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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: December 22nd, 2009

cubezzzFacebook is slowDec 22 00:02
trmancoit is nowDec 22 00:04
trmancobut it wasn't beforeDec 22 00:04
trmancobut the main cause is not phpDec 22 00:04
ziggyfish_the main cause is advertisementsDec 22 00:04
ziggyfish_;)Dec 22 00:05
trmancoI use adblockDec 22 00:06
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Offlineimap 6.2.0 seems a lot more stable than 5.99.4 that's in Ubuntu hardy on my server. Need to build thatDec 22 00:16
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IDC Speculation That #Vista7 is Last PC Operating System from Microsoft http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/21/windows-ends-winmob-slips/Dec 22 00:36
phIRCe-localTitle: IDC Speculation That Vista 7 is Last PC Operating System from Microsoft, Windows Mobile 7 Already Slips | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 116.9 KBDec 22 00:36
zoobab_th mplayer, vlc or rtmpdump.Dec 22 00:50
zoobab_th mplayer, vlc or rtmpdump.Dec 22 00:50
zoobab_does someone knows how to dump this stream:Dec 22 00:50
zoobab_th mplayer, vlc or rtmpdump.Dec 22 00:50
zoobab_rtsp://vod.europarl.europa.eu/nasvod02/cod0910/wm_pad/Channel04/VODChapter_20091013_14103900_18521500_Ch04.wmvDec 22 00:50
schestowitzziggyfish_: yeah, bloat in generalDec 22 00:51
schestowitztrmanco: yeah, right. C++ 4 times faster... I really buy that...Dec 22 00:51
trmancoit's CDec 22 00:52
trmancomaybe I misread itDec 22 00:52
schestowitzcgi....Dec 22 00:52
trmancoyeahDec 22 00:52
trmancoc++Dec 22 00:52
schestowitzWhen does red hat announce results?Dec 22 00:55
schestowitzI thought it was todayDec 22 00:55
schestowitzhttp://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/has-the-ftc-opened-the-door-for-the-great-chip-war/Dec 22 00:59
phIRCe-localTitle: Error processing the URL:  .::. Size~: 0 KBDec 22 00:59
schestowitzhttp://news.softpedia.com/news/Goodbye-Fedora-10-130258.shtmlDec 22 01:02
phIRCe-localTitle: Goodbye Fedora 10 - Cambridge "died" on December 17th - Softpedia .::. Size~: 47.71 KBDec 22 01:02
schestowitzI want to try Fedora 13 if it had kde4.4Dec 22 01:02
schestowitz*hasDec 22 01:02
*Balrog (n=Balrog@pool-74-109-70-59.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 01:06
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #digiKam 1.0.0 looks really, really nice. http://linuxcrunch.com/content/digikam-100-out #kde rocksDec 22 01:09
phIRCe-localTitle: digiKam 1.0.0 out ! | We love Linux ! .::. Size~: 29.68 KBDec 22 01:09
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oiaohmhttp://blogs.zdnet.com/perlow/?p=11821&tag=content;col1 indemnification clause lol some times these guys are idiots.  GPL makes no allowance for such thing to effect ruling.Dec 22 01:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Microsoft's CFO moved to another dying company, Federal Motors. http://ur1.ca/ibjbDec 22 01:13
schestowitzOh, not the Perlow anti-FSF trollDec 22 01:13
phIRCe-localTitle: GM Taps Microsoft Executive for CFO - WSJ.com .::. Size~: 54.98 KBDec 22 01:13
schestowitzEven Hess is more enlightened than him.......Dec 22 01:14
schestowitzhttp://www.linuxuser.co.uk/opinion/jolicloud-thoughts/Dec 22 01:18
phIRCe-localTitle: Jolicloud thoughts | Linux User .::. Size~: 29.68 KBDec 22 01:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The poor ratings of @glynmoody 's article show that more people care about "Linux", not freedom http://ur1.ca/icevDec 22 01:20
phIRCe-localTitle: Is the Success of Google's Android a Threat to Free Software? | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 75.19 KBDec 22 01:20
schestowitzhttp://www.itbusinessedge.com/cm/blogs/bentley/google-could-face-lawsuit-over-smartphone-name/?cs=38299Dec 22 01:21
phIRCe-localTitle: Google Could Face Lawsuit over Smartphone Name | Blogs | ITBusinessEdge.com .::. Size~: 81.09 KBDec 22 01:21
*notzed has quit ("Page closed")Dec 22 01:22
schestowitzhttp://news.zdnet.co.uk/security/0,1000000189,39926434,00.htmDec 22 01:23
phIRCe-localTitle: Top stories - ZDNet UK News .::. Size~: 119.85 KBDec 22 01:23
schestowitzhttp://2010.newsweek.com/top-10/tech-predictions/Microsoft-Pushes-Out-Steve-Ballmer.htmlDec 22 01:26
phIRCe-localTitle: Microsoft Pushes Out Steve Ballmer - Tech Predictions for 2010 - Newsweek 2010 .::. Size~: 35.68 KBDec 22 01:26
schestowitz"Another problem: there's no heir apparent on the management team. Nevertheless, investors must be getting restless. Soon they'll start calling for a shake-up."Dec 22 01:27
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Gecko is still far more widespread than khtml/webkit http://ur1.ca/icfa http://ur1.ca/icfaDec 22 01:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How committed will #Cavium be to Linux commits? http://it.tmcnet.com/news/2009/12/18/4540889.htm Not terribly reassuringDec 22 01:34
schestowitz[00:21] <zoobab_> Lehne hereDec 22 01:35
schestowitz[00:21] <zoobab_> http://europarltv.europa.eu/Dec 22 01:35
schestowitz[00:21] <zoobab_> he is speaking after a talk on conflict of interests Dec 22 01:35
schestowitzHehe!Dec 22 01:35
schestowitzLook who's talking!!Dec 22 01:35
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cubezzzFederal Motors? You mean GM I guess? :)Dec 22 01:43
schestowitzIt's owned by the government now... part of itDec 22 01:44
schestowitzIt's more federal than the Federal reserveDec 22 01:45
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[sagarun/@sagarun] Will push emacs-goodies and emacs-haskell-mode tonight now leavin to my alma mater ;Dec 22 01:49
ender2070[19:56] <schestowitz> I want to try Fedora 13 if it had kde4.4 - KDE 4.3.85Dec 22 01:59
ender2070Current: Rawhide(F13): kde-4.3.85/qt-4.6.0, F10/F11/F12: kde-4.3.3/qt-4.5.3, updates-testing: kde-4.3.4Dec 22 02:00
ender20704.3.85 is beta 2Dec 22 02:00
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/21/google_tax/Dec 22 02:03
phIRCe-localTitle: Google: Do no evil, pay no tax • The Register .::. Size~: 24.62 KBDec 22 02:03
schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/21/rip_obannon/Dec 22 02:08
phIRCe-localTitle: Dan O’Bannon dies at 63 • The Register .::. Size~: 24.04 KBDec 22 02:08
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Some sugar for the geek that manages to record the stream of the STOA meeting on UPLS and patents: http://i5.be/5wDec 22 02:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[anivar] RT @EFF: EFF's Holiday Guide to E-Book Privacy: http://eff.org/n/9332Dec 22 02:12
phIRCe-localTitle: An E-Book Buyer's Guide to Privacy | Electronic Frontier Foundation .::. Size~: 22.78 KBDec 22 02:12
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] I've always assumed cell phones were a bit of an experiment and dumped mine in 03. http://ur1.ca/ichdDec 22 02:13
phIRCe-localTitle: US politico calls for cancer warning on cell phones • The Register .::. Size~: 27.73 KBDec 22 02:13
zoobab_damn itDec 22 02:18
*oiaohm has quit (Remote closed the connection)Dec 22 02:21
*trmanco has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Dec 22 02:27
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schestowitzzoobab_: did you make a video copy/mirror?Dec 22 02:33
schestowitzOgg would be good.... embeddable in FirefoxDec 22 02:33
zoobab_I cannot manage to even see the streamDec 22 02:33
schestowitzTypicalDec 22 02:34
schestowitzasp->no transparencyDec 22 02:34
schestowitzDRM circusDec 22 02:34
zoobab_it seemsDec 22 02:34
zoobab_RTSP/1.0 Forbidden: Proxy not licensedDec 22 02:34
zoobab_RTSP/1.0 403 Forbidden: Proxy not licensedDec 22 02:35
schestowitzThe FFII complained aboit the format some years ago, IIRCDec 22 02:35
schestowitzzoobab_: it's public infoDec 22 02:35
schestowitzNo reason for "licence" or "permission"Dec 22 02:35
schestowitzThey should offer the raw dataDec 22 02:35
zoobab_rtsp://vod.europarl.europa.eu/nasvod02/cod0910/wm_pad/Channel04/VODChapter_20091013_14103900_18521500_Ch04.wmv?wmcache=0Dec 22 02:35
schestowitzEsp. for EU IPsDec 22 02:35
schestowitzspdy:// ? :-)Dec 22 02:36
*Balrog has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out))Dec 22 02:36
schestowitzBlakenhorn... http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=5460 "Whenever I feel a need for traffic, and talkbacks, I just write something with Microsoft or Windows in the title and y’all come running."Dec 22 02:39
sebsebsebInteresting point they makeDec 22 03:05
sebsebsebhttp://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=6479Dec 22 03:05
sebsebseboh no bot?Dec 22 03:06
sebsebsebheading/title:  Why the EU's "browser ballot" is a bad ideaDec 22 03:06
schestowitzzoobab_: http://techdirt.com/articles/20091214/0911457340.shtmlDec 22 03:07
phIRCe-localTitle: UK Looks To Lower Taxes On Patents; Encouraging More Patents But Less Actual Innovation | Techdirt .::. Size~: 35.89 KBDec 22 03:07
schestowitzsebsebseb: he's a troll, I don't bother with his blogDec 22 03:07
sebsebsebschestowitz: Why do you think that?Dec 22 03:09
sebsebsebschestowitz: Also what do you think of this browser screen?Dec 22 03:10
schestowitzI don't care muchDec 22 03:12
schestowitzIt's for Windows, I don't use itDec 22 03:12
sebsebsebwell yeah, butDec 22 03:12
sebsebsebthis effects Desktop Linux users as wellDec 22 03:12
sebsebsebit effects web usersDec 22 03:12
sebsebsebif enough web users use a decant browsers, a lot of websites are likely to start becoming a lot better :)Dec 22 03:12
zoobab_IE is still preinstalledDec 22 03:16
schestowitzObama's Home Teleprompter Malfunctions During Family Dinner http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXQTaWjMoFw&feature=PlayList&p=58NKeitRqbEDec 22 03:18
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-faCh8BUEts&feature=PlayList&p=58NKeitRqbEDec 22 03:21
sebsebsebzoobab_: well sure, but it's also bundled into Windows big timeDec 22 03:27
sebsebsebzoobab_: and that woudn't be providing a choice if IE got removed?Dec 22 03:28
zoobab_Microsoft will never accept thatDec 22 03:33
zoobab_the IE binary will always be somewhere on the OEM harddisk imageDec 22 03:33
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9k_nAbsNfI&feature=PlayList&p=58NKeitRqbEDec 22 03:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] European Commission boosts Microsoft's monopoly with software patents: http://i5.be/5xDec 22 03:40
phIRCe-localTitle: Microsoft's interoperability pledge not free enough for Free Software | Software News - Betanews .::. Size~: 31.23 KBDec 22 03:40
schestowitzUS debt is over... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRgRz3nSG7o&feature=PlayList&p=58NKeitRqbEDec 22 03:40
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oiaohmhttp://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Qt-applications-in-your-browser-891117.html  InterestingDec 22 05:25
phIRCe-localTitle: Qt applications in your browser - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 32.32 KBDec 22 05:25
*Ender2070 (n=Ender207@bas1-toronto12-1128666469.dsl.bell.ca) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 05:41
DaemonFCthese granola bars are deliciousDec 22 05:54
DaemonFCprobably from the sugar and frosting and honeyDec 22 05:55
DaemonFCblood sugar always has to run low when it's late at night and I have to drive 3 miles to get some candy bars or somethingDec 22 05:56
DaemonFCEnder2070, I should go to a police sale or somethingDec 22 06:00
DaemonFCsee if I can get in a bid for a car they seizedDec 22 06:00
DaemonFCwhat do you think? :)Dec 22 06:00
Ender2070lolDec 22 06:02
DaemonFCEnder2070, The county has a pretty shitty websiteDec 22 06:03
DaemonFChalf the department pages are blankDec 22 06:03
DaemonFChttp://huntington.in.us/Dec 22 06:03
phIRCe-localTitle: Huntington, IN | City & County | Home Page .::. Size~: 9.77 KBDec 22 06:03
DaemonFCthey were supposed to start listing all their seized property that's up for sale, but I'll be damned if I can find itDec 22 06:04
DaemonFCAfter they arrested all my neighbors for drug dealing and minor consumption and providing alcohol to minors, etc......Dec 22 06:05
DaemonFCseveral years agoDec 22 06:05
DaemonFCI broke in while I knew they were in jail and uhhhhmmmmDec 22 06:05
DaemonFCkinda sorta reappropriated some propertyDec 22 06:06
