| balzac | Microsoft has to be let down easy | Dec 28 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| schestowitz | Microwave absorber | Dec 28 00:00 |
| balzac | they can't have a "catastrophic failure" without bad repercussions all around the industry | Dec 28 00:01 |
| cubezzz | I only buy Microsoft certified toilet paper | Dec 28 00:01 |
| schestowitz | In Burger King they have multiple microwaves working above the sandwich engineers | Dec 28 00:01 |
| cubezzz | yikes | Dec 28 00:01 |
| schestowitz | Very bad... carcinigent | Dec 28 00:01 |
| schestowitz | *carcinogen | Dec 28 00:01 |
| balzac | I've decided that it's okay for Microsoft to taste some success in areas other than operating systems and office software | Dec 28 00:01 |
| cubezzz | extra beef, extra cheese, extra bacon | Dec 28 00:01 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: SCO has one too | Dec 28 00:02 |
| schestowitz | SCO-banded asswipes | Dec 28 00:02 |
| schestowitz | It's on the Web. Google it! | Dec 28 00:02 |
| schestowitz | *branded | Dec 28 00:02 |
| cubezzz | ;-) | Dec 28 00:02 |
| balzac | Bing.com, webservices, content and gaming - that's fine as long as they back off the strong-arm tactics | Dec 28 00:02 |
| cubezzz | but are SCO asswipes really good enough for wiping my ass? | Dec 28 00:02 |
| cubezzz | I mean, is the quality there? | Dec 28 00:02 |
| schestowitz | balzac: *LOL* | Dec 28 00:02 |
| schestowitz | What would your activist parents say? | Dec 28 00:03 |
| schestowitz | You're letting the mafia don do some business | Dec 28 00:03 |
| schestowitz | While they speak to the Murdoch Monster to collude vs Google | Dec 28 00:03 |
| MinceR | 005022 < schestowitz> MCSE = Microsoft certified Sandwich Engineer | Dec 28 00:03 |
| schestowitz | A leopard never change its spots | Dec 28 00:03 |
| MinceR | Minesweeper Consultant and Solitaire Expert | Dec 28 00:03 |
| cubezzz | I'm a pain to the dozers, I admit | Dec 28 00:03 |
| schestowitz | That too | Dec 28 00:03 |
| MinceR | Must Consult Someone Experienced | Dec 28 00:03 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: that's after work | Dec 28 00:03 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 28 00:03 |
| balzac | they can't just get wiped out or it would be chaotic like the collapse of the soviet union | Dec 28 00:03 |
| MinceR | "work"? | Dec 28 00:03 |
| cubezzz | I'm ready for the collapse though | Dec 28 00:04 |
| balzac | trying to attain the 'flawless victory' only makes a big mess | Dec 28 00:04 |
| cubezzz | I'll be right there chanting "Die Die!!" | Dec 28 00:04 |
| schestowitz | balzac: they can get wiped like soft extraction on SCO-branded toilet cushions | Dec 28 00:04 |
| cubezzz | how many more years of Doze must I endure? | Dec 28 00:05 |
| balzac | it has to be gradual since microsoft has so many important government bureaucracies dependent on their OS and office softwrae | Dec 28 00:05 |
| balzac | i've decided i'm against 'revolution' in almost all it's forms | Dec 28 00:05 |
| schestowitz | But _goblin says we have Linux XP | Dec 28 00:05 |
| schestowitz | That's not the Russian Windows XP | Dec 28 00:05 |
| schestowitz | But a Chinese one | Dec 28 00:05 |
| cubezzz | we do? | Dec 28 00:05 |
| balzac | think about the aftermath of a 'revolution' of ideology | Dec 28 00:05 |
| MinceR | they can quit m$ office gradually even if m$ fails suddenly | Dec 28 00:05 |
| schestowitz | Mao FTW :-p | Dec 28 00:05 |
| balzac | it's always a horrible mess | Dec 28 00:05 |
| MinceR | the mess is already here | Dec 28 00:06 |
| MinceR | the faster it's cleaned up the better | Dec 28 00:06 |
| cubezzz | it is a mess already, yeah | Dec 28 00:06 |
| schestowitz | half of PCs a zombie | Dec 28 00:06 |
| MinceR | every minute m$ survives means more damage | Dec 28 00:06 |
| schestowitz | The Internet could collapse if the crackers wanted to | Dec 28 00:06 |
| schestowitz | First DNS | Dec 28 00:06 |
| balzac | i'm supporting the uninspired, undemocratic governments in cuba and north korea for the same reason | Dec 28 00:06 |
| balzac | toppling them is too disorderly | Dec 28 00:06 |
| schestowitz | Cuba? | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | they need a gradual transition to whatever comes next | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | yeah, raul | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | raul castro | Dec 28 00:07 |
| schestowitz | WHat's wrong with Cuba that makes it dangerous? | Dec 28 00:07 |
| schestowitz | The US is more dangerous than Cuba | Dec 28 00:07 |
| cubezzz | nothing | Dec 28 00:07 |
| MinceR | there's a dictatorship in cuba | Dec 28 00:07 |
| cubezzz | nothing is dangerous about Cuba | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | i even wrote something about a chinese dissident for the same reason | Dec 28 00:07 |
| MinceR | that's what's dangerous | Dec 28 00:07 |
| schestowitz | In fact, polls show that the world sees the US as the biggest threat to world peace | Dec 28 00:07 |
| schestowitz | Fact. | Dec 28 00:07 |
| cubezzz | no one lives forever | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | i'm not saying cuba is dangerous, but their government is pretty stagnant | Dec 28 00:07 |
| balzac | i'm just saying I don't support anyone who wants revolution | Dec 28 00:08 |
| balzac | or to usher in rapid change in cuba | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: they get better healthcare in Cuba than in the US | Dec 28 00:08 |
| balzac | rapid change can be very bad | Dec 28 00:08 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: who doesn't | Dec 28 00:08 |
| MinceR | ? | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | I had an argument today with a friend | Dec 28 00:08 |
| MinceR | balzac: upkeeping an unjust system can be just as bad, or worse | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | He came and told me about some British dude who got death penalty for smuggling heroine in China | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | I was like, "so?" | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | That's minor news | Dec 28 00:08 |
| schestowitz | THe big news is the rise of China | Dec 28 00:09 |
| balzac | MinceR: you don't have to "keep" an unjust system to gradually phase it out | Dec 28 00:09 |
| schestowitz | And people are executed in the US every day | Dec 28 00:09 |
| balzac | but the world has grown too small for radical agendas | Dec 28 00:09 |
| schestowitz | Some despite innocence | Dec 28 00:09 |
| schestowitz | THe UK No longer executes | Dec 28 00:09 |
| MinceR | balzac: if you're gradually phasing it out, you're propping it up for a while | Dec 28 00:09 |
| schestowitz | The US used to even execute in gas chambers until some decades ago.. and women too | Dec 28 00:09 |
| balzac | microsoft must be 'defeated' in a limited scope - in operating systems, gradually and responsibly | Dec 28 00:09 |
| balzac | therefore, microsoft needs a retreat plan - webservices, content deals, gaming, entertainment | Dec 28 00:10 |
| MinceR | m$ might need it, but we certainly don't need them to | Dec 28 00:10 |
| balzac | and then they can retreat from monopoly status in operating systems and retool that area of their business | Dec 28 00:10 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: +1 | Dec 28 00:10 |
| MinceR | they can do a lot of damage in those fields too | Dec 28 00:10 |
| MinceR | especially web services | Dec 28 00:10 |
| schestowitz | balzac: nope | Dec 28 00:10 |
| balzac | they're getting downsized gradually, but it can't be like the collapse of the USSR | Dec 28 00:10 |
| cubezzz | I wish I had used Unix more in the 80's | Dec 28 00:10 |
| schestowitz | COmpanies that are antipathic have no room in society | Dec 28 00:11 |
| cubezzz | I didn't clue into how bad Microsoft was under much later | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | i doubt the sudden collapse of m$ would harm anyone outside the cult | Dec 28 00:11 |
| cubezzz | under=until | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | and those inside deserve all the harm they can get | Dec 28 00:11 |
| balzac | Microsoft is changing culturally within too | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | no, their PR is changing | Dec 28 00:11 |
| schestowitz | Hahahaha | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | nothing else is | Dec 28 00:11 |
| schestowitz | Hahahaha | Dec 28 00:11 |
| schestowitz | Hahahaha | Dec 28 00:11 |
| schestowitz | Hahahaha | Dec 28 00:11 |
| schestowitz | Someone drank Kool-Aid | Dec 28 00:11 |
| cubezzz | ok, ok :) | Dec 28 00:11 |
| balzac | PR changes signal a change in business operations | Dec 28 00:11 |
| balzac | look, they're getting downsized anyway | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | there's nothing good for us in that "change" | Dec 28 00:11 |
| MinceR | of course they're getting downsized | Dec 28 00:12 |
| MinceR | they're dying | Dec 28 00:12 |
| MinceR | even if slowly | Dec 28 00:12 |
| schestowitz | balzac: not fast enough | Dec 28 00:12 |
| schestowitz | Ballmer needs to be arrested too | Dec 28 00:12 |
| schestowitz | RICO Act | Dec 28 00:12 |
| _goblin | Ballmer needs committing IMO. | Dec 28 00:12 |
| balzac | schestowitz: if it's too fast, it creates a bad crisis, and they put stress on all their clients. | Dec 28 00:12 |
| _goblin | Sec 136 of Mental Health act applies (IMO) in his case. | Dec 28 00:12 |
| MinceR | their clients deserve it then. | Dec 28 00:12 |
| balzac | i'm tired of hearing about government bureaucracies dropping the ball on national security because of technical incompetence | Dec 28 00:12 |
| cubezzz | He'll have a heart attack or something | Dec 28 00:13 |
| cubezzz | the end | Dec 28 00:13 |
| balzac | I'd rather Microsoft get an easy let down than for their corporate problems to trouble the government | Dec 28 00:13 |
| MinceR | apparently the government thinks so too | Dec 28 00:13 |
| cubezzz | changes are happening | Dec 28 00:13 |
| MinceR | they've got away easily with all the crimes they've even been found guilty of | Dec 28 00:13 |
| balzac | microsoft has a lot of government involvement and they need to gradually modernize their company, not fail utterly and let down the US government on whatever critical systems and services they're responsible for | Dec 28 00:14 |
| balzac | Microsot will get bailed out before they're allowed to be any more of national security liability | Dec 28 00:14 |
| MinceR | if the government depends on m$ for any critical systems and services, they're doomed anyway | Dec 28 00:15 |
| balzac | they're "too big to fail" | Dec 28 00:15 |
| schestowitz | balzac: Microsoft does damage in other fields now | Dec 28 00:15 |
| schestowitz | So I worry about more than Microsoft | Dec 28 00:15 |
| balzac | so they need to get let down easy, there's no other way | Dec 28 00:15 |
| schestowitz | The maijn thug behind the company is now attacking African and Indian farmers for example | Dec 28 00:15 |
| balzac | which one? | Dec 28 00:15 |
| schestowitz | He and Rockefeller put their weight behind the monster called Monsanto | Dec 28 00:15 |
| schestowitz | They should be probed and maybe arrested too, but by whom? | Dec 28 00:15 |
| balzac | monsanto is much worse than microsoft | Dec 28 00:15 |
| balzac | but it's not going to happen like that | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | The problem is, it's like an agenda of top rich people to control the world by a sort of force | Dec 28 00:16 |
| balzac | people said the same thing about wall street | Dec 28 00:16 |
| balzac | yeah, but we can't fix the problem by acting like karl marx | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | FraudStreet? | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | Who said Marx? | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | I'm talking about capialism | Dec 28 00:16 |
| balzac | we have to look at how president obama is dealing with this stuff - diplomatically | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | The US is not a capitalism | Dec 28 00:16 |
| schestowitz | It's this free market radicalism, where freedom means the companies are free to run the country | Dec 28 00:17 |
| balzac | i know it's not what capitalism is defined as | Dec 28 00:17 |
| balzac | sink or swim | Dec 28 00:17 |
| balzac | sink or swim is the dillema for the little guys | Dec 28 00:17 |
| schestowitz | balzac: Obama is like the queen of ENgland | Dec 28 00:17 |
| schestowitz | He has no real power | Dec 28 00:17 |
| balzac | big guys own the pool and the water in it | Dec 28 00:17 |
| schestowitz | He was funded by the banking sector | Dec 28 00:17 |
| balzac | obama has power | Dec 28 00:17 |
| MinceR | not just the water, also the people | Dec 28 00:17 |
| schestowitz | So GS, AIG et al have him by the balls | Dec 28 00:18 |
| balzac | that's one way of looking at it, but there he is. | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | Pardon my language | Dec 28 00:18 |
| MinceR | obama is controlled by companies, afaik | Dec 28 00:18 |
| balzac | no one man has more power | Dec 28 00:18 |
| MinceR | he's a puppet | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | He gets his power from the companies | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | IOW: | Dec 28 00:18 |
| balzac | he can regulate any of the companies who you say 'have him by the balls' | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | If the companie don't like him, he loses the powrr | Dec 28 00:18 |
| balzac | that's why kucinich didn't win | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | See neo-con attempt to impeach Clinton | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | They hunted for slime for years | Dec 28 00:18 |
| schestowitz | Cause he didn't serve their agenda | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | Obama too | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | They can throw him to the dogs | Dec 28 00:19 |
| balzac | yeah, but obama is smarter | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | Like they did Kate Moss in the press | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | Or even Michael Jackson | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | balzac: they have more power than you imagine | Dec 28 00:19 |
| balzac | that's all the more reason for the public to support obama | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | Through conglemarates like Murdoch's too | Dec 28 00:19 |
| MinceR | they can also make sure nobody close to obama will get any money for election campaigns again | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | See how Faux attacks Obama for example | Dec 28 00:19 |
| balzac | because there's no better bureaucrat than him to do that job | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | So Obama has to be their puppey or else he's out! | Dec 28 00:19 |
| schestowitz | *puppy | Dec 28 00:19 |
| balzac | he's the top bureaucrat, the top military commander, the top "CEO" in the world. | Dec 28 00:20 |
| balzac | he needs support, not cynicism | Dec 28 00:20 |
| MinceR | the top figurehead | Dec 28 00:20 |
| balzac | yep, that too | Dec 28 00:20 |
| balzac | he's not an ornament, as some would like to portray him | Dec 28 00:20 |
| schestowitz | balzac: I think you were allured by slogans and PR | Dec 28 00:20 |
| schestowitz | I never bought that | Dec 28 00:20 |
| MinceR | also, i at least hope he doesn't control the world outside the USA like a CEO | Dec 28 00:20 |
| MinceR | if he does, we're in bigger shit than i've ever imagined. | Dec 28 00:20 |
| schestowitz | Obama is there to serve those who he ALREADY does... with Biden | Dec 28 00:20 |
| balzac | schestowitz: no matter how it turns out, i consider him a success | Dec 28 00:20 |
| schestowitz | His actions speak for his agenda | Dec 28 00:20 |
| schestowitz | Sorry, but he's not a cnadidate now but a president. And I seee what he does | Dec 28 00:21 |
| balzac | people need to look at the longer view | Dec 28 00:21 |
| schestowitz | I track it cause it affects the UK too | Dec 28 00:21 |
| schestowitz | Like his circle of crooks like David Geffen | Dec 28 00:21 |
| balzac | i was not supporting obama until very late in his campaign | Dec 28 00:21 |
| schestowitz | Who now want to treat me and everyone like a criminal for logging onto the Intwernet | Dec 28 00:21 |
| schestowitz | What "longer view"? | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | Look back from future? | Dec 28 00:22 |
| MinceR | obama didn't show his true colors until he got elected | Dec 28 00:22 |
| balzac | i came from the darkest wilderness of marginalized politics | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | Like war criminals (E.g. Kissinger) hailing other war criminals like Ragaen? | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | Looking back it's easy | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | Same with gates | Dec 28 00:22 |
| balzac | there are some very difficult issues to deal with, most people don't talk about them | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | Take the nastiest crooks, rely on young generation | Dec 28 00:22 |
| schestowitz | project PR and dreary imagery and portray the person as famous and good | Dec 28 00:23 |
| schestowitz | It happened all the time, balzac, for Obama it will too | Dec 28 00:23 |
| schestowitz | There are still people who will praises Bush | Dec 28 00:23 |
| schestowitz | "The president who..... was a "wartime" president... poor him" | Dec 28 00:23 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: he said no lobbyists | Dec 28 00:24 |
| balzac | bush made the messes | Dec 28 00:24 |
| schestowitz | Just Ballmer, his wife, Bill and his wife and others | Dec 28 00:24 |
| MinceR | lol | Dec 28 00:24 |
| schestowitz | And the backing from the world's biggest gangsters, the banksters | Dec 28 00:24 |
| schestowitz | Those who stole from the public, now with his endorsement | Dec 28 00:24 |
| schestowitz | But the nation has not woken up yet | Dec 28 00:24 |
| schestowitz | Their savings are being confiscated and they wave signs bearing messages like "Hope" and "Unity' | Dec 28 00:25 |
| balzac | yeah, but what do you mean by "wake up"? | Dec 28 00:25 |
| balzac | sounds dangerous | Dec 28 00:25 |
| schestowitz | Wake up, learn the facts | Dec 28 00:25 |
| MinceR | well, it's dangerous for some | Dec 28 00:25 |
| schestowitz | Wake up means not beign drones | Dec 28 00:25 |
| schestowitz | But being involved | Dec 28 00:25 |
| balzac | think about the bolshevik revolution | Dec 28 00:25 |
| schestowitz | You're speaking as though I spoke of "Armed revolution" or something | Dec 28 00:26 |
| balzac | it didn't turn out well, did it? | Dec 28 00:26 |
| *itzamna (n=itzamna@i111060.upc-i.chello.nl) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 00:26 | |
| schestowitz | Waking up != Lenin | Dec 28 00:26 |
| schestowitz | C'mon | Dec 28 00:26 |
| balzac | now I support royal families in Japan, England, Saudi Arabia | Dec 28 00:26 |
| MinceR | well, we in absurdistan (hungary) had a revolution-less switch away from socialism, and that didn't work out well either | Dec 28 00:26 |
| MinceR | we basically have the same gangsters | Dec 28 00:26 |
| schestowitz | balzac: in the US it's families like Rockefeller | Dec 28 00:26 |
| schestowitz | Carnegie etc. | Dec 28 00:27 |
| balzac | i just don't support revolutions and chaos. the world is getting by on narrower margins for error than ever before. | Dec 28 00:27 |
| MinceR | not the oldest generation of course, those retired with the stolen riches | Dec 28 00:27 |
| balzac | i supported bloomberg for that reason | Dec 28 00:27 |
| balzac | i didn't think his opponent was ready to administer NYC | Dec 28 00:27 |
| schestowitz | Then there's Rothschild dynasty | Dec 28 00:27 |
| schestowitz | They are even more secretive than Rockefeller | Dec 28 00:27 |
| balzac | no big deal | Dec 28 00:27 |
| schestowitz | Not that places like UAE don't have privileged families too | Dec 28 00:28 |
| schestowitz | balzac: you're suggesting that voting not for the business party is chaos | Dec 28 00:28 |
