| Ender2070 | "I agree with this split 100%. Stallman is showing his ignorance in the extreme by putting forth the notion that all proprietary software and its producers should be shunned. Is it really that bad if someone wants to pay for software? Is it so bad to pay for software or use software that you paid for?" | Dec 13 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 13 00:00 |
| Ender2070 | you can buy free software | Dec 13 00:00 |
| *jono (n=jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 00:01 | |
| Ender2070 | RHEL is free software | Dec 13 00:01 |
| Ender2070 | the subscription covers support | Dec 13 00:01 |
| schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/articles/20091211/0955157308.shtml | Dec 13 00:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Piracy Destroying Hollywood Right To Yet Another Record Year At The Box Office... In A Recession | Techdirt .::. Size~: 63.41 KB | Dec 13 00:01 |
| schestowitz | Heh. | Dec 13 00:02 |
| schestowitz | Free software confused with "pay" | Dec 13 00:02 |
| schestowitz | The Microsoft smear of "no free lunch" | Dec 13 00:02 |
| schestowitz | As though 0s and 1s are a 'lunch' you eat | Dec 13 00:02 |
| *iKonaK has quit ("Leaving.") | Dec 13 00:03 | |
| schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/articles/20091210/2104287303.shtml | Dec 13 00:03 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Apple Trying To Patent Anti-Tamper Tape | Techdirt .::. Size~: 71.06 KB | Dec 13 00:03 |
| schestowitz | Jobs blows | Dec 13 00:04 |
| schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/articles/20091211/1531517314.shtml | Dec 13 00:06 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Tiger Woods Gags UK Media; Alerts World To Nude Photos | Techdirt .::. Size~: 59.33 KB | Dec 13 00:06 |
| *jono is now known as jono2 | Dec 13 00:08 | |
| schestowitz | http://paul.kedrosky.com/archives/2009/12/beware_canadian.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A%20InfectiousGreed%20%28Paul%20Kedrosky%27s%20Infectious%20Greed%29 | Dec 13 00:12 |
| *aTr (n=aTr@188.24.122.77) has left #boycottnovell | Dec 13 00:13 | |
| Ender2070 | racist linsuxx user: http://identi.ca/notice/16622321 | Dec 13 00:16 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Shane Gordon (notmyfuckingidentica) 's status on Saturday, 12-Dec-09 19:56:12 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.02 KB | Dec 13 00:16 |
| schestowitz | http://identi.ca/notice/16596091 | Dec 13 00:19 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: snarf's status on Saturday, 12-Dec-09 09:16:09 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.72 KB | Dec 13 00:19 |
| schestowitz | Ender2070: don't feed trolls | Dec 13 00:19 |
| *schestowitz gives channel operator status to trmanco | Dec 13 00:21 | |
| *schestowitz removes channel operator status from schestowitz | Dec 13 00:21 | |
| Ender2070 | yeah theres no point | Dec 13 00:25 |
| Ender2070 | its like arguing with a brick wall | Dec 13 00:25 |
| schestowitz | http://www.kdenews.org/2009/12/10/exploring-new-nepomuk-features-mandriva-linux-2010 | Dec 13 00:26 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Exploring New Nepomuk Features in Mandriva Linux 2010 | KDE.news .::. Size~: 30.97 KB | Dec 13 00:26 |
| schestowitz | Ender2070: at least it keeps those trolls away from BN | Dec 13 00:26 |
| MinceR | how? | Dec 13 00:26 |
| schestowitz | RMS gets the heat now | Dec 13 00:27 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: keeps the anti-Freedom people busy | Dec 13 00:27 |
| MinceR | what does? identi.ca? | Dec 13 00:27 |
| Ender2070 | they poked fun at you suggesting I summarize the gnome stuff, which I wanted to do anyways | Dec 13 00:27 |
| schestowitz | For a while there they were attacking Brandon ( Ender2070) | Dec 13 00:27 |
| schestowitz | Actually, I think he came here to BN only after they had bash on on the head with a giant big dildo (you know who I'm referring to) | Dec 13 00:28 |
| Ender2070 | yeah I did come here after that | Dec 13 00:29 |
| *Tallken has quit ("Leaving") | Dec 13 00:31 | |
| *MinceR rediscovers desktop meta-search tools | Dec 13 00:39 | |
| schestowitz | Check out http://pclosmag.com/index.php/latest-mag/13-the-new-pclinuxos-magazine-december-2009-issue | Dec 13 00:42 |
| schestowitz | It's really quite professionally done; I'm impressed | Dec 13 00:42 |
| schestowitz | OpenSourc3 is also good | Dec 13 00:42 |
| MinceR | pclos become professionally done? | Dec 13 00:42 |
| MinceR | or just the magazine? | Dec 13 00:42 |
| schestowitz | Both | Dec 13 00:43 |
| *jono2 is now known as jono | Dec 13 00:43 | |
| trmanco | kumopeN | Dec 13 00:45 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz will love this: http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/HardKernel-Odroid/?kc=rss | Dec 13 00:46 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Hackable Android handheld game device uses Cortex-A8 SoC - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 66.99 KB | Dec 13 00:46 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: that's not a strong password | Dec 13 00:46 |
| trmanco | it's not a password | Dec 13 00:46 |
| trmanco | lool | Dec 13 00:46 |
| trmanco | read it from right to left | Dec 13 00:46 |
| MinceR | it's a kde4 component spelled backwards | Dec 13 00:46 |
| trmanco | exactly | Dec 13 00:47 |
| trmanco | :> | Dec 13 00:47 |
| MinceR | amsalP | Dec 13 00:47 |
| MinceR | nonohP | Dec 13 00:47 |
| schestowitz | ?yhw tuB | Dec 13 00:47 |
| MinceR | .aedi on evah I | Dec 13 00:48 |
| trmanco | I dekr0B amsalP a elihw oga | Dec 13 00:48 |
| trmanco | LOOL | Dec 13 00:48 |
| schestowitz | Dec 13 00:48 | |
| MinceR | Dec 13 00:48 | |
| trmanco | Dec 13 00:48 | |
| *schestowitz craps out with error | Dec 13 00:48 | |
| Diablo-D3 | schestowitz: I mentioned that thing on my identica feed already | Dec 13 00:48 |
| MinceR | btw, i meant web metasearch, not file search :> | Dec 13 00:49 |
| schestowitz | Same in some ways | Dec 13 00:49 |
| schestowitz | Just different datasets | Dec 13 00:49 |
| schestowitz | "Come on, come to the cloud!" --Towelie | Dec 13 00:50 |
| schestowitz | http://s.bebo.com/app-image/7931303294/5411656627/PROFILE/i.quizzaz.com/img/q/u/08/04/03/towelie.jpg | Dec 13 00:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 00:50 |
| schestowitz | Google: "pay your data. Bring it UP to the hol cloud... wanna get high?" | Dec 13 00:51 |
| schestowitz | A lot of businesses already hand their data over to Google | Dec 13 00:51 |
| schestowitz | This allows all sorts of "Marshall" agencies (inc. IRS) to have a joyride, even if nothing is wrong | Dec 13 00:51 |
| schestowitz | They could automate a scanner that finds misconduct in Apps spreadsheets | Dec 13 00:52 |
| Diablo-D3 | http://instantrimshot.com/ | Dec 13 00:52 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Instant Rimshot .::. Size~: 3.27 KB | Dec 13 00:52 |
| schestowitz | http://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Stanford-creates-highly-conductive-paper/?kc=rss | Dec 13 00:58 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Nanotech ink turns paper into batteries - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 60.76 KB | Dec 13 00:58 |
| _goblin | schestowitz: FYI: Really enjoyed Linux Basement Ep47....excellent show! | Dec 13 00:59 |
| schestowitz | "You obviously have no idea of Stallman’s stance on this. He says to sell software if you can, and even survived himself by selling tapes of Emacs. How about you really read what he has to say rather than spouting inaccuracies." | Dec 13 01:01 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 13 01:02 |
| schestowitz | _goblin: sometimes they have a crowd of 4... they are longtime Linux users | Dec 13 01:02 |
| schestowitz | I only discovered them cause Linux superstar Susan (Tux Machines) links to them | Dec 13 01:02 |
| schestowitz | They got a big surge in listeners recently | Dec 13 01:02 |
| schestowitz | A couple of shows ago fabs was very drunk and it put me off a bit | Dec 13 01:03 |
| schestowitz | http://linuxcrunch.com/content/krita-got-%E2%82%AC4000-donation | Dec 13 01:05 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Krita got €4,000 Donation | We love Linux ! .::. Size~: 24.98 KB | Dec 13 01:05 |
| *_goblin has quit ("Ex-Chat") | Dec 13 01:13 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "Drinking coffee 'will not sober you up' when drunk" http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8403088.stm Interesting... | Dec 13 01:18 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 86.11 KB | Dec 13 01:18 |
| schestowitz | http://gizmodo.com/5422574/giant-mysterious-spiral-takes-over-the-skies-of-norway | Dec 13 01:19 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Giant Mysterious Spiral Takes Over the Skies of Norway - Giant Spiral - Gizmodo .::. Size~: 78.56 KB | Dec 13 01:19 |
| MinceR | malfunctioning missile :> | Dec 13 01:20 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] When people see something they don't understand they usually think wrongly. http://ur1.ca/hnv6 | Dec 13 01:21 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: This Is How the Mysterious Giant Spiral Happened - Military - Gizmodo .::. Size~: 76.39 KB | Dec 13 01:22 |
| schestowitz | UFO =UNIDENTIFIED object | Dec 13 01:22 |
| schestowitz | Not 'alien' | Dec 13 01:22 |
| schestowitz | Now it's identified | Dec 13 01:22 |
| schestowitz | "Russian military sources, confirming that this is a failed Bulava missile launched from a nuclear submarine in the White Sea." | Dec 13 01:23 |
| schestowitz | Nuclear submarine... keeping you safe at night, eh? | Dec 13 01:23 |
| MinceR | keeping you entertained at night | Dec 13 01:23 |
| schestowitz | 'Baking' the weapons of mass extermination deep in the ocean somewhere | Dec 13 01:24 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: disco in norway | Dec 13 01:24 |
| schestowitz | "Hey, girl, the aliens are coming, it's the end of the world, let's have some fun.." | Dec 13 01:24 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 13 01:24 |
| schestowitz | http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/12/facebooks-new-privacy-changes-good-bad-and-ugly | Dec 13 01:25 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Facebook's New Privacy Changes: The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly | Electronic Frontier Foundation .::. Size~: 33.54 KB | Dec 13 01:25 |
| schestowitz | Zuckerberg is the ugly? | Dec 13 01:25 |
| *cj (n=cjac@173-10-126-202-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 01:26 | |
| cj | schestowitz: http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-saving-mysql.html | Dec 13 01:26 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 01:26 |
| *cj (n=cjac@173-10-126-202-BusName-Washington.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) has left #boycottnovell | Dec 13 01:27 | |
| schestowitz | Widenius is in Microsoft's fauxpen source foundation | Dec 13 01:31 |
| schestowitz | Here's what's baffling | Dec 13 01:31 |
| schestowitz | oracle says too little | Dec 13 01:31 |
| schestowitz | Moglen and RMS contradict one another | Dec 13 01:32 |
| schestowitz | Even Monty and Mickos contradict each other | Dec 13 01:32 |
| schestowitz | http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/12/11/crunchpad-federal-lawsuit-filed-some-additional-thoughts/ | Dec 13 01:40 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: CrunchPad Federal Lawsuit Filed; Some Additional Thoughts .::. Size~: 423.87 KB | Dec 13 01:40 |
| *lis` has quit ("baibai<3") | Dec 13 01:42 | |
| Omar87 | Hi all. | Dec 13 01:42 |
| Ender2070 | hi | Dec 13 01:43 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] The furthering epic of the #CrunchPad http://ur1.ca/hnw5 | Dec 13 01:46 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: CrunchPad Federal Lawsuit Filed; Some Additional Thoughts .::. Size~: 423.87 KB | Dec 13 01:46 |
| schestowitz | http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2009/12/poulsbo-mess-casts-a-shadow-on-intels-moblin-project.ars | Dec 13 01:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Poulsbo mess casts a shadow on Intel's Moblin project .::. Size~: 42.97 KB | Dec 13 01:50 |
| schestowitz | http://www.junauza.com/2009/12/joojoo-supposed-to-be-crunchpad-linux.html | Dec 13 01:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: JooJoo (supposed-to-be-CrunchPad) Linux-based Tablet PC Unleashed | TECH SOURCE FROM BOHOL .::. Size~: 95.88 KB | Dec 13 01:50 |
| schestowitz | Looks nice! | Dec 13 01:50 |
| schestowitz | But cripple like Chrome OS junk | Dec 13 01:50 |
| schestowitz | *crippled for Weboholics | Dec 13 01:51 |
| schestowitz | Moblin is dead in the water cause of ARM and other competition | Dec 13 01:51 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] New Blog Post - BBC iPlayer Advert Contempt - Strictly Come Dancing | The Digital Prism http://tinyurl.com/y9jwwto | Dec 13 01:52 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC iPlayer Advert Contempt - Strictly Come Dancing | The Digital Prism .::. Size~: 11.89 KB | Dec 13 01:52 |
| schestowitz | http://royal.pingdom.com/2009/12/11/retro-delight-gallery-of-early-computers-1940s-1960s/ | Dec 13 01:53 |
| schestowitz | Nice shots: http://www.benkevan.com/blog/installing-opensuse-11-2-walk-through-virtualbox/ | Dec 13 02:00 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Installing openSUSE 11.2 Walk Through VirtualBox | Ben Kevan's Blog .::. Size~: 62.31 KB | Dec 13 02:00 |
| schestowitz | gn | Dec 13 02:02 |
| trmanco | http://linux.slashdot.org/story/09/12/12/135209/ | Dec 13 02:13 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Linux Story | GNOME Developer Suggests Split From GNU Project .::. Size~: 174.45 KB | Dec 13 02:13 |
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| Ender2070 | trmanaco - im responsible for that one :) | Dec 13 02:18 |
| Ender2070 | check out this comment, rofl http://www.pwnage.ca/?p=433&cpage=1#comment-328 | Dec 13 02:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Pwnage.ca » Gnome to Split Off from GNU Project? .::. Size~: 57.23 KB | Dec 13 02:18 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @aswinms: What is Rajinikanth's gmail address? gmail@rajinikanth.com....Thalai!!!! happy 60th birthday to you! (via @kedars) | Dec 13 02:28 | |
| trmanco | :) | Dec 13 02:31 |
| trmanco | Ender2070: you are from canda right? | Dec 13 02:31 |
| trmanco | Canada* | Dec 13 02:31 |
| Omar87 | trmanco: btw, I fixed that silly problem. | Dec 13 02:35 |
| trmanco | what was it? | Dec 13 02:35 |
| trmanco | I mean | Dec 13 02:35 |
| trmanco | what was the problem? | Dec 13 02:35 |
| Omar87 | trmanco: z-index. :P | Dec 13 02:35 |
| trmanco | ah :-P | Dec 13 02:35 |
| Ender2070 | yeah im from Canada | Dec 13 02:45 |
| trmanco | Toronto? | Dec 13 02:50 |
| Ender2070 | Brampton | Dec 13 02:53 |
| Ender2070 | its in the GTA | Dec 13 02:53 |
| trmanco | cool, soon we will be "neighbors" | Dec 13 02:57 |
| trmanco | :-P | Dec 13 02:57 |
| *Omar87 has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) | Dec 13 03:01 | |
| Ender2070 | oh really? | Dec 13 03:05 |
| Ender2070 | are you going to be in Toronto? | Dec 13 03:05 |
| trmanco | no | Dec 13 03:06 |
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| Ender2070 | brampton? | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | Mississauga | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | :) | Dec 13 03:06 |
| Ender2070 | oh lawl | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | even closer to Bramtpon | Dec 13 03:06 |
| Ender2070 | thats where I lived last week | Dec 13 03:06 |
| Ender2070 | I just moved | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | :S | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | Brampton* | Dec 13 03:06 |
| trmanco | neat | Dec 13 03:07 |
| Ender2070 | thats awesome | Dec 13 03:07 |
| trmanco | yeah, Canada is awesome too :D | Dec 13 03:07 |
| Ender2070 | where did you live before | Dec 13 03:08 |
| trmanco | before when? | Dec 13 03:08 |
| trmanco | to keep it short | Dec 13 03:08 |
| Ender2070 | mississauga | Dec 13 03:08 |
| trmanco | I was born in Hamilton, then I moved to Portugal, now I'm moving back to Canada again :S | Dec 13 03:09 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 13 03:10 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] does Woverine use Claws mail? | Dec 13 03:21 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Wolverine* | Dec 13 03:21 | |
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| Ender2070 | lol emacs irc :) | Dec 13 04:18 |
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| yuhong | http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1476462&cid=30418756 | Dec 13 04:27 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | Microsoft Invents Price-Gouging the Least Influential .::. Size~: 36.77 KB | Dec 13 04:27 |
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| amarsh04 | for schestowitz when he's back in chat after the Peter Watts link was posted: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/degrading-ordeal-over-for-tasmanias-top-cop-jack-johnston/story-e6frg6nf-1225809566973 | Dec 13 05:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 'Degrading' ordeal over for Tasmania's top cop Jack Johnston | The Australian .::. Size~: 59 KB | Dec 13 05:23 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @madhusudancs: "If you want to start with NumPy/SciPy development, Sprint is the best place to start. Join us for sprints" - David Courna | Dec 13 05:42 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @fossee: "Programming language is more than just a tool in science, its a communication tool" - David #scipy #india | Dec 13 05:44 | |
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| Omar87 | Hi all. | Dec 13 05:50 |
| amarsh04 | hi Omar87 | Dec 13 05:51 |
| amarsh04 | did you see this: http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/degrading-ordeal-over-for-tasmanias-top-cop-jack-johnston/story-e6frg6nf-1225809566973 | Dec 13 05:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 'Degrading' ordeal over for Tasmania's top cop Jack Johnston | The Australian .::. Size~: 59.03 KB | Dec 13 05:52 |
| Omar87 | amarsh04: hey. | Dec 13 05:56 |
| amarsh04 | I wish our state and federal attorneys general also experienced the other side of the laws they are responsible for | Dec 13 05:59 |
| *Diablo-D3 has quit ("do coders dream of sheep()?") | Dec 13 06:11 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @dhempe: FB ALERT: new facebook privacy regulations have opened up ur profile/pictures unless u make them private! go ahead and do that s | Dec 13 06:15 | |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 13 06:18 |
| Ender2070 | facebook is probably going to run into more issues with the Canadian government in this case | Dec 13 06:19 |
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| cubezzz | is there a way to set colours in bash easily? | Dec 13 06:32 |
| cubezzz | right now I'm doing: "echo -en "\033[0;34m" | Dec 13 06:32 |
| ThistleWeb | cubezzz: look in bashrc | Dec 13 06:38 |
| ThistleWeb | the arch wiki has back colour code help | Dec 13 06:39 |
| ThistleWeb | bash* | Dec 13 06:39 |
| cubezzz | uh, there's nothing in there | Dec 13 06:40 |
| ThistleWeb | that's where I found a list of colours and codes for bash | Dec 13 06:41 |
| ThistleWeb | to fix the all white user@pc$ in the terminal | Dec 13 06:42 |
| cubezzz | I'll just write something | Dec 13 06:42 |
| cubezzz | I thought there was some standard utility to make it easy | Dec 13 06:43 |
| ThistleWeb | http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Color_Bash_Prompt | Dec 13 06:44 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Color Bash Prompt - ArchWiki .::. Size~: 27.31 KB | Dec 13 06:44 |
| ThistleWeb | that may not be what you're looking for, but it's what I meant.....it may be of some hel[ | Dec 13 06:44 |
| ThistleWeb | help^ | Dec 13 06:44 |
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| DaemonFC | http://content.cartoonbox.slate.com/?feature=a5202534662ef388948e7f3cc101b66f | Dec 13 07:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 07:51 |
| DaemonFC | How true | Dec 13 07:51 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] 30+ Windows 7 Features Phone Home to Microsoft: http://tinyurl.com/yb94ovz ... it's not spyware it's a feature... | Dec 13 07:52 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 30 Windows 7 Features Phone Home to Microsoft - A closer look at the Windows 7 Privacy Statement - Softpedia .::. Size~: 87.54 KB | Dec 13 07:52 |
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| DaemonFC | http://content.cartoonbox.slate.com/?feature=81c403eb1a88eda42adf8ffeef7891e1 | Dec 13 07:57 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 07:57 |
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| Ender2070 | http://identi.ca/notice/16634453 | Dec 13 08:34 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Shane Gordon (notmyfuckingidentica) 's status on Sunday, 13-Dec-09 00:46:52 UTC - Identi.ca .::. Size~: 8.01 KB | Dec 13 08:34 |
| schestowitz | http://www.mneylon.com/blog/archives/2009/12/12/yet-another-funny-tshirt/ | Dec 13 08:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Yet Another Funny Tshirt - Michele Neylon :: Pensieri .::. Size~: 48.26 KB | Dec 13 08:50 |
| schestowitz | Ender2070: don't feed those trolls | Dec 13 08:50 |
| Ender2070 | trying... so... hard | Dec 13 08:55 |
| Ender2070 | ill go the higher route now | Dec 13 08:55 |
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| schestowitz | http://money.cnn.com/2009/12/09/technology/windows_7_problems/index.htm | Dec 13 09:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Windows 7 complaints rolling in - Dec. 9, 2009 .::. Size~: 69.3 KB | Dec 13 09:11 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] The bug filed with Chromium was fixed with 24hrs! I am currently running build 4.0.270.0 Happy to have been with this project from early on! | Dec 13 09:20 | |
| _goblin | Chromium is really great.....in beta but Ive not had to run FF in a while now.... | Dec 13 09:28 |
| oiaohm | _goblin: competition keeps items strong | Dec 13 09:33 |
| _goblin | its so much faster than firefox | Dec 13 09:40 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Currently running xPUD 0.9.2 for a review on Openbytes! - A tiny out of the box distro! #xpud #linux #foss #gnu | Dec 13 09:42 | |
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| _Goblin | right!...xPUD is actually quite a good little distro | Dec 13 09:57 |
| _Goblin | blindingly fast load times... | Dec 13 09:57 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] xPUD is very much in the vain of ChromeOS, that being with a cloud based ethos...Derived from Ubuntu its certainly out of the box! | Dec 13 10:03 | |
| schestowitz | xpud is interesting... scarcely reviewed | Dec 13 10:08 |
| schestowitz | I don't think it's originally Ubuntu based | Dec 13 10:09 |
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| oiaohm | xpud is not ubuntu based. | Dec 13 10:16 |
| oiaohm | Its part vampire. | Dec 13 10:16 |
| oiaohm | http://github.com/penk/mkxpud | Dec 13 10:17 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: penk's mkxpud at master - GitHub .::. Size~: 30.33 KB | Dec 13 10:17 |
| oiaohm | Part of xpud design is the means to extract the parts is need to operate out other distributions. The current vampire target is Ubuntu | Dec 13 10:17 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @manoharban: An attack on padyatra is being planned led by Salwa Judum backed by the state, tomorrow... - Himanshu Kumar, VCA, Dantewada | Dec 13 10:17 | |
| *zer0c00l is now known as zer0c00l|Away | Dec 13 10:18 | |
| *zer0c00l|Away is now known as zer0c00l | Dec 13 10:38 | |
| schestowitz | So it's not Ubuntu based after all..... | Dec 13 10:43 |
| DaemonFC | Q: Do songs ever make you cry? | Dec 13 10:43 |
| DaemonFC | Me: "A lot of the crap that the RIAA labels release could make me cry knowing I paid money for it and will never get it back." | Dec 13 10:43 |
| DaemonFC | B-) | Dec 13 10:43 |
| oiaohm | Its only ubuntu based when ubuntu is the targeted distribution to vampire parts from schestowitz | Dec 13 10:44 |
| schestowitz | Daily links done: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/13/preview-of-linux-2-6-33/ | Dec 13 10:44 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Links 13/12/2009: Preview of Linux 2.6.33, Krita Gets €4,000 | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 147.1 KB | Dec 13 10:44 |
| DaemonFC | well what I don't get is why you would base anything on Ubuntu when Debian is the better choice | Dec 13 10:44 |
| schestowitz | Says MEPIS | Dec 13 10:45 |
| DaemonFC | the whole reasoning behind Ubuntu was that they could get away with stupid crap that Debian would never give thumbs up on | Dec 13 10:45 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: MEPIS is a bad example | Dec 13 10:45 |
| DaemonFC | a real real bad example | Dec 13 10:46 |
| DaemonFC | there's some good Debian-based stuff out there, not all of which happens to use Linux | Dec 13 10:47 |