DaemonFCI've never really had any good neighbors no matter where I've livedDec 22 06:07
DaemonFCthe closest thing I've ever had to neighbors I can stand are the ones I have nowDec 22 06:07
DaemonFCof course one of them moved in her son which is listed on the Megan's Law websiteDec 22 06:07
DaemonFCyou never know about those though, cause there's a lot of ways to end up registering as a sex offender without really doing anything that wrongDec 22 06:08
DaemonFCIndiana even makes you register for 10 years if someone sees you taking a piss out in the woodsDec 22 06:09
DaemonFCEnder2070, I'd really like to know how taking a piss out in the woods is worse than a woman breast feeding in Burger KingDec 22 06:10
DaemonFCwouldn't you? :)Dec 22 06:10
DaemonFCas far as I'm concerned, if they label a man a sex offender for peeing, they should label a woman a sex offender for breast feedingDec 22 06:10
DaemonFClet them have trouble finding a job for the next 10 years cause they were breast feeding in publicDec 22 06:11
DaemonFCin fact, I think we should amend the state constitution so that pissing in the woods is protected free speech or somethingDec 22 06:12
DaemonFCI'm gonna start carrying a crucifix and a mason jar around with me when I'm in the woods, so that if I'm caught peeing, the government is intruding on my first amendment rightsDec 22 06:13
DaemonFCI was going to sell that as modern art, dammit :DDec 22 06:14
Ender2070I would rather them stop freaking out over people peeing where they can't find a toiletDec 22 06:18
Ender2070than to punish femalesDec 22 06:18
Ender2070breast feeding and urination are both natural and have nothing to do with sexDec 22 06:19
Ender2070unless you're R KellyDec 22 06:19
DaemonFChmmmmDec 22 06:21
Ender2070http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=llR4JBw29LcDec 22 06:21
DaemonFCI'm about ready to stick XP back on this laptopDec 22 06:22
DaemonFCthe 200m just dies on LinuxDec 22 06:22
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: which distroDec 22 06:23
Ender2070you suckDec 22 06:23
DaemonFCany, ATI stopped supporting it and the radeon driver is no good for itDec 22 06:24
Ender2070you didnt think aheadDec 22 06:24
Ender2070ati does that all the timeDec 22 06:24
ziggyfish_I have a radeon card, and never had a problem, how do you have it configured?Dec 22 06:25
DaemonFCEnder2070, Something tells me that my RadeonHD 4670 might be unsupported before they release a driver that supports the latest X serverDec 22 06:25
DaemonFC:PDec 22 06:25
Ender2070nvidia fixes xorg, they dont just stick to their driverDec 22 06:25
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: I've got the one above that Radeon HD 4850Dec 22 06:26
DaemonFCiirc, Nvidia works around X bugs Dec 22 06:26
DaemonFCdoesn't fix themDec 22 06:26
Ender2070keyword: worksDec 22 06:26
Ender2070;)Dec 22 06:27
DaemonFCwell, in Windows, the RadeonHD 4670 blows the Geforce 9600 I had awayDec 22 06:27
Ender2070both suckDec 22 06:27
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: what version of the driver do you have installed?Dec 22 06:27
Ender2070my 9800GTX+ pwns them bothDec 22 06:28
DaemonFCon Linux, the damned thing can't even keep up with the Geforce 9500 GTDec 22 06:28
Ender207055nm beotchDec 22 06:28
DaemonFCATI is fine as long as you never plan to stop using WindowsDec 22 06:28
Ender2070which is unacceptableDec 22 06:28
Ender2070Windows is terribleDec 22 06:28
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: as I said, I've never had a problemDec 22 06:28
oiaohmThe driver for the 4670 is still a work in progress DaemonFCDec 22 06:28
DaemonFCtheir Linux driver is just sadDec 22 06:29
DaemonFCcuts your card's performance in halfDec 22 06:29
DaemonFCsome features just don't existDec 22 06:29
Ender2070blame amd, they only care about windowsDec 22 06:29
oiaohmOpen source driver for a r700 will improve DaemonFCDec 22 06:30
DaemonFCI had considered formatting again and just going back to XP Pro x64 Dec 22 06:30
DaemonFCIt can handle quad core CPUs I believeDec 22 06:30
Ender2070XP is 8 years oldDec 22 06:30
DaemonFCx64 is only like 4 years oldDec 22 06:30
Ender2070not much betterDec 22 06:30
Ender2070what did linux look like 4 years agoDec 22 06:30
Ender2070WAY differentDec 22 06:31
DaemonFCblahDec 22 06:31
DaemonFCway buggierDec 22 06:31
Ender2070linux advances fasterDec 22 06:31
DaemonFCdidn't even boot on every other systemDec 22 06:31
Ender2070not their fault proprietary businesses can't keep upDec 22 06:31
DaemonFCthe Ubuntu 4.10 CD case was very pretty, the OS itself just never really workedDec 22 06:31
Ender2070for me it didDec 22 06:32
Ender2070back then I was running gentoo evenDec 22 06:32
DaemonFCI think I got it booted up on one of my three systemsDec 22 06:32
DaemonFCand I had no soundDec 22 06:32
Ender2070ever since 1999 I've purchased no hardware that does not work in linuxDec 22 06:32
Ender2070its not hardDec 22 06:33
oiaohmhttp://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzgyNQ  << I guess you are not trying this DaemonFCDec 22 06:33
phIRCe-localTitle: [Phoronix] R600 Open-Source Driver WIth GLSL, OpenGL 2.0 .::. Size~: 15.7 KBDec 22 06:33
DaemonFCyou shouldn't even have to consider that in my opinionDec 22 06:33
Ender2070yes i shouldDec 22 06:33
DaemonFCI can plug anything in and Windows will see it and find a driverDec 22 06:33
Ender2070if they cant make gpl drivers, they are ms shillsDec 22 06:33
oiaohmYes that recent driver update for the open source stack is r600 and r700 DaemonFC.Dec 22 06:33
Ender2070i dont want to fund ms shillsDec 22 06:33
DaemonFCI can't even count how many times Linux has failed to detect basic and widely used stuffDec 22 06:33
Ender2070i'd rather eat broken glass that buy windows-only hardwareDec 22 06:34
oiaohmSorry DaemonFC I work on second hand machines with old hardware.Dec 22 06:34
DaemonFCWindows has failed to detect what I plugged in, once, and I worked around thatDec 22 06:34
oiaohmI do run into a lot of machines there that the drivers are no longer avaible DDec 22 06:34
oiaohmYet Linux is fine DaemonFCDec 22 06:34
DaemonFCXP x64 has no MTP driver for my Sansa playersDec 22 06:34
DaemonFCbut it can still use them in MSC modeDec 22 06:34
oiaohmBoth suffer XP has minor new hardware advantage.Dec 22 06:34
Ender2070i bet MTP works in AmarokDec 22 06:34
oiaohmOld stuff major head ache DaemonFCDec 22 06:34
DaemonFCEnder2070, It might. It's buggy in RhythmboxDec 22 06:35
Ender2070Amarok is like 100x betterDec 22 06:35
DaemonFCsometimes doesn't actually copy anything over, sometimes it tells you it deleted something and it's still thereDec 22 06:35
DaemonFCBanshee has the best MTP support outside of Windows Media PlayerDec 22 06:35
DaemonFCnot surprisingDec 22 06:35
oiaohmRhythmbox has been neglected since the.net guys have been in gnome pushing there music player banshee.Dec 22 06:35
Ender2070nopeDec 22 06:35
Ender2070banshee is ms crapDec 22 06:35
Ender2070you've never even tried amarokDec 22 06:36
oiaohmAmarok has the best MTP support in open source.   There is no question.Dec 22 06:36
DaemonFCI've tried it, but my players are in MSC modeDec 22 06:36
Ender2070try MTPDec 22 06:36
DaemonFCit worked, but everything else does tooDec 22 06:36
Ender2070[01:30] <oiaohm> Amarok has the best MTP support in open source.   There is no question.Dec 22 06:36
Ender2070M T PDec 22 06:36
Ender2070works fineDec 22 06:36
ziggyfish_oiaohm: the only problem with Amarok is that it uses QT4, which doesn't run well in a gnome environmentDec 22 06:37
DaemonFCMSC mode is the only way to guarantee compatibility between operating systems and media playersDec 22 06:37
Ender2070but MTP works in amarokDec 22 06:37
oiaohmStiff ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:37
Ender2070MSC mode works in everything true, including dosDec 22 06:37
oiaohmThis gtk or qt split is stupidity.Dec 22 06:37
DaemonFCMSC just tells the operating system to address it like a "dumb" mass storage deviceDec 22 06:37
ziggyfish_oiaohm: yesDec 22 06:37
DaemonFCit'll even work for Windows 98Dec 22 06:38
Ender2070DaemonFC - the point is that Amarok supports it natively without requiring MSCDec 22 06:38
Ender2070everything from even a 512mb iriver from 2004Dec 22 06:38
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: MSC = ???Dec 22 06:39
Ender2070usb modeDec 22 06:39
DaemonFCyeah, those 64 megabyte RCA Lyras from 1999 will still work with MSCDec 22 06:39
Ender2070acts as a flash driveDec 22 06:39
oiaohmMSC works in armarok 2.0 is kinda minorly broken in 2.1 DaemonFCDec 22 06:39
oiaohmMSC kind breaks regularly in all of them.Dec 22 06:40
Ender2070<ziggyfish_> oiaohm: the only problem with Amarok is that it uses QT4, which doesn't run well in a gnome environmentDec 22 06:40
Ender2070Qt4 works fine in my KDE environmentDec 22 06:40
ziggyfish_Ender2070: I've tried to get into KDE, however, everytime I do, I find something missing like proper ssh and ftp support in dolphin,Dec 22 06:41
oiaohmWhat version kde were you trying ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:41
Ender2070<ziggyfish_> - when was the last version you tried? I use them regularilyDec 22 06:42
DaemonFCwell, they need to kill KonquerorDec 22 06:42
ziggyfish_also it has to big of a memory footprintDec 22 06:42
DaemonFCor turn it into something better than it isDec 22 06:42
ziggyfish_4.3Dec 22 06:42
Ender2070we'll see when mono has infected more of gnomeDec 22 06:42
oiaohmOk you must have missed instealling the plugins some how.  Because I go to ssh and ftp in dolphin here ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:42
oiaohmKDE memory foot print is that much larger than gnomes.Dec 22 06:43
ziggyfish_Ender2070: if this gnome 3,0 goes ahead, I will probally put up with the missing features (or write them my self)Dec 22 06:43
Ender2070you might also not want to use kubuntu, very bad kde implementationDec 22 06:43
ziggyfish_and use it as my prefered Dec 22 06:43
ziggyfish_desktop environmentDec 22 06:44
ziggyfish_Ender2070: what distro do you use?Dec 22 06:44
ziggyfish_for KDEDec 22 06:44
oiaohmkubuntu missing the addon plugins by default.Dec 22 06:44
Ender2070FedoraDec 22 06:44
oiaohmI am using Debian testing and sid yes I am a little of a edge runner.Dec 22 06:44
Ender2070Fedora 13 is going to be more advanced than the other distros till they catch upDec 22 06:44
Ender2070btrfs w/ snapshots is one exampleDec 22 06:45
Ender2070yum snapshotsDec 22 06:45
Ender2070grub integration too, a bad system update can be reverted via boot menuDec 22 06:46
ziggyfish_niceDec 22 06:46
Ender2070the kde team are very hard working tooDec 22 06:47
oiaohmPersonally I stay way from not complete filesystems.Dec 22 06:47
Ender2070they give users final kde releasesDec 22 06:47
oiaohmSo I am still using ext3 is trustable.Dec 22 06:47
Ender2070when 4.4 hits, f12 users will get itDec 22 06:47
Ender2070oiaohm - btrfs is close to mission critical friendly, and will be when f13 hitsDec 22 06:48
oiaohmNo most likely F14 before mission friendly ie allowing for the 6 months of running to find any major hidden bugs Ender2070Dec 22 06:49
Ender2070you can opt to ext3 or ext4 and not get snapshotsDec 22 06:49
ziggyfish_Ender2070: can more than one monitor work with kde 4.3 (have tried to get it working in the pass, but have failed)Dec 22 06:49
oiaohmPitty no one has worked out how to use lvm snapshots intergrated.Dec 22 06:49
*Diablo-D3 (n=diablo@64.223.238.130) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 06:49
Ender2070ziggyfish_ in 4.4, when you plug the second one in you get a wizardDec 22 06:49
oiaohm4.3 is a minor trip threw hell but doable.Dec 22 06:50
oiaohmFor multi monitor.Dec 22 06:50
DaemonFCMandriva's site is downDec 22 06:50
Ender2070gnome is hellDec 22 06:50
Ender2070if your distro sucks, you get spacial nautilusDec 22 06:50
oiaohmKDE 4.0 was hell.Dec 22 06:50
oiaohmLater ones are just getting better and better.Dec 22 06:51
ziggyfish_Ender2070: it was very easy with ubuntu to set up more than one monitorDec 22 06:51
Ender2070gnome is obsoleteDec 22 06:51
DaemonFCGNOME is falling apartDec 22 06:51
ziggyfish_yesDec 22 06:51
oiaohmI wish gcc 4.5 would get out.Dec 22 06:51
Ender2070hehDec 22 06:52
Ender2070whats new in gcc 4.5Dec 22 06:52