| schestowitz | Au contraire | Dec 28 00:28 |
| balzac | if the popular will to tear down all the figureheads is accomodated, things will get worse | Dec 28 00:28 |
| schestowitz | It will actually allow feudalism to be lessened | Dec 28 00:28 |
| balzac | schestowitz: no, i support voting for candidates like howard dean and dennis kucinich | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | Bloomberg is a conglomerate | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | It has "business party" all over it | Dec 28 00:29 |
| balzac | for mayor, then congressman, for governor | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | "Let us, the corporations, look after you..." | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | Of course they'll externalise | Dec 28 00:29 |
| balzac | look, you can't get to a very high office with too much aggressive populism | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | Sending out the suffering misery and death to work camps in places like CHina, working for a buck a day | Dec 28 00:29 |
| schestowitz | kucinich is good | Dec 28 00:30 |
| balzac | i supported him, i still support hugo chavez | Dec 28 00:30 |
| schestowitz | He was also endorsed by other good guys like Vidal. | Dec 28 00:30 |
| schestowitz | Paul too is among those who want to actually care for people, not businesses | Dec 28 00:30 |
| schestowitz | Which is why they won't get elected | Dec 28 00:30 |
| balzac | look man, i support communists, royal families, corrupt democratic leaders like Berlusconi | Dec 28 00:30 |
| schestowitz | They need billions just top advertise their presence | Dec 28 00:30 |
| schestowitz | Obama is said to have had $2,000,000,000 spent on promoting it | Dec 28 00:31 |
| balzac | as long as we have some stability, improvements can be made gradually | Dec 28 00:31 |
| schestowitz | Small bucks for corrupt banks | Dec 28 00:31 |
| schestowitz | Goldman banksters are handing out $17bn in BONUSES after robbing the public (bailout) | Dec 28 00:31 |
| balzac | the problem is with social networks, identity politics, and catastrophic victories | Dec 28 00:31 |
| schestowitz | People should be furious, but they are asleep | Dec 28 00:31 |
| MinceR | balzac: as long as you have the stability you want, no change will happen for the better. | Dec 28 00:31 |
| balzac | i want complexity and slow progress | Dec 28 00:31 |
| schestowitz | What complexity? | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | slow progress? | Dec 28 00:32 |
| MinceR | there's no use tweaking minor variables in a system that's rotten to the core. | Dec 28 00:32 |
| balzac | MinceR: controlled chaos is acceptable. One country or another can change, but we can't all change at once without a massice logistical collapse | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | They want progress too | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | They as in corporation | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | They don't want to pay tax | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | That's progress | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | For you to beg them for cash is progress for them | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | And they have been getting it for decades now | Dec 28 00:32 |
| schestowitz | In other terms, things improve | Dec 28 00:33 |
| balzac | i'm becomming like a chinese bureaucrat. i want harmony and prosperity, a harvest sufficient for the hungry people. | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | Like racial and gender equality | Dec 28 00:33 |
| MinceR | and then you steal half the harvest in bribes | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | But in financial term the system goes down the sewer | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | *terms | Dec 28 00:33 |
| balzac | we have barack obama as president. that's a major step for equality among ethnic groups. | Dec 28 00:33 |
| balzac | it's much more significant than people realize. | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | It is | Dec 28 00:33 |
| balzac | that's a big reason to keep giving him slack | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | But that's not the role of president | Dec 28 00:33 |
| schestowitz | Unless he truly is just like the queen giving speeches | Dec 28 00:34 |
| balzac | he's a rather competent president too | Dec 28 00:34 |
| schestowitz | [oh, and waving at the crows] | Dec 28 00:34 |
| MinceR | in other words, you give him slack because he's black | Dec 28 00:34 |
| schestowitz | *crowd | Dec 28 00:34 |
| MinceR | what's that if not racism? :> | Dec 28 00:34 |
| balzac | come on man, the guy is very competent | Dec 28 00:34 |
| balzac | ridiculous to say otherwise. he's the smartest president in years. | Dec 28 00:34 |
| MinceR | that's easy | Dec 28 00:34 |
| balzac | and he has guts too | Dec 28 00:34 |
| MinceR | considering that he was preceded by dubya | Dec 28 00:34 |
| schestowitz | balzac: so why does he make so many poor decisions? | Dec 28 00:34 |
| schestowitz | IMHO | Dec 28 00:34 |
| MinceR | it isn't exactly difficult to be smarter than dubya | Dec 28 00:34 |
| schestowitz | The solutions are simple | Dec 28 00:35 |
| schestowitz | Example: | Dec 28 00:35 |
| balzac | schestowitz: why does he accept so many sub-optimal solutions? because he's a president, not a dictator. | Dec 28 00:35 |
| schestowitz | 1) let fail baksters rot, that's capitalism | Dec 28 00:35 |
| schestowitz | 2) healthcare reform | Dec 28 00:35 |
| balzac | he still has the congress, the corporate media, the military industrial complex | Dec 28 00:35 |
| balzac | and frankly, plenty of hostile foreign governments too | Dec 28 00:35 |
| schestowitz | I hear of stories from friends whose friends died cause they couldn't afford the insurance cartel thingie | Dec 28 00:35 |
| schestowitz | 3) get the MAFIAA out of the government | Dec 28 00:35 |
| MinceR | he'll keep having more hostile foreign governments if Jesusland keeps doing what it does. | Dec 28 00:36 |
| balzac | ok, not necessarily "hostile" but subjectively self-interested and not always helpful | Dec 28 00:36 |
| schestowitz | Not appoint people who shore up racketeering as business model to run commerce | Dec 28 00:36 |
| schestowitz | Get the heck out of the middle east | Dec 28 00:36 |
| MinceR | stop ACTA "negotiations" | Dec 28 00:36 |
| balzac | yeah, i hear you and i agree on what is ideal and what we want to attain | Dec 28 00:36 |
| schestowitz | And while at it, shut down those 1000+ military bases in other people copuntries | Dec 28 00:36 |
| schestowitz | Being an empire isn't 'cool' anymore | Dec 28 00:36 |
| balzac | schestowitz: they all can't get shut down | Dec 28 00:36 |
| schestowitz | It makes resentment, it doesn't impress anyone | Dec 28 00:36 |
| balzac | not without geopolitical instability | Dec 28 00:37 |
| Ender2070 | http://www.pwnage.ca/?p=516 | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | Insatbility is code word | Dec 28 00:37 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Pwnage.ca » Evangelism is War The Mono/Moonlight Agenda .::. Size~: 48.91 KB | Dec 28 00:37 |
| balzac | you can bet other nations with military power will scramble to fill that power vacuum | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | Euphemism for "something that's not good for out interests" | Dec 28 00:37 |
| Ender2070 | more comments, lol | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | They should get over it, they don't own world, agenda | Dec 28 00:37 |
| balzac | bush failed terribly by invading iraq | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | To kill 4 million Vietnamese to spread democracy is not a good thing | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | They destoryed 3 nations while at it | Dec 28 00:37 |
| schestowitz | In south-east Asia | Dec 28 00:37 |
| balzac | the campaign in afghanistan was too ambitious in the first place, not focused well enough on a narrow goal - pursuing al qaeda. | Dec 28 00:38 |
| balzac | the military needs reform | Dec 28 00:38 |
| balzac | but how can these hard problems be solved if smart people like you will just say the whole institution is unecessary? | Dec 28 00:38 |
| schestowitz | Al Qaeda was breeding on US weapons | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | They were used as pawns against the Soviets | Dec 28 00:39 |
| MinceR | i can't see who said the military as a whole was unnecessary | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | And it wasn't them who organised 9/11 | Dec 28 00:39 |
| balzac | that was the origin | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | 9/11 is said to have been planned in Germany | Dec 28 00:39 |
| MinceR | by whom? | Dec 28 00:39 |
| balzac | by who, if not al qaeda? | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | Maybe Osama just bankrolled some of it | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | What is Al Qaeda | Dec 28 00:39 |
| schestowitz | Some say it doesn't actually exist | Dec 28 00:39 |
| balzac | Khalid Sheik Mohammed is about to go on trial right here in NYC | Dec 28 00:39 |
| balzac | he is guilty as hell | Dec 28 00:40 |
| schestowitz | It's a name made up to describe a faction of people | Dec 28 00:40 |
| schestowitz | Watch the BBC documentaries about it | Dec 28 00:40 |
| schestowitz | It's rather enlightening | Dec 28 00:40 |
| balzac | schestowitz: trust me, the ideological group exists, the funding exists, the secret society exists | Dec 28 00:40 |
| balzac | and they try to blow up planes, and one was just caught in the act | Dec 28 00:40 |
| balzac | and nidal hasan | Dec 28 00:40 |
| schestowitz | I believe in "Al Qauea" like I believe in people in a fancy lab and RPG in a _cave_! | Dec 28 00:41 |
| balzac | kille 13 people at fort hood | Dec 28 00:41 |
| schestowitz | Lots of fables | Dec 28 00:41 |
| schestowitz | balzac: fighting them won't help | Dec 28 00:41 |
| schestowitz | It reduces security | Dec 28 00:41 |
| balzac | nevermind the clownish portrayal, the media's role in instigating the continuation of the problem, and all the fake intel | Dec 28 00:41 |
| schestowitz | It helps them recruit more | Dec 28 00:41 |
| balzac | i know all this | Dec 28 00:41 |
| balzac | the bin laden double in the video, and all those audio tapes which are fake | Dec 28 00:41 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft ought to know this. When you fight, you create more resentment | Dec 28 00:42 |
| *wallc_ (i=44e6566b@gateway/web/freenode/x-dinbzvpbvnmczaci) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 00:42 | |
| balzac | schestowitz: exactly | Dec 28 00:42 |
| schestowitz | If they wanted Bin Laden, they would have him | Dec 28 00:42 |
| balzac | he's most likely dead | Dec 28 00:42 |
| wallc_ | Hi! | Dec 28 00:42 |
| schestowitz | Maybe | Dec 28 00:42 |
| balzac | they probably could have caught him at tora bora | Dec 28 00:42 |
| schestowitz | It's rather comical that they pretend to be looking for him in caves | Dec 28 00:42 |
| schestowitz | They could get Saddam and his kids quite quickly | Dec 28 00:42 |
| schestowitz | wallc_: hey | Dec 28 00:42 |
| balzac | iraq is flat, afghanistan is more difficult geographically | Dec 28 00:43 |
| balzac | logistics in afghanistan are a whole different thing | Dec 28 00:43 |
| schestowitz | Did you know about the leaks? | Dec 28 00:43 |
| balzac | anyway, i'm anti war and all of that, but i'm pro-stability and therefore, pro-obama | Dec 28 00:43 |
| schestowitz | Lobby groups for Afghan wars? | Dec 28 00:43 |
| balzac | probably | Dec 28 00:43 |
| MinceR | hay wallc_ | Dec 28 00:44 |
| schestowitz | It seems like the corrupt contractors just want more business (of war) to increase their wuarterly earnings | Dec 28 00:44 |
| *apathy (i=paul@unaffiliated/apathy) has left #boycottnovell | Dec 28 00:44 | |
| schestowitz | They have war lobbies | Dec 28 00:44 |
| balzac | selling the long war that we intend to bring to an end ASAP | Dec 28 00:44 |
| balzac | yes | Dec 28 00:44 |
| wallc_ | Hi MinceR! | Dec 28 00:44 |
| schestowitz | balzac: "stability" is a vague concept | Dec 28 00:44 |
| MinceR | well, that "long war" is "stability" | Dec 28 00:44 |
| balzac | it's not so vague | Dec 28 00:44 |
| schestowitz | "Stability" usually means, "things work as they should... for us" | Dec 28 00:44 |
| schestowitz | Instability can simply mean that someone is in charge who does not take order from the WHite House | Dec 28 00:45 |
| schestowitz | *orders | Dec 28 00:45 |
| schestowitz | Iraq was more stable before the invasion for example | Dec 28 00:45 |
| balzac | that's why I opposed it | Dec 28 00:45 |
| schestowitz | From another POV, Iraq was not stable because it was not occupied from the top or from the ground | Dec 28 00:45 |
| balzac | quite powerfully and consistently for years | Dec 28 00:45 |
| schestowitz | Same issue with Hugo Chavez | Dec 28 00:45 |
| balzac | my resistance to Bush began before he stole the election in 2000 | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | He did | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | THe neo-cons did | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | It was teamwork | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | Getting young George to be standing in front of the press with a fake Texan accent | Dec 28 00:46 |
| balzac | i still seek the end of the occupation in Iraq ASAP | Dec 28 00:46 |
| MinceR | "we've been always at war with eastasia" | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | Same here | Dec 28 00:46 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Eurasia? | Dec 28 00:47 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | Oh | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | I see what you did there | Dec 28 00:47 |
| balzac | you're teaching to the creature, preaching to the teacher | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | Korea, Vietnam, Philippines, Iraq...... | Dec 28 00:47 |
| balzac | i was born converted | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | Oh, Japan before that | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | Turns out the guy behind Manhattan Project had regrets about it... or so he says | Dec 28 00:47 |
| schestowitz | I saw a little interview | Dec 28 00:48 |
| schestowitz | He was weird about it | Dec 28 00:48 |
| schestowitz | No clear remorse | Dec 28 00:48 |
| balzac | i broke with conventional wisdom on hiroshima and nagasaki many years ago | Dec 28 00:48 |
| balzac | that it was necessary to do | Dec 28 00:48 |
| balzac | and for the general good | Dec 28 00:48 |
| schestowitz | ? | Dec 28 00:48 |
| schestowitz | Civilians? | Dec 28 00:48 |
| balzac | it was an epic, catastrophic, massive historical failure which was wrapped in a ribbon of victory | Dec 28 00:49 |
| schestowitz | By the same logic, it's OK to slaughter 4k people because of some missiles falling over Sderrot | Dec 28 00:49 |
| wallc_ | +1 to Balzac | Dec 28 00:49 |
| balzac | and the whole world has suffered decades of nuclear paranoia as a result | Dec 28 00:49 |
| schestowitz | I never accepted what happened there | Dec 28 00:49 |
| schestowitz | balzac: ah , OK | Dec 28 00:49 |
| schestowitz | I thought you meant the opposite | Dec 28 00:49 |
| schestowitz | Sorry | Dec 28 00:49 |
| balzac | schestowitz: I was critical of the heavy handed israeli defense policy as well | Dec 28 00:49 |
| balzac | gaza, beruit, most recently | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | Yes | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | There are prior such incidents in Lebanon | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | With direct US backing even | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | Charlie Chaplin made a speech about brutes taking control | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | Obama may be different after all | Dec 28 00:50 |
| schestowitz | He hasn't started another war | Dec 28 00:51 |
| schestowitz | And I doubt he'll go hardcore w/ Iran | Dec 28 00:51 |
| balzac | yeah, as i mentioned, i was born a convert into the secular humanist, pro-peace and harmony agenda | Dec 28 00:51 |
| schestowitz | So that's a relief | Dec 28 00:51 |
| schestowitz | The Iran thing almost 'exploded' some years ago | Dec 28 00:51 |
| schestowitz | It almost seemed inevitable | Dec 28 00:51 |
| balzac | yeah, I've advised against revolution in Iran | Dec 28 00:51 |
| schestowitz | Anyway, it's left for China to decide | Dec 28 00:51 |
| balzac | and justice for those who've been killed by basij paramilitary forces | Dec 28 00:52 |
| schestowitz | They'll probably rule when we're older | Dec 28 00:52 |
| schestowitz | Tide turns, it's their turn now | Dec 28 00:52 |
| balzac | i make the most boring comments on geopolitical matters | Dec 28 00:52 |
| schestowitz | After Elizabeth the 1st had British dominance for like 5 centuries | Dec 28 00:52 |
| balzac | i ask for mercy for the chinese dissident. just a few years instead of 11 years. | Dec 28 00:52 |
| balzac | it's boring and doesn't have the zeal of the outrage | Dec 28 00:52 |
| schestowitz | US did well for itself since WW2 | Dec 28 00:52 |
| schestowitz | China's worst atrocities are at least behind | Dec 28 00:53 |
| schestowitz | Now the mind control is digital | Dec 28 00:53 |
| schestowitz | It's not longer a mass murder of 60 million people | Dec 28 00:53 |
| balzac | well, more like a combination of social disruption and bad logistics. those killed by bombs, bullets, and bayonets may well have been fewer than the resulting logistical problems caused by war | Dec 28 00:54 |
| schestowitz | If they can naturally decrease population size while growing more technologically advanced, maybe they can become a "Big Japan" | Dec 28 00:54 |
| schestowitz | Seoul and Singapore are like another world | Dec 28 00:54 |
| balzac | and then ideological alienation leading to other logistical failures, leading to famine | Dec 28 00:54 |
| balzac | maybe the whole world can become like a 'big japan' | Dec 28 00:55 |
| schestowitz | Maybe | Dec 28 00:55 |
| schestowitz | Cubicle life | Dec 28 00:55 |
| schestowitz | Seems possible | Dec 28 00:55 |
| balzac | stable and humane, relative to the rest of the world | Dec 28 00:55 |
| schestowitz | trmanco would love that :-) | Dec 28 00:55 |
| schestowitz | He told me :-p | Dec 28 00:55 |
| trmanco | yeah | Dec 28 00:55 |
| balzac | what if things are getting better? | Dec 28 00:56 |
| MinceR | if "the rest of the world" is an empty set, then it is by definition "stable and humane" relative to it | Dec 28 00:56 |
| balzac | just suppose things keep getting more good, less bad as time passes | Dec 28 00:56 |
| MinceR | i don't see things getting better | Dec 28 00:56 |
| schestowitz | Same here | Dec 28 00:56 |
| MinceR | ACTA is coming | Dec 28 00:56 |
| MinceR | for example | Dec 28 00:56 |
| schestowitz | Cautious optimism is a geographical thing | Dec 28 00:56 |
| balzac | what if new york city comes to resemble amsterdam,with liberal policies on the classic vices | Dec 28 00:56 |
| schestowitz | Better for some classes too | Dec 28 00:56 |
| schestowitz | Not globally | Dec 28 00:56 |
| schestowitz | It's a zero-sum game | Dec 28 00:57 |
| balzac | it's nto | Dec 28 00:57 |
| balzac | not | Dec 28 00:57 |
| MinceR | it doesn't have to be a zero-sum game | Dec 28 00:57 |
| schestowitz | True | Dec 28 00:57 |
| schestowitz | It's a minus-something-sum game | Dec 28 00:57 |
| balzac | smooth logistics can make resources go much futher | Dec 28 00:57 |
| schestowitz | Cause we run out of resuces | Dec 28 00:57 |
| balzac | nah | Dec 28 00:57 |
| schestowitz | And the population is not a constant | Dec 28 00:57 |
| MinceR | current human conditioning/mindset makes it a zero-sum game | Dec 28 00:57 |
| MinceR | it can be fixed, but it isn't easy | Dec 28 00:57 |
| balzac | big roll-outs of new technology can save everyone all at once | Dec 28 00:57 |
| schestowitz | Animals too? | Dec 28 00:58 |
| balzac | i agree MinceR, and yet the alternative is harder | Dec 28 00:58 |
