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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: November 25th, 2009

-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] After all the hype, Microsoft Windows 7 advert? http://tinyurl.com/amy7pb #microsoft #vista #windows7 #xp #windows #failNov 25 00:01
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schestowitz_goblin: what's that about?Nov 25 00:09
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_goblinschestowitz: its for an upcomming article....Nov 25 00:14
_goblinschestowitz: "I did it my way" - a look at MS and "their way"Nov 25 00:14
_goblinschestowitz: with a few revelations about what "their way" actually is....Nov 25 00:14
_goblinschestowitz: the lyrics are very fitting I think for Windows...Nov 25 00:15
schestowitzOh, Sinatra...Nov 25 00:19
schestowitzActually, whose song was it originally?Nov 25 00:19
schestowitzThe composer...Nov 25 00:19
schestowitzOh.Nov 25 00:19
schestowitzAnother tactoid for youNov 25 00:19
schestowitzIn 2006 (maybe 07) BillG was dancing stupidly at some party to the song My WayNov 25 00:19
schestowitzOr maybe he was singing itNov 25 00:19
schestowitzIt was reported by a major paper like Forbes and it was embarrassingNov 25 00:20
schestowitzRelevance:Nov 25 00:20
schestowitzOne Way MicrosoftNov 25 00:20
schestowitzAnd the idea of BillG choosing the message "I did it my way"Nov 25 00:20
schestowitzSimilar to 2pac's "Me Against the World"Nov 25 00:20
schestowitz"it's just me against the world, baby!"Nov 25 00:20
schestowitzW3C established standardsNov 25 00:21
schestowitzBilLG: "I did it my way" [activeX]Nov 25 00:21
schestowitzSUN made x-platform [Java]Nov 25 00:21
schestowitzBillG: "I did it my way" [.NET/XAML/etc]Nov 25 00:21
_goblinIts been a busy few days for me....Nov 25 00:21
schestowitzIt's an issue associated with control freaksNov 25 00:21
schestowitzOnly /HIS/ way can be rightNov 25 00:22
schestowitzSo it becomes a matter of egoNov 25 00:22
schestowitzIf it's not done Bill's way, then he has to prove it's wrongNov 25 00:22
_goblinNeed to try and get hold of Andre......I want his input on this piece...Nov 25 00:22
schestowitzit gives him that warm Hubris  feeling deep insideNov 25 00:22
schestowitzInferiority complex... for geeksNov 25 00:22
schestowitzDid Andre find another Sugar Daddy?Nov 25 00:23
schestowitzOr just Suga Babes?Nov 25 00:23
_goblinlolNov 25 00:23
_goblinhe's pimping the ipod at the momentNov 25 00:23
schestowitzHeh.Nov 25 00:23
_goblinof course Ive got money where thats going.....Nov 25 00:23
_goblinZune comes out....Andre gets one....Nov 25 00:23
_goblinand then say its better "because I have both, I should know"Nov 25 00:24
schestowitzBetter than Da Costa pimpin' on the Red LightNov 25 00:24
schestowitzYeah, typicalNov 25 00:24
schestowitzMicrosoft boosters install GentooNov 25 00:24
schestowitzAnd then talk about how WIndows is all so much easierNov 25 00:24
_goblinI am not sure why MS keep trying with Zune....Nov 25 00:24
schestowitzFLOSS Weekly sold out to Ford for advertising... now does that fake recommendation routine for Zunes and iPodsNov 25 00:25
schestowitz_goblin: mobileNov 25 00:25
schestowitzThey can't avoid gadgets, that's whyNov 25 00:25
_goblinbut then again, their Q figures are going to be boosted by all the people needing to buy a new 360 after the switchoff.Nov 25 00:25
schestowitzThey even bought DangerNov 25 00:25
schestowitzSideKick major failNov 25 00:25
schestowitzThey want RIMNov 25 00:25
_goblinoh roy, have a really (sad) link to give you about the power of computer games....................Nov 25 00:26
schestowitz_goblin: BTW, the UK has been following US direction a lot recentlyNov 25 00:26
schestowitzIf you care about Law, which I  have reason to suspect you do, then it's worth looking intoNov 25 00:27
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_goblinhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wgn2jugK_HkNov 25 00:27
schestowitzIt's turning more into a pseudo-fascist prelude with all that eavesdropping on dissentNov 25 00:27
schestowitz_goblin: will watch it in a moment.Nov 25 00:27
schestowitzI wanna post in COLA for a bitNov 25 00:27
schestowitzSecond time today,Nov 25 00:28
_goblinthe US thing you mentioned....Nov 25 00:28
schestowitzThey assimilate laws using the excuse that laws need be uniform... so France gets ISP laws that now pass to UK and USNov 25 00:29
_goblinbut copyright law is slightly different.....Nov 25 00:29
_goblinit needs to be uniform otherwise it can't work....Nov 25 00:29
_goblinas TPB detractors found out...Nov 25 00:29
schestowitzIt was the same with DMCANov 25 00:30
schestowitzACTA now hastens itNov 25 00:30
_goblinjust shift the server to a country with different laws...Nov 25 00:30
schestowitzWatch this new one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZA0qNsf4m0&feature=player_embedded#Nov 25 00:30
schestowitzUniform HOW?Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzThat's the question?Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzWhose laws dominate?Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzWho is spreading and who is accepting?Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzIt's usually Hollywood maximalism over rights of Net usersNov 25 00:31
schestowitzLaw should not be accepted blindly... nor should it be ignored Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzBut if it's ignored for making no sense, then it means it needs to be modifiedNov 25 00:31
_goblinok....lets put this question forward.....Nov 25 00:31
schestowitzAs Lessig shrewdly points outNov 25 00:31
schestowitzand ORG tooNov 25 00:31
_goblinif copyright laws are archaic and "data is merely data".....Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzWho are laws for?Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzThe rulers?Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzThe people?Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzEconomics?Nov 25 00:32
_goblinyes.Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzMaximisation of output?Nov 25 00:32
_goblinall threeNov 25 00:32
schestowitzSo...Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzIt's already more complexNov 25 00:32
schestowitzPeople are brainwashed in school for a lot of copyrightNov 25 00:32
_goblinwithout commercialism would we see COD, GTA and the blockbuster releases?Nov 25 00:32
schestowitzIt's a monopoly for those in power of literature and artsNov 25 00:32
schestowitzNot singersNov 25 00:32
schestowitzNot authorsNov 25 00:32
schestowitzPublishersNov 25 00:32
schestowitzMogulsNov 25 00:33
schestowitzRecord companies...Nov 25 00:33
schestowitzIncluding those possessing material of now-deceased peopleNov 25 00:33
_goblinthis will upset you (maybe)........Nov 25 00:33
_goblinConformity, obedience, compliance is all needed in our society.....Nov 25 00:33
_goblinwhy?Nov 25 00:33
_goblinbecause.....Nov 25 00:33
schestowitzWhy not have patents last for 100 years too?Nov 25 00:34
schestowitzRiddle me this.Nov 25 00:34
_goblin(I assume you are a scientist?Nov 25 00:34
schestowitzYesNov 25 00:34
_goblinlook at any colony of insects/animals.....Nov 25 00:34
_goblindo they not all conform....Nov 25 00:34
_goblinin order to be sucessfull?Nov 25 00:34
schestowitzWell, I majored in math, physics, CSNov 25 00:34
_goblinants....bees.....wolvesNov 25 00:34
schestowitzIt's not about conformityNov 25 00:35
schestowitzIt's /collaboration/Nov 25 00:35
schestowitzThey work on common goalsNov 25 00:35
_goblinagreedNov 25 00:35
schestowitzEnvironment too needs that constraintNov 25 00:35
schestowitzElse we're battling for personal extremitiesNov 25 00:35
_goblinand in working to those common goals, the ant builds the nest....Nov 25 00:35
schestowitzLike maximising a company's output of oilNov 25 00:35
_goblinbees the hive...Nov 25 00:35
schestowitzAnt colonies don't have thatNov 25 00:35
schestowitzUnless they are divided upon themselvesNov 25 00:35
_goblinbut don't they service the queen?Nov 25 00:36
schestowitzAnts have no monopoliesNov 25 00:36
schestowitzOr "royalties"Nov 25 00:36
schestowitzAdded value makes incomeNov 25 00:36
_goblinno but isnt that just an extension of human progress...Nov 25 00:36
schestowitzI could sell you a good pair of shoes based on some common knowledgeNov 25 00:36
schestowitzThe "Commons"Nov 25 00:36
schestowitzActually, human progress did not always come from patentsNov 25 00:37
oiaohmBefore patents cloning was a common thing.Nov 25 00:37
_goblinand isn't greed the driving force behind some of the greatest discoveries of man...Nov 25 00:37
oiaohmNot really _goblinNov 25 00:37
_goblinthe desire to do something better faster cheeper...Nov 25 00:37
schestowitzGood literature came from what we now know as a repeat "copyright infringer" (Shakespeare)Nov 25 00:37
oiaohmGreed is behind the destruction of most of our greatest discoveries.Nov 25 00:37
schestowitz_goblin: common respectNov 25 00:38
schestowitzLike in tribesNov 25 00:38
_goblinof course you can't blanket it with simple statements....exceptions....Nov 25 00:38
schestowitzFor some people in Western society, money became a GodNov 25 00:38
_goblinwhat about your personal data....Nov 25 00:38
oiaohmLike how to make docks that are tidal dredged  _goblin Nov 25 00:38
_goblinwhat about T-Mobile customers...Nov 25 00:38
schestowitzSo people throw numbers out there, even those who are scientists-turned-businessmenNov 25 00:38
schestowitzBusinessman rarely invent muchNov 25 00:38
schestowitzThey manageNov 25 00:38
oiaohmLot of tech has been lost over the centerys due to greed _goblinNov 25 00:38
_goblinvery true...Nov 25 00:39
oiaohmIe this provides us with and advantage.Nov 25 00:39
oiaohmSo we let no one else have it.Nov 25 00:39
_goblinbut the driving force behind man has always been that of aquisition....IMONov 25 00:39
schestowitzElectric car.......Nov 25 00:39
oiaohmthey human greed causes war.Nov 25 00:39
schestowitzNovelty...Nov 25 00:39
schestowitzBut not good for major polluters with thirst form oil..Nov 25 00:39
oiaohmSo killing the people who invented good stuff _goblinNov 25 00:39
schestowitzJust coal maybe.Nov 25 00:39
oiaohmSo we loss the tech _goblinNov 25 00:39
schestowitzLuddites are not mere farmersNov 25 00:39
oiaohmOr the people who create the tech keep it secrect and when they die we lose it as _wNov 25 00:40
schestowitzSome of today's most ruthless and richest people are the LudditesNov 25 00:40
oiaohmas well _goblinNov 25 00:40
schestowitzLike the Rockefellers. Earlier I found out about their AstroTurfs for energyNov 25 00:40
oiaohmGreed is harmful.Nov 25 00:40
schestowitzEarlier today that wasNov 25 00:40
_goblinlet me put this question to you then:Nov 25 00:40
oiaohmPatent system was designed to stop greedy people keeping stuff secret.Nov 25 00:40
*schestowitz all earsNov 25 00:40
schestowitzoiaohm: I beg your pardon??Nov 25 00:41
_goblinwhat would your solution be?  I tend to go down the direction of compliance, conformity......Nov 25 00:41
oiaohmNow the patent system is being abused by greed.Nov 25 00:41
schestowitz[citation needed]Nov 25 00:41
schestowitzoiaohm: it was designed to protect inventors and increase innovationNov 25 00:41
schestowitzThat's the myth anywayNov 25 00:41
oiaohmAt the time current patent system started.  Lot of black smiths and the like had trade secrets schestowitzNov 25 00:41
schestowitzNot to encourage publicationNov 25 00:41
oiaohmIe they would invent stuff then tell no one how they did it.Nov 25 00:42
_goblinI watch the "Everything is OK" vids, and think...ok then, whats your solution.....Nov 25 00:42
schestowitzTo whatn specifically?Nov 25 00:42
oiaohmIdea of patents was that it would be more profitable to tell you trade secrets.Nov 25 00:42
schestowitzThey talk about a variety of thingsNov 25 00:42
_goblinfreedom of speech......for starters...Nov 25 00:42
schestowitzYes...Nov 25 00:42
_goblinwe can't have it....Nov 25 00:42
_goblinits impossible....Nov 25 00:43
oiaohmSome of the first patents are over metal mixes of all things schestowitzNov 25 00:43
schestowitz_goblin: depends.Nov 25 00:43
schestowitzIt's a tricky oneNov 25 00:43
_goblinbecause if we do, then we would also hate mongering....racism and condone all manner of offensive behaviour...Nov 25 00:43
_goblin*also allow hateNov 25 00:43
_goblinits like censorship....Nov 25 00:44
_goblinwe must have that....Nov 25 00:44
schestowitzin the news: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8374519.stm " Heart attack risk 'raised by suppressing anger'"Nov 25 00:44
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 93.61 KBNov 25 00:44
_goblinits easy to talk about censorship when talking about China and opposition to the government......Nov 25 00:44
schestowitzCHallenges of power that isNov 25 00:44
schestowitzIt usually boils down to power strugglesNov 25 00:44
schestowitzAnd there's an issue hereNov 25 00:45
_goblinbut if we don't have censorship, then you can imagine what material people would be exposed to....Nov 25 00:45
schestowitzCause those in power take away speech so that people cannot talk about how to overthrow powerNov 25 00:45
_goblinyes, and thats wrong....Nov 25 00:45
schestowitzSee ChinaNov 25 00:45
_goblinbut in those vids...is it really an infringment of human rights to be prevented from swearing in front of a child?Nov 25 00:46
schestowitzFor a developed stage of the problemNov 25 00:46
oiaohmI notice they left out stress causing lack of sleep ie causing problems.Nov 25 00:46
schestowitzWhere you are killed or put in prison for just criticising the political partyNov 25 00:46
schestowitz_goblin: no swearingNov 25 00:46
_goblinbut then thats our values being imposed on another culture....Nov 25 00:46
oiaohmHmm ok so you blieve media is not censored.Nov 25 00:47
_goblinfor example...age of consent in this country is 16...in some its less and in some its more....all have different values about what constitutes a child...Nov 25 00:47
_goblinoiaohm: in this country no.Nov 25 00:48
_goblinoiaohm: in others....I am not qualified to answer.Nov 25 00:48
oiaohmWhat country _goblinNov 25 00:48
_goblinUK..Nov 25 00:48
oiaohmOk yours is censored the same way it is done here.Nov 25 00:48
_goblini think in the UK the media is so uncensorsed to the point of being completely wrong....Nov 25 00:48
_goblintake the DNA story running at the moment.Nov 25 00:48
_goblinMedia is suggesting that people are arrested simply to be put onto a DNA database....Nov 25 00:49
oiaohmIf you as a media firm speak out about something you should not you miss out being first with news important information.Nov 25 00:49
oiaohmSo censored by information control.Nov 25 00:49
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sub-notebooks with Google's GNU/Linux Could be Given for Free? http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/would-you-accept-googles-free-netbookNov 25 00:50
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Would You Accept Google's Free Netbook? | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 102.1 KBNov 25 00:50
_goblinbut then isn't that the fault of the press?Nov 25 00:50
_goblinand isn't it the fault of the viewer to buy into it?Nov 25 00:50
oiaohmLess in face than china method _goblin not 100 percent effective.Nov 25 00:50
oiaohmDon't you notice politions and the like don't give interviews on particular channels after that channel says bad thing about them.  instead uses a rival.Nov 25 00:51
oiaohmInformation control censorship _goblinNov 25 00:51
oiaohmToe the line or be last getting the information.Nov 25 00:52
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE on Television http://dot.kde.org/2009/11/24/konqueror-icon-setting-tvs-ablazeNov 25 00:52
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Konqueror Icon Setting TVs Ablaze | KDE.news .::. Size~: 24.86 KBNov 25 00:52
_goblinoiaohm: Really?  In this age of youtube...citizen journalism et al...its not un-common for a story to break by a member of public and then get picked up by the papers.Nov 25 00:53
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Dell Prepares to Support Next Version of #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux http://ur1.ca/ghctNov 25 00:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Dell Shows Ubuntu 10.04 Lucid Lynx Some Love | WorksWithU .::. Size~: 52.34 KBNov 25 00:54
_goblinoiaohm: whilst some of the public are complaining about being under CCTV in a big brother state, they seem more than happy to film others and publish them on the net to millions....(Everything is OK vids)Nov 25 00:54
oiaohmMain stream media has been censored _goblinNov 25 00:54
oiaohmMost people don't notice it.Nov 25 00:54
oiaohmI expect in time youtube to be made to be in the same class as tablods.Nov 25 00:55
_goblinoiaohm: I (unfortunately) can't go any further with this....however what I will say, is that Ive yet to see an example of Media censorship....in my opinions Government Organizations are frightened of the media, because it is not censored.Nov 25 00:55
oiaohmThe way it done is suttle _goblinNov 25 00:56