Ender2070i've been excited about Qt 4.6 myselfDec 22 06:52
DaemonFCprobably breaks more stuffDec 22 06:52
oiaohmLink time optimisation option Ender2070Dec 22 06:52
Ender207030% speed boosts in old codeDec 22 06:52
oiaohmThat also means gcc can find even more hidden bugs.Dec 22 06:53
Ender2070yayDec 22 06:53
ziggyfish_gcc 4.4 was the first to have auto-parallelization, I hope that will be improved in 4.5Dec 22 06:53
Ender2070auto-parallelization?Dec 22 06:53
oiaohmLink time optimisation helps with that ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:53
Ender2070sounds like uses more cores if available or am I totally wrong?Dec 22 06:54
oiaohmBeing locked inside single object files kinda limited it effectiveness ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:54
oiaohmEnder2070: yep you are rightDec 22 06:54
ziggyfish_Ender2070: GraphiteDec 22 06:54
Ender2070how is it different than -j5 ?Dec 22 06:54
ziggyfish_Ender2070: you mean 'make -j5'?Dec 22 06:55
Ender2070yesDec 22 06:55
Ender2070does it achieve the same goal?Dec 22 06:55
oiaohmEnder2070: Not really this is talking about applicaitons automatically using more cores if they are there.Dec 22 06:56
oiaohmIe the final built program.Dec 22 06:56
Ender2070ohhhhhhDec 22 06:56
DaemonFChmmmmDec 22 06:56
Ender2070not just during compilationDec 22 06:56
DaemonFCWine now supports the DRM in Left4Dead 2Dec 22 06:56
Ender2070badassDec 22 06:56
oiaohmcompliation most likely still be slow Ender2070Dec 22 06:57
ziggyfish_kind of, but at the code level (in other words, if you have a loop than GCC will run each loop in seperate threads)Dec 22 06:57
Ender2070interesting developmentDec 22 06:57
Ender2070i haven't really followed gccDec 22 06:57
oiaohmRemember most optimisations in gcc don't work correctly for most programs.Dec 22 06:58
ziggyfish_but the problem is, it's very limited ATMDec 22 06:58
oiaohmDue to the fact of the program is linked objectsDec 22 06:58
oiaohmAnd the linker does not optimise.Dec 22 06:58
oiaohmLink time optimiser changes lot of things in ways most of us cannot dream.Dec 22 06:58
ziggyfish_it only works if each loop can run in any order Dec 22 06:59
oiaohmGcc can only work that out ziggyfish_ if it can see all the code contained in loop.Dec 22 06:59
Ender2070it should improve over the long term correct?Dec 22 06:59
ziggyfish_yeahDec 22 06:59
oiaohmGuess where the lack of link time opt was killing that ziggyfish_Dec 22 06:59
Ender2070as more developers make use of itDec 22 06:59
oiaohmThen we have the perf and timetool in 2.6.33Dec 22 07:00
Ender2070Qt 4.6 boosted scripting speed by 30% for old code, and boasts more when making use of all the new featuresDec 22 07:00
oiaohmtimetool allows locating performance issues.Dec 22 07:00
Ender2070KDE 4.4 + Qt 4.6 is going to be amazingDec 22 07:00
oiaohmMost likely not perfect Ender2070Dec 22 07:01
oiaohmTimetool on that might be able to find more.Dec 22 07:01
*yuhong (n=chatzill@pool-96-253-143-208.sttlwa.dsl-w.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 07:01
Ender2070yesDec 22 07:01
Ender2070just as powertop helped reduce power usageDec 22 07:01
oiaohmEverything is going forwards.Dec 22 07:02
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/21/people-digital-profiles-mail/comment-page-1/#comment-76978Dec 22 07:02
phIRCe-localTitle: Google and Microsoft Fight Over Data and Contracts | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 121.55 KBDec 22 07:02
ziggyfish_oiaohm: Timetool = URL????Dec 22 07:03
oiaohmOpp name wrong.Dec 22 07:04
oiaohmTimechartDec 22 07:04
oiaohmhttp://blog.fenrus.org/?p=5Dec 22 07:04
DaemonFCWine 1.1.35 looks like it has some good fixesDec 22 07:04
phIRCe-localTitle: Introducing timechart «  Arjan van de Ven's blog .::. Size~: 56.35 KBDec 22 07:04
oiaohmIts in the tools directory of 2.6.33 kernel ziggyfish_Dec 22 07:04
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Detective Superintendent Swindle, an unfortunate name for someone in that position http://tinyurl.com/yk5n7smDec 22 07:04
phIRCe-localTitle: BBC News - Killer Tobin used prostitutes and aliases .::. Size~: 51.78 KBDec 22 07:04
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Priest thinks man made laws don't apply to them - Not exactly news is it? http://tinyurl.com/ydlh2bhDec 22 07:05
phIRCe-localTitle: BBC News - 'Thou shalt shoplift' says priest .::. Size~: 48.8 KBDec 22 07:05
ziggyfish_oiaohm: looks interestingDec 22 07:05
yuhonghttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/21/people-digital-profiles-mail/comment-page-1/#comment-76978Dec 22 07:06
phIRCe-localTitle: Google and Microsoft Fight Over Data and Contracts | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 121.55 KBDec 22 07:06
ziggyfish_can someone tell me if the fedora website is down?Dec 22 07:10
ziggyfish_I can't seem to get to itDec 22 07:10
Ender2070http://fedoraproject.org/Dec 22 07:10
phIRCe-localTitle: Fedora Project .::. Size~: 5.42 KBDec 22 07:10
Ender2070works for meDec 22 07:10
Ender2070I got rawhide in kvm right nowDec 22 07:11
Ender2070KDE 4.4 beta 2 is sweet (4.3.85)Dec 22 07:11
*ThistleWeb (n=gordon@unaffiliated/thistleweb) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 07:12
*ziggyfish_ now downloading fedora 11Dec 22 07:16
Ender2070<Trompete> You should configure GCC's (or whatever) warning mode to be compatible with Visual Studio 2008 express.Dec 22 07:24
Diablo-D3AAHAAHAHHAHAHAHDec 22 07:25
Ender2070<ICeDX> You mean force c++95 compliance?Dec 22 07:25
ziggyfish_shouldn't it be the otherway aroundDec 22 07:25
Ender2070<ICeDX> Sun's compiler is just as old, I can use it instead perhaps.Dec 22 07:25
Ender2070LOLDec 22 07:26
ziggyfish_VS 2008 should be configured to be compatible with GCCDec 22 07:26
Ender2070correctDec 22 07:26
Ender2070windows devs, lolDec 22 07:26
Ender2070<Tompete> In my experience, it only annoys you to have those warnings turned on. Whoop dee doo. It caught that I did another anonymous cast or that I put an unsigned long in a unsigned short. Dec 22 07:28
Ender2070buffer overflow?Dec 22 07:29
ziggyfish_Ender2070: isn't that what lint is for?Dec 22 07:29
*yuhong has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.85 [Firefox 3.5.5/20091028153816]")Dec 22 07:29
Ender2070they didn't know what valgrind didDec 22 07:29
Ender2070lint would just confuse themDec 22 07:31
ziggyfish_lol, trueDec 22 07:31
*Omar87 has quit (Remote closed the connection)Dec 22 07:31
Ender2070"I put an unsigned long in a unsigned short. "Dec 22 07:32
Ender2070doesnt that cause overflow?Dec 22 07:32
ziggyfish_yes, but not a buffer overflowDec 22 07:32
ziggyfish_it's called an integer overflowDec 22 07:33
Ender2070scaryDec 22 07:33
Ender2070no wonder the game has such odd bugsDec 22 07:33
Ender2070i fixed like 50 of them just to get past gcc errorsDec 22 07:33
Diablo-D3Ender2070: speaking of whichDec 22 07:33
Diablo-D3some dude is trying to port valgrind to windowsDec 22 07:34
Ender2070i knowDec 22 07:34
ziggyfish_which can some times cause a buffer overflowDec 22 07:34
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Using !Xfce 4 on my !Debian using #Powerbook, rejecting #Gnome + #Mono http://ur1.ca/icveDec 22 07:34
phIRCe-localTitle:   Using Xfce4 on my Debian-using Powerbook, rejecting Gnome+Mono » Ad Terras Per Aspera .::. Size~: 16.56 KBDec 22 07:34
Ender2070the game already requires something along the lines of a button that resyncs, cause there is a lot of data lossDec 22 07:34
ziggyfish_http://valgrind.org/downloads/current.html Dec 22 07:35
DaemonFChmmm, Canonical is closing the US storeDec 22 07:35
ziggyfish_valgrind 3.5.0 (tar.bz2) [5482Kb] - 19 Aug 2009.Dec 22 07:35
ziggyfish_For {x86,amd64,ppc32,ppc64}-linux and x86-Darwin (Mac OS X).Dec 22 07:35
ziggyfish_md5: f03522a4687cf76c676c9494fcc0a517Dec 22 07:35
phIRCe-localTitle: Valgrind: Current Releases .::. Size~: 6.62 KBDec 22 07:35
DaemonFCbut they say they'll just convert whatever you buy from their main store into US Dollars from now onDec 22 07:36
Ender2070I can't even get a headless gameserver built to run it through valgrindDec 22 07:36
Diablo-D3hehDec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3Im clearly not a programmer, Ender2070 Dec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3you know why?Dec 22 07:37
Ender2070stardock messed up the code badlyDec 22 07:37
Ender2070im not eitherDec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3ask why damnitDec 22 07:37
ziggyfish_yDec 22 07:37
Ender2070i was fixing stuff I learned in chapter 1 of my c++ book, lolDec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3because I use valgrind a lot.Dec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3My code, essentially, is bug free.Dec 22 07:37
Diablo-D3well, in the useful sense of bug free anywaysDec 22 07:38
Ender2070:)Dec 22 07:38
ziggyfish_lol, doesn't bug = feature?Dec 22 07:38
Ender2070I think I might run this game throug sun's compilerDec 22 07:38
Diablo-D3ziggyfish_: no noDec 22 07:39
Diablo-D3if it does it onceDec 22 07:39
Ender2070I got an opensolaris disk kicking aroundDec 22 07:39
Diablo-D3its a bugDec 22 07:39
Diablo-D3if it does it twice its a featureDec 22 07:39
ziggyfish_lolDec 22 07:39
Diablo-D3if it does it more than twice is a design philosophyDec 22 07:39
Diablo-D3I have coined a new insultDec 22 07:42
Diablo-D3Homognome.Dec 22 07:42
Ender2070?Dec 22 07:44
Diablo-D3Homo GnomeDec 22 07:46
Diablo-D3Homognome.Dec 22 07:46
Ender2070yeahDec 22 07:48
Ender2070lolDec 22 07:48
*wolfy (n=lonewolf@fedora/wolfy) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 08:13
*wolfy (n=lonewolf@fedora/wolfy) has left #boycottnovell ("Culmea lenei este sa te scoli la sase dimineata ca sa ai mai mult timp de stat degeaba. (Tristan Bernard)")Dec 22 08:14
*ziggyfish_ installing fedora in VMDec 22 08:24
oiaohmhttp://lwn.net/Articles/363575/  Nice feature in up comming 2.6.33 kernelDec 22 08:33
phIRCe-localTitle: Snapshot merge for the device mapper [LWN.net] .::. Size~: 11.27 KBDec 22 08:33
ziggyfish_niceDec 22 08:34
Ender2070you noticed kvm is supported by fedora?Dec 22 08:35
Ender2070im used to having to install virtualbox drivers but kvm seems fasterDec 22 08:35
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Gay unicorn. Just, gay unicorn. http://i.imgur.com/doyvE.jpg HT @picturecoolDec 22 08:35
phIRCe-localTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBDec 22 08:35
ziggyfish_Ender2070: I've never used KVM.Dec 22 08:37
*sebsebseb has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))Dec 22 08:42
*oiaohm has quit (Remote closed the connection)Dec 22 08:48
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] I've finally figured out MS's view of the law in a nutshell "laws are to be used against others, sometimes at our instigation" :-XDec 22 08:52
DaemonFCI feel like drinking some sizzurp and passing out for the dayDec 22 09:12
ziggyfish_brbDec 22 09:18
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Noticing two attempted downloads of S02E20 of @uupc . Some people are keen :)Dec 22 09:18
*ziggyfish_ has quit (Remote closed the connection)Dec 22 09:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] it would be typical MS to change the background colour of the BSOD to say green, then say they've fixed it, rather than actually fixing it.Dec 22 09:31
*ziggyfish_ (n=ziggyfis@123-243-163-103.static.tpgi.com.au) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 09:37
ziggyfish_backDec 22 09:37
schestowitzhttp://twitter.com/codingfreak/statuses/6917145139Dec 22 09:40
phIRCe-localTitle: Twitter / codingfreak: "boycott novell" is really ... .::. Size~: 9.89 KBDec 22 09:40
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] I wonder if the ACTA site has a "nothing to see here, move along" message with an unauthorised image of a Monopoly jailer.Dec 22 09:48
DaemonFCI've seen Vista crash several timesDec 22 09:48
DaemonFCwhat really bothered me about it was how sluggish it was compared with XPDec 22 09:49
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] it sends the message that A:it's all a game. B:you're going to jail & C:the rich always win.Dec 22 09:49
DaemonFCI've actually managed to get Ubuntu to drop me to the terminal while trying to install video drivers on more than one occasionDec 22 09:49
DaemonFCschestowitz, Did you see those declassified Russian documents?Dec 22 09:51