| balzac | it'll have to be like that | Dec 28 00:58 |
| balzac | with all the hope and enthusiasm of the copenhagen event, except without so much anxiety and futility | Dec 28 00:58 |
| balzac | there'll be another event like it in Mexico | Dec 28 00:58 |
| MinceR | at least recent research shows that human nature includes altruism | Dec 28 00:58 |
| balzac | we must achieve sweet success or else | Dec 28 00:59 |
| MinceR | so it must be conditioning and learning from others that suppresses it | Dec 28 00:59 |
| balzac | some very powerful people have revealed lately that they can be pursuaded | Dec 28 00:59 |
| balzac | that they're not so "above it all" as they'd been acting | Dec 28 00:59 |
| MinceR | who? and of what? and by whom? | Dec 28 01:00 |
| balzac | i've seen gestures of submission to the popular will from some very powerful and rotten people | Dec 28 01:00 |
| balzac | just the look in their eyes tells me they're ready to play ball | Dec 28 01:00 |
| balzac | i'm not saying submission to anarchy, maybe not even "submission" | Dec 28 01:01 |
| balzac | but a look which tells me there's something of an awakening | Dec 28 01:01 |
| balzac | i won't say who, or else they'll put on a tough face and try to project a ruthless facade again | Dec 28 01:01 |
| MinceR | ic | Dec 28 01:01 |
| balzac | but i haven't seen one of the most powerful people involved in geopolitics or corporate world who hasn't shown a certain look of anxiety in the eyes | Dec 28 01:02 |
| balzac | that says, "let's find a way not to melt down globally" | Dec 28 01:02 |
| schestowitz | They fear for their power | Dec 28 01:02 |
| MinceR | yeah | Dec 28 01:02 |
| balzac | fear is good enough | Dec 28 01:02 |
| MinceR | no world -- nothing to rule over | Dec 28 01:02 |
| schestowitz | A good system would be punishing their greed | Dec 28 01:02 |
| MinceR | also no food, no water, no life | Dec 28 01:02 |
| schestowitz | But it's mostly punishing the people below | Dec 28 01:03 |
| balzac | concern or sympathy for humanity is preferable, but fear is acceptable | Dec 28 01:03 |
| MinceR | it only shows we're in deep shit | Dec 28 01:03 |
| schestowitz | The banksters were betting FOR mortgages to collapse | Dec 28 01:03 |
| schestowitz | And they made a bundle | Dec 28 01:03 |
| schestowitz | While people suffered foreclosures | Dec 28 01:03 |
| balzac | trust me roy, they've all been rattled | Dec 28 01:03 |
| schestowitz | Banker get average bonus of $400,000 for xmas, people get a tent... for the tent city | Dec 28 01:03 |
| balzac | they won't soon forget | Dec 28 01:04 |
| schestowitz | They externalise their cost | Dec 28 01:04 |
| MinceR | yeah, they got a little less millions of dollars of income per year | Dec 28 01:04 |
| schestowitz | Those poor rich people :-) | Dec 28 01:04 |
| MinceR | i feel so sorry for them | Dec 28 01:04 |
| balzac | that's not the point | Dec 28 01:04 |
| balzac | maybe rush limbaugh hasn't be rattle well enough yet | Dec 28 01:04 |
| balzac | but everyone else has | Dec 28 01:05 |
| MinceR | these people can't be "rattled" that way | Dec 28 01:05 |
| balzac | oh yes they can | Dec 28 01:05 |
| schestowitz | rush limbaugh should ne exiled | Dec 28 01:05 |
| schestowitz | He's a danger to his country | Dec 28 01:05 |
| schestowitz | Breeding a mindset that's self-destructive | Dec 28 01:05 |
| schestowitz | Cowboys are so yesterday. | Dec 28 01:05 |
| balzac | not as big a danger anymore because he'll get shaken like a rag doll if he steps into the wrong confrontation | Dec 28 01:06 |
| balzac | they all have to tread very carefully or else they'll get slammed by the media, and there are some rather aggressive guys waiting to dog-pile | Dec 28 01:06 |
| balzac | limbaugh shut up for a long time | Dec 28 01:06 |
| balzac | you know there's a quiet dread in that long absence from the mainstream media | Dec 28 01:07 |
| balzac | i actually had to stand up for bill o'reilly because some dumbasses went so far off the deep end, i was outraged at his opponents more than him. | Dec 28 01:08 |
| balzac | it was like when mincer took a ride on the crazy train months ago | Dec 28 01:08 |
| MinceR | i didn't take a ride on the crazy train | Dec 28 01:09 |
| balzac | let's not discuss it | Dec 28 01:09 |
| MinceR | you're just full of shit as always | Dec 28 01:09 |
| balzac | fine | Dec 28 01:09 |
| MinceR | wanting your buddies steve jobs, steve ballmer, bill gates, etc. live happily ever after on their piles of ill-gotten money | Dec 28 01:09 |
| balzac | nevermind | Dec 28 01:09 |
| MinceR | that's "stability" | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | Yeah | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | Well, I don't know about Stsve Jobs | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | He's a different case | Dec 28 01:10 |
| MinceR | raising the next generation of criminals "see, crime does pay after all!" | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | I don't lump his with Bill , Steve and the Gang | Dec 28 01:10 |
| MinceR | jobs isn't much different | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | Less corruption, I think | Dec 28 01:10 |
| MinceR | he just wasn't as good at the game as the m$ guys | Dec 28 01:10 |
| schestowitz | Except the stock backdating scandal | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: you can't judge based on intent | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | Same with Google | Dec 28 01:11 |
| MinceR | same control-freak mentality over "customers" | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | Some scrutinise them cause they /might/ abuse | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | But they don't quiet yet | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | That's the difference | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: OK, that I agree with | Dec 28 01:11 |
| MinceR | should we wait until google installs webcams in our homes then? | Dec 28 01:11 |
| schestowitz | But still, Bill and Steve did crimes | Dec 28 01:12 |
| schestowitz | Abusing customers is not a crime | Dec 28 01:12 |
| MinceR | tying is, though :> | Dec 28 01:12 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Google Home? | Dec 28 01:12 |
| MinceR | Google Big Brother | Dec 28 01:12 |
| schestowitz | Goooooooooooooogle all the way to da livin' room! | Dec 28 01:12 |
| schestowitz | Vroom vroom! | Dec 28 01:12 |
| MinceR | gn | Dec 28 01:13 |
| balzac | later MinceR | Dec 28 01:13 |
| schestowitz | But you know what Schmidt would say.... | Dec 28 01:13 |
| schestowitz | You would not mind having Google cams in the house unless you have dead corpse there | Dec 28 01:13 |
| tessier | schestowitz: 4 million Vietnamese were killed to stop communism as much as to spread democracy. The other side killed 4 million to spread communism and stop democracy. | Dec 28 01:13 |
| balzac | schmidt got a little carried away for sure | Dec 28 01:13 |
| MinceR | yeah. if i don't want him to see me on the toilet then i must be hiding something and being up to something evil | Dec 28 01:14 |
| tessier | They have a long history (which continues to this day) of making disastrous decisions for their country. | Dec 28 01:14 |
| balzac | google should be more amenable to destroying data | Dec 28 01:14 |
| *tessier is going to the airport Tuesday to pick up his wife returning from Christmas in Vietnam which is still a shitty country thanks to alleged socialists who are really just corrupt capitalists | Dec 28 01:15 | |
| balzac | at this point, data storage is so cheap, and privacy so rare, and so many business models are based on accumulating data, the company which agrees to destroy data is the one which is less 'evi'. | Dec 28 01:15 |
| balzac | evil | Dec 28 01:15 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: *did* you do something evil in the bowl then? :-) | Dec 28 01:15 |
| balzac | but i figure nobody is destroying data unless they're too cheap to save it | Dec 28 01:15 |
| *tessier studies surface analysis charts | Dec 28 01:15 | |
| balzac | everything is now on the record for all time | Dec 28 01:15 |
| schestowitz | Do no evil, do not poo-poo | Dec 28 01:15 |
| schestowitz | Brought to you by Google... | Dec 28 01:16 |
| *fewa_ (n=fewa__@c-67-168-200-83.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 01:16 | |
| balzac | google is going to want to scan your droppings eventually | Dec 28 01:16 |
| balzac | google doodoo | Dec 28 01:16 |
| balzac | jk | Dec 28 01:16 |
| schestowitz | tessier: thanks. It's good to know the other side of the story | Dec 28 01:16 |
| balzac | no, that will be another business, not scanning, but recycling. they will monitor the substance of sewage. | Dec 28 01:17 |
| schestowitz | balzac: for that Google HeathThing... | Dec 28 01:17 |
| balzac | not individual crappings, but the aggregate | Dec 28 01:17 |
| schestowitz | They'll want samples for you to monitor progress | Dec 28 01:17 |
| balzac | it'll be a sewage recycling startup | Dec 28 01:17 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[tracyrreed] Soon there will be no more bathroom access on airlines: If you can't hold it you must be a terrist! | Dec 28 01:17 | |
| schestowitz | balzac: http://newsblaze.com/story/2009122113281400001.bw/topstory.html | Dec 28 01:18 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Oregon's DMC partners with Microsoft to put Patients in Charge .::. Size~: 32.78 KB | Dec 28 01:18 |
| schestowitz | pretending that giving a convicted a monopolist control of people's intimate data and allowing locking is actually "put[ting] Patients in Charge" | Dec 28 01:18 |
| fewa_ | doublespeak | Dec 28 01:18 |
| schestowitz | Yeah | Dec 28 01:18 |
| schestowitz | total reversal of the truth | Dec 28 01:18 |
| schestowitz | "Give us your data..." | Dec 28 01:18 |
| schestowitz | We'll let you control it | Dec 28 01:19 |
| Omar87 | Hi all. | Dec 28 01:19 |
| *Takyoji (n=caleb870@24-177-111-78.dhcp.roch.mn.charter.com) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 01:19 | |
| balzac | you're right | Dec 28 01:20 |
| balzac | the government needs to be stronger | Dec 28 01:20 |
| balzac | obama needs more power | Dec 28 01:20 |
| balzac | i said the same of hu jintao | Dec 28 01:20 |
| tessier | I think in this case the citizens need some more rights | Dec 28 01:20 |
| balzac | a stronger central leadership in china can lead to less paranoia about a dissident circulating a petition | Dec 28 01:20 |
| tessier | The govt does not mean the president. | Dec 28 01:20 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft Fails to Understand #SaaS with #GNU #Linux http://ur1.ca/im2f | Dec 28 01:20 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Cloud over the IT world in 2010? Survey results & what next for Windows? « OPEN BYTES cave quid dicis, quando, et cui. .::. Size~: 46.38 KB | Dec 28 01:21 |
| balzac | stronger president means weaker corporations | Dec 28 01:21 |
| tessier | In this case more power would be given to the courts in the form of more laws they can enforce when private citizens bring suit | Dec 28 01:21 |
| balzac | corporations are out of control | Dec 28 01:21 |
| balzac | now that we have a president who is not leering sadistically and promising to bring his "deliverance" style justice all over the world, I want him to have the power to get the critical work done. | Dec 28 01:21 |
| balzac | Give Obama more power, and lobbyists will be weakened | Dec 28 01:22 |
| balzac | he is a good guy | Dec 28 01:22 |
| balzac | therefore, public support is crucial | Dec 28 01:22 |
| balzac | why did we have an escalation in afghanistan? | Dec 28 01:22 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Matter of Perspective When Analysing/Comparing Operating Systems http://it.toolbox.com/blogs/locutus/its-the-eye-of-the-beholder-36076 | Dec 28 01:22 | |
| balzac | because president obama's domestic critics were too powerful relative to him | Dec 28 01:22 |
| balzac | stuff them back in their box, close the lid and bad problems can be ended | Dec 28 01:23 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] How #GNU #Linux Became a Viable Desktop Operating System Over the Years http://ur1.ca/im2i | Dec 28 01:23 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 15 game-changing Linux moments of the decade | News | TechRadar UK .::. Size~: 66.06 KB | Dec 28 01:23 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Dubai Company to Launch #GNU #Linux Server Product http://www.ameinfo.com/219669.html | Dec 28 01:25 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Habl to introduce revolutionary server solution in 2010 | Habl Consultancy | AMEinfo.com .::. Size~: 33.95 KB | Dec 28 01:25 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Fedora Omega 12 (Simpler Than Fedora) Launched, Screenshots up http://www.my-seo-company.com/index.php?linux&release=Fedora%20Omega%2012 | Dec 28 01:26 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Fedora Omega 12 Screenshots - Screenshots of Fedora Omega 12 - Linux, BSD, and Solaris Screenshots .::. Size~: 24.09 KB | Dec 28 01:27 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #RSSOwl 2.0.1 is Out, #OpenTumblr Goes #Qt http://ur1.ca/im2r http://ur1.ca/ikfu | Dec 28 01:28 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: TuxArena: RSSOwl 2.0.1 Review - Feature-Rich Feed Reader for Linux .::. Size~: 104.27 KB | Dec 28 01:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: OMG! UBUNTU!: OpenTumblr Goes QT, [Desktop Tumblr App] .::. Size~: 87.15 KB | Dec 28 01:29 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Short Reviews of #Sabayon #GNU #Linux 5.1 and #BrowserLinux http://ur1.ca/im2s http://ur1.ca/im2t | Dec 28 01:29 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Sabayon 5.1 : Another good KDE distribution « Linux is Freedom .::. Size~: 17.25 KB | Dec 28 01:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Have Laptop Will Travel » Blog Archive » BrowserLinux: a Linux distro with a browser, and nothing much else .::. Size~: 30.88 KB | Dec 28 01:30 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Ubuntu 10.04 Alpha 1 in Review, http://gadgetmix.com/index/ubuntu-10-04-lucid-lynx-alpha-1-review/ | Dec 28 01:31 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Sabily 9.10 (Muslim #Ubuntu Derivative) Out http://news.softpedia.com/news/Sabily-9-10-Is-Based-on-Karmic-Koala-130612.shtml | Dec 28 01:31 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Ubuntu 10.04 Lucid Lynx Alpha 1 review : Netbook Reviews and News: GadgetMix .::. Size~: 58.21 KB | Dec 28 01:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Sabily 9.10 Is Based on Karmic Koala - Codename Gaza - Softpedia .::. Size~: 47.99 KB | Dec 28 01:32 |
| schestowitz | [01:22] <balzac> why did we have an escalation in afghanistan? | Dec 28 01:36 |
| schestowitz | There was a lobby | Dec 28 01:36 |
| schestowitz | This was covered in a major political site whose name I'm not typically familiar with | Dec 28 01:36 |
| schestowitz | The military industrial complex still has a lot of power | Dec 28 01:36 |
| schestowitz | Why would they not use this power if they could? | Dec 28 01:36 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Sub-$100 #GNU #Linux PCs Target #Africa http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/184709/cherrypal_offers_laptop_for_under_100.html | Dec 28 01:40 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Cherrypal Offers Laptop for Under $100 - PC World Business Center .::. Size~: 61.72 KB | Dec 28 01:40 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #FreeSoftware Concepts Now Applied to Movement http://ur1.ca/im3l | Dec 28 01:41 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Asian ‘campers’ troop to Cavite, reinforce open-source movement | Manila Bulletin .::. Size~: 21.7 KB | Dec 28 01:42 |
| wallc_ | well, I better go for now. Dinner's ready (chili and fresh, home-made cornbread!), I'd be happy to share with all of you if I could...maybe someday we'll have a BN IRC convention somewhere...I'll bring the chili. : ) | Dec 28 01:43 |
| wallc_ | bye for now, take care... | Dec 28 01:43 |
| *wallc_ has quit ("Page closed") | Dec 28 01:43 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Bad Examples of #CivilRights in #China and #Venezuela (Censorship, Jail) http://ur1.ca/im3p http://ur1.ca/im3q | Dec 28 01:44 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] List of Lesser-known #FreeSoftware Contributions from #Google http://techie-buzz.com/featured/google-open-source-projects.html | Dec 28 01:47 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Google Open Source Projects You Didnt Know About .::. Size~: 49.75 KB | Dec 28 01:48 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Linux Has #IntellectualMonopolies -Free #Seamonkey (Iceape), #Thunderbird (Icedove) http://ur1.ca/im44 | Dec 28 01:50 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #ACM Attacks Freedom of Thought, #OpenAccess http://ur1.ca/i4zn #luddite | Dec 28 01:52 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Real-Time Rendering · US Gov Requests Feedback on Open Access ACM Gets it Wrong (Again) .::. Size~: 45.08 KB | Dec 28 01:53 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] The #Microsoft credit card (cartoon) http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20091227 | Dec 28 01:53 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Groklaw is Piling up Evidence of #Microsoft Crimes http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=2009122612211929 | Dec 28 01:53 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Groklaw - Finishing up the Comes Collection - Please Can You Help? .::. Size~: 53.04 KB | Dec 28 01:54 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Drupal Module Adds #ODF Support http://opendocument.xml.org/product/drupal-odf-import | Dec 28 01:56 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Drupal ODF Import | Open Document .::. Size~: 13.23 KB | Dec 28 01:56 |
| fewa_ | meh | Dec 28 02:01 |
| fewa_ | there is a distinction of "strong" leaders | Dec 28 02:01 |
| fewa_ | hitler was strong | Dec 28 02:01 |
| fewa_ | FDR was also strong | Dec 28 02:02 |
| fewa_ | one dismantled democratic institutions, the other did not | Dec 28 02:02 |
| fewa_ | it was the authoritarian supreme court that gave FDR trouble | Dec 28 02:04 |
| fewa_ | in the house of reps you had at least some helpful dialogue | Dec 28 02:05 |
| fewa_ | eg Huey Long | Dec 28 02:05 |
| fewa_ | but quite honestly the presidential system is horribly broken | Dec 28 02:06 |
| schestowitz | Whose? | Dec 28 02:06 |
| fewa_ | well, i guess Bolivia did it quite well recently.... | Dec 28 02:07 |
| *_goblin has quit ("Ex-Chat") | Dec 28 02:07 | |
| fewa_ | contrasting with the parlimentary system where majority of MPs elect PM | Dec 28 02:08 |
| fewa_ | and the much larger problem is the continually shrinking public sphere | Dec 28 02:09 |
| fewa_ | the continual attack on democratic institutions with private tyrannies | Dec 28 02:09 |
| fewa_ | (corporations) | Dec 28 02:09 |
| schestowitz | fewa_: yes, Bolivia | Dec 28 02:14 |
| schestowitz | I only recently found out who it was named after | Dec 28 02:14 |
| schestowitz | Anyway, they take the yoke off now | Dec 28 02:15 |
| fewa_ | 85% voter turnout | Dec 28 02:15 |
| fewa_ | voter understand issues | Dec 28 02:15 |
| fewa_ | issues are real issues | Dec 28 02:20 |
| fewa_ | 1,77% population growth rate | Dec 28 02:21 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Been giving FreeCiv a look. Since Im a fan of the early Civilisation game I am loving it! #foss #linux #freeciv | Dec 28 02:21 | |
| fewa_ | ahh: Roman Catholic 95% | Dec 28 02:22 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] and thats me done for the evening! Tired. Time for bed! | Dec 28 02:22 | |
| Ender2070 | Wesnoth kicks ass | Dec 28 02:49 |
| Ender2070 | the fedora kde sig got me interested in it | Dec 28 02:49 |
| fewa_ | yeah | Dec 28 02:49 |
| fewa_ | wesnoth is awesome | Dec 28 02:49 |
| fewa_ | freeciv: meh | Dec 28 02:49 |
| fewa_ | not very good | Dec 28 02:49 |
