestowitzThat's a quote above BTWJul 28 10:24
schestowitzDidn't paste it properlyJul 28 10:24
MinceRi'm afraid linux is being whored out nowJul 28 10:24
schestowitz"And this time, I don't feel sorry to be blunt: it's past time already, after all these ad hominem attacks -- all completely unrelated to Linux."Jul 28 10:24
schestowitz"Another (related) thing: .Net is a product of M$. Pay to use it! With enough paying clients, M$ might make a Linux version. If not, it shows they don't care -- will they care about Mono?"Jul 28 10:24
schestowitzMinceR: they do the same in vmwareJul 28 10:25
schestowitzI hear MCSEs are taking overJul 28 10:25
schestowitzand Microsoft execsJul 28 10:25
schestowitzThey inflitrate even this IRC channelJul 28 10:26
schestowitzcj for exampleJul 28 10:26
schestowitzFormer MicrosoftersJul 28 10:26
Diablo-D3schestowitz: who cares thoughJul 28 10:27
Diablo-D3I mean, Bill could logon right nowJul 28 10:27
Diablo-D3I'd be like "Hi Bill, I heard your ultra long term Microsoft investment is shitting out on you."Jul 28 10:28
fewawhoresJul 28 10:28
Diablo-D3and he'd be like "I'm still the richest man in the universe."Jul 28 10:28
Diablo-D3and we'd laughJul 28 10:28
schestowitzWHat..? /:Jul 28 10:29
Diablo-D3Its called sarcasm.Jul 28 10:29
MuttleyheheJul 28 10:32
Diablo-D3http://pastebin.ca/1509814Jul 28 10:32
*Diablo-D3 gets out his censorship stickJul 28 10:32
*Diablo-D3 beats that guy with itJul 28 10:32
schestowitzDiablo-D3: yes, but still...Jul 28 10:37
schestowitzTether an Android Phone Using Proxoid http://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/Blogs/Productivity-Sauce-Dmitri-s-open-source-blend-of-productive-computing/Tether-an-Android-Phone-Using-Proxoid?blogboxJul 28 10:37
schestowitz"I pray that they are caught, rounded up, prosecuted beyond the extent of the law, thrown in a windowless cell and locked up forever until the day they die."Jul 28 10:39
schestowitzThat's harshJul 28 10:39
schestowitzIt was DDoS mitigation, they claimJul 28 10:39
schestowitzNow they get DDoS on their staff, by E-mail complaintsJul 28 10:39
schestowitzTruck drivers! Don't go texting now http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/28/texting_trucks/Jul 28 10:40
schestowitzBlog Spam < http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2009/07/27/No-Blog-Spam >Jul 28 10:44
schestowitzJo Shields favors us with a special remix of Ubuntu. < http://mono-nono.com/2009/07/28/chicken-little-remix-up/ >Jul 28 10:47
schestowitzNo MonoJul 28 10:47
taconewowJul 28 10:48
schestowitzit'ss an insultJul 28 10:51
schestowitz"chicken"Jul 28 10:51
tacone...Jul 28 10:52
schestowitzlike Jo's avatarJul 28 10:52
taconei wouldn't pick this kind of detailsJul 28 10:52
taconeI like the happening, even if it won't be mantained.Jul 28 10:53
schestowitzSueMe Linux was not maintainedJul 28 10:53
schestowitzNeither is the Suemelinux.com Web siteJul 28 10:54
KrensoOpenSueMeJul 28 11:02
schestowitzSesameJul 28 11:03
taconelolJul 28 11:04
taconesueme :)Jul 28 11:04
*tacone has quit (Remote closed the connection)Jul 28 11:10
*fewa has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host))Jul 28 11:10
schestowitzMicrosoft says it won't do ARM, but some fools keep spreading contradictory FUD. http://www.unthinkable.biz/home/article/394/Jul 28 11:11
KrensoWhat about this storie, saying c# books selling is decliningJul 28 11:12
Krenso*storyJul 28 11:12
schestowitz"Microsoft is merely making the best of the situation. The drivers in question violated the GPL and, once this was discovered by Vyatta, they were FORCED to release them or face a lawsuit. They then proceeded to spin this event as a positive contribution to OSS. The pigs have yet to fly, the horse hasn't changed color, and hell is still uncomfortably toasty."Jul 28 11:23
schestowitzhttp://linuxmednews.com/1248210795Jul 28 11:23
schestowitzKrenso: what about it?Jul 28 11:23
schestowitzDo You Bing? Yahooers May Soon Search With Microsoft < http://adage.com/digital/article?article_id=138138 > That would be digusting  -- Microsoft bullying a company that buy its market shareJul 28 11:26
schestowitzAnd at the same time using Feds against Google to prevent a similar dealJul 28 11:26
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Krensois it really delclining? Or every other languagae books selling is low, except objective-c and javascript?Jul 28 11:34
schestowitzI quoted Balrog on a factual observationJul 28 11:37
schestowitzWhat applies to some other language asideJul 28 11:38
*schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitzJul 28 11:38
schestowitzPeter Yared, as usual, curses FOSS: http://www.businessweek.com/technology/technology_at_work/archives/2009/07/the_failure_of.htmlJul 28 11:46
schestowitzWhy are CNET and other publications give him a platform?Jul 28 11:46
schestowitzHe also spreads Microsoft's patent FUDJul 28 11:46
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Ngschestowitz: he's not cursing FOSS, he's commenting on the commercial aspects of itJul 28 11:51
Ngand he's not exactly wrong, but I think he's right for the wrong reasons, iyswim :)Jul 28 11:51
Ngcompanies like those tend to take a bunch of FOSS components and integrate them with layers of awful nonsense which they make a "community edition" of and then a fully featured commercial oneJul 28 11:52
Ngthe best example of that would be Zimbra, which is a terrible, terrible messJul 28 11:52
schestowitzNg: I judge him by previous such 'columns'Jul 28 11:52
NgI'm not familiar with his past workJul 28 11:53
schestowitzI didn't read this BW article, but I saw his name and remembered his warpath against FOSSJul 28 11:53
schestowitzIncluding utter BS like justification of Microsoft racketeeringJul 28 11:53
oiaohmThere are all kinda of Foss models.Jul 28 11:54
oiaohmRealy Foss is way broader in business styles compared to closed source.Jul 28 11:55