DaemonFCThey revealed that the UK and France were trying to stop German reuinificationDec 22 09:52
*jono (n=jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 09:52
ziggyfish_DaemonFC:, you can press <ctrl><alt>F1-F6 to get you to a terminalDec 22 09:57
ziggyfish_and to switch back it's <alt>F7Dec 22 09:57
DaemonFCwell, not on FedoraDec 22 09:58
DaemonFCFedora has X using tty1Dec 22 09:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] oh, xmarks lets you save to your own server instead of theirsDec 22 09:58
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: I'm installing Fedora now, will find out the KDE equivalent  Dec 22 09:59
DaemonFCziggyfish_, use Alt+F1 on FedoraDec 22 10:00
DaemonFCto get backDec 22 10:00
Diablo-D3....Dec 22 10:02
Diablo-D3ThistleWeb: wtf dudeDec 22 10:02
Diablo-D3EVERYONE PLEASEDec 22 10:02
Diablo-D3STOP TRYING TO BE LIKE MEDec 22 10:02
MinceRDiablo-D3: please stop trying to be like the way you are nowDec 22 10:03
ThistleWebDiablo-D3: what are you blabbering about?Dec 22 10:03
ziggyfish_lolDec 22 10:03
*Diablo-D3 was the first person here to use foxmarks damnitDec 22 10:03
ThistleWebyeah, I'm sure it was built with one client in mindDec 22 10:03
ThistleWebnot to be used by anyone elseDec 22 10:03
ThistleWebfeel free to point me to the eula part with those conditionsDec 22 10:04
ThistleWebor the fact that the download link was mysteriously working to let me install itDec 22 10:04
Diablo-D3its below the line that says "If you're the first to read this, email us for your $500 prize"Dec 22 10:04
Diablo-D3afaik no one has collected itDec 22 10:04
ThistleWebit should have been disabled after you installed yours after allDec 22 10:04
tessierhttp://www.betanews.com/joewilcox/article/10-things-Microsoft-did-wrong-in-2009/1261424173Dec 22 10:04
phIRCe-localTitle: 10 things Microsoft did wrong in 2009 | Betanews .::. Size~: 53.35 KBDec 22 10:05
ThistleWebthen congrats on your $500Dec 22 10:05
Diablo-D3tessier: only ten?Dec 22 10:05
tessierThe top 10Dec 22 10:05
Diablo-D3it must have taken them a lot of time just to chose tenDec 22 10:05
tessierHe says he easily could have listed 20Dec 22 10:05
tessierYepDec 22 10:05
Diablo-D320? shit dudeDec 22 10:05
ThistleWebsheesh, I got an Apple logo flashing in front of my eyes for a min there, with the rabid elitism rantDec 22 10:05
Diablo-D3at leats 1000Dec 22 10:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #XServer 1.8 is Coming, Other #Graphics Stack Additions to #Linux http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzgyNwDec 22 10:06
phIRCe-localTitle: [Phoronix] X Server 1.8 Snapshot 2 Released .::. Size~: 16.17 KBDec 22 10:06
ThistleWebI'm guessing you'll be switching to Haiku now that peeps are using Linux, for fear that they all copied youDec 22 10:07
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE 4.4 Reaches Beta 2 and Qt Starts Targeting the Web http://ur1.ca/id0l http://ur1.ca/id0mDec 22 10:08
phIRCe-localTitle: KDE - Software Compilation 4.4 Beta 2 Release Announcement .::. Size~: 17.35 KBDec 22 10:08
phIRCe-localTitle: Qt applications in your browser - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 32.34 KBDec 22 10:08
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #PartedMagic 4.7 is Released, with #Chrome Rather Than #Firefox http://ur1.ca/id0pDec 22 10:09
phIRCe-localTitle: Parted Magic 4.7 with Google Chrome - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 33.63 KBDec 22 10:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Zimbabwe Uses #Ubuntu #GNU #Linux in Large Lab of 87 Computer Aid Computers http://ur1.ca/id0r #humanityforothersDec 22 10:10
DaemonFCare there KDE 4.4 beta packages in a Kubuntu PPA?Dec 22 10:10
*DaemonFC looksDec 22 10:11
DaemonFChttp://www.kubuntu.org/newsDec 22 10:11
phIRCe-localTitle: News | Kubuntu .::. Size~: 19.47 KBDec 22 10:11
DaemonFCthey have Beta 1 packagesDec 22 10:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #MontaVista Still Releases #FreeSoftware Apart from #Linux http://ur1.ca/id0vDec 22 10:12
phIRCe-localTitle: MontaVista integrates multi-core analysis plugin - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 62.85 KBDec 22 10:12
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: interestingDec 22 10:14
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Two New Reviews of #Jolicloud on Sub-notebooks http://ur1.ca/id0w http://ur1.ca/id0xDec 22 10:14
phIRCe-localTitle: Jolicloud thoughts | Linux User .::. Size~: 29.75 KBDec 22 10:14
DaemonFCziggyfish_, What keeps me on GNOME is that they finally have MSN voice and video chat supportDec 22 10:15
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Dell Improves Its #GNU #Linux-powered Sub-notebooks with #Pineview http://ur1.ca/id0zDec 22 10:15
phIRCe-localTitle: Dell netbook updated with Pineview CPU - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 62.67 KBDec 22 10:15
DaemonFCI know I could use Empathy on KDE, but what stops me is the thought I'll end up with all kinds of dependenciesDec 22 10:16
ziggyfish_yes, that's the reason I'm still on GNOME, I use a lot of GTK appsDec 22 10:16
DaemonFCKDE no doubt looks and feels cooler, but pretty much all the apps I use integrate with GNOME betterDec 22 10:17
ziggyfish_Evolution is the only one to support MAPI to an extentDec 22 10:17
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IBM Brings #GNU #Linux to #Tunisia , Erwin Claims #FOSS at #SAP http://ur1.ca/id11 http://ur1.ca/id12Dec 22 10:17
phIRCe-localTitle: SAP Community Network Blogs .::. Size~: 22.52 KBDec 22 10:17
DaemonFCziggyfish_, Thunderbird does to some extent I believeDec 22 10:18
Diablo-D3http://i.imgur.com/pG3q7.jpgDec 22 10:19
phIRCe-localTitle: Not a web page! Aborting image/jpeg type .::. Size~: 0 KBDec 22 10:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Examples of Popular #FreeSoftware Projects That Receive Little Attention http://ur1.ca/id17Dec 22 10:19
phIRCe-localTitle: 8 Free, Offbeat Open-source Social Tools   GigaOM .::. Size~: 67.97 KBDec 22 10:19
ziggyfish_no, Exchange does have the ability to use smtp. which is what thunderbird supportsDec 22 10:20
ziggyfish_but you can not use the MAPI protocol in thunderbirdDec 22 10:20
ziggyfish_thunderbird also supports IMAPDec 22 10:21
DaemonFCI hate Evolution, it's like driving a tank when all you want is to use your emailDec 22 10:21
DaemonFC:PDec 22 10:21
DaemonFCI know it's meant for users that need a lot more features than I need thoughDec 22 10:22
ziggyfish_yes I agree, however, the place I work at uses an Exchange serverDec 22 10:22
DaemonFChttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Claws_MailDec 22 10:23
phIRCe-localTitle: Claws Mail - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 57.29 KBDec 22 10:23
DaemonFCI use ClawsDec 22 10:23
ziggyfish_niceDec 22 10:24
MinceRat least that tank does search folders with less bugs than othersDec 22 10:25
MinceR(it's still horribly buggy though)Dec 22 10:25
*ziggyfish_ totally agreesDec 22 10:25
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #openQRM is Alive and Well http://virtualization.com/guest-posts/2009/12/15/openqrm-lives-on/Dec 22 10:26
phIRCe-localTitle:    openQRM Lives On  : Virtualization.com .::. Size~: 566.54 KBDec 22 10:26
ziggyfish_the one feature I would love to see in evolution is folder retention (the ability for evolution to delete messages older than a specified age) Dec 22 10:28
ziggyfish_thunderbird has itDec 22 10:28
*MinceR doesn't delete messages :)Dec 22 10:28
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] German Stock Exchange Moves to Adopt More #FreeSoftware http://ur1.ca/id1dDec 22 10:28
phIRCe-localTitle: OTRS AG to float on German stock exchange - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 32.05 KBDec 22 10:28
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Christmas-Themed #GNU #Linux Advocacy http://ur1.ca/id1f http://ur1.ca/id1gDec 22 10:29
phIRCe-localTitle: Tux's Christmas Carol   | Sirius Corporation plc .::. Size~: 29.34 KBDec 22 10:29
ziggyfish_MinceR: I use it for things like mailing listsDec 22 10:30
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Mozilla 's Browser Becomes Most Popular http://ur1.ca/id1h http://ur1.ca/icfaDec 22 10:30
*Diablo-D3 has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Dec 22 10:31
ziggyfish_when I am only going to read the message maybe once and it is only relevent for like on month Dec 22 10:31
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Upcoming Free/Libre #CMS Software Listed, #BitNami Grows http://ur1.ca/id1l http://ur1.ca/id1nDec 22 10:31
*Diablo-D3 (n=diablo@64.223.238.130) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 10:31
phIRCe-localTitle: Alert: What's Coming In Open Source CMS In 2010 .::. Size~: 89.41 KBDec 22 10:31
phIRCe-localTitle:  BitNami Adds New Stacks to List of Pre-Rolled Open Source Software Deployments  .::. Size~: 33.66 KBDec 22 10:31
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FSF / #GNU Gets Mainstream Press Coverage http://thephoenix.com/Portland/News/94550-Tilting-at-Windows/?page=1#TOPCONTENT seems balancedDec 22 10:32
DaemonFCschestowitz, Those stats are wrong thoughDec 22 10:33
DaemonFCit counts IE 6, 7, and 8 as different browsersDec 22 10:33
DaemonFCbut pools all versions of Firefox as the same browserDec 22 10:34
ziggyfish_schestowitz I like that image at the top of that last linkDec 22 10:34
MinceRthey aren't wrong as long as you keep in mind what they're aboutDec 22 10:34
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Versions of #OpenNebula and #Collectd are Released http://ur1.ca/id1r http://ur1.ca/id1sDec 22 10:34
phIRCe-localTitle: .:: OpenNebula: The Open Source Toolkit for Cloud Computing ::. .::. Size~: 8.19 KBDec 22 10:34
MinceRand read them correctlyDec 22 10:34
phIRCe-localTitle: Collectd 4.9 system statistics collection daemon released - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 33.02 KBDec 22 10:34
MinceRmajor browser versions matter to web developers, for exampleDec 22 10:35
DaemonFCif you count Firefox 1, 2, and 3 as different browsers, IE 6 is the most used browser in the worldDec 22 10:35
MinceRapparently you haven't bothered to read the stats, thenDec 22 10:35
DaemonFCdepends on where your stats are fromDec 22 10:35
*ziggyfish_ have spent hours trying to get sites to work with IE 6Dec 22 10:35
MinceRoh, you get yours from Net Applications, don't you?Dec 22 10:36
DaemonFCw3schools or whatever it was always grossly exagerates FirefoxDec 22 10:36
MinceRexcept it wasn't w3schoolsDec 22 10:36
DaemonFCMinceR, All stat companies are usually within a few points of one anotherDec 22 10:36
DaemonFCw3schools is the only outlierDec 22 10:37
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Open #Standards Mandatory in Hungary, #Google Adds New Ones http://ur1.ca/id26 http://ur1.ca/id27Dec 22 10:37
phIRCe-localTitle: Hungary mandates open standards • The Register .::. Size~: 26.4 KBDec 22 10:37
phIRCe-localTitle: Google Races to Speed up the Web - PC World Business Center .::. Size~: 67.75 KBDec 22 10:37
MinceRDaemonFC: http://gs.statcounter.com/#browser_version-ww-weekly-200827-200951Dec 22 10:38
phIRCe-localTitle: StatCounter Global Stats - Browser, OS, Search Engine including Mobile Market Share .::. Size~: 10.33 KBDec 22 10:38
MinceRthat isn't w3schoolsDec 22 10:38
ziggyfish_I've never noticed, but fedora looks good from an art point of viewDec 22 10:38
MinceRand it doesn't show IE 6 as the "browser" (i'm applying the term loosely here) version with the highest market shareDec 22 10:38
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Wikileaks Need Support to Defend Civil Rights http://davidgerard.co.uk/notes/2009/12/21/wikileaks-is-in-trouble/Dec 22 10:38
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Australia Attacks Its Citizens with @Wikileaks -leaked #Filters http://ur1.ca/id29 http://ur1.ca/id2a #freespeechDec 22 10:38
phIRCe-localTitle: David Gerard  » Blog Archive   » Wikileaks is in trouble. .::. Size~: 12.82 KBDec 22 10:38
phIRCe-localTitle: Australian Domain Authority Circumvents Standard Process To Shut Down Site Critical Of Australian Internet Filters | Techdirt .::. Size~: 61.96 KBDec 22 10:38