| Ender2070 | wesnoth doesnt require a proprietary binary driver either | Dec 28 02:50 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 28 02:50 |
| schestowitz | fewa_: is that growth rate per how many years? | Dec 28 02:52 |
| fewa_ | per year | Dec 28 02:52 |
| schestowitz | it can also mean high mortality | Dec 28 02:52 |
| fewa_ | 1.77 | Dec 28 02:52 |
| schestowitz | Or low longevity | Dec 28 02:52 |
| fewa_ | no | Dec 28 02:52 |
| fewa_ | this cancells that out | Dec 28 02:52 |
| fewa_ | its birth rate - death rate | Dec 28 02:52 |
| schestowitz | That's fast population growth | Dec 28 02:52 |
| schestowitz | The rule says 7 is the magic number | Dec 28 02:53 |
| schestowitz | DOubling rate | Dec 28 02:53 |
| fewa_ | not really | Dec 28 02:53 |
| fewa_ | its a log | Dec 28 02:53 |
| fewa_ | 1.0177^x = 2 | Dec 28 02:53 |
| schestowitz | How many years to double? | Dec 28 02:53 |
| fewa_ | ln(2)/ln(1.0177) | Dec 28 02:55 |
| fewa_ | 39.5 years | Dec 28 02:56 |
| fewa_ | at 1,77 rate, not yield | Dec 28 03:10 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Microsoft ’s Gates Seeks More #Monopolies http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/27/gates-smoke-education-monopoly/ #spin #imperialism | Dec 28 03:18 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsofts Gates Seeks More Monopolies | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 122.57 KB | Dec 28 03:19 |
| schestowitz | That's still high | Dec 28 03:20 |
| schestowitz | Doubling in less than 2 generations | Dec 28 03:20 |
| schestowitz | Germany's is one of the lowest IIRC | Dec 28 03:20 |
| schestowitz | Scandinavia trailing | Dec 28 03:20 |
| *Balrog has quit () | Dec 28 03:22 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #AlexisdeTocqueville #Microsoft -Funded Anti- #Linux Paper Gets Leaked http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/27/alexis-de-tocqueville-leak/ | Dec 28 03:48 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Alexis de Tocquevilles Microsoft-Funded Anti-Linux Paper Gets Leaked | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 111.92 KB | Dec 28 03:49 |
| schestowitz | http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/why-copyleft.html | Dec 28 03:59 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Why Copyleft? - GNU Project - Free Software Foundation (FSF) .::. Size~: 9.1 KB | Dec 28 03:59 |
| schestowitz | gn | Dec 28 03:59 |
| *fewa_ has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) | Dec 28 04:06 | |
| Ender2070 | good stuff | Dec 28 04:06 |
| balzac | GNU rules | Dec 28 04:16 |
| Ender2070 | yes it does | Dec 28 04:17 |
| balzac | i still think my business plan is sound but a solid plan gets no attention | Dec 28 04:17 |
| Ender2070 | ? | Dec 28 04:17 |
| Ender2070 | hey, a solid business plan is heresy in the business world | Dec 28 04:18 |
| balzac | i need to be talking about cloudonomics to get anyone's interest | Dec 28 04:18 |
| balzac | cloudonomies, your data belongs to everyone wheee | Dec 28 04:18 |
| balzac | my business plan is basically to take GNU as a brand to the masses | Dec 28 04:19 |
| balzac | and all the most powerfully-licensed software | Dec 28 04:19 |
| Ender2070 | sounds good | Dec 28 04:20 |
| balzac | and to build a dev business standardized around the most uncompromised projects | Dec 28 04:20 |
| balzac | but there is no money for a small businessman, nor for someone who isn't trying to compromise their business plan from it's very inception | Dec 28 04:21 |
| balzac | you've got to say all the crap people want to hear about cloudonomies or something nebulus and lacking in meaning | Dec 28 04:22 |
| balzac | and add a harvard MBA and some nepotism | Dec 28 04:22 |
| balzac | be a relative or married to someone | Dec 28 04:22 |
| balzac | or be a solitary genius like Richard Stallman who goes forth like John Henry | Dec 28 04:23 |
| balzac | not everyone can do that | Dec 28 04:23 |
| Ender2070 | RMS isnt solitary | Dec 28 04:24 |
| balzac | well, i'm just saying he committed to his plan and worked really hard for a very long time | Dec 28 04:24 |
| balzac | i'm not ever going to be so productive of code | Dec 28 04:25 |
| Ender2070 | don't give up, lol | Dec 28 04:26 |
| balzac | i'm not, but it's going on the back burner | Dec 28 04:26 |
| balzac | i should be a highly-paid consultant | Dec 28 04:26 |
| balzac | getting huge government contracts | Dec 28 04:26 |
| Ender2070 | why not? | Dec 28 04:26 |
| balzac | because, i can't stand working alone and i can't find anyone to work with | Dec 28 04:27 |
| Ender2070 | can't get some co-op students or volunteers? | Dec 28 04:28 |
| balzac | it's too much to be looking at software shangri la, to have the right answers, and to languish | Dec 28 04:28 |
| balzac | no, i lost my office anyway | Dec 28 04:28 |
| Ender2070 | where are you from | Dec 28 04:28 |
| balzac | doesn't matter as much as where i live now - nyc | Dec 28 04:29 |
| Ender2070 | have you considered ontario? | Dec 28 04:29 |
| balzac | i have to scale down my ambitions and just get back to learning - on my own time | Dec 28 04:29 |
| balzac | i'm not going anywhere | Dec 28 04:30 |
| Ender2070 | have you looked into government grants and such? | Dec 28 04:30 |
| Ender2070 | i know you can get them in ontario where I am | Dec 28 04:31 |
| balzac | i even got some choice work to do, but i can't do it by myself | Dec 28 04:31 |
| balzac | there's too much territory to cover and it's too easy to get distracted | Dec 28 04:31 |
| Ender2070 | what would u have to do thats too much? | Dec 28 04:32 |
| balzac | just putting in a solid day of work by myself - i can't even stay focused that long anymore | Dec 28 04:33 |
| balzac | now i'll have to buy out of a contract and get back to blue collar work | Dec 28 04:33 |
| balzac | i'll pay out my client on a blue collar wage for the second time, i didn't finish | Dec 28 04:34 |
| balzac | that's enough for me | Dec 28 04:34 |
| balzac | software is a crappy business if you can't get along with people | Dec 28 04:35 |
| Ender2070 | cant get along? were u getting into fights or something? | Dec 28 04:36 |
| balzac | and i honestly can't stand carrying a computer around | Dec 28 04:36 |
| balzac | nor working from home | Dec 28 04:36 |
| balzac | Ender2070: small clients with big expectations and bad tempers | Dec 28 04:37 |
| balzac | i tried to grind it out, working for small businessmen | Dec 28 04:37 |
| balzac | because i wanted to choose my own software and be self employed | Dec 28 04:38 |
| Ender2070 | you'll run into that everywhere though | Dec 28 04:38 |
| balzac | yeah, and I'll have to let it go | Dec 28 04:38 |
| Ender2070 | I used to fix computers for your average joe, for $20 diagnostic they expected the full nine yards | Dec 28 04:38 |
| balzac | keep my software, but stop taking clients | Dec 28 04:38 |
| balzac | yeah, because the software landscape is a mess with the lack of standardization | Dec 28 04:39 |
| Ender2070 | im going into the software dev industry | Dec 28 04:39 |
| Ender2070 | via schooling | Dec 28 04:39 |
| *fewa_ (n=fewa__@c-67-168-200-83.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 04:39 | |
| balzac | that can work, but what kind of compromises are you prepared to make? | Dec 28 04:39 |
| balzac | will you use proprietary development tools? | Dec 28 04:40 |
| Ender2070 | ny goal is redhat | Dec 28 04:40 |
| Ender2070 | fuck proprietary | Dec 28 04:40 |
| balzac | fine, you can do it if you have the energy | Dec 28 04:40 |
| Ender2070 | how old are you? | Dec 28 04:41 |
| balzac | 34 | Dec 28 04:41 |
| balzac | my learning has slowed down some | Dec 28 04:41 |
| Ender2070 | im only 25 | Dec 28 04:41 |
| Ender2070 | how long have you been into software dev? | Dec 28 04:42 |
| balzac | if i'd started with free software i'd have been better off | Dec 28 04:42 |
| balzac | i've never been a software developer, just a web designer turned developer | Dec 28 04:42 |
| balzac | i quit using proprietary software, which cuts me off from a lot of good jobs | Dec 28 04:42 |
| Ender2070 | ohh | Dec 28 04:42 |
| balzac | but good riddance | Dec 28 04:42 |
| Ender2070 | dreamweaver and shit> | Dec 28 04:42 |
| Ender2070 | ? | Dec 28 04:43 |
| balzac | i've been using emacs for a couple years now, it seems | Dec 28 04:43 |
| balzac | but yeah, i used dreamweaver from version 1 til version 8 | Dec 28 04:43 |
| balzac | now i don't touch any proprietary dev tools | Dec 28 04:43 |
| Ender2070 | I used a bit of dreamweaver in high school | Dec 28 04:43 |
| Ender2070 | its over rated to use anything but a text editor | Dec 28 04:44 |
| balzac | once you're my age, if you're not a well-paid sysadmin, developer, or manager, you've basically failed | Dec 28 04:44 |
| balzac | emacs is nice | Dec 28 04:44 |
| Ender2070 | emacs could be an OS | Dec 28 04:45 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 28 04:45 |
| balzac | it has a very good core | Dec 28 04:45 |
| Ender2070 | its probably the most advanced text editor out there | Dec 28 04:45 |
| balzac | i agree, and i'm only scratching the surface | Dec 28 04:46 |
| balzac | if i had a company, all my devs would use emacs | Dec 28 04:46 |
| balzac | i would dictate like kim jong il on what software to use | Dec 28 04:47 |
| balzac | my company would crush the competition | Dec 28 04:47 |
| balzac | but i have to find funding and i can't stand it as a profession if i have no workers | Dec 28 04:48 |
| balzac | i'll be more productive as a hobbyist than a failing freelance professional | Dec 28 04:49 |
| balzac | i'll start to enjoy it again when the pressure is off | Dec 28 04:50 |
| Ender2070 | government grant? | Dec 28 04:50 |
| balzac | never | Dec 28 04:50 |
| Ender2070 | why not? | Dec 28 04:50 |
| balzac | the government had to bail out the aristocrats | Dec 28 04:50 |
| Ender2070 | cant be that bad | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | they're not handing money out to the plees | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | plebes | Dec 28 04:51 |
| Ender2070 | my government is offering out 30K cheques to startups | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | nah, you can't get a small business loan without great credit | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | loans are available to those who don't need them | Dec 28 04:51 |
| Ender2070 | are you incorporated? | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | not yet | Dec 28 04:51 |
| Ender2070 | get it | Dec 28 04:51 |
| balzac | disruptech.com | Dec 28 04:52 |
| Ender2070 | then its not in your name and not your credit, iirc | Dec 28 04:52 |
| balzac | i will get around to it when i finish paying debts | Dec 28 04:52 |
| balzac | the thing to keep in mind about the financial elite is that they wouldn't exist as an economic class if you could get there merely by working hard or having good ideas | Dec 28 04:53 |
| balzac | wealth is defined by the relationship of the wealthy to the rest | Dec 28 04:54 |
| balzac | wealth is relative | Dec 28 04:54 |
| Ender2070 | wealth is all tied to connections | Dec 28 04:54 |
| balzac | yeah, well some people accomplished great weath only through a few good ideas | Dec 28 04:55 |
| balzac | but that era has passed. it was like a gold rush. | Dec 28 04:55 |
| Ender2070 | they usually have ties to wealthy people | Dec 28 04:55 |
| Ender2070 | Bill Gates didn't start off poor, his dad was already rich | Dec 28 04:55 |
| balzac | now once in a while, a person has the right idea at the right time and gains wealth independently | Dec 28 04:55 |
| Ender2070 | not as rich as he became, but it wasnt a rags to riches story | Dec 28 04:56 |
| balzac | yeah, but he multiplied his dad's fortune many times | Dec 28 04:56 |
| balzac | there are plenty of 'rags to riches' stories facilitate by the internet economic boom | Dec 28 04:56 |
| balzac | but that was an era of its own | Dec 28 04:56 |
| balzac | you need more than a gimmick or a stroke of good luck | Dec 28 04:56 |
| balzac | and dedication to that great idea | Dec 28 04:57 |
| Ender2070 | can't you find people to do web design and server work remotely? you could do the in house stuff yourself | Dec 28 04:57 |
| balzac | i can't stand working remotely | Dec 28 04:57 |
| Ender2070 | why? | Dec 28 04:58 |
| balzac | too much inconvenience and latency in communication | Dec 28 04:58 |
| balzac | i don't even like text messaging very much | Dec 28 04:58 |
| balzac | i prefer to talk on the phone and rest my hands and eyes | Dec 28 04:59 |
| balzac | screen sharing is a good option | Dec 28 04:59 |
| Ender2070 | you don't have to put up with it forever | Dec 28 04:59 |
| Ender2070 | just to get started | Dec 28 04:59 |
| balzac | but then you need something like skype | Dec 28 04:59 |
| Ender2070 | theres a skype replacment coming very soon :) | Dec 28 05:00 |
| balzac | yeah, i'm excited about that | Dec 28 05:00 |
| balzac | anything to destroy the profits of the phone cartels | Dec 28 05:00 |
| balzac | i'm pissed that our military personnel have to pay for telephone services | Dec 28 05:00 |
| Ender2070 | hehe | Dec 28 05:00 |
| Ender2070 | seriously? | Dec 28 05:00 |
| balzac | well, the President asked people to donate phone cards to them | Dec 28 05:01 |
| balzac | why don't they just stop billing them? | Dec 28 05:01 |
| balzac | wtf? | Dec 28 05:01 |
| balzac | stop frigging billing them | Dec 28 05:01 |
| Ender2070 | damn | Dec 28 05:01 |
| balzac | but the telecommunications companies are afraid of opening up any lines of communication for free | Dec 28 05:01 |
| Ender2070 | well, probably a price the government pays to keep their secret spy rooms up with AT&T | Dec 28 05:01 |
| balzac | no free network access can be tolerated, or else it begs the question, why are we paying to connect? | Dec 28 05:02 |
| balzac | now the telecommunications companies have become gate-keepers | Dec 28 05:02 |
| Ender2070 | canadian military doesn't have the same problem however | Dec 28 05:02 |
| balzac | they're not liberating us, they're controlling the tubes | Dec 28 05:02 |
| Ender2070 | i have friends I talk to on msn, they get free wifi | Dec 28 05:02 |
| balzac | knowing the corporations in the USA, they probably make our deployed military personnel pay for emergency communications | Dec 28 05:03 |
| Ender2070 | when i say msn i mean kopete, not messenger itself | Dec 28 05:03 |
| balzac | don't have any minutes on your phone card? you can't call for back up and you'll get toasted. | Dec 28 05:03 |
| balzac | i'm exaggerating, but probably not by much | Dec 28 05:04 |
| cubezzz | bah | Dec 28 05:04 |
| cubezzz | using MSN is hardly ideal | Dec 28 05:04 |
| Ender2070 | I know | Dec 28 05:04 |
| Ender2070 | i wish my friends would switch | Dec 28 05:04 |
| Ender2070 | gtalk could've been a hit if google didnt keep gmail exclusive for the first year or two | Dec 28 05:05 |
| balzac | I wish every ISP could be forced to provide 50% carrying capacity for public use for free | Dec 28 05:06 |
| cubezzz | what is the FOSS equivalent to MSN? | Dec 28 05:06 |
| balzac | the rest they can sell for their non-neutral business plan | Dec 28 05:06 |
| Ender2070 | i have one friend who uses gtalk | Dec 28 05:07 |
| balzac | it's a service, there is no FOSS equivalent | Dec 28 05:07 |
| Ender2070 | cubezzz - the protocol google uses with gtalk, XMPP | Dec 28 05:07 |
| Ender2070 | ie, jabber | Dec 28 05:07 |
| balzac | MSN as a messnger service? | Dec 28 05:07 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 05:07 |
| cubezzz | the network itself I mean | Dec 28 05:07 |
| Ender2070 | instant messaging | Dec 28 05:08 |
| cubezzz | google talk seems to require doze | Dec 28 05:09 |
| Ender2070 | nah | Dec 28 05:09 |
| Ender2070 | I use it in kopete | Dec 28 05:09 |
| cubezzz | ok, I have that | Dec 28 05:10 |
| cubezzz | let me take another look at this | Dec 28 05:10 |
| cubezzz | too old probably | Dec 28 05:11 |
| Ender2070 | it uses XMPP | Dec 28 05:11 |
| Ender2070 | gtalk is just googles version | Dec 28 05:12 |
| *fewa_ has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)) | Dec 28 05:12 | |
| Ender2070 | you could setup your own jabber server if you wanted | Dec 28 05:12 |
| cubezzz | I could | Dec 28 05:12 |
| cubezzz | I bet MSN deletes people off their network if they don't use their accounts for a long time | Dec 28 05:14 |
| Ender2070 | yes it does | Dec 28 05:14 |
| Ender2070 | hotmail users anyways | Dec 28 05:14 |
| cubezzz | I don't seem to be on their passport thing now | Dec 28 05:15 |
| cubezzz | but I forget what my password was anyway | Dec 28 05:15 |
| Ender2070 | i use their passport system | Dec 28 05:15 |
| Ender2070 | my concern with using msn is the patriot act | Dec 28 05:16 |
| Ender2070 | us government spying on my conversations | Dec 28 05:16 |
| Ender2070 | a lot of my friends are windows users who think im a zealot and wont try alternatives | Dec 28 05:17 |
| cubezzz | we are logged here :) | Dec 28 05:17 |
| cubezzz | what about me? | Dec 28 05:17 |
| Ender2070 | lol its obvious were logged here though | Dec 28 05:17 |
| Ender2070 | its in your face | Dec 28 05:17 |
| cubezzz | totally | Dec 28 05:17 |
| cubezzz | actually people don't think I'm a zealot | Dec 28 05:18 |
| cubezzz | the difference is, I've been around a long time so I know what the world was like before Microsoft existed at all | Dec 28 05:18 |
| Ender2070 | my friends are young like me and find nothing wrong with microsoft | Dec 28 05:19 |
| cubezzz | nothing? :) | Dec 28 05:19 |
| balzac | nothing? | Dec 28 05:19 |
| cubezzz | non programmers I guess | Dec 28 05:19 |
| balzac | microsoft's perception management department has done a good job of managing your perception of them | Dec 28 05:19 |
| Ender2070 | im a non programmer technically | Dec 28 05:19 |
| cubezzz | it's so much easier to convince the programmer type | Dec 28 05:19 |
| Ender2070 | im only starting to learn but i've been into the scene for a while | Dec 28 05:19 |
| cubezzz | let me describe the computer world of 1979 :) | Dec 28 05:20 |
| balzac | unix | Dec 28 05:21 |
| balzac | is there anything else? | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | there was no Windows, no MS DOS, (well maybe there was DOS but I didn't see it) | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | sure | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | CP/M | Dec 28 05:21 |
| balzac | what's that? | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | the father of MS DOS basically | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CP/M | Dec 28 05:21 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: CP/M - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 82.04 KB | Dec 28 05:21 |
| cubezzz | in 1979 there was BSD | Dec 28 05:22 |
| cubezzz | and a ton of ROM based basic DOSes | Dec 28 05:22 |
| cubezzz | now you see the significance of Digital Research | Dec 28 05:22 |
| cubezzz | basically erased by Microsoft | Dec 28 05:23 |
| Ender2070 | yeah | Dec 28 05:23 |
| cubezzz | it wasn't open source back then, but now it is | Dec 28 05:23 |
| Ender2070 | I was embittered by having to use their products | Dec 28 05:23 |
| balzac | what os are u using now? | Dec 28 05:24 |
| cubezzz | and now you miss them? :) | Dec 28 05:24 |
| cubezzz | me? | Dec 28 05:24 |
| balzac | sure, either, both | Dec 28 05:24 |
| cubezzz | I'm using mostly GNU/Linux based systems | Dec 28 05:24 |
| Ender2070 | one of my good friends uses linux casually, but he wont use it without defiling it with ms office | Dec 28 05:24 |
| Ender2070 | im using Fedora 12 myself | Dec 28 05:24 |
| balzac | ubuntu | Dec 28 05:24 |
| cubezzz | let's see... in order: | Dec 28 05:25 |
| balzac | cubezzz: currently? | Dec 28 05:25 |
| cubezzz | balzac, yeah, for work too, everything | Dec 28 05:25 |
| balzac | which one now? | Dec 28 05:25 |
| cubezzz | my main box is FC1 which I continually modify | Dec 28 05:26 |
| cubezzz | I also have a zaurus which is embedix 2.4.6 | Dec 28 05:26 |
| cubezzz | there's various Fedora boxes around, F10 | Dec 28 05:27 |
| balzac | i've installed a dozen different GNU/Linux distros | Dec 28 05:28 |