| oiaohm | Yep there is some debian based stuff with a freebsd core. | Dec 13 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | and with Solaris as the kernel | Dec 13 10:47 |
| DaemonFC | Nexenta | Dec 13 10:47 |
| oiaohm | Ubuntu guys still have the debian issue. | Dec 13 10:48 |
| oiaohm | Over patching. | Dec 13 10:48 |
| DaemonFC | Nexenta is just bizarre, because it's basically Debian running on Solaris using ZFS | Dec 13 10:48 |
| oiaohm | Instead of moving to the newer version. | Dec 13 10:48 |
| DaemonFC | if it wasn't for all the stupid driver problems (mainly GPU-related), I'd be using it | Dec 13 10:49 |
| DaemonFC | it actually performs quite well | Dec 13 10:49 |
| oiaohm | For server work I cannot fault Nexenta | Dec 13 10:49 |
| *zer0c00l is now known as zer0c00l|Away | Dec 13 10:50 | |
| oiaohm | desktop usage it will drive you up walls due to poor support from Nvidia and ATI. | Dec 13 10:50 |
| DaemonFC | I've been running my older laptop off of OpenSolaris for some time now mainly as a curiousity | Dec 13 10:50 |
| oiaohm | Lot of the performance gaps between Linux and Solaris is closing. | Dec 13 10:51 |
| DaemonFC | oiaohm: FreeBSD is benefiting from the ATI open source drivers | Dec 13 10:51 |
| oiaohm | So is solaris DaemonFC | Dec 13 10:52 |
| DaemonFC | Debian is a good base, but the average end user would be nuts to try to make a desktop out of it just because of how old everything in the stable release is | Dec 13 10:53 |
| oiaohm | From a stablity point of view Debian is not always the best. | Dec 13 10:53 |
| DaemonFC | Lenny is currently six kernel versions behind, for example | Dec 13 10:53 |
| DaemonFC | stability is great, but a desktop user probably wants all the latest features, drivers, etc. | Dec 13 10:54 |
| oiaohm | And the kernel has back ported patches DaemonFC | Dec 13 10:54 |
| DaemonFC | Debian doesn't do that for them | Dec 13 10:54 |
| oiaohm | One minor screwup and the stablity goes to hell. | Dec 13 10:54 |
| DaemonFC | the Stable release is frozen to everything but security bugs and major crashers and such | Dec 13 10:54 |
| oiaohm | The risk of back porting. | Dec 13 10:55 |
| oiaohm | Is that you back port 1 patch and not another so breaking system. | Dec 13 10:55 |
| DaemonFC | well, it really kind of shocks me that they are trying to make a FOSS operating system for everyone, that's so old that it doesn't even install if your PC is too new | Dec 13 10:55 |
| oiaohm | There comes a time when just update the part would have been wiser than back porting. | Dec 13 10:55 |
| DaemonFC | so maybe it works on some old antique just fine | Dec 13 10:56 |
| DaemonFC | if you buy a new PC, you might have to wait for two years for Debian to catch up in a stable release | Dec 13 10:56 |
| DaemonFC | so you're kind of stuck on Testing and you get to be in limbo until it freezes and becomes a release | Dec 13 10:57 |
| oiaohm | Debian testing is supprisingly stable. | Dec 13 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | not always though | Dec 13 10:58 |
| oiaohm | No sid is scrary | Dec 13 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | and security patches are not timely there | Dec 13 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | Sid eats babies | Dec 13 10:58 |
| DaemonFC | I really like Debian but I hate their release cycle | Dec 13 10:59 |
| oiaohm | Secuirty patches are not on time compared to stable. | Dec 13 10:59 |
| DaemonFC | every time I've thought I'd make a nice workstation out of it, that's what got me back to using something else | Dec 13 10:59 |
| oiaohm | Really release cycle is the wrong thing from a QA point of view. | Dec 13 10:59 |
| oiaohm | When items are proven stable and quality they should move to the user. | Dec 13 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | oiaohm: It's largely because they're trying to support like 12 architectures where nobody even uses most of them | Dec 13 11:00 |
| oiaohm | Not some arboratiry time frame or trying to have everything ready at the same time. | Dec 13 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | including Itanic | Dec 13 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 13 11:00 |
| oiaohm | Lets say they droped the fixed time frame. | Dec 13 11:00 |
| DaemonFC | so if something goes wrong with a package on Itanium, it might hold up the entire release | Dec 13 11:01 |
| oiaohm | You don't end up with things forced out. | Dec 13 11:01 |
| DaemonFC | even if it builds and runs on the other 11 | Dec 13 11:01 |
| oiaohm | Yep fixed release patent nightmares DaemonFC | Dec 13 11:01 |
| oiaohm | patent/point | Dec 13 11:01 |
| oiaohm | Avoidable with release when ready model. | Dec 13 11:02 |
| DaemonFC | a big reason Ubuntu can release so often is that they only care about x86 and x86-64 | Dec 13 11:02 |
| oiaohm | Fixed release windows also cause Ubuntu nightmares. | Dec 13 11:02 |
| oiaohm | They release parts that are from development trees to stay ahead of the next releasing. | Dec 13 11:02 |
| DaemonFC | well, Microsoft tends to over-engineer things to the point where it becomes ludicrous and delays a Windows release for years, and gets scrapped in the end | Dec 13 11:03 |
| DaemonFC | and it's just a telltale sign of their organizational problems | Dec 13 11:03 |
| oiaohm | Also fixed point release again. | Dec 13 11:03 |
| oiaohm | Its never has worked for anyone DaemonFC | Dec 13 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | Microsoft can't do a rolling release without moving to subscriptions | Dec 13 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | and nobody wants to buy subscriptions to access their own data on their own PC | Dec 13 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | so you get these big monolithic releases, 3-5 years apart that nobody looks forward to trying to install :) | Dec 13 11:05 |
| oiaohm | And we have 12 months of that release cycle waiting for patches. | Dec 13 11:05 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Desktop #GNU #Linux Thrives in Developing Nations, Less So in the West http://ur1.ca/hogz | Dec 13 11:05 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Killer Applications that make 800 pound gorillas tremble .::. Size~: 31.32 KB | Dec 13 11:06 |
| *zer0c00l|Away is now known as zer0c00l | Dec 13 11:07 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The Name of #GNU #Linux Still a Controversy, Unfamiliar to Some http://ur1.ca/hoh3 http://ur1.ca/hoh4 | Dec 13 11:07 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The GNU/Linux Naming Controversy Quietly Lives On | TECH SOURCE FROM BOHOL .::. Size~: 94.97 KB | Dec 13 11:07 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Not Always Right | Funny & Stupid Customer Quotes » When Open Source Meets Closed Minds .::. Size~: 53.96 KB | Dec 13 11:08 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] An Early Look at #Linux 2.6.33 http://ur1.ca/hoh6 | Dec 13 11:09 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Kernel Log: New stable kernels, 2.6.33 with DRBD and RT2800PCI - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 42.74 KB | Dec 13 11:10 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Many Developments Around the #Linux #Graphics Stack http://ur1.ca/hoh8 http://ur1.ca/hoh9 http://ur1.ca/hoha | Dec 13 11:10 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] New xf86-video-intel 2.10 Testing Release .::. Size~: 17.06 KB | Dec 13 11:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] What Will Happen To xf86-video-nv In 2010? .::. Size~: 21.47 KB | Dec 13 11:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] NVIDIA 190.53 Pre-Release Linux Driver .::. Size~: 16.65 KB | Dec 13 11:11 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @jamie_love: @glynmoody on the "twisted, crimped souls fighting against the blind and visual impaired" http://bit.ly/7ItOZT | Dec 13 11:13 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: open...: Of Access to Copyright Materials and Blindness .::. Size~: 94.72 KB | Dec 13 11:13 |
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| DaemonFC | Debian is dropping Alpha and ARM | Dec 13 11:25 |
| DaemonFC | looks like they want to offload some dead weight | Dec 13 11:25 |
| oiaohm | Dropping arm would be foolish. | Dec 13 11:25 |
| oiaohm | Droping alpha is valid its not even in production. | Dec 13 11:25 |
| amarsh04 | there's arm and armel in Debian | Dec 13 11:27 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE Raises Money, #KOffice Worth $34,484,962 http://ur1.ca/hohz http://ur1.ca/hoi0 http://ur1.ca/hoi1 | Dec 13 11:27 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Krita got €4,000 Donation | We love Linux ! .::. Size~: 25 KB | Dec 13 11:28 |
| oiaohm | There are quite a few companies looking at 8 core arm processors for servers due to power profile. | Dec 13 11:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Fading Memories .::. Size~: 21.4 KB | Dec 13 11:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: PiggZ Homepage .::. Size~: 14.8 KB | Dec 13 11:28 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Distributions Comparable to #Google 's #ChromeOS http://ur1.ca/hoi5 | Dec 13 11:28 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Five Web-Centric Alternatives to Google Chrome OS | Chrome OS Geek .::. Size~: 23.26 KB | Dec 13 11:29 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Releases of GNU/Linux: GNUstep, Sabayon... http://ur1.ca/hoi9 http://ur1.ca/hoib | Dec 13 11:30 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: GNUstep 2.0 OS released - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 31.31 KB | Dec 13 11:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Sabayon Linux 5.1 Released! | v00d00.net .::. Size~: 31.31 KB | Dec 13 11:31 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Reviews of Lesser-Known #GNU #Linux Distributions #MangakaChu and #Slitaz http://ur1.ca/hoid http://ur1.ca/hoie | Dec 13 11:31 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Mangaka Chu (Gesundheit) .::. Size~: 7.73 KB | Dec 13 11:32 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Life just isnt fair « Motho ke motho ka botho .::. Size~: 49.58 KB | Dec 13 11:32 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #RedHat Makes Event, Network Appliance, Success Story http://ur1.ca/hoig http://ur1.ca/hoih http://ur1.ca/hoii | Dec 13 11:33 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: EDL Consulting - .::. Size~: 21.27 KB | Dec 13 11:34 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Network appliance offers up to 10 GbE ports - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 60.5 KB | Dec 13 11:34 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Seeding breakthrough thoughts .::. Size~: 44.11 KB | Dec 13 11:34 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FUDCon Reports and Another #Fedora 12 Review http://ur1.ca/hoio http://ur1.ca/hoip http://ur1.ca/hoir | Dec 13 11:39 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The Grand Fallacy » FUDCon Toronto report. .::. Size~: 56.32 KB | Dec 13 11:40 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Fedora 12 A Visually-Pleasing, Highly-Configurable Linux Distro You Might Want To Try .::. Size~: 53.87 KB | Dec 13 11:40 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Overview of #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux 10.04 Developments http://ur1.ca/hoiv http://ur1.ca/hoiw http://ur1.ca/hoix | Dec 13 11:41 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] Plymouth Gets Pulled Into Ubuntu 10.04 LTS .::. Size~: 17.76 KB | Dec 13 11:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] Plymouth Running On Ubuntu 10.04 LTS .::. Size~: 16.61 KB | Dec 13 11:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: What will Ubuntu 10.04 bring to the table? .::. Size~: 54.4 KB | Dec 13 11:42 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Walkthrough of #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux 9.10 in a #VirtualMachine http://ur1.ca/hoj1 | Dec 13 11:42 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Installing Ubuntu 9.10 Walk Through – VirtualBox | Ben Kevan's Blog .::. Size~: 55.3 KB | Dec 13 11:43 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #UbuntuOne in Review, #Ubuntu #Backup Called Awesome http://twit.tv/floss99 http://shanefagan.com/2009/12/12/ubuntu-backup-awesomeness/ | Dec 13 11:44 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The TWiT Netcast Network with Leo Laporte .::. Size~: 23.67 KB | Dec 13 11:44 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Shane Fagan » Ubuntu backup awesomeness .::. Size~: 33.18 KB | Dec 13 11:45 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More New Devices Run #Linux , Including #Handheld #Console http://ur1.ca/hoj4 http://ur1.ca/hoj6 #android | Dec 13 11:45 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Hackable Android handheld game device uses Cortex-A8 SoC - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 67.01 KB | Dec 13 11:46 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Linux development platform targets multimedia SoCs - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 61.31 KB | Dec 13 11:46 |
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| oiaohm | Great Ubuntu just got one of the most hated windows features installing updates on shutdown. I hope they include by pass option not the MS pain from hell. | Dec 13 11:49 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Google #Phones Start to Surface, Run #Linux http://www.linuxworld.com/news/2009/121209-google-releases-experimental-phone-to.html | Dec 13 11:50 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Google releases experimental phone to employees - LinuxWorld .::. Size~: 37.22 KB | Dec 13 11:50 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Subnotebooks Have Bright Future, with #GNU #Linux http://ur1.ca/hoji http://ur1.ca/hojj | Dec 13 11:51 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Raiden's Realm: Netbooks and where the future takes them .::. Size~: 31.74 KB | Dec 13 11:52 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 10 Questions To Ask About Netbooks -- Netbooks -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 88.85 KB | Dec 13 11:52 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Look at the #Linux -based #JooJoo #Tablet /Sub-notebooks, #Moblin http://ur1.ca/hojn http://ur1.ca/hojo | Dec 13 11:52 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: JooJoo (supposed-to-be-CrunchPad) Linux-based Tablet PC Unleashed | TECH SOURCE FROM BOHOL .::. Size~: 95.88 KB | Dec 13 11:52 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The Moblin Netbook OS Giving Chrome OS A Run For Its Money .::. Size~: 66.94 KB | Dec 13 11:53 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FreeSoftware Leads to Computer Affinity http://ur1.ca/hntt Troll? http://ur1.ca/hojy | Dec 13 11:58 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Free Software Fanatics - Opinions by ExtremeTech .::. Size~: 63.21 KB | Dec 13 11:59 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Poor Economy Proving Helpful to #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/hoka http://ur1.ca/hokb | Dec 13 12:00 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: IT: Move to innovation park benefited South Tyrol's open source centre — .::. Size~: 29.96 KB | Dec 13 12:00 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Bad economy may lead to good IPOs in open source | The Open Road - CNET News .::. Size~: 82.44 KB | Dec 13 12:01 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Review of #Sun #VirtualBox , #SFLC to Defend #Oracle Takeover http://ur1.ca/hokg http://ur1.ca/hokj | Dec 13 12:01 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Techgage - Sun VirtualBox - Free, Powerful Virtualization .::. Size~: 24.64 KB | Dec 13 12:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Software Freedom Law Center Chairman to Testify at Oracle/Sun Hearing - Software Freedom Law Center .::. Size~: 5.3 KB | Dec 13 12:02 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Firefox Builds #Extensions Store http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/11/mozilla_add_on_marketplace/ | Dec 13 12:02 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Mozilla to open - gasp! - Firefox add-on store • The Register .::. Size~: 29.18 KB | Dec 13 12:02 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Free Software's Impact on Hardware: 2009 Overview http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2009/12/open_source_hardware_2009_-_the_def.html | Dec 13 12:03 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Make: Online : Open source hardware 2009 - The definitive guide to open source hardware projects in 2009 .::. Size~: 78.78 KB | Dec 13 12:03 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Polish and US #Governments Do the Right Thing with #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/hoko http://ur1.ca/hokp | Dec 13 12:04 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: PL: Interior ministry supports open source group's procurement project — .::. Size~: 28 KB | Dec 13 12:05 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Does Open Source Software Put Government Security at Risk? - *nix Software News Story .::. Size~: 44.59 KB | Dec 13 12:05 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Internet Abuse Found in #DigitalEconomyBill , Unrest Grows http://ur1.ca/hokv http://ur1.ca/hokw | Dec 13 12:10 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Digital Economy Bill: Lords Want To Stamp Out Piracy Chasers | TorrentFreak .::. Size~: 63.12 KB | Dec 13 12:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Amendment Tabled to Delete Clause 17 from the UK Digital Economy Bill − ISPreview UK .::. Size~: 16.47 KB | Dec 13 12:11 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IntellectualMonopolies Don't Match up with Business Models http://ur1.ca/hol5 http://ur1.ca/hol6 | Dec 13 12:14 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Look at #KDE4 Distributions http://www.tuxradar.com/content/get-best-kde-linux-distro #gnu #linux | Dec 13 12:14 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Russian Publishers Taking A More Progressive View On Book 'Piracy' | Techdirt .::. Size~: 27.72 KB | Dec 13 12:14 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Music as Commerce: Understanding a Mindset - hypebot .::. Size~: 62.99 KB | Dec 13 12:14 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Get the best KDE Linux distro | TuxRadar Linux .::. Size~: 46.11 KB | Dec 13 12:14 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Makes #Vista7 Look Unappealing http://jeffhoogland.blogspot.com/2009/12/hands-on-with-windows-7-ubuntu-users.html | Dec 13 12:14 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Thoughts on Technology: Hands on with Windows 7 - An Ubuntu User's Perspective .::. Size~: 82.78 KB | Dec 13 12:14 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Vista All Over Again: 31% of #Vista7 Clients Have Upgrade Problems http://ur1.ca/hold http://ur1.ca/holg | Dec 13 12:16 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Windows 7 complaints rolling in - Dec. 9, 2009 .::. Size~: 69.35 KB | Dec 13 12:17 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Windows 7 Complaints Trickling In » ulyssesonline.com .::. Size~: 30.4 KB | Dec 13 12:17 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.informationweek.com/news/windows/microsoft_news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=222000693 | Dec 13 12:33 |
| schestowitz | "Microsoft said it would release a patch next week that will address an Explorer 8 zero-day vulnerability and several other security threats. The software maker, however, disclosed no plans to fix a bug that may have crippled as many as 50,000 Windows PCs. " | Dec 13 12:33 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Patch Tuesday: No Black Screen Fix -- InformationWeek .::. Size~: 81.74 KB | Dec 13 12:33 |
| schestowitz | Is this still really a bug or just malware? | Dec 13 12:33 |
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| ChrisTX | this "bug" is because the RPC service is started as LocalService instead of NetworkService | Dec 13 12:38 |
| ChrisTX | it's not a bug | Dec 13 12:38 |
| ChrisTX | and can be fixed by editing the service account | Dec 13 12:38 |
| schestowitz | OK, thanks | Dec 13 12:39 |
| schestowitz | It's over a week old (the article) | Dec 13 12:39 |
| schestowitz | The company issued a sort of apology, but that was days beforehand, so... | Dec 13 12:39 |
| schestowitz | omar should see this...: http://www.ameinfo.com/mobile/news/company/218066/ | Dec 13 12:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: AMEinfo.com Mobile : eSense pioneers the corporate transition to Windows 7 .::. Size~: 4.79 KB | Dec 13 12:42 |
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| Omar87 | Hi all. | Dec 13 12:48 |
| oiaohm | Hi Omar87 | Dec 13 12:49 |
| Omar87 | oh, hi oiaohm. | Dec 13 12:49 |
| schestowitz | http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Windows/5-Reasons-Why-Android-Could-Kill-Windows-Mobile-132239/ | Dec 13 12:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Five Reasons Why Android Could Kill Windows Mobile - Windows from eWeek .::. Size~: 128.69 KB | Dec 13 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Hey, Omar87 | Dec 13 12:51 |
| schestowitz | http://www.ameinfo.com/mobile/news/company/218066/ | Dec 13 12:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: AMEinfo.com Mobile : eSense pioneers the corporate transition to Windows 7 .::. Size~: 4.79 KB | Dec 13 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Your local Microsoft 'ecosystemers' | Dec 13 12:51 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: hey, Roy. | Dec 13 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Check it out | Dec 13 12:51 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: yeah man. Tell me about it. :-) | Dec 13 12:51 |
| schestowitz | Is someone here decently familiar with leafnode? | Dec 13 12:52 |
| schestowitz | They have those in India too.... Microsoft helpers... http://www.indiaprwire.com/pressrelease/information-technology/2009120739020.htm | Dec 13 12:53 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: ITC Infotech launches services for seamless migration to Windows 7 in partnership with Microsoft .::. Size~: 9.31 KB | Dec 13 12:53 |
| Omar87 | See Roy? This is part of why I feel ashamed of being an Arab. (I'm proud of my Islam, though) | Dec 13 12:53 |
| oiaohm | Windows Moblie is going to be squesed between Android and what nokia is plaining to do with QT | Dec 13 12:54 |
| Omar87 | oiaohm: Maemo. ;-) | Dec 13 12:59 |
| Omar87 | oiaohm: trust me, it's amazing. | Dec 13 13:01 |
| oiaohm | Nop Omar87 | Dec 13 13:01 |
| Omar87 | oiaohm: why? | Dec 13 13:01 |
| oiaohm | QT will be the front end for all Nokia's OS's not just Maemo | Dec 13 13:02 |
| oiaohm | You are just seeing smaller coner in Maemo | Dec 13 13:02 |
| Omar87 | oiaohm: Yeah, that's right, I know. | Dec 13 13:02 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: zero-day LLLLLLL | Dec 13 13:02 |
| schestowitz | http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-10413678-94.html | Dec 13 13:02 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft needs to go big with Windows Mobile | Wireless - CNET News .::. Size~: 141.77 KB | Dec 13 13:02 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] REVIEW – xPUD 0.9.2 http://tinyurl.com/ybcve85 #linux #foss #gnu #xpud | Dec 13 13:02 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: REVIEW xPUD 0.9.2 « OPEN BYTES cave quid dicis, quando, et cui. .::. Size~: 36.53 KB | Dec 13 13:02 |
| schestowitz | Suggests Microsoft should embrace Android. Heh. | Dec 13 13:03 |
| oiaohm | MS replacement to Windows Mobile is dead. ie spot the .net OS. | Dec 13 13:03 |
| oiaohm | Problem for MS if nokia wins the smart phone batter with QT MS is in real trouble. | Dec 13 13:07 |
| *trmanco (n=trmanco@unaffiliated/trmanco) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 13:07 | |
| oiaohm | batter/battle | Dec 13 13:07 |
| schestowitz | http://technologizer.com/2009/12/11/office-2003-rights-management-bug-locks-up-files/ | Dec 13 13:07 |
| schestowitz | Typical. | Dec 13 13:08 |
| schestowitz | http://www.techflash.com/seattle/2009/12/microsoft_office_03_bug_preventing_access_to_protected_docs.html | Dec 13 13:08 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft Office '03 bug prevents access to protected documents .::. Size~: 45.7 KB | Dec 13 13:08 |
| ChrisTX | with ws2003 so | Dec 13 13:09 |
| ChrisTX | ws2008 and ws2008r2 won't have that issue | Dec 13 13:10 |
| oiaohm | LOL | Dec 13 13:10 |
| oiaohm | That bug happens 2003 to 2003 MS Office. | Dec 13 13:10 |
| *zer0c00l` (n=user@117.199.134.83) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 13:10 | |
| oiaohm | I only reported it to MS in 2004 | Dec 13 13:11 |
| oiaohm | There is a second as well | Dec 13 13:11 |
| *zer0c00l has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) | Dec 13 13:12 | |
| oiaohm | Files are touchy to even the most minor damage rendering the data not accessable. | Dec 13 13:12 |