_goblinI have never seen proof...Nov 25 00:56
oiaohmGulf war embed journaist.Nov 25 00:57
_goblinahNov 25 00:57
_goblinI think we are at different purposes here...Nov 25 00:57
oiaohmOnly media not against goverment used.Nov 25 00:57
_goblinforiegn policy I could not answer for....Nov 25 00:57
_goblinI was talking more "homeland" affairs.Nov 25 00:57
oiaohmEven inside your country.Nov 25 00:57
oiaohmLot of invites to press confs are selective.Nov 25 00:57
oiaohmSo only friendly media are there.Nov 25 00:58
oiaohmSo only freindly media can break the story.Nov 25 00:58
oiaohmIts a far suttler way of applying censor ship _goblinNov 25 00:58
_goblinpress invites? again if we are talking UK matters, no such thing...Nov 25 00:58
_goblinlike I say, I cannot really go further with this...Nov 25 00:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu Netbook Remix Receives Good Review from Linux-hostile Publication http://ur1.ca/ghd2Nov 25 00:59
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ubuntu Netbook Remix review - PC Advisor .::. Size~: 65.7 KBNov 25 00:59
oiaohmInterviews with primemistor and queen are done by invite _goblinNov 25 00:59
_goblinsuffice to say that honesty, accountability and integrity are keywords that are actually lived by with organizations that I work with...Nov 25 00:59
oiaohmTo be censored don't mean you have to lie.Nov 25 01:00
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sub-notebooks with ARM Chips (and GNU/Linux) Can Outdo W|Intel http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-10400275-64.htmlNov 25 01:00
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Will the 'smartbook' be a better Netbook? | Nanotech - The Circuits Blog - CNET News .::. Size~: 126.75 KBNov 25 01:00
_goblinno but then the omission can be a lie in itself....Nov 25 01:00
_goblin"I swear by almighty God, to give the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth"Nov 25 01:00
oiaohmLot of omissions happen.Nov 25 01:00
cubezzzwhere are the ARM netbooks thoughNov 25 01:01
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Another New #Phone Runs #Linux http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/11/24/emblaze_demos_else/Nov 25 01:01
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Emblaze demos Else handset • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 20.06 KBNov 25 01:01
cubezzzI'm still lookingNov 25 01:01
_goblinand in matters of criminal law, an intentional omission will loose a case...Nov 25 01:01
_goblinand could find you in contempt...or perverting the course....Nov 25 01:01
oiaohmIf you don't talk about the complete subject you have not breached ethics.Nov 25 01:01
oiaohmIe the story just did not have space to run _goblinNov 25 01:02
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Sub-notebooks Now for Under $200 http://ur1.ca/gea2 http://ur1.ca/ghdeNov 25 01:02
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Dell Vostro A90 8.9” netbook with Ubuntu on sale for $184 .::. Size~: 24.28 KBNov 25 01:02
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ubuntu based Dell Vostro A90 netbook on sale for $184 .::. Size~: 40.5 KBNov 25 01:02
Diablo-D3$184 you say?Nov 25 01:02
cubezzzI can't even get a Vostro with Linux from dell.caNov 25 01:03
cubezzzand the price was way higher tooNov 25 01:03
cubezzzor perhaps I should say "without windows" on itNov 25 01:03
_goblinoiaohm: sorry, I was not ignoring....called away for a few minutes...Nov 25 01:07
_goblinoiaohm: In respect of the Queen, she has no real power....its mostly ceromonial...Nov 25 01:07
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Government of #Spain Makes Real Shift to #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/ghdx http://ur1.ca/ghdyNov 25 01:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle: ES: CIO Extremadura 'open source key to development' —  .::. Size~: 27.56 KBNov 25 01:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Students line up for new free software master at open universities —  .::. Size~: 28.58 KBNov 25 01:08
_goblinoiaohm: In respect of the government since they were voted in democratically, people only have themselves to be responsible....Nov 25 01:08
cubezzzI wonder if I could actually build a netbook or notebookNov 25 01:10
_goblinalthough I agree with consumerism, I think this vid is the best example of why its bad: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93yDaVSbuK0&NR=1Nov 25 01:11
cubezzzwould dell US sell to me in Canada?Nov 25 01:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Unrest Grows Over Web Abuse and Erosion of Digital Rights http://ur1.ca/ghe1 http://ur1.ca/ghe2Nov 25 01:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Opera Complies with Censorship in #China http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8376555.stmNov 25 01:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC News - Protests grow over digital bill .::. Size~: 57.91 KBNov 25 01:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Setting the record straight on Net neutrality and infrastructure investment | La Quadrature du Net .::. Size~: 21.19 KBNov 25 01:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 93.69 KBNov 25 01:12
_goblinfunny thing about censorship and government.....Nov 25 01:12
_goblinask any Polish person about Poland when it was under communism and you will find they are very pro....Nov 25 01:13
oiaohmThe most annoying thing is you do a search of products on dell and it lists linux as a option then when I go to get it since I am in Australia no Linux version.Nov 25 01:13
oiaohmNow communism and censorship don't have to go hand and hand.Nov 25 01:13
oiaohmMyth of the west.Nov 25 01:13
_goblinagreed....however in Poland (according to my sources) it did...Nov 25 01:14
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] not that this is me or anything http://www.whattheduck.net/strip/377Nov 25 01:14
_goblinhowever people were happier....Nov 25 01:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 377 | What The Duck .::. Size~: 23.3 KBNov 25 01:14
_goblinnot saying thats an umbrella rule....Nov 25 01:14
oiaohmMore good news got reported as well.  _goblinNov 25 01:14
_goblinbut then if people believe they are happy is that not just as good?Nov 25 01:14
oiaohmThat is the funny thing.  Good new basically gets censored out by free press editors most of the time.Nov 25 01:14
oiaohmBecause bad news gets more viewers but worried viewers ie unhappy viewers.Nov 25 01:15
_goblinbut then bad news can be a good control too.....Nov 25 01:15
_goblindo as we say...we will keep you safeNov 25 01:15
oiaohmExactlyNov 25 01:16
_goblinyou can apply negatives to any press...Nov 25 01:16
oiaohmForms of inderect censorship and control _goblinNov 25 01:16
oiaohmDirect censorship and control are simple to spot.Nov 25 01:16
cubezzzon the phone to dell nowNov 25 01:16
_goblinbut then lets look at my blog....for example.....Nov 25 01:16
_goblinif I was to read a genuine good news story about Microsoft, would I write about it?Nov 25 01:17
oiaohmThe internet is cracking the censorship systems.Nov 25 01:17
_goblinif I live by my ethos of honesty, integrity and accountability.....Nov 25 01:17
_goblinId say I probably wouldn't....Nov 25 01:17
oiaohmBut internet also has bias.Nov 25 01:17
_goblinI believe MS is harmful to the IT world, so I would be reluctant to print a story......Nov 25 01:18
oiaohmMS solution to bad stories on line is to flood them.Nov 25 01:18
_goblinhaving said that I honestly don't believe Ive ever been in that position...Nov 25 01:18
_goblinso until it happens, I don't know.Nov 25 01:18
oiaohminternet is secondary media.Nov 25 01:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Things Turn Sour for EU Internet http://ur1.ca/ghee http://ur1.ca/ghef http://ur1.ca/ghegNov 25 01:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC News - European MPs votes on new telecoms law .::. Size~: 50.62 KBNov 25 01:20
oiaohmInternet is a printing press that is not controlledNov 25 01:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Intellectual Property Watch  » Blog Archive   » EU Telecom Package To Enter Into Force In December .::. Size~: 40.61 KBNov 25 01:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: At last ... the 1709 Copyright Blog: Here comes a pan-European copyright regime? .::. Size~: 78.33 KBNov 25 01:20
phIRCe-BNcInternet is a printing press that is not controlledNov 25 01:20
oiaohmHmm phIRCe-BNc glitched ?Nov 25 01:20
_goblinI think its human nature to have bias, otherwise we wouldn't have unique thought.....I think the trick is to find bias on both sides and then strike a balance in the middle.Nov 25 01:20
oiaohmWay I look at it is everything is censored.Nov 25 01:21
oiaohmThe question is how much.Nov 25 01:21
oiaohmAnd by what forces.Nov 25 01:21
_goblindoes it matter though...?Nov 25 01:21
_goblinif its wrong, its wrong.Nov 25 01:21
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Britain Gives Hollywood More Internet Powers http://ur1.ca/g7l0 http://ur1.ca/ghej http://ur1.ca/ghekNov 25 01:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Britain's new Internet law -- as bad as everyone's been saying, and worse. Much, much worse.  - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 300.39 KBNov 25 01:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: UK and 12 Other Member States issue Statement on Telecoms Reform Package [UPDATED] | No Deep Packet Inspection .::. Size~: 29.39 KBNov 25 01:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: panGloss: Mandy and Me: some thoughts on the Digital Economy Bill .::. Size~: 108.33 KBNov 25 01:22
_goblinif Andre was to say MS is great, it doesn't matter if he's an employee or simply deluded.....its still the same opinion...Nov 25 01:22
oiaohmDefining wrong can be a very had thing _goblinNov 25 01:22
oiaohmFor MS share holders what MS has done has been good.Nov 25 01:22
_goblinto be wrong = something which does not agree with my opinion.....otherwise I wouldn't have conviction in my own views.Nov 25 01:23
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Qualcomm Off the Hook After Abuse Using #Patents http://ur1.ca/ghep http://ur1.ca/gherNov 25 01:23
_goblin*IMONov 25 01:23
phIRCe-BNcTitle: EU stops haranguing Qualcomm • The Register .::. Size~: 24.01 KBNov 25 01:23
oiaohmAbusing others I class as wrong _goblinNov 25 01:23
_goblinoh yes, agreed...Nov 25 01:23
oiaohmLot of what MS has done is abusive without question.Nov 25 01:24
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Call to Overhaul the #Patent System http://ur1.ca/ghew http://ur1.ca/ghexNov 25 01:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Calling For An Independent Invention Defense In Patents | Techdirt .::. Size~: 50.13 KBNov 25 01:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: open...: Software Copyright vs. Software Patents .::. Size~: 100.44 KBNov 25 01:24
_goblinagreed.....its what encourages me to write my blog.Nov 25 01:24
_goblinIve also experienced the MS faithful first hand....Nov 25 01:24
_goblinand also seen them attempt to bully others.Nov 25 01:25
oiaohmProblem with a MS good story like releasing an antivirus for free.  You are sitting there woundering if MS will jack up price of windows to recover cost.Nov 25 01:25
oiaohmHistory of IE and other they did that.Nov 25 01:25
cubezzzno go, U.S. onlyNov 25 01:25
_goblinexactly...thats why I say "genuine good news"...like I say though...Ive never been in that position.Nov 25 01:25
oiaohmProblem is even if ms does something genuine good you may not know for years _goblinNov 25 01:26
oiaohmIf it was genuineNov 25 01:26
_goblinand can a firm (any firm) who lives off making money, do anything genuinely good?  I don't think MS would be as big as it is today if it relied on kind guestures.Nov 25 01:27
cubezzzyou can get that deal though Diablo-D3Nov 25 01:27
_goblinanyway....Im off for the evening....great chat as always!!!!Nov 25 01:28
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oiaohmhttp://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/11/giving-up-the-gimp-is-a-sign-of-ubuntus-mainstream-maturity.ars  Now if they were droping it for likes if http://www.digikam.org/ but something .netNov 25 01:30
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Giving up the GIMP is a sign of Ubuntu's mainstream maturity .::. Size~: 42.3 KBNov 25 01:30
phIRCe-BNcTitle: digiKam - Photo Management Program | Manage your photographs as a professional with the power of Open Source .::. Size~: 25.02 KBNov 25 01:30
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Apple is Alienating Developers, Says Paul Graham http://paulgraham.com/apple.htmlNov 25 01:30
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Apple's Mistake .::. Size~: 19.29 KBNov 25 01:30
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Wants "Outside PR Agency" to Shill for Patents and FUD on FOSS http://ur1.ca/ghf9Nov 25 01:31
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Has Microsoft Got a Job for You... - Community - ComputerworldUK .::. Size~: 81.08 KBNov 25 01:31
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @schestowitz Absolutely brilliant links! I wish I had more time to read...I will certainly be looking at this tomorrow! Regards.Nov 25 01:32
cubezzz$319 Vostro A90 hmmmNov 25 01:40
cubezzzwell, big price differenceNov 25 01:40
fewacheaperthn thatNov 25 01:41
fewa$219Nov 25 01:41
fewawith ubuntuNov 25 01:41
fewahttp://www.dell.com/us/en/business/notebooks/laptop-vostro-a90/pd.aspx?refid=laptop-vostro-a90&cs=04&s=bsdNov 25 01:41
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schestowitzOK, time for posts en masseNov 25 01:45
schestowitzAbout 10 coming.....Nov 25 01:45
schestowitzfewa: I heard about Amy Goodman getting arrestedNov 25 01:46
fewarecently?Nov 25 01:46
schestowitzDon't knowNov 25 01:46
fewaor at the RNC last year?Nov 25 01:46
schestowitzShe has been a very, very naughty woman.... not to agree with the corporate pressNov 25 01:46
schestowitzMaybe RNCNov 25 01:46
fewayes she was arrested thenNov 25 01:46
schestowitzSome place where other got snatched tooNov 25 01:46
schestowitzPauling, Linus, maybe even Sagan got arrested tooNov 25 01:46
fewathats the descent into barbarismNov 25 01:47
schestowitzSOoner or later all those "evil" people are intimidated/harassed like this.Nov 25 01:47
schestowitzIn all the cases above it was organising for peaceNov 25 01:47
schestowitzVery, very naughty peaceNov 25 01:47
schestowitzThe "threat of peace"Nov 25 01:47
schestowitzWhat would worker in the Military Industrial Companies and Big Oil do?Nov 25 01:48
schestowitz"Stop preventing war!! You're ruining the economy!!!!"Nov 25 01:48
schestowitzEven nuclear cold war  was "good for the economy"Nov 25 01:49
schestowitzNot so much for the SovietNov 25 01:49
schestowitzThey went bankrupt firstNov 25 01:49
schestowitzAnd Bush doubled the national debt in his 8 years in officeNov 25 01:49
schestowitzWhere did this borrowed money go?Nov 25 01:49
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cubezzzfewa, for Canada thoughNov 25 01:55
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEi3COi3D5I&feature=response_watchNov 25 02:00
trmancololNov 25 02:08
trmancolook what I've foundNov 25 02:08
trmancoprocess `skype' is using obsolete setsockopt SO_BSDCOMPATNov 25 02:08
trmancoLOLNov 25 02:08
fewabut that is what capitalism isNov 25 02:08
fewageoism is the only form of "enlightened" capitalismNov 25 02:08
fewaHenry GeorgeNov 25 02:08
cubezzzok, only the Vostro A90 is windows freeNov 25 02:10
fewayesNov 25 02:11
cubezzz*everything* else I saw had windows on itNov 25 02:11
fewadell.com/ubuntuNov 25 02:11
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Paid #Caldera $280,000,000 and Made Incriminating Evidence Go “Poof!” http://ur1.ca/ghheNov 25 02:24
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cubezzzwow 280 millNov 25 02:24
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Apple Likely to Lose Developers, Microsoft Wants Free Software Developers (for Windows) http://ur1.ca/ghidNov 25 02:47
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Apple Likely to Lose Developers, Microsoft Wants Free Software Developers (for Windows) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 109.57 KBNov 25 02:47
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DaemonFCNewegg has free AVG Internet Security after mail in rebate on black fridayNov 25 03:05
ender2070_anti virus is for foolsNov 25 03:10
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Novell Promotes #Silverlight http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/24/novell-advancing-microsoft/Nov 25 03:23
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Novell Promotes Silverlight | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 110.61 KBNov 25 03:23
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Sued for Deliberately Making Competitor’s Product “Become Incompatible” http://ur1.ca/ghknNov 25 03:45