phIRCe-localTitle: Oz anti-censorship site is censored • The Register .::. Size~: 26.53 KBDec 22 10:38
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DaemonFChttp://gs.statcounter.com/#browser-ww-weekly-200827-200951Dec 22 10:39
phIRCe-localTitle: StatCounter Global Stats - Browser, OS, Search Engine including Mobile Market Share .::. Size~: 10.33 KBDec 22 10:39
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DaemonFCthere's your real statsDec 22 10:39
DaemonFCit also appears to overestimate FirefoxDec 22 10:40
MinceRi'll repeat it for your own sake, as you seem to have difficulties at reading comprehensionDec 22 10:40
MinceR112821 < MinceR> they aren't wrong as long as you keep in mind what they're aboutDec 22 10:40
MinceReverybody "overestimates" firefox in comparison to net applicationsDec 22 10:41
MinceRi wonder whyDec 22 10:41
ziggyfish_it would be good to see the numbers rather than the percentages, also the source(s) of dataDec 22 10:43
DaemonFChttp://gs.statcounter.com/#os-ww-weekly-200827-200951Dec 22 10:44
phIRCe-localTitle: StatCounter Global Stats - Browser, OS, Search Engine including Mobile Market Share .::. Size~: 10.33 KBDec 22 10:44
DaemonFCLinux falls into the "other" pile?Dec 22 10:44
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IntellectualMonopolists Do Not Know How to Evolve http://techdirt.com/articles/20091114/1824226931.shtmlDec 22 10:44
phIRCe-localTitle: Why The Record Labels Are Still Confused: The Difference Between Transformative And Incremental Change | Techdirt .::. Size~: 121.98 KBDec 22 10:44
Ender2070[05:29] * ziggyfish_ have spent hours trying to get sites to work with IE 6Dec 22 10:44
Ender2070i spent minutes putting netscape buttons upDec 22 10:45
MinceRlolDec 22 10:45
DaemonFCjust tell people using IE 6 to go awayDec 22 10:45
MinceRDaemonFC: if you switch to Bar mode, you can see that the "\"other\" pile" is bigger than vista7Dec 22 10:46
MinceRbut never mind :>Dec 22 10:46
MinceRask them why they categorize OSes that wayDec 22 10:46
ziggyfish_I would to, unfortunately, it was a site for CBADec 22 10:46
Ender2070people using IE 6 need to retire from computersDec 22 10:46
MinceR(it's also bigger than win2k)Dec 22 10:46
MinceRCBA?Dec 22 10:46
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Olympic Games Still an Attack on #FreeSpeech and Expression http://techdirt.com/articles/20091220/2321187440.shtml #olympicfailDec 22 10:46
phIRCe-localTitle: Vancouver Olympics Demands All Copyrights And Royalties From Musician Just To Hear Her Song | Techdirt .::. Size~: 59.03 KBDec 22 10:46
ziggyfish_commonwealth bank of australiaDec 22 10:46
MinceRpeople using winblows need to learn how to use computersDec 22 10:47
MinceRalso, people using ie6 for online banking are stupid and don't deserve to do online bankingDec 22 10:47
DaemonFCLinux is 0.7%Dec 22 10:47
Ender2070people doing that might as well be giving you their pinDec 22 10:47
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #VillagePeople Claim to 'Own' Jamie Oliver Advert http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2009/dec/18/village-people-jamie-oliver-trailer lame!Dec 22 10:47
DaemonFCaccording to themDec 22 10:47
ziggyfish_trueDec 22 10:47
Ender2070windows cause global warmingDec 22 10:48
ziggyfish_DaemonFC: I prefer this stat http://boycottnovell.com/2009/08/03/net-applications-flip-flop/Dec 22 10:49
phIRCe-localTitle: Net Applications Finally Shows Its Just a Joke: Mac ‘Market Share’ Halved Overnight! | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 128.12 KBDec 22 10:49
ziggyfish_According to statistics from the Boycott Novell domain, it is approximately 40%. HonestDec 22 10:49
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #UK to Use #IntellectualMonopolies to Further Retard Research and Development http://ur1.ca/id2o #patentsDec 22 10:49
phIRCe-localTitle: UK Looks To Lower Taxes On Patents; Encouraging More Patents But Less Actual Innovation | Techdirt .::. Size~: 41.71 KBDec 22 10:49
MinceR114131 < DaemonFC> Linux is 0.7%Dec 22 10:50
MinceR[[citation needed]]Dec 22 10:50
Ender2070look at thisDec 22 10:50
Ender2070http://developers.slashdot.org/story/09/12/20/1433257/The-Environmental-Impact-of-PHP-Compared-To-C-On-FacebookDec 22 10:50
phIRCe-localTitle: Slashdot Developers Story | The Environmental Impact of PHP Compared To C++ On Facebook .::. Size~: 189.55 KBDec 22 10:50
Ender2070this is just the different from php to c++Dec 22 10:50
Ender2070imagine the environmental impact of windows to linuxDec 22 10:50
DaemonFChttp://gs.statcounter.com/#os-ww-weekly-200950-200951Dec 22 10:51
ziggyfish_Evolution is to gnome, ??? is to KDE?Dec 22 10:51
phIRCe-localTitle: StatCounter Global Stats - Browser, OS, Search Engine including Mobile Market Share .::. Size~: 10.33 KBDec 22 10:51
Ender2070vista uses a thousand megs of ram just to boot upDec 22 10:51
MinceRziggyfish_: KMailDec 22 10:51
MinceRor perhaps officially it's KontactDec 22 10:52
MinceR(it's a better match to what Evolution does anyway)Dec 22 10:52
ziggyfish_I'll give KMail a goDec 22 10:53
Ender2070KMail is awesomeDec 22 10:53
Ender2070and its not programmed by reptilians!Dec 22 10:53
schestowitzEnder2070: I didn't know about http://socialitelife.celebuzz.com/archive/2006/02/24/the_term_r_kelly_doesnt_hold_up_too_well_in_court.phpDec 22 10:53
phIRCe-localTitle: The Term 'R. Kelly' Doesn't Hold Up Too Well In Court - Socialite Life .::. Size~: 105.43 KBDec 22 10:53
MinceRi don't like kmail that much due to the way it handles non-writable shared folders and search foldersDec 22 10:54
MinceRi used to use itDec 22 10:54
Ender2070lol r kellyDec 22 10:55
Ender2070mincer, do you have cold blood?Dec 22 10:55
Ender2070just wonderingDec 22 10:56
Ender2070...Dec 22 10:56
MinceRwhat's that?Dec 22 10:56
MinceRif you mean lack of internal regulation of body temperature, then no, i don't have itDec 22 10:57
Ender2070just checkingDec 22 10:57
MinceRwhy?Dec 22 10:57
Ender2070making sure, you're not reptilianDec 22 10:57
MinceRwhat are you trying to say anyway?Dec 22 10:58
Ender2070are you a reptilian alien?Dec 22 10:58
MinceRwhat gives you that idea?Dec 22 10:58
Ender2070David Icke told meDec 22 10:59
schestowitz*LOL*Dec 22 10:59
MinceRwho's David Icke?Dec 22 10:59
schestowitzSome nutter who's more extreme than JonesDec 22 10:59
Ender2070http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_IckeDec 22 10:59
phIRCe-localTitle: David Icke - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 155.07 KBDec 22 10:59
schestowitzFrom Isle of Man, IIRCDec 22 10:59
Ender2070oo, same as Mark ShuttleworthDec 22 10:59
schestowitzMinceR: are you in Skulls and Blobs?Dec 22 10:59
Ender2070cooincidence?Dec 22 11:00
MinceRschestowitz: nopeDec 22 11:00
MinceRdo i look like i'm ruling the world? :>Dec 22 11:00
schestowitzAh, OKDec 22 11:00
schestowitzI worriedDec 22 11:00
schestowitzcause Bill and Steve are in it. They sleep in coffins made of a large VIsta 7 box :-)Dec 22 11:00
MinceRwhat's Skulls and Blobs?Dec 22 11:01
schestowitzJokeDec 22 11:01
schestowitzMaking fun of the whole Icke thingDec 22 11:01
MinceRi don't get your jokesDec 22 11:01
schestowitzAlthough Bush did publicly admit being a member of Skull and BonesDec 22 11:01
Ender2070He identifies the Brotherhood as originating from reptilians from the constellation Draco, who walk on two legs and appear human, and who live in tunnels and caverns inside the earth.Dec 22 11:01
ziggyfish_http://www.ulteo.com/home/en/news/2009/11/25 - Ulteo introduces open source virtual desktop OVD 2.0. This new release delivers both Linux and/or Windows applications as complete virtual desktops – and also via web portal.Dec 22 11:01
schestowitzIt's captured in video :-)Dec 22 11:01
phIRCe-localTitle: Ulteo introduces open source virtual desktop OVD 2.0. This new release delivers both Linux and/or Windows applications as complete virtual desktops – and also via web portal. - Ulteo - Enterprise Open Source VDI and Application Delivery solutions (SBC), Enterprise Open Source Virtual Desktop solutions .::. Size~: 15.75 KBDec 22 11:01
schestowitzEnder2070: LOLDec 22 11:01
Ender2070They are the same race of gods known as the Anunnaki  in the Babylonian creation myth, Enûma Eliš.Dec 22 11:02
Ender2070Icke argues that the Anunnaki came specifically for "monoatomic gold," a mineral he says can increase the carrying capacity of the nervous system ten thousand fold. After ingesting it, the Anunnaki are able to process vast amounts of information, speed up trans-dimensional travel, and shapeshift from reptilian to human form. They use human fear, guilt, and aggression as energy in a similar way, part of the reason they Dec 22 11:02
Ender2070organize human conflict.[43]  The more negative emotion we emit, the more the reptilians absorbDec 22 11:02
Ender2070"shapeshift from reptilian to human form" omgzDec 22 11:03
MinceRi think the term he's looking for is "the spice Melange"Dec 22 11:03
MinceRhm, maybe i'm confusing it with Sapho juiceDec 22 11:03
schestowitzEnder2070: yes, it's all true !!Dec 22 11:04
schestowitzWe're made in MarsDec 22 11:04
schestowitzAnd they still come and visit sometimes... just to do sexual experiments on us and return us home by 9 :-)Dec 22 11:05
Ender2070The reptilians not only come from another planet, but are also from another dimension, the lower level of the fourth dimension, the one nearest the physical world.Dec 22 11:05
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Ender2070They also set the price of gold every tuesday.Dec 22 11:07
Ender2070That's why MS does patches, so everyone is distracted.Dec 22 11:07
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MinceRlolDec 22 11:08
schestowitzEnder2070: just 4th dimensions? Pffffffftttt.Dec 22 11:08
schestowitzThere are 11... according to String TheoryDec 22 11:08
schestowitzSOme say 10Dec 22 11:08
schestowitzTHey are still trying to agree ;)Dec 22 11:09
schestowitzNot that they can point at the 6th, or 7th, or 8th...Dec 22 11:09
Ender2070I would tend to go with the many worlds theory.Dec 22 11:09
schestowitzWe have ten fingers, so there must be 10 dimensionsDec 22 11:09
MinceRi've only heard of 10Dec 22 11:09
schestowitzAnd the decimal system is made as a rule of God, just like having one meter ic system makes sense.Dec 22 11:10
schestowitzBTWDec 22 11:10
Ender2070http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretationDec 22 11:10
phIRCe-localTitle: Many-worlds interpretation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 152.88 KBDec 22 11:10
schestowitzWe could use speed or light as a better universal emasureDec 22 11:10
schestowitzCause it never changedDec 22 11:10
schestowitzLike the 24 hours in a dayDec 22 11:10
schestowitzWHich makes up all the meausres of timeDec 22 11:10
schestowitzWhere is meter derivs from?Dec 22 11:10
schestowitzWe could use a distance measure that takes into account unchangd units like speed of lightDec 22 11:11
schestowitzEarth's revolusion if planet-dependent, so no good there....Dec 22 11:11
schestowitzAs a lost civilisation, the rule would be hard to restoreDec 22 11:11
schestowitzMinceR: see the BBC documenatry on strong theory. Some dude from Cambridge says 11 and they are still "working on it" (same as in previous decades)Dec 22 11:12
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Ender2070hmmmmDec 22 11:19
Ender2070http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_immortality#The_quantum_suicide_thought_experimentDec 22 11:19
phIRCe-localTitle: Quantum suicide and immortality - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 46.1 KBDec 22 11:19
Ender2070wrap your head around thatDec 22 11:19
schestowitzhttp://firedoglake.com/2009/12/20/spitzer-partnoy-black-call-for-aig-open-source-investigation-and-goldman-implications/Dec 22 11:23
phIRCe-localTitle: Firedoglake  » Spitzer, Partnoy, Black Call for AIG Open Source Investigation (and Goldman Implications) .::. Size~: 82.72 KBDec 22 11:23
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] ♺ @izem4mazigh: ♺ @marcinobel: #Mono has been removed from #Fedora !Linux distribution http://bit.ly/8BIsnbDec 22 11:34
phIRCe-localTitle: Forbidden items - FedoraProject .::. Size~: 33.26 KBDec 22 11:34
schestowitzHmmmmm... YouTube's changs are very annoyingDec 22 11:38
schestowitzIt's still impossible to "sort by X"Dec 22 11:38