| schestowitz | What a silly headline from Paula Rooney : http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=5428 | Dec 13 13:13 |
| schestowitz | It's like she's trying to compare Microsoft to Red Hat. Meh. | Dec 13 13:13 |
| schestowitz | *LOL* .. "White House Office of Management and Budget (OBM)" | Dec 13 13:16 |
| schestowitz | Coincidence in this acronym or what? | Dec 13 13:16 |
| oiaohm | SPICE from redhat is attackive tech. | Dec 13 13:17 |
| *Omar87 has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 13 13:17 | |
| oiaohm | Hopefully vmware and redhat can play nice with it. | Dec 13 13:17 |
| schestowitz | Intrusions...? http://seattle.blockshopper.com/news/story/700047810-Microsoft_Europe_exec_sells_Sammamish_5BD | Dec 13 13:24 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft Europe exec sells Sammamish 5BD | BlockShopper Seattle .::. Size~: 40.83 KB | Dec 13 13:24 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: attractive or attacking? | Dec 13 13:24 |
| schestowitz | Another one: http://seattle.blockshopper.com/news/story/700046945-Microsoft_corporate_exec_unloads_4BD_in_Kirkland | Dec 13 13:25 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft corporate exec unloads 4BD in Kirkland | BlockShopper Seattle .::. Size~: 40.17 KB | Dec 13 13:25 |
| schestowitz | This is weird.. they even show people's houses... | Dec 13 13:25 |
| schestowitz | Privacy comes to mind | Dec 13 13:25 |
| schestowitz | Again: http://seattle.blockshopper.com/news/story/700048980-Microsoft_product_manager_picks_3BD_in_University_District | Dec 13 13:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft product manager picks 3BD in University District | BlockShopper Seattle .::. Size~: 39.94 KB | Dec 13 13:28 |
| cubezzz | who is Philipe Kahn? | Dec 13 13:29 |
| cubezzz | sorry, Philippe I should say | Dec 13 13:30 |
| cubezzz | ah, now I see, Borland guy | Dec 13 13:30 |
| oiaohm | attractive schestowitz | Dec 13 13:32 |
| amarsh04 | I use leafnode but I wouldn't claim to be 'decently familiar' with it | Dec 13 13:33 |
| schestowitz | http://www.crunchgear.com/2009/12/09/microsoft-germany-sprechen-nicht-von-apple/ | Dec 13 13:34 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft Germany: Sprechen nicht von Apple! (updated) .::. Size~: 37.01 KB | Dec 13 13:34 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: it threw SPICE right in Microsoft's eyes. Ouch! | Dec 13 13:35 |
| cubezzz | Rochester free-net is one of the few US free-nets I can find that's still operating | Dec 13 13:47 |
| cubezzz | There are very few FreeNets still online. | Dec 13 13:50 |
| schestowitz | http://www.izgadget.com/2009/12/10/microsoft-and-google-sued-links-to-file-sharing-site/ | Dec 13 13:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft And Google Sued Links To File-Sharing Site | izGadget .::. Size~: 18.92 KB | Dec 13 13:51 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: what are these for? newsgroups? | Dec 13 13:51 |
| cubezzz | internet access | Dec 13 13:51 |
| *Omar87 (n=quassel@94.249.85.124) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 13:51 | |
| cubezzz | via non-profit companies | Dec 13 13:51 |
| cubezzz | http://www.ispbargains.com/free-isp.html | Dec 13 13:52 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Free ISP Update - Free Dial-Up Internet Access in the U.S. .::. Size~: 35.26 KB | Dec 13 13:52 |
| cubezzz | that list is the most current | Dec 13 13:52 |
| cubezzz | you can see the death list is rather big | Dec 13 13:53 |
| cubezzz | we are fortunate in Canada though | Dec 13 13:54 |
| cubezzz | relatively speaking, as we have Toronto Freenet and NCF | Dec 13 13:55 |
| cubezzz | NCF you can buy broadband if you have a bell phone anywhere in Ontario or Quebec | Dec 13 13:55 |
| cubezzz | not sure if there is a US equivalent | Dec 13 14:00 |
| trmanco | http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-saving-mysql.html | Dec 13 14:02 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 14:02 |
| *Tallken (n=f2f93bf5@93.102.36.218.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 14:03 | |
| oiaohm | http://schreuders.org/FBAC-LSM Interesting new security module idea. | Dec 13 14:03 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Z. Cliffe Schreuders .::. Size~: 0.76 KB | Dec 13 14:03 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 13 14:04 |
| *_goblin has quit ("Ex-Chat") | Dec 13 14:06 | |
| schestowitz | And Microsoft pretends that Google does not honour privacy.. http://blog.seattlepi.com/microsoft/archives/187507.asp | Dec 13 14:17 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: EntityCube project gathers Web info on everyone .::. Size~: 64.55 KB | Dec 13 14:17 |
| MinceR | no, what they pretend is that they do | Dec 13 14:19 |
| MinceR | google doesn't honor privacy but neither does m$ | Dec 13 14:19 |
| trmanco | has anybody sent an email to the EC? for mysql? | Dec 13 14:25 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Started organizing my life with !emacs !org-mode . | Dec 13 14:26 | |
| trmanco | http://kloeri.livejournal.com/12231.html | Dec 13 14:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: kloeri: Changes in Microsoft Windows EULA .::. Size~: 38.02 KB | Dec 13 14:28 |
| trmanco | wow | Dec 13 14:28 |
| trmanco | this is old :| | Dec 13 14:28 |
| trmanco | I'm a bit outdated :S | Dec 13 14:28 |
| schestowitz | http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5jMJ1j2vnIPOtzpfLLCK4ul7pUzFQ | Dec 13 14:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The Press Association: Game shares fall on poor sales .::. Size~: 7.16 KB | Dec 13 14:29 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: don't | Dec 13 14:30 |
| schestowitz | The Microsofters want it | Dec 13 14:30 |
| trmanco | don't what? | Dec 13 14:30 |
| schestowitz | Which usually implies it's good for Microsoft | Dec 13 14:30 |
| schestowitz | Don't bother mailing the EU | Dec 13 14:30 |
| trmanco | why? | Dec 13 14:30 |
| *Eruaran (n=quassel@CPE-121-214-36-2.lnse4.win.bigpond.net.au) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 14:30 | |
| schestowitz | Monty is now close to Microsoft | Dec 13 14:30 |
| schestowitz | I don't trust him | Dec 13 14:30 |
| trmanco | found this | Dec 13 14:32 |
| trmanco | http://planet.mysql.com/entry/?id=22607 | Dec 13 14:32 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Planet MySQL - Archives - Come on Monty .::. Size~: 18.45 KB | Dec 13 14:32 |
| oiaohm | Yep is basically impossiable with windows 7 to get a refund | Dec 13 14:36 |
| cubezzz | hmmph | Dec 13 14:37 |
| cubezzz | which is why I have said _many_ times not to pay the Microsoft Tax in the first place | Dec 13 14:37 |
| MinceR | which is usually impossible | Dec 13 14:39 |
| cubezzz | no, that's not true | Dec 13 14:39 |
| cubezzz | well, sorry | Dec 13 14:39 |
| cubezzz | it's not always true | Dec 13 14:39 |
| cubezzz | if you are determined enough you can buy a machine without windows | Dec 13 14:40 |
| trmanco | I usually build my own machine | Dec 13 14:40 |
| cubezzz | yes, the current situation is poor | Dec 13 14:40 |
| schestowitz | http://www.fiercewireless.com/story/lawsuit-charges-sprint-palm-negligence-over-data-loss/2009-12-08 | Dec 13 14:40 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Lawsuit charges Sprint, Palm with negligence over data loss - FierceWireless .::. Size~: 43.26 KB | Dec 13 14:40 |
| trmanco | works better and faster | Dec 13 14:40 |
| Eruaran | Dell, Zareason, System76 | Dec 13 14:40 |
| trmanco | I prefer to buy all the needed hardware and putting it together myself | Dec 13 14:41 |
| cubezzz | if it was $5 I still wouldn't pay the Microsoft Tax | Dec 13 14:41 |
| oiaohm | Dell is useless if you want systems without windows here in Australia Eruaran | Dec 13 14:41 |
| MinceR | Zareason and System76 don't sell everywhere | Dec 13 14:41 |
| trmanco | I would even pay if it it would cost 1¢ | Dec 13 14:41 |
| MinceR | and Dell sells shitpiles, not computers | Dec 13 14:41 |
| trmanco | for* | Dec 13 14:41 |
| cubezzz | woulnd't or would? :) | Dec 13 14:42 |
| trmanco | I wouldn't | Dec 13 14:42 |
| trmanco | :S | Dec 13 14:42 |
| Eruaran | its still possible to order from Zareason or System76 | Dec 13 14:42 |
| cubezzz | ebay then | Dec 13 14:42 |
| cubezzz | at least you have choices | Dec 13 14:42 |
| Eruaran | New smartbooks are coming | Dec 13 14:43 |
| Eruaran | They wont run Windows | Dec 13 14:43 |
| MinceR | and what about warranty? | Dec 13 14:43 |
| MinceR | pay my ass off to ship the computer back if there's any issue? | Dec 13 14:43 |
| MinceR | and wait a few weeks more? | Dec 13 14:43 |
| MinceR | let's hope it isn't dell because they could sit on the broken machine for a month | Dec 13 14:44 |
| Eruaran | I'm thinking primarily of notebooks, which is a greater part of the market now | Dec 13 14:44 |
| MinceR | s/dell/like dell/ | Dec 13 14:44 |
| MinceR | notebooks need warranty too | Dec 13 14:44 |
| cubezzz | buy high-end stuff MinceR | Dec 13 14:44 |
| Eruaran | Dell recently lied to one of our customers | Dec 13 14:44 |
| cubezzz | the probability of failure would be very low | Dec 13 14:44 |
| MinceR | well, high-end stuff isn't sold without winblows tax | Dec 13 14:44 |
| MinceR | system76 only ships to usa and canada | Dec 13 14:45 |
| cubezzz | which country are you in? | Dec 13 14:46 |
| MinceR | absurdistan, also known as hungary | Dec 13 14:46 |
| Eruaran | The only way consumers will get this practice to stop is by demanding different products (ie Smartbooks) or by refusing to buy products that force you to pay the Microsoft tax | Dec 13 14:46 |
| MinceR | no, the only way consumers will get this practice to stop is by making the m$ tax illegal | Dec 13 14:46 |
| MinceR | or by waging war on m$ | Dec 13 14:46 |
| cubezzz | MinceR, can you at least get parts and assemble a desktop? | Dec 13 14:46 |
| MinceR | assembling a desktop will help me very little towards having a laptop | Dec 13 14:47 |
| Eruaran | Then send your complaint to the ACCC or VCAT etc | Dec 13 14:47 |
| MinceR | and then it will be ignored | Dec 13 14:47 |
| MinceR | i don't have millions of dollars for lobbying (or for anything else) | Dec 13 14:47 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Rocknerd: Have yourself a merry little Christmas. vhttp://rocknerd.co.uk/2009/12/13/have-yourself-a-merry-little-christmas/ | Dec 13 14:47 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Rocknerd » Blog Archive » Have yourself a merry little Christmas. .::. Size~: 5.96 KB | Dec 13 14:47 |
| Eruaran | Refer to first comment | Dec 13 14:47 |
| oiaohm | What next windows bundled with motherboards so we cannot get away from it for anything. | Dec 13 14:48 |
| Eruaran | I'm putting together a Linux only desktop system | Dec 13 14:48 |
| Eruaran | To be sold to customers | Dec 13 14:48 |
| Eruaran | Requests for a Windows version will be denied | Dec 13 14:48 |
| cubezzz | no, things aren't _that_ bad MinceR :) | Dec 13 14:49 |
| cubezzz | er | Dec 13 14:49 |
| cubezzz | oiaohm | Dec 13 14:49 |
| Eruaran | havent decided on the config yet, but it will be a single model, complete with a Coreboot BIOS | Dec 13 14:49 |
| cubezzz | zareason sells to Hungary yes? | Dec 13 14:49 |
| Eruaran | It's going to be a "respects your rights and freedom" system | Dec 13 14:50 |
| MinceR | zareason does | Dec 13 14:50 |
| Eruaran | No Windows allowed | Dec 13 14:50 |
| oiaohm | cubezzz: The zero refund policy is basically the step in that direction. | Dec 13 14:50 |
| Eruaran | If a customer wants a Windows system I will direct them to other systems in our range | Dec 13 14:50 |
| cubezzz | how can they say zero refund? | Dec 13 14:50 |
| oiaohm | They already have cubezzz | Dec 13 14:50 |
| oiaohm | http://kloeri.livejournal.com/12231.html Read it carefully. cubezzz | Dec 13 14:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: kloeri: Changes in Microsoft Windows EULA .::. Size~: 38.02 KB | Dec 13 14:51 |
| cubezzz | I think Tyan even ships motherboards with linux bios | Dec 13 14:51 |
| cubezzz | ok | Dec 13 14:51 |
| oiaohm | You want to return windows you must comply with makers return policy. | Dec 13 14:51 |
| oiaohm | So lets say is 60 dollars refund for windows and I charge a 120 handling charge. That is a nice -60 dollar refund cubezzz | Dec 13 14:51 |
| cubezzz | huh | Dec 13 14:52 |
| oiaohm | And that can be nicely written into the return policy. | Dec 13 14:52 |
| oiaohm | Instead, contact the manufacturer or installer to determine its return policy << That line is pure evil cubezzz | Dec 13 14:52 |
| oiaohm | You must comply with that policy, which might limit your rights or require you to return the entire system on which the software is installed. << This new line is a kicker | Dec 13 14:54 |
| cubezzz | ok, I have a suggestion | Dec 13 14:54 |
| cubezzz | I've mentioned this before... | Dec 13 14:54 |
| cubezzz | I buy used panasonic toughbooks from ebay | Dec 13 14:54 |
| cubezzz | they are excellent, and work well with linux | Dec 13 14:54 |
| cubezzz | I buy used then remove the windows stickers, format and install Linux | Dec 13 14:55 |
| oiaohm | Still supply is limited and someone would have still paid the MS tax. | Dec 13 14:55 |
| Eruaran | What is a good name for a [insert FOSS operating system here] only system | Dec 13 14:55 |
| oiaohm | You have just avoided paying it your self cubezzz | Dec 13 14:55 |
| cubezzz | Acer will sell a Linux laptop | Dec 13 14:56 |
| cubezzz | I know this for sure | Dec 13 14:56 |
| Eruaran | I was thinking of putting Arch on it... I've gone off Ubuntu | Dec 13 14:56 |
| cubezzz | toughbook CF-48 worked, 3d acceleration too | Dec 13 14:56 |
| cubezzz | probably the best I've ever tried | Dec 13 14:57 |
| cubezzz | well, I still like Fedora for OS | Dec 13 14:57 |
| Eruaran | I was thinking of defaulting to Arch, but if someone wants Fedora, I'd do that | Dec 13 14:59 |
| cubezzz | your idea is good | Dec 13 14:59 |
| Eruaran | I don't think what Dell have done with their website is bad with regard to Ubuntu. You don't want the wrong people buying an Ubuntu system. Its nothing but hassle. | Dec 13 15:01 |
| Eruaran | People can be really dumb. | Dec 13 15:03 |
| cubezzz | I have no problem buying used laptops | Dec 13 15:04 |
| cubezzz | as long as I can get parts, which is easy with toughbooks | Dec 13 15:04 |
| MinceR | you don't want anyone buying a dell system. it's nothing but hassle. | Dec 13 15:05 |
| cubezzz | the police and fire departments use toughbooks so the world is swimming in parts | Dec 13 15:05 |
| Eruaran | I know | Dec 13 15:05 |
| Eruaran | We recently had a customer who wanted us to fix their Dell notebook | Dec 13 15:05 |
| Eruaran | It was nothing but hassle | Dec 13 15:05 |
| MinceR | dell must think the same about fixing their laptops | Dec 13 15:06 |
| Eruaran | They really need a new notebook but they don't want to pay for it | Dec 13 15:06 |
| amarsh04 | our electricity utility uses toughbooks also | Dec 13 15:06 |
| Eruaran | they got insurnance | Dec 13 15:06 |
| Eruaran | *insurance | Dec 13 15:06 |
| Eruaran | So, we get this notebook, and Dell wont give us the time of day on getting a new motherboard for it. | Dec 13 15:07 |
| Eruaran | So, our senior notebook tech fixes the motherboard as best he can. | Dec 13 15:07 |
| Eruaran | They're still not happy, but we can't do anything more. | Dec 13 15:07 |
| cubezzz | what's wrong with it? | Dec 13 15:08 |
| Eruaran | He calls Dell again, and miraculously, they do an about face and offer a motherboard for free... WTF ? | Dec 13 15:08 |
| oiaohm | Normal Eruaran | Dec 13 15:08 |
| Eruaran | The customer, who have well and truly gotten on my nerves by now, calls Dell | Dec 13 15:08 |
| Eruaran | Dell lies to the customer, telling them that we never called them in the first place | Dec 13 15:08 |
| Eruaran | We are furious | Dec 13 15:09 |
| oiaohm | Perfectly normal. | Dec 13 15:09 |
| MinceR | time to stop supporting dell. | Dec 13 15:09 |
| Eruaran | I call Dell in front of the customer | Dec 13 15:09 |
| Eruaran | and have their call on loudspeaker | Dec 13 15:09 |
| Eruaran | we don't support Dell, we fix notebooks in general | Dec 13 15:09 |
| oiaohm | I inform dell I am recording there call and will be playing there answers to customers. | Dec 13 15:09 |
| MinceR | "we fix notebooks in general, except dell" | Dec 13 15:09 |
| MinceR | :> | Dec 13 15:09 |
| cubezzz | I've fixed Dell laptops, but it was an easy fix | Dec 13 15:10 |
| oiaohm | Supprising how much more willing they are to play ball in that case. | Dec 13 15:10 |
| cubezzz | keyboard replacement | Dec 13 15:10 |
| Eruaran | Dell admits there has been some "confusion", so now the customer knows Dell are dodgy as | Dec 13 15:10 |
| MinceR | well, i know an easy fix | Dec 13 15:10 |
| MinceR | replace it with a thinkpad | Dec 13 15:10 |
| MinceR | ;) | Dec 13 15:10 |
| MinceR | i didn't say it was cheap though | Dec 13 15:10 |
| oiaohm | I have learnt over my years recording gear pays for itself Eruaran | Dec 13 15:10 |
| cubezzz | sure, I'll get Acer or Panasonic instead and avoid Dell | Dec 13 15:10 |
| Eruaran | oiaohm: yes | Dec 13 15:10 |
| oiaohm | I have had some Acer personal be pricks as well. | Dec 13 15:11 |
| cubezzz | actually I have this one Dell that's 1996 era and it still works | Dec 13 15:11 |
| Eruaran | Dell were ok in 96 | Dec 13 15:11 |
| MinceR | i have a dell that's a little over 2 years old and has been in service 3 times | Dec 13 15:11 |
| MinceR | and they still refused to fix the keyboard under warranty, so i hacked that myself | Dec 13 15:11 |
| cubezzz | ok, I get it :) | Dec 13 15:12 |
| cubezzz | no Dells | Dec 13 15:12 |
| cubezzz | which is kind of a pity | Dec 13 15:12 |
| oiaohm | I have supprisingly few hassles with dells. | Dec 13 15:12 |
| Eruaran | Michael Dell originally rebadged IBM PC's as Dell | Dec 13 15:12 |
| oiaohm | Mind you that is mostly because they know I am recording. | Dec 13 15:12 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 13 15:12 |
| oiaohm | Keyboards screens the lot I have had replaced fairly cheep. | Dec 13 15:13 |
| oiaohm | I also quite commonly get complete unit replacement offers as well. | Dec 13 15:13 |
| oiaohm | Simple fact how do you bluff someone with recordings. | Dec 13 15:14 |
| MinceR | i'd be more insterested in why do they want to bluff in the first place | Dec 13 15:14 |
| MinceR | if dell wasn't a fraud, they wouldn't have to | Dec 13 15:14 |
| *Tallken has quit ("Leaving") | Dec 13 15:15 | |
| oiaohm | Its staff there get extra cash for resolving without needing replacement parts MinceR | Dec 13 15:15 |
| MinceR | in other words, scamming is in their policy | Dec 13 15:16 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. its close but its not. | Dec 13 15:16 |
| MinceR | of course it doesn't help that the stuff they produce is crap in the first place | Dec 13 15:16 |
| oiaohm | If you have recordings staff caught doing it get punished MinceR | Dec 13 15:17 |
| MinceR | i prefer to do business with companies that don't need recordings to keep them in line. | Dec 13 15:17 |
| oiaohm | Recording system is need at times when dealing with all companies. | Dec 13 15:19 |
| Eruaran | Our experience with Asus has always been good | Dec 13 15:20 |
| oiaohm | Bad operators are bad operators. Just dell seams to collect them. | Dec 13 15:20 |
| Eruaran | Asus and BenQ, always go out of their way to help if we call them | Dec 13 15:20 |
| oiaohm | BenQ I have had one suspect operator. But next call got a good operator. | Dec 13 15:21 |
| oiaohm | I would give Asus and BenQ high marks for keeping there call centers in order. | Dec 13 15:21 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Created my first TODO list with emacs org-mode [screenshot] http://www.twitpic.com/tcunc . i like org-mode :-) | Dec 13 15:21 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Twitpic - Share photos on Twitter .::. Size~: 7.31 KB | Dec 13 15:21 |
| oiaohm | Recording gear is not that expensive. | Dec 13 15:22 |
| Eruaran | I called HP/Compaq once and was told by an operator that if I installed Linux, "you'll break it" and that installing any operating system but Windows "voids the warranty". | Dec 13 15:23 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 13 15:23 |
| cubezzz | HP used to have a Unix divison | Dec 13 15:23 |
| cubezzz | you need to talk to an old-timer | Dec 13 15:23 |
| Eruaran | Second call got a better operator | Dec 13 15:23 |
| ChrisTX | ohja HP doesnt have HP-UX anymore | Dec 13 15:24 |
| ChrisTX | I forgot | Dec 13 15:24 |
| Eruaran | Don't they compete with IBM in Linux mainfraims ? | Dec 13 15:25 |
| *zer0c00l` is now known as zer0c00l|Away | Dec 13 15:25 | |
| ChrisTX | uhm IBM also got IBM AIX, so it's not like IBM was selling only linux lol | Dec 13 15:25 |
| Eruaran | I know | Dec 13 15:26 |
| ChrisTX | and HP-UX and AIX are competitors, yes | Dec 13 15:26 |
| Eruaran | But how many people actually use AIX | Dec 13 15:26 |
| ChrisTX | uhm quite a lot actually | Dec 13 15:26 |
| Eruaran | k | Dec 13 15:27 |
| ChrisTX | else they wouldn't do AIX | Dec 13 15:27 |
| Eruaran | their latext Z doesn't come with AIX | Dec 13 15:27 |
| Eruaran | latest | Dec 13 15:27 |
| ChrisTX | it's just that Linux is good to keep costs low | Dec 13 15:27 |
| *Diablo-D3 (n=diablo@64.223.238.130) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 15:27 | |
| ChrisTX | so what? | Dec 13 15:27 |
| Eruaran | just saying | Dec 13 15:28 |
| ChrisTX | think: if AIX wouldn't sell, IBM wasn't doing it | Dec 13 15:28 |
| ChrisTX | *wasn't selling | Dec 13 15:28 |
| ChrisTX | ah | Dec 13 15:28 |
| ChrisTX | damnit | Dec 13 15:28 |
| cubezzz | another closed source OS | Dec 13 15:28 |
| ChrisTX | so? | Dec 13 15:28 |
| Eruaran | 90% of mainfraims run Linux | Dec 13 15:28 |
| cubezzz | I think my remark is self-evident | Dec 13 15:28 |
| oiaohm | ChrisTX: HP is openvms and Linux these days. | Dec 13 15:29 |
| Eruaran | or supercomputers rather | Dec 13 15:29 |
| MinceR | except for the parts that are winblows | Dec 13 15:29 |
| MinceR | and printers that suck at pulling in paper | Dec 13 15:29 |
| ChrisTX | lol what does mainframes got to do with supercomputers | Dec 13 15:29 |
| ChrisTX | sorry if I don't see the relevance | Dec 13 15:29 |
| Eruaran | nevermind | Dec 13 15:29 |
| oiaohm | Mainframes are normally modules in mondern day supers ChrisTX | Dec 13 15:30 |
| Eruaran | racks | Dec 13 15:30 |
| oiaohm | Yes rack mounted modules | Dec 13 15:31 |
| *oiaohm has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 13 15:31 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.suntimes.com/technology/1928861,CST-NWS-sidekick09.article | Dec 13 15:32 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 'Sidekick' owners sue Microsoft over cell data wipeout :: CHICAGO SUN-TIMES :: Technology .::. Size~: 40.64 KB | Dec 13 15:32 |
| Omar87 | Hi all. | Dec 13 15:33 |
| ChrisTX | <oiaohm> Mainframes are normally modules in mondern day supers ChrisTX <- sure everyone builds a supercomputer out of $500k mainframes | Dec 13 15:34 |
| ChrisTX | makes sense | Dec 13 15:34 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Pics from Nov 2009 Vagabonds up at last! http://reddragdiva.co.uk/thumbnails.php?album=82 | Dec 13 15:41 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: reddragdiva.co.uk - Vagabonds, Sat 28 Nov 2009 .::. Size~: 32.38 KB | Dec 13 15:41 |
| *Tallken (n=f2f93bf5@93.102.36.218.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 15:50 | |
| schestowitz | Eruaran: well, almost 90% (or more) of mainframes run IBM | Dec 13 15:51 |
| *_nbnds (n=_nbnds@port-92-195-16-9.dynamic.qsc.de) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 15:52 | |
| _nbnds | do you boycott only novell or opensuse as well? | Dec 13 15:56 |
| MinceR | i thought opensuse was novell :> | Dec 13 16:01 |
| MinceR | i can't speak for the others but i avoid *suse anyway | Dec 13 16:01 |
| cubezzz | it is free and open | Dec 13 16:05 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Sunday afternoon, kids playing Wii sports, wifey out shopping, me with my laptop. 21st century family. #fb | Dec 13 16:05 | |
| cubezzz | I've never tried it though | Dec 13 16:06 |
| MinceR | it's in novell control, afaik | Dec 13 16:06 |
| MinceR | and i've tried it and found it to suck | Dec 13 16:06 |
| cubezzz | so what do you use? | Dec 13 16:06 |
| _nbnds | do you also boycott redhat? | Dec 13 16:06 |
| MinceR | i use kubuntu | Dec 13 16:07 |
| MinceR | _nbnds: afaik no | Dec 13 16:07 |
| schestowitz | you must enable Javascript to download Chrome. Lame. | Dec 13 16:07 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 13 16:07 |
| schestowitz | \o/ | Dec 13 16:08 |
| schestowitz | http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202436144682&Judge_in_Mark_Cuban_Case_Orders__Discovery_Against_SEC | Dec 13 16:09 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Law.com - Judge in Mark Cuban Case Orders Discovery Against SEC .::. Size~: 27.9 KB | Dec 13 16:09 |
| _nbnds | what are you aiming at by boycotting novell? | Dec 13 16:11 |
| MinceR | to protect the FLOSS community from attacks by m$ and novell | Dec 13 16:13 |