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Sued for Deliberately Making Competitors Product “Become Incompatible” | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 108.2 KBNov 25 03:45
ender2070_im compiling firefox 3.7Nov 25 04:03
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Confirmed: #Murdoch Waves Goodbye to #Google in Order to Please Ballmer http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/24/second-icahn-vs-google/Nov 25 04:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Confirmed: Murdoch Waves Goodbye to Google in Order to Please Ballmer | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.03 KBNov 25 04:18
schestowitzgnNov 25 04:21
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DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=do2xrL9H_f8&feature=relatedNov 25 05:10
DaemonFCB-)Nov 25 05:10
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qnq7N6X4x84Nov 25 05:17
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Omar87Hi guys, check out my comment here: http://www.fsdaily.com/Opposition/The_market_has_rejected_Linux_desktops_Get_over_it#comment-5451Nov 25 05:18
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DaemonFChttp://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/11/25/does-having-an-hdtv-actually-mean-anything-if-you-have-comcast/Nov 25 06:49
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Tip:clear bathroom window sill before putting coffee and toast there.Marmite on toast is not improved with the addition of talcum powder #fbNov 25 07:46
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_goblinRoy, you there?Nov 25 08:24
DaemonFCMicrosoft sent me a Windows logo t-shirt and baseball capNov 25 08:25
DaemonFCO_ONov 25 08:25
DaemonFCanyone want them?Nov 25 08:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] If most of your tweets are "I rated this youtube video" auto spam crap. I'll likely unfollow you. #spamtweetNov 25 09:02
ender2070_probably for promoting their software hereNov 25 09:03
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DaemonFCender2070_: Like which software precisely?Nov 25 09:10
ender2070_windowsNov 25 09:11
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Got my company pass today. Switched $COMPANY lanyard for Ubuntu bamboo one http://bit.ly/5vcuPj #subtlemarketingNov 25 09:38
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Canonical Store .::. Size~: 16.8 KBNov 25 09:38
fewahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYjyvkR0bGQNov 25 09:47
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schestowitz_goblin: yesNov 25 10:26
_goblinlol....Nov 25 10:27
_goblinnot bad....Nov 25 10:27
_goblin2 hours!Nov 25 10:27
_goblinits not important....Nov 25 10:27
_goblinIve sorted it now...Nov 25 10:27
_goblinjust a silly question that I had.....Nov 25 10:27
DaemonFCWhat really still has me in awe, is iTunesNov 25 10:30
DaemonFCas in, how did that many people pay for a library of music in DRM'd files?Nov 25 10:31
DaemonFCand why are all the tracks $1.29 now instead of 99 cents?Nov 25 10:31
_goblindid the average user really understand DRM?  would they not have thought "it works, so who cares"...that was until they tried to make backup copies....Nov 25 10:32
DaemonFCThe last DRM'd files I've actually experienced was in 2004, when Pepsi gave you "free songs" for bottlecapsNov 25 10:32
schestowitzfewa: thanks for the video. Police state!Nov 25 10:32
DaemonFCyou punched in the code into iTunes and you would get 1 creditNov 25 10:32
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DaemonFCso I saved up the bottlecaps from all the Pepsi I was drinking at work and bought a few albums one dayNov 25 10:33
DaemonFCthen I tried to play them in Winamp, no goodNov 25 10:33
DaemonFCWindows Media Player, wouldn't playNov 25 10:33
DaemonFCVLC couldn't play themNov 25 10:33
DaemonFCand so I ended up calling their customer support to ask why the files were damaged or in some weird formatNov 25 10:34
DaemonFCand how I could get them to workNov 25 10:34
DaemonFCthat's when they explained, in marketing speak, how DRM worksNov 25 10:34
DaemonFCso thanks to that promo tie-in, I was disgusted with DRM before I ever actually bought anything from themNov 25 10:34
DaemonFCI'd have been REAL pissed if I had paid full album price for crippled filesNov 25 10:35
DaemonFCbut lots of people bought thousands of tracks like thatNov 25 10:35
DaemonFCwithout batting an eyelidNov 25 10:35
DaemonFCeither cause they're rich, stupid, or both (Mac users)Nov 25 10:36
DaemonFCI think I also explained once in here how Windows Media DRM facilitates spyware installationsNov 25 10:37
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fewaschestowitz, its the video you referred to earlierNov 25 10:38
DaemonFCblack friday cheapie, $10 4 GB SD or Micro SD cards at WalmartNov 25 10:39
DaemonFCwootNov 25 10:40
schestowitzfewa: didn't see the video.. hadn't seen ratherNov 25 10:40
schestowitz"Conspiracy to riot"Nov 25 10:40
schestowitzProtest -> Riot -> TerroristNov 25 10:40
schestowitzOrganise -> ConspireNov 25 10:40
schestowitzEven "libertarian" was warped by the right wingersNov 25 10:41
fewasame law they tried to use here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_SevenNov 25 10:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Chicago Seven - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 75.6 KBNov 25 10:42
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fewaand here http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/10/man-arrested-twittering-goes-court-eff-has-documenNov 25 10:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Man Arrested for Twittering Goes to Court, EFF Has the Documents | Electronic Frontier Foundation .::. Size~: 18.97 KBNov 25 10:42
fewahttp://www.democracynow.org/2009/10/6/twitter_crackdown_nyc_activist_arrested_forNov 25 10:43
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Twitter Crackdown: NYC Activist Arrested for Using Social Networking Site during G-20 Protest in Pittsburgh .::. Size~: 47.88 KBNov 25 10:43
fewa(interview)Nov 25 10:43
schestowitzfewa: it must have had the necessary effect; her and her fellow people will be afraid to stage a protest nowNov 25 10:43
fewathe video recieved 1M viewsNov 25 10:43
fewaand she did not stage protestNov 25 10:43
schestowitzYesNov 25 10:43
fewanor did any of here fellow reportersNov 25 10:43
schestowitzIt's good they got the videoNov 25 10:43
fewashe is a reportedNov 25 10:43
schestowitzOnly made her most respectedNov 25 10:43
fewashe was reporting on things that were happeningNov 25 10:44
schestowitzHeh.Nov 25 10:44
schestowitzMaybe Bush sent his little troops....Nov 25 10:44
fewathe corporate media was notNov 25 10:44
schestowitzPrivate army...Nov 25 10:44
fewaeven if it was right thereNov 25 10:44
schestowitzFull armorNov 25 10:44
schestowitzTo treat an adult ladyNov 25 10:44
schestowitzI wonder what they had Linus arrested forNov 25 10:45
fewahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnTtZOy5hO4Nov 25 10:45
schestowitzIt's always curious... the circumstancesNov 25 10:45
DaemonFCThey throw you in jail and figure out what lies they'll tell in court laterNov 25 10:47
DaemonFCnothing new thereNov 25 10:47
DaemonFCthe police always lie under oath to help the state convict youNov 25 10:48
DaemonFCand they're always "credible witnesses"Nov 25 10:48
fewatheres alot of truth behind thatNov 25 10:48
fewabut i wouldn't state it as such as absoluteNov 25 10:48
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DaemonFCit's why I asked my lawyer to make a motion to suppress police testimonyNov 25 10:48
DaemonFCrelating to my mental state during the time period in questionNov 25 10:48
DaemonFCthe judge prevented the police from testifying alltogetherNov 25 10:49
DaemonFCthe motion to suppress was on the grounds that they are not certified mental health professionalsNov 25 10:49
DaemonFC:)Nov 25 10:49
schestowitzThere was a similar incident in the UK, fewaNov 25 10:49
DaemonFCthe prosecution's case fell apart one piece at a timeNov 25 10:50
DaemonFCuntil the judge dismissed the caseNov 25 10:50
DaemonFCit was awesomeNov 25 10:50
DaemonFCthose police officers were PISSEDNov 25 10:50
DaemonFCthey were fumingNov 25 10:50
DaemonFCI've been in court several times, some as plaintiff and some as defendant, some criminal, some civilNov 25 10:52
fewaschestowitz, its not like this is the only oneNov 25 10:52
DaemonFCthe most that the state ever got out of those ordeals was to order me to therapyNov 25 10:52
DaemonFCthat was last yearNov 25 10:52
DaemonFCI made a deal with the prosecutorNov 25 10:52
DaemonFCthey dropped the charges after I went to anger managementNov 25 10:53
DaemonFCWhat's one more idiot therapist to appease?Nov 25 10:53
fewalike nader at the 2000 presidendial debatesNov 25 10:54
DaemonFCThe score is, you go in there all defiant and everything, then you let them think they're whittling you down and remaking you however they see fitNov 25 10:54
fewaa political exclusionNov 25 10:54
DaemonFCit's so easy to bullshit a therapist because psychiatry is not realNov 25 10:54
DaemonFCit's not a firm and defined fieldNov 25 10:54
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DaemonFCabout the only time the psychiatrists get any diagnosis correct, is when it's so obvious that you don't even need a PHD to tell what's wrong with someoneNov 25 10:56
DaemonFCand psychiatry is a corrupt practice, because the state has perverted it to suppress political dissidents and social "undesirables"Nov 25 10:56
DaemonFCin the US, until 1972, being gay was considered a severe mental illness and you were "committed" for "treatment"; see "Torture"Nov 25 10:57
DaemonFCthe Soviet Union used psychiatrists to "hospitalize" the "mentally ill" who didn't like the Soviet Union or the Communist PartyNov 25 10:57
fewaGulagNov 25 10:58
DaemonFCthe state's goal is to use psychiatrists as another control mechanismNov 25 10:58
DaemonFCto scare the shit out of youNov 25 10:58
kecskebakI'm trying out Fedora 12 at the moment. I've been a big Ubuntu fan up to now, but some of the things they are doing worry me.Nov 25 10:58
DaemonFCcause you know what happens to "those people"Nov 25 10:58
fewakecskebak, I use Linux, but......Nov 25 10:58
DaemonFCmeh, Ubuntu is a lousy distroNov 25 10:59
DaemonFCkeep goingNov 25 10:59
DaemonFCyou can do betterNov 25 10:59
schestowitzkecskebak: KDE or GNOME?Nov 25 10:59
kecskebakGNOME for now - I can't get on with KDENov 25 10:59
kecskebakI tried it this weekNov 25 10:59
DaemonFCUbuntu is like settling for a fat slob because you know it will never reject youNov 25 10:59
schestowitzOKNov 25 10:59
schestowitzfewa: he refers to the decisions made by CanonicalNov 25 10:59
fewaahaNov 25 11:00
fewabut he needs to be more specificNov 25 11:00
kecskebakI disliked the software storeNov 25 11:00
kecskebakI dislike MonoNov 25 11:00
fewameh it wasn't badNov 25 11:00
DaemonFCKubuntu hasn't been Kontaminated much yetNov 25 11:00
fewabut yesNov 25 11:00
fewamono is a piece of shitNov 25 11:00
DaemonFCbut if you want to go that route, just use SiduxNov 25 11:00
MinceRmoar liek contamonotedNov 25 11:00
fewacanonical is making short-term decisionsNov 25 11:00
DaemonFCSidux is way nicer than KubuntuNov 25 11:00
fewaand neglects the strengthening of FOSSNov 25 11:01
DaemonFCI like the whole rolling release deal myselfNov 25 11:01
kecskebakI like the fact that GNOME is so clean and straightforward - KDE seems very gimmickyNov 25 11:01
fewaby supporting non-free driversNov 25 11:01
DaemonFCkecskebak: They've been neglecting huge gaping holes in KDE to go polish the chrome elsewhereNov 25 11:01
kecskebakI'm using nouveau drivers on Fedora and they are just fine for InkscapeNov 25 11:01
DaemonFCmost of it is very nice, but some things don't exist there at allNov 25 11:01
_goblin"mono is a piece of shit" - Interesting point.  If for example there were no patent trap/Microsoftesq worries/connections about Mono would it still receive the same bad press?  I wonder if its maybe Microsofts actions/behaviour that have stiffled Mono acceptance...Nov 25 11:02
kecskebakThe software store refers to "free", but it seems to be as in beer but not in "speech".Nov 25 11:02
DaemonFCOffice Max has a $150 netbook!!!Nov 25 11:02
DaemonFCon Friday B-)Nov 25 11:02
fewakecskebak, yes, canonical uses the brainwash terminologyNov 25 11:02
MinceR_goblin: do "Microsofteq worries" include the fact that m$ controls the platform? :)Nov 25 11:03
_goblinyes....Nov 25 11:03
fewathe neutered corporate termsNov 25 11:03
_goblinthats what I meant....cut MS away completely...Nov 25 11:03
DaemonFCwell, it surprises me that Windows hasn't been locked down as much as you would expectNov 25 11:03
MinceRi think m$ has certainly stifled the acceptance of monoNov 25 11:03
_goblinand would it be, in itself poorly accepted...Nov 25 11:03
MinceRmost of the problems with mono are directly related to themNov 25 11:03
DaemonFCwell, why use a second rate clone when you can get the real thing?Nov 25 11:04
_goblinI like to cite Gamemaker (by Yoyogames) here.....Nov 25 11:04
DaemonFCthe point of Mono has never been to be compatible with .NetNov 25 11:04
_goblina script language that tacks itself onto a runtime in order to make an executable.Nov 25 11:04
DaemonFCMicrosoft would never allow them to catch upNov 25 11:04
DaemonFCMoonlight is always a year or more behind SilverlightNov 25 11:04
_goblinDaemonFC: Agreed....Nov 25 11:04
DaemonFCwhy do they bother?Nov 25 11:04
_goblinDaemonFC: Mono is the methodone, the hardstuff can only be got by going "pure" MS.Nov 25 11:05
MinceRDaemonFC: you mean, why use a second-rate clone of java? :>Nov 25 11:05
kecskebakI don't dislike Ubuntu as a distro - it is very, very good for new users and I would never have discovered free software without it.Nov 25 11:05
DaemonFChmmm, that's an insult!Nov 25 11:05
DaemonFClolNov 25 11:05
kecskebakIt's just that some of the decisions the community is making strike me as curious.Nov 25 11:05
kecskebakAnd I think they are harming free software.Nov 25 11:06
DaemonFCit's hard to get worse than JavaNov 25 11:06
DaemonFCbut I agree that in some ways, .Net has managedNov 25 11:06
_goblinas I was saying, GM is a pretty bloated and poorly implimented scripting language, that has a devout following and enables simple app development....its crap, but because its Indi, is it seen as good?Nov 25 11:06
_goblinmaybe its always been the only people killing the FOSS, were proprietary companies.....all proprietary companies...Nov 25 11:07
_goblinas I say, if Yoyogames had created Mono, would we still be reacting against its infection of Ubuntu?Nov 25 11:07
kecskebakI think that GNU/Linux is so precious, and the companies that want to see it fail are so powerful, that caution, even extreme caution, is entirely rational.Nov 25 11:09
_goblinagreed.Nov 25 11:09
kecskebakI don't want to be a ladder kicker, so my kids can't enjoy free software in the same way that I've been able too.Nov 25 11:09
_goblinbut then a kid faced with say Alien Arena or GTA....I think the choice they would make is obvious.Nov 25 11:10
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Muppets doing Bohemian Rhapsody in 1080p on #YouTube http://ur1.ca/ghnuNov 25 11:11
_goblinI hope nobody minds, but Kecskebak, I would like to link again to a vid showing the power of proprietary: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wgn2jugK_HkNov 25 11:11
kecskebakI'll be back in a while - it's dinner time here in Hungary!Nov 25 11:12
_goblin:)Nov 25 11:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More #Microsoft #Cashback Flaws, Cashback Actually a Throwback http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/internet-explorer-cashback-flaws/Nov 25 11:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: More Microsoft Cashback Flaws, Cashback Actually a Throwback, Internet Explorer Gets More New Flaws (Zero-Day) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.1 KBNov 25 11:16
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOvGTULHw2YNov 25 11:31
DaemonFCloved that gameNov 25 11:31
DaemonFCmusic wasn't bad eitherNov 25 11:31
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXkOdveHWhU&feature=relatedNov 25 11:34
DaemonFClive version of thatNov 25 11:34
DaemonFChttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HTkvjR4IgI&feature=relatedNov 25 11:35
DaemonFCand a speed run B-)Nov 25 11:35
DaemonFCI wish I still had that Genesis and not just a stupid emulatorNov 25 11:39
DaemonFC@ 6:15 was my favorite bossNov 25 11:42
fewammm a Hungary dinner :PNov 25 11:45
fewakecskebak, GNU/Linux is alot more powerful than you make it out to beNov 25 11:45
fewabig companies cant write softwareNov 25 11:45
fewathat anyone will actually want to useNov 25 11:46
fewa"enterprise software"Nov 25 11:46
fewaaka crapNov 25 11:46
DaemonFCMicrosoft fucked up Street Fighter on the 360Nov 25 11:49
DaemonFCthey might as well have given the AI players infinite healthNov 25 11:49
DaemonFCthere went $10 I'll never get back :PNov 25 11:49
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Complaints About Perverted #EIF Continue to Pile Up http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/eif-many-complain-after-forums/ (ta, @glynmoody )Nov 25 11:50