schestowitzThey removed these options from SERPsDec 22 11:38
schestowitzUnless it's just a GUI change with the option folded into s/t elseDec 22 11:38
*oiaohm (n=oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 11:40
Diablo-D3umDec 22 11:41
Diablo-D3I can sort by x in youtubeDec 22 11:41
Diablo-D3schestowitz: click "search options"Dec 22 11:41
*pawel_121 (n=quassel@82.177.199.102) has joined #boycottnovellDec 22 11:44
ThistleWebstop being like me, I search in youtube tooDec 22 11:45
schestowitzDiablo-D3: I see..... it's no longer a dropdown boxDec 22 11:46
schestowitzThanksDec 22 11:46
Diablo-D3schestowitz: it follows the unified google look in a wayDec 22 11:46
Diablo-D3like, theres no google search variants anymoreDec 22 11:47
Diablo-D3its all hidden behind the search options slide in panelDec 22 11:47
schestowitzhttp://www.randomreviews.placeboism.com/index.php/en/aticles/14-linux-documentation-bug-1Dec 22 11:50
schestowitzI think that Jack Wallen started this whole memeDec 22 11:50
ziggyfish_time to go to bed, c ya allDec 22 11:53
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #KDE 4.4 Feature Freeze: Christmas Special http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/feature-freeze-kde4/ short videoDec 22 11:57
phIRCe-localTitle: KDE 4.4 Feature Freeze: Christmas Special | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 104.5 KBDec 22 11:57
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] just noticed VLC's status icon has a lil Christmas hat on :-DDec 22 12:01
-BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Update: Fedora still hates open source, and has only stopped shipping Moonlight instead of all of MonoDec 22 12:09
schestowitzhttp://artipc10.vub.ac.be/wordpress/uncategorized/replacing-google.html "As default search engine, I currently switched to Ask.com. In some corner cases, it is lacking a bit compared to Google, but the majority of searches yield good results, so it is perfectly fine as default search engine for me. Be sure to enable AskEraser for a privacy level much better than what you get with Google."Dec 22 12:10
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Some people are worried about #Google #privacy ( #Mandriva dev): http://ur1.ca/id5z Why not #scroogle ?Dec 22 12:13
phIRCe-localTitle: Frederik's Blog  » Blog Archive   » Replacing Google - Random thoughts of a sysadmin  .::. Size~: 23.64 KBDec 22 12:13
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] The Best Thing We Have Ever Posted: Reader Tries To Cancel AOL - The Consumerist http://tinyurl.com/yfyv5z3Dec 22 12:32
phIRCe-localTitle: The Best Thing We Have Ever Posted: Reader Tries To Cancel AOL - The Consumerist .::. Size~: 137.47 KBDec 22 12:32
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Identi.ca is great for finding new peeps, after watching one half of am interesting convo, it peeks your interest to find the other halfDec 22 12:44
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] anyone else think the Xbox controller is the result of a 6 button MegaDrive (genesis) and Dreamcast controller mating under the TV? :-DDec 22 13:21
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Pupils 'bypassing school internet security' - WHY WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN? http://tinyurl.com/yg6grpfDec 22 13:36
phIRCe-localTitle: BBC - Newsbeat - Pupils 'bypassing school internet security' .::. Size~: 28.75 KBDec 22 13:36
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Why #GNU #Linux Makes a Perfect Gift That Proprietary Products That Cannot Match http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2357356,00.aspDec 22 14:01
phIRCe-localTitle: Give the Gift of Linux for the Holidays - Opinions by ExtremeTech .::. Size~: 60.06 KBDec 22 14:01
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Accepts Hardware About 4 Times Slower/Smaller Than #Windows http://ur1.ca/idduDec 22 14:03
phIRCe-localTitle: Ubuntu vs Windows Hardware Requirements | Prakash Advani's Blog .::. Size~: 47.48 KBDec 22 14:04
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Multitouch Displays Work with #Linux , With Even a Dozen Pointing Devices http://ur1.ca/iddwDec 22 14:04
phIRCe-localTitle:   Linux + Multitouch display = open source 10 fingered goodness .::. Size~: 22 KBDec 22 14:04
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Stars in Films Use #GNU #Linux http://mdeslaur.blogspot.com/2009/12/ubuntu-movie-sighting.htmlDec 22 14:06
phIRCe-localTitle: mdeslaur: Ubuntu movie sighting .::. Size~: 51 KBDec 22 14:06
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Top Technologies Worth Tracking in 2010 http://www.daniweb.com/news/story247912.html http://mybroadband.co.za/news/Software/10902.htmlDec 22 14:07
phIRCe-localTitle: 10 Linux-based Technologies to Look for in 2010 - Getting Started and Choosing a Distro News Story .::. Size~: 50.75 KBDec 22 14:07
phIRCe-localTitle: Kickstart 2010 with Linux .::. Size~: 38.88 KBDec 22 14:07
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Linux a Key Operating System in the Past Decade http://ur1.ca/ide6Dec 22 14:08
phIRCe-localTitle: Great and Disappointing Operating Systems of the Decade | ITworld .::. Size~: 82.83 KBDec 22 14:08
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Review of #qBittorrent and Other #GNU #Linux Applications http://ur1.ca/ideb http://ur1.ca/idec http://ur1.ca/idedDec 22 14:09
phIRCe-localTitle: Review: qBittorrent «  The Source.com .::. Size~: 24.69 KBDec 22 14:09
phIRCe-localTitle: Inkscape 0.47 Totally Solid with Lots of New Tools | Worldlabel Blog .::. Size~: 31.04 KBDec 22 14:09
phIRCe-localTitle: OMG! UBUNTU!: 12 Days of Xmas: Day Five - ViewNior .::. Size~: 83.79 KBDec 22 14:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Gentoo Derivative #Pentoo 2009.0 is Out http://pentestit.com/2009/12/21/pentoo-20090-final-ready-action/Dec 22 14:10
phIRCe-localTitle: Pentoo 2009.0 final - out and ready for action — PenTestIT .::. Size~: 36.3 KBDec 22 14:10
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Why Dell's #GNU #Linux Sub-notebooks Still Beats #Vista7 http://ur1.ca/idek MSFT cripples selfDec 22 14:11
phIRCe-localTitle: Dell introduces best Ubuntu netbook ever? - Computerworld Blogs .::. Size~: 129.31 KBDec 22 14:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Review of #LinuxMint 8 (Helena) http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,2845,2357344,00.aspDec 22 14:15
phIRCe-localTitle: Hands On with Linux Mint 8 (Helena) - OS, Software & Networking by ExtremeTech .::. Size~: 55.9 KBDec 22 14:15
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #OpenOffice .org 3.2.0 Very Close to Final Release http://ur1.ca/ides http://ur1.ca/idetDec 22 14:17
phIRCe-localTitle: New: OpenOffice.org 3.2.0 Release Candidate 1 (build OOO320_m8) available - GullFOSS .::. Size~: 57.41 KBDec 22 14:17
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Review of #SheevaPlug with #Debian #GNU #Linux Installed http://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20091221#featureDec 22 14:18
phIRCe-localTitle: DistroWatch.com: Put the fun back into computing. Use Linux, BSD. .::. Size~: 85.68 KBDec 22 14:18
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Freedom #CMS #Drupal Rules in #Belgium Where it Was Born http://buytaert.net/king-of-belgium-goes-drupalDec 22 14:19
phIRCe-localTitle: King of Belgium goes Drupal | Dries Buytaert .::. Size~: 14.95 KBDec 22 14:19
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] [News] "Open Source" Yields 203,000,000 Results in #Google http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/wanted-more-open-source-researchDec 22 14:21
phIRCe-localTitle: Wanted: More Open Source Research | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 47.73 KBDec 22 14:21
oiaohmhttp://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=NzgzMg New block of docsDec 22 14:22
phIRCe-localTitle: [Phoronix] AMD Publishes Evergreen Shader Documents .::. Size~: 16.04 KBDec 22 14:22
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] "Monster List" of Free/Open Source Software http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/osrc/article.php/3854601/Open-Source-Downloads-the-MonsterDec 22 14:22
phIRCe-localTitle: Open Source Downloads: the Monster List &mdash; Datamation.com .::. Size~: 88.99 KBDec 22 14:22
schestowitzoiaohm: did you buy AMD?Dec 22 14:45
oiaohmMy core processor is AMD my video card is still Nvidia.  But its getting old.Dec 22 14:47
oiaohmI really should update this machine its getting a little slugish for 3d work these days.Dec 22 14:48
schestowitzhttp://twitter.com/epponuman/statuses/6929104069 "WELL, WELL, WELL - Copenhagen police - just fucking kill the BASTARDS - http://bit.ly/8Zpfoj - I would boycott Denmark for life"Dec 22 14:50
phIRCe-localTitle: Twitter / Eppo Harbrink Numan: WELL, WELL, WELL - Copenha ... .::. Size~: 10.08 KBDec 22 14:50
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Police acting like bullies in Copenhagen. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6gCyklaYZ4 Pass on.Dec 22 14:52
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] More videos of Danish policemen doing their work for Big Oil corporations by battering women http://ur1.ca/idgeDec 22 14:58
amarsh04back in a few, trying new grub releaseDec 22 15:17
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schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/21/microsoft_in_the_noughties/Dec 22 15:37
phIRCe-localTitle: A decade to forget - how Microsoft lost its mojo • The Register .::. Size~: 27.77 KBDec 22 15:37
schestowitz> > Microsoft paid the price for its confidence. When the internet changed the world, it became clear that the software Microsoft had refined on the desktop and server was not suited to the new world of the online openness ..Dec 22 15:38
schestowitzYou are incorrect MS operating systems were fully designed for the Internet,Dec 22 15:38
schestowitz>> at least as far back as Windows 85. They they fail miserably is down to the defects in the product. Namely embedding the browser and email client so deeply into the core OS. ActiveX being the chief culprit.Dec 22 15:38
schestowitz> Here are posts from 1994/5, where the chief software architect discusses 'Internet Strategy' ..Dec 22 15:38
schestowitzhttp://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/122106/PLEX0_4524.pdfDec 22 15:38
phIRCe-localTitle: Not a web page! Aborting application/pdf type .::. Size~: 0 KBDec 22 15:38
schestowitzhttp://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/122106/PLEX0_2281.pdfDec 22 15:38
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schestowitz> from 1997, Preserving the desktop Paradise http://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/122106/PLEX0_2700.pdfDec 22 15:38
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schestowitz"Subject: elREG on the 'new world of online openness': "I guess they don't like the comment... notice the huge advert for MS from Mark Jonson... Get over there and sort them out...!!!! Not the first time, well, don't accuse them of censorship, you re-phrase my comment and post it..."Dec 22 15:40
schestowitzGavin Calrke fluff pieceDec 22 15:40
schestowitzMicrosoft adverts, revisionismDec 22 15:40
schestowitzMarbux is still on with his fight against ODF....... "Subject: ODF 1.2 just got derailed"Dec 22 15:43
schestowitz"<http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/200912/msg00264.html>. OASIS has overruled IBM. ODF 1.1 apparently goes to ISO/IEC first and the ODF TC hasn't even started work on ODF 1.1 to meet the JTC 1 transposition requirements. Basically, that requires a rewrite of the entire specification."Dec 22 15:44
phIRCe-localTitle: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found .::. Size~: 0 KBDec 22 15:44
schestowitz"Note the link to the revised OASIS Liaison Policy as the basis for Clark's action. If you compare that page with the same page in the Wayback Machine, you'll see a rather large movement of authority from the membership to OASIS staff, hemmed in with new mandatory criteria for OASIS standards to be sent off for international standardization."Dec 22 15:44
schestowitz"See section 3(d). ("The President shall not approve any request that does not meet the criteria listed in Sections 1 and 2.")"Dec 22 15:44