| MinceR | one of which is the sw patent FUD/protection racket campaign m$ is running and novell (among others) is supporting | Dec 13 16:14 |
| ChrisTX | oh lol | Dec 13 16:14 |
| ChrisTX | right MS got nothing better to do than that | Dec 13 16:14 |
| ChrisTX | I forgot | Dec 13 16:14 |
| MinceR | well, they're getting desperate | Dec 13 16:14 |
| ChrisTX | because? | Dec 13 16:14 |
| MinceR | because they're losing the monopolies they've built their entire "business" on | Dec 13 16:15 |
| ChrisTX | like? Windows is still @ 92-93% market share for desktops | Dec 13 16:15 |
| MinceR | not having a hegemony of winblows on desktop computers means not being able to force anything they want on the users | Dec 13 16:15 |
| ChrisTX | lol | Dec 13 16:15 |
| MinceR | yes, and it's decreasing | Dec 13 16:15 |
| ChrisTX | uhm actually not, plus if at all, 1% to mac | Dec 13 16:16 |
| ChrisTX | but mac is decreasing now again | Dec 13 16:16 |
| ChrisTX | and secondly how does MS forces users to do anything? | Dec 13 16:16 |
| ChrisTX | sorry if I don't see the relation | Dec 13 16:16 |
| cubezzz | by controlling the OEMs | Dec 13 16:16 |
| _nbnds | novell supports anti-FLOSS attacks ? being one of the biggest produsers of opensource OS ? | Dec 13 16:16 |
| MinceR | what cubezzz said. | Dec 13 16:16 |
| ChrisTX | ah yes | Dec 13 16:16 |
| MinceR | _nbnds: the m$-novell deal gives credit to m$'s unsupported, unproven accusations that linux is infringing on their patents | Dec 13 16:17 |
| ChrisTX | and how are OEMs <-?-> Users related | Dec 13 16:17 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: users buy computers from OEMs | Dec 13 16:17 |
| MinceR | they can only get laptops from them, preassembled | Dec 13 16:17 |
| ChrisTX | yeah, and MS keeps market share by oppressing OEMs ? | Dec 13 16:17 |
| _nbnds | i got my laptop with freedos:) | Dec 13 16:17 |
| MinceR | yes, by forcing them into deals that mean that OEMs may only sell PCs with windows | Dec 13 16:17 |
| ChrisTX | oh lawl | Dec 13 16:18 |
| _nbnds | freedos, presinstalled! :) | Dec 13 16:18 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: so whose agenda are you supporting | Dec 13 16:18 |
| MinceR | ? | Dec 13 16:18 |
| ChrisTX | you are tho aware that users would go nuts if you'd sold them PCs with Linux preinstalled, right? | Dec 13 16:18 |
| ChrisTX | what agenda? | Dec 13 16:18 |
| MinceR | actually many users wouldn't go nuts | Dec 13 16:18 |
| MinceR | and indeed, many users don't | Dec 13 16:18 |
| ChrisTX | oh lol boy | Dec 13 16:19 |
| MinceR | iirc most of netbooks are sold with linux nowadays | Dec 13 16:19 |
| ChrisTX | a) no | Dec 13 16:19 |
| ChrisTX | b) netbooks != computers in that mean | Dec 13 16:19 |
| _nbnds | i dont think that users care miuch about what they are using and why, they want simplicity and users hate to learn | Dec 13 16:19 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: now you're starting to sound like a 12 years old m$ fanboy | Dec 13 16:19 |
| ChrisTX | lmao | Dec 13 16:19 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, got also anything beside flames for me? | Dec 13 16:19 |
| ChrisTX | Im just trying to talk to your normally | Dec 13 16:20 |
| _nbnds | so if you give one a linux-box he'll use it | Dec 13 16:20 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: got anything besides disparaging comments for me? | Dec 13 16:20 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: you're failing hard at talking normally | Dec 13 16:20 |
| ChrisTX | uhm ok | Dec 13 16:20 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: i've presented my arguments and you only have stuff like "oh lol boy" | Dec 13 16:20 |
| MinceR | this discussion isn't going anywhere. | Dec 13 16:20 |
| ChrisTX | yeah, the thing is, if you sell a normal user a computer with linux installed | Dec 13 16:20 |
| ChrisTX | they'll ask you at some point | Dec 13 16:20 |
| ChrisTX | how do games work on it? | Dec 13 16:21 |
| ChrisTX | and so on | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | and then i'll show them some games | Dec 13 16:21 |
| cubezzz | LGP... | Dec 13 16:21 |
| *Eruaran has quit (Client Quit) | Dec 13 16:21 | |
| ChrisTX | plus some OEMs give Linux as option | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | Nexuiz, for example :) | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | very few OEMs do | Dec 13 16:21 |
| ChrisTX | Dell does | Dec 13 16:21 |
| cubezzz | ChrisTX, which ones? | Dec 13 16:21 |
| cubezzz | yes, and Acer | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | and even most of those only sporadically and for a tiny fragment of their computers | Dec 13 16:21 |
| ChrisTX | http://www.dell.com/content/topics/segtopic.aspx/ubuntu?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&~ck=anavml | Dec 13 16:21 |
| cubezzz | but I can't go to the store and buy one in my country | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | well, dell only ever offers linux on a very limited set of models | Dec 13 16:21 |
| MinceR | and they hide it well | Dec 13 16:22 |
| MinceR | and that offer doesn't even work in most countries | Dec 13 16:22 |
| *Eruaran (n=quassel@CPE-121-214-36-2.lnse4.win.bigpond.net.au) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 16:22 | |
| ChrisTX | yeah because think economically: do you think 1% of all users make a good profit for a linux preinstallation | Dec 13 16:22 |
| ChrisTX | oh please | Dec 13 16:22 |
| MinceR | (not that i'd want to buy dell ever again) | Dec 13 16:22 |
| ChrisTX | plus, what kind of proof do you have that MS *forces* OEMs somewhat? | Dec 13 16:22 |
| cubezzz | Allchin's remarks? | Dec 13 16:23 |
| MinceR | you really should check out the BN website :) | Dec 13 16:23 |
| MinceR | i'm pretty sure most of the answers to your questions can be found there | Dec 13 16:23 |
| MinceR | but i'll dig up some of my bookmarks | Dec 13 16:23 |
| _nbnds | producers develop products only if there is so much demand for it that it would at least cover the costs of developing, market share of linux comuters is too low to consider it as a potential market | Dec 13 16:23 |
| ChrisTX | _nbnds +1 | Dec 13 16:23 |
| MinceR | netbook makers are already considering it | Dec 13 16:23 |
| cubezzz | that's a red herring, I can't buy a blank computer | Dec 13 16:23 |
| MinceR | smartbook makers even more so | Dec 13 16:24 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, finally understand that netbooks are there to surf the internet | Dec 13 16:24 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: finally understand that they aren't | Dec 13 16:24 |
| ChrisTX | and yet 4 out of 5 netbooks which had Linux installed have XP now | Dec 13 16:24 |
| MinceR | my netbook can certainly do a lot more than just "surf the internet" | Dec 13 16:24 |
| *shreddar (i=62f0385c@gateway/web/freenode/x-vdovlmqroncfdzrt) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 16:24 | |
| shreddar | Any more news on the Gnu Gnome split? | Dec 13 16:24 |
| schestowitz | zoobab: http://www.patentlyo.com/patent/2009/12/the-matrix-for-first-inventor-to-file-an-experimental-investigation-into-proposed-changes-in-us-patent-law.html | Dec 13 16:24 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Patent Law Blog (Patently-O): The "Matrix" for First-Inventor-To-File: An Experimental Investigation into Proposed Changes in US Patent Law .::. Size~: 138.91 KB | Dec 13 16:24 |
| ChrisTX | and btw you're saying OEMs are forced to use Windows and yet can install Linux on netbooks? | Dec 13 16:25 |
| ChrisTX | contradiction hard? | Dec 13 16:25 |
| cubezzz | no, they do it only on low-end machines, or not at all | Dec 13 16:25 |
| MinceR | few OEMs get to install Linux on netbooks | Dec 13 16:25 |
| ChrisTX | so wait | Dec 13 16:25 |
| schestowitz | ChrisTX is parroting Microsoft FUD about market share | Dec 13 16:26 |
| ChrisTX | on the one hand OEMs use Linux for netbooks and it dominates there and on the other they don't install linux ? | Dec 13 16:26 |
| schestowitz | Not that I'm surprised by him doing this | Dec 13 16:26 |
| cubezzz | as a customer, I want a choice not to buy windows | Dec 13 16:26 |
| ChrisTX | schestowitz, not exactly, I don't have got anything to do with Microsoft | Dec 13 16:26 |
| ChrisTX | I just took the ciphers from wikipedia | Dec 13 16:26 |
| shreddar | ChrisTX NDA's, Legacy Support, Licensing fees are tools that MS uses to control OEMs | Dec 13 16:26 |
| schestowitz | I can't remember for sure if he was banned before | Dec 13 16:26 |
| ChrisTX | schestowitz, what did I do now? I just tried understand your points? | Dec 13 16:27 |
| ChrisTX | and you accuse me to spread FUD | Dec 13 16:27 |
| ChrisTX | please, 1% is what Wikipedia says | Dec 13 16:27 |
| ChrisTX | and Linux on the netbook market got 38% or so | Dec 13 16:27 |
| ChrisTX | so that argument that only few OEMs offer Linux netbooks | Dec 13 16:28 |
| cubezzz | 1% of what? | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | is very weak | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | cubezzz, desktop oses | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | wait actually | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | lemme link you | Dec 13 16:28 |
| cubezzz | there's no way to measure it accurately | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems | Dec 13 16:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Usage share of operating systems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 89.32 KB | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | there | Dec 13 16:28 |
| ChrisTX | cubezzz, but OEMs work based on demands | Dec 13 16:29 |
| schestowitz | Wikipedia's links are.......? | Dec 13 16:29 |
| MinceR | http://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/01/leaked-oem-vista-ad-incentives/ | Dec 13 16:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Leaked: Microsoft Pays Companies to Recommend Windows | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 218.47 KB | Dec 13 16:29 |
| schestowitz | Wikipedia does does not measure stuff | Dec 13 16:29 |
| ChrisTX | schestowitz, median of serveral statistics | Dec 13 16:29 |
| cubezzz | ok, fine, sell me a blank computer then | Dec 13 16:29 |
| cubezzz | even less work for the OEM | Dec 13 16:29 |
| schestowitz | And sorry, I misremembered, you were not the troll that was banned. http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/irc-log-07062009.html | Dec 13 16:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: June 7th, 2009 .::. Size~: 810.58 KB | Dec 13 16:29 |
| _nbnds | yes it realy can be looked upon like microsoft is "bying" the demand for their software, i agree | Dec 13 16:29 |
| schestowitz | What statistics? Which countries? | Dec 13 16:30 |
| ChrisTX | common stat counters | Dec 13 16:30 |
| MinceR | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/01/28/derail-dell-gnu-linux/ | Dec 13 16:30 |
| ChrisTX | info is given there | Dec 13 16:30 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Antitrust: How Microsoft Schemed to Derail Dell GNU/Linux | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 144.32 KB | Dec 13 16:30 |
| _nbnds | what are possible solutions to overcome microsoft dominance? | Dec 13 16:31 |
| schestowitz | http://legalblogwatch.typepad.com/legal_blog_watch/2009/12/file-sharing-lawyer-says-judge-screwed-up.html | Dec 13 16:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Legal Blog Watch .::. Size~: 47.12 KB | Dec 13 16:31 |
| schestowitz | _nbnds: it's already being overcome | Dec 13 16:31 |
| schestowitz | E.g. in netbooks | Dec 13 16:31 |
| MinceR | there's a very slow solution at work now | Dec 13 16:31 |
| schestowitz | Windows revenue is down 40% | Dec 13 16:31 |
| cubezzz | just let blank computers to the people who know which OS they want | Dec 13 16:32 |
| shreddar | ChrisTX vender lock-in and alliances with OEMs gives MS monopoly power. | Dec 13 16:32 |
| cubezzz | just sell | Dec 13 16:32 |
| MinceR | m$'s loss of market share is accelerating itself via positive feedback | Dec 13 16:32 |
| schestowitz | ChrisTX: these measures are US-centric | Dec 13 16:32 |
| schestowitz | I have no doubt Linux has low share in the US (no-one knows for sure) | Dec 13 16:32 |
| MinceR | also, it seems that certain OEMs try to force lower licensing prices out of m$ by occasionally selling Linux PCs | Dec 13 16:32 |
| schestowitz | PCs in Brazil and Venezuela hardly even touch any English-speaking sites | Dec 13 16:33 |
| MinceR | m$ is losing leverage with market share | Dec 13 16:33 |
| schestowitz | brb | Dec 13 16:33 |
| cubezzz | hmmm, I thought Mac was higher than 5% | Dec 13 16:33 |
| MinceR | (not just windows, also office) | Dec 13 16:33 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: in the US. | Dec 13 16:33 |
| MinceR | (and web browsers) | Dec 13 16:33 |
| schestowitz | Also search market has the "US-based" part omitted | Dec 13 16:33 |
| schestowitz | US population is less than 5% of the world's population | Dec 13 16:34 |
| *Tallken has quit ("Leaving") | Dec 13 16:34 | |
| schestowitz | Bing globally: 3% | Dec 13 16:34 |
| cubezzz | it would be interesting to see the country by country break-down | Dec 13 16:34 |
| schestowitz | In US: ~9% (maybe) | Dec 13 16:34 |
| shreddar | What's with all the talk about Market Share for again? | Dec 13 16:34 |
| _nbnds | low end hardware isnt meant to play games. so linux fits nicely into this sector, and netbook market is growing. nice have some hope | Dec 13 16:34 |
| schestowitz | So assume US loves Microsoft '3 times more' | Dec 13 16:34 |
| *schestowitz kids | Dec 13 16:34 | |
| MinceR | shreddar: it's the favorite bone for the m$ fanboys to chew | Dec 13 16:34 |
| schestowitz | brb | Dec 13 16:35 |
| MinceR | shreddar: they don't have any technical arguments | Dec 13 16:35 |
| ChrisTX | what technical arguments? | Dec 13 16:35 |
| MinceR | about which product is technically superior | Dec 13 16:35 |
| shreddar | Oh then chew on this the majority of PC's is Windows but not computer in general. | Dec 13 16:35 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, is boycottnovell about that? | Dec 13 16:35 |
| MinceR | to m$ fanboys, there's only desktops | Dec 13 16:35 |
| cubezzz | actually I did buy a zaurus a while back, that was linux based | Dec 13 16:35 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: better ask schestowitz about that :) | Dec 13 16:36 |
| cubezzz | so Dell, Sharp, ASUS, and Acer | Dec 13 16:36 |
| ChrisTX | no I just said, offering a Linux option is a point of cost - that's quite obvious - and due to market share that might be not profitable for some OEMs | Dec 13 16:36 |
| ChrisTX | nothing with technical points | Dec 13 16:37 |
| ChrisTX | or 'm$ fanboy' as you say | Dec 13 16:37 |
| schestowitz | MS BS | Dec 13 16:37 |
| MinceR | m$ fanboys like to forget that in the supercomputer, server, mobile and embedded markets GNU/Linux has a much higher market share/installed base than windows. | Dec 13 16:37 |
| schestowitz | http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/2009/dec/10/art-design-serpentine-gallery | Dec 13 16:37 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: no, offering a Linux option is not a point of cost | Dec 13 16:37 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, did I speak about those? | Dec 13 16:37 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: obviously you didn't | Dec 13 16:37 |
| ChrisTX | why not? | Dec 13 16:37 |
| schestowitz | I guess LHC doesn't use Windows cause it's "too expensive | Dec 13 16:37 |
| schestowitz | Same for LSE.... | Dec 13 16:37 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: because the truth hurts, i guess :) | Dec 13 16:37 |
| ChrisTX | I mean I would assume it is | Dec 13 16:37 |
| schestowitz | And the french cabinet | Dec 13 16:38 |
| shreddar | Apple is profitable and it doesn't use Windows. | Dec 13 16:38 |
| schestowitz | They are just too poor those ministers... | Dec 13 16:38 |
| MinceR | well, it's too expensive to clean up the mess m$ products make | Dec 13 16:38 |
| ChrisTX | huh? | Dec 13 16:39 |
| ChrisTX | that's not my point | Dec 13 16:39 |
| ChrisTX | lemme try to explain what I meant | Dec 13 16:39 |
| ChrisTX | it is, that offering a new OS is some kind of cost factor. That's quite obvious I guess | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | because you need people or techniques to install it | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | prepare rescue CDs etc | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | people expect that | Dec 13 16:40 |
| MinceR | so is paying m$ license fees | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | yeah, but the user pays those | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | these are for the company I mean | Dec 13 16:40 |
| MinceR | training the people and learning the know-how is a one-off cost, and not a particularly high one at that | Dec 13 16:40 |
| ChrisTX | yet, based on demand it might not be profitable | Dec 13 16:41 |
| ChrisTX | which Im basically trying to say all the time | Dec 13 16:41 |
| MinceR | you're trying to say that most of the PC users know what windows is and demand it | Dec 13 16:41 |
| ChrisTX | but then somebody threw the 'm$ fanboy' bomb at me showing how much MS FUD I would spread | Dec 13 16:41 |
| MinceR | i think that's wrong | Dec 13 16:41 |
| ChrisTX | ok, why do you think that? | Dec 13 16:41 |
| MinceR | i've helped beginner windows users, so i have some concept of how much they know | Dec 13 16:42 |
| MinceR | one user didn't even know what windows is | Dec 13 16:42 |
| MinceR | how can you expect them to want to choose? | Dec 13 16:42 |
| shreddar | ChrisTX it seems the people you're talking about are Businesses. | Dec 13 16:42 |
| ChrisTX | businesses ? | Dec 13 16:42 |
| ChrisTX | what? | Dec 13 16:42 |
| shreddar | Companies | Dec 13 16:42 |
| MinceR | well, businesses are mostly concerned about cost, and m$ fails hard there. | Dec 13 16:42 |
| ChrisTX | no businesses enroll themselves | Dec 13 16:42 |
| ChrisTX | that's a whole other point | Dec 13 16:42 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, well the thing is, most users expect that if you insert a CD, it will work | Dec 13 16:43 |
| ChrisTX | and it that's a windows app | Dec 13 16:43 |
| ChrisTX | it most likely won't on Linux | Dec 13 16:43 |
| ChrisTX | that, for example | Dec 13 16:43 |
| MinceR | i don't know what kind of CD you're talking about | Dec 13 16:44 |
| ChrisTX | ISP CDs for example, or software they bought in a shop | Dec 13 16:44 |
| ChrisTX | like a game | Dec 13 16:44 |
| MinceR | they don't need ISP CDs | Dec 13 16:44 |
| MinceR | GNU/Linux distros come with internet apps, including web browsers and PPPoE clients | Dec 13 16:45 |
| MinceR | btw, do most users also expect their system to keep working for months and not be riddled with malware? :> | Dec 13 16:46 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, so does Windows, that's not the point | Dec 13 16:46 |
| ChrisTX | uhm really, malware is a whole other subject | Dec 13 16:46 |
| MinceR | m$ might have defeated that expectation | Dec 13 16:46 |
| ChrisTX | you get me wrong there | Dec 13 16:46 |
| shreddar | ChrisTX most people don't buy CD's for their PC | Dec 13 16:46 |
| _nbnds | novell produces enterprise-level opensource linux | Dec 13 16:46 |
| MinceR | _nbnds: so does red hat | Dec 13 16:47 |
| ChrisTX | shreddar, games for example ? | Dec 13 16:47 |
| shreddar | They want everything to already be installed. | Dec 13 16:47 |
| MinceR | _nbnds: and yet red hat doesn't assist m$ in harming the community while doing so | Dec 13 16:47 |
| shreddar | PC gamers is not the majority of PC users. | Dec 13 16:47 |
| MinceR | novell is also pushing mono into gnu/linux and gnome. | Dec 13 16:47 |
| ChrisTX | shreddar, do you really think so? | Dec 13 16:47 |
| ChrisTX | Im not sure about that one | Dec 13 16:48 |
| shreddar | Yes | Dec 13 16:48 |
| MinceR | and mono does have real legal issues regarding patents | Dec 13 16:48 |
| ChrisTX | I mean quite a lot of people play something etc | Dec 13 16:48 |
| ChrisTX | anyway | Dec 13 16:48 |
| MinceR | unlike the linux kernel | Dec 13 16:48 |
| ChrisTX | that's not the point | Dec 13 16:48 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: quite a lot of people play games on consoles, not PCs | Dec 13 16:48 |
| MinceR | and quite a lot of people play casual flash games | Dec 13 16:48 |
| ChrisTX | yeah flash games are not the point | Dec 13 16:48 |
| MinceR | yeah, i'm seeing the pattern | Dec 13 16:49 |
| ChrisTX | but I really think consoles don't have that high share yet | Dec 13 16:49 |
| ChrisTX | no MinceR, I'm not trying to argue for 'm$' like you think | Dec 13 16:49 |
| MinceR | everything that proves you wrong is simply "not the point" | Dec 13 16:49 |
| MinceR | then how are you trying to argue for m$? | Dec 13 16:49 |
| ChrisTX | flash games work on about all oses | Dec 13 16:49 |
| MinceR | if not the way i think? | Dec 13 16:49 |
| MinceR | most of the things typical users do work on about all OSes now | Dec 13 16:49 |
| ChrisTX | and malware is something that you can argue days about | Dec 13 16:49 |
| MinceR | and this is part of why m$ is losing | Dec 13 16:50 |
| ChrisTX | well concerning office stuff etc | Dec 13 16:50 |
| ChrisTX | I couldn't say you'd be wrong | Dec 13 16:50 |
| ChrisTX | office is definitively using market share | Dec 13 16:50 |
| ChrisTX | OOo is by far more popular than it was few years ago | Dec 13 16:50 |
| shreddar | Your right about Office users. | Dec 13 16:50 |
| ChrisTX | it's because OOo is fine for most homeusers | Dec 13 16:51 |
| ChrisTX | they don't need w/e office features | Dec 13 16:51 |
| shreddar | They do make a large portion of PC users. | Dec 13 16:51 |
| shreddar | PC gamer don't though. | Dec 13 16:51 |
| ChrisTX | well, we'd need stats for that | Dec 13 16:51 |
| shreddar | Office users however don't expect everything to just work though. | Dec 13 16:51 |
| ChrisTX | what do you mean? | Dec 13 16:52 |
| shreddar | Neither do PC gamers now that I think about it. | Dec 13 16:52 |
| MinceR | business users tend to have in-house support :) | Dec 13 16:52 |
| ChrisTX | MinceR, yea | Dec 13 16:52 |
| shreddar | They don't just buy any CD expecting it to work. They are smart enough to see what compatible. | Dec 13 16:52 |
| ChrisTX | business users also enroll using PXE etc | Dec 13 16:52 |
| ChrisTX | either WDS or gPXE, etc, doesn't matter | Dec 13 16:53 |
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| ChrisTX | I mean plugging a machine to a network and having it installing automatically is also more handy than a CD | Dec 13 16:53 |
| shreddar | Regular Average joes out their for the most part stay as far away from "Computers" (they usually mean PCs) as possible. | Dec 13 16:54 |
| ChrisTX | sure | Dec 13 16:54 |
| shreddar | They are the ones that want CD's to just work | Dec 13 16:55 |
| ChrisTX | yea, so? | Dec 13 16:55 |
| MinceR | KPackageKit and Synaptic are also a lot handier than install CDs | Dec 13 16:56 |
| shreddar | The main PC customers either want everything installed or they are smart enough to find compatible software (retail CDs) | Dec 13 16:58 |
| shreddar | Very few people assume CD with just work. | Dec 13 16:59 |
| shreddar | with=will | Dec 13 16:59 |
| ChrisTX | anyway, another thing I don't understand is why Novell as Linux company should FUD Linux | Dec 13 17:01 |
| shreddar | I didn't know Novell spreaded FUD on Linux. That sounds kinda dumb. | Dec 13 17:02 |
| MinceR | they've made a wrong turn at some point | Dec 13 17:02 |
| MinceR | now they're depending on m$, so they do what m$ tells them to | Dec 13 17:02 |
| MinceR | i don't know why they did that | Dec 13 17:03 |
| MinceR | buying SuSE was a decision that could have revitalized novell | Dec 13 17:03 |
| MinceR | and ever since they've been trying to harm themselves. | Dec 13 17:03 |
| shreddar | I see the whole Novell/Microsoft thing is comparable to the scene in The Matrix where Agent Smith sticks his hand into people and makes a copies. | Dec 13 17:07 |
| shreddar | The Matrix 2 and 3 that is. | Dec 13 17:07 |
| Eruaran | Agent Steve Ballmer, "Me... me, me, me, me, me" | Dec 13 17:16 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 13 17:16 |
| _nbnds | steve ballmer is a monkey, in a human costume:) | Dec 13 17:17 |
| MinceR | now that's very degrading to monkeys to say that ;) | Dec 13 17:17 |
| Diablo-D3 | <BillG> Me, too | Dec 13 17:18 |
| Diablo-D3 | <Balmer> Shuddup Bill | Dec 13 17:18 |
| _nbnds | what i dont understand, what is the point of this agressive marketing, like Ballmer presents? everyone knows, that he's behaving like an idiot, but everyone is looking at it... | Dec 13 17:20 |
| MinceR | it seems that there still are people who (for one reason or another) believe him | Dec 13 17:21 |
| MinceR | for example, for those who worship money he's a saint because he's rich. | Dec 13 17:21 |
| MinceR | that's why some "university" here in absurdistan (also known as hungary) honored him. | Dec 13 17:22 |
| _nbnds | panem et circenses | Dec 13 17:22 |
| MinceR | it would be funnier if he didn't have means to harm human society. | Dec 13 17:22 |