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Complaints About Perverted EIF Continue to Pile Up | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 114.11 KBNov 25 11:50
amarsh04schestowitz, I will be following up Automatic Number Plate Recognition system uses with our local police ministerNov 25 11:54
DaemonFClicense plate?Nov 25 11:55
_goblinhi amarsh04! whats the problem with ANPR?Nov 25 11:55
DaemonFCI got a big can of bear strength pepper spray for if that asshole next door bothers me againNov 25 12:02
kecskebakBack again - you're never hungry in Hungary for long. Staying under three tonnes is a struggle around here...Nov 25 12:05
*oiaohm (n=oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 12:12
*kecskebak has quit ()Nov 25 12:16
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*zer0c00l (n=user@117.199.133.80) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 12:16
schestowitz[11:45] <fewa> mmm a Hungary dinner :PNov 25 12:21
schestowitz???Nov 25 12:21
schestowitzDid I miss s/t?Nov 25 12:21
schestowitzamarsh04: we have it hereNov 25 12:22
schestowitzfewa: oh, I see... a jokeNov 25 12:23
schestowitzI thought it was about the Hungary reports I wrote about less than an hour agoNov 25 12:23
kecskebakNo, it's just the fact that I live in HungaryNov 25 12:24
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft's “Multi-Million Dollar Budget and Relationship With an Outside PR Agency” to Attack Software Freedom http://ur1.ca/giadNov 25 12:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Looks to Manage “Multi-Million Dollar Budget and Relationship With an Outside PR Agency” to Attack Software Freedom | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.46 KBNov 25 12:24
schestowitzkecskebak: MinceR alsoNov 25 12:24
schestowitzBallmer lives there too sometimes, when he needs more moneyNov 25 12:24
kecskebakNeoliberal government - not very pleasant for the people who live here.Nov 25 12:25
kecskebakBut it's still a lovely countryNov 25 12:26
MinceRit would be a lovely country if it weren't for most of the people that live hereNov 25 12:27
kecskebakAre you in Budapest?Nov 25 12:27
MinceRi amNov 25 12:27
kecskebakThe people in Kiskunhalas are lovelyNov 25 12:27
kecskebakI wasn't keen on Budapest when I lived there.Nov 25 12:28
oiaohmhttp://www.gizmag.com/biodegradable-plastic/13410/  This could be intersting thinking the plastic they are making is the most common one used in items like reprapNov 25 12:28
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Simpler, cheaper, biodegradable plastic without using fossil fuels .::. Size~: 44.32 KBNov 25 12:29
MinceReven Kiskunhalas is subject to the machinations of some peopleNov 25 12:30
kecskebakOh yes - Government funded discos :)Nov 25 12:30
MinceRand the same state opresses people in the same wayNov 25 12:30
MinceRs/p/pp/Nov 25 12:31
DaemonFCI downloaded the audio book of Napalm and Silly PuttyNov 25 12:42
DaemonFCpretty funny so farNov 25 12:42
*bing (n=ben@87-198-16-156.ptr.magnet.ie) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 12:57
bingi'm a little concerned with the integrity of a photo shown on boycottnovell.comNov 25 12:59
schestowitzhey benNov 25 12:59
schestowitzwhich one?Nov 25 12:59
binghttp://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Miguel_de_Icaza.jpgNov 25 12:59
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBNov 25 12:59
binguh, the one of miguel holding an xp boxNov 25 13:00
schestowitzHe doesNov 25 13:00
schestowitzIt's called "humour"Nov 25 13:00
kecskebakDave Lee-Travis picked Roy up on that on FLOSS Weekly.Nov 25 13:00
schestowitzAnd not far fetched, eitherNov 25 13:00
bingit's gimp'd, and it doesn't come from  wikipedia like the article suggestsNov 25 13:00
schestowitzThe image isNov 25 13:00
bingyeah, like it said it's just an integrity issueNov 25 13:00
schestowitzIt's modified, as the licence permitsNov 25 13:01
schestowitzbing:  it isNov 25 13:01
schestowitzMiguel has no integrityNov 25 13:01
ThistleWebI dunno, most peeps who have windows dont know it comes in a box, or that they're actually paying for itNov 25 13:01
schestowitzI hope Port 25 offers him a jobNov 25 13:01
schestowitzThis time we can explain more easily to people who he works forNov 25 13:01
bingschestowitz, i enjoy the irony of the picture, and it's some good satireNov 25 13:02
bingschestowitz, and it's not a licensing issue about the image that i'm concerned with.Nov 25 13:02
kecskebakI think it's fine as it's so obviously GIMP-ed.Nov 25 13:02
kecskebakIf it was done well, it may be a problem.Nov 25 13:03
bingyeah i think it just lowers the integrity of the siteNov 25 13:03
kecskebakIf it was a cartoon, would it bother you?Nov 25 13:03
bingkecskebak, not at allNov 25 13:04
bingkecskebak, but it wouldn't at a glance be attributable to a noteworthy siteNov 25 13:04
kecskebakbing I can see where you are coming from. I think perhaps it could have been more of a collage, with a different background as well.Nov 25 13:05
bingyeah it's just my 2 centsNov 25 13:05
kecskebakbing The more I think about it the more I can see your point.Nov 25 13:06
bingi think the story pretty major thoughNov 25 13:06
bing...to drop the gimp for f-spotNov 25 13:06
ThistleWebbing: are you MS's search engine?Nov 25 13:06
kecskebakThat's why I'm on Fedora todayNov 25 13:06
bingThistleWeb, nope.  my nick predates the search engine.Nov 25 13:06
ThistleWebor just a person with a nick named after it?Nov 25 13:06
ThistleWebahh, convienient, any relation to twitter?Nov 25 13:07
bingkecskebak, yeah, it might be nice to make migration software for people to easily switch from ubuntu to fedoraNov 25 13:07
*iKonaK (n=user-0@89.137.219.70) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 13:07
bingThistleWeb, my nick lets me do this:Nov 25 13:07
*bing bing bing bing!Nov 25 13:07
ThistleWebahh, I seeNov 25 13:07
bingkecskebak, you know... bring over documents, copy over the high scores from the logic games... that sort of thingNov 25 13:08
schestowitzSorry, catching up again.........Nov 25 13:08
schestowitzbing: that photo of de Icaza is widely usedNov 25 13:08
schestowitzThe original oneNov 25 13:09
DaemonFCCarlin: "Now they call them 'uniformed crew members', that's a relief. As opposed to the guy sitting next to me in the Grateful Dead t-shirt and the 'Fuck You' hat finishing off his 9th Kahlua"Nov 25 13:09
schestowitzSo people who are 'into' this debate will see the joke straight awayNov 25 13:09
DaemonFC"Now I'll know who to look for"Nov 25 13:09
schestowitzI didn't even do a good GIMP job, it was rushed.Nov 25 13:09
ThistleWebI could see a problem if the image was altered to be something out of characterNov 25 13:09
schestowitzLook at the size of the XP boxNov 25 13:09
schestowitzIt's deliberately oversizedNov 25 13:09
bingschestowitz, i'm into the debate and i was left with the impression that i'd find that image on wikipedia, and i didn'tNov 25 13:09
schestowitzIt's like twice the size of the man's headNov 25 13:10
schestowitzWhich is metaphoricNov 25 13:10
ThistleWebsince it is a visual play on what Miquel does and has been doing, it could classed as satire, or a more accurate version of what's going on than the original imageNov 25 13:10
kecskebakThat said, it's more believable that most of the things on Photoshop Disasters.Nov 25 13:10
ThistleWebif it was an OSX box he was holding I could understand, as, as far as I know Miguel and Apple have no connectionNov 25 13:11
schestowitzbing: it's in the main article about MiguelNov 25 13:11
bingso hire an editorial cartoonist.  that would class it up.Nov 25 13:11
schestowitzIt's the best-known photo of himNov 25 13:11
schestowitzThat's why I chose itNov 25 13:11
schestowitzTo turn a classic into parodyNov 25 13:11
ThistleWebhe has chosen a path which sees him helping promote MS and it's techNov 25 13:12
bingschestowitz: yeah i enjoyed the image.  it's just an integrity issue.Nov 25 13:12
kecskebakYes, but you can be right in the right way and right in the wrong way. It's better to be the former.Nov 25 13:12
schestowitzI'm not buying the whole "I used bing before" defenseNov 25 13:12
schestowitzUnless you can produce evidenceNov 25 13:12
kecskebakMind you, I can talk calling Jono Dave Lee Travis ;)Nov 25 13:12
bingschestowitz: lookup the registration date of the nick, or the other channel i'm inNov 25 13:12
schestowitzSmells more like drive-by buzz advertisingNov 25 13:12
ThistleWebso an altered promo image of him doing a photoshoot for a MS product is perfectly validNov 25 13:12
bingschestowitz or i can give you links to me free software projects if you likeNov 25 13:13
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Ridiculous #Patents , Qualcomm Permitted to Abuse, Human Rights Step in as Overhaul Debated http://ur1.ca/gid5Nov 25 13:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Patents Roundup: More Ridiculous Patents, Qualcomm Permitted to Abuse, Human Rights Step in as Overhaul Debated | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 116.51 KBNov 25 13:13
schestowitzbing: that's OK, I'll take your word for itNov 25 13:13
kecskebakIt's fine as satire, but on Floss Weekly did you hear the faux-dramatic way Jono referred to it?Nov 25 13:13
schestowitzNice coincidence thoughNov 25 13:13
bingschestowitz, yeah i'll still have the nick after their search engine goes awayNov 25 13:13
schestowitzThat someone who defends Microsofters also had the nickname "bing" for a long time, that's all......Nov 25 13:13
zer0c00lbing.com Nov 25 13:14
zer0c00l:PNov 25 13:14
ThistleWebschestowitz: lol, exactlyNov 25 13:14
bingschestowitz i'm not defending miguelNov 25 13:14
bingschestowitz i'm trying to get you to raise the integrity of your siteNov 25 13:14
schestowitzHahaNov 25 13:14
schestowitzOK, now you're just being dishonest, methinksNov 25 13:14
bingheheNov 25 13:14
ThistleWebthe world is full of amazing coincedences, like lots of first time voters joining the ISO just to vote blindly in gavour of OOXML, I mean, what are the odds?Nov 25 13:15
bingschestowitz anyway i've said my 2 cents.    i'm just trying to help.Nov 25 13:15
schestowitzSo did you come here on behalf of the Irish ASA or to defend Miguel?Nov 25 13:15
schestowitzYou see...Nov 25 13:15
schestowitzI don't agree with Britney spears forumsNov 25 13:15
bingno, i didn'tNov 25 13:15
schestowitzAnd yet, I don't go to Britney Spears forums to talk to regulars there about their 'integrity'Nov 25 13:16
bingschestowitz i'm not a britney spears fan.  hah.Nov 25 13:16
schestowitzGood for youNov 25 13:16
schestowitzBut you escaped my pointNov 25 13:16
bingi'm a free software developer... how about you?Nov 25 13:16
schestowitzAnyway, I'm off to doing other stuff now...Nov 25 13:16
bingi happen to live in irelandNov 25 13:16
bingand i have no connection to the ASA, whatever that isNov 25 13:17
bingjeez, you guys must get a lot of trolls here to be so mistrustfulNov 25 13:17
schestowitzThat's not the point (geography)Nov 25 13:17
schestowitzNor is it a point about Britney Spears Nov 25 13:17
schestowitz*BritneyNov 25 13:17
zer0c00lis that you bing http://www.facebook.com/asselstineNov 25 13:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ben Asselstine | Facebook .::. Size~: 19.21 KBNov 25 13:18
bingzer0c00l, yeah that's meNov 25 13:18
kecskebakEveryone's right. bing was just being helpful - he's right, the picture has been used to hit the site over the head in public. Roy is also right, the picture is perfectly valid as satire and was very funny.Nov 25 13:18
oiaohmNo just problem some past true trolls have used the name bing here bing.Nov 25 13:18
oiaohmJust name bad luck that is all.  bingNov 25 13:19
bingoiaohm, ah, i couldn't have knownNov 25 13:19
zer0c00lhttp://savannah.nongnu.org/users/benasselstine Nov 25 13:19
bingoiaohm, maybe i should stay logged in more often so they can't have my nickNov 25 13:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: People at Savannah: Ben Asselstine Profile [Savannah] .::. Size~: 15.37 KBNov 25 13:19
bingzer0c00l, yeah i've written a lot of free softwareNov 25 13:19
ThistleWebI wonder if Mr Crosby's estate will take MS to court for tarnishing the word "Bing"Nov 25 13:19
DaemonFChttp://my.opera.com/core/blog/Nov 25 13:20
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 500 Internal Server Error .::. Size~: 0.71 KBNov 25 13:20
MinceRdoesn't matter what Roy does, m$ cultists will use anything against himNov 25 13:21
MinceRso why worry?Nov 25 13:21
oiaohm2 wrongs don't make a right.  MinceRNov 25 13:21
zer0c00loiaohm, MinceR you people have a facebook profile ?Nov 25 13:22
oiaohmMaybe labeling altered for jokes would be a good idea just from a intergity point of view schestowitzNov 25 13:22
MinceRoiaohm: where's the second wrong?Nov 25 13:22
schestowitzbing: I won't use that picture againNov 25 13:22
MinceRwell, there could be a label with yellow background saying "This is satire, you idiots"Nov 25 13:22
bing"image modified from _wikipedia_  original"Nov 25 13:23
bingi dunno, reallyNov 25 13:24
schestowitzhttp://techdirt.com/articles/20091121/1353527039.shtmlNov 25 13:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Jury Says Fictional Character Can Be Libelous | Techdirt .::. Size~: 49.7 KBNov 25 13:24
oiaohmIts just a intergity thing MinceR.  There is no need to steep to MS level.  Thinking failed at editing out a black guy to make a picture contain all white people and did not have the intergity to mark it as edited.Nov 25 13:24
MinceRi don't think this has anything to do with thatNov 25 13:25
MinceRmainly because there's nothing racist about xp boxes :>Nov 25 13:25
schestowitzImages for "microsoft poland" :http://images.google.com/images?rlz=1B5GGGL_enGB315GB316&hl=en&source=hp&q=microsoft+poland&gbv=2&aq=f&oq=&aqi=Nov 25 13:25
*zer0c00l thinks there is nothing wrong in depicting miguel as proponent of non free s/wNov 25 13:25
phIRCe-BNcTitle: microsoft poland - Google Images .::. Size~: 45.98 KBNov 25 13:25
bingzer0c00l, yep i agree.  it's satire.Nov 25 13:26
MinceR142115 < bing> "image modified from _wikipedia_  original"Nov 25 13:26
MinceRneither do i :>Nov 25 13:26
zer0c00lyou people should check miguel's twitter feeds Nov 25 13:26
zer0c00lhe has become some kind of silverlight mumbo jumboNov 25 13:26
schestowitzFrankly, I don't think bing means to harmNov 25 13:27
oiaohmIe MinceR MS has done worse basically.Nov 25 13:27
bingenjoy your chat folks.Nov 25 13:27
zer0c00lyes :)Nov 25 13:27
*bing (n=ben@87-198-16-156.ptr.magnet.ie) has left #boycottnovell ("Ex-Chat")Nov 25 13:27
zer0c00lbing: :)Nov 25 13:27
schestowitzBut we've had so many trolls here before, thus the suspicion and prejudice that's a defensive measureNov 25 13:27
zer0c00lhahahaNov 25 13:27
schestowitzHow about this:Nov 25 13:28
schestowitzMake a postNov 25 13:28
MinceRalso, there's the vigorous re-assertion of an indefensible pointNov 25 13:28
schestowitzOpen Letter to MicrosoftNov 25 13:28
schestowitzWhere we argue why they should hire this really talented man called MiguelNov 25 13:28
schestowitzWe can get him a via this time aroundNov 25 13:28
schestowitz*visaNov 25 13:28
schestowitzIt would be good if he worked for MicrosoftNov 25 13:29
schestowitzLet me do a quick post......Nov 25 13:29
MinceRdidn't he get hired already?Nov 25 13:29
kecskebakYou don't need the ad hominemNov 25 13:29
kecskebakYou're right - you've got the facts on your sideNov 25 13:29
MinceRfirst at novell, then at one of their fake FLOSS sites, don't remember what it's calledNov 25 13:29
MinceRm$ departments all the wayNov 25 13:29
kecskebakThe fact that Mono is a huge bloated white elephant is enoughNov 25 13:30
kecskebakIf you go for ad hominem if makes you look pettyNov 25 13:30
kecskebakFree Software is about respecting peopleNov 25 13:30
kecskebakThat's what Miguel is not doingNov 25 13:31
kecskebakBut I wouldn't advise getting hung up on the personality.Nov 25 13:31
kecskebakThe arguments and the software is enoughNov 25 13:31
*fewa agrees with kecskebakNov 25 13:32
fewabut you should still call things like they areNov 25 13:32
fewabut focus on what is most pertinentNov 25 13:33
fewaand keep the focus on thatNov 25 13:33
MinceRi think both software and people deserve criticismNov 25 13:33
fewathe cult of personality is a rhetorical deviceNov 25 13:33
MinceRpeople need to know that m$/novell is wrong and evil in many ways, not just one or twoNov 25 13:33
fewayesNov 25 13:33
kecskebakThe post that showed how big a Mono app was compared to a non-mono app was a killer post.Nov 25 13:34
kecskebakhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/23/gthumb-and-gnote-ubuntu/Nov 25 13:34
phIRCe-BNcTitle: With gThumb and Gnote in Ubuntu 10.04, Default Install Would be Leaner, Mono Free | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 119.75 KBNov 25 13:34
kecskebakThat picture, with the size of Tomboy and gNote, told the story better than a dig at MiguelNov 25 13:34
MinceRi think both needs to be doneNov 25 13:35