schestowitz*LOL* Mrs Martin, she annoys me < http://beranger.org/v3/wordpress/2009/07/27/mrs-martin-she-annoys-me/ >Jul 28 11:55
schestowitzFianlly.Jul 28 11:55
schestowitzFeud between Caltlin and Radu made themselves famous ? on Centos < http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/38455#comment-10971 >Jul 28 11:56
schestowitz^MSFT inevstor/trollJul 28 11:56
schestowitzThis is bad: http://my.opera.com/it-s/blog/2009/07/27/wallpaper-a-day-day-2Jul 28 11:56
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oiaohmhttp://shibuvarkala.blogspot.com/2009/07/ohh-my-god-debian-ubuntu-package.html  << Finally a application I don't think MS can clone.Jul 28 12:00
>ChanServ<op #boycottnovell schestowitzJul 28 12:05
*ChanServ gives channel operator status to schestowitzJul 28 12:05
*schestowitz sets ban on *!*@58.166.70.68Jul 28 12:05
*schestowitz has kicked fishbait from #boycottnovell (schestowitz)Jul 28 12:05
schestowitzMutex againJul 28 12:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft violated the GPL after all: http://ping.fm/IooaMJul 28 12:05
*schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitzJul 28 12:05
schestowitzoiaohm: wget no good?Jul 28 12:06
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oiaohmThat program is more a presetup lists schestowitz.Jul 28 12:07
oiaohmOpen source developers come in all shapes and forms.Jul 28 12:08
Krensois it analysis of book selling biased? Should we say java and python is obsolete too? It's to early for victoryJul 28 12:18
schestowitzYou can scale it relatievlyJul 28 12:20
schestowitzAnd these are just _book_ sales from one companyJul 28 12:20
schestowitzThe claims that C# is "taking over" are refuted easilyJul 28 12:20
schestowitzPeople use RoR, PHP, even JavaJul 28 12:21
schestowitzWordPress, Drupal, etcJul 28 12:21
schestowitzMaybe I'll get back ti posting links twice per dayJul 28 12:22
KrensoSo maybe it would be be better "c# books sell is declining as other languagaes, except objective-c and javascript". It would be more fairJul 28 12:22
*schestowitz mekes teacJul 28 12:22
Krensosuch analysis put us in bad light imhoJul 28 12:23
schestowitzDoes exherbo use mono?Jul 28 12:24
Ngit has packages of itJul 28 12:26
Nghttp://git.exherbo.org/summer/repositories/mono/index.htmlJul 28 12:26
oiaohmBook selling shows a problems with tools and provided documentation.Jul 28 12:28
oiaohmwhen it comes to programming.Jul 28 12:28
oiaohm.net programming must not be as simple as they claim.Jul 28 12:28
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Computer Magazine Recommends GNU/Linux for Audio Studio http://ping.fm/zbpvqJul 28 12:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Vanity Credit Card with Linux Foundation Branding http://ping.fm/6Q85MJul 28 12:31
schestowitzoiaohm: what's up with LinuxDevices.com?Jul 28 12:32
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Satire: GNU/Linux Free as in "Communism"?!?! Microsoft Says So http://ping.fm/T125OJul 28 12:34
oiaohmeweek normal slowness on thing schestowitz.   Lot of new cpu devices just after the mid year.  Devices normally following using them next month.Jul 28 12:35
schestowitzeWeek is slow tooJul 28 12:35
schestowitzBut LinuxDevices is o vacation it semsJul 28 12:36
oiaohmhttp://www.linuxfordevices.com  << Not really.Jul 28 12:37
oiaohmIf you have a old rss feed link you are kind missing out.   Another normal eweek thing renaming there god darn sites.Jul 28 12:37
schestowitzWhat's that?Jul 28 12:37
schestowitzHmmmmm..Jul 28 12:38
oiaohmlinuxdevices.com eweek renamed to linuxfordevices.comJul 28 12:38
oiaohmNormal old eweek annoyance.Jul 28 12:38
oiaohmhttp://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Samsung-CortexA8/  The 9 form of this is going to be interestingJul 28 12:39
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] GNU/Linux RAM Consumption Today Same as Windows About a Decade ago http://ping.fm/iY9EQJul 28 12:41
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oiaohmMore correct is Linux ram requirements basically have not moved in a Decade.Jul 28 12:43
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Linux in Automobiles Seems Promising http://sglnx.com/?p=133Jul 28 12:45
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The Linux Fight Over "the Desktop" Becomes Blurred as Desktops Deform http://ping.fm/LN2cZJul 28 12:46
oiaohmIts a old game schestowitz.  Cannot win on a battle field.  Change the battle field to something that suits you.Jul 28 12:47
schestowitzGoogle doesJul 28 12:47
schestowitzsub-notebooks and phonesJul 28 12:47
schestowitzAndroid and Chrome OS (not reprectively)Jul 28 12:48
schestowitz*respectivelyJul 28 12:48
oiaohmExactly changing the battle field.Jul 28 12:48
oiaohmA idea windows supportters overlook.Jul 28 12:48
oiaohmLinux is lining up for a fight.  But are moving the field first.Jul 28 12:48
schestowitzMicrosoft chases backJul 28 12:48
schestowitzSells WIndows XP...Jul 28 12:49
schestowitzFor $5Jul 28 12:49
Krensowhy you ask about exherbo. I know this distro a little.Jul 28 12:49
schestowitzI knowJul 28 12:49
schestowitzThat's why I brought it upJul 28 12:49
oiaohmAlso Linux is getting its foot holds in bios.Jul 28 12:51
oiaohmHold the bios have machine completely.Jul 28 12:51
KrensoThere is no mono in exherbo gnome setJul 28 12:53
Krensohttp://git.exherbo.org/?p=gnome.git;a=blob;f=sets/gnome.conf;h=a62c06760b1f02005f0a46f185e2ad68a580f1a8;hb=fca6aa0a804ef7c900bc8206d3302809039bab3eJul 28 12:53
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Vista 7 Problems Show Why It's Good to Migrate to GNU/Linux Now http://ping.fm/NmI1NJul 28 12:54
KrensoYou have to even add mono repo manually. The same goes with other repos except the arborJul 28 12:56
oiaohmI like fedora is heading.   Mult users per machine.Jul 28 12:56