| MinceR | he should be kept in a cage and showed to people. | Dec 13 17:23 |
| shreddar | Yeah Ballmers pretty bad for MSs PR. | Dec 13 17:23 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Linux Basement podcast, very good show! http://linuxbasement.com/ #linux #foss #gnu #windows #microsoft #xp #vista #windows7 | Dec 13 17:26 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Linux Basement | Linux Lurking Beneath .::. Size~: 33.23 KB | Dec 13 17:26 |
| MinceR | hm, i forgot a point regarding dell's "linux" offers: afaik they're also in the patent racket, paying m$ for patents m$ does not own. | Dec 13 17:26 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #FDIC won't turn over document illustrating #WaMu and #Chase fraud http://ur1.ca/hqgu #douchebags #politics | Dec 13 17:26 | |
| MinceR | Basement Cat! | Dec 13 17:26 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: FDIC sends a big F-U: completely blacked out documents in response to WaMu takeover freedom of information requests Boing Boing .::. Size~: 41.1 KB | Dec 13 17:26 |
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| *shreddar_ 's Browser Crash :( | Dec 13 17:28 | |
| *shreddar_ is now known as shreddar | Dec 13 17:29 | |
| MinceR | Snow Crash | Dec 13 17:29 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] A new url shrinking service. Free and simple! http://rupom.net/ #linux #foss #gnu #gpl | Dec 13 17:32 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: RUPOM.NET - Shrinks Your URL .::. Size~: 3.2 KB | Dec 13 17:32 |
| _goblin | Mr Majestic on COLA seems very scared of his upcoming article...Quote "LOL, you are a vulgar lying COLA snake with a garbage site. You should call the site www.sloblin/goblin/a/skank/liar.com " | Dec 13 17:34 |
| MinceR | he should read up on how DNS works | Dec 13 17:35 |
| cubezzz | wow, nice guy | Dec 13 17:36 |
| cubezzz | I don't bother with COLA | Dec 13 17:36 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] UK detains children from foreign countries, denies them Christmas http://ur1.ca/hqjv #policestate #douchebags | Dec 13 17:36 | |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Drug cartels helped save large banks, and not in a good way http://ur1.ca/hql6 #douchebags | Dec 13 17:36 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Santa Claus banned from visiting locked-up children in UK asylum detention centre Boing Boing .::. Size~: 45.5 KB | Dec 13 17:37 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Hundreds of billions in crime money knowingly laundered by banks during credit crunch Boing Boing .::. Size~: 51.61 KB | Dec 13 17:37 |
| MinceR | they could have Winter Solstice and Grav-mass instead! | Dec 13 17:37 |
| MinceR | hm, not only DNS, but also URL/URI | Dec 13 17:38 |
| cubezzz | I use the term Newton Mass myself :) | Dec 13 17:39 |
| MinceR | for the holiday that starts on 12-25 and lasts for 10 days? | Dec 13 17:39 |
| cubezzz | no, just December 25th | Dec 13 17:40 |
| cubezzz | well, looks like no ARM netbook unless I buy netwalker | Dec 13 17:45 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Shifting my gaze at the second of my distro reviews: Incognito 2009.0 beta very interesting LiveCD #linux #foss #gpl #free | Dec 13 17:49 | |
| Diablo-D3 | there are others | Dec 13 17:51 |
| cubezzz | I see all sorts of announcements but nothing that I can order | Dec 13 17:54 |
| ender2070 | arch is fast too | Dec 13 17:55 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] This is why California has a budget shortfall http://ur1.ca/hqnt #douchebags | Dec 13 17:56 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: State Of California Doesn't Know How To Accept $14 Fee - The Consumerist .::. Size~: 49.95 KB | Dec 13 17:56 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Nitrotracker v0.4 for DS. If you have an R4 or similar its a great great util! http://rupom.net/37 #nds #nitrotacker #foss | Dec 13 17:58 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: NitroTracker - A Fasttracker II style tracker for the Nintendo DS. .::. Size~: 34.68 KB | Dec 13 17:58 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Autumn in Japan timelapse http://ur1.ca/hqtw | Dec 13 18:01 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: (autumn) on Vimeo .::. Size~: 42.53 KB | Dec 13 18:01 |
| cubezzz | there's a ton of ebook devices now | Dec 13 18:11 |
| _goblin | Note to channel: The user Declination is another Linxxx user. Just discovered one of those void blogs where the only people who visit/comment are the same 16/17 that follow each other on Twitter...just for your info. | Dec 13 18:13 |
| _goblin | Heres the level of this particular "blog" Quote: "The FSF has long been a pox upon the house of anyone who actually wants to 'get stuff done’" | Dec 13 18:14 |
| cubezzz | meaningless | Dec 13 18:15 |
| shreddar | What a hateful, evil, ignorant, thing to say. | Dec 13 18:15 |
| _goblin | and Mr De Icazza seems to support it....He has linked to it on his Twitter (which was picked up and retweeted by the Linxxx users) | Dec 13 18:16 |
| ender2070 | this guy REALLY doesnt get it, free software isnt a business model | Dec 13 18:16 |
| ender2070 | http://www.pwnage.ca/?p=433&cpage=1#comment-341 | Dec 13 18:16 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Pwnage.ca » Gnome to Split Off from GNU Project? .::. Size~: 71.82 KB | Dec 13 18:16 |
| _goblin | Quote Mr De Icaza: "Just discovered #######, track the FUD and Net Memes!" | Dec 13 18:17 |
| _goblin | I wonder is this opinion held by the Gnome project as a whole? Don't need to ask that of Mono. | Dec 13 18:18 |
| _goblin | Maybe Linxxx isn't all that bad...Ive got some interesting questions to ask in a future article..... | Dec 13 18:18 |
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| ender2070 | what article | Dec 13 18:27 |
| shreddar | That guy is treating FSF and it's supporters like they are a company. | Dec 13 18:30 |
| shreddar | Free Software is just software that give users the freedom and control over the stuff on their computers. | Dec 13 18:31 |
| shreddar | Free as in Freedom Software. | Dec 13 18:31 |
| shreddar | I always though that was so confusing | Dec 13 18:32 |
| shreddar | They should just call it Freedom Software so people immediately know what they mean. | Dec 13 18:32 |
| shreddar | If you say Free Software everyone thinks of Freeware. | Dec 13 18:33 |
| shreddar | The fact you have to say Free as in Freedom only highlights the confusion. | Dec 13 18:34 |
| shreddar | There is also a huge problem in the Software Industry (as well as similar industries) that every company feels entitles to mass sums of money for their artificially scarce products. | Dec 13 18:39 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Wondering where the BBC iPlayer app has gone from his @boxee box :S | Dec 13 18:40 | |
| shreddar | Adobe charges $600 for every new version of Photoshop. If it was Free and Open Source they just couldn't do that. | Dec 13 18:41 |
| shreddar | But that's not Free Softwares fault | Dec 13 18:41 |
| ChrisTX | shreddar, what I don't get about that point is why it bothers you that they do so? | Dec 13 18:42 |
| ChrisTX | I mean GIMP is available | Dec 13 18:42 |
| ChrisTX | it's not like it wasnt | Dec 13 18:42 |
| shreddar | ChrisTX it doesn't bother that they do that. | Dec 13 18:43 |
| shreddar | That was an example for how Free Software is bad for Software companies that wasn't to be able to do that. | Dec 13 18:44 |
| shreddar | wasn't = want | Dec 13 18:44 |
| *_nbnds has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 13 18:50 | |
| shreddar | $600 for a Adobe computer built specifically for FOSS Photoshop could work. | Dec 13 18:54 |
| MinceR | except for the fact that it's adobe | Dec 13 18:54 |
| MinceR | and nothing from adobe ever works | Dec 13 18:54 |
| MinceR | though if photoshop were FLOSSed, the community could turn it into something usable | Dec 13 18:55 |
| shreddar | It's just with Hardware you have to be careful with supply and demand. If you manufacture 1,000,000,000 units and nobody buys them you're screwed. | Dec 13 18:59 |
| MinceR | i think there should be modular laptops you can build from components like desktop pcs | Dec 13 19:00 |
| shreddar | If you just print 1,000,000,000 CD and nobody buys them you can still be in business. | Dec 13 19:00 |
| shreddar | Like AOL | Dec 13 19:00 |
| shreddar | Obviously the Hardware business is not the small risk big reward setting Software companies are used to. | Dec 13 19:02 |
| shreddar | That doesn't matter to me as a customer and it shouldn't. | Dec 13 19:08 |
| shreddar | It's not my fault if I don't want to pay a ridiculous amount for something that's not really all that scarce. | Dec 13 19:08 |
| shreddar | It's not my problem that your company isn't willing to learn about Supply and Demand. | Dec 13 19:11 |
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| trmanco_ | stupid power loss :| | Dec 13 19:24 |
| schestowitz | http://web.archive.org/web/20040928043900/http://pl.caldera.com/2004forum/agenda/Enderle_keynote_SCO-Forum2004.html | Dec 13 19:28 |
| schestowitz | thistle was right... he sucks up to Tomboyvell. http://www.twit.tv/floss99 | Dec 13 19:28 |
| Omar87 | Hi guys | Dec 13 19:29 |
| Omar87 | Anyone knows anythign about this bullc**p? http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9142106/Mozilla_exec_suggests_Firefox_users_move_to_Bing_cites_Google_privacy_stance | Dec 13 19:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 19:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Anyone knows anythign about this bullc**p? http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9142106/Mozilla_exec_suggests_Firefox_users_move_to_Bing_cites_Google_privacy_stance | Dec 13 19:29 |
| schestowitz | [17:23] <shreddar> Yeah Ballmers pretty bad for MSs PR. | Dec 13 19:30 |
| schestowitz | And good for us | Dec 13 19:30 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: So what's with Mozilla? | Dec 13 19:31 |
| schestowitz | [18:11] <cubezzz> there's a ton of ebook devices now | Dec 13 19:33 |
| schestowitz | Almost all are Linux based | Dec 13 19:33 |
| schestowitz | A success story that's never told | Dec 13 19:33 |
| Omar87 | Hi, Roy. | Dec 13 19:34 |
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| *trmanco_ is now known as trmanco | Dec 13 19:34 | |
| Omar87 | Did you read this article? http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9142106/Mozilla_exec_suggests_Firefox_users_move_to_Bing_cites_Google_privacy_stance | Dec 13 19:35 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Mozilla exec suggests Firefox users move to Bing, cites Google privacy stance .::. Size~: 139.32 KB | Dec 13 19:35 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: it's not Mozilla | Dec 13 19:35 |
| schestowitz | It's one guy whom I usually find obnoxious | Dec 13 19:35 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: What do you mean? | Dec 13 19:35 |
| schestowitz | Ingore it | Dec 13 19:36 |
| schestowitz | The others in Mozilla would not agree | Dec 13 19:36 |
| schestowitz | He -- unlike others -- does not seem to like Free(Dom) software either | Dec 13 19:36 |
| schestowitz | I wouldn't worry about it | Dec 13 19:36 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: Mozilla dumping Google for Bing to protect user privacy sounds pretty much like some junky goes from taking to cocaine to taking heroin just to avoid death in overdoze (they both will lead to the same thing). | Dec 13 19:39 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: If we want to say truth, I think Startpage.com is the best choice for user privacy. | Dec 13 19:40 |
| shreddar | I still have to mention my Wikipedia like search engine idea. | Dec 13 19:41 |
| shreddar | It would be this Open Source search engine that would be donation supported. (So they can buy losts of servers) | Dec 13 19:43 |
| Omar87 | shreddar: sounds good to me. | Dec 13 19:44 |
| Omar87 | http://www.workswithu.com/2009/12/10/dell-website-shows-ubuntu-more-respect/ | Dec 13 19:46 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Dell U.S. Website Shows Ubuntu More Respect | WorksWithU .::. Size~: 54.31 KB | Dec 13 19:46 |
| schestowitz | [19:39] <Omar87> schestowitz: Mozilla dumping Google for Bing to protect user privacy sounds pretty much like some junky goes from taking to cocaine to taking heroin just to avoid death in overdoze (they both will lead to the same thing). | Dec 13 19:48 |
| shreddar | Man that's alot of Ubuntu/Canonical ads. | Dec 13 19:48 |
| schestowitz | I'd have to memorise this analogy. Omar87 :-) | Dec 13 19:48 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: from the news: http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-10410340-75.html | Dec 13 19:49 |
| schestowitz | FAR worse than Google | Dec 13 19:49 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft labs tests a Wikipedia of average Joes | Microsoft - CNET News .::. Size~: 112.75 KB | Dec 13 19:49 |
| schestowitz | They make it public | Dec 13 19:49 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: :-) | Dec 13 19:49 |
| schestowitz | Not for the first time, either. Microsoft built profiles of people and made them public based on USENET messages. This was organised by its research unit and pulled about 2 years ago. | Dec 13 19:49 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: and yes, Dell is playing more nicely. Can't say a bad thing about this latest move. | Dec 13 19:50 |
| schestowitz | Fedora claims 20 million instllations | Dec 13 19:50 |
| schestowitz | For Ubuntu it's likely to be a high number too | Dec 13 19:50 |
| schestowitz | But some are servers running Feodra rather than centos | Dec 13 19:51 |
| schestowitz | Wow. Major coincidence. 10 minutes ago I mailed someone called Mark Anthony | Dec 13 19:52 |
| schestowitz | And 5 minutes ago I got spam from the same name, by sheer coincidence. | Dec 13 19:52 |
| schestowitz | But Anthony is the middle name in one case | Dec 13 19:52 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: lol! So Microsoft is desperately trying to clone Wikipedia? | Dec 13 19:52 |
| shreddar | You know I didn't know Asa was a Mozilla exec. I thought he just some guy who worked on the project. | Dec 13 19:54 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: Oh my God, I just realized the article you just gave me is for Ina Fried. (You just can't imagine how much I hate that creature..) | Dec 13 19:56 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: I was surprised he was an exec as well. | Dec 13 19:58 |
| schestowitz | For all I know, he is a very key person, but more of an advocate/marketing | Dec 13 19:58 |
| schestowitz | He was behind the Spread Firefox push (IIRC), which was a smashing success | Dec 13 19:58 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] today's #wikipedia tour de force: http://is.gd/5m1zE TeX and all. Make sense? Did the SVG diagram and all :-D | Dec 13 19:59 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Carey Foster bridge - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 25.89 KB | Dec 13 19:59 |
| schestowitz | He still roams the Web helping the spread of Microsoft, but this latest move was amajor PR disaster IMHO | Dec 13 19:59 |
| schestowitz | Schmidt was being an idiot with that remark | Dec 13 19:59 |
| schestowitz | Then a guy from Mozilla chose to TOP that stupid remark] | Dec 13 19:59 |
| schestowitz | So now both mozilla and Google look bad to people who use Mozilla and Google to escape Convicted Monopolist | Dec 13 19:59 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: Ina is sucking up to Mister Ballmer. You should see them in interview | Dec 13 20:00 |
| schestowitz | Mary Jo oFley doesn't get interviews with Ballmer because she doesn't suck up to Microsoft 100% of the time and PR agencies like W-E notice and 'punish' her | Dec 13 20:01 |
| schestowitz | That's the Microsoft 'PR politics' as they tell me about them | Dec 13 20:01 |
| schestowitz | For instance, Mary Jo hasn't gotten access to Gates for many years because she MIGHT (Oh God forbid!) ask him a hard question. | Dec 13 20:02 |
| schestowitz | Speaking of being an arse: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/hardtalk/7414438.stm | Dec 13 20:02 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC NEWS | News Front Page .::. Size~: 86.04 KB | Dec 13 20:02 |
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| schestowitz | Speaking of being an arse, another one from Ben Stein: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlZtEjtlirc | Dec 13 20:04 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: here's a Linux preinstall | Dec 13 20:14 |
| schestowitz | "According to Computerworld, the server itself is a behemonth -- a $200,000+ machine designed to eclipse both their older mainframe offerings and high-end x86-based servers. It's been built to allow business not just to run Linux well, but to add horsepower on demand when businesses need it -- and to do that without disrupting anything else currently running." | Dec 13 20:14 |
| schestowitz | http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2009/12/ibms_big_iron_s.html;jsessionid=K4CMOZTQYCPP5QE1GHPSKH4ATMY32JVN | Dec 13 20:14 |
| schestowitz | It doesn't come with the XP tax, so.... | Dec 13 20:14 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: InformationWeek.com .::. Size~: 77.37 KB | Dec 13 20:14 |
| schestowitz | Of course, the box costs like 100,000% the cost of a licence, but... | Dec 13 20:15 |
| schestowitz | "Linux-based servers are becoming increasingly popular in Europe, but Linux administrators typically believe there is little need for special security around these servers because the operating system in inherently more secure than others." http://www.computerweekly.com/Articles/2009/12/11/239685/video-interview-nikolay-grebennikov-on-linux-server.htm | Dec 13 20:15 |
| schestowitz | Says insecurity company (making money from _lack_ of security) | Dec 13 20:16 |
| schestowitz | http://www.velti.com/index.cfm?page=1411&articleID=19509496 | Dec 13 20:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Firefox mobile internet browser 'will launch in December' | #MobileMarketing | Velti Mobile Marketing News | Velti .::. Size~: 19.53 KB | Dec 13 20:18 |
| schestowitz | http://industry.bnet.com/technology/10004377/arrington-crunchpad-suit-paints-him-as-naive/ | Dec 13 20:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Arrington CrunchPad Suit Paints Him As Naïve | BNET Technology Blog | BNET .::. Size~: 50.96 KB | Dec 13 20:18 |
| schestowitz | IT didn't take a gadget to paint him that way | Dec 13 20:19 |
| schestowitz | !google arrington people ready microsoft | Dec 13 20:19 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Arrington mourns abortion of enigmatic CrunchPad | http://www.tgdaily.com/consumer-electronics-features/44871-arrington-mourns-untimely-death-of-enigmatic-crunchpad- | Dec 13 20:19 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Malik, Arrington and Battelle: X-22, come in | News Blog - CNET News | http://news.cnet.com/8301-10784_3-9733995-7.html | Dec 13 20:19 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Microsoft pays star writers to recite slogan - Valleywag - Gawker | http://valleywag.gawker.com/271485/microsoft-pays-star-writers-to-recite-slogan | Dec 13 20:19 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! | http://www.crunchnotes.com.php5-2.dfw1-2.websitetestlink.com/2007/06/23/im-shocked-shocked-to-find-that-gambling-is-going-on-in-here/ | Dec 13 20:19 |
| schestowitz | http://www.stockwatch.in/transcend-unveils-new-usb-drive-jetflash-600-india-24252 | Dec 13 20:20 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Transcend unveils a new USB drive, Jetflash 600 in India | Stock Watch .::. Size~: 14.35 KB | Dec 13 20:20 |
| schestowitz | Dell Fell [fail] http://www.electronista.com/articles/09/12/11/part.delays.hampering.dell.holidays/ | Dec 13 20:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Dell having trouble delivering holiday orders? | Electronista .::. Size~: 79.82 KB | Dec 13 20:23 |
| schestowitz | http://news.softpedia.com/news/Mozilla-Releases-Thunderbird-3-0-for-Linux-129310.shtml Great app | Dec 13 20:30 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Mozilla Releases Thunderbird 3.0 for Linux - Introducing tabbed e-mail, global search, e-mail archiving and more - Softpedia .::. Size~: 53.98 KB | Dec 13 20:30 |
| trmanco | too bad it's gtk :| | Dec 13 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Skin it | Dec 13 20:31 |
| schestowitz | it mixed well with Oxygen here | Dec 13 20:31 |
| *burrit (n=mage@c-76-23-49-154.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 20:31 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.silvermel.net/ | Dec 13 20:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: themes for firefox and thunderbird .::. Size~: 3.11 KB | Dec 13 20:31 |
| *shreddar has quit (Ping timeout: 180 seconds) | Dec 13 20:31 | |
| trmanco | I know | Dec 13 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Use Silver | Dec 13 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Looks better than all the themes I've used for 5 years | Dec 13 20:32 |
| *shreddar (i=62f0385c@gateway/web/freenode/x-ulunqqxfhxukhfje) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 20:32 | |
| trmanco | the only thing I use that is gtk is firefox | Dec 13 20:32 |
| trmanco | and I skinned it, because the default theme is horrible | Dec 13 20:32 |
| schestowitz | http://it-chuiko.com/internet/1643-the-french-military-declined-from-ms-outlook-in.html | Dec 13 20:35 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The French military declined from MS Outlook in favor of Mozilla Thunderbird » IT - Chuiko | Information Technology News .::. Size~: 41.79 KB | Dec 13 20:35 |
| schestowitz | Mozilla needs to get its thing together with themes. Most Linux distros too, with or without Composite by default | Dec 13 20:35 |
| schestowitz | http://baghira.sourceforge.net/OS_Clone-en.php | Dec 13 20:36 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Baghira - Arnaud's OSX cloning tutorial .::. Size~: 63.29 KB | Dec 13 20:36 |
| shreddar | That's kinda cool. I almost themed my Gnome desktop to look like OSX. | Dec 13 20:39 |
| shreddar | Then I decided to go with Elegant Brit. | Dec 13 20:39 |
| shreddar | I just didn't like the default look. | Dec 13 20:41 |
| shreddar | I think I would've gotten tired of the OSX look. | Dec 13 20:42 |
| shreddar | Plus it would remind me of what I don't have. | Dec 13 20:42 |
| burrit | so why does novell "including TPM support" take away rights? | Dec 13 20:44 |
| schestowitz | Delusion? http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2009/12/11/america-is-on-a-path-to-economic-recovery/ | Dec 13 20:44 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: America is on a path to economic recovery RoughlyDrafted Magazine .::. Size~: 41.77 KB | Dec 13 20:44 |
| schestowitz | burrit: it ushers it along with I.B.M. | Dec 13 20:45 |
| MinceR | why not remind yourself that you aren't impeded in your work and entertainment by macos? :> | Dec 13 20:45 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: Bagjra goes many years back | Dec 13 20:45 |
| burrit | schestowitz, i still don't understand how that will even eventaully take away our rights | Dec 13 20:46 |
| schestowitz | When I was on KDE 3.1 in 2004 it was more distant an idea... to make KDE as good-looking (skin deep) as Jaguar | Dec 13 20:46 |
| schestowitz | burrit: it takes control to begin with | Dec 13 20:46 |
| schestowitz | Then, companies will choose to hook onto this control | Dec 13 20:46 |
| schestowitz | Greed for power knows no bounds | Dec 13 20:46 |
| burrit | hmmmm | Dec 13 20:46 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] jIH muS Wintrolls #klingon (translate: http://bit.ly/508fmH) | Dec 13 20:47 | |
| burrit | no, i think you are wrong | Dec 13 20:47 |
| schestowitz | That too is why privacy is importany | Dec 13 20:47 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Tweet in Klingon .::. Size~: 35.16 KB | Dec 13 20:47 |
| burrit | schestowitz, tpm never "takes power" | Dec 13 20:47 |
| burrit | it is 100% a passive device | Dec 13 20:47 |
| MinceR | then again, macos is ugly | Dec 13 20:47 |
| schestowitz | And worse, you can't change it | Dec 13 20:47 |
| schestowitz | Maybe change some tones only | Dec 13 20:47 |
| schestowitz | Theme uniformity... like communist Russia /sarcasm | Dec 13 20:47 |
| schestowitz | Taking marching orders from Mr. Jobs | Dec 13 20:48 |
| burrit | in order for what you suggest to happen, you would have to install such software (which currently doesn't even exist) yourself | Dec 13 20:48 |
| schestowitz | burrit: explain why not | Dec 13 20:48 |
| burrit | ok | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | Elaborate on why it can't take power away | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | burrit: not you | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | A company that deploys your workstation | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | It's like DRM | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | You can buy DRM-free | Dec 13 20:49 |