MinceRbtw, then they could make ubuntu 10.04 leaner by omitting mono instead of omitting gimpNov 25 13:36
kecskebakThat's a no-brainerNov 25 13:36
fewawtfNov 25 13:36
kecskebakWhich is why I found the decision inexplicableNov 25 13:36
fewadumping gimpNov 25 13:36
kecskebakYes, that's why I dumped UbuntuNov 25 13:36
fewaits not desktop GNU/Linux without gimpNov 25 13:36
fewaf'in idiotsNov 25 13:36
kecskebakI don't think Banshee will be far behind eitherNov 25 13:37
MinceRi wish i could dump [k]ubuntu, but i have no suitable replacement yetNov 25 13:37
fewathey work hard to dampen and slow the FOSS communityNov 25 13:37
MinceRmaybe Sidux (that DaemonFC mentioned earlier)?Nov 25 13:37
MinceRor maybe Fedora 13 once it's releasedNov 25 13:37
fewaby not understand itNov 25 13:37
kecskebakThere are some lovely people in the Ubuntu community who love free software. But the community decisions leave me scratching my head sometimes.Nov 25 13:38
fewa"community decisions"Nov 25 13:38
oiaohmOne of the things they complain about with gimp is a slow start up time.Nov 25 13:38
oiaohmTrue it don't have a nice plugin system and that does need to be fixed.Nov 25 13:39
fewadon't go branding the word community without a real analysis of weather democracy is actually happeningNov 25 13:39
MinceRit does have a nice plugin system :>Nov 25 13:39
oiaohmHaving to run all plugins every start up of gimp MinceR ?Nov 25 13:39
oiaohmThat is not exactly a nice plugin system.Nov 25 13:39
fewamy impression is that ubuntu decisions are run by a small cabalNov 25 13:39
fewathe critical ones that isNov 25 13:40
Diablo-D3heehehehNov 25 13:40
MinceRthey're the "community"Nov 25 13:40
Diablo-D3I now have identica on my wp blogNov 25 13:40
fewaand they those people can about nothing else than short term interests of their brandNov 25 13:40
MinceRjust like the rule of "One Man, One Vote" in Ankh-Morpork.Nov 25 13:40
oiaohmAdd a index of plugins and a refresh feature.  Lot faster start times MinceRNov 25 13:40
MinceRand the PatricianNov 25 13:40
fewaand absolutely no interest in building free and open source softwareNov 25 13:40
kecskebakThat would explain a lot.Nov 25 13:40
fewathat is what i've seenNov 25 13:40
MinceRoiaohm: no, you add them :>Nov 25 13:40
fewathere are certainly great contributersNov 25 13:40
fewathe software _is_ free softwareNov 25 13:40
fewa(most of it)Nov 25 13:41
Diablo-D3I hacked advanced rss (yet another rss widget), it has a twitter templateNov 25 13:41
Diablo-D3so I merely changed two urls in the templateNov 25 13:41
fewabut its really being "led" by something other than the interests of those that use itNov 25 13:41
kecskebakI don't know how Ubuntu is run, but obviously having a bloke with a big bag of money would distort it.Nov 25 13:41
fewanot that that is easyNov 25 13:41
fewamehNov 25 13:42
fewai don't think he is that badNov 25 13:42
kecskebakImpatientNov 25 13:42
*Diablo-D3 should write a full fledged identica pluginNov 25 13:42
MinceRoiaohm: actually i don't think that the single most important thing about a nice plugin system is how it starts :>Nov 25 13:42
fewathe shipit.ubuntu.com was greatNov 25 13:42
zer0c00lbing was here after listened to http://www.softwarefreedom.org/podcast/2009/nov/19/0x1B/Nov 25 13:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Episode 0x1B: Jeremy Allison of the Samba Team - Software Freedom Law Show - Software Freedom Law Center .::. Size~: 12.34 KBNov 25 13:42
fewait introduces lots to LinuxNov 25 13:42
fewathat sort of thing is greatNov 25 13:42
kecskebakI wouldn't be using Free Software without UbuntuNov 25 13:42
oiaohmWhen it comes to memory usage and other things way gimp start is not nice MinceR.Nov 25 13:42
fewaUbuntu really did put a focus on some usability improvementsNov 25 13:42
zer0c00ljeremy allison must have mentioned about BNNov 25 13:42
kecskebakI will always be grateful for thatNov 25 13:43
oiaohmAnd its all due to the plugin system MinceRNov 25 13:43
fewasome really smart stuff like command-not-foundNov 25 13:43
MinceRi think kubuntu improves usability moreNov 25 13:43
oiaohmLittle bit of effort could fix it  MinceRNov 25 13:43
MinceRby avoiding the usability mess called "gnome"Nov 25 13:43
fewawhich kicks assNov 25 13:43
fewaMinceR, thats not really ubuntuNov 25 13:43
MinceRi knowNov 25 13:43
fewathats KDE and GNOMENov 25 13:43
oiaohmI like the KDE world moto MinceRNov 25 13:43
fewaof course that distinction is lost on mostNov 25 13:43
oiaohmDistributions exist to server KDE not KDE to serve distributions.Nov 25 13:43
fewaand those running Ubuntu like to engender that false correlationNov 25 13:44
fewathat is something that makes me not trust themNov 25 13:44
oiaohmUbuntu has been pushing bleeding edge stuff over and over again.Nov 25 13:44
fewanot reallyNov 25 13:44
DaemonFCSidux doesn't even have GNOMENov 25 13:44
DaemonFCthey have KDE and XFCE editionsNov 25 13:44
fewaFedora is more bleeding edgeNov 25 13:44
fewaat least on Red Hat developed partsNov 25 13:45
MinceRsome gnome apps don't hurt thoughNov 25 13:45
fewaUbuntu was pushing alot of new gnome appsNov 25 13:45
fewaand alot of those are successesNov 25 13:45
fewaand even simply things like command-not-foundNov 25 13:45
fewathat seriously is a _huge_ usability improvementNov 25 13:45
fewasuprised it didn't happen earlierNov 25 13:45
fewaother things like itNov 25 13:45
kecskebakUbuntu is the nicest distro to install I've tried yetNov 25 13:46
kecskebakI use GNOME, and Ubuntu really is easierNov 25 13:46
*zer0c00l is now known as zer0c00l|afkNov 25 13:46
fewaof course real stuff doesn't come from organizationsNov 25 13:46
fewait comes from individual developers who scratch their itchNov 25 13:46
schestowitzhttp://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/24/business/media/24adcol.html?_r=1&src=twt&twt=nytimestechNov 25 13:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The New York Times > Log In .::. Size~: 9.82 KBNov 25 13:46
oiaohmI use a mix of KDE and Gnome apps kecskebak  gimp is about my last GTK app.Nov 25 13:47
fewathe only thing a distribution really has to do is fit together the base system and test itNov 25 13:47
oiaohmLot of KDE apps are better.Nov 25 13:47
fewaand canonical doesn't even do thatNov 25 13:47
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Open Letter to #Microsoft http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/open-letter-to-microsoft/Nov 25 13:47
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Open Letter to Microsoft | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 105.44 KBNov 25 13:47
fewathey off-load that to debianNov 25 13:47
oiaohmUbuntu keeps the good old Gnome/KDE split a live.Nov 25 13:47
kecskebakI use FontForge, Inkscape and The GIMP dailyNov 25 13:47
oiaohmSo users don't get the best applications.Nov 25 13:47
oiaohmGoal should be to kill the Gnome/KDE split.Nov 25 13:47
fewaI think distributions need to learn from Linux developmentNov 25 13:47
MinceRthat's a risky goalNov 25 13:48
fewaabout avoiding forks and good version controlNov 25 13:48
schestowitzzer0c00l|afk: how do you know where he wasNov 25 13:48
schestowitz?Nov 25 13:48
MinceRit can be done very wrong and i'm afraid it would beNov 25 13:48
fewathat allows controled forksNov 25 13:48
schestowitzAllison mentioned GPL infringement in that show, but I didn't listen to itNov 25 13:48
fewathe linux standard base is a good base for such a moveNov 25 13:48
kecskebakI think it's good that there is GNOME and KDE. If KDE was the first desktop I saw, I probably wouldn't have switched to GNU/LinuxNov 25 13:48
MinceRexcept the LSB mandates RPMNov 25 13:48
fewaor standardizing of rpm _or_ debNov 25 13:48
fewadoesn't matter whichNov 25 13:49
MinceRsome gobolinux-ish package management should be standardized insteadNov 25 13:49
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: please check #gnuNov 25 13:49
fewaI think debian policies on file higherarchy are much betterNov 25 13:49
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: He is in #gnuNov 25 13:49
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: Just asked himNov 25 13:49
schestowitzThe American KGB is at it again: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/11/court-surveillance/Nov 25 13:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Court Kills Round-The-Clock Surveillance Case | Threat Level | Wired.com .::. Size~: 89.06 KBNov 25 13:49
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: I think you are in there too :)Nov 25 13:49
fewared hat is all disorganized and archicNov 25 13:49
fewacruftNov 25 13:49
schestowitzzer0c00l|afk: ahNov 25 13:49
schestowitzzer0c00l|afk: so I'll listen to it tomorrowNov 25 13:50
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: ok :)Nov 25 13:50
fewareforming the system to make it simpler is very important in making the system understandable and approachableNov 25 13:50
schestowitz[13:28] <bing> hello zer0c00lNov 25 13:50
schestowitz[13:29] <zer0c00l> hey bing :)Nov 25 13:50
schestowitz[13:29] <zer0c00l> we see lot of trolls there bing, so everyone was little suspicious :)Nov 25 13:50
schestowitz[13:29] --> tsdh has joined this channel (n=horn@141.26.94.95).Nov 25 13:50
schestowitz[13:30] <bing> zer0c00l, yeah there are a few trolls here too.... but boycottnovell must be a real magnet for themNov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:30] <zer0c00l> hahahaNov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:32] <bing> i listened to the software freedom law show today... it was entertainingNov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:33] <bing> it makes me want to register my copyrights!Nov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:33] <zer0c00l> link? where?Nov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:34] <bing> http://www.softwarefreedom.org/podcast/2009/nov/19/0x1B/Nov 25 13:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Episode 0x1B: Jeremy Allison of the Samba Team - Software Freedom Law Show - Software Freedom Law Center .::. Size~: 12.34 KBNov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:34] <zer0c00l> okNov 25 13:51
schestowitz[13:34] <bing> it's an hour long showNov 25 13:51
schestowitzTrolls?Nov 25 13:51
zer0c00l|afk:PNov 25 13:51
MinceRfor whom the bell trollsNov 25 13:51
zer0c00l|afkschestowitz: Don't flood the channel :PNov 25 13:51
schestowitzI love it when people try to argue that people in a channel that agrees with them are trollsNov 25 13:51
schestowitzAs if to say, the Tories are 'trolls' on the conservative partyNov 25 13:51
fewawell there is a troll device that uses thatNov 25 13:52
fewait goes like thisNov 25 13:52
fewaI use Linux and I really like it, but.....Nov 25 13:52
schestowitzSometimes the trolls call the regulars "trolls", then use large numbers (like lins*** flood) or sockpuppets as "yes men"Nov 25 13:53
fewabut yesNov 25 13:53
fewathat word is overusedNov 25 13:53
schestowitzfewa: "I was once an atheist, but..."Nov 25 13:53
schestowitz"Don't get me wrong, but..."Nov 25 13:53
schestowitz"Some people argue...."Nov 25 13:53
schestowitz"I like <x> as much as the next guy, however..."Nov 25 13:54
schestowitz[13:53] <fewa> that word is overusedNov 25 13:54
schestowitz"Terrorist" alsoNov 25 13:54
schestowitzAlthough terrorist is one who terrorisesNov 25 13:54
fewanot reallyNov 25 13:54
fewaI only hear that word used by the media and those that are trying to get powerNov 25 13:54
schestowitzBy that that definition, some husbands are terrorists tooNov 25 13:54
fewaand alot those scaredNov 25 13:54
schestowitzBy this definition, George Bush is a terroristNov 25 13:55
fewaits never used in rational debateNov 25 13:55
fewaquite honestlyNov 25 13:55
schestowitzI'm really surprised that Bush is not in prisonNov 25 13:55
fewaits like most uses of "nazi"Nov 25 13:55
fewait immediately makes you wrongNov 25 13:55
schestowitzBy some criteria, Bush should be executed, based on simple law with precedenceNov 25 13:55
fewait means you have interest in actual debateNov 25 13:55
fewa9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 9/11 vNov 25 13:55
fewathat sort of thingNov 25 13:55
MinceRv?Nov 25 13:56
fewactrl-vNov 25 13:56
schestowitzObama, terrorist, plane, 9/11, Muhammad Muhammad Muhammad, be afraid, stay home, terrorism, terrorism, terrorism, terrorism, terrorism, mushroom cloudNov 25 13:56
fewa*no interest in actual debateNov 25 13:56
fewain most uses of the word it immidially makes be stop paying attention to the personNov 25 13:57
schestowitzfewa: Buckley tried to call Vidal "Nazi"Nov 25 13:57
schestowitzOr something like that...Nov 25 13:57
schestowitzLet me find itNov 25 13:57
schestowitzHere: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYymnxoQnf8 (William Buckley Vs Gore Vidal)Nov 25 13:57
fewaI just watched a Ralph Nader talkNov 25 13:57
schestowitzI can't stand BuckleyNov 25 13:57
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kecskebakbrbNov 25 13:58
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schestowitzNoam Chomsky vs. William F. Buckley Debate : Part 1 of 2 < http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYlMEVTa-PI >Nov 25 13:58
fewahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oh_Y_WOL2ewNov 25 14:00
fewahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oh_Y_WOL2ew#t=5m20sNov 25 14:00
MinceRin response to what schestowitz said:Nov 25 14:00
MinceRGazprom e-bomb M-14 War on Terrorism lynch quiche cryptographic ExonNov 25 14:00
MinceRShell terrorism Sears Tower genetic Kosovo passwd cypherpunkNov 25 14:00
MinceRcryptanalysisNov 25 14:00
MinceR(had to install emacs on my netbook to generate that :> )Nov 25 14:00
fewa"In 1938 FDR said 'when government is controled by private economic power that is fascism'"Nov 25 14:01
schestowitz"NOT VERY HAPPY with Google at the best of times, certain German authorities want the search engine's analytics product banned." http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1563272/germany-google-analyticsNov 25 14:01
fewathe corruption of words tries to wipe such frank statements from their meaningNov 25 14:02
fewathe corruption of languageNov 25 14:02
fewadestroy the ability to have frank discussionNov 25 14:03
schestowitzhttp://www.softwarefreedom.org/podcast/2009/nov/19/0x1B/ "Jeremy discussed that he resigned from Novell in protest over the Microsoft/Novell deal. "Nov 25 14:03
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Episode 0x1B: Jeremy Allison of the Samba Team - Software Freedom Law Show - Software Freedom Law Center .::. Size~: 12.34 KBNov 25 14:03
schestowitzfewa: I'll watch Nader vidz laterNov 25 14:03
fewawell its really just that quoteNov 25 14:04
fewaas we were talking about the words people throw aroundNov 25 14:04
fewathe scare wordsNov 25 14:04
fewaFranklin Delano Roosevelt, 1938:  'when government is controled by private economic power that is fascism'Nov 25 14:05
schestowitzIphone users are bandwidth hogs http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1563258/iphone-users-bandwidth-hogsNov 25 14:05
schestowitz"If the figures are to believed, Jobs' Mob's slice of mobile data traffic has grown to now exceed half share globally."Nov 25 14:05
schestowitzhttp://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1563261/google-backs-away-racist-search "The latest outcry has been about a picture which depicts US First Lady Michelle Obama as a monkey."Nov 25 14:07
schestowitzYikes.Nov 25 14:07
schestowitzhttp://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/11/24/facebook-stock-maneuver-feeds-ipo-rumorsNov 25 14:08
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Facebook Stock Maneuver Feeds IPO Rumors | WebProNews .::. Size~: 34.77 KBNov 25 14:08
schestowitzNews Corp. Joined by Rivals Weighing Google Block http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aRVlZEzbmNu0Nov 25 14:09
phIRCe-BNcTitle: News Corp. Joined by Rivals Weighing Google Block (Update2)  - Bloomberg.com .::. Size~: 32.37 KBNov 25 14:09
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fewalolNov 25 14:21
fewawishful "news"Nov 25 14:21
fewathe old media is so scared of direct mediaNov 25 14:22
fewaof direct access to informationNov 25 14:23
schestowitzhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8377922.stmNov 25 14:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 93.96 KBNov 25 14:41
trmancohttp://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=fedora_12_ati&num=1Nov 25 14:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] The Cost Of ATI Kernel Mode-Setting On Fedora 12 .::. Size~: 19.94 KBNov 25 14:41
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schestowitzfewa: they are so dead that they think they have nothing to lose anymoreNov 25 14:41
schestowitzClinging on to promisesNov 25 14:41
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Explanation of What Bill Gates’ Patent Investments Do to Developing World http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/monsanto-video/Nov 25 14:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] have people abandoned identica or have they changed the xmmp settings?Nov 25 14:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Explanation of What Bill Gates Patent Investments Do to Developing World | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 109.71 KBNov 25 14:54
*schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitzNov 25 14:58
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/11/24/bind_dns_security_bug/Nov 25 14:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Bug puts net's most popular DNS app in Bind • The Register .::. Size~: 26.75 KBNov 25 14:58
schestowitzWoohoo!!Nov 25 14:59
schestowitzMicrosoft CFO quitsNov 25 14:59
schestowitzMaybe he can't cook the numbers anymoreNov 25 15:00
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marcusbHow can I boycott something I don't use?Nov 25 15:06
ThistleWebthe concept of "biycotting" something means "not using it"Nov 25 15:07
ThistleWebboycotting*Nov 25 15:07
MinceRmarcusb: by continuing to not use it and adding another reason for not using it :)Nov 25 15:09
marcusbok :DNov 25 15:09
marcusbthat's easy enoughNov 25 15:10
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Omar87H all.Nov 25 15:28
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-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Multicolr Search Lab: color search for Flickr http://labs.ideeinc.com/multicolr/Nov 25 15:31
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting  type .::. Size~: 0 KBNov 25 15:31
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #Wikileaks publishes 500k 9/11 pager messages http://ur1.ca/ginaNov 25 15:41
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft ’s Chief Financial Officer Quits http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/chris-liddell-jumps-ship/Nov 25 15:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsofts Chief Financial Officer Quits | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 114.13 KBNov 25 15:46
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schestowitzCool. Now people can buy toilet paper with their iPhone... http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/11/25/iphone_tesco/Nov 25 15:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: iPhone comes to Tesco • The Register .::. Size~: 23.72 KBNov 25 15:49
schestowitzHehe. Register dupe. http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/11/25/tesco_iphone/Nov 25 15:50
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Apple adds Tesco as iPhone partner • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 18.63 KBNov 25 15:50
schestowitzIn a way the same lump of newsNov 25 15:51
schestowitzIs "business ready" the new slogan for WinMob? http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/11/25/hp_ipaq_glisten/Nov 25 15:51
phIRCe-BNcTitle: HP rolls out business-friendly smartphone • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 19.43 KBNov 25 15:51
schestowitzOrrin Hatch ?????? http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2009/11/25/oracle_sun_european_sabotage/Nov 25 15:53
phIRCe-BNcTitle: US senators tell EC: Butt out of Oracle-Sun • Channel Register .::. Size~: 20.24 KBNov 25 15:53
schestowitzI think he's the father of a SCOsterNov 25 15:53
schestowitzYes, he is. http://boycottnovell.com/2009/09/07/layoffs-and-microsoft-utah/Nov 25 15:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Lays Off More Employees Across the US, But Hires Near SCO | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 113.77 KBNov 25 15:54
schestowitzWhy would he want Sun to be bought?Nov 25 15:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] OK, so BTI is a POSNov 25 15:54
schestowitzHis son represents SCONov 25 15:54
schestowitzAnd John Kerry too left the beauty salon to loibbyNov 25 15:55
schestowitzhttp://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2009/11/decertifying_te.htmlNov 25 15:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Schneier on Security: Decertifying "Terrorist" Pilots .::. Size~: 33.46 KBNov 25 15:58
schestowitz"The SAME people who created TRILLIONS in debts for the USA and then stole TRILLIONS more in tax dollars, should def. be trusted to run the US Treasury! The Federal Reserve needs to be shut down, they are bankrupting the USA.""Nov 25 15:59
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Oracle should make a promise not to enforce any of its patents (including Sun's patents) towards companies using MySQL+OO: http://i5.be/VgNov 25 16:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Karsten Gerloffs blog  » The case for independence - Oracle, Sun and what to do with MySQL [updated] .::. Size~: 86.16 KBNov 25 16:24
schestowitzHow I hate "articles about other articles" ("Mr. X has just published an article.... blah blah") http://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/News/Brockmeier-Issues-Beginner-s-Guide-to-Vim-EditorNov 25 16:25
MinceRyou should write an article about that article ;)Nov 25 16:26
kecskebakThese days most news stories seem to be recycled press releases, so it's hard to find articles that don't do that.Nov 25 16:26
schestowitzzoobab: it's not so newNov 25 16:27
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] ACTA negotiatior: “I have never seen a treaty being negotiated in public. It is not feasible.” http://i5.be/VhNov 25 16:27
schestowitzkecskebak: yes, like the MSFT CFO newsNov 25 16:27
schestowitzNobody bother to say anything newsNov 25 16:27
schestowitzI look through over 30 articlesNov 25 16:27
schestowitzKey points same as in press release and company pagesNov 25 16:27
schestowitzCountry of birth, bio... he leaves, another guy comesNov 25 16:28
kecskebakThe book "Flat Earth News" is excellent at talking about this trend - worth seeking out if you haven't read it.Nov 25 16:28
kecskebakhttp://www.flatearthnews.net/Nov 25 16:28
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Home | Flat Earth News .::. Size~: 9.73 KBNov 25 16:28
schestowitzBut eWEEK is the one posting 'articles' that are meta-articles saying: "PERSON X has just published a review. Go check it out."Nov 25 16:28
schestowitzIt means they have nothing much to write by chaining one article to another article from the same publisher, which I find comicalNov 25 16:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Name the GUI. http://www.blogicalthoughts.com/images/signs/1078_signs.jpgNov 25 16:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBNov 25 16:29
schestowitzeWEEK has just published an introduction to another eWEEK review of Fedora...Nov 25 16:29
schestowitzMaybe they should issue an introduction to the introduction to the introduction....Nov 25 16:29
kecskebakNick Davies calls it "Churnalism"Nov 25 16:30
schestowitzkecskebak: libel laws does thatNov 25 16:30
schestowitzPress is afraid to step outside boxesNov 25 16:30
schestowitzLike saying the no evidence exists for WoMDNov 25 16:30
schestowitzLet alone publish outside pieces that say thisNov 25 16:31
kecskebakAnd the fact that the liars for hire in the PR industry outnumber journalists several to oneNov 25 16:31
schestowitzObedience can be financially rewarding to them through advertisingNov 25 16:31
schestowitzkecskebak: sometimes they are the sameNov 25 16:31
schestowitzSome journos turn to PR puppets and via versa. Analysts also.Nov 25 16:31
schestowitz*visaNov 25 16:32
schestowitz*vice Nov 25 16:32
schestowitzJoe Wilcox for exampleNov 25 16:32
kecskebakI think a lot of it is because journalists are so overworkedNov 25 16:33
kecskebakMany UK newspapers have one journalist to cover the whole of the north of England. About 20 million peopleNov 25 16:33
kecskebakAll they can do is type up PR releasesNov 25 16:33
kecskebakThey can't hope to fact check or investigate or to thinkNov 25 16:34
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Microsoft is looking for an Interoperability Patent Tax manager, send them your CV and motivation letter: http://i5.be/ViNov 25 16:34
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Has Microsoft Got a Job for You... - Community - ComputerworldUK .::. Size~: 82.16 KBNov 25 16:34
*zer0c00l|afk is now known as zer0c00lNov 25 16:34
schestowitzhttp://www.boingboing.net/2009/11/23/british-cops-arrest.htmlNov 25 16:36
phIRCe-BNcTitle: British cops arrest people just to add them to the DNA database, claims inquiry - Boing Boing .::. Size~: 71.28 KBNov 25 16:36
schestowitzkecskebak: there's that tooNov 25 16:36
schestowitzYou know what it means?Nov 25 16:36
schestowitzThe 'added value' or journalism is lost, without fact checkingNov 25 16:37
schestowitzIn which case they can no longer justify abandoning 'indie' sourcesNov 25 16:37
schestowitzCause they become a lot worse, they overall PR which it produced by marketing people with a wage given to promoteNov 25 16:37
schestowitzTMCNet does lots of thisNov 25 16:37
schestowitzCIOL alsoNov 25 16:37
schestowitzThey flood the press with Microsoft, Novell, other press releaseNov 25 16:37
schestowitzThey change a few words here and thereNov 25 16:38
schestowitzBut the press releases ended up embeddd as tweaked articles in the public recordNov 25 16:38
schestowitzI.e. the companies write the newsNov 25 16:38
schestowitzHistory is being recorded by companies, about themselvesNov 25 16:38
kecskebakIn England there's a disturbing trend of local councils releasing free newspapers reporting on themselvesNov 25 16:38
kecskebakWhich not only helps kill off real local newspapers but also means that councils are "holding themselves to account"Nov 25 16:39
kecskebakIf a council does a deal with, say Microsoft or Novell, how would it appear to the local population?Nov 25 16:40
schestowitzConsumerism:. ... http://www.wired.com/autopia/2009/11/fim-e-power-series/Nov 25 16:40
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Electric Motorcycle Racing Hits the Big Time | Autopia | Wired.com .::. Size~: 71.33 KBNov 25 16:40
schestowitzkecskebak: yes, the 'free' 'news' papersNov 25 16:40
schestowitzPeople are unsuspectingly think it's 'free'Nov 25 16:40
kecskebakI've got to go now, but I've really enjoyed chatting here today. Hope to be back tomorrow. TTFNNov 25 16:40
schestowitzThey never ask whyNov 25 16:40
schestowitzkecskebak: ywNov 25 16:41
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schestowitzhttp://izanbardprince.wordpress.com/2009/11/25/does-having-an-hdtv-actually-mean-anything-if-you-have-comcast/Nov 25 16:44
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Does having an HDTV actually mean anything if you have Comcast? « Ryans Blog .::. Size~: 29.41 KBNov 25 16:44
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-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] hehehe RT: @eduvid: Open Letter to #Microsoft http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/open-letter-to-microsoft/Nov 25 17:01
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Open Letter to Microsoft | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 110.55 KBNov 25 17:01
schestowitzzer0c00l: You've gotta watch this: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/11/25/monsanto-video/Nov 25 17:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Explanation of What Bill Gates Patent Investments Do to Developing World | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 109.71 KBNov 25 17:16
schestowitzIt's also about IndiaNov 25 17:16
zer0c00lok :)Nov 25 17:26
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schestowitzGoogle's Andy Rubin turns out to have left Sidekick when he joined AndroidNov 25 17:36
schestowitzSickkick is now MicrosoftNov 25 17:37
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schestowitzBad, bad logic: http://www.infoworld.com/d/mobilize/why-open-source-could-kill-androids-chances-029Nov 25 17:39
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Why open source could kill Android's chances | Mobilize - InfoWorld .::. Size~: 75.21 KBNov 25 17:39
schestowitzSymbian (Nokia) vs Linux: "The thing with the Limo Foundation is that it’s a document factory, they don’t have anyone that produces kits. " http://www.telecoms.com/16575/the-open-roadNov 25 17:46
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Interview: John Forsyth, leadership team, Symbian Foundation | telecoms.com - telecoms industry news, analysis and opinion .::. Size~: 56.36 KBNov 25 17:46
schestowitzBig Pimpin': http://redmonk.com/sogrady/2009/11/24/monkjobs-how-can-we-help/Nov 25 18:00
phIRCe-BNcTitle: tecosystems » Monkjobs: How Can We Help? .::. Size~: 44.3 KBNov 25 18:00
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Peter Thiel Says Don't Piss Off The Robots (Or Bet On A Recovery) http://ur1.ca/giwbNov 25 18:04
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Peter Thiel Says Don't Piss Off The Robots (Or Bet On A Recovery) .::. Size~: 98.76 KBNov 25 18:04
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satiperahello all, roy I have even tried to re-register. I can't because of course the nick and email address are taken. Using the new password that is sent after using forgotten your password does not work either. In short I am not able to comment.Nov 25 18:06
schestowitzUS pours millions into anti-Taliban militias in Afghanistan http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/nov/22/us-anti-taliban-militias-afghanistanNov 25 18:06
schestowitzLater on they wonder why these weapons turn against themNov 25 18:06
schestowitzHey, satiperaNov 25 18:06
satiperahiNov 25 18:07
schestowitzsatipera: I mailed you a new passwordNov 25 18:07
schestowitzLet's retryNov 25 18:07
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satiperaokNov 25 18:07
NostradumbasshiNov 25 18:07
schestowitzHeyNov 25 18:07
Nostradumbasscame across your website, groovy site for posting all the fud going on in the software businessNov 25 18:07
schestowitzsatipera: i PMed you the new passwordNov 25 18:08
schestowitzNostradumbass: you can help too by reporting and adding informationNov 25 18:09
satiperaok tyNov 25 18:09
Nostradumbassschestowitz: well I have been kind of out of that loop in favor of the general political oneNov 25 18:10
schestowitzhttp://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/nov/22/lotfi-raissi-secret-files-evidenceNov 25 18:11
schestowitzNostradumbass: yes, it's only related though at the level of staffNov 25 18:11
schestowitzMicrosoft has many people in govt.Nov 25 18:11
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #KDE renamed #KDE, still worst desktop environment on #Linux http://ur1.ca/gix1Nov 25 18:11
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Repositioning the KDE Brand | KDE.news .::. Size~: 70.45 KBNov 25 18:11
Nostradumbassschestowitz: many key industries do, lobbying is nothing new, its just that M$ is one of the few that has a major presence when it pertains to softwareNov 25 18:11
schestowitzhttp://www.muckety.com/Microsoft-Corporation/5001219.mucketyNov 25 18:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Microsoft Corporation  relationship map - Muckety.com .::. Size~: 58.48 KBNov 25 18:12
Nostradumbassschestowitz: I can't see "do no Evil" Google doing quite the same thingNov 25 18:12
schestowitzMicrosoft's do not registerNov 25 18:13
schestowitzFor instance:Nov 25 18:13
schestowitzOne pretends to represent small businessesNov 25 18:13
Nostradumbassschestowitz: well thats a form of astroturfing which many corporate lobbies such as ones AT&T and Verizon put into do as wellNov 25 18:14
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Association_for_Competitive_TechnologyNov 25 18:15
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Association for Competitive Technology - Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 20.44 KBNov 25 18:15
Nostradumbassschestowitz: I see they learn well from the telecom industry: http://www.prwatch.org/node/5962Nov 25 18:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: AT&T, Verizon Reach Out and Co-Opt Someone | Center for Media and Democracy .::. Size~: 23.36 KBNov 25 18:16
cubezzzok, two laptop/netbooks so far: Lemote and Dell Vostro A90Nov 25 18:16
cubezzzand old ASUSNov 25 18:16
Nostradumbassschestowitz: major telcos and cable companies have been doing this to ban municipal ISPs for some time and gain statewide franchise agreementsNov 25 18:17
Nostradumbassschestowitz: the whole Connected Nation and Net Neutrality issues are also falling to this as wellNov 25 18:17
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cubezzzwe have municipal ISPsNov 25 18:18
cubezzzmost major metro centres have a freenetNov 25 18:18
cubezzzthere is NCF in OttawaNov 25 18:18
Nostradumbasscubezzz: you're one of the lucky one's who states' representatives have balls, which state do you hail from Virginia, Vermont?Nov 25 18:18
cubezzzno, I'm in Canada :)Nov 25 18:18
Nostradumbasscubezzz: oh Canada, well thats why :PNov 25 18:18
cubezzzOntarioNov 25 18:18
Nostradumbasscubezzz: at least Canadians still have the fortitude to stand up to big businessNov 25 18:19
cubezzzNostradumbass, U.S. doesn't have any freenets?Nov 25 18:19
Nostradumbasscubezzz: very sparselyNov 25 18:19
Nostradumbasscubezzz: big ISPs are making sure the FCC squashes themNov 25 18:20
cubezzzhmmmNov 25 18:20