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Why GNU/Linux Sucks (Satire) http://ping.fm/OsRxeJul 28 12:57
Krensois there any exherbo user?Jul 28 12:57
schestowitzThe developers I supposeJul 28 12:58
schestowitzIt's a young distroJul 28 12:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Univa Deploys GNU/Linux Servers http://ping.fm/mxNoGJul 28 13:00
Krensohmm, right. Exherbo has no users, only developers.Jul 28 13:01
schestowitzIt's a nicheJul 28 13:02
schestowitzIt's like saying that Qimo has no adult usersJul 28 13:02
schestowitzIt's not intended toJul 28 13:02
schestowitzThat may change laterJul 28 13:02
schestowitzDebian>UbuntuJul 28 13:03
Krensoi like this quote "exherbo is trying to have the least users possible".Jul 28 13:05
Krensoor "exherbo in suahili means fuck you"Jul 28 13:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Even KDE Skeptics Starts Loving K Desktop Environment 4.3 http://ping.fm/6YtRx http://ping.fm/yTAAYJul 28 13:06
schestowitzMinceR: ^^for youJul 28 13:06
schestowitzKrenso: CHruchill had something to say about it IIRCJul 28 13:06
schestowitzSomething about a club that's not exclusive just not being worth itJul 28 13:06
schestowitzSo exherbo is exclsuive-elitistJul 28 13:06
schestowitzWorks for some charactersJul 28 13:06
schestowitzFreedomJul 28 13:06
schestowitzKrenso: in exherbo, you must append "!!" to all commands, not just for rootJul 28 13:07
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Hannah Montana Linux Shows the Fun of GNU/Linux Flexibility http://ping.fm/HFytyJul 28 13:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Mandriva Added KDE 4.3 (RC3) Packages to the Repository http://ping.fm/bqEvqJul 28 13:11
schestowitz^Great distro.Jul 28 13:12
KrensoI don't think elitism is intended in exherbo.Jul 28 13:12
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Krensoit's rather "users has no rights to demand anything"Jul 28 13:13
Krensoread my analysis http://rofrol.wordpress.com/2009/06/24/exherbo-community/Jul 28 13:13
schestowitz"demand" -- noJul 28 13:14
schestowitzrequest -- yesJul 28 13:14
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Linux4Afrika Conceived http://ping.fm/1Th81 Why Africans Should Use GNU/Linux http://ping.fm/to7IuJul 28 13:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Red Hat on the MSBBC, Boot Camp http://ping.fm/tJaSt http://ping.fm/tZFLGJul 28 13:19
MinceRschestowitz: i still wonder if _i_ will :>Jul 28 13:21
schestowitzYou might. nothing to lose..Jul 28 13:21
schestowitzsudo apt-get install kde-desktopJul 28 13:21
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MinceRi'm not on ubuntu right now :>Jul 28 13:23
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Fedora 12 Looks Exciting http://ping.fm/QDBTg , Red Hat Tells Microsoft to Quit the Racketeering http://ping.fm/sdaa0Jul 28 13:23
MinceRbtw debian lenny doesn't really have both kde3 and kde4Jul 28 13:24
oiaohmMind you people starting liking KDE is 1 . version ahead of my guess.  Ie it was kde 4.4Jul 28 13:24
schestowitzmikankun: cool.Jul 28 13:24
schestowitzYeah, maybe 4.5Jul 28 13:24
schestowitz3.x is still here (pclos 2009 for example)Jul 28 13:24
MinceRi ought to learn how to use stow, especially for non-autoconf stuff, including proprietary/other binaryJul 28 13:24
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Ubuntu Partner Program Analysed http://ping.fm/WJOWJ http://ping.fm/aOB6eJul 28 13:26
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schestowitzwb, wallclimber Jul 28 13:27
wallclimberGood morning!Jul 28 13:27
wallclimberit's 6am hereJul 28 13:27
wallclimberbeen reading all the new stuff...Jul 28 13:28
schestowitzThere's not much new stuff this weekJul 28 13:29
schestowitzWhich is why it's good I organised the Wiki moreJul 28 13:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Embedded Linux Trailblazer Says Linux Presence is Underestimatd http://ping.fm/lJHlaJul 28 13:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Asus and Acer Offer New Products with Both GNU/Linux and Windows http://ping.fm/nwe8q http://ping.fm/SZA3OJul 28 13:32
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Penguin-shaped Bootable Linux USB Drives Hit the Streets http://ping.fm/XGtfmJul 28 13:33
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] God has forsaken Linux. http://bit.ly/yf5cUJul 28 13:33
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Latest Victory for Linux (on Phones): Sprint http://ping.fm/hb3GlJul 28 13:36
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How Palm's New Phones Constitute a Win for Linux http://ping.fm/KdQhTJul 28 13:38
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] H-P Sells Sub-notebooks with GNU/Linux for Less Than Those with Antiquated XP http://ping.fm/Km6rZJul 28 13:39
Krensoisn't request synonime to demand?Jul 28 13:42
Diablo-D3hmmJul 28 13:44
Diablo-D3hey schestowitzJul 28 13:44
Diablo-D3thats HPJul 28 13:44
Diablo-D3not H-PJul 28 13:44
Diablo-D3and that review is mostly crapJul 28 13:45
Diablo-D3thats $499 australian dollarsJul 28 13:45
Diablo-D3US HP is selling it for $280Jul 28 13:45
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Free your content - "all rights reserved" will make it irrelevant http://bit.ly/SUTPFJul 28 13:46
Diablo-D3which is actually pretty damned cheapJul 28 13:47
Diablo-D3cheapest eees, msi winds, and aspire ones are $299 and upJul 28 13:47
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Hardware-assisted 3D Acceleration Comes to FOSS Web Browser http://ping.fm/T0Sr1Jul 28 13:50
Diablo-D3although to be fairJul 28 13:51
Diablo-D3I'd change out the cpu for the n280 and get the 6 cell batteryJul 28 13:52
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Firefox 4.0 Design Mockups Start Flying http://ping.fm/B9UXZ http://ping.fm/1bDAW http://ping.fm/e6c7gJul 28 13:52