| burrit | right | Dec 13 20:49 |
| burrit | i see | Dec 13 20:49 |
| schestowitz | But with DRM, companies will make use of it | Dec 13 20:49 |
| burrit | so you believe that your company shouldn't have control over their own property? | Dec 13 20:49 |
| *yuhong (n=chatzill@pool-96-253-143-208.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 20:50 | |
| schestowitz | Not to that degree | Dec 13 20:50 |
| schestowitz | Let me ask you this: | Dec 13 20:50 |
| burrit | i see | Dec 13 20:50 |
| schestowitz | At work, you mail your wife | Dec 13 20:50 |
| schestowitz | Should your boss be able to intrude or not? | Dec 13 20:50 |
| schestowitz | [and many already do BTW] | Dec 13 20:50 |
| yuhong | http://monty-says.blogspot.com/2009/12/help-saving-mysql.html | Dec 13 20:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 20:50 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: just ignore him | Dec 13 20:50 |
| yuhong | "Oracle has instead contacted hundreds of their big customers and asked them to write to the EC and require unconditional acceptance of the deal.“ | Dec 13 20:51 |
| shreddar | burrit so do you believe that a customer shouldn't have controls over their own property? | Dec 13 20:51 |
| yuhong | Not even MS does this. | Dec 13 20:51 |
| burrit | tpm is neither here nor there about whether your boss can 'intrude' on your wife email | Dec 13 20:51 |
| schestowitz | It can be | Dec 13 20:51 |
| schestowitz | As an analogy | Dec 13 20:51 |
| yuhong | "I don't think it's right that big companies should be able to buy they way out of competition chargers by mobilizing customers.“ | Dec 13 20:51 |
| schestowitz | You distorted my message | Dec 13 20:51 |
| burrit | shreddar as I stated above, if you install software that implements any kind of vendor lock in, it's your own fault | Dec 13 20:51 |
| schestowitz | I didn't say TPM is related to it | Dec 13 20:51 |
| schestowitz | It was an example | Dec 13 20:51 |
| burrit | well what the hell, hehe | Dec 13 20:52 |
| burrit | i'm talking about tpm | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | TPM is like this (to put it simply): | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | TPM adds a hook for control | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | In due time, companies can require that control | Dec 13 20:52 |
| yuhong | schestowitz: Why? | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | You can require that people enable it to access the Internet | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | For "security" reason | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | Solution? | Dec 13 20:52 |
| schestowitz | Do not support TPM | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Shun TPM | Dec 13 20:53 |
| yuhong | Or it can be used for other purposes too. | Dec 13 20:53 |
| burrit | no | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | How to harm our freedom: | Dec 13 20:53 |
| burrit | i think you read slashdot too much | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Support DRM | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Support ACTA | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Support TPM | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Support DPI | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | Support Marshall law | Dec 13 20:53 |
| yuhong | There is no doubt about the first two. | Dec 13 20:53 |
| schestowitz | You seem not to understand the mechanisms of control and how history demonstrate their misuse | Dec 13 20:53 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] DW/LJ: Last of the famous international playboys http://reddragdiva.dreamwidth.org/23076.html http://reddragdiva.livejournal.com/536990.html | Dec 13 20:54 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: reddragdiva | Last of the famous international playboys. .::. Size~: 27.66 KB | Dec 13 20:54 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: reddragdiva: Last of the famous international playboys. .::. Size~: 18.65 KB | Dec 13 20:54 |
| schestowitz | If people are allowed to sniff your packet, they will | Dec 13 20:54 |
| schestowitz | See AT&T.... | Dec 13 20:54 |
| burrit | ???? | Dec 13 20:54 |
| schestowitz | If the media can censor/distort, it will | Dec 13 20:54 |
| yuhong | Of course. | Dec 13 20:54 |
| burrit | ok | Dec 13 20:54 |
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| schestowitz | If a criminal president does not need Senate permission to start a war, he will | Dec 13 20:54 |
| sebsebseb | hi | Dec 13 20:54 |
| schestowitz | sebsebseb: welcome | Dec 13 20:54 |
| burrit | enough philosophy please | Dec 13 20:54 |
| yuhong | Of course. | Dec 13 20:54 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] The only time I see people that happy with AOL is when they escape them http://tinyurl.com/yejau44 | Dec 13 20:55 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC News - AOL seeks a new growth strategy .::. Size~: 50.41 KB | Dec 13 20:55 |
| yuhong | Anyway, my topic is MySQL. | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | burrit: no, I don't read Slashdot | Dec 13 20:55 |
| yuhong | "Oracle has instead contacted hundreds of their big customers and asked them to write to the EC and require unconditional acceptance of the deal.“ | Dec 13 20:55 |
| yuhong | "I don't think it's right that big companies should be able to buy they way out of competition chargers by mobilizing customers.“ | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | Not that I see how /. has anything to do with it | Dec 13 20:55 |
| yuhong | Not even MS does this. | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | It's not philosophy, burrit | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | It's your life | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | Not at mental level | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | At very practical levels | Dec 13 20:55 |
| burrit | i bring up /. because thats where all the ridiculous "trecherous computing" fruits come from | Dec 13 20:55 |
| yuhong | And MS is a even worse convicted monopolist | Dec 13 20:55 |
| schestowitz | No, "trecherous computing" is FSF term | Dec 13 20:56 |
| shreddar | Oh! You're talking about Trusted Computing. | Dec 13 20:56 |
| schestowitz | Some GNU person (maybe RMS) invented it | Dec 13 20:56 |
| burrit | yes yes yes I know | Dec 13 20:56 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: Microsoft wants to block the deal | Dec 13 20:56 |
| burrit | i'm trying to understand why you think tpm use restricts freedoms | Dec 13 20:56 |
| schestowitz | It chokes Java and OOo, VirtualBox, other stuff... | Dec 13 20:57 |
| schestowitz | Do the smell test | Dec 13 20:57 |
| burrit | and you seem to claim that companies will use it on their own equipment | Dec 13 20:57 |
| burrit | and that that is wrong | Dec 13 20:57 |
| schestowitz | If Microsoft likes it, it's probably best for us | Dec 13 20:57 |
| schestowitz | Oops | Dec 13 20:57 |
| schestowitz | Opposite | Dec 13 20:57 |
| MinceR | burrit: if you think that the tpm is benign, explain what the Endorsement Key is good for | Dec 13 20:57 |
| yuhong | Of course MS would want to block the deal, but this do not mean this can be ignored. | Dec 13 20:57 |
| yuhong | "Oracle has instead contacted hundreds of their big customers and asked them to write to the EC and require unconditional acceptance of the deal.“ | Dec 13 20:57 |
| yuhong | "I don't think it's right that big companies should be able to buy they way out of competition chargers by mobilizing customers.“ | Dec 13 20:57 |
| MinceR | what does it enable anyone (including companies) to take care of their own computers better? | Dec 13 20:58 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: hello? You pasted this 3 times | Dec 13 20:58 |
| burrit | MinceR endorsement key isn't even every seen anymore with attestation | Dec 13 20:58 |
| shreddar | Trusted Computing seems like it's invented to give a very select few control over what every computer in the world is uses for and capable of. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| yuhong | True. This can't be ignored. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| burrit | MinceR so your privacy concern was obliterated in 1.1 specs | Dec 13 20:58 |
| MinceR | burrit: attestation doesn't serve the interests of the owner | Dec 13 20:58 |
| shreddar | That's scarry. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| shreddar | I don't know how it wouldn't be. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| yuhong | shreddar: It was, but they are now permoting it fo rother purposes. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| MinceR | attestation is there so that others can control what you run on your own computer. | Dec 13 20:58 |
| burrit | MinceR so don't use it? | Dec 13 20:58 |
| yuhong | I mean, even MS don't do this. | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | burrit: it's staged intro | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | Like with ID card in the UK | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | First it's permissive | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | Then encouraged | Dec 13 20:59 |
| MinceR | burrit: exactly. don't use treacherous campaign | Dec 13 20:59 |
| shreddar | Purposes that don't involve giving select few control over all the computers out there? | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | Eventually a must | Dec 13 20:59 |
| MinceR | s/campaign/computing/ | Dec 13 20:59 |
| schestowitz | Learn from history | Dec 13 20:59 |
| burrit | MinceR you are forgetting that such software (along with the privacy CAs and manufacturer certs) does not exist | Dec 13 20:59 |
| MinceR | what sw doesn't exist? | Dec 13 20:59 |
| burrit | any software that employs even remote ideas of such vendor lockdown | Dec 13 21:00 |
| MinceR | yet. | Dec 13 21:00 |
| burrit | ok | Dec 13 21:00 |
| burrit | so will you install it on your computer when it comes out? | Dec 13 21:00 |
| MinceR | i won't, as long as i have a choice. | Dec 13 21:00 |
| schestowitz | it's like RIAA and premium content | Dec 13 21:00 |
| burrit | or you tihnk it's morally wrong that a compay install it on their workstatoins? | Dec 13 21:00 |
| *yuhong has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.5/20091028153816]") | Dec 13 21:00 | |
| schestowitz | Use "our stuff" for access to exclusive films | Dec 13 21:00 |
| schestowitz | Bait and switch | Dec 13 21:01 |
| MinceR | nope | Dec 13 21:01 |
| shreddar | Scary "as long as you have a choice" | Dec 13 21:01 |
| schestowitz | Sometimes it's another scheme | Dec 13 21:01 |
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| MinceR | i think it's morally wrong to force TPMs into every computer | Dec 13 21:01 |
| burrit | lol well then what the hell is the problem? :) | Dec 13 21:01 |
| burrit | ?? | Dec 13 21:01 |
| schestowitz | The incentivitisation to 'reform' people | Dec 13 21:01 |
| burrit | tpm use has great benefits | Dec 13 21:01 |
| schestowitz | Like paying people to replace TV and go digital | Dec 13 21:01 |
| schestowitz | Or cash for clunkers | Dec 13 21:01 |
| MinceR | i'm not seeing those great benefits | Dec 13 21:01 |
| yuhong | schestowitz: I'm sure that was the original plan. | Dec 13 21:01 |
| shreddar | Yeah so does Martial Law | Dec 13 21:01 |
| burrit | that's because you don't konw what it does | Dec 13 21:01 |
| MinceR | i do know what it does | Dec 13 21:01 |
| burrit | then why don't you understand how an individual can use it? | Dec 13 21:02 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: yes, "Security" | Dec 13 21:02 |
| MinceR | most of that baggage doesn't serve the individual's needs | Dec 13 21:02 |
| schestowitz | That's what the 'war' in Iraq was for, too | Dec 13 21:02 |
| burrit | lol bull | Dec 13 21:02 |
| schestowitz | It only increased threat 7-fold | Dec 13 21:02 |
| MinceR | so what an individual can do with it is just an excuse | Dec 13 21:02 |
| burrit | no | Dec 13 21:02 |
| burrit | I argue that that is very, very wrong | Dec 13 21:02 |
| yuhong | Now they are permoting it mostly for business use, so it won't get on every consumer computer. | Dec 13 21:02 |
| MinceR | a lot of what TC does shows that the intention is not to serve the interests of the owners of the computers | Dec 13 21:02 |
| burrit | almost totally secure storage of keys is useless then, eh? | Dec 13 21:02 |
| schestowitz | DRM was called "enablement" later... | Dec 13 21:03 |
| MinceR | tokens can do that | Dec 13 21:03 |
| burrit | no | Dec 13 21:03 |
| schestowitz | As if DRM really gives 'benefit' | Dec 13 21:03 |
| schestowitz | To whom? | Dec 13 21:03 |
| MinceR | without being soldered onto the mainboard | Dec 13 21:03 |
| burrit | from third parties is different | Dec 13 21:03 |
| MinceR | yes they can | Dec 13 21:03 |
| burrit | secure storage on local machine too | Dec 13 21:03 |
| MinceR | if you think tokens can't do that, you'd better learn what tokens are. | Dec 13 21:03 |
| burrit | no, i think you don't understand how PKI works | Dec 13 21:03 |
| schestowitz | brb | Dec 13 21:04 |
| MinceR | and i think that you are clueless | Dec 13 21:04 |
| burrit | this is about keeping the private part private | Dec 13 21:04 |
| burrit | well ok | Dec 13 21:04 |
| yuhong | Yep, Digital "Rights" Management. | Dec 13 21:04 |
| yuhong | FSF prefers "Restrictions". | Dec 13 21:04 |
| MinceR | it's more accurate | Dec 13 21:04 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=5419 | Dec 13 21:04 |
| yuhong | I prefer "Rights/Restrictions". | Dec 13 21:05 |
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| shreddar | Give me control over your computer. I'll keep away viruses, pedophiles and Spam. I promise I won't do anything bad. Honest. | Dec 13 21:05 |
| MinceR | for example, fair use is a right yet DRM takes that away | Dec 13 21:05 |
| yuhong | I know, but this don't mean the tactics can be ignored. | Dec 13 21:05 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: it's more passive than that | Dec 13 21:05 |
| schestowitz | It's more like censorship | Dec 13 21:05 |
| schestowitz | You'll be able to restrict what goes in and out | Dec 13 21:05 |
| schestowitz | Like keep away all that 'unhealthy' stuff | Dec 13 21:06 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/23/google-is-dirty-microsoft-is-hypocrite/ | Dec 13 21:06 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft Has Already Decided: Google is Dirty, Microsoft is Clean | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 116.55 KB | Dec 13 21:06 |
| yuhong | I mean, even MS don't do this. | Dec 13 21:07 |
| schestowitz | That's what net neutrality is all about, too | Dec 13 21:07 |
| burrit | yes, i guess tpm is a very scary thing if i accidently install such evil software that might eventually exist on my computer | Dec 13 21:07 |
| burrit | someday | Dec 13 21:07 |
| MinceR | TPM is basically a piece of hw the owner is often forced to pay for even though it's designed to serve interests counter to his | Dec 13 21:08 |
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| burrit | MinceR thats fud | Dec 13 21:08 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Honorable mentions – what’s been good this weekend. http://rupom.net/38 #klingon #nintendo #ds #incognito #linux #foss #r4 | Dec 13 21:09 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Honorable mentions whats been good this weekend. « OPEN BYTES cave quid dicis, quando, et cui. .::. Size~: 34.75 KB | Dec 13 21:09 |
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| MinceR | burrit: no, that's an accurate summary | Dec 13 21:09 |
| burrit | MinceR i think you are very wrong | Dec 13 21:09 |
| MinceR | and i think that you are wrong | Dec 13 21:09 |
| burrit | well the difference is that one of us actually understands what tc is | Dec 13 21:09 |
| MinceR | indeed, one of us does | Dec 13 21:10 |
| burrit | how much code for tpm use have you written? | Dec 13 21:10 |
| MinceR | and the other one spreads bullshit about how great it is | Dec 13 21:10 |
| burrit | did you read the spec? | Dec 13 21:10 |
| MinceR | while mentioning things the TPM allows one to do, even though any token can do those things | Dec 13 21:10 |
| yuhong | Anyway, now "trusted computing" is premoted for mostly business use, so it won't be on every consumer computer. | Dec 13 21:10 |
| MinceR | i did read parts of it | Dec 13 21:10 |
| burrit | oh great. . . ."parts of it" | Dec 13 21:10 |
| MinceR | yuhong: it's on non-crap high-end laptops | Dec 13 21:10 |
| shreddar | You know that's one of the unsettling things about Chrome OS to me. Is how close it's security features remind me of TC. | Dec 13 21:10 |
| burrit | so you must know exactly how it works | Dec 13 21:11 |
| MinceR | i know enough of how it works | Dec 13 21:11 |
| burrit | haha right | Dec 13 21:11 |
| burrit | i've determined which one of us understands tpm | Dec 13 21:11 |
| MinceR | burrit: i'm still waiting for your explanation of how the endorsement key and remote attestation are supposed to serve the interests of the owner of the computer. | Dec 13 21:11 |
| burrit | easy | Dec 13 21:11 |
| MinceR | burrit: or at least an explanation of why they're there if they don't. | Dec 13 21:11 |
| burrit | so unless you're a jackass and installed it on your personal worstation, owner = company | Dec 13 21:12 |
| *sebsebseb has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | Dec 13 21:12 | |
| burrit | company is controlling which software goes on their workstation | Dec 13 21:12 |
| burrit | there you go | Dec 13 21:12 |
| burrit | and, for the second time, the ek isn't even visible in this scenario | Dec 13 21:12 |
| MinceR | it doesn't matter if it's visible or not | Dec 13 21:13 |
| burrit | so your privacy concerns were removed in 1.2 of the spec | Dec 13 21:13 |
| yuhong | Yes, but not on every laptop. | Dec 13 21:13 |
| burrit | to some it does | Dec 13 21:13 |
| MinceR | it's there and the owner has paid for it | Dec 13 21:13 |
| burrit | ah, so you argue that the tpm chip adds significant cost to the laptop? | Dec 13 21:13 |
| schestowitz | burrit's "real name" is "maggie-poo".... hmmmmmmmmm........... | Dec 13 21:13 |
| MinceR | and the company can put their own private keys on it anyway | Dec 13 21:13 |
| burrit | but that would be stupid considering the purpose is to keep the key secret . . . | Dec 13 21:13 |
| burrit | and that would make the key migratable | Dec 13 21:13 |
| schestowitz | BTW, Google already locks down netbooks | Dec 13 21:14 |
| MinceR | then they can generate private keys on it | Dec 13 21:14 |
| schestowitz | Apple does that with its crippleware too | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | yes | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | true | Dec 13 21:14 |
| schestowitz | And fights over it in court with Psychostar | Dec 13 21:14 |
| MinceR | then there's no point for the EK | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | no, ek still hsa a point | Dec 13 21:14 |
| MinceR | well, what is it then? | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | the other keys can be erased if you re-take ownership of it | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | and the SRK changes too | Dec 13 21:14 |
| schestowitz | So the idea of being force to run something with DRM-like h/w is not far-fetched | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | the EK never changes | Dec 13 21:14 |
| MinceR | so what? | Dec 13 21:14 |
| shreddar | TC isn't bad if I'm still in control over my computers. But then I don't think that goes with the idea behind TC. | Dec 13 21:14 |
| burrit | you really don't see the use of a non-ephemeral key?? | Dec 13 21:14 |
| yuhong | I know, the history of the Apple case is another mess. | Dec 13 21:14 |
| MinceR | if they erase the private key you trust that machine based on, they win nothing by erasing it | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | We already live in an era where RIAA lobbies to force people to install spyware that detects 'infringing' 'content' | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | http://techie-buzz.com/opensource/french-military-thunderbird.html // | Dec 13 21:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: French Military contributes to Thunderbird .::. Size~: 47.54 KB | Dec 13 21:15 |
| burrit | MinceR sure | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | France runs away from vendor control | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | Why do you think that is? | Dec 13 21:15 |
| burrit | MinceR i was explaining the use of EK | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | French military, German, Turkish... | Dec 13 21:15 |
| schestowitz | Maybe they realise who's increasingly in charge | Dec 13 21:15 |
| yuhong | Once the Mac ROM and the fact that the core of the Mac system software is just a set of patches to it protected the Mac from cloning. | Dec 13 21:15 |
| MinceR | burrit: so what does the owner win by having a key there that can't be erased? | Dec 13 21:16 |
| schestowitz | French govt did the same (cabinet members all run Ubuntu0 | Dec 13 21:16 |
| burrit | MinceR it's used in remote attestation in a non-visible way | Dec 13 21:16 |
| schestowitz | Chrome OS makes root partition RO | Dec 13 21:16 |
| schestowitz | Yuck! | Dec 13 21:16 |
| burrit | MinceR and i don't understand why you are all scared of the ek | Dec 13 21:16 |
| MinceR | burrit: i'm not scared of it, since i already control the boot loader | Dec 13 21:17 |
| burrit | schestowitz RO root partition has been done in BSD land since 70s . . . | Dec 13 21:17 |
| schestowitz | Maybe Chromium OS will enable one to change it, but it won't come on sub-notebooks. It's a PR excuse for people to play with while Google gets to call it "open source" | Dec 13 21:17 |
| MinceR | if anyone cries because remote attestation yields a result they don't like, i can tell them i have a boot loader of my own and they can just screw themselves. | Dec 13 21:17 |
| yuhong | Then Apple decided to allow Mac clones and decided to in the future help them by adopting CHRP, which required this ROM to be moved to disk. | Dec 13 21:17 |
| MinceR | i'm simply offended by the fact that i'm forced to buy something that was designed to serve the interests who want to take over control of computers they do not own. | Dec 13 21:18 |
| MinceR | s/ests/& of those/ | Dec 13 21:18 |
| burrit | MinceR " take over control of computers they do not own." ??? | Dec 13 21:18 |
| burrit | please explain how the hell this is done | Dec 13 21:19 |
| MinceR | by demanding that remote attestation shows that i'm running the exact version of the OS and apps that they require. | Dec 13 21:20 |
| MinceR | the problem here is that many clueless users would comply with such a request. | Dec 13 21:20 |
| burrit | so you think that someone will randomly request remote atttestion from you??? | Dec 13 21:20 |
| MinceR | someone i might be doing business with | Dec 13 21:20 |
| burrit | i see | Dec 13 21:21 |
| MinceR | or just about anyone i'm communicating with | Dec 13 21:21 |
| burrit | so you don't understand that for remote attestion to work, you have to have an entire compliant os | Dec 13 21:21 |
| MinceR | i do | Dec 13 21:21 |
| MinceR | 221510 < MinceR> by demanding that remote attestation shows that i'm running the exact version of the OS and apps that they require. | Dec 13 21:21 |
| MinceR | re-read this line then. | Dec 13 21:21 |
| burrit | no | Dec 13 21:21 |
| burrit | that still doesn't make sense | Dec 13 21:21 |
| burrit | it makes no sense for any company to request remote attestations like you are suggesting because it REQUIRES A COMPLIANT OS | Dec 13 21:22 |
| burrit | which doesn't exist | Dec 13 21:22 |
| burrit | and of course you don't have installed | Dec 13 21:22 |
| burrit | so your concern of someone requiring one day is absurd | Dec 13 21:22 |
| *yuhong has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.5/20091028153816]") | Dec 13 21:22 | |
| MinceR | yet. | Dec 13 21:23 |
| burrit | right | Dec 13 21:23 |
| schestowitz | _goblin: they have videos too :-) http://linuxbasement.com/vlog | Dec 13 21:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Linux Basement Vlog | Linux Basement .::. Size~: 34.64 KB | Dec 13 21:23 |
| *yuhong (n=chatzill@pool-96-253-143-208.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 21:24 | |
| yuhong | http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/12/how-the-robber-barons-hijacked-the-victorian-internet.ars | Dec 13 21:24 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: How Robber Barons hijacked the "Victorian Internet" .::. Size~: 39.13 KB | Dec 13 21:24 |
| shreddar | I think all they have to do is sell computers with the compliant OS already installed. | Dec 13 21:24 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: yes, already in BN | Dec 13 21:24 |
| burrit | so, for that to work, someone will require you to be running the evil tpm os | Dec 13 21:24 |