schestowitz"IMHO, a well placed and well deserved bitch slap for Rob Weir and the vendor lock-in games he's been playing with ODF. Cf., "When they eventually implement ODF they will want to implement write support ("producer" conformance) for the current version of ODF, as well as read support ("consumer" conformance) for earlier versions of ODF.""Dec 22 15:44
schestowitz"<http://www.robweir.com/blog/2009/12/relevancy-of-odf-10.html>. No write support for ODF 1.0 and 1.1? Just what was implemented in StarOffice and OOo. Forced upgrades for all. And IBM completes its transition to the OOo 3.x code base next year."Dec 22 15:44
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schestowitz"Someday, I hope you and others wake up to the fact that IBM is every bit as bad as Microsoft when it comes to open standards. Embrace, Extend, and Extinguish whilst keeping the format specs dark and mysterious enough that others can't fully interoperate. That's the story of ODF 1.0, 1.1, and 1.2 and why OpenOffice.org is so evil. <http://www.sutor.com/newsite/blog-open/?p=1260>."Dec 22 15:44
phIRCe-localTitle: Interoperability vs. intraoperability: your open choice | Blog | Bob Sutor .::. Size~: 54.73 KBDec 22 15:44
schestowitz"It's nothing new, just what's been going on in the word processor market since the beginning."Dec 22 15:44
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Hoping to get away from work early to get to the Ubuntu UK Christmas Drinks http://bit.ly/9116vLDec 22 15:48
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] Wooot! All passwords synchronised on $work systems! Yay! This fact will of course not last. They will expire soon :(Dec 22 15:58
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Software patents reward failure and penalise success: http://i5.be/5NDec 22 16:01
phIRCe-localTitle: Saxon diaries :: Patents: an Open Letter to my MP .::. Size~: 26.84 KBDec 22 16:01
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] “We Need #ACTA to Send Microsoft and Linus to Jail” http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/eu-intellectual-freedom-at-risk/Dec 22 16:03
phIRCe-localTitle: “We Need ACTA to Send Microsoft and Linus to Jail” | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 111.62 KBDec 22 16:03
schestowitzbblDec 22 16:06
Diablo-D3_and_ Linus?Dec 22 16:07
Diablo-D3I mean, he'd probably get raped in jail dudeDec 22 16:07
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] listening to the latest h4cked.com podcast, I love these guysDec 22 16:29
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cubezzzsend Linus to jail?Dec 22 16:46
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cubezzzyeah I don't understand that at allDec 22 17:13
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] I'm waiting for a fork of tinycore by the adult movie industry called hardcore linux, with porn mode enabled by defaultDec 22 17:22
Omar87So, Buce Perens is back in action again! I'm glad. :-)Dec 22 17:25
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cubezzzheh, another hacker attack, I love theseDec 22 18:17
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[zoobab] Microsoft forbidden to sell Word, 290 million USD fine for not respecting software patents: http://i5.be/5QDec 22 18:22
phIRCe-localTitle: Court Affirms Injunction Against Microsoft - WSJ.com .::. Size~: 100.58 KBDec 22 18:22
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trmancohttp://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blog/2009/12/22/from-all-of-us-to-all-of-youDec 22 19:32
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trmancofinallyDec 22 19:32
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schestowitzhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8425906.stmDec 22 19:47
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schestowitzFirefox for mobile 'days away' from launchDec 22 19:47
schestowitztrmanco: it's blobdsDec 22 19:47
schestowitz*blobsDec 22 19:47
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schestowitzhttp://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2009/12/18/Day-of-the-DMDDec 22 19:58
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schestowitzhttp://www.webpronews.com/topnews/2009/12/22/yahoo-announces-weeklong-shutdownDec 22 20:00
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Will__http://www.patentlyo.com/patent/2009/12/appellate-court-enforces-permanent-injunction-against-microsoft-word.htmlDec 22 20:06
phIRCe-localTitle: Patent Law Blog (Patently-O): Appellate Court Enforces Permanent Injunction against Microsoft Word .::. Size~: 73.33 KBDec 22 20:06
Will__Now my question:  Does this have any effect on OOXML?  Dec 22 20:07
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schestowitzhttp://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/22/indochinese_tiger/Dec 22 20:11
phIRCe-localTitle: Chinese villager jailed for eating tiger • The Register .::. Size~: 23.46 KBDec 22 20:11
schestowitzSpicyDec 22 20:11
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sebsebsebhiDec 22 20:16
schestowitzYoDec 22 20:16
sebsebsebschestowitz: YoDec 22 20:21
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] any idea which version of #ubuntu the current #jolicloud is based on?Dec 22 20:42
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Readers’ Response to #Microsoft and American Library Association (ALA), Job Cremation http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/ala-and-msft/Dec 22 21:01
phIRCe-localTitle: Readers Response to Microsoft and American Library Association (ALA), Job Cremation | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 109.52 KBDec 22 21:01
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNOME Makes a White Christmas Too http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/white-christmas-gnome-xmas/ #video #playoggDec 22 21:02
phIRCe-localTitle: GNOME Makes a White Christmas Too | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 104.97 KBDec 22 21:02
starcannonMicrosoft loses Word patent appeal http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-10420391-75.htmlDec 22 21:05
phIRCe-localTitle: Microsoft loses Word patent appeal, will change code | Microsoft - CNET News .::. Size~: 98.02 KBDec 22 21:06
starcannonEurope Drops Microsoft Antitrust Case http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/17/business/global/17msft.htmlDec 22 21:12
phIRCe-localTitle: The New York Times > Log In .::. Size~: 9.69 KBDec 22 21:12
schestowitzstarcannon: yeahDec 22 21:27
schestowitz2 people have said this here so farDec 22 21:28
cubezzzwell, I gave a bit of a talk at the old fogies home about FOSS :)Dec 22 21:33
cubezzzalmost everyone goes "I didn't know there were any alternatives"Dec 22 21:34
cubezzzeverybody was using dozeDec 22 21:34
cubezzzin return they talked about the "old days"Dec 22 21:35
cubezzzshort hand, and when word processors started to appearDec 22 21:36
starcannonsorry, I just arrived, so I hadn't seen the previous posts :(Dec 22 21:37
cubezzzNorth America should get ballot screens tooDec 22 21:38
cubezzzlike "what OS would you like installed"Dec 22 21:39
cubezzzso when you buy a new computer you can pick the OS you wantDec 22 21:39
cubezzzthen if you picked Linux it would go "no extra charge"Dec 22 21:40
starcannoncubezzz yeah, that'd be awesome, but I wouldn't hold my breath for it. First off, OEM's would lobby like hell to NOT allow that(operating system resellers aside). Dec 22 21:40
cubezzzif you want doze on there then it asked for your credit card Dec 22 21:40
starcannoncubezzz the overall added expense of supporting multiple operating systems from getting hardware vendors to supply drivers to customer support, it would be a business logistical nightmare. I would guess its the primary reason Dell only offers 3 or 4 Ubuntu Linux choices.Dec 22 21:43
cubezzzI wonder Dec 22 21:43
cubezzzI want the blank option thenDec 22 21:44
cubezzz"Do you want Doze or Blank?"Dec 22 21:44
cubezzzI'd do the restDec 22 21:44
starcannoncubezzz yeah, that would be very nice. Dec 22 21:44
cubezzzless work for the OEM Dec 22 21:44
starcannoncubezzz I build my own desktops, so "blank" is always that option; laptops and netbooks though, it's either the few linux choices we have Zareason, System76, or Dell, or buy one with Windows on it, and scrub it ourselves. There have been some interesting license refund situations though.. but they require a lot of work on the consumers partDec 22 21:45
cubezzzI'd rather not pay for doze then try to get a refund afterwardsDec 22 21:46
starcannoncubezzz yep agreed, milking the refund out of the OEM takes a lot of time and patience, and for most of us is just not a viable alternativeDec 22 21:47
cubezzzthere is one company that will sell laptop kitsDec 22 21:48
cubezzzthen you can just assemble what you wantDec 22 21:48
cubezzzthe retail situation is just horribleDec 22 21:50
starcannoncubezzz oy vey, I work on computers, and laptops are always the kicker; its hi-tech origami. Dec 22 21:50
starcannoncubezzz I'm trying to find the article, but it seems to me back in the late 90's lobbiest were responsible for the current "it must have an OS on it" situation that exists here in the US; I may be remembering wrong though, so don't run with that, but if interested, it is worth googling, I'll drop a link here if I find anything to verify my memoryDec 22 21:51
cubezzzstarcannon, all "brand systems" had an OS going back to 1977Dec 22 21:52
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The #Moonlight and #Mono World Does Not Work That Way Though. http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/latest-moonlight-mono-pr/ #novellDec 22 21:52
phIRCe-localTitle: “The Moonlight/Mono World Does Not Work That Way Though.” | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 108.51 KBDec 22 21:52
cubezzzin the beginning that was BASIC in romDec 22 21:53
cubezzzand a very primitive dosDec 22 21:53
cubezzzthe only exception was "white box" PCsDec 22 21:53
cubezzzAmigas had AmigaDosDec 22 21:54
cubezzzAtari had GEMDec 22 21:54
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cubezzzTandy's had some form of Tandy DOS licensed from MicrosoftDec 22 21:54
cubezzzI'm pretty sure white box PCs go back to at least 1986Dec 22 21:55
cubezzzthat's when I bought my first XT cloneDec 22 21:55
starcannoncubezzz yeah, thats not what I'm referring to, there was a short time between 95' and 99' that Dell among other large OEM's, offered computers with no OS on it, then there was some legislation or something passed that put the skids on it. It's why they always come with at least freedos or something I forget nowDec 22 21:55
starcannonTRS80 was the first computer I ever got to use, then an Apple II GS, then my folks bought me my own Vic 20Dec 22 21:56
schestowitzstarcannon: I'm writing about the Word thingDec 22 21:56
cubezzzI'd be interested to know what legislation that was :)Dec 22 21:56
cubezzzTRS-80 Model 1?Dec 22 21:57
starcannoncubezzz nod, sorry I can't dig it up, I'm still lookingDec 22 21:57
cubezzzthat is pretty old stuff Dec 22 21:57
starcannoncubezzz I'm not sure, I was 8 or 9 years old, would have been 78', 79' somewhere in thereDec 22 21:57
cubezzzwell then you know the whole history of PCs pretty muchDec 22 21:57
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] BBC News - Microsoft Word patent infringement verdict upheld http://tinyurl.com/ya9homnDec 22 21:57
phIRCe-localTitle: BBC News - Microsoft Word patent infringement verdict upheld .::. Size~: 47.71 KBDec 22 21:57
starcannonmaybe 77'Dec 22 21:58
cubezzzstarcannon, 1977 I'm pretty sure, I'll double checkDec 22 21:58
cubezzzAugust 3, 1977Dec 22 21:58
starcannonnod, I didn't get to see one till 1978 though, and didn't get to play with one until 1979, my mom's boss could afford one, so I got to see it. I was allowed to do math blasters or something on it for a whole summer.Dec 22 21:59
cubezzznow Radio Shack itself is gone, at least from my countryDec 22 22:00
starcannonwe still have Radio Shack here in Spokane Washington USADec 22 22:00
cubezzza pity, I used to like the ShackDec 22 22:00
starcannonbut they don't really sell computers anymoreDec 22 22:00