Diablo-D3and go for the 16gb flash driveJul 28 13:53
Diablo-D3and switch to 2gb of memoryJul 28 13:53
Diablo-D3and pick up a second ac adapterJul 28 13:54
Diablo-D3shit, thats $440Jul 28 13:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Departure Photos from OSCON 2009 http://ping.fm/Crj1WJul 28 13:54
Diablo-D3I might as well just buy a damned laptopJul 28 13:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Company That Sells GNU/Linux Appliances Gets $20,000,000 in Funding http://ping.fm/Dg3EdJul 28 13:56
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] VistA (the Free Software, Not the Microsoft Disaster) Gets a Lot More Advanced http://ping.fm/3z7QYJul 28 13:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Open Source API to Tame Fog Computing is Still Yearned for http://ping.fm/6TlI9Jul 28 13:59
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Telecom Cartels May Be Targeting Skype with FUD http://ping.fm/OZwGCJul 28 14:01
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] IBM to Put More Emphasis on GNU/Linux in Mainframes http://ping.fm/nakOSJul 28 14:07
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Gates Foundry Quits India and Leaves Government to Pay for US Patents http://ping.fm/UbeKPJul 28 14:08
oiaohmhttp://thebeezspeaks.blogspot.com/2009/07/from-russia-with-linux.html schestowitz ripples are starting over MS backing down and supporting the browser ballot.Jul 28 14:23
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schestowitzyes, I saw thatJul 28 14:24
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twitterlots of trolls out today http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/28/linus-torvalds-on-free-software/#commentsJul 28 14:43
wayne no "fair use" for filesharing: http://government.zdnet.com/?p=5145Jul 28 14:43
twitterwhy do you let people like Eet continue to spam BN?Jul 28 14:43
twitterI know he'll just use nyms to get around blocking but still.   Ick.Jul 28 14:44
twitterSomething amusing happened to me while reading that article.  I read, " Regarding Microsoft’s loadable module" as " Regarding Microsoft’s loadable mouth" as in M$ is able to stuff Linus' mouth.Jul 28 14:45
twitterLinus' bad attitude really shines through in that GL comment.Jul 28 14:46
twitterHe was both technically wrong and plain wrong headed.Jul 28 14:47
twitterGPL3 does nothing to keep people from making signed binaries, but does everything to avoid loss of freedom via Tivo attack and patents.Jul 28 14:48
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PlDL-767LYE&NR=1Jul 28 14:49
Diablo-D3its officially summerJul 28 14:52
twitterI'm glad projects are moving to GPL3.  If it were not for that, we will all get "Linux" as a bunch of sorry little devices like cellphones that no one can modify.Jul 28 14:52
Diablo-D3todays the first day I had to turn my AC onJul 28 14:52
twitterhmmm, that youtube link does not work with cliveJul 28 14:53
schestowitzReader: "I've got that Chicken Little feeling, but at least I don't have Mono :) "Jul 28 14:55
schestowitzhttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/28/chicken-little-remix-up/Jul 28 14:55
schestowitzLinus might have to accept GPLv3Jul 28 14:55
schestowitzRight now he's trying to crash RMS' credibility IMHOJul 28 14:55
schestowitzHis last pointless resortJul 28 14:55
schestowitz*crushJul 28 14:55
twitterLinus needs to understand and admit he was wrong.Jul 28 14:56
schestowitz"Hi, Roy,Jul 28 14:56
schestowitzHave the MSFTers responded to the open invitation to Mono proponentsJul 28 14:56
schestowitzwith anything other than attacks and name calling?  Carla's invite seemsJul 28 14:56
schestowitzunanswered to date.  Perhaps it is because Mono is not a safe orJul 28 14:56
schestowitzfunctional alternative to J2EEJul 28 14:56
schestowitz http://www.linuxtoday.com/developer/2009061102135OSCY "Jul 28 14:56
twitterI have never seen anything like she asked for ->  Say anything you want, keeping in mind of course the LT TOS, which in a nutshell is no swear words and no personal attacks.Jul 28 14:59
twitterevery defense of mono is filled with personal attacks.Jul 28 15:00
schestowitzIt wasJul 28 15:00
Ngschestowitz: RMS does a perfectly good job of destroying his own credibility every time he turns up somewhere ;)Jul 28 15:00
schestowitzeventually she published Jo's junk with a personal attack]Jul 28 15:00
schestowitzOn me tooJul 28 15:00
schestowitzClaiming or associating me with some death wishes or somethingJul 28 15:00
schestowitzCiting troll commentsJul 28 15:00
schestowitzThe trolls keep creating new accountsJul 28 15:00
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schestowitzNg: maybe for youJul 28 15:01
twitterand it was as all others were, " fractured, wandering, and emotional"Jul 28 15:01
twittershe should have edited the thingJul 28 15:02
Ngschestowitz: I suspect I'm not alone there :)Jul 28 15:02
schestowitzThis is interesting... on how education-imposed debt is used to turn educated people to passive troops: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa8UoZVXobk&feature=relatedJul 28 15:02
twitterbut there would have been very little leftJul 28 15:02
Ngwhy might linus "have to accept GPLv3"?Jul 28 15:02
schestowitzWe'll see what Oracle does with OpenSolarisJul 28 15:03
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schestowitzHehe. http://davyd.ucc.asn.au/images/gpl3-reloaded.jpgJul 28 15:12
schestowitzI saw this while looking for GPL imagesJul 28 15:12
EruaranRichard Morpheus Stallman ?Jul 28 15:13
twitterThere's not much left that this guy misses about Vista now.  http://opendaily.wordpress.com/2009/07/27/6-things-i-miss-about-windows-vista-in-linux/Jul 28 15:15
twitter:)Jul 28 15:15
schestowitzhttp://www.fundsforngos.org/ngosustainabilitynetwork/article/bill-gates-foundation-uninstalling-its-program/ Was any of the money spent on buying drugs against HIV?Jul 28 15:19