| MinceR | yeah, and once enough clueless users have them, they can start requiring them in random situations, saying that you're infected by viruses if you don't | Dec 13 21:25 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: in http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/03/microsoft-news-corp-backtracking/ | Dec 13 21:25 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft About Anti-Google “Bribes”: Lets Call the Whole Thing Off | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 103.54 KB | Dec 13 21:25 |
| shreddar | It would already be running. | Dec 13 21:25 |
| MinceR | say, accessing state services over the internet | Dec 13 21:25 |
| burrit | MinceR sure, i agree that that might happen | Dec 13 21:25 |
| shreddar | Because the manufacturers installed it. | Dec 13 21:25 |
| MinceR | then they could make it the only way to access such services | Dec 13 21:25 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: or they can pay people to take the tpm poison pill | Dec 13 21:25 |
| burrit | MinceR but how is that any worse from clueless users right now? | Dec 13 21:25 |
| MinceR | and you'd end up in a world where you pay thousands of dollars for a computer you don't have control over | Dec 13 21:25 |
| schestowitz | That's how it's usually done by governments (similar incentives for other stuff) | Dec 13 21:25 |
| MinceR | burrit: now at least i have control over my own computer, even if clueless users don't have control over their own computers | Dec 13 21:26 |
| burrit | MinceR i disagree completely, if you or me buy such a computer with such an os, then we are idiots | Dec 13 21:26 |
| schestowitz | burrit chooses to be naive cause he likes TPM, maybe for a living, who knows... | Dec 13 21:26 |
| MinceR | and i can access web services and i can do business in this way | Dec 13 21:26 |
| burrit | MinceR ok, so you think that eventually you won't have a choice about your os?? | Dec 13 21:26 |
| MinceR | eventually this could be turned into m$'s wet dream of taking over all PCs like they imagined with palladium | Dec 13 21:26 |
| schestowitz | burrit: they *Are* idiots | Dec 13 21:26 |
| schestowitz | There's a saying that goes like | Dec 13 21:26 |
| MinceR | burrit: i think it's possible | Dec 13 21:26 |
| shreddar | We hardly have a choice now | Dec 13 21:26 |
| burrit | MinceR well i don't | Dec 13 21:27 |
| burrit | MinceR you suggest that there won't be one vendor in the world that supplies a computer without/with a different os | Dec 13 21:27 |
| MinceR | burrit: and eventually we can end up in a market where we can't buy PCs we can control. | Dec 13 21:27 |
| schestowitz | "There are 3 types of users... those who understand computers... they who don't care about computers... and those who try to take advantage of the other two groups" | Dec 13 21:27 |
| MinceR | clueful users don't comprise enough part of the market. | Dec 13 21:27 |
| schestowitz | [21:26] <shreddar> We hardly have a choice now | Dec 13 21:27 |
| schestowitz | Yes, VIsta DRM is a must | Dec 13 21:27 |
| schestowitz | VIsta 7 | Dec 13 21:27 |
| MinceR | burrit: i can't possibly get the means to construct a computer in home conditions. | Dec 13 21:28 |
| schestowitz | Same BS that Gutmann warned about | Dec 13 21:28 |
| schestowitz | But they nymshifted to escape the warnings | Dec 13 21:28 |
| burrit | MinceR ok, well if you'll argue that every vendor in the world will all sell the same os restrictively | Dec 13 21:28 |
| MinceR | well, at least for some decades. maybe rapid prototyping will lead out of this situation. | Dec 13 21:28 |
| burrit | MinceR i guess i just disagree | Dec 13 21:28 |
| schestowitz | I think you just lose the argument | Dec 13 21:28 |
| schestowitz | "Idiots can be defeated but they never admit it." --Richard Stallman | Dec 13 21:29 |
| yuhong | "But they nymshifted to escape the warnings" I would not go that far. | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | They did | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | Vista 7 is VIsta | Dec 13 21:29 |
| burrit | i have nothing to say to you | Dec 13 21:29 |
| burrit | you are ignorant | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | They deliberately pulled a Mojave | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | They knew Vista had a bad reputation | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | They just needed to spend $500,000,000 on propaganda and bullying or critics | Dec 13 21:29 |
| schestowitz | Then promote this new name, "win7' | Dec 13 21:30 |
| schestowitz | /or/of/ | Dec 13 21:30 |
| yuhong | I know, but I don't think they pulled a Mojave. | Dec 13 21:30 |
| MinceR | m$ does a lot of rebranding nowadays | Dec 13 21:30 |
| MinceR | m$n->live->bing, vista->win7 | Dec 13 21:30 |
| schestowitz | Azune [sic]..... | Dec 13 21:30 |
| MinceR | palladium->tcpa->tc | Dec 13 21:30 |
| yuhong | "vista->win7" Not a rebranding. | Dec 13 21:30 |
| burrit | wow | Dec 13 21:30 |
| burrit | palladium != tc | Dec 13 21:30 |
| MinceR | wince->winmo->who knows what | Dec 13 21:30 |
| schestowitz | SideKICK | Dec 13 21:31 |
| MinceR | well, tc is what became of palladium once the hw makers said no :> | Dec 13 21:31 |
| schestowitz | kicked in the side | Dec 13 21:31 |
| schestowitz | And sued this week | Dec 13 21:31 |
| MinceR | it's a subtler plan | Dec 13 21:31 |
| yuhong | "wince->winmo“ Not a rebranding. | Dec 13 21:31 |
| schestowitz | For data loss | Dec 13 21:31 |
| yuhong | WinCE was rebranded WinEmbeddedCE. | Dec 13 21:31 |
| MinceR | yuhong: yeah, we heard it all, win7 is totally new code, not vista at all | Dec 13 21:31 |
| MinceR | yuhong: well, sorry for not listing the thousand names wince has today | Dec 13 21:31 |
| yuhong | Win7 is not totally new code. | Dec 13 21:31 |
| schestowitz | It's not rebranding, it's rebandging | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | [21:31] <yuhong> Win7 is not totally new code. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | Yes, and... | Dec 13 21:32 |
| MinceR | relabeling | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | It's enhancements to VIsta | Dec 13 21:32 |
| yuhong | Many of it do come from Vista, but in most cases there has been changes. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | Only they charge for it... again | Dec 13 21:32 |
| MinceR | it's windows nt 6 sp3 | Dec 13 21:32 |
| yuhong | Nope, NT 6.1. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | fee-requiring SP | Dec 13 21:32 |
| yuhong | Nope. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| yuhong | Nope, NT 6.1. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| schestowitz | Bugfix release for the $712 alpha | Dec 13 21:32 |
| MinceR | yeah, cite the marketing bullshit over and over | Dec 13 21:32 |
| yuhong | Vista SP3 is different. | Dec 13 21:32 |
| MinceR | we'll believe you the 9001st time, i promise | Dec 13 21:33 |
| MinceR | (not) | Dec 13 21:33 |
| schestowitz | Vista still exists? | Dec 13 21:33 |
| shreddar | It's service Pack 8 or 7 whatever | Dec 13 21:33 |
| ender2070 | windows 7 is very close to vista | Dec 13 21:33 |
| yuhong | Yes. | Dec 13 21:33 |
| schestowitz | I thought the only ones touching Vista 7 are disgruntled Vista users | Dec 13 21:33 |
| schestowitz | Surveys showed this | Dec 13 21:33 |
| ender2070 | windows 7 is probably closer to server2008 though | Dec 13 21:33 |
| schestowitz | LOL | Dec 13 21:33 |
| schestowitz | Server 2008... | Dec 13 21:34 |
| schestowitz | VIsta with some tweaks | Dec 13 21:34 |
| schestowitz | Like Ubuntu Server | Dec 13 21:34 |
| MinceR | now if it has "server" in the name, you know it's got to be reliable ;) | Dec 13 21:34 |
| ender2070 | people could enable aero in server 2008 and it used less ram and stuff than vista | Dec 13 21:34 |
| yuhong | Yep, Win Server 2008 is the server version of Vista. | Dec 13 21:34 |
| schestowitz | And Vista was Server 2003 | Dec 13 21:34 |
| MinceR | too bad you know if it's from m$, it isn't reliable | Dec 13 21:34 |
| yuhong | It wasn't. | Dec 13 21:34 |
| ender2070 | im looking forward to RHEL 6 | Dec 13 21:35 |
| yuhong | But do you know that is the name of the server version of Windows 7. | Dec 13 21:35 |
| yuhong | Yep, Server 2008 R2. | Dec 13 21:35 |
| burrit | aaaah, i understand now | Dec 13 21:37 |
| burrit | schestowitz is the clown that wrote the article in the first place | Dec 13 21:37 |
| burrit | lol | Dec 13 21:37 |
| burrit | everything is clear now | Dec 13 21:37 |
| yuhong | http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1476462&cid=30418756 | Dec 13 21:37 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | Microsoft Invents Price-Gouging the Least Influential .::. Size~: 36.78 KB | Dec 13 21:37 |
| yuhong | Sad schestowitz is not on slashdot. | Dec 13 21:37 |
| MinceR | slashdot is overrated | Dec 13 21:38 |
| yuhong | Win7 is more similar to Vista than XP. | Dec 13 21:38 |
| MinceR | wow, really? | Dec 13 21:39 |
| *MinceR would have never guessed | Dec 13 21:39 | |
| yuhong | But there has been some significant code and feature changes compared to Vista. | Dec 13 21:39 |
| shreddar | It was like that with 98 and 95. | Dec 13 21:39 |
| MinceR | sure | Dec 13 21:39 |
| MinceR | new skin | Dec 13 21:39 |
| MinceR | few new bugfixes | Dec 13 21:39 |
| MinceR | few new bugs | Dec 13 21:39 |
| _goblin | and new box | Dec 13 21:39 |
| MinceR | UAC is even more worthless than before | Dec 13 21:40 |
| _goblin | its got a new price structure... | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | why that MinceR? | Dec 13 21:40 |
| shreddar | Everyone complain how it was really just a expensive service pack upgrade | Dec 13 21:40 |
| yuhong | Well, but it is less annoying. | Dec 13 21:40 |
| yuhong | And a few other new features. | Dec 13 21:40 |
| MinceR | ChrisTX: because it has a whitelist based on executable name | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | wrong. | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | only if you enable that | Dec 13 21:40 |
| MinceR | so all i need to do is put the payload of my virus in, say, notepad.exe | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | you can set it to a non-whitelist mode | Dec 13 21:40 |
| MinceR | and boom, it gets administrator privileges whenever it asks | Dec 13 21:40 |
| yuhong | Of course, it is far from just a service pack. | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | and boom, FUD | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | wrong | Dec 13 21:40 |
| MinceR | wow, you can set it up to be only as broken as it was in vista | Dec 13 21:40 |
| ChrisTX | as I said | Dec 13 21:41 |
| MinceR | that's amazing | Dec 13 21:41 |
| ChrisTX | no lol | Dec 13 21:41 |
| MinceR | huge step ahead! | Dec 13 21:41 |
| _goblin | Im still looking for all the great unique Windows 7 features that make it worth a purchase....... | Dec 13 21:41 |
| MinceR | _goblin: it looks more like kde4! | Dec 13 21:41 |
| yuhong | What is funny is UAC at it's core is a clone of sudo. | Dec 13 21:41 |
| _goblin | been testing it for a while now... | Dec 13 21:41 |
| MinceR | it's a broken clone of sudo, though | Dec 13 21:41 |
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| sebsebseb | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| schestowitz | [21:41] <_goblin> Im still looking for all the great unique Windows 7 features that make it worth a purchase....... | Dec 13 21:42 |
| MinceR | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| _goblin | maybe these "features" are like easter eggs on DVD's? Maybe I have to press a certain combination of keys in order to find the hidden extra's | Dec 13 21:42 |
| schestowitz | The silence is deafening | Dec 13 21:42 |
| sebsebseb | MinceR: | Dec 13 21:42 |
| yuhong | Indeed, UAC in it's Vista version do not have a timer, but that can easily be workaround by apps. | Dec 13 21:42 |
| MinceR | sebsebseb: | Dec 13 21:42 |
| schestowitz | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| sebsebseb | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| schestowitz | [21:41] <_goblin> Im still looking for all the great unique Windows 7 features that make it worth a purchase....... | Dec 13 21:42 |
| schestowitz | Open Source Hardware 2009 < http://www.wired.com/beyond_the_beyond/2009/12/open-source-hardware-2009/ > | Dec 13 21:42 |
| sebsebseb | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Open Source Hardware 2009 | Beyond The Beyond .::. Size~: 65.12 KB | Dec 13 21:42 |
| _goblin | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| sebsebseb | Dec 13 21:42 | |
| yuhong | schestowitz: http://yro.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1476462&cid=30418756 | Dec 13 21:42 |
| schestowitz | UACv7 | Dec 13 21:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | Microsoft Invents Price-Gouging the Least Influential .::. Size~: 36.78 KB | Dec 13 21:42 |
| schestowitz | UAC: it was My idea. memememe! | Dec 13 21:43 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: yes, I saw it yesterday | Dec 13 21:43 |
| yuhong | MS's recent UAC patents on Win7 probably relate to making it less annoying. | Dec 13 21:43 |
| sebsebseb | _goblin: | Dec 13 21:43 |
| MinceR | they did patent UAC, did they not? :) | Dec 13 21:43 |
| MinceR | even though they did not invent it | Dec 13 21:43 |
| MinceR | typical m$/crApple conduct | Dec 13 21:43 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: it was THEIR idea | Dec 13 21:43 |
| yuhong | Exactly what people complained about UAC in Vista. | Dec 13 21:44 |
| schestowitz | Maybe they patented the "nuisance" part | Dec 13 21:44 |
| schestowitz | !google microsoft uac designed to annoy | Dec 13 21:44 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Vista's UAC security prompt was designed to annoy you | http://arstechnica.com/security/news/2008/04/vistas-uac-security-prompt-was-designed-to-annoy-you.ars | Dec 13 21:44 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Microsoft: Vista feature designed to 'annoy users' | Tech News on ... | http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9590_22-197085.html | Dec 13 21:44 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Slashdot | Microsoft Designed UAC to Annoy Users | http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl%3Fsid%3D08/04/12/006242%26from%3Drss | Dec 13 21:44 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Microsoft Exec: UAC Designed To 'Annoy Users' - Software - IT ... | http://www.crn.com/software/207100934 | Dec 13 21:44 |
| MinceR | yeah, now there's a UAC that does nothing to help security, but is still somewhat annoying | Dec 13 21:44 |
| yuhong | I would not go that far. | Dec 13 21:44 |
| shreddar | Free and Open Specification Hardware. | Dec 13 21:44 |
| MinceR | i know you wouldn't | Dec 13 21:44 |
| MinceR | you're a m$ apologist. | Dec 13 21:44 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: no | Dec 13 21:44 |
| schestowitz | I would go that far :-) | Dec 13 21:44 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 13 21:45 |
| schestowitz | http://www.shortnews.com/start.cfm?id=82060 | Dec 13 21:45 |
| yuhong | Sad that schestowitz do not post on slashdot. | Dec 13 21:45 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: French Military Picks Mozilla Email Client Over Microsoft Outlook .::. Size~: 47.54 KB | Dec 13 21:45 |
| schestowitz | Ourhosexpress | Dec 13 21:45 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: I used to | Dec 13 21:45 |
| schestowitz | In 2005 mostly | Dec 13 21:45 |
| yuhong | What is funny is UAC at it's core is a clone of sudo. | Dec 13 21:46 |
| schestowitz | What is funny is Vista at it's core is a clone of Makos. | Dec 13 21:46 |
| ender2070 | its a shitty clone of sudo | Dec 13 21:46 |
| schestowitz | it's [sic] | Dec 13 21:46 |
| yuhong | It isn't. | Dec 13 21:46 |
| schestowitz | Not at the core, no... | Dec 13 21:46 |
| yuhong | I am not a MS apologist, BTW. | Dec 13 21:46 |
| schestowitz | It's a poor attempt to copy it | Dec 13 21:46 |
| schestowitz | Widgets->Gadgets | Dec 13 21:47 |
| MinceR | what is funny is that windows not at it's core is still a bad clone of VMS trying to look like it's a clone of CP/M-86 running a dumbed-down version of OS/2. | Dec 13 21:47 |
| yuhong | Indeed, UAC in it's Vista version do not have a timer, but that can easily be workaround by apps. | Dec 13 21:47 |
| MinceR | s/not/nt/ | Dec 13 21:47 |
| schestowitz | !google Microsoft Vista copies OS X | Dec 13 21:47 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - YouTube - NYT: Did Microsoft rip-off Apple Mac OS X in Windows Vista? | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DMDNuq94Zg_8 | Dec 13 21:47 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - YouTube - NYT's David Pogue on Windows Vista | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DQT6YO30GhmQ | Dec 13 21:47 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Windows 7 Copies Mac OS X, Microsoft Employee Says - Redmond soon ... | http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows-7-Copies-Mac-OS-X-Microsoft-Employee-Says-126805.shtml | Dec 13 21:47 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Microsoft: We Didn't Copy Mac OS X | Maximum PC | http://www.maximumpc.com/article/news/microsoft_we_didnt_copy_mac_os_x | Dec 13 21:47 |
| ender2070 | MS always copies Apple | Dec 13 21:47 |
| yuhong | I know, Apple was poking at this at WWDC 2005, I think. | Dec 13 21:47 |
| ender2070 | it was admitted in a documentary | Dec 13 21:47 |
| schestowitz | ender2070: then denies it | Dec 13 21:47 |
| ender2070 | Pirates of Silicon Valley | Dec 13 21:47 |
| MinceR | they both copy xerox | Dec 13 21:48 |
| MinceR | (ironic name there) | Dec 13 21:48 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 21:48 |
| yuhong | Xerox PARC. | Dec 13 21:48 |
| schestowitz | "Our friends up north [Microsoft] spend over five billion dollars on research and development and all they seem to do is copy Google and Apple."--Steve Jobs, 2006 | Dec 13 21:48 |
| ender2070 | Steve Jobs freaked on Bill for copying, and Bill freaked back saying they stole it from Xerox | Dec 13 21:48 |
| yuhong | I know, there is a story at folklore. | Dec 13 21:48 |
| schestowitz | Jobs and Gates are not rivals | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | Just elite ego game | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | THey share many goals | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | And they signed deals | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | Many deals in fact | Dec 13 21:49 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | Their threat is commodity | Dec 13 21:49 |
| MinceR | i think "elite" is too good a word for those sociopathic criminals. | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: elite is OK | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | It's not a compliment | Dec 13 21:49 |
| schestowitz | Not more than "bankster" | Dec 13 21:50 |
| shreddar | According to Roughlydrafted Steve wasn't even at Apple when Microsoft copied Apple. | Dec 13 21:50 |
| yuhong | I don't think so, only one is a sociopathic criminals. | Dec 13 21:50 |
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| yuhong | I know, one of the thing that helped was an agreement Sculley signed with MS about Windows 1.0. | Dec 13 21:50 |
| schestowitz | Jobs and Gates are like politicians from different parties | Dec 13 21:50 |
| shreddar | Or when Apple signed the contract that bascally gave them permission to copy them. | Dec 13 21:50 |
| schestowitz | Patting each other on the shoulder after the debate | Dec 13 21:50 |
| yuhong | I know, and Gates is more evil. | Dec 13 21:51 |
| schestowitz | Assuming they both represent businesses that fund them both | Dec 13 21:51 |
| MinceR | i'm not sure which is more evil | Dec 13 21:51 |
| schestowitz | They are just rallying for money and power from the same people | Dec 13 21:51 |
| schestowitz | Nader would not | Dec 13 21:51 |
| yuhong | I would not go that far. | Dec 13 21:51 |
| schestowitz | But he's "irrelavant" to elite interests... same as Kucinich and Paul | Dec 13 21:51 |
| yuhong | Gates is more evil. | Dec 13 21:51 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: I would go that far! :-)D | Dec 13 21:51 |
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| schestowitz | "Evil" does not mean much | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | It's a word | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | It does not decribe behaviour | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | Just some vague adjective | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | Greedy means more | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | Megalomanical maybwe | Dec 13 21:52 |
| schestowitz | "Evil" is a word that's used to dismiss critics | Dec 13 21:53 |
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| schestowitz | "he thinks I'm evil!" | Dec 13 21:53 |
| yuhong | Yep, remember that when you see claims that Google is "evil". | Dec 13 21:53 |
| schestowitz | "This irrational hater says Microsoft is evil" | Dec 13 21:53 |
| schestowitz | No-one says that, you see? | Dec 13 21:53 |
| shreddar | Genghis Khan is more evil than Stalin. | Dec 13 21:53 |
| yuhong | I know, one of the thing that helped was an agreement Sculley signed with MS about Windows 1.0. | Dec 13 21:53 |
| yuhong | Yep, remember that when you see claims that Google is "evil". | Dec 13 21:53 |
| schestowitz | If one explain a crime of Microsoft, then it means Microsoft is a criminal | Dec 13 21:53 |
| shreddar | Mothra is more evil than Godzilla | Dec 13 21:53 |
| schestowitz | The apologists will say something, "he thinks people at Microsoft are evil" | Dec 13 21:53 |
| yuhong | Yep. | Dec 13 21:53 |
| schestowitz | Tricky technique | Dec 13 21:54 |
| yuhong | Yep, remember that when you see claims that Google is "evil". | Dec 13 21:54 |
| *zoobab (i=zoobab@vic.ffii.org) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 21:54 | |
| *Balrog (n=BRBT@129.32.100.56) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 21:54 | |
| *Aondo (i=stian@193.71.154.133) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 21:54 | |
| schestowitz | yuhong: I see it a lot recently | Dec 13 21:54 |
| MinceR | fans of evil are trying to strip the word "evil" of its meaning. | Dec 13 21:54 |
| schestowitz | I have a post about it tomorrow | Dec 13 21:54 |
| schestowitz | And it's clear where it comes from | Dec 13 21:54 |
| *Balrog is now known as Guest46491 | Dec 13 21:55 | |
| schestowitz | Joe Wilcox ( _goblin's 'friend') and chuims | Dec 13 21:55 |
| schestowitz | *chums | Dec 13 21:55 |
| yuhong | One of the most famous deals with MS was when Apple decided to bundle IE with Mac OS. | Dec 13 21:55 |
| yuhong | But it was not as bad as the IE 4 desktop update. | Dec 13 21:55 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: they have already killed "open" | Dec 13 21:55 |
| schestowitz | "Open XML" | Dec 13 21:55 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 13 21:55 |
| yuhong | Apple even kept Netscape. | Dec 13 21:56 |
| yuhong | Yea also notice the similarities between "Office Open XML" and OpenOffice. | Dec 13 21:56 |
| schestowitz | http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/184541/google_releases_experimental_phone_to_employees.html | Dec 13 21:56 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Google Releases Experimental Phone to Employees - PC World Business Center .::. Size~: 61.17 KB | Dec 13 21:56 |
| schestowitz | Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeevil Ivan | Dec 13 21:56 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: yes, I wrote about that | Dec 13 21:56 |
| schestowitz | They did the same vs Palm | Dec 13 21:56 |
| shreddar | I think the phone is just a design that they want OEMs to use. | Dec 13 21:57 |
| yuhong | Yep, Palm had to file a trademark suit to change it to "Palm-sized PC" | Dec 13 21:57 |
| schestowitz | http://globalvoicesonline.org/2009/12/03/bangladesh-india-arrest-of-ulfa-chairman/ | Dec 13 21:57 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Global Voices Online » Bangladesh, India: Arrest OF ULFA Chairman .::. Size~: 105.36 KB | Dec 13 21:57 |
| schestowitz | Eeeeeevil | Dec 13 21:57 |
| schestowitz | :-) | Dec 13 21:57 |
| shreddar | Simular to Chrome OS designed hardware. | Dec 13 21:58 |
| shreddar | They want to tell OEM how to make a Android 2.0 phone. | Dec 13 21:58 |
| *Will_ (i=453b6936@gateway/web/freenode/x-ysznevjkzulnyqob) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 21:59 | |
| shreddar | I really doubt they will start selling phones. | Dec 13 22:00 |
| Will_ | http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/12/12/1942207/Microsoft-Invents-Price-Gouging-the-Least-Influential?art_pos=18 | Dec 13 22:00 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Your Rights Online Story | Microsoft Invents Price-Gouging the Least Influential .::. Size~: 156.39 KB | Dec 13 22:00 |
| yuhong | Yep, I already cited a comment. | Dec 13 22:00 |
| schestowitz | Neat: http://home.arcor.de/axel.mellinger/ | Dec 13 22:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: All-Sky Milky Way Panorama 2.0 .::. Size~: 13.04 KB | Dec 13 22:01 |
| schestowitz | Will_: yes, seen it | Dec 13 22:01 |
| Will_ | ok. late to the party on that one. | Dec 13 22:01 |
| _goblin | schestowitz: Joe Wilcox my friend? | Dec 13 22:01 |