cubezzzsounds like it's time for Flynn to take out the MCP :)Nov 25 18:21
cubezzzagainNov 25 18:21
schestowitzhttp://www.thevarguy.com/2009/11/23/whats-a-mysql-partner-to-do/Nov 25 18:21
phIRCe-BNcTitle: What's a MySQL Partner to Do? | The VAR Guy .::. Size~: 50.18 KBNov 25 18:21
Nostradumbasscubezzz: MCP?Nov 25 18:21
cubezzzit's a reference from the movie TronNov 25 18:21
cubezzzMaster Control ProgramNov 25 18:21
NostradumbassahhNov 25 18:22
NostradumbasslolNov 25 18:22
schestowitz'Telecom analyst Bruce Kushnick writes that "Astroturf and co-opted groups representing the deaf, disabled, black, low income and others" are "touting a plan to loosen cable franchise rules for the phone companies.'Nov 25 18:22
schestowitzMicrosoft also uses Hispanics for thisNov 25 18:22
schestowitzMicrosoft will use even the Guild of Murderers if it helps make a bucklNov 25 18:22
Nostradumbassschestowitz: so do Republicans, like how those Cuban Americans protesting kinda won GW the 2000 election by getting the polls to close early in FloridaNov 25 18:22
schestowitzGore suffers from this nowNov 25 18:23
schestowitzPaid-for protestsNov 25 18:23
schestowitzPseudo-protestsNov 25 18:23
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: except GWB never won an electionNov 25 18:23
cubezzzI remember how excited everyone was back in 1994 when we got our first FreenetNov 25 18:23
schestowitzOrganised by oil companies that make coalitionsNov 25 18:23
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: whether you like it or not the US Presidential election depends more on the Electoral College then on popular votes, sorry thats just the way it is :-/Nov 25 18:24
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: I think you misunderstoodNov 25 18:25
Diablo-D3GWB "won" via vote fraudNov 25 18:25
cubezzzfound a list: http://www.lights.ca/freenet/Nov 25 18:25
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: not really since the Electoral College (dominated by Republicans) considered all the votes in to be sufficient and the Supreme Court declared it to be legal :PNov 25 18:26
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: ahh, but here we run into a problemNov 25 18:27
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: and nobody has raised a major fuss since, its kinda like how Gerald Ford pardoned Nixon just so the American government and public can move on to issues at hand rather then being stuck in the pastNov 25 18:27
Diablo-D3if the votes are fraudulent, it doesnt matter what the EC nor the Surpreme Court thinksNov 25 18:27
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: no one did?Nov 25 18:27
Diablo-D3dude, congress threatened to throw several thousand people in jailNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3for protestingNov 25 18:28
cubezzzthe two-term limit saves thingsNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3the US people did in fact demand a recount by a non-biased third partyNov 25 18:28
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: have you seen any major public outcry, Obama is in the Whitehouse so everyone is somehow feels re-embersed by Uncle Same in this respectNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: I dontNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3I actually wish Obama would pardon BushNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3you know why?Nov 25 18:28
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: well the public at large does, and thats what mattersNov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3you know what a pardon like that really is?Nov 25 18:28
Diablo-D3when nixon was pardoned, it made him 100% guilty without a chance of anyone ever thinking otherwiseNov 25 18:29
Diablo-D3no judge, no jury, straight to 100% gulty.Nov 25 18:29
Diablo-D3its the worst possible punishment for one president to do to anotherNov 25 18:29
cubezzzhe was guilty though :)Nov 25 18:29
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: true, but it also makes them forgivenNov 25 18:29
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: it makes their lives effectively over.Nov 25 18:29
Diablo-D3and it also records in history books, in it's entirety, what nixon did to get that pardonNov 25 18:30
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: politically yes, but they can then go on with their civil livesNov 25 18:30
Diablo-D3I want to see bush get the same treatment for what he didNov 25 18:30
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: I don't see GW going back into politics anytime soonNov 25 18:30
Nostradumbassschestowitz: sorry for hijacking your threadNov 25 18:31
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: no, but there are people out there who dont even know he wasnt legally our presidentNov 25 18:31
Diablo-D3we, effectively, had terrorists in control of the US government for 8 yearsNov 25 18:32
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: he became legally president once the election was done and the Supreme Court declared it so, his administration's sovereignty was further strengthened by winning a 2nd term Nov 25 18:32
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: if they're not acting in favor of the american people, they are also guilty.Nov 25 18:33
Diablo-D3so Im not sure where you're going with thisNov 25 18:33
cubezzzoh yeah, the system worked great, lolNov 25 18:33
Diablo-D3protecting a criminal also makes you a criminal.Nov 25 18:34
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: they did initially act in favor the public at large though, through endorsement of the War on Terror and complacency to the Patriot Act. Nov 25 18:34
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: a government is only as strong and legitimate by its social contract with the peopleNov 25 18:35
Diablo-D3Yes, and for 8 years, our government wasn't legitimate.Nov 25 18:36
Diablo-D3And, honestly, that should scare the almighty fuck out of most of the countryNov 25 18:36
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] C'mon Rupert, what are you waiting for? Go exclusive to Bing already! The rest of the internet will gather to wave you off.Nov 25 18:36
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: the administration may have done some questionable things, but people still head steady to the US political systemNov 25 18:36
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: nothing even approached the 1960s with civil-disobedienceNov 25 18:36
cubezzza lot of people didn't vote thoughNov 25 18:36
cubezzzvoter apathyNov 25 18:36
Nostradumbasscubezzz: well thats their decision, voting is only as much a right as people want to follow itNov 25 18:37
cubezzzbut of course the turnout was pretty good in the last election I thinkNov 25 18:37
Diablo-D3Nostradumbass: use the words "the people" very carefullyNov 25 18:38
NostradumbassBNc: I get a kick out of what makes a CEO of a media company thing by limiting how their website can be found can somehow help themNov 25 18:38
Diablo-D3Im part of "the people" and I did not, do not, and never will support terrorism.Nov 25 18:38
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: I can use as frivolously as I want since the public at large does jack squat in the face of blatant corruption and lies anyway Nov 25 18:38
NostradumbassDiablo-D3: give them a nice home, a car and cash on borrowed credit and most will be happyNov 25 18:39
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NostradumbassDiablo-D3: I think history has taught us violent revolution most of the time doesn't bring beneficial change within their lifetime anyway Nov 25 18:40
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Nostradumbassmagentar: welcome back, got anything to contribute to this channel that has something to do with it?Nov 25 18:41
cubezzzah, what about the American Revolution?Nov 25 18:42
cubezzzyou guys didn't want to pay tax to King George :)Nov 25 18:42
cubezzzanyway, the search for a Linux laptop continues...Nov 25 18:42
Nostradumbasscubezzz: yes that is true, goods and funds being funneled off to a far away land with little to no benefit to folks at home doesn't make people happy. Also, people in that time already had the fiercely independent attitude of forging a new society as wellNov 25 18:44
Nostradumbasscubezzz: how large, you can always get a Pandora handheld, which has most the functions of a Linux laptop at the fraction of the sizeNov 25 18:44
Nostradumbasscubezzz: how important is a x86 based chipset, hardrive and disc drive important to you?Nov 25 18:45
cubezzzI'm looking at the ASUS EEE 100HE at the momentNov 25 18:45
cubezzznot ideal thoughNov 25 18:45
Nostradumbasscubezzz: how is Newegg when it comes to shipping in Canada, wouldn't Fry's Electronics have a good Black Friday sale?Nov 25 18:45
Nostradumbasscubezzz: does Canada have a "Black Friday?"Nov 25 18:46
cubezzzthere is newegg.caNov 25 18:46
cubezzzuh, probably Nov 25 18:46
cubezzz1000HE is XP of courseNov 25 18:46
cubezzzI want something with a keyboard I can type onNov 25 18:46
cubezzzI don't care about x86 at allNov 25 18:47
cubezzzeveryone is selling ASUS thoughNov 25 18:48
Nostradumbasscubezzz: get a LimePC :DNov 25 18:49
Nostradumbasscubezzz: jk, I don't even know if those will ever be mass producedNov 25 18:49
cubezzzthat's it, I'm buying an Amiga :)Nov 25 18:50
cubezzzit's weird how there's no ARM based laptopsNov 25 18:51
Nostradumbasscubezzz: funny you should say that, Hyperion and Amiga.inc lawsuit was finally settled in favor of Hyperion so Amiga OS4 development is said to be pressing forward to finally introduce an updated 3D API, Java, SMPT and other features in a next release as well as possible PowerPC Mac supportNov 25 18:52
Nostradumbasscubezzz: there are ARM based notebooks out, even older ones that use Windows CENov 25 18:53
Nostradumbasscubezzz: there is also possible releases of Tegra ones tooNov 25 18:53
Nostradumbasscubezzz: its just that they have not really been sold in North America that muchNov 25 18:53
cubezzzyeahNov 25 18:54
cubezzzthe only thing I ever saw was zaurus, and zaurus was discontinuedNov 25 18:55
Nostradumbasscubezzz: you probably heard of this website: http://www.dynamism.com/#homeNov 25 18:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Dynamism .::. Size~: 98.96 KBNov 25 18:58
cubezzzno, I haven't seen that beforeNov 25 19:02
Nostradumbasscubezzz: its not the most reasonably priced but a pretty consistent and trusted website for buying Asian imported gadgets fromNov 25 19:06
cubezzzunfortunately there are no Linux boxes (as far as I can see)Nov 25 19:06
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Maybe PiSi would take off more as an application if it wasn#t pronounced Pissy, and Choqock just sounds rude :pNov 25 19:08
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Nostradumbasscubezzz: yea... but you can always buy one and format it or do a dual boot. But I know you don't like contributing to the Windows taxNov 25 19:08
sebsebsebhiNov 25 19:08
Nostradumbasshi?Nov 25 19:08
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ender2070_i wouldnt want m$ getting money when I dont use them eitherNov 25 19:11
ender2070_ooo i have http://www.dynamism.com/gp2x_wiz.shtmlNov 25 19:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Dynamism .::. Size~: 97.03 KBNov 25 19:12
ender2070_but the earlier version w/o rechargable batteriesNov 25 19:12
Nostradumbassender2070: wow thats a pretty nice price for touchscreen device with an OLED displayNov 25 19:16
Nostradumbassender2070: I wonder if it still has 2 SDIO card slots like its predecessor?Nov 25 19:17
ender2070_im wonderingNov 25 19:17
ender2070_i'd like to get that, my gp2x's biggest drawback is batteriesNov 25 19:18
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schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-11-25-008-35-OP-DT-NT-0002 I too noticed that Tony Mobily  is a defeatist, which is a shame because it makes his articles unnecessarily depressinglyNov 25 19:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Linux Today - Google Chrome OS. Or, how KDE and GNOME managed to shoot each other dead .::. Size~: 77 KBNov 25 19:19
schestowitzNostradumbass: you didn't hijack anything :-) I was just busy w/ other stuffNov 25 19:19
Nostradumbassender2070: nope according to this it only has 1 SD slot but with SDHC support: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GP2X_Wiz#SpecificationsNov 25 19:19
phIRCe-BNcTitle: GP2X Wiz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 69.4 KBNov 25 19:19
schestowitzAnd actually, presidential crimes are on topic in the channelNov 25 19:20
Nostradumbassschestowitz: kewl, but I usually don't like discussing topics that end up flooding the channel in one directionNov 25 19:20
ender2070_SDHC cards are much  larger in size, I would require less of themNov 25 19:22
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Nostradumbassother news Australian politicos continue to get further digitally out of touch: http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/11/25/187249/Australian-Govt-Proposes-Internet-Panic-Button-For-KidsNov 25 19:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Slashdot Your Rights Online Story | Australian Govt. Proposes Internet "Panic Button" For Kids .::. Size~: 143.23 KBNov 25 19:22
Nostradumbassender2070: there is still something cool to having 2 SD slots, one for storage and the other for peripheralsNov 25 19:23
Nostradumbassender2070: thats why I personally like the Pandora handheld better, and its 800mhz ARM Cortex CPUNov 25 19:23
Nostradumbasswith PowerVR SGX CPUNov 25 19:23
Nostradumbassoh nvm its a OMAP 3 CPU, which I prefferNov 25 19:24
Nostradumbasswait I'm confused: http://openpandora.org/Nov 25 19:24
Nostradumbassender2070: oh yea, forgot the OMAP 3 is pretty much a Cortex v8 with a DSPNov 25 19:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Pimp your GNU Linux desktop; submit a screenshot http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/coolest-desktop-screenshot-wins-prizeNov 25 19:25
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Coolest Desktop Screenshot Wins Prize -- Winners Announced | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 41.37 KBNov 25 19:25
Nostradumbassand more direct interconnect to GPUNov 25 19:25
schestowitzhttp://www.makeuseof.com/tag/9-hilarious-websites-to-visit-when-you-need-to-kill-time/Nov 25 19:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 9 Hilarious Websites To Visit When You Need To Kill Time .::. Size~: 49.85 KBNov 25 19:29
schestowitzNicaragua is moving to GNU \o/Nov 25 19:29
ender2070_Nostradumbass - i dont know what else I would even add to itNov 25 19:30
Nostradumbassender2070_: umm.. bluetooth adapter?Nov 25 19:31
Nostradumbassender2070_: or any future wireless standard, Pandora has a full version of the kernel 2.6x Linux and folks have been installing Ubuntu Hardy distro on itNov 25 19:33
ender2070_Nostradumbass - my laptop does all thatNov 25 19:34
Nostradumbassender2070_: true, but that does it in a smaller form factor with better battery life, even though there is definitely more to do for x86 Linux then any other platform.Nov 25 19:34
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Just been adding peeps manually from groups, since group dents don't work. #hpr needs a cleanout of spam membersNov 25 19:37
ender2070_i would argue better battery life, i couldnt get more than an hour out of that thingNov 25 19:38
ender2070_i only wanted it for emulators so I could put my snes in storageNov 25 19:39
Nostradumbassender2070_: well if you go to the gp32x forum, you can find out whats going on with Open PandoraNov 25 19:42
ender2070_openpandora is niceNov 25 19:43
ender2070_would be nicer if they could get the hardware out there soonerNov 25 19:43
Nostradumbassender2070_: only major issue is it is still a device sold in limited quantitiesNov 25 19:43
NostradumbassyeaNov 25 19:43
ender2070_i've been waiting a year so farNov 25 19:43
NostradumbassUbuntu is further distancing itself from the FOSS: http://www.osnews.com/story/22541/Ubuntu_Dumps_the_GIMP_Really_Needs_a_Paint_NETNov 25 19:45
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ubuntu Dumps the GIMP, Really Needs a Paint.NET .::. Size~: 23.64 KBNov 25 19:45
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Two Romanian women kidnapped a 3yo girl in local ASDA, shaved head, redressed as a boy.ADSA closed doors, police called.Scary close to home.Nov 25 19:45
NostradumbassI get a kick out long loading times being the excuse because I can even load GIMP up with YDL on my PS3Nov 25 19:45
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Nostradumbassanyway I don't complain about removing software from initially installs, it makes them easier to downloadNov 25 19:48
ender2070_my switch to kde pretty much ensures I dont need to do thatNov 25 19:52
ender2070_kde distros dont have mono appsNov 25 19:52
Nostradumbassalright I got to go, been nice chatting with ya'llNov 25 20:05
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ender2070_i love how fedora doesn't trust moonlightNov 25 20:07