schestowitzIf so, now the govwrnment will pay for the patents people came to depend on.Jul 28 15:19
schestowitzI'll need to check this... read 2 articles in full and no answer.Jul 28 15:20
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[trmanco] ♺ @cenourinha: Adorei... http://bit.ly/bFjZ1 LOLJul 28 15:20
EruaranWe are switching our official offering to customers.Jul 28 15:23
EruaranBased upon recent customer feedback.Jul 28 15:23
EruaranUbuntu is out, Kubuntu is in.Jul 28 15:24
schestowitz9.04?Jul 28 15:26
schestowitzI got the impression Kubuntu was not thoroughly done and maintained.. not as well as MandrivaJul 28 15:27
EruaranYes, fully updated to KDE 4.3.Jul 28 15:27
Eruaran9.04 was a huge improvement.Jul 28 15:27
Eruaran9.10 should be very nice.Jul 28 15:28
EruaranLately I've had some interesting feedback on Ubuntu... some people love it, but increasingly we've noticed there is a certain amount of frustration... and people light up like Christmas tree's when they look at our in store demo, which is running Kubuntu with KDE 4.3... they want that.Jul 28 15:32
EruaranOne example of what for us has been "lessons in usability" is RhythmBox v Amarok...Jul 28 15:33
twitterKDE does rock.Jul 28 15:34
schestowitzAmarok is simpleJul 28 15:34
schestowitzxmms tooJul 28 15:34
schestowitzI've never seen a 'hard' music  playerJul 28 15:34
EruaranOne customer especially was quite frustrated by RhythmBoxJul 28 15:34
EruaranShe didn't like it at allJul 28 15:34
schestowitzRhythmBox confused me at firstJul 28 15:34
EruaranNo problem... just look at a few other playersJul 28 15:34
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft Did Violate the GPLv2 http://ping.fm/zM8QAJul 28 15:34
twitterRhythmBox does has it's quirks.Jul 28 15:34
schestowitzI used it in GNOME (Ubuntu 6.06 IIRCJul 28 15:34
twitterAmarok works much better.Jul 28 15:35
twitterbblJul 28 15:35
EruaranEnded up installing Amarok (Songbird was a fizzer)Jul 28 15:35
EruaranShe loves AmarokJul 28 15:35
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EruaranWhat was interesting was that we assumed RhythmBox was simplerJul 28 15:35
EruaranBut the customer was frustrated by it... found the interface too opaque and lacking in feature depthJul 28 15:36
EruaranShe took to Amarok like a duck to waterJul 28 15:36
EruaranWe've noticed this as a general trend only in the last few weeksJul 28 15:36
schestowitzAmarok 2?Jul 28 15:37
schestowitzI use 1.4Jul 28 15:37
Eruaran2.1Jul 28 15:37
schestowitzDutch spam suspect fined €250K http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/28/dutch_spam_fine/Jul 28 15:39
EruaranSpam is Dutch ? Who would have guessed... ;)Jul 28 15:40
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/28/wipo_free_speech/ "A protest website was set up at sutherlandinstitute.com. It identified itself as a parody of the Sutherland Institute's and made it clear that it was not endorsed by or affiliated to the organisation."Jul 28 15:41
schestowitzGoldman Sachs tried something similarJul 28 15:41
schestowitzUsing trademark to suppress criticsJul 28 15:41
schestowitzBoycott N*v*llJul 28 15:41
schestowitzNHS Direct wrongly emailed patients' data http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/28/nhs_direct_email_data/Jul 28 15:42
EruaranHope to see these changes in Amarok soonish: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpx4jwt1ILEJul 28 15:42
schestowitzHehe. The graphics I made prove popular... http://www.log.gr/read.cfm?id=4130Jul 28 15:46
schestowitzAsus cancels its first USB 3.0 motherboard  < http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1495417/asus-cancels-usb-motherboard >Jul 28 15:51
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schestowitzHere's a reversal in general policies: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/uk_politics/8171597.stm "New government guidance has been published urging civil servants to use the micro-blogging site Twitter."Jul 28 15:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] China Bans Violent Online Games < http://ping.fm/tVnnK > Will this actually reduce violence? Remains to be shown...Jul 28 15:54
EruaranVery out of character for Asus to cancel something like a new moboJul 28 15:55
waynethat will upset alot of china companies that level up MMORPT avatar's for money.Jul 28 15:56
EruaranThey'll move to India ;)Jul 28 15:56
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schestowitzDamn. My stove just broke.Jul 28 16:06
Eruaranbroke ?Jul 28 16:10
schestowitzWe'll see.Jul 28 16:14
schestowitzbblJul 28 16:14
taconeah these patent encumbered stoves :(Jul 28 16:15
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cjschestowitz: I am not an MCSE, btw.  please remember to check your facts.Jul 28 17:09
cjnor am I a MS execJul 28 17:09
cjschestowitz: also, there is no "infiltration" going on with me.  I've been on freenode for quite a long time and idle on quite a few channels.Jul 28 17:10
cjschestowitz: any movement on the software freedom law center issue?  shall I CC you on my next reply to the ops over there so we can get something going?Jul 28 17:11
thenixedreport@cj: Hey may not be here at the moment.Jul 28 17:12
thenixedreportYou may want to try later.Jul 28 17:12
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 17:12
cjthenixedreport: sokay.  he reads scrollback, I'm sure.Jul 28 17:12
thenixedreportWhy not just e-mail him instead?Jul 28 17:12
cjhe usually ignores me anyhow.  *shrug*Jul 28 17:12
cjI'll try that if I get a few extra minutes.  changing windows and typing a few lines is less overhead than writing an dmeil ;)Jul 28 17:13
cjs/dmeil/email/Jul 28 17:13
taconecj: when schestowitz is here, he talksJul 28 17:14
tacone(continuosly :D)Jul 28 17:14
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 17:14