starcannonThey are still good for lots of other things thoughDec 22 22:01
starcannonI buy soldering supplies there all the timeDec 22 22:01
starcannonI rebuilt my marantz 2270 receiver using radio shack solder, and other suppliesDec 22 22:01
starcannonAre you in Canada cubezzz?Dec 22 22:02
cubezzzyesDec 22 22:02
starcannonnodDec 22 22:02
starcannonyeah, Radio Shack, Sears, JC Penny, Montgomery Wards, even K-mart, and several other large retailers went way down, or clear gone from the retail landscape here what about 15 years ago? It was the beginning of the Wal-Mart type modelDec 22 22:03
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NewsTechnica: Lily Allen quits "talking complete bollocks" http://newstechnica.com/2009/12/22/lily-allen-quits-talking-complete-bollocks/Dec 22 22:03
phIRCe-localTitle:   Lily Allen quits talking complete bollocks | NewsTechnica .::. Size~: 24.69 KBDec 22 22:03
cubezzzK-mart also is goneDec 22 22:03
cubezzzummmDec 22 22:04
starcannonYeah, wow, we still have them down here, but its not like it was when I was a kid, they used to be everywhere.Dec 22 22:04
cubezzzretail is really different nowDec 22 22:04
starcannonAFK phoneDec 22 22:05
cubezzzthere are still a few small computer shops locally thoughDec 22 22:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NewsTechnica: Holy See declares unique copyright on priestly molestations http://is.gd/5xLgc (yes, two in a day!)Dec 22 22:05
phIRCe-localTitle:   Holy See declares unique copyright on priestly molestations | NewsTechnica .::. Size~: 23.91 KBDec 22 22:05
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft #Word Can be Banned Within Weeks for Microsoft #Patent Crime http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/22/lawsuits-infringement-vs-word/Dec 22 22:07
phIRCe-localTitle: Microsoft Word Can be Banned Within Weeks for Microsoft Patent Crime (Willful Infringement and Trial Misconduct) | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.13 KBDec 22 22:07
schestowitzhttp://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2009/12/2009122013166878529.htmlDec 22 22:11
schestowitzAs RMS says, "Saboteurs cut the main Iraqi oil pipeline, perhaps trying to prevent their nation's wealth from being handed over to foreign conquerors. "Dec 22 22:11
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schestowitzhttp://www.themedialine.org/news/news_detail.asp?NewsID=27415Dec 22 22:11
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Back from pubbing with @techpractical and @pndc. James says it's the first pint I've ever bought him.Dec 22 22:14
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-BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] I found the UI for UNR, it's netbook-launcher. It does seem to need Gnome however which is sad. Further examination may disprove that thoughDec 22 22:29
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[popey] On the way home after a great first #ubuntu UK "sherry and mince pie evening". Met some nice people and took an OLPC to bits. Oops! #fbDec 22 22:38
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Live by the sword……. – or so Microsoft discover? http://tinyurl.com/ylh2q8v #microsoft #windows #word #xp #msoffice #fail #shameDec 22 22:41
phIRCe-localTitle: Live by the sword&&.  or so Microsoft discover? «  OPEN BYTES  cave quid dicis, quando, et cui. .::. Size~: 34.12 KBDec 22 22:41
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Put the #RedHat on http://ur1.ca/ieat Ballmer and Hovsepian are failing once again to obstruct the leaderDec 22 22:48
phIRCe-localTitle: Put the Red Hat on | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 109.09 KBDec 22 22:48
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schestowitzhttp://www.blogicalthoughts.com/images/signs/1096_signs.jpgDec 22 22:51
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrFgX83OsEYDec 22 22:52
schestowitzhttp://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091220/ap_on_bi_ge/us_cell_phone_warningsDec 22 22:59
phIRCe-localTitle: Maine to consider cell phone cancer warning - Yahoo! News .::. Size~: 100.48 KBDec 22 23:00
schestowitzCute: http://theoatmeal.com/comics/computersDec 22 23:01
phIRCe-localTitle: Why It's Better To Pretend You Don't Know Anything About Computers - The Oatmeal .::. Size~: 15.31 KBDec 22 23:01
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] What a great blog - http://crankyoldnutcase.blogspot.com I recommend people visit! #linux #foss #rms #gnu #windows #microsoft #xp #vistaDec 22 23:03
phIRCe-localTitle: Cranky Old Nutcase by The Mad Hatter .::. Size~: 74.41 KBDec 22 23:03
schestowitzhttp://techdirt.com/articles/20091221/1607597451.shtmlDec 22 23:05
phIRCe-localTitle: US Declares Victory Again In WTO Fight Over US Content In China | Techdirt .::. Size~: 26.06 KBDec 22 23:05
schestowitzhttp://www.thresq.com/2009/12/rolling-stone-merchandise-trademark-lawsuit.htmlDec 22 23:09
phIRCe-localTitle: Rolling Stone loses Round One in T-shirt case--The Hollywood Reporter | Esq. | Entertainment and Media Law .::. Size~: 40.35 KBDec 22 23:09
-BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Currently running Chromium (build 4.0.279.0) still impressed! Can't remember the last time I used any other browser! #chromiumDec 22 23:14
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ziggyfishgood morningDec 22 23:19
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_goblinhi!Dec 22 23:24
_goblinziggyfish and oiaohm!Dec 22 23:25
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schestowitzhttp://www.linuxfordevices.com/c/a/News/Intel-N450-D410-D510/?kc=rssDec 22 23:39
phIRCe-localTitle: Intel launches Pineview Atoms - News - Linux for Devices .::. Size~: 67.37 KBDec 22 23:39
schestowitz_goblin: yeah, it's morning down underDec 22 23:39
_goblinhi!Dec 22 23:39
schestowitz_goblin: I've just subscribed to Mad Hatter's blog after you recommended it... no idea why I hadn't done this beforeDec 22 23:39
_goblinjust filing a Chromium bug....typical...I sing its praises and then have to report one....Dec 22 23:39
schestowitz_goblin: are you fluent in law?Dec 22 23:39
_goblincriminal yesDec 22 23:39
_goblincivil - a littleDec 22 23:39
schestowitzCause I had a chat with this lawyer in the sauna about Mandy's messDec 22 23:40
_goblinMandy's mess?Dec 22 23:40
schestowitzPeople hardly know about it. Same with ACTA.Dec 22 23:40
schestowitz_goblin: digital economy bill of whateverDec 22 23:40
_goblinahDec 22 23:40
schestowitzIt's a farceDec 22 23:40
schestowitzAnd they still change itDec 22 23:40
_goblinI agree...but on the basis of it being unenforacable...Dec 22 23:41
schestowitzE.g. latest is http://the1709blog.blogspot.com/2009/12/groundless-copyright-threats.htmlDec 22 23:41
phIRCe-localTitle: At last ... the 1709 Copyright Blog: Groundless copyright threats .::. Size~: 85 KBDec 22 23:41
_goblinIve suggested ISP licensing like public houses....Dec 22 23:41
_goblinmake the ISP responsible for the data passing though their servers..Dec 22 23:41
schestowitzBy the way, why no love for apostrophes?Dec 22 23:41
_goblinlol...Dec 22 23:41
_goblinI dont use them much at work.Dec 22 23:42
schestowitzits not so good [sic]Dec 22 23:42
_goblinthe systems we use dont search using them.Dec 22 23:42
schestowitzIt makes me want to edit stuff I quote from youDec 22 23:42
_goblinplease feel freeDec 22 23:42
schestowitzYou're lowering credibility by leaving grammar issues in thereDec 22 23:42
_goblinits like your name.....I have to stop myself when I want to type:Dec 22 23:43
_goblinRoy SCHESTOWITZDec 22 23:43
schestowitzbt _goblin if dats t case y not just blame txting on bad habits 2?Dec 22 23:43
_goblinlike I say our systems dont like punctuation....Dec 22 23:43
_goblinyeah but theirs an operational reason for my non-usage.Dec 22 23:43
schestowitz_goblin: I thought that was French conventionDec 22 23:43
schestowitzMy ex g/f who was French would capitalise(all cap) surnamesDec 22 23:44
_goblinits common in statementsDec 22 23:44
_goblinalong with addressesDec 22 23:44
schestowitzDepends whereDec 22 23:44
schestowitzPeople freak out here if I say zipcodeDec 22 23:44
_goblinand punctuation is bad because it can draw incorrect inference.Dec 22 23:44
schestowitzPunctuation resolves ambiguitiesDec 22 23:45
schestowitzIt's not just for reading and paceDec 22 23:45
_goblinim trying to think of an example....Dec 22 23:45
schestowitzExampleDec 22 23:45
schestowitzJohn, Harry, and TomDec 22 23:45
schestowitzJohn, Harry and TomDec 22 23:45
_goblindirect speech...?Dec 22 23:46
_goblinI am trying to think of an example I can use here.Dec 22 23:46
schestowitzBut you can change preferencesDec 22 23:46
schestowitzI mean, why not adds punctuation?Dec 22 23:47
schestowitzIt's not as though you can be multi-lingualDec 22 23:47
_goblinIll give an example.....Dec 22 23:47
schestowitzSame with IRC vs blogsDec 22 23:47
_goblinwe use a system that has a freetext box for information....Dec 22 23:47
schestowitzBlogs I write properly, more formally. Same with academic papersDec 22 23:47
schestowitz_goblin: you don't use Google? /sarcasmDec 22 23:48
_goblinit has no proximity type search and because of the diverse nature of the information in it, there are certain rules...for exampleDec 22 23:48
schestowitzAccording to Schmidt, if you care about privacy, you do something criminalDec 22 23:48
schestowitzSo I guess he was right :-0Dec 22 23:48
schestowitzCriminal in the formal sensxeDec 22 23:48
_goblinlol...Dec 22 23:49
schestowitzKleenexDec 22 23:49
_goblinI think privacy of the person and privacy of action are two different issues....Dec 22 23:49
_goblinfor example, the right for your to have a private family life, is a good right....Dec 22 23:50
_goblinwhereas you intentionally go online........Dec 22 23:51
_goblinin regards to commercial exploitation, your surfing habbits should be private...Dec 22 23:51
_goblinin regards to law enforcement, I think that right is waivered.Dec 22 23:51
_goblinmost people have already signed away their privacy in their ISP T&CDec 22 23:51
_goblinI know I have with O2 .Dec 22 23:52
schestowitzDec 22 23:53
schestowitz[23:50] <_goblin> for example, the right for your to have a private family life, is a good right....Dec 22 23:53
schestowitzDepends on themDec 22 23:53
schestowitzThen you talk about relational dataDec 22 23:53
schestowitzAnd it's up to those members of family--individually--to keep privateDec 22 23:54
schestowitz[23:51] <_goblin> in regards to commercial exploitation, your surfing habbits should be private...Dec 22 23:54
schestowitzNot with Marshall lawDec 22 23:54
_goblinI am refering to sale of your habits for commercial gain...i.e Phorm.Dec 22 23:55
schestowitzYes, what do you make of DPI?Dec 22 23:55
schestowitzSlated/Homer protests against itDec 22 23:55
schestowitzSo have I, but unlike him, I don't block users who use Phorm-infected ISPsDec 22 23:56
_goblinyeah....its a hard one...Dec 22 23:56
schestowitzI don't blame usersDec 22 23:56
_goblinin regards to your ISP....I bet you have already given authority albeit by your T&CDec 22 23:56
schestowitzYou're a legal buff, you ought to grok this stuffDec 22 23:56
schestowitz_goblin: they don't do surveillance, unless there is a reasonDec 22 23:56
schestowitzI'm harmlessDec 22 23:57
_goblinin regards to law enforcment you are looking at RIPR policy...Dec 22 23:57
_goblincovert intrusive observation.Dec 22 23:57
_goblinof sorts.Dec 22 23:57
schestowitzRIPPER sounds badDec 22 23:57
schestowitzWHat'szit?Dec 22 23:57
_goblinits the best practice for covert surviellance for policeDec 22 23:57
_goblinits actually reassuring for a MOP to read.Dec 22 23:57
_goblinas a MOP you have more power in terms of covert surviellance..Dec 22 23:58
_goblinyou can pick up a camera, hide it and start filming...Dec 22 23:58
_goblinpolice can'tDec 22 23:58
_goblinSup Ints authority for covert obsDec 22 23:58
schestowitzThey have CCTVDec 22 23:59
schestowitzFilming us all the timeDec 22 23:59
schestowitzFrom many anglesDec 22 23:59
_goblinbut thats overtDec 22 23:59
schestowitzWith disposal cyclesDec 22 23:59
schestowitzBTW, I don't perceive police as only force of goodDec 22 23:59
schestowitzANd I will show you whyDec 22 23:59

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