ender2070_https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/ForbiddenItems#MoonlightNov 25 20:07
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Forbidden items - FedoraProject .::. Size~: 33.26 KBNov 25 20:07
schestowitzProprietary FUD against embedded Linux/FOSS: http://www.electronicsweekly.com/Articles/2009/11/24/47504/where-is-the-cost-in-an-embedded-linux-system.htmhttp://www.electronicsweekly.com/Articles/2009/11/24/47504/where-is-the-cost-in-an-embedded-linux-system.htmNov 25 20:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 400 Bad Request .::. Size~: 0 KBNov 25 20:14
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schestowitzender2070_: Mono should be in that list tooNov 25 20:14
ender2070_yes it shouldNov 25 20:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] AUTOPOST: Digital Economy Bill - My interpretation : http://tinyurl.com/yayvyxg #piracy #p2p #torrent #legalNov 25 20:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Digital Economy Bill  My interpretation «  OPEN BYTES  cave quid dicis, quando, et cui. .::. Size~: 55.83 KBNov 25 20:24
_goblinyay............it worksNov 25 20:24
_goblinmy first piece of python code that does what its supposed too.Nov 25 20:24
trmancocoolNov 25 20:36
trmancois it gpl'ed?Nov 25 20:36
_goblinits closed source, proprietary, DRM'd.....Nov 25 20:39
_goblinonly joking of course....Nov 25 20:39
trmancololNov 25 20:39
_goblinIm on a different rig and Im pleased to see it working by itself....Nov 25 20:39
_goblinwhat it does is:Nov 25 20:39
_goblin1. Connects to wordpress and uploads a document created for my blog with a template....Nov 25 20:39
_goblin2. Publishes article and announces on Twitter...Nov 25 20:40
_goblin3. Can be set to a time/date....Nov 25 20:40
_goblinso what it means now is that all my articles which Ive never gotten around to publish, I can pepper them at random intervals during the week.Nov 25 20:41
_goblinI am really quite pleased....Nov 25 20:41
_goblinI will publish the code when I get back on that rig.Nov 25 20:41
_goblinits released under the OBCA (Openbytes Code Agreement) - in that do with it as you wish...I really don't care...Nov 25 20:42
trmancohttp://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/11/giving-up-the-gimp-is-a-sign-of-ubuntus-mainstream-maturity.arsNov 25 20:42
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Giving up the GIMP is a sign of Ubuntu's mainstream maturity .::. Size~: 42.48 KBNov 25 20:42
trmancobeerware?Nov 25 20:42
schestowitztrmanco: it's a Mono boosterNov 25 20:44
MinceRbewareNov 25 20:44
schestowitzNo idea why he has been gullibleNov 25 20:44
schestowitzMinceR: by British pronunciation, yeahNov 25 20:44
MinceR:)Nov 25 20:44
ender2070_what happened to best of breedNov 25 20:46
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Been in bed most of the day recovering from Manflu....still feel rotten but can't sleep anymore!Nov 25 20:48
MinceRbest of bread, best of beerNov 25 20:50
ender2070_I guess it also displays mono or nothing, no matter the excuseNov 25 20:50
ender2070_best of breed was false, gimp is bestNov 25 20:50
schestowitzHmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...... best of bbbbbbbeer.Nov 25 20:53
*Tallken (n=f2f93bf5@93.102.44.112.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 20:53
trmancohahahaNov 25 20:54
trmanco"2001-09-11 15:36:34 Arch [0987275] C  ALPHA  s0191: 09/11 13:35:22 Reboot NT machine g"Nov 25 20:54
MinceR?Nov 25 20:55
trmancohttp://911.wikileaks.org/files/messages_2001_09_11-15_35_2001_09_11-15_39.txtNov 25 20:55
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Not a web page! Aborting text/plain type .::. Size~: 0 KBNov 25 20:55
trmancohtml hereNov 25 20:56
trmancohttp://911.wikileaks.org/files/messages_2001_09_11-15_35_2001_09_11-15_39.htmlNov 25 20:56
phIRCe-BNcTitle: WikiLeaks 9/11 pager data .::. Size~: 501.07 KBNov 25 20:56
trmancohttp://911.wikileaks.org/Nov 25 20:56
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 9/11 Pager data .::. Size~: 3.73 KBNov 25 20:56
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Loving this Lego Matrix video.. http://bit.ly/7Kk4nyNov 25 20:58
trmancomoooore -> http://911.wikileaks.org/files/index.htmlNov 25 20:59
phIRCe-BNcTitle: 9/11 Pager data .::. Size~: 30.23 KBNov 25 20:59
trmanco:)Nov 25 20:59
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] The Matrix is now 10 years old, now in #Lego http://ur1.ca/gj8tNov 25 21:06
ender2070_lol - http://www.linuxpromagazine.com/Online/News/Ubuntu-X.org-Guru-Calls-for-Desktop-HelpNov 25 21:15
schestowitzCan anyone provide help transcribing?Nov 25 21:25
*ender2070_ has quit (Remote closed the connection)Nov 25 21:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] RT @codinghorror: Buy Bad Code Offsets! http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/001312.htmlNov 25 21:35
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Coding Horror: Buy Bad Code Offsets Today! .::. Size~: 68.33 KBNov 25 21:35
tessierhehe..bad code offsets...Nov 25 21:48
tessierDoes anyone really think the carbon offset thing could possibly work? Seems like someone actually needs to be in posession of the big blocks of carbon. Just to make sure it doesn't all got lost in fuzzy accounting.Nov 25 21:49
tessierI saw a sticker on a car or truck or something the other day indicating that the pollution for the vehical was being compsensated for by carbon offsets from such and such place.Nov 25 21:49
tessiervehicleNov 25 21:49
tessierBut who really audits that stuff and who has any incentive to do so?Nov 25 21:49
tessierWhy can't I start selling carbon offsets based on nothing at all? But people will buy them because they think it is doing the right thing. Maybe I could even sell mine really cheap!Nov 25 21:50
tessierIt would be pure profit for me.Nov 25 21:50
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_goblinMr De Icaza has found Utopia: http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2009/Nov-23.html and he's "drooling" (his words)Nov 25 21:57
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Silverlight: Universal GUI toolkit - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 17.06 KBNov 25 21:57
MinceRsilverblight is miguel's panaceaNov 25 21:57
_goblinHe really is besotted isnt he?Nov 25 21:59
schestowitz_goblin: droolingly yoursNov 25 22:05
*schestowitz drollsNov 25 22:05
*schestowitz droolsNov 25 22:05
schestowitzSpeaking of which, nutcases drool too over this leak: http://www.reddit.com/r/reddit.com/comments/a7xpt/conspiracy_theories_commence_wikileaks_to_release/Nov 25 22:06
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Conspiracy theories commence: WikiLeaks to release over half a MILLION text messages from 9/11 : reddit.com .::. Size~: 452.39 KBNov 25 22:06
_goblintrouble is I can picture that image of Icaza drooling...its very disturbing..Nov 25 22:06
schestowitzMaybe rabbiesNov 25 22:06
_goblinI wonder what would happen if Silverblight was sentient and had a webcam.....a quick little connect up with a drooling Icaza?Nov 25 22:06
_goblinThe mind boggles....in a proprietary, lockin sort of way.Nov 25 22:07
schestowitzhttp://scienceblogs.com/authority/2009/11/the_wikileaks_pager_archive_du.phpNov 25 22:09
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The WikiLeaks Pager Archive Dump: Who's Been Intercepting Private Texts, and How Long Has It Been Going On? : The Questionable Authority .::. Size~: 53.22 KBNov 25 22:09
schestowitzThey say it's unlikely to be fakeNov 25 22:09
schestowitzTHe bankers worry about downtimeNov 25 22:09
schestowitzBusiness, business, business... gotta make moneyNov 25 22:09
schestowitz_goblin: I'm gonna write more about Silver Lie soonNov 25 22:09
tessierhttp://www.avweb.com/blogs/insider/HeyWomen_WhereAreYou_201566-1.html#topNov 25 22:18
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Hey, Women — Where Are You? .::. Size~: 46.18 KBNov 25 22:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] F70EXR is middling as camera, the ISO12800 trick remains way cool. Also the "merge 4 shots for better quality" trick. I am most pleased.Nov 25 22:41
*gmzlj (n=simongmz@CPE00223f7552ad-CM00223a6ef767.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 22:41
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Michigan State University Invests in #GNU #Linux Training http://www.wwj.com/MSU-Gives-Michigan-Works--200K-For-IT-Training/5749924Nov 25 22:59
phIRCe-BNcTitle: WWJ Newsradio 950 - MSU Gives Michigan Works $200K For IT Training .::. Size~: 85.63 KBNov 25 22:59
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Five Ways of Exploring #GNU #Linux on the Desktop http://www.daniweb.com/news/story241106.htmlNov 25 23:00
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Linux in 5 Easy Steps - Getting Started and Choosing a Distro News Story .::. Size~: 51.07 KBNov 25 23:00
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Upcoming #GNU #Linux Events: LCA 2010, Others http://ur1.ca/gjkc http://ur1.ca/gjkd http://ur1.ca/gjkeNov 25 23:03
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Expanding Career Options with Linux | Irish Developer Network ICT Portal .::. Size~: 16.5 KBNov 25 23:03
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How #IBM Uses #GNU #Linux to Make Innovative Large #Servers http://ur1.ca/gjkhNov 25 23:04
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Todays supercomputers: far greater than the sum of their parts - SmartPlanet .::. Size~: 56.52 KBNov 25 23:04
*gargoyle-grin has quit ("Leaving.")Nov 25 23:04
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Reviews and Predictions for #ChromeOS http://ur1.ca/gjkk http://ur1.ca/gjkm http://ur1.ca/gjknNov 25 23:06
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Five reasons Google Chrome OS Security Wins | ITworld .::. Size~: 86.13 KBNov 25 23:06
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Chrome OS: a first look Preview  in Operating systems Reviews at ZDNet.co.uk - Page 1 .::. Size~: 107.36 KBNov 25 23:06
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Polar Bears and Penguins: Where is Google Chrome leading us? .::. Size~: 79.31 KBNov 25 23:06
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux #Kernel Space Analysis: Kernel #ModeSetting http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=fedora_12_ati&num=1Nov 25 23:10
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] The Cost Of ATI Kernel Mode-Setting On Fedora 12 .::. Size~: 19.94 KBNov 25 23:10
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FreeBSD 8.0 is Officially Released http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzczNg #bsdNov 25 23:12
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] FInally, FreeBSD 8.0 Released .::. Size~: 16.23 KBNov 25 23:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #NVIDIA Brings Beta #Drivers for #Linux and #BSD http://ur1.ca/gjl3 http://ur1.ca/gjl4Nov 25 23:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] NVIDIA Pushes Out 195.22 Beta Linux Driver .::. Size~: 16.77 KBNov 25 23:14
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] NVIDIA 64-bit FreeBSD Beta Driver By Year's End .::. Size~: 16.88 KBNov 25 23:14
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Book About Inkscape, New Release of #Inkscape http://ur1.ca/gjld http://ur1.ca/gjleNov 25 23:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Book Review: The book of Inkscape: The definitive guide to the free graphic editor by Dmitry Kirsanov  .::. Size~: 42.06 KBNov 25 23:16
phIRCe-BNcTitle:  Inkscape 0.47 Released With a Batch of Cool Improvements  .::. Size~: 33.1 KBNov 25 23:16
*magentar (n=frederic@ip-109-90-135-190.unitymediagroup.de) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 23:17
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Congrats to Rachael & Alan on the arrival of baby Drew on Friday.Nov 25 23:18
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Proprietary Software for #GNu #Linux: Opera 10.10 http://www.internetnews.com/software/article.php/3849721Nov 25 23:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: What's New in the Opera 10.10 Browser? - InternetNews.com .::. Size~: 142.44 KBNov 25 23:22
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Docky Separates from #Mono Trap http://lifehacker.com/5411278/docky-separates-from-gnome-do-still-a-clever-linux-app-dockNov 25 23:24
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Docky Separates from GNOME Do, Still a Clever Linux App Dock - Docky - Lifehacker .::. Size~: 63.51 KBNov 25 23:24
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE to Use Branding to Market the Free Desktop http://ur1.ca/gix1 http://ur1.ca/gjm0Nov 25 23:25
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Repositioning the KDE Brand | KDE.news .::. Size~: 72.65 KBNov 25 23:25
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Asinen |   Why the rebranding? .::. Size~: 11.29 KBNov 25 23:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #RHEL Clone #ScientificLinux 5.4 Is Released, #Fedora 12 Overview http://ur1.ca/gjm5 http://ur1.ca/gjm7Nov 25 23:27
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Live CD/DVD of Scientific Linux 5.4 Is Out - Based on Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5.4 - Softpedia .::. Size~: 48.96 KBNov 25 23:27
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KOffice 2.1 is Released http://ur1.ca/gjmc http://ur1.ca/gjmeNov 25 23:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: KOffice 2.1 Released | KDE.news .::. Size~: 22.49 KBNov 25 23:29
phIRCe-BNcTitle: KDE Community Repositions Brand, Releases KOffice 2.1 .::. Size~: 114.13 KBNov 25 23:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux and Anine Unite Their Powers http://blog.thesilentnumber.me/2009/11/can-ubuntu-reach-over-16000-anime.htmlNov 25 23:34
phIRCe-BNcTitle: The Silent Number: Can Ubuntu reach over 16,000 anime lovers in April? .::. Size~: 154.89 KBNov 25 23:34
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu 9.10 Tested on #Flash , Still Behind Some Distros http://ur1.ca/gjmo http://ur1.ca/gi0sNov 25 23:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Ubuntu: Time for Another Reality Check | WorksWithU .::. Size~: 51.65 KBNov 25 23:37
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu Derivatives #Jolicloud and and T.O.S.S - Early Look http://ur1.ca/gjmq http://ur1.ca/gjmrNov 25 23:39
phIRCe-BNcTitle: [Phoronix] Jolicloud "Robby" Beta To Ship WIth Linux 2.6.32 .::. Size~: 18.99 KBNov 25 23:39
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Interview with TOSS developers .::. Size~: 44.93 KBNov 25 23:39
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Tivo (with Linux) Comes to UK, Spies with #Google http://ur1.ca/gjmy http://ur1.ca/gjn0Nov 25 23:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Tivo to return to UK in 2010 • Register Hardware .::. Size~: 16.42 KBNov 25 23:41
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Google eyeballs to track Tivo watchers • The Register .::. Size~: 29.52 KBNov 25 23:41
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More Powerful #RISC Cores Target #Linux , Not Windows http://ur1.ca/gjnhNov 25 23:49
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Multi-threaded RISC cores released for Linux, Android - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 65.13 KBNov 25 23:49
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Subnotebooks with #GNU #Linux Drop Considerably in Price http://ur1.ca/gjnlNov 25 23:52
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux -based #Nokia #N900 Has Good Potential with Developers http://ur1.ca/gjnoNov 25 23:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NotN: "Going Rogue" sells 500,000 copies, some read http://notnews.today.com/2009/11/25/going-rogue-sells-500000-copies-some-read/Nov 25 23:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: &And the survey says: Nokia N900 is a developers dream!  | NokNok.tv .::. Size~: 47.88 KBNov 25 23:54
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Going Rogue sells 500,000 copies, some read - News of the News .::. Size~: 35.29 KBNov 25 23:54
*_goblin has quit ("Ex-Chat")Nov 25 23:54
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Another #Mobile Environment for #Linux Surfaces http://ur1.ca/gjnq http://ur1.ca/gjnrNov 25 23:56
phIRCe-BNcTitle: First ELSE Linux phone: hands-on photos! | Electricpig .::. Size~: 59.67 KBNov 25 23:56
*alxconn (n=alex@c-24-15-46-226.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovellNov 25 23:56
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Emblaze Mobile Unveils Else Intuition Linux Smartphone - ITProPortal.com .::. Size~: 51.39 KBNov 25 23:56
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Android Phones Have #VoIP as Killer App http://whatwillweuse.com/2009/11/24/road-to-going-droid-finale/Nov 25 23:58
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Road to going Droid, Finale .::. Size~: 30.98 KBNov 25 23:58

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