thenixedreportSo who has ops?Jul 28 17:14
thenixedreportNo one?Jul 28 17:14
thenixedreportlolJul 28 17:14
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cjtacone: ha.  so I've noticed.Jul 28 17:21
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[d235j] RT @jzdziarski Apple continuing to stifle innovation http://tinyurl.com/n3k5jvJul 28 17:21
cjthenixedreport: freenode policy is to keep the ops hidden until needed.Jul 28 17:22
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Omar87HiJul 28 18:54
Omar87Does Sony use Linux in their hardware?Jul 28 18:54
Omar87(i.e: PS3)?Jul 28 18:54
MinceRafaik no, but they do offer it as part of some sort of add-on, iircJul 28 18:56
schestowitzOmar87: they use it on other hardwareJul 28 18:56
schestowitzA colleague told me that PS2 uses it too, which I found hard to believeJul 28 18:56
schestowitzSony has a subsite for Linux and source codeJul 28 18:57
schestowitzbrbJul 28 18:57
MinceRhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_for_PlayStation_2Jul 28 18:58
MinceRit seems to work out of the box with PS3 since that one ships with a HDDJul 28 18:59
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_Goblinhi all...Jul 28 19:12
_Goblinanything happening?Jul 28 19:13
MinceRsomebody set up us the bomb.Jul 28 19:13
schestowitzBong has a fighting chanceJul 28 19:16
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schestowitzMicrosoft is said to be negotiating with Cronyoo!Jul 28 19:16
schestowitzOver redirection to Bong.com.Jul 28 19:17
trmancowolfram alpha look coolJul 28 19:19
trmancolooks*Jul 28 19:19
_Goblinhavent had the pleasure yet...Jul 28 19:22
balzachi schestowitzJul 28 19:24
balzacHere's a recent comment I wrote on FreeSoftwareMagazine.comJul 28 19:24
balzachttp://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/columns/yes_linus_microsoft_hating_disease_and_its_pandemic#comment-77075Jul 28 19:24
balzacMild delivery, yet still a stingerJul 28 19:25
schestowitzHi, balzac Jul 28 19:25
schestowitztessier is our sysadminJul 28 19:25
schestowitzStrangely enough you were insulting him earlierJul 28 19:25
MinceRwho hasn't he insulted yet?Jul 28 19:26
twitterBooooom -> (11:33:59 AM) MinceR: somebody set up us the bomb.Jul 28 19:26
balzacHi schestowitzJul 28 19:26
MinceR:)Jul 28 19:26
balzacschestowitz: he told me I was a gadflyJul 28 19:26
schestowitzbalzac: when I saw that FSM article headlien I thought  it was from yuoJul 28 19:26
balzacI don't think I insulted him, but I did say "what? what?"Jul 28 19:26
MinceRwhen i see FSM, i think "Flying Spaghetti Monster"Jul 28 19:26
twitterSo, was tessier__ really tessier or someone pretending?Jul 28 19:26
schestowitzMinceR: yes, FSM is gadflyJul 28 19:27
balzacbut we're acquaintedJul 28 19:27
schestowitzGod flying spaghetti monsterJul 28 19:27
MinceRlolJul 28 19:27
schestowitztwitter: just dupesJul 28 19:27
schestowitzLike Balrog_ or amarsh04__Jul 28 19:27
balzacI'm a bit more of a GNU partisan than mostJul 28 19:27
twitterinteresting, the dupe was rude the other day.  Trashing RMS and things.Jul 28 19:28
balzacIf anything, I'm a GNU-FlyJul 28 19:28
schestowitzIt's a good think the whole 'sexist' brouhaha did not target _you_Jul 28 19:28
balzacjeez, who knows when it's really someoneJul 28 19:28
balzacI come here as balzacJul 28 19:28
balzacand balzac_Jul 28 19:28
schestowitz"My name is James..Jul 28 19:29
schestowitz"James underscore"Jul 28 19:29
schestowitzLady: "Nice to meet you, Mister underscoreJul 28 19:29
twitterRMS was targeted because people listen to him.Jul 28 19:29
schestowitz"I can't score" :-(Jul 28 19:29
twitterwho's counting?Jul 28 19:29
balzacdang, my server froze for 30 secondsJul 28 19:30
balzacWho was saying sexism?Jul 28 19:30
balzacAnd who was trashing RMS?Jul 28 19:30
schestowitzGovt website messes up with its users’ privacy data < http://www.alootechie.com/content/govt-website-messes-with-its-users’-privacy-data >Jul 28 19:30
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balzacI'm about to $$$coreJul 28 19:41
balzachttp://www.disruptech.com is about to blow upJul 28 19:41
balzac20,000 lines of Microsoft code under the GNU GPLv2Jul 28 19:42
balzacIt's almost like a crack in the Berlin WallJul 28 19:43
balzacIt means Bill Gates is starting to recognize the freedom of GNU software can't be containedJul 28 19:44
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxjournal.com/video/backslash-helping-linux-users-ignore-thingsJul 28 19:48
schestowitzTry tryJul 28 19:49
schestowitzTo contained it within a VMJul 28 19:49
schestowitzPut it in a Microsoft Windows Server Cage EditionJul 28 19:49
schestowitzCaging the GNU won't workJul 28 19:49
schestowitzPeople can buy a server with just a GNU. It's cheaper and more stable than when it runs inside a cage (Windows guest)Jul 28 19:50
schestowitzEach patch Tuesday would mean downtimes for the Linux VM... if Windows even boots at all after the poatchingJul 28 19:50
balzacindeedJul 28 19:52
schestowitzeWeek's a messJul 28 19:52
MinceRstill, putting that m$ code in the official kernel means that linux is now corrupted.Jul 28 19:52
schestowitzThey also seem to have lost happygeeJul 28 19:52
MinceRm$ has bought its way into it.Jul 28 19:52
schestowitz*happygeek (the devices guru)Jul 28 19:52
schestowitzMinceR: a long time agoJul 28 19:52
MinceRand now we see gregkh sing praises for it, neglecting to mention that he was paid for itJul 28 19:52
MinceRit sickens me.Jul 28 19:52
schestowitzeWeek is Ziffft|Davis: http://www.google.com/search?q=site:boycottnovell.com+ziff+davis&sourceid=navclient-ff&rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&ie=UTF-8&hl=enJul 28 19:53
schestowitzaka Ziff|GatesJul 28 19:53
schestowitzMinceR: yes, that Ubuntu bashing tooJul 28 19:53
MinceRthat tooJul 28 19:53
MinceRbut that at least didn't pollute the codeJul 28 19:54