| balzac | but i'm using ubuntu | Dec 28 05:28 |
| balzac | on my home systems and my servers | Dec 28 05:28 |
| Ender2070 | same | Dec 28 05:28 |
| cubezzz | in order: | Dec 28 05:28 |
| balzac | fresh repositories with common packages | Dec 28 05:28 |
| Ender2070 | I run www.pwnage.ca with ubuntu server | Dec 28 05:28 |
| cubezzz | CP/M, Xenix 286, Xenix 386, MS DOS, { Windows 2.0 },SCO Unix System V, AmigaDOS 1.3, GEM, Dark Star Linux 0.99, Win95, Win98, Win2K, Red Hat 8.0, FC1, various other Fedoras, Embedix 2.4.6, TinyCore, OpenSolaris | Dec 28 05:30 |
| cubezzz | oh and Windows 3.0 and Windows 3.1 are in there somewhere | Dec 28 05:31 |
| Ender2070 | OpenSolaris is cool, got it on my file server | Dec 28 05:31 |
| cubezzz | I also played around with BeOS in 1997 and Minix | Dec 28 05:31 |
| Ender2070 | I tried BeOS out when it was already dead | Dec 28 05:33 |
| cubezzz | GEM was DR as well | Dec 28 05:33 |
| Ender2070 | 5.1 | Dec 28 05:33 |
| cubezzz | I think it was still alive in 1997 | Dec 28 05:33 |
| cubezzz | the BeOS people were not Unix fans at all | Dec 28 05:35 |
| cubezzz | but the Unix based systems ended up prevaling | Dec 28 05:35 |
| Ender2070 | I had Unysis Iconix at school, then I got a pc with DOS/Win3.1, 3.11 for workgroups, Win95, Win98, Win98SE, Win2k, Redhat 5.2-8, Suse 5.3,9,10, Mandrake 7.1, 2008 Powerpack, Slackware 7.1 to 13, OpenCaldara, Corel Linux, Ubuntu 4.10 and on, Arch Linux, Gentoo, not in this order at all | Dec 28 05:35 |
| Ender2070 | the linux ones arent in order | Dec 28 05:35 |
| Ender2070 | I went back and forth between distros too much to keep track of it all | Dec 28 05:36 |
| cubezzz | yeah but all the windows were crap | Dec 28 05:36 |
| cubezzz | my biggest regret, learning doze | Dec 28 05:36 |
| cubezzz | I wrote a paper about windows 2.0 being really slow | Dec 28 05:37 |
| cubezzz | and windows 7, still the same story | Dec 28 05:37 |
| cubezzz | in fact, it's just becoming a monstrous pig | Dec 28 05:37 |
| Ender2070 | it keeps getting slow | Dec 28 05:39 |
| cubezzz | slower, despite hardware getting faster and faster | Dec 28 05:40 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 05:40 |
| Ender2070 | DOS booted up in seconds | Dec 28 05:40 |
| cubezzz | embedix does the same | Dec 28 05:40 |
| cubezzz | portability should make GNU/Linux win | Dec 28 05:40 |
| Ender2070 | should make it win | Dec 28 05:41 |
| cubezzz | speaking for myself, it's won already | Dec 28 05:42 |
| cubezzz | for the masses, not so much | Dec 28 05:42 |
| Ender2070 | to us it has | Dec 28 05:42 |
| cubezzz | I remember Stallman posting on usenet in the 80's | Dec 28 05:43 |
| cubezzz | and a _lot_ of people started to say "Communist" | Dec 28 05:43 |
| Ender2070 | LOL | Dec 28 05:43 |
| cubezzz | and they still do today | Dec 28 05:43 |
| Ender2070 | yes or extremist | Dec 28 05:43 |
| Ender2070 | non programmers dont care | Dec 28 05:45 |
| Ender2070 | thats so true | Dec 28 05:46 |
| cubezzz | there's still the Microsoft Tax | Dec 28 05:46 |
| Ender2070 | my friends tell me nobody looks at code, why do they need to inspect source code for malicousness | Dec 28 05:46 |
| cubezzz | obvious two answers: | Dec 28 05:47 |
| Ender2070 | ha | Dec 28 05:47 |
| cubezzz | what is it going? | Dec 28 05:47 |
| cubezzz | and for learning | Dec 28 05:47 |
| cubezzz | going = doing | Dec 28 05:47 |
| Ender2070 | they all build their own custom pc's with pirated windows | Dec 28 05:47 |
| Ender2070 | thats not an issue for them | Dec 28 05:47 |
| cubezzz | that's just low though | Dec 28 05:47 |
| Ender2070 | its funny because they steal it, and i get free copies from msft legally | Dec 28 05:48 |
| Ender2070 | and i dont even run them | Dec 28 05:48 |
| cubezzz | if the top tier is writing your own OS, the bottom, the 7th circle of Hell, must be pirating doze | Dec 28 05:48 |
| cubezzz | that is funny | Dec 28 05:48 |
| cubezzz | I mean, I never liked doze but now I really hate it | Dec 28 05:49 |
| cubezzz | it hits the hard drive so much | Dec 28 05:49 |
| Ender2070 | its a one size fits all solution | Dec 28 05:49 |
| cubezzz | with virus scans and malware scans and who knows what else | Dec 28 05:49 |
| cubezzz | why is it so bloated? | Dec 28 05:49 |
| Ender2070 | im not sure why it gets so bloated | Dec 28 05:50 |
| cubezzz | even FC1 is bloated, but not as bad | Dec 28 05:51 |
| Ender2070 | at least you dont waste 30+ mb of ram just making sure malware doesnt break your OS | Dec 28 05:51 |
| Ender2070 | plus fees for the software | Dec 28 05:51 |
| cubezzz | well the uptime is better | Dec 28 05:52 |
| cubezzz | way better | Dec 28 05:52 |
| Ender2070 | hell yes | Dec 28 05:53 |
| Ender2070 | less damage to the environment too | Dec 28 05:53 |
| Ender2070 | windows drains so much power | Dec 28 05:54 |
| cubezzz | my box isn't super efficient cpu-wise | Dec 28 05:55 |
| Ender2070 | it could be worse | Dec 28 05:56 |
| cubezzz | could be better too :) | Dec 28 05:57 |
| cubezzz | but the zaurus is extremely efficient power-wise | Dec 28 05:57 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 28 05:57 |
| cubezzz | btw Richard Freedman, former Microsoft Product manager, had an ironic name | Dec 28 05:58 |
| cubezzz | who is a dick | Dec 28 05:58 |
| Ender2070 | LOL | Dec 28 05:58 |
| Ender2070 | I get an extra hour out of my laptop on average | Dec 28 05:58 |
| Ender2070 | I did a test a while ago | Dec 28 05:58 |
| cubezzz | seriously he is a dickhead | Dec 28 05:59 |
| Ender2070 | I did a more thorough test a few months ago, I used a voltage monitor | Dec 28 05:59 |
| cubezzz | http://www.maxframe.com/DR/Info/fullstory/factstat.html | Dec 28 05:59 |
| cubezzz | get this talk: | Dec 28 06:01 |
| cubezzz | What I would like to brainstorm is how to push Excel over the top and Lotus out of business." To which Silverberg replied: "I'd be glad to help tilt lotus into the death spiral." | Dec 28 06:01 |
| Ender2070 | hehe | Dec 28 06:01 |
| Ender2070 | did you read my recent article? | Dec 28 06:01 |
| cubezzz | I don't think so | Dec 28 06:01 |
| Ender2070 | http://www.pwnage.ca/?p=516 | Dec 28 06:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Pwnage.ca » Evangelism is War The Mono/Moonlight Agenda .::. Size~: 64.07 KB | Dec 28 06:01 |
| Ender2070 | I went over Comes vs Microsoft | Dec 28 06:02 |
| Ender2070 | found a lot of relevant data that might be relevant to the mono issue | Dec 28 06:02 |
| cubezzz | Freedman leaves Microsoft in Dec 1994 | Dec 28 06:02 |
| cubezzz | yeah, I just avoid Mono | Dec 28 06:03 |
| cubezzz | is an attempt to embrace I guess | Dec 28 06:04 |
| cubezzz | it's | Dec 28 06:04 |
| Ender2070 | I found them discussing the benefits of having others use their platform | Dec 28 06:04 |
| Ender2070 | they considered win32 on unix, ole on mac wins for them | Dec 28 06:04 |
| Ender2070 | why isnt mono a win for them | Dec 28 06:05 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 06:05 |
| Ender2070 | logically | Dec 28 06:05 |
| cubezzz | well we have control not them | Dec 28 06:05 |
| cubezzz | once you get to autoconf and the like, you can port and it's game over for Microsoft | Dec 28 06:06 |
| cubezzz | this is funny: | Dec 28 06:06 |
| cubezzz | Ironically, other discussion there focused on "Our Image" and how to overcome the industry perception of "Microslop," "Microshaft," and "Microsleaze." | Dec 28 06:06 |
| cubezzz | ok, this is one _advantage_ of old linux | Dec 28 06:07 |
| cubezzz | you don't have all those auto-updates | Dec 28 06:07 |
| cubezzz | _you_ decide what updates you want, or even make your own code updates | Dec 28 06:08 |
| cubezzz | there's nothing I have to have in 2.6 | Dec 28 06:08 |
| cubezzz | nothing | Dec 28 06:08 |
| cubezzz | do I need to write to NTFS? | Dec 28 06:08 |
| cubezzz | no :) | Dec 28 06:08 |
| Ender2070 | I liked that about gentoo | Dec 28 06:12 |
| Ender2070 | I used to compile my own kernels | Dec 28 06:13 |
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| Ender2070 | i use ntfs-3g | Dec 28 06:14 |
| Ender2070 | so i can read my friends usb drives | Dec 28 06:14 |
| cubezzz | this Chris guy didn't like your article | Dec 28 06:19 |
| Ender2070 | Chris = eet | Dec 28 06:20 |
| Ender2070 | apparently hes a known troll | Dec 28 06:21 |
| cubezzz | I assume you are "admin"? | Dec 28 06:21 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 06:21 |
| cubezzz | no one posts on my blog | Dec 28 06:22 |
| Ender2070 | what blog is yours? | Dec 28 06:22 |
| cubezzz | http://maxhost.org/blog/linux-blog.html | Dec 28 06:22 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Notes on Linux .::. Size~: 36.94 KB | Dec 28 06:22 |
| cubezzz | I don't talk about Microsoft much, maybe that is why | Dec 28 06:23 |
| cubezzz | I follow it, but I don't blog about it | Dec 28 06:23 |
| Ender2070 | i dont get comments often | Dec 28 06:23 |
| Ender2070 | last article that got me a lot of traffic was the gnome/gnu issue | Dec 28 06:23 |
| cubezzz | yes I remember | Dec 28 06:24 |
| Ender2070 | usually I just get lefty posting stuff | Dec 28 06:24 |
| cubezzz | it's the internet that changed everything, that and BSD and Stallman and Linus of course | Dec 28 06:26 |
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| cubezzz | we have a "bus" now | Dec 28 06:26 |
| fewa_ | argg how do you escape spaces in sh | Dec 28 06:27 |
| fewa_ | I hate sh | Dec 28 06:27 |
| Ender2070 | funny how chris dropped off the face of the earth after I called him on his lack of evidence | Dec 28 06:28 |
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| cubezzz | \ | Dec 28 06:55 |
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| cubezzz | Richard Freedman gets grilled | Dec 28 07:10 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] Has anyone noticed XScreensaver's lock dialog is uglier than hell? !XFCE needs a lock dialog that looks like stock gnome-screensaver | Dec 28 07:24 | |
| Ender2070 | hey cubezzz | Dec 28 07:25 |
| Ender2070 | noticed you use fedora 10 | Dec 28 07:25 |
| Ender2070 | version 10 is EOL now | Dec 28 07:25 |
| cubezzz | dude, I'm still using FC1 :) | Dec 28 07:27 |
| cubezzz | plus I'm still using the even older embedix 2.4.6 | Dec 28 07:27 |
| cubezzz | I have a laptop with F10 | Dec 28 07:27 |
| Ender2070 | im just saying :) | Dec 28 07:28 |
| Ender2070 | whatever you have that runs f10 can also run f11/f12 | Dec 28 07:29 |
| Ender2070 | less buggy pulse audio too | Dec 28 07:29 |
| cubezzz | basically what I do is if a system is stable is leave the kernel alone | Dec 28 07:30 |
| cubezzz | user space stuff still gets updated | Dec 28 07:30 |
| Ender2070 | ahh | Dec 28 07:31 |
| Ender2070 | I prefer the latest everything, lol but I live on the edge | Dec 28 07:31 |
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| cubezzz | I experienced some crashes on F11 | Dec 28 07:32 |
| cubezzz | could be hardware related though | Dec 28 07:32 |
| Ender2070 | I heard F11 had some issues | Dec 28 07:32 |
| Ender2070 | I never experienced any myself though | Dec 28 07:32 |
| cubezzz | gpu lock ups | Dec 28 07:33 |
| Ender2070 | I tend to only purchase hardware from companys that support linux | Dec 28 07:33 |
| cubezzz | ati 9250 | Dec 28 07:33 |
| Ender2070 | eww | Dec 28 07:33 |
| cubezzz | not my machine actually | Dec 28 07:33 |
| Ender2070 | yay :) | Dec 28 07:34 |
| cubezzz | what graphics card(s) do you like? | Dec 28 07:34 |
| Ender2070 | I like nVidia and Intel | Dec 28 07:34 |
| Ender2070 | only newer intel graphics though | Dec 28 07:35 |
| cubezzz | yeah I still want a 3d with open source drivers | Dec 28 07:35 |
| cubezzz | ok, could you suggest a specific card? | Dec 28 07:35 |
| Ender2070 | intel can do that | Dec 28 07:35 |
| Ender2070 | iirc, they are the only ones with a 3d open source driver | Dec 28 07:35 |
| Ender2070 | not sure if the ati one does | Dec 28 07:36 |
| Ender2070 | nouveau doesnt support 3d yet | Dec 28 07:36 |
| oiaohm | ATI support is getting there. | Dec 28 07:36 |
| oiaohm | Big thing to watch with current ati open source drivers is lack of power management. | Dec 28 07:36 |
| oiaohm | That will change next year. | Dec 28 07:36 |
| cubezzz | ok, what happened on the ati 9250 was Xorg went to 100% cpu and I could not stop the process | Dec 28 07:36 |
| oiaohm | The lack of power management causes some ati cards to over heat and pause. | Dec 28 07:36 |
| Ender2070 | same for nouveau | Dec 28 07:36 |
| Ender2070 | kills my laptop | Dec 28 07:37 |
| Ender2070 | battery wise | Dec 28 07:37 |
| cubezzz | hmmm | Dec 28 07:37 |
| cubezzz | but why couldn't I kill the process? | Dec 28 07:37 |
| oiaohm | are you sure cubezzz | Dec 28 07:37 |
| cubezzz | positive, it's widely documented, plus I experienced it myself | Dec 28 07:38 |
| oiaohm | Did you use SAK build into kernel to kill everything connected to the virtual console. | Dec 28 07:38 |
| cubezzz | I tried kill -9 | Dec 28 07:38 |
| oiaohm | Ie sak in kernel only fails to work if kernel has been taken out by something. | Dec 28 07:38 |
| cubezzz | I didn't use SAK anything I don't think | Dec 28 07:38 |
| Ender2070 | one thing I like about Fedora 12 w/ KDE is that ctrl+alt+backspace works | Dec 28 07:38 |
| cubezzz | couldn't ctrl-alt-backspace | Dec 28 07:39 |
| Ender2070 | gdm disables that iirc | Dec 28 07:39 |
| cubezzz | I still could ssh though | Dec 28 07:39 |
| oiaohm | SAK is more powerful than ctrl-alt-backspace. | Dec 28 07:39 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 07:39 |
| oiaohm | SAK is also stronger than kill -9 | Dec 28 07:39 |
| cubezzz | oiaohm, how do I use that? | Dec 28 07:39 |
| Ender2070 | SAK is hardcore but I haven't had the need to use something that powerful | Dec 28 07:39 |
| oiaohm | If it killable SAK will kill it. | Dec 28 07:39 |
| Ender2070 | my systems tend to be quite stable | Dec 28 07:40 |
| cubezzz | can I do that at the command line via ssh? | Dec 28 07:40 |
| oiaohm | If SAK cannot kill something it will kill the kernel so rebooting the machine. | Dec 28 07:40 |
| oiaohm | Ie 100 percent determined kill. | Dec 28 07:40 |
| cubezzz | that's what I ended up doing, a reboot as in the command | Dec 28 07:40 |
| Ender2070 | there is a new feature coming soon where it will hotswap the kernel in case of a kernel panic or crash | Dec 28 07:41 |
| oiaohm | Nop Ender2070 | Dec 28 07:41 |
| oiaohm | SAK is kernel level. It don't give a stuff about X11 or gdm. | Dec 28 07:41 |
| cubezzz | yes but how do I use SAK? :) | Dec 28 07:42 |
| Ender2070 | oiamhm - i was refering to ctrl+alt+backspace | Dec 28 07:42 |
| oiaohm | X11 and gdm are just another item connected to a virtual terminal to be killed. | Dec 28 07:42 |
| oiaohm | It is in the documenation with the kernel cubezzz | Dec 28 07:42 |
| cubezzz | ok | Dec 28 07:43 |
| oiaohm | Currently all my bandwidth it being taken up by downloads. | Dec 28 07:43 |
| oiaohm | I have used wine a lot Ender2070 I have had a lot of need for sak due to it doing strange things. | Dec 28 07:43 |
| cubezzz | np, thanks for telling me about it | Dec 28 07:43 |
| Ender2070 | oiaohm - good call, lol :) | Dec 28 07:43 |
| Ender2070 | theres a lot of buggy windows software | Dec 28 07:43 |
| oiaohm | In about another 7 mins I will be able to give you the page cubezzz | Dec 28 07:44 |
| cubezzz | Secure Attention Key? | Dec 28 07:44 |
| oiaohm | And wine is not exactly bug free Ender2070 Then combind with Nvidia and ATI drivers not being bug free you have party. | Dec 28 07:44 |
| oiaohm | Yep that is SAK cubezzz | Dec 28 07:45 |
| oiaohm | Don't use the sysrq version. Use the assign to key version. sysrq version is even more of a sledge hammer it don't fully bother freeing memory. | Dec 28 07:46 |
| Ender2070 | http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux-2.6.git;a=blob;f=Documentation/SAK.txt;h=74be14679ed891820cd9c3a7393007f8dd21d07d;hb=HEAD | Dec 28 07:46 |
| Ender2070 | there u go, lastest | Dec 28 07:46 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: .::. Size~: 0.51 KB | Dec 28 07:46 |
| Ender2070 | latest* | Dec 28 07:46 |
| cubezzz | umm, but I probably wouldn't have it on FC1? | Dec 28 07:46 |
| cubezzz | or is it still possible? | Dec 28 07:47 |
| Ender2070 | 18 March 2001, Andrew Morton | Dec 28 07:47 |
| oiaohm | It works on FC1 if assigned. | Dec 28 07:47 |
| Ender2070 | probably on FC1 | Dec 28 07:47 |
| oiaohm | SAK is abasically a default bit of the Linux kernel. | Dec 28 07:47 |
| cubezzz | ok, it should be possible then | Dec 28 07:47 |
| oiaohm | You can also assign nasty keys like reboot now as well cubezzz | Dec 28 07:47 |
| cubezzz | umm | Dec 28 07:48 |
| cubezzz | how about a key that could just kill X or Xorg? | Dec 28 07:48 |
| oiaohm | Basically it there but not key assigned so it does nothing cubezzz | Dec 28 07:48 |
| Ender2070 | bind it to the most common tomboy keyboard shortcut? | Dec 28 07:48 |
| Ender2070 | :) | Dec 28 07:48 |
| oiaohm | X11 connects to a virtual terminal. | Dec 28 07:49 |
| oiaohm | SAK is a virtual terminal clearer. | Dec 28 07:49 |
| Ender2070 | that would be hilarious | Dec 28 07:49 |
| oiaohm | Basically SAK works text or X11 it don't care. | Dec 28 07:49 |
| cubezzz | ok, that's what I want | Dec 28 07:49 |
| Ender2070 | its like an interrupt | Dec 28 07:50 |
| oiaohm | It can be multi bound. | Dec 28 07:50 |
| oiaohm | Its a nice way to make a system that cannot be logged in Ender2070 | Dec 28 07:50 |
| oiaohm | Ie SAK bound to every key. | Dec 28 07:51 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 07:51 |
| oiaohm | SAK is processed in the first part of input processing done inside the kernel. | Dec 28 07:51 |
| oiaohm | it processed before even transfering the data to userspace. | Dec 28 07:52 |
| oiaohm | Mind you a sak lock down even works against remote items like ssh | Dec 28 07:53 |
| oiaohm | SAK is a highly useful tool cubezzz but you can abuse it and hurt self. | Dec 28 07:53 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #RonPaul is now winning against the #Republican majority http://ur1.ca/imhp #politics | Dec 28 07:54 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The growing clout of Lake Jackson's Ron Paul finally | Houston & Texas News | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle .::. Size~: 49.74 KB | Dec 28 07:54 |
| cubezzz | oops | Dec 28 07:56 |
| cubezzz | don't use showkey under X :) | Dec 28 07:56 |
| -BNi/#boycottnovell-[diablod3/@diablod3] #RandPaul (the son of #RonPaul) is leading against his douchebag opponent for #Senate seat http://ur1.ca/imht (pdf) #politics | Dec 28 07:59 | |
| cubezzz | damn it | Dec 28 07:59 |
| cubezzz | how do you kill showkey? | Dec 28 07:59 |
| cubezzz | ah, ok, it kills itself after 10 seconds | Dec 28 08:01 |
| oiaohm | Don't touch anything it auto dies after 10 seconds. | Dec 28 08:01 |
| oiaohm | I was a little late | Dec 28 08:01 |
| oiaohm | http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Keyboard-and-Console-HOWTO-15.html Loadkeys support doing lots of evils people would never dream. | Dec 28 08:02 |
| oiaohm | Like assigning strings to keys. | Dec 28 08:02 |
| cubezzz | hmmm, ok I will try to kill X now | Dec 28 08:02 |
| cubezzz | hmmm, I'm still here | Dec 28 08:04 |
| oiaohm | Only root user can assign the sak key. | Dec 28 08:05 |
| oiaohm | Any other user assigning it would be disreguarded. | Dec 28 08:05 |
| cubezzz | it's assigned | Dec 28 08:05 |
| cubezzz | dumpkeys shows alt ctrl = SAK | Dec 28 08:05 |
| oiaohm | Ok that cannot work. | Dec 28 08:06 |
| oiaohm | alt ctrl are both modifiers | Dec 28 08:06 |
| oiaohm | There is no active key there. | Dec 28 08:06 |
| cubezzz | ok, this doc is wrong then | Dec 28 08:06 |
| cubezzz | cho "control alt keycode 101 = SAK" | /bin/loadkeys | Dec 28 08:06 |
| cubezzz | echo "control alt keycode 101 = SAK" | /bin/loadkeys | Dec 28 08:06 |
| oiaohm | That should be alt ctrl pause | Dec 28 08:07 |
| oiaohm | ie 101 is a active key. | Dec 28 08:07 |
| cubezzz | oh ok | Dec 28 08:08 |
| cubezzz | right right :) | Dec 28 08:08 |
| cubezzz | ok, here goes... | Dec 28 08:08 |
| *cubezzz has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 28 08:08 | |