| schestowitz | What's so special about it? | Dec 13 22:01 |
| MinceR | google gets into hw design? it will be just as great when they started making applications :> | Dec 13 22:01 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft makes another anti-'consumer' patents? | Dec 13 22:01 |
| schestowitz | *tent | Dec 13 22:01 |
| schestowitz | _goblin: scare quotes | Dec 13 22:02 |
| _goblin | where? | Dec 13 22:02 |
| schestowitz | But you encouraged him by hanging around there | Dec 13 22:02 |
| Will_ | nothing special. Just makes me wonder what they are smoking. But that's getting more and more common by the year. | Dec 13 22:02 |
| schestowitz | THey just need to increase patent count | Dec 13 22:02 |
| schestowitz | It's quantity, not quality to them | Dec 13 22:02 |
| schestowitz | They want to come to companies for racketeering purposes | Dec 13 22:03 |
| _goblin | I think Jo (whatever his bias) was very good for highlighting the benefits of Linux...he allowed MS Watch to turn into a Linux advocate site for a while. | Dec 13 22:03 |
| schestowitz | And then say a number like "10,000 patents" | Dec 13 22:03 |
| schestowitz | "Just don't bother checking /WHAT/ patents" | Dec 13 22:03 |
| _goblin | and if you look back at those threads, they did nothing but put Linux and FOSS in its true good light. | Dec 13 22:03 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is a racket operation and it should be shut down where there is interest in science | Dec 13 22:03 |
| schestowitz | _goblin: well, one of the Microsoft Nicks is in change now | Dec 13 22:04 |
| schestowitz | Almost no-one participates now | Dec 13 22:04 |
| schestowitz | Not even Mr Dee Costa Boy | Dec 13 22:04 |
| shreddar | Microsoft will bow before my mighty science! | Dec 13 22:04 |
| Will_ | I don't recall Jo doing any censoring, except once or twice to clean up some unruly conduct that got really out of hand, including impersonating Jo. | Dec 13 22:04 |
| *Guest46491 is now known as Balrog | Dec 13 22:05 | |
| schestowitz | >Yeah | Dec 13 22:05 |
| _goblin | I think the "death" of MS watch came when moderating of comments started. | Dec 13 22:05 |
| Will_ | And you can guess which side that conduct came from | Dec 13 22:05 |
| schestowitz | Back in the 90s he wrote some MS-hostile stuff too | Dec 13 22:05 |
| schestowitz | He's not entuirely PR | Dec 13 22:05 |
| _goblin | I don't necessarily think it was because Joe Wilcox left. | Dec 13 22:05 |
| _goblin | I am sure he was let go because the site became toxic (for MS) | Dec 13 22:05 |
| schestowitz | _goblin: Ziff Davis rtightened the relationship with Microsoft | Dec 13 22:06 |
| schestowitz | SOme Linux writers left/were pushed out too | Dec 13 22:06 |
| schestowitz | SJVN for example | Dec 13 22:06 |
| Will_ | well, the "MS faithful" brought that on themselves there, as _goblin and I saw. | Dec 13 22:06 |
| schestowitz | "Microsoft is now a software company, it's a religion..." | Dec 13 22:07 |
| MinceR | s/now/not/ | Dec 13 22:07 |
| schestowitz | >"Microsoft allowed us to [remove Internet Explorer from Windows] but we don't think we should have to ask permission every time we want to make some minor software modification. Windows is an operating system, not a religion." -- | Dec 13 22:07 |
| schestowitz | Gateway Computer Chairman Ted Waitt</font> | Dec 13 22:07 |
| schestowitz | </p> | Dec 13 22:07 |
| MinceR | crApple and adobe are religions too | Dec 13 22:07 |
| schestowitz | Cults | Dec 13 22:07 |
| MinceR | indeed | Dec 13 22:07 |
| Will_ | MS should really stay away from science. Their whole ethos seems contradictory to the spirit of scientific investigation and dissemination of information. | Dec 13 22:08 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:08 |
| schestowitz | http://www.cultofmac.com/ | Dec 13 22:08 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Cult of Mac | The Mac, the iPod, the iPhone - and the people who love them .::. Size~: 58.02 KB | Dec 13 22:08 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:08 |
| schestowitz | Compre to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology | Dec 13 22:08 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Scientology - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 445.66 KB | Dec 13 22:08 |
| shreddar | Apple a religion too so was OS/2 and other computer standards | Dec 13 22:08 |
| schestowitz | Apple realised it... | Dec 13 22:09 |
| schestowitz | With KAwasaki and all.... | Dec 13 22:09 |
| shreddar | Back when there was variety. | Dec 13 22:09 |
| schestowitz | That it needed to create a cult to succeed | Dec 13 22:09 |
| schestowitz | People who identify with some stupid logos | Dec 13 22:09 |
| schestowitz | And vain personas like that rubbish dude from Mac ads | Dec 13 22:09 |
| schestowitz | Some people are like that with Linux | Dec 13 22:10 |
| schestowitz | Fascination with penguins and Linus... | Dec 13 22:10 |
| shreddar | Oh yeah tux | Dec 13 22:10 |
| schestowitz | They need to think without logos and 'Gods'... and more about their rights | Dec 13 22:10 |
| shreddar | I forgot about him | Dec 13 22:10 |
| shreddar | I think Linux's logo should've been a frog | Dec 13 22:10 |
| schestowitz | "Linux is a registered trademarks of Linus Torvalds" | Dec 13 22:11 |
| schestowitz | /marks/mark/ | Dec 13 22:11 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: can't be | Dec 13 22:11 |
| shreddar | and it should have call Lofoage | Dec 13 22:11 |
| schestowitz | That would infringe on the Ballmer logo | Dec 13 22:11 |
| MinceR | shreddar: huh? | Dec 13 22:11 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:11 |
| shreddar | Gnu/Lofoage | Dec 13 22:11 |
| schestowitz | !google ballmer leaps youtbe | Dec 13 22:11 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - YouTube - Ballmer | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DNc4MzqBFxZE | Dec 13 22:11 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - I'm a PC, I'm a Mac, but checkout LINUX! - Unix Linux Forum ... | http://fixunix.com/linux/557328-im-pc-im-mac-but-checkout-linux.html | Dec 13 22:11 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Yahoo Shares Leap on Talks News. Microsoft? Not So Much. | Kara ... | http://kara.allthingsd.com/20090413/yahoo-shares-leap-on-talks-news-microsoft-not-so-much/ | Dec 13 22:11 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Tech-Ex: Apple Laptop Sales Leap During Back-to-School Season | http://technologyexpert.blogspot.com/2008/10/apple-laptop-sales-leap-during-back-to.html | Dec 13 22:11 |
| yuhong | Linus finally got the trademark after a fight. | Dec 13 22:11 |
| *MinceR thinks there's a joke he's missing | Dec 13 22:11 | |
| shreddar | With a cute little frog mascot | Dec 13 22:12 |
| shreddar | call Loffy | Dec 13 22:12 |
| shreddar | called | Dec 13 22:12 |
| *burrit (n=mage@c-76-23-49-154.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) has left #boycottnovell | Dec 13 22:12 | |
| schestowitz | MOG on MySQL and the Microsoft line supporters http://xml.sys-con.com/node/1218753 | Dec 13 22:13 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: MySQL Creator Wants War with Oracle | XML Journal .::. Size~: 124.13 KB | Dec 13 22:13 |
| *Will_ has quit ("Page closed") | Dec 13 22:13 | |
| schestowitz | Surprise, surprise... | Dec 13 22:13 |
| yuhong | I wonder if things would have been better if Monty had more control over the original company. | Dec 13 22:14 |
| yuhong | Yep, that is exactly what I was going to discuss. | Dec 13 22:14 |
| yuhong | http://developers.slashdot.org/story/09/12/13/1530211/Widenius-Warns-Against-MySQL-Falling-Into-Oracles-Hands | Dec 13 22:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Developers Story | Widenius Warns Against MySQL Falling Into Oracle's Hands .::. Size~: 148.75 KB | Dec 13 22:15 |
| yuhong | Exactly what I am reading. | Dec 13 22:15 |
| yuhong | I wonder if things would have been better if Monty had more control over the original company. | Dec 13 22:15 |
| yuhong | http://developers.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1476830&cid=30425568 | Dec 13 22:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | Widenius Warns Against MySQL Falling Into Oracle's Hands .::. Size~: 38.25 KB | Dec 13 22:15 |
| schestowitz | http://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/permalink/?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20091203006412&newsLang=en | Dec 13 22:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Artifex Software Files Copyright Infringement Lawsuit Against Palm, Inc. | Business Wire .::. Size~: 53.71 KB | Dec 13 22:18 |
| schestowitz | Did you hear about Palm and 'their' network being sued for data loss too? | Dec 13 22:18 |
| yuhong | Read that on slashdot as well. | Dec 13 22:18 |
| schestowitz | Like a mino-sidekick] | Dec 13 22:18 |
| schestowitz | yuhong: na, I'm staying out of Slashdotr | Dec 13 22:19 |
| schestowitz | /. does xss with fsdn.com | Dec 13 22:20 |
| schestowitz | I'd leave my excellent karma in tact, too http://slashdot.org/~schestowitz | Dec 13 22:21 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot - News for nerds, stuff that matters .::. Size~: 107.33 KB | Dec 13 22:21 |
| schestowitz | http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/EtherPad-to-become-open-source-as-Google-changes-plans-878426.html | Dec 13 22:22 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: EtherPad to become open source as Google changes plans - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 32.16 KB | Dec 13 22:22 |
| schestowitz | I didn't know just how much personal info on activity /. had decided to give away after overhaul... hmmmmmmm..... | Dec 13 22:22 |
| shreddar | http://www.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DNc4MzqBFxZE | Dec 13 22:23 |
| shreddar | Come on , shake your body baby, do the conga I know you can't control yourself any longer Come on , shake your body baby, do the conga I know you can't control yourself any longer | Dec 13 22:23 |
| yuhong | slashdot claims that: | Dec 13 22:23 |
| yuhong | "What do I see loading from fsdn.com? | Dec 13 22:23 |
| yuhong | That's our new image server." | Dec 13 22:23 |
| yuhong | http://slashdot.org/faq/tech.shtml | Dec 13 22:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot FAQ - Tech .::. Size~: 32.47 KB | Dec 13 22:23 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: they do crack at Redmond | Dec 13 22:24 |
| schestowitz | !google crack redmond | Dec 13 22:24 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Companies Get Free Crack at Windows 7 Enterprise -- Redmondmag.com | http://redmondmag.com/Blogs/Lee-Pender/2009/09/Companies-Get-Crack-at-Windows-7-Enterprise.aspx | Dec 13 22:24 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Week in Microsoft: Pirates crack Windows 7, Redmond counters | http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2009/08/week-in-microsoft-pirates-crack-windows-7-redmond-counters.ars | Dec 13 22:24 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Windows 7 Ultimate Activation Crack | Redmond Pie | http://www.redmondpie.com/windows-7-ultimate-activation-crack/ | Dec 13 22:24 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Channel Gets a Crack at Windows 7 -- Redmond Developer News | http://reddevnews.com/articles/2009/02/04/channel-gets-a-crack-at-windows-7.aspx | Dec 13 22:24 |
| schestowitz | See? | Dec 13 22:25 |
| schestowitz | There's crack in VIsta 7, too! | Dec 13 22:25 |
| schestowitz | Maybe Steve was sniffing it too much | Dec 13 22:25 |
| yuhong | I know, piracy and WGA. | Dec 13 22:25 |
| ChrisTX | lol these 'cracks' are nothing but a modded GRUB4DOS to emulate the ACPI SLIC tables OEM activation checks for | Dec 13 22:26 |
| schestowitz | How about those cracks that delete the MBR? | Dec 13 22:27 |
| schestowitz | ALong with that virus called "Linux32"? | Dec 13 22:27 |
| schestowitz | These wonderful Microsoft dudes... they think of EVERYTHING! | Dec 13 22:27 |
| MinceR | yeah, it isn't fair to emulate ACPI SLIC tables | Dec 13 22:28 |
| MinceR | anything but that! | Dec 13 22:28 |
| schestowitz | They foresee threats to their OS and respond to it | Dec 13 22:28 |
| ChrisTX | in fact MS could block that, but that would require OEMs to use stupid retail activation | Dec 13 22:29 |
| schestowitz | Cool: http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/12/10/stealth-startup-relaxed-raises-2-million-from-redpoint-ventures-for-couchdb-support/ | Dec 13 22:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Stealth Startup Relaxed Raises $2 Million From Redpoint Ventures For CouchDB Support .::. Size~: 66.85 KB | Dec 13 22:29 |
| ChrisTX | and as 95% of all windows are sold per OEM channel | Dec 13 22:29 |
| ChrisTX | this is not wanted by MS | Dec 13 22:29 |
| MinceR | "stupid" is redundant there | Dec 13 22:29 |
| MinceR | activation is stupid | Dec 13 22:29 |
| yuhong | Yep, SLP, invented in Windows XP. | Dec 13 22:29 |
| schestowitz | Ubuntu One uses a lot of CouchDB | Dec 13 22:29 |
| schestowitz | It's a document-oriented DB | Dec 13 22:29 |
| MinceR | it's just like all other forms of DRM and copy protection | Dec 13 22:29 |
| schestowitz | Very suitable for high scale | Dec 13 22:29 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: I have activation too | Dec 13 22:30 |
| MinceR | inconvenience most legal users, provide an interesting challenge to someone to crack once, not inconvenience those who copy it illegally. | Dec 13 22:30 |
| schestowitz | It's a round button with a led behind it | Dec 13 22:30 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 13 22:30 |
| shreddar | WOW, last I check it was 80% I can't. | Dec 13 22:30 |
| shreddar | belive it. | Dec 13 22:30 |
| schestowitz | Yes, 80% | Dec 13 22:30 |
| schestowitz | I think MS says so | Dec 13 22:30 |
| schestowitz | That 80% of licences are sold to OEMs | Dec 13 22:31 |
| schestowitz | And forced upon sheeple | Dec 13 22:31 |
| ChrisTX | 80% OEMs then? | Dec 13 22:31 |
| schestowitz | http://www.ubuntu.com/news/bazaar-commercial-support-and-training | Dec 13 22:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Canonical announces commercial services for its version control system, Bazaar | Ubuntu .::. Size~: 13.43 KB | Dec 13 22:31 |
| ChrisTX | well I don't know exactly | Dec 13 22:31 |
| ChrisTX | the vast majority however | Dec 13 22:31 |
| schestowitz | It's good, ain't it? | Dec 13 22:32 |
| shreddar | Oh you were just guessing | Dec 13 22:32 |
| schestowitz | They just need to bribe some CEOs of companies | Dec 13 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Not users | Dec 13 22:32 |
| schestowitz | !google dell intel kickbacks | Dec 13 22:32 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Dell facing investor lawsuit over shady Intel kickbacks -- Engadget | http://www.engadget.com/2007/02/03/dell-facing-investor-lawsuit-over-shady-intel-kickbacks/ | Dec 13 22:32 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Intel Faces Antitrust Lawsuit, Kickbacks Alleged — Datamation.com | http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/cnews/article.php/3847056/Intel-Faces-Antitrust-Lawsuit-Kickbacks-Alleged.htm | Dec 13 22:32 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - NY attorney general Cuomo files antitrust suit against Intel - Nov ... | http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/04/technology/cuomo_sues_intel_antitrust/index.htm%3Fcnn%3Dyes | Dec 13 22:32 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Intel hit by NY antitrust suit, kickbacks alleged: Thomson Reuters ... | http://news.moneycentral.msn.com/ticker/article.aspx%3FFeed%3DOBR%26Date%3D20091104%26ID%3D10644658%26Symbol%3DDELL | Dec 13 22:32 |
| schestowitz | http://www.redhat.com/about/news/prarchive/2009/spice-os.html | Dec 13 22:32 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: redhat.com | The World's Open Source Leader .::. Size~: 21.32 KB | Dec 13 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Dell is Pal (just slide fat dollaz' under the table) | Dec 13 22:33 |
| schestowitz | IMHO, Michael Dell should be sent to criminal prosection and Ottelini too | Dec 13 22:33 |
| schestowitz | But they live in a land that glorifies -- not scrutinises-- the businessmen who 'own' the country | Dec 13 22:34 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:34 |
| yuhong | And I certainly agree about Ottelini. | Dec 13 22:35 |
| schestowitz | Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rico_act | Dec 13 22:35 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 22:35 |
| schestowitz | Seems to be forgotten by now | Dec 13 22:35 |
| schestowitz | Cause this is more 'important' | Dec 13 22:36 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marshall_law | Dec 13 22:36 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 22:36 |
| schestowitz | Keep people impotent and powerless | Dec 13 22:36 |
| schestowitz | George Obama.. more of the same sadly | Dec 13 22:37 |
| schestowitz | !google obama renew patriot | Dec 13 22:37 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Obama: Renew Patriot Surveillances | http://thedailybell.com/614/Obama-Renew-Patriot-Surveillances.html | Dec 13 22:37 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Obama Quietly Backs Renewing Patriot Act Surveillance Provisions ... | http://www.alternet.org/rights/144170/obama_quietly_backs_renewing_patriot_act_surveillance_provisions/ | Dec 13 22:37 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Obama Quietly Backs Patriot Act Provisions | CommonDreams.org | http://www.commondreams.org/headline/2009/11/23-6 | Dec 13 22:37 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Obama Backs Extending Patriot Act Spy Provisions | Threat Level ... | http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2009/09/obama-backs-expiring-patriot-act-spy-provisions/ | Dec 13 22:37 |
| yuhong | I know | Dec 13 22:38 |
| *pentarex (n=pentarex@82-170-54-237.ip.telfort.nl) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 13 22:38 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.sutor.com/newsite/drupal/2010events | Dec 13 22:38 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 2010 Linux and Open Source Events | Bob Sutor .::. Size~: 20.21 KB | Dec 13 22:38 |
| schestowitz | The Republic of -China- USA | Dec 13 22:38 |
| schestowitz | Sadly, again | Dec 13 22:38 |
| schestowitz | And the UK follows the US | Dec 13 22:38 |
| schestowitz | Basically, once a law passes in the US, it son extends | Dec 13 22:39 |
| schestowitz | DMCA, ACTA, etc. | Dec 13 22:39 |
| schestowitz | So we suffer too | Dec 13 22:39 |
| schestowitz | /son/soon/ | Dec 13 22:39 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:39 |
| schestowitz | http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE5B91G020091210?type=technologyNews | Dec 13 22:39 |
| shreddar | What did you expect? A non-corrupt government that looks after the interest of it's citizens? | Dec 13 22:39 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] If you post about good experiences of Linux, you should read this. http://www.multinombres.com.ar/gpage.html #foss #linux #windows #vista | Dec 13 22:40 | |
| schestowitz | Even France could not resist... they elected this clown called Sarko to make his people slaves of other cultures that put money ahead of culture | Dec 13 22:40 |
| schestowitz | shreddar: some have been more successful | Dec 13 22:40 |
| schestowitz | Scandinavian countries for instance | Dec 13 22:41 |
| schestowitz | There's less federal unrest in Norway, for obvious reasons | Dec 13 22:41 |
| schestowitz | And they are less densely populated | Dec 13 22:41 |
| schestowitz | http://www.businesswire.com/portal/site/home/permalink/?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20091210006062&newsLang=en | Dec 13 22:41 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Linus Torvalds Accepts DRBD into Linux Kernel | Business Wire .::. Size~: 51.41 KB | Dec 13 22:41 |
| Diablo-D3 | yeah that doesnt really mean anything | Dec 13 22:42 |
| yuhong | http://hardware.slashdot.org/story/09/12/12/0114248/860-Million-In-Fines-Handed-Out-For-LCD-Price-Fixing | Dec 13 22:42 |
| Diablo-D3 | drbd is absolute crap and shouldnt be used | Dec 13 22:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Hardware Story | $860 Million In Fines Handed Out For LCD Price-Fixing .::. Size~: 144.03 KB | Dec 13 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Where does the money go? | Dec 13 22:44 |
| schestowitz | Refunds for screwed buyers? | Dec 13 22:44 |
| schestowitz | Or lawyers and diplomats? | Dec 13 22:44 |
| schestowitz | And more importantly, how many execs go to prison? | Dec 13 22:45 |
| schestowitz | Oops. Sorry, I forgot. Prisons cells are built for hungry shoplifters, not the criminals that detroy the world more than anyone else, including the harm to hungry people who must then shoplift :-) | Dec 13 22:45 |
| yuhong | " Additionally, nine executives have been charged to date in the department's ongoing investigation. “ | Dec 13 22:46 |
| yuhong | "What's even worse are the cases where they get a free pass by paying the class action settlement, like the Google book deal." | Dec 13 22:48 |
| yuhong | http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1475942&cid=30410552 | Dec 13 22:48 |
| yuhong | "Current copyright laws are awful but one private company essentially ceasing it is even more awful.“ | Dec 13 22:48 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | $860 Million In Fines Handed Out For LCD Price-Fixing .::. Size~: 44.1 KB | Dec 13 22:48 |
| yuhong | In fact, this thread is exactly about what you call "funny money": | Dec 13 22:52 |
| yuhong | http://hardware.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1475942&cid=30410304 | Dec 13 22:52 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | $860 Million In Fines Handed Out For LCD Price-Fixing .::. Size~: 54.41 KB | Dec 13 22:52 |
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| schestowitz | http://ostatic.com/blog/research-shows-foss-bugs-get-rapid-response-commercial-software-not-so-much | Dec 13 22:54 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Research Shows FOSS Bugs Get Rapid Response, Commercial Software Not So Much .::. Size~: 37.88 KB | Dec 13 22:54 |
| schestowitz | Bad headline | Dec 13 22:54 |
| schestowitz | "proprietarry", not "commercial" | Dec 13 22:55 |
| yuhong | I know. | Dec 13 22:57 |
| schestowitz | http://savannah.gnu.org/forum/forum.php?forum_id=6077 | Dec 13 22:59 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Automake - News: GNU Automake 1.11.1 and 1.10.3 released, with security fix [Savannah] .::. Size~: 15.73 KB | Dec 13 22:59 |
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| yuhong | I think PR 2.0 ethics is going to be an important topic. | Dec 13 23:13 |
| yuhong | For example, is it ethical to spy on bloggers? | Dec 13 23:14 |
| yuhong | http://www.slideshare.net/michaelocc/the-ethics-of-social-media-pr-presentation | Dec 13 23:14 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The Ethics Of Social Media PR .::. Size~: 51.96 KB | Dec 13 23:14 |
| yuhong | http://www.briansolis.com/2009/02/media-20-workgroup-announces-best/ | Dec 13 23:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Media 2.0 Workgroup Announces Best Practices | Brian Solis - PR 2.0 .::. Size~: 32.76 KB | Dec 13 23:15 |
| yuhong | I think it depends on the actions done after spying. What Comcast seems to have been done is just post a comment under a real name. | Dec 13 23:16 |
| yuhong | Last time I checked. | Dec 13 23:17 |
| yuhong | On the other hand, posting using fake names would be astroturfing. | Dec 13 23:17 |
| yuhong | http://www.deirdrebreakenridge.com/2009/03/pr-20-culture-%E2%80%93-the-sociology-and-anthropology-of-pr/ | Dec 13 23:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: PR 2.0 Culture – The Sociology and Anthropology of PR | Deirdre Breakenridge .::. Size~: 72.2 KB | Dec 13 23:18 |
| yuhong | http://guerrilla-viral-marketing.suite101.com/article.cfm/twitter_ethics_for_business | Dec 13 23:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 13 23:18 |
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| yuhong | http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=1474792&cid=30399344 | Dec 13 23:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Slashdot Comments | Microsoft Expands exFAT Multimedia Licensing .::. Size~: 42.75 KB | Dec 13 23:23 |
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| ender2070 | sounded like linus was pissed that nouveau wasn't submitted | Dec 13 23:29 |
| ender2070 | which is why its in 2.6.33 | Dec 13 23:29 |
| ender2070 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnzvtfGnGtI | Dec 13 23:35 |
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| ender2070 | aseigo has a bit of a tom green look | Dec 13 23:46 |
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| shreddar | I'd like electronic companies (Toshiba, Sony, Panasonic, Sanyo etc.) to make their own Browser Based devices. | Dec 13 23:56 |
| shreddar | And they would have local storage you could use. | Dec 13 23:57 |
| schestowitz | ender2070: yeah, h does | Dec 13 23:58 |
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