schestowitzNovell slams the desktop leader... for actually... well, NOT helping MicrosoftJul 28 19:54
schestowitzPeople still ponder the Novell boycottJul 28 19:54
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schestowitzNovell brings so much... Moonlight.... Mono... drivers that makes WIndow a host and Linux just a slaveJul 28 19:54
schestowitzNovell pays Microsoft for the patent racket tooJul 28 19:54
MinceRmoonlight only to its own customers, of courseJul 28 19:54
schestowitzIt markets the racketJul 28 19:54
schestowitzWell, of courseJul 28 19:55
schestowitzI'm trying to remember if Novell execs too urged other companies to join the racketJul 28 19:55
schestowitzI fail to remember with certaintyJul 28 19:55
schestowitzI made this page 2 days ago: http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Steve_Ballmer_Quotes_on_Linux%2C_Free_Software%2C_and_NovellJul 28 19:56
schestowitzSchmidt should just blow Jobs: http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/28/google-voice-iphone-app-rejected-current-gv-apps-lose-connectio/Jul 28 19:58
schestowitzhttp://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/07/28/google-voice-completely-banned-from-apples-app-storeJul 28 19:58
schestowitzJobs is messing w/ them againJul 28 19:58
schestowitzRemember that Google's happy people are also in Apple's management... and brag iPhones and MacsJul 28 19:59
schestowitz*brag aboutJul 28 19:59
thenixedreportlolJul 28 20:03
thenixedreportSpeaking of blowing people.Jul 28 20:03
thenixedreportNah, I better not.Jul 28 20:03
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 20:03
thenixedreportlolJul 28 20:03
schestowitz Pirate Bay faces new legal threat < http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/technology/8173388.stm >. But it's hosting Linux ISOs like Ubuntu without MonoJul 28 20:05
schestowitzthenixedreport: was a joke, a game of wordsJul 28 20:05
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schestowitzReturned to the world from my Heligoland retreat, saddened by the death of Richard Rothwell. You will be missed!  http://identi.ca/notice/6979106Jul 28 20:15
schestowitzSJVN changed themes... http://practical-tech.com/operating-system/buying-with-the-penguin/Jul 28 20:17
schestowitzApple spijner: http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/07/27/why-apple-is-killing-the-pre-via-itunes/ (Why Apple is killing the Pre via iTunes)_Jul 28 20:19
thenixedreportApple doesn't like competition.Jul 28 20:20
thenixedreportThey're no better than Microsoft.Jul 28 20:20
thenixedreportIn many cases, they're worse.Jul 28 20:21
thenixedreportThat just goes to show that there needs to be an audio player that will support only free formats.Jul 28 20:21
thenixedreport(and can support other formats through software plugins written by third party developers)Jul 28 20:21
schestowitzApple is like the 5 y-o screaming at the back seatJul 28 20:25
schestowitzYou know he's a little brat, but you're more concerned about the monster at the wheelJul 28 20:26
schestowitzTo stop this car we need to end non-Free software and spread Firefox, OO, etc.Jul 28 20:26
schestowitzI'm gonna post some more Linux news soon :-) Lots of themJul 28 20:29
thenixedreportCool.Jul 28 20:30
thenixedreportWell.Jul 28 20:30
thenixedreportGotta shut down for a bit.Jul 28 20:30
thenixedreportI'm about to upgrade my video card.Jul 28 20:30
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 20:30
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] "Power of the word of mouth – A new blog!" http://bit.ly/OKdyi #linux #fossJul 28 20:42
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "Oh my, there is a banner on KDE.org that says it’s gonna be released on August 4" http://ping.fm/Hh18vJul 28 20:42
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Introduction to "Iron Linux" http://ping.fm/dAPCuJul 28 20:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] UNIX at Age 40 http://ping.fm/kXga7Jul 28 20:57
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thenixedreportI'm back.Jul 28 20:57
thenixedreportRaden HD 4650's working very well.Jul 28 20:57
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 20:58
thenixedreportI may be able to do dual-monitor if my other LCD has a DVI connector.Jul 28 20:58
thenixedreport:)Jul 28 20:58
schestowitzThe FOSS one?Jul 28 20:58
schestowitzRadeonHS?Jul 28 20:58
schestowitz*HDJul 28 20:58
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Another Journey Through GNU/Linux Audio Applications http://ping.fm/iOK0WJul 28 21:00
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Comparison of Desktop Environments: GNOME, KDE, Xfce, and LXDE http://ping.fm/3IJdS http://ping.fm/OpWMTJul 28 21:03
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Review of antiX 8.2 (GNU/Linux) http://ping.fm/JeeBkJul 28 21:05
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Linux Mint Reviewed in News Factor http://ping.fm/I3d4BJul 28 21:07
thenixedreportFedora 11's not bad, but if you're wanting 3D with certain ATI cards, you're S.O.L.Jul 28 21:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Red Hat Spends $0.1 Billion/Annum Promoting GNU/Linux, Szulik Claims http://ping.fm/m0usZJul 28 21:09
schestowitzthenixedreport: preinstalls resolve all thatJul 28 21:09
schestowitzHand-in-glove h/w-s/wJul 28 21:09
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Ubuntu Derivative CrunchBang Linux 9.04 Gets Another Great Review http://ping.fm/3WN2WJul 28 21:13
thenixedreport@schestowitz, how so?Jul 28 21:14
thenixedreportI could get the FGLRX driver working.Jul 28 21:14
thenixedreportI would wind up with a blank screen.Jul 28 21:14
thenixedreportI had a Radeon HD 2400 Pro from Visiontek.Jul 28 21:14
thenixedreportCouldn't get the driver working.Jul 28 21:14
thenixedreportThe Radeon driver worked okay, but the 3D rendering wasn't the best in the world.Jul 28 21:15