| *cubezzz (n=cubeman@maxhost.org) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 08:09 | |
| cubezzz | ok :) | Dec 28 08:09 |
| cubezzz | so I have ctrl-alt-backspace and the stronger ctrl-alt-pause | Dec 28 08:10 |
| cubezzz | I should be able to not hit that by accident | Dec 28 08:11 |
| cubezzz | but I lose my klipper buffer when I do that | Dec 28 08:12 |
| Ender2070 | http://zoome.jp/koedoyoshida/diary/9 | Dec 28 08:16 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Btrfs: Filesystem Status and Future Plans koedoyoshida - Æ°²è¶¦Í¥µ¥€¥Èzoome .::. Size~: 47.85 KB | Dec 28 08:16 |
| cubezzz | ohh, my router uses javascript | Dec 28 08:18 |
| cubezzz | I'll have to remember that | Dec 28 08:19 |
| oiaohm | You can assign it to ctrl-alt-backspace if you wanted to cubezzz | Dec 28 08:20 |
| oiaohm | X.org is trying to remove ctrl-alt-backspace in the server since most times when you need it the server is dead and will not work. | Dec 28 08:21 |
| cubezzz | ummm | Dec 28 08:25 |
| oiaohm | The zap function of X11 is older than SAK cubezzz | Dec 28 08:25 |
| oiaohm | Both are designed todo the same job. | Dec 28 08:25 |
| cubezzz | why not have both though? | Dec 28 08:25 |
| oiaohm | Mostly because X11 server one most of the time when you need it it don't work. | Dec 28 08:26 |
| cubezzz | I don't think I have seen alt-ctrl-backspace not work on this machine | Dec 28 08:26 |
| oiaohm | Also X11 server can bleed memory every time it zaped. That SAK would clean up. | Dec 28 08:26 |
| cubezzz | so it's better to have SAK working | Dec 28 08:27 |
| cubezzz | or mapped to a key code | Dec 28 08:27 |
| cubezzz | that's good to know | Dec 28 08:27 |
| oiaohm | Basically distributions are being stupid and failing to understand why X.org removed zap. | Dec 28 08:27 |
| cubezzz | that should help uptimes | Dec 28 08:27 |
| oiaohm | Same with users. | Dec 28 08:27 |
| oiaohm | Ie remove items that don't work right and can never be made work perfectly right. | Dec 28 08:28 |
| oiaohm | Particualarly when deeper down on most posix OS's out there is a SAK equal. | Dec 28 08:29 |
| cubezzz | can windows do that oiaohm? | Dec 28 08:29 |
| oiaohm | Windows builds of x.org still have zap. | Dec 28 08:29 |
| oiaohm | Because windows has its SAK key hooked up kinda wrong. | Dec 28 08:30 |
| oiaohm | cntrl-alt-delete is windows SAK key. | Dec 28 08:30 |
| oiaohm | Ie it is not a sledge hammer. | Dec 28 08:30 |
| Ender2070 | oooo Chris Mason was using Arch Linux | Dec 28 08:31 |
| cubezzz | dun dun DUNNN! | Dec 28 08:32 |
| Ender2070 | btrfs developer | Dec 28 08:32 |
| cubezzz | SAK is much harsher than just killing X | Dec 28 08:34 |
| cubezzz | On the PC keyboard, SAK kills all applications which have /dev/console opened. | Dec 28 08:34 |
| cubezzz | I assume it doesn't effect apache and ssh and the like | Dec 28 08:34 |
| oiaohm | They should close there interfaces or be redirected. | Dec 28 08:35 |
| oiaohm | It covered in the SAK instructions how to correct if any have problems cubezzz | Dec 28 08:35 |
| cubezzz | no probs so far | Dec 28 08:36 |
| oiaohm | X11 does not just kill X it kills eveyrthing running X as well. | Dec 28 08:36 |
| oiaohm | Basically everything on the terminal. | Dec 28 08:36 |
| cubezzz | can I SAK via ssh? | Dec 28 08:37 |
| cubezzz | I'll try it :) | Dec 28 08:37 |
| cubezzz | it seems not | Dec 28 08:38 |
| cubezzz | usually I can just init 3 then init 5 | Dec 28 08:39 |
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| fewa_ | libcanberra: get that stupid IE clicking sound in every one of your GTK apps! | Dec 28 08:57 |
| fewa_ | and enabled by default when you install it! | Dec 28 08:58 |
| fewa_ | (and installed by default in GNOME distributions--effecting gtk apps in and out of GNOME) | Dec 28 08:58 |
| fewa_ | And the gnome settings do not work unless gnome-settings daemon is running! | Dec 28 08:59 |
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| DaemonFC | I'm thinking about ditching my XBOX 360 | Dec 28 09:06 |
| DaemonFC | who do you all figure I could sucker into buying it from me for the most money? | Dec 28 09:07 |
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| Ender2070 | some ms fanboy | Dec 28 09:13 |
| Ender2070 | "...ReiserFS. I hear it's killer." | Dec 28 09:13 |
| Ender2070 | "Yeah, but it's murder getting support." | Dec 28 09:13 |
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| DaemonFC | lmao | Dec 28 09:16 |
| DaemonFC | they remade A Boy and His Blob for the Wii | Dec 28 09:16 |
| DaemonFC | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Boy_and_His_Blob_%282009_video_game%29 | Dec 28 09:16 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: HTTP/1.0 403 Forbidden .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 28 09:16 |
| DaemonFC | I may be getting a Wii | Dec 28 09:17 |
| DaemonFC | I loved that game on the NES | Dec 28 09:18 |
| Ender2070 | I have a wii | Dec 28 09:19 |
| Ender2070 | best part about it: free online gaming | Dec 28 09:19 |
| DaemonFC | Do you regret buying it at all? | Dec 28 09:19 |
| Ender2070 | not at all | Dec 28 09:19 |
| Ender2070 | I am a Nintendo fan | Dec 28 09:19 |
| Ender2070 | ever since nes | Dec 28 09:20 |
| DaemonFC | the Gamecube drove me away | Dec 28 09:20 |
| Ender2070 | I owned nes, snes, n64, gamecube, gameboy, gameboy colour, gameboy advance, ds | Dec 28 09:20 |
| DaemonFC | most people complained about the N64, I liked it | Dec 28 09:20 |
| Ender2070 | I loved gamecube | Dec 28 09:20 |
| DaemonFC | I think I have like 3-4 Gamecube games somewhere | Dec 28 09:21 |
| DaemonFC | I gave away the console and my memory cards and most of the games I had for it | Dec 28 09:21 |
| Ender2070 | Wii is backwards compatible | Dec 28 09:22 |
| Ender2070 | I use my gamecube controllers for certain games on Wii even | Dec 28 09:22 |
| Ender2070 | smash bros, mario kart | Dec 28 09:22 |
| DaemonFC | so they'll work in place of the Classic Controller? | Dec 28 09:22 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 09:23 |
| Ender2070 | as far as I've seen so far | Dec 28 09:23 |
| DaemonFC | might dig up some old Gamecube controllers then | Dec 28 09:23 |
| DaemonFC | hell of a lot cheaper than buying a couple $50 Classic Controllers | Dec 28 09:23 |
| DaemonFC | and god knows what else | Dec 28 09:24 |
| Ender2070 | I got a massive collection of gamecube games | Dec 28 09:24 |
| Ender2070 | all the nintendo originals that were decent | Dec 28 09:24 |
| DaemonFC | people see this cheap console then find out the accessories are wher eyou really get robbed | Dec 28 09:24 |
| DaemonFC | Nintendo used to throw in two controllers and a game | Dec 28 09:24 |
| Ender2070 | Nintendo always bundled a game with gamecube, via the retailers | Dec 28 09:25 |
| DaemonFC | now you have to buy another remote, a nunchuk, a couple classic controllers, memory cards no doubt | Dec 28 09:25 |
| Ender2070 | you could pick 1 of 3 | Dec 28 09:25 |
| DaemonFC | games obviously | Dec 28 09:25 |
| Ender2070 | now they bundle wii sports | Dec 28 09:25 |
| Ender2070 | which isnt bad | Dec 28 09:25 |
| Ender2070 | dont need memory cards | Dec 28 09:25 |
| Ender2070 | you can use standard sd cards | Dec 28 09:25 |
| DaemonFC | sounds like Duck Hunt for the 21st century :P | Dec 28 09:26 |
| DaemonFC | they used to start you off with Super Mario Bros | Dec 28 09:26 |
| Ender2070 | the wiimotes are probably the biggest rip | Dec 28 09:26 |
| DaemonFC | what happened to the good freebies? | Dec 28 09:26 |
| Ender2070 | the nunchuck is sold seperately | Dec 28 09:26 |
| DaemonFC | yep | Dec 28 09:26 |
| DaemonFC | that's their angle | Dec 28 09:26 |
| Ender2070 | it hardly matters | Dec 28 09:26 |
| DaemonFC | so how much do those bite you for? | Dec 28 09:26 |
| Ender2070 | they are of such a high quality that you won't have to replace them | Dec 28 09:26 |
| Ender2070 | unless you intentionally break them | Dec 28 09:27 |
| DaemonFC | so buttons sticking and jotsticks wearing out? | Dec 28 09:27 |
| Ender2070 | doesnt really happen on nintendo | Dec 28 09:27 |
| DaemonFC | the N64 joystick would get this white powder all over it and eventually break | Dec 28 09:27 |
| Ender2070 | kids damage stuff more than regular people, and they are aiming at them | Dec 28 09:27 |
| DaemonFC | like it worked, but there was no resistance on the stick | Dec 28 09:27 |
| Ender2070 | the n64 joystick sucked | Dec 28 09:27 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 09:27 |
| Ender2070 | gamecube and on fixed that | Dec 28 09:28 |
| DaemonFC | I always figured Nintendo did it on purpose | Dec 28 09:28 |
| DaemonFC | sell you a new controller every 6 months | Dec 28 09:28 |
| Ender2070 | nah it was a rushed design back then | Dec 28 09:28 |
| DaemonFC | I bet those unlicensed aftermarket controller guys made a killing off N64 | Dec 28 09:28 |
| DaemonFC | I know I bought at least 3-4 | Dec 28 09:29 |
| Ender2070 | the unlicnsed controllers suffered the same problem | Dec 28 09:29 |
| DaemonFC | theirs did it too | Dec 28 09:29 |
| Ender2070 | the nintendo ones lasted a lot longer | Dec 28 09:29 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but Nintendo's cost twice as much | Dec 28 09:29 |
| Ender2070 | you can still get them from nintendo | Dec 28 09:29 |
| Ender2070 | hell you can still get original snes accessories from them | Dec 28 09:29 |
| DaemonFC | might as well get the $15 controller if the $40 Nintendo one is just as bad | Dec 28 09:29 |
| oiaohm | I like the after market Nintendo ones you could get bigger versions. | Dec 28 09:30 |
| oiaohm | Same was true for xbox 360's before MS locked down after market controllers. | Dec 28 09:30 |
| Ender2070 | I wanted the higher quality components | Dec 28 09:30 |
| DaemonFC | why would you want a bigger N64 controller? | Dec 28 09:30 |
| DaemonFC | it was hard enough to use as-is | Dec 28 09:30 |
| DaemonFC | it was poorly designed and cheaply built | Dec 28 09:30 |
| DaemonFC | that's my only complaint about N64 | Dec 28 09:30 |
| Ender2070 | wiimotes: $39.99 | Dec 28 09:30 |
| oiaohm | Slightly larger fitted into my hands better DaemonFC | Dec 28 09:30 |
| DaemonFC | I had tons of games | Dec 28 09:30 |
| Ender2070 | nunchuck: $19.99 | Dec 28 09:31 |
| oiaohm | Also the bigger ones had a slightly altered grip design. | Dec 28 09:31 |
| DaemonFC | so basically $60 + tax for the Wiimote | Dec 28 09:31 |
| Ender2070 | yeah | Dec 28 09:31 |
| oiaohm | Ok at first look seams the same. But feel was way different. | Dec 28 09:31 |
| Ender2070 | well you dont always need a nunchuck | Dec 28 09:31 |
| DaemonFC | $64.20 with Indiana sales tax | Dec 28 09:31 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 09:31 |
| Ender2070 | you can play mario bros wii perfectly fine without it | Dec 28 09:31 |
| Ender2070 | I only have a couple games that require it | Dec 28 09:32 |
| DaemonFC | I'm gonna buy the Wii on Newegg | Dec 28 09:32 |
| Ender2070 | aren't xbox controllers also $60 + tax? | Dec 28 09:32 |
| DaemonFC | evade my $14 of state tax on it | Dec 28 09:32 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 09:32 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Like $49.99 for XBOX 360 controller if you want wireless | Dec 28 09:32 |
| DaemonFC | wired is $39.99 | Dec 28 09:32 |
| Ender2070 | $59.99 in Canada | Dec 28 09:32 |
| Ender2070 | wireless | Dec 28 09:33 |
| Ender2070 | fuck wired | Dec 28 09:33 |
| DaemonFC | I prefer wired | Dec 28 09:33 |
| DaemonFC | when you eat batteries like that with wireless | Dec 28 09:33 |
| Ender2070 | rechargables | Dec 28 09:33 |
| DaemonFC | breaks your connection in the middle of a fragfest | Dec 28 09:33 |
| DaemonFC | it sucks | Dec 28 09:33 |
| Ender2070 | not on wii, the OS freezes the game for you with an OS menu telling you to change the batteries | Dec 28 09:34 |
| DaemonFC | the 360's controller just dies. No warning, just "Please reinsert your controller" | Dec 28 09:34 |
| Ender2070 | the OS menu also has a battery meter | Dec 28 09:34 |
| DaemonFC | in the mean time your character is standing there lifeless getting murdered by something | Dec 28 09:34 |
| DaemonFC | and you're fishing for batteries | Dec 28 09:34 |
| Ender2070 | thats microsoft for you | Dec 28 09:34 |
| DaemonFC | well, it pauses the game if you're in single player | Dec 28 09:34 |
| DaemonFC | can't do that on Live | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | hmm | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | i wonder what happens on wii on the net | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | never had it happen to me | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | I monitor the battery meter | Dec 28 09:35 |
| DaemonFC | I think when ytour controller dies, the game should put up a force field around you | Dec 28 09:35 |
| DaemonFC | until you get more batteries | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 09:35 |
| Ender2070 | the game dev would need to do that | Dec 28 09:36 |
| Ender2070 | and people would pull their batteries out to avoid dying | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | yep | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | Microsoft could make it mandatory | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | part of the certifications deal | Dec 28 09:36 |
| Ender2070 | people would pull their batteries out to avoid dying | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | hmmmm | Dec 28 09:36 |
| Ender2070 | imagine halo | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | maybe give them a countdown | Dec 28 09:36 |
| DaemonFC | like you have 60 seconds before the field is removed | Dec 28 09:36 |
| Ender2070 | you would have 60 seconds of invulnerablilty | Dec 28 09:37 |
| DaemonFC | where you can't do anything in the game | Dec 28 09:37 |
| DaemonFC | so why would it matter? | Dec 28 09:37 |
| Ender2070 | because you cant die? | Dec 28 09:37 |
| oiaohm | I could exploit that DaemonFC | Dec 28 09:37 |
| DaemonFC | put in a block so it won't put up the forcefield if there's X amount of time left on the round | Dec 28 09:37 |
| oiaohm | 60 seconds frozen at the right time would be useful. | Dec 28 09:37 |
| Ender2070 | imagine the situation in halo where if you came close to death you just pull your batteries and wait for them to go attack someone else | Dec 28 09:38 |
| DaemonFC | then you pop them back in and your shields recharge | Dec 28 09:38 |
| DaemonFC | ick | Dec 28 09:38 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, that would be abused | Dec 28 09:38 |
| Ender2070 | the best way for them to do that is force the player in spectator mode | Dec 28 09:38 |
| DaemonFC | They probably considered thi | Dec 28 09:38 |
| DaemonFC | *this | Dec 28 09:38 |
| Ender2070 | and have a number limit | Dec 28 09:38 |
| Ender2070 | for each round | Dec 28 09:38 |
| oiaohm | Also that would make you curse if people are camping entry points into the map Ender2070 | Dec 28 09:39 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, so the game won't credit them for 50 sets of "batteries dying" | Dec 28 09:39 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 09:39 |
| oiaohm | Really I would be tempted to make battery removal a weapon. | Dec 28 09:39 |
| Ender2070 | xboxlive should also keep track of how often their batteries die in online games | Dec 28 09:39 |
| DaemonFC | like you can do it twice or something | Dec 28 09:39 |
| Ender2070 | if such a system was put in | Dec 28 09:40 |
| oiaohm | Ie big god darn explosion anyone who is doing in the face combat death. | Dec 28 09:40 |
| DaemonFC | something needs to be done, cause either way it's not fair | Dec 28 09:40 |
| DaemonFC | people would cheat with the battery force field thing | Dec 28 09:40 |
| oiaohm | Of course still loss of life. | Dec 28 09:40 |
| DaemonFC | people will kill your lifeless character if not | Dec 28 09:40 |
| oiaohm | At least power loss would be fun. | Dec 28 09:40 |
| oiaohm | Not a life less char just a huge crator. | Dec 28 09:41 |
| Ender2070 | another idea | Dec 28 09:41 |
| Ender2070 | it could tag you as battery-less, and if you die you don't lose points and they don't gain points | Dec 28 09:41 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, that would stop them from doing it | Dec 28 09:41 |
| oiaohm | I could exploit that too Ender2070 | Dec 28 09:42 |
| DaemonFC | and if they do, you respawn with what you had on you? | Dec 28 09:42 |
| Ender2070 | a death would keep you in spec mode | Dec 28 09:42 |
| oiaohm | Almost dead remove battery so I don't loss points. | Dec 28 09:42 |
| oiaohm | I still think player bomb would be the best solution. | Dec 28 09:42 |
| oiaohm | Run out of battery explode. | Dec 28 09:42 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 09:42 |
| Ender2070 | I would limit the threshold to 1 per round too | Dec 28 09:43 |
| Ender2070 | how often do batteries die in one sitting | Dec 28 09:43 |
| oiaohm | It would be a nice easter egg. | Dec 28 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | Little did Jesus know, the Romans were spawn camping | Dec 28 09:43 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 09:43 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 09:44 |
| Ender2070 | anyways daemon, if you do get a wii pickup mario kart or smash bros and we can play each other | Dec 28 09:44 |
| DaemonFC | I was looking at New Super Mario Bros | Dec 28 09:45 |
| DaemonFC | and that A Boy and His Blob | Dec 28 09:46 |
| Ender2070 | new super mario bros +1 | Dec 28 09:47 |
| Ender2070 | awesome game | Dec 28 09:47 |
| DaemonFC | hmmm, can't find them refurbished anywhere | Dec 28 09:52 |
| DaemonFC | ahhh, Gamestop has them | Dec 28 09:53 |
| DaemonFC | $50 cheaper than a new one too | Dec 28 09:53 |
| DaemonFC | none in stock | Dec 28 09:54 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: That's something I've always hated about Nintendo | Dec 28 09:54 |
| Ender2070 | ? | Dec 28 09:54 |
| DaemonFC | they manipulate their stock to create artificial shortages | Dec 28 09:54 |
| Ender2070 | thats speculation | Dec 28 09:54 |
| DaemonFC | they always do it | Dec 28 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | make only a few available each store | Dec 28 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | it becomes more desirable | Dec 28 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | they did it with the Wii for at least 6 months | Dec 28 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | They did it with the N64 and that Christmas parents were paying $600 to get one | Dec 28 09:55 |
| DaemonFC | if they really wanted to, they could have easily stockpiled one for everyone, but then it wouldn't be special if everyone got one for Christmas | Dec 28 09:56 |
| DaemonFC | so they go through each retailer and say "Six for you, twelve for you, none for you, three for you" | Dec 28 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | and so they get parents out in December on icy roads looking at every store | Dec 28 09:57 |
| DaemonFC | then ending up buying one for $600 from a scalper | Dec 28 09:58 |
| DaemonFC | Gamestop's CEO even called Nintendo out on that | Dec 28 10:00 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.joystiq.com/2007/03/28/nintendo-refutes-gamestop-states-wii-shortages-are-unintentiona/ | Dec 28 10:00 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Nintendo refutes Gamestop, states Wii shortages are unintentional .::. Size~: 131.44 KB | Dec 28 10:00 |
| DaemonFC | "The argument against managed scarcity has always been that making more consoles means making more money (duh!), though this critically underestimates the value of "buzz" and the strange culture that has formed around supposedly scarce items. Already, there's an impression among many that the European PS3 launch was a "failure", simply because the system failed to sell out and attain a level... | Dec 28 10:01 |
| DaemonFC | ...of unattainability. | Dec 28 10:01 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Microsoft uses the same tactics, only it just simply stopped selling Family Pack license codes for Windows 7 at some arbitrary point it wouldn't say | Dec 28 10:02 |
| DaemonFC | could they make more? Sure. Will they? Not when the launch hype is over and they can sell you three individual codes for twice the money. | Dec 28 10:02 |
| DaemonFC | So Microsoft kind of pulled a "reverse Nintendo" and flooded the market with lots of cheap Windows 7 to be stopped at an unknown (to you) date. | Dec 28 10:03 |
| DaemonFC | Artifical scarcity creates a panicked sense of "Oh my God, I'm not going to get one! Name a price and I will pay it!" | Dec 28 10:04 |
| DaemonFC | it's what Microsoft, Nintendo, Sony, retail chains, etc. do to psychologically manipulate people | Dec 28 10:05 |
| DaemonFC | Christmas time is all about the "How do we make too few of our console and force the ones who do get one to buy 6 games and an accessory pack they don't want" | Dec 28 10:05 |
| oiaohm | Still the Family pack was still higher per licence than volume DaemonFC | Dec 28 10:06 |
| oiaohm | Ms really was not doing that cheep. | Dec 28 10:07 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, VLK has always been cheaper, but it starts at like 50 copies I think | Dec 28 10:07 |
| DaemonFC | I don't have 50 computers | Dec 28 10:07 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 10:07 |
| oiaohm | Depends. | Dec 28 10:07 |
| oiaohm | Charities can buy in entry 3 licences DaemonFC | Dec 28 10:08 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but they probably make you prove you're a charity | Dec 28 10:08 |
| DaemonFC | I can't just walk up and tell them I'm a charity and get VLK pricing | Dec 28 10:09 |
| oiaohm | Charity gets lower than VLK pricing. | Dec 28 10:09 |
| oiaohm | There is even a sub cat for small business that entry is 10 copies. | Dec 28 10:09 |
| oiaohm | The VLK price is slightly higher but still way cheeper than the other options. | Dec 28 10:10 |
| oiaohm | Finally there is what I use what is the registered parnter action pack from time to time for myself when I am in a mood to play with MS products. https://partner.microsoft.com/Australia/program/managemembership/40112699 | Dec 28 10:13 |
| oiaohm | For the price of one working copy of Office I get more software than I know what to deal with. | Dec 28 10:14 |
| DaemonFC | give me a few license codes maybe? | Dec 28 10:18 |
| DaemonFC | waste not want not | Dec 28 10:18 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2009/12/att-stops-iphone-sales-in-nyc/ | Dec 28 10:20 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: AT&T Stops iPhone Sales in NYC | Gadget Lab | Wired.com .::. Size~: 72.04 KB | Dec 28 10:20 |
| DaemonFC | Because New York doesn’t “have enough towers to handle the phone.” | Dec 28 10:20 |
| DaemonFC | lol | Dec 28 10:20 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: There's some used Wii consoles on eBay | Dec 28 10:27 |
| DaemonFC | I'm not buying someone's used Wii that's had who knows what done to it for $180 | Dec 28 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | it's $199 in the store | Dec 28 10:28 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 10:28 |
| *_goblin (n=goblin@94-193-188-104.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 10:30 | |
| Ender2070 | more troll comments http://www.pwnage.ca/?p=516 | Dec 28 10:30 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Pwnage.ca » Evangelism is War The Mono/Moonlight Agenda .::. Size~: 71.94 KB | Dec 28 10:30 |
| Ender2070 | chris/eet got served | Dec 28 10:30 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Does new super mario bros use the wiimote? | Dec 28 10:38 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Has anyone noticed their Identi.ca being followed by an increasing number of Ad bots? I had hoped Twitter would keep them all. #junk #spam | Dec 28 10:40 | |
| oiaohm | There all basically single keys DaemonFC just multi install supporting. So not something you hand out. | Dec 28 10:44 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @_Goblin chromium kept processes running when I closed the windows - killed them, started 4.0.283.0 (35283), we'll see now! | Dec 28 10:48 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #SteveBallmer Should Not be Fired, He Should be Arrested http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/28/steve-ballmer-accountability/ | Dec 28 10:53 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Steve Ballmer Should Not be Fired, He Should be Arrested | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 115.87 KB | Dec 28 10:54 |
| *PetoKraus has quit ("Leaving") | Dec 28 10:58 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] FreeBeeHosting - Yo-Yo servers, up and down, it's like a fucking game, working one minute, not the next. http://tinyurl.com/ykouv3t | Dec 28 11:04 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: FreeBeeHosting - Server Status Reports For All FreeBeeHosting Web Servers .::. Size~: 16.14 KB | Dec 28 11:04 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] BBC News - Technology changes 'outstrip' netbooks http://tinyurl.com/y9grjs6 | Dec 28 11:12 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC News - Technology changes 'outstrip' netbooks .::. Size~: 56.95 KB | Dec 28 11:12 |
| *jono (n=jono@ubuntu/member/jono) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 11:20 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Apple Helps #Microsoft Attack #Google ’s Linux While Google Spreads GNU/Linux, #ODF http://ur1.ca/impu | Dec 28 11:54 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Apple Helps Microsoft Attack Googles Linux While Google Spreads GNU/Linux, ODF | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 124.44 KB | Dec 28 11:55 |
| schestowitz | http://www.the-source.com/2009/12/more-on-the-moonlight-covenant/ | Dec 28 11:56 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: More on the Moonlight Covenant « The Source.com .::. Size~: 35.98 KB | Dec 28 11:56 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @thistleweb BBC News - Technology changes 'outstrip' netbooks http://tinyurl.com/y9grjs6 | Dec 28 12:00 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC News - Technology changes 'outstrip' netbooks .::. Size~: 56.84 KB | Dec 28 12:00 |
| schestowitz | Read and weep about the Moonlight covenant | Dec 28 12:01 |
| schestowitz | Mono is a cancer that attached itself to Linux | Dec 28 12:01 |
| oiaohm | Battle is on going schestowitz | Dec 28 12:03 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9142778/Psystar_halts_sales_of_Mac_cloning_tool_will_peddle_Linux_PCs | Dec 28 12:06 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Psystar halts sales of Mac cloning tool, will peddle Linux PCs .::. Size~: 139.15 KB | Dec 28 12:06 |
| schestowitz | Wow. Digg really lost focus... http://digg.com/linux_unix | Dec 28 12:08 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 28 12:08 |
| schestowitz | Page 1 for this category used to be like 2 days only | Dec 28 12:08 |
| DaemonFC | They're putting Linux on as a filler while still telling you how to install OS X yourself | Dec 28 12:09 |
| schestowitz | Doesn't matter | Dec 28 12:10 |
| schestowitz | I may treat Windows like that | Dec 28 12:10 |
| schestowitz | Some treat OS X like this.... Linus for instance | Dec 28 12:10 |
| schestowitz | They just wipe OS X or Windows off when they buy a PC | Dec 28 12:10 |
| oiaohm | DaemonFC: Remember that the machine sells with Linux installed it counts to linux sales numbers. | Dec 28 12:21 |
| DaemonFC | yeah | Dec 28 12:21 |
| DaemonFC | doesn't matter if they don't use it | Dec 28 12:22 |
| DaemonFC | it's kind of a way of shipping it with something and letting the customer choose | Dec 28 12:22 |
| oiaohm | Also the hardware they buy has to be OS X and Linux friendly. | Dec 28 12:23 |
| oiaohm | Does not have to be Windows friendly. | Dec 28 12:23 |
| DaemonFC | my dad did comment on how seemless the upgrade from Ubuntu 9.04 to 9.10 was on his laptop | Dec 28 12:23 |
| Diablo-D3 | its easy to do that | Dec 28 12:23 |
| Diablo-D3 | you know how? | Dec 28 12:23 |
| Diablo-D3 | BUY A MAC | Dec 28 12:23 |
| Diablo-D3 | dohohohoho | Dec 28 12:23 |
| DaemonFC | You can run Windows on a Mac | Dec 28 12:23 |
| DaemonFC | you do not need Boot Camp | Dec 28 12:23 |
| DaemonFC | you'll need the bundle of drivers from Apple thoug | Dec 28 12:24 |
| *_goblin has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | Dec 28 12:24 | |
| DaemonFC | they do have them separate on their support site somewhere | Dec 28 12:24 |
| DaemonFC | Windows Vista SP2 and Windows 7 will both boot up on a system using EFI | Dec 28 12:25 |
| DaemonFC | Windows XP has to use Boot Camp and the BIOS emulation it provides though | Dec 28 12:25 |
| oiaohm | Vista SP2 not exactly stable boot on EFI. Only on trustable on it is windows 7 | Dec 28 12:25 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] Technology we have loved in 2009 - None of them chose Win7 or OSX, not even MS or RKJ http://tinyurl.com/y8mzxbe | Dec 28 12:25 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC News - Technology we have loved in 2009 .::. Size~: 64.27 KB | Dec 28 12:25 |
| DaemonFC | new Mac owner will probably buy Windows 7 | Dec 28 12:26 |
| oiaohm | Particular drivers will shot you foot off with EFI and Vista SP2 | Dec 28 12:26 |
| DaemonFC | but they're all idiots and will stuff it into boot camp cause they don't know how to partition a drive | Dec 28 12:26 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 12:26 |
| oiaohm | Or just are trying it DaemonFC | Dec 28 12:27 |
| oiaohm | And might delete it latter. | Dec 28 12:27 |
| DaemonFC | I played around with OS X and was not impressed | Dec 28 12:27 |
| oiaohm | Then it turns into stuck. | Dec 28 12:27 |
| DaemonFC | it's unstable and everything you click on is designed to make you pay Apple more money | Dec 28 12:27 |
| DaemonFC | .Mac, iTunes, etc. | Dec 28 12:27 |
| DaemonFC | ports from Windows never get less expensive on a Mac | Dec 28 12:28 |
| DaemonFC | if the Mac gets a Windows game ported over, it's a year later and at full price, usually $50, while the Windows version is down to like $15 | Dec 28 12:28 |
| oiaohm | Same can be true with Linux. | Dec 28 12:28 |
| DaemonFC | OS X is garbage, it has all the problems you would run into on Windows and Linux, combined | Dec 28 12:29 |
| DaemonFC | and some of its own | Dec 28 12:29 |
| oiaohm | But at least items from ID and the like get collectors cases and the like for the Linux version. | Dec 28 12:29 |
| oiaohm | Where the Mac versions don't. | Dec 28 12:29 |
| DaemonFC | Apple should take down those demo iMacs | Dec 28 12:29 |
| DaemonFC | that's what talked me into another Windows system | Dec 28 12:29 |
| DaemonFC | if I'm going to have to deal with all the problems of a Mac, I may as well save some money and sanity and just use Windows | Dec 28 12:31 |
| oiaohm | http://www.h-online.com/security/news/item/Security-flaw-in-Microsoft-IIS-892881.html Hmm next months MS web server numbers should be bad. | Dec 28 12:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Security flaw in Microsoft IIS - The H Security: News and Features .::. Size~: 34.06 KB | Dec 28 12:31 |
| DaemonFC | Apple supports more standards than Microsoft only because they don't have any weight to throw around if they start trying to make them | Dec 28 12:33 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly true DaemonFC | Dec 28 12:33 |
| DaemonFC | What exactly is AMD's plans for EFI? | Dec 28 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Job at the head of apple is a true programmer so understands the nightmares of not doing stuff with written standards DaemonFC | Dec 28 12:34 |
| oiaohm | Even if apple keeps the standard internal you can bet it will be a well written up and followed standard. | Dec 28 12:34 |
| oiaohm | So avoid all the hickups we have to put up with from MS. | Dec 28 12:35 |
| DaemonFC | I liked how Greg KH was talking about all the work he had to do to clean up those Hyper-V drivers from Microsoft | Dec 28 12:36 |
| DaemonFC | poor coding quality | Dec 28 12:36 |
| oiaohm | And the support staff for them are a wall again DaemonFC | Dec 28 12:37 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: El Reg reported it some days ago.. | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | *LOL* http://twitter.com/beranger_v4/status/3756546193 | Dec 28 12:45 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Twitter / Béranger: I've just closed my blog a ... .::. Size~: 9.86 KB | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | "@beranger_v4 man, I didn't know you're here..." | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | He's still around to rant like mad | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | But watch his homepage | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | http://beranger.org/v3/wordpress/ | Dec 28 12:45 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Planète Béranger v3 .::. Size~: 37.17 KB | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | Shop closed | Dec 28 12:45 |
| schestowitz | Less attacks on distros from him. That's a relief | Dec 28 12:46 |
| schestowitz | No wonder TuxMachines never mentions him anymore | Dec 28 12:46 |
| schestowitz | I've decided to give /, another try and subscribed to it | Dec 28 12:46 |
| oiaohm | wonder how many others will magically go into hibernation. | Dec 28 12:48 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] lost count of the number of cars going backwards with wheels spinning past my window downhill as they struggle to get grip on the snow & ice | Dec 28 12:52 | |
| DaemonFC | oiaohm: Is there a way to do what Wubi does, only put Windows in the virtual hard disk file? | Dec 28 12:54 |
| DaemonFC | with Linux as the host | Dec 28 12:54 |
| oiaohm | Yes but it completely evil to make work. | Dec 28 12:55 |
| oiaohm | Number one you have to use the reactos ntldr replacement. | Dec 28 12:55 |
| oiaohm | Since MS own bootloader for the OS will not have anything todo with doing that. | Dec 28 12:55 |
| oiaohm | Then there is third party drivers to do other bits like the loop back device. | Dec 28 12:56 |
| oiaohm | Other option is truecrypt and the like. | Dec 28 12:57 |
| oiaohm | But they don't support a file as a partitiion and booting from it. | Dec 28 12:57 |
| DaemonFC | Fedora won't even package Truecrypt | Dec 28 13:12 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 13:12 |
| oiaohm | truecrypt creates a fake block device before windows load that windows will talk to. | Dec 28 13:13 |
| oiaohm | How I am not exactly sure. | Dec 28 13:13 |
| DaemonFC | Blu Ray market share is now at 15% | Dec 28 13:20 |
| DaemonFC | err 14 | Dec 28 13:20 |
| schestowitz |  | Dec 28 13:21 |
| schestowitz | [12:48] <oiaohm> wonder how many others will magically go into hibernation. | Dec 28 13:21 |
| schestowitz | Many already have | Dec 28 13:21 |
| schestowitz | I've just gone through my RSS feeds, most are dead and I didn't notice | Dec 28 13:21 |
| schestowitz | Some are just posting the "I'm still alive" placeholder | Dec 28 13:22 |
| DaemonFC | http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-10416699-92.html | Dec 28 13:24 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: FTC pursues Intel on new front: Graphics chips | Business Tech - CNET News .::. Size~: 118.62 KB | Dec 28 13:24 |
| *kecskebak (n=kecskeba@dsl4E5CCF61.pool.t-online.hu) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 13:29 | |
| kecskebak | BN is very slow at the moment from here... | Dec 28 13:31 |
| DaemonFC | hmmm, guy at Gamestop says they don't get a lot of Refurbished Wiis in cause they don't break down a lot | Dec 28 13:50 |
| schestowitz | kecskebak: there was an issue | Dec 28 13:51 |
| schestowitz | Sometimes when there are spike it stops serving | Dec 28 13:51 |
| schestowitz | http://www.democracynow.org/2009/12/23/report_obama_ordered_us_military_strike | Dec 28 13:51 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Report: Obama Ordered US Military Strike on Yemen .::. Size~: 38.84 KB | Dec 28 13:51 |
| kecskebak | schestowitz: I'm glad the site is getting so well used! | Dec 28 13:52 |
| kecskebak | Some cracking stories on the news page today. | Dec 28 13:53 |
| schestowitz | I need to keep an eye on "top" | Dec 28 13:55 |
| schestowitz | Since yesterday we've had this issue where I sometimes have to give apache a prod | Dec 28 13:55 |
| *schestowitz organises his reading lists today | Dec 28 13:55 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/12/26/chinese-copy-cat-pirates-launch-ubuntu-that-looks-just-like-windows-xp/ | Dec 28 14:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Infamous Chinese pirates launch Ubuntu that looks just like Windows XP .::. Size~: 106.15 KB | Dec 28 14:01 |
| *Omar87 (n=quassel@79.173.221.115) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 14:15 | |
| schestowitz | wb, Omar87 | Dec 28 14:19 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: hi, thanks. | Dec 28 14:19 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Demo of #KDE4 : #Multitouch and #Marble http://boycottnovell.com/2009/12/28/multitouch-and-marble/ | Dec 28 14:48 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Demo of KDE4: Multitouch and Marble | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 108.23 KB | Dec 28 14:49 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @glynmoody: Now Germany joins in, blaming China and US for Copenhagen debacle [...] [english] - http://bit.ly/8PKxeQ #cop15 | Dec 28 14:57 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Google Translate .::. Size~: 1.02 KB | Dec 28 14:58 |
| schestowitz | http://thenextweb.com/au/2009/12/27/shoes-prey-web-real-customisable/ | Dec 28 15:01 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Shoes of Prey and the New Web of Real Customisable Things .::. Size~: 28.16 KB | Dec 28 15:01 |
| schestowitz | Heh. http://bitly.tv/ | Dec 28 15:05 |
| *pawel (n=quassel@82.177.199.102) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 15:08 | |
| schestowitz | http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/27/us/27plane.html?_r=2 | Dec 28 15:09 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The New York Times > Log In .::. Size~: 9.64 KB | Dec 28 15:09 |
| pawel | http://www.h-online.com/open/news/item/Microsoft-promises-not-to-press-charges-against-Moonlight-users-892666.html | Dec 28 15:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Microsoft promises not to press charges against Moonlight users - The H Open Source: News and Features .::. Size~: 33.77 KB | Dec 28 15:11 |
| pawel | "promises"... | Dec 28 15:11 |
| *oiaohm has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)) | Dec 28 15:16 | |
| schestowitz | pawel: I called it "promiseware" | Dec 28 15:19 |
| pawel | nice :) | Dec 28 15:19 |
| schestowitz | hmmmmmmm.... load average: 17.26, 13.13, 7.94 | Dec 28 15:27 |
| schestowitz | The site won't be responding now, I guess. | Dec 28 15:27 |
| schestowitz | Not good | Dec 28 15:27 |
| kecskebak | It is real traffic and not someone trying a denial of service? | Dec 28 15:29 |
| schestowitz | That's what I'm trying to figure out | Dec 28 15:33 |
| kecskebak | No response from Hungary btw | Dec 28 15:33 |
| schestowitz | I noticed that a shill agency crawls it | Dec 28 15:33 |
| schestowitz | Radian6 | Dec 28 15:33 |
| schestowitz | A lot of crawlers it seems... | Dec 28 15:34 |
| schestowitz | I wish I had a switch to just dent SEs and then let them in again | Dec 28 15:35 |
| schestowitz | It seems like Windows zombies also hammer on http://boycottnovell.com/wp-login.php | Dec 28 15:36 |
| schestowitz | Maybe tessier is awake, but doubt it | Dec 28 15:38 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Error processing the URL: .::. Size~: 0 KB | Dec 28 15:39 |
| *pawel has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 28 15:40 | |
| schestowitz | I'm not sure what to do | Dec 28 15:40 |
| schestowitz | It looks like legitimate bots and users, some rogues ones also | Dec 28 15:41 |
| schestowitz | MSN and Yahoo! still hit quite hard on it, I can hardly find a way around it | Dec 28 15:44 |
| *gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 15:46 | |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] Is George Hostler <highplainsthumper@gmail.com> valid or a forger? | Dec 28 15:46 | |
| *gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 15:47 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] I am afraid that I already know the answer :-( | Dec 28 15:52 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[ml2mst] The Microsoft Shills are getting desperate thus even nastier. | Dec 28 15:54 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @ml2mst E-mails can be forged too | Dec 28 16:02 | |
| *jono has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) | Dec 28 16:10 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] having load issues with the server today. Useless Yahoo and MSN pounding endlessly at CPU-intensive pages | Dec 28 16:10 | |
| *DaemonFC has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Dec 28 16:16 | |
| *DaemonFC (n=chatzill@c-67-173-86-174.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 16:16 | |
| kecskebak | BN is back again from Hungary | Dec 28 16:42 |
| schestowitz | Yes, I know | Dec 28 16:48 |
| schestowitz | It's a load issue | Dec 28 16:48 |
| schestowitz | Not geographical or uptime | Dec 28 16:49 |
| schestowitz | > Cause and effect, or just a set of correlated symptoms? | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/12/19/verizon_snuffs_google_for_bing/ | Dec 28 16:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Verizon snuffs Google for Microsoft search • The Register .::. Size~: 29.71 KB | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | > http://crackberry.com/blackberry-messenger-fritz | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | No correlation AFAIK | Dec 28 16:50 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BlackBerry EVERYTHING on the Fritz??! Data Service Issues Being Reported by Users | CrackBerry.com .::. Size~: 223.79 KB | Dec 28 16:50 |
| schestowitz | kecskebak: happy birthday | Dec 28 16:52 |
| kecskebak | Thanks - it was yesterday :) | Dec 28 16:52 |
| kecskebak | I'm an ancient 38 | Dec 28 16:52 |
| *ThistleWeb (n=gordon@87.112.25.108.plusnet.ptn-ag1.dyn.plus.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 17:04 | |
| *ThistleWeb has quit ("Lost terminal") | Dec 28 17:18 | |
| schestowitz | Weir has just migrated to WordPress (hours ago): http://www.robweir.com/blog/2009/12/planned-migration-of-antic-disposition.html | Dec 28 17:24 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Planned Migration of An Antic Disposition .::. Size~: 11.51 KB | Dec 28 17:24 |
| schestowitz | WTH is this? http://twitter.com/preymonster | Dec 28 17:25 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: jony (preymonster) on Twitter .::. Size~: 31.93 KB | Dec 28 17:25 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RMS is being harassed by the US authorities. http://ubunlog.com.ar/blog/tras-una-pelea-richard-stallman-detenido-en-el-aeropuerto-de-miami/ | Dec 28 17:27 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Tras una pelea, Richard Stallman detenido en el aeropuerto de Miami | Ubunlog .::. Size~: 80.25 KB | Dec 28 17:28 |
| schestowitz | Seems like a hoax | Dec 28 17:28 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Wait... it's the "Day of the Innocents"....... | Dec 28 17:29 | |
| *_goblin (n=goblin@94-193-188-104.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 17:30 | |
| schestowitz | RT @carlopiana: Hoax or true? Stallman arrested in Miami after a quarrel with M. de Icaza (or abuse of facial hair ;-) " | Dec 28 17:31 |
| *kecskebak has quit ("Ex-Chat") | Dec 28 17:38 | |
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| amarsh04 | schestowitz, did you see that sjvn references the bn site in http://blogs.computerworld.com/15321/a_decade_of_linux | Dec 28 17:42 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: A decade of Linux - Computerworld Blogs .::. Size~: 133.51 KB | Dec 28 17:42 |
| Ender2070 | [05:31] <DaemonFC> Ender2070: Does new super mario bros use the wiimote? | Dec 28 17:47 |
| Ender2070 | yes, doesnt require nunchuck | Dec 28 17:47 |
| DaemonFC | heh, so you just turn it sideways, right? | Dec 28 17:47 |
| DaemonFC | I am going to get that A Boy and His Blob | Dec 28 17:48 |
| DaemonFC | the NES one I played about 20 years ago | Dec 28 17:48 |
| DaemonFC | it was one of my favorites | Dec 28 17:48 |
| Ender2070 | i've come to the conclusion that chris can't read | Dec 28 17:57 |
| DaemonFC | it's annoying that half the pages on Wikipedia use British spellings | Dec 28 18:00 |
| DaemonFC | the other half use the American spellings | Dec 28 18:01 |
| DaemonFC | consistency anyone? | Dec 28 18:01 |
| DaemonFC | then there are some pages that use both sets of spelling rules on the same page | Dec 28 18:01 |
| DaemonFC | then for the longest time, en-US wasn't even an option in Ubuntu | Dec 28 18:03 |
| DaemonFC | you'd get en-GB pulled in by default | Dec 28 18:03 |
| DaemonFC | it was annoying because it would "correct" my spelling when I hadn't actually misspelled anything, so my documents were full of words with the red underlines | Dec 28 18:04 |
| Ender2070 | they should use en-GB by default | Dec 28 18:04 |
| Ender2070 | for wikipedia and everything | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | if they're going to clone Debian, why couldn't they clone one set of f----g spelling rules? | Dec 28 18:05 |
| Ender2070 | america should switch to the english the rest of the world uses | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | Canada can't even do that, | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | ;) | Dec 28 18:05 |
| Ender2070 | yes :D | Dec 28 18:05 |
| Ender2070 | i use british english whenever I can | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | they mix and match between the two | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | en-CA | Dec 28 18:05 |
| DaemonFC | then they have French speakers *shivers* | Dec 28 18:06 |
| Ender2070 | I use en-GB | Dec 28 18:06 |
| Ender2070 | en-CA is sometimes lazy and just symlinks to en-US | Dec 28 18:06 |
| DaemonFC | rofl | Dec 28 18:06 |
| DaemonFC | en-CA is en-US's hat | Dec 28 18:06 |
| Ender2070 | developer ignorance | Dec 28 18:06 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 18:06 |
| Ender2070 | they assume canadians use backwards english | Dec 28 18:06 |
| schestowitz | amarsh04: I didn't, let's see...... | Dec 28 18:07 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Does it try to correct you if you type "tire"? | Dec 28 18:07 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 18:07 |
| Ender2070 | tire? | Dec 28 18:07 |
| DaemonFC | yes, tire | Dec 28 18:07 |
| DaemonFC | well, I guess it wouldn't | Dec 28 18:07 |
| Ender2070 | canadian tire is a store, stfu | Dec 28 18:07 |
| Ender2070 | :P | Dec 28 18:08 |
| schestowitz | amarsh04: it's not correct | Dec 28 18:08 |
| Ender2070 | colour, honour | Dec 28 18:08 |
| Ender2070 | etc | Dec 28 18:08 |
| DaemonFC | cause you could say that something tires you | Dec 28 18:08 |
| schestowitz | I'm not too strict on libre s/w | Dec 28 18:08 |
| schestowitz | I have Flash and nvidia driver installed | Dec 28 18:08 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Just back from V&A. Frozen. Lovely afternoon :-) Fuji F70EXR got a workout. (Still haven't sent it back.) | Dec 28 18:08 | |
| DaemonFC | so you might not be referring to tires | Dec 28 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | en-GB tires me | Dec 28 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 18:09 |
| Ender2070 | actually you would probably not use it in such a way | Dec 28 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | woohoo | Dec 28 18:09 |
| Ender2070 | you would say something makes you tired | Dec 28 18:09 |
| DaemonFC | spelling software wouldn't know that | Dec 28 18:10 |
| *Tallken (n=f2f93bf5@93.102.61.47.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 18:10 | |
| Ender2070 | no | Dec 28 18:10 |
| Ender2070 | but its bad grammer | Dec 28 18:10 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] RT @ThisIsSethsBlog Seth's Blog: It's not the rats you need to worry about http://bit.ly/5UlsaZ | Dec 28 18:10 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Seth's Blog: It's not the rats you need to worry about .::. Size~: 52.37 KB | Dec 28 18:11 |
| schestowitz | People align BN a lot with the FSF simply because it stands for freedom, but that's like lumping together Fox and NRA because they both must detest Democrats | Dec 28 18:11 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: Fixed News is just one way of slanting and inventing news | Dec 28 18:12 |
| DaemonFC | there's an agenda behind every news network | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | Healthcare reform is communism :-) LOL | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | So die, die. die.... as long as we don't have this "communism" thingue | Dec 28 18:12 |
| DaemonFC | MSNBC appears to be the Democrats answer to Fox | Dec 28 18:12 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: I've heard of people in a similar situation who died from easily-curable health issue | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC | meh, they casrated the healthcare bill and turned it into one giant corporate welfare bill | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC | the Democrats are still lining up behind it | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC | *castrated | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC | braindead zombies | Dec 28 18:13 |
| schestowitz | Like this kid whose dental issue he could not afford to sort out, so it turns septic and went up to his brain, killing him | Dec 28 18:13 |
| DaemonFC | just braindead in a different way from the Republicans | Dec 28 18:13 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: no, the Democrats are just obedient to Big Business | Dec 28 18:14 |
| schestowitz | Like the "Other Party" | Dec 28 18:14 |
| DaemonFC | braindead in a more subtle but equally frightening way | Dec 28 18:14 |
| schestowitz | They try to change, but all their funding comes from those people whom they try to affect. Well, truth be told, almost $300ml in funding came from donours, but some of them are business execs and there are still billions that come from businesses directly | Dec 28 18:15 |
| DaemonFC | throwing more soldiers into the middle east while they give the rhetoric that they want to wind things down over there | Dec 28 18:15 |
| DaemonFC | their actions don't align with their words | Dec 28 18:15 |
| schestowitz | The election is a ceremony that happens once in 4 years where the businesses groom two puppets and sub-puppets (VPs), then let the sheeple vote based on PR campaigns, not issues or policies | Dec 28 18:15 |
| DaemonFC | I figured I'd vote for Obama on the off chance that there would be a full exit from Iraq sometime during my natural lifespan | Dec 28 18:16 |
| DaemonFC | doesn't look like it will ever happen | Dec 28 18:16 |
| schestowitz | http://www.embedded.com/shared/article/showPRNews.jhtml?art_id=E786603 | Dec 28 18:17 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Embedded.com - Marvell Powers 10,000th SheevaPlug .::. Size~: 59.41 KB | Dec 28 18:17 |
| schestowitz | I know someone who uses this as a PC.... | Dec 28 18:17 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: you didn't vote for him; | Dec 28 18:17 |
| schestowitz | you _shilled_ for him | Dec 28 18:17 |
| DaemonFC | it's not long before Iraq *and* Afghanistan have been going on longer than the Vietnam War | Dec 28 18:17 |
| schestowitz | You told me you went to houses when you could promote more independent people who need folks like you | Dec 28 18:17 |
| schestowitz | Kocinich for example | Dec 28 18:17 |
| Diablo-D3 | whos he shilling for now? | Dec 28 18:18 |
| schestowitz | Isn't he from around Ohio? | Dec 28 18:18 |
| DaemonFC | that was a mistake | Dec 28 18:18 |
| Diablo-D3 | schestowitz: answer ze question | Dec 28 18:18 |
| schestowitz | Diablo-D3: I don't know | Dec 28 18:18 |
| schestowitz | Ask him | Dec 28 18:18 |
| Diablo-D3 | I have him on ignore. | Dec 28 18:18 |
| schestowitz | He can nynshift to daemon7 | Dec 28 18:18 |
| schestowitz | *nym | Dec 28 18:19 |
| schestowitz | That's why I'd never spend much effort promoting so-called FOSS companies | Dec 28 18:19 |
| schestowitz | Eventually they get scooped up by some closed empire or turn hostile | Dec 28 18:19 |
| DaemonFC | cause they have a tendency to throw in with Microsoft later and then you look like an idiot? | Dec 28 18:19 |
| DaemonFC | good idea | Dec 28 18:20 |
| schestowitz | EFF, FSF, IEF, CC... those I can support... also Firefox and Wikipedia because of their organisation structure | Dec 28 18:20 |
| schestowitz | *organisational structure (not pressured by shareholders) | Dec 28 18:20 |
| DaemonFC | Mozilla should be blocking Silverlight entirely, all versions | Dec 28 18:20 |
| schestowitz | I thought they almost did | Dec 28 18:20 |
| DaemonFC | and anything else Microsoft trojans in without user permission | Dec 28 18:20 |
| schestowitz | Nitot hates it | Dec 28 18:21 |
| schestowitz | They blocked that .NET virus | Dec 28 18:21 |
| DaemonFC | virus? | Dec 28 18:21 |
| schestowitz | Addin that came as part of the attack known as Windows Upd4te | Dec 28 18:21 |
| DaemonFC | heh | Dec 28 18:21 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but swatting at them one by one won't work | Dec 28 18:21 |
| Ender2070 | I think chris hangs out in here | Dec 28 18:22 |
| DaemonFC | there will be a new one every day eventually | Dec 28 18:22 |
| DaemonFC | then what does Mozilla do? | Dec 28 18:22 |
| Ender2070 | <schestowitz> chris/eet must hang out in here | Dec 28 18:22 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/10/19/mozilla-blocks-microsoft-leech/ | Dec 28 18:22 |
| DaemonFC | Firefox got 10 times more dangerous because of Mozilla's refusal to nip this problem in the bud and banish all the Microsoft trojan crapware | Dec 28 18:22 |
| schestowitz | Server gets crippled again. Dman. | Dec 28 18:22 |
| schestowitz | load average: 13.94, 7.24, 3.64 | Dec 28 18:23 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Mozilla Sort of Bans Microsoft | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 112.78 KB | Dec 28 18:23 |
| DaemonFC | why should they let Firefox become a victim of shoddy plugins that installed without user permission? | Dec 28 18:23 |
| DaemonFC | that's exactly why Microsoft put them there, to create a huge security hazard in Firefox | Dec 28 18:24 |
| DaemonFC | the way Firefox ignores the UAC model makes Silverlight and ClickOnce more dangerous in Firefox than in Internet Explorer | Dec 28 18:25 |
| DaemonFC | there's nothing at all to sandbox any possible malware that uses that stuff in Firefox | Dec 28 18:25 |
| schestowitz | http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/happy-birthday-linus | Dec 28 18:25 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Happy Birthday, Linus | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 48.04 KB | Dec 28 18:25 |
| schestowitz | He stole kecskebak's thunder | Dec 28 18:25 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Linus turns 40 today. Linux is mature! | Dec 28 18:28 | |
| schestowitz | KDE4 is getting to look better than the competition. http://maketecheasier.com/customize-kde-desktop-with-kde-look-org/2009/12/28 | Dec 28 18:29 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: How to customize your KDE desktop with KDE-Look.org Make Tech Easier .::. Size~: 44.7 KB | Dec 28 18:29 |
| schestowitz | http://www.digikam.org/drupal/node/493 | Dec 28 18:31 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: digiKam 1.1 Splash-screens: call to photographers ! | digiKam - Photo Management Program .::. Size~: 16.18 KB | Dec 28 18:31 |
| *Balrog (n=Balrog@pool-74-109-70-59.phlapa.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 18:31 | |
| DaemonFC | I wonder if that Avatar game runs in Wine if I buy it on Steam | Dec 28 18:32 |
| DaemonFC | I would just try the demo in Wine except that most problems with its Windows compatibility stem from conflicts with DRM | Dec 28 18:33 |
| DaemonFC | it would probably help a lot if they hacked away on DRM compatibility for a while | Dec 28 18:34 |
| DaemonFC | there's probably thousands of programs that would run otherwise already but don't | Dec 28 18:34 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: How many people that rail against DRM don't realize that a console is DRM and always has been? :P | Dec 28 18:36 |
| DaemonFC | http://www.defectivebydesign.org/day08-nintendowii | Dec 28 18:37 |
| DaemonFC | heh | Dec 28 18:37 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 35 Days Against DRM -- Day 8: Nintendo Wii | DefectiveByDesign.org .::. Size~: 18.32 KB | Dec 28 18:37 |
| DaemonFC | Nobody that puts out a product on the market is safe from these people | Dec 28 18:37 |
| DaemonFC | their 35 days just about covers every consumer electronics device out there | Dec 28 18:38 |
| DaemonFC | I can't believe they devoted an entire day to Spore though | Dec 28 18:38 |
| DaemonFC | Grand Theft Auto is amusing though because you have to hotwire the game itself before you can enjoy it | Dec 28 18:39 |
| Ender2070 | <schestowitz> KDE 4.4 is looking sweet in Rawhide | Dec 28 18:41 |
| Ender2070 | <schestowitz> We'll also see it in Fedora 12, officially when its released | Dec 28 18:42 |
| Ender2070 | not some experimental ppa | Dec 28 18:42 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: PPA's are usually stable enough | Dec 28 18:42 |
| DaemonFC | it's how I got KDE 4.2 on Ubuntu 8.10 I believe | Dec 28 18:43 |
| DaemonFC | KDE betas are actually pretty stable themselves lately | Dec 28 18:43 |
| Ender2070 | yeah but they shouldn't be ppa's | Dec 28 18:43 |
| Ender2070 | they should get pushed to all users | Dec 28 18:43 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: If they're unofficial backports, they should be in PPAs | Dec 28 18:44 |
| Ender2070 | exactly, lol | Dec 28 18:44 |
| DaemonFC | you know the risk when you choose to upgrade those packages | Dec 28 18:44 |
| Ender2070 | Fedora does it officially | Dec 28 18:44 |
| Ender2070 | regular users will see KDE 4.4 before Fedora 13 | Dec 28 18:44 |
| DaemonFC | usually KDE is usually within a month of a new Kubuntu anyway | Dec 28 18:44 |
| Ender2070 | along with Qt 4.6 | Dec 28 18:44 |
| DaemonFC | so you should probably just wait and upgrade the whole OS | Dec 28 18:45 |
| DaemonFC | KDE and all | Dec 28 18:45 |
| Ender2070 | no | Dec 28 18:45 |
| Ender2070 | theres nothing wrong with using the latest kde when its released by the kde guys | Dec 28 18:45 |
| DaemonFC | beats risking blowing up your working system with hundreds of backported packages | Dec 28 18:45 |
| Ender2070 | they arent backported packages | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | you're using weird terminology | Dec 28 18:46 |
| DaemonFC | they are if you use Kubuntu | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | i dont | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | cause it sucks for that reason | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | I want an official kde 4.4 in my distro upon release | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | without waiting | Dec 28 18:46 |
| DaemonFC | I'm not saying they will wreck your system, just that they're probably not well tested with that version of Kubuntu | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | well, i wait like a week or two for bugs to get flushed | Dec 28 18:46 |
| Ender2070 | they put it in updates-testing first | Dec 28 18:47 |
| Ender2070 | then updates when its proven to work | Dec 28 18:47 |
| DaemonFC | Ubuntu releases are short lived anyway, it's a good reason to not make new KDE official | Dec 28 18:47 |
| Ender2070 | fedora has short 6 month releases too | Dec 28 18:47 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but I think they're supported longer | Dec 28 18:47 |
| Ender2