thenixedreportIt wouldn't have been enough to play Penumbra.Jul 28 21:15
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] OLPC in American Classrooms Despite Microsoft's (and Intel's) Sabotage of the Project http://ping.fm/zIuS2Jul 28 21:18
schestowitzthenixedreport: not a good card for LinuxJul 28 21:18
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schestowitzDon't buy a speed bike for riding up the mountain..Jul 28 21:18
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New GIMP Tutorial http://ping.fm/bQjQgJul 28 21:25
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Apple Carries on Bullying Competition http://ping.fm/bRWIAJul 28 21:27
Krenso2Hello againJul 28 21:29
schestowitzHowdyJul 28 21:30
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Intellectual Monopolies Indanities Fail for Taser http://ping.fm/6GfvsJul 28 21:31
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Patent Troll Gets Humiliated for Attacking Free Software Project http://ping.fm/kYCrbJul 28 21:32
Krenso2do you know where those hyper-v modules for kernel were available?Jul 28 21:32
Krenso2did ms really distributed them to publicJul 28 21:33
Krenso2?Jul 28 21:33
schestowitzIt mustJul 28 21:33
schestowitzIt wanted them to be SLES-only AFAIKJul 28 21:33
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sys-Con, Home of Malicious Stalkers, Busted Badly http://ping.fm/bcXEMJul 28 21:34
Krenso2They were searchable through google, but were put on the web by ms? If not how ms violated gpl2?Jul 28 21:35
Krenso2I don't get itJul 28 21:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How GNU/Linux Forces Microsoft to Stop Earning Money from Windows http://ping.fm/MwLoEJul 28 21:36
schestowitzKrenso2: see SFLC explantionJul 28 21:36
schestowitzThey didn't make all that's required publicJul 28 21:36
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Head of AstroTurfing Operations Waggener Edstrom Joins Microsoft http://ping.fm/pftBrJul 28 21:38
Krenso2They don't have to make public, just give source licenced under gpl2 to parties they distribute binariesJul 28 21:39
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] FSFE Publishes Analysis of EU Attempt to Punish Microsoft for Browser Crimes http://ping.fm/w4S1eJul 28 21:40
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Krenso2I just want to read some press news about linuxic before relasing on gpl2Jul 28 21:43
Krenso2that it's available to buy/boundles with hyper-vJul 28 21:43
Krenso2*boundledJul 28 21:43
fewaKrenso2, but being held to tell users their rights would have been a big lose of face for microsoftJul 28 21:44
*schestowitz listens to latest Linux Outlaws episode.Jul 28 21:47
Krenso2maybe i will find which hyper-v version supported linux first with violating codeJul 28 21:53
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schestowitzFabs is being annoyingJul 28 21:54
sldkfjschestowitz: do you have any source for "It wanted them to be SLES-only AFAIK"?Jul 28 22:04
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schestowitzsldkfj: look back at the Novell/Microsoft deal. It has the whole host/guest plan for Hyper-V (before it was called that)Jul 28 22:08
schestowitzIt was only much later that Red Hat too subscribed to this (the Red Hat-Microsoft announcement)Jul 28 22:09
sldkfjwell, them stating to ijmprove interoperability doesn't support your claim that it should have been SLE only imho.Jul 28 22:09
schestowitzSee Hypercalls announcement  (2007)Jul 28 22:10
schestowitzAFAIK, support for this was intended for SLES onlyJul 28 22:11
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Krenso2i have found this http://bit.ly/2YqboIJul 28 22:15
Krenso2it's about ms and novell partnership on vmJul 28 22:15
schestowitzI saw that beforeJul 28 22:17
schestowitzI wrote about it here: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/09/virtualisation-groupwise-people-videos/Jul 28 22:17
Krenso2So maybe they distributed linuxic since sles 10Jul 28 22:18
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Krenso2here you can download linuxic without source available  (on ms site) http://bit.ly/VJHh0Jul 28 22:19
Krenso2or maybe i don't see option to download sourceJul 28 22:20
Krenso2maybe source is boundled with exe?Jul 28 22:21
fewadoes anyone know if Wave works with openjdk?Jul 28 22:22
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hexxholy macro, batmat, so many people!Jul 28 22:23
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] News Site That Promotes the SCO Lawsuit and Microsoft’s Patent Racket is Bullying Critics http://ping.fm/PitQ4Jul 28 22:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Just Say No to Sys-Con: Aral’s Jihad http://ping.fm/xUfkOJul 28 22:56
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schestowitz"Just another heads-up on Sys-Con; many of us in the Linux community have been attacked quite like this by one of Sys-Con’s “writers”, and I use that term loosely, Maureen O’ Gara. She appears to be on a “cihad” against Linux, and Linux users, and has been for years… not sure why, though. I’ve posted your story, and my take on it, here;"Jul 28 22:56
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Brainwash Firm Waggener Edstrom and Microsoft Share More Staff http://ping.fm/Hjf8LJul 28 23:20
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schestowitzIs it true that an advertisement for Internet Explorer said "One World, One Web, One Program"?Jul 28 23:42
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] FSFE Responds to Browser Competition While Apple Proceeds to Blocking Another Competitor http://ping.fm/9UX9dJul 28 23:52
oiaohmhttp://it.slashdot.org/story/09/07/28/1958237/Sandia-Studies-Botnets-In-1M-OS-Digital-Petri-Dish  << now this is kinda wrong.Jul 28 23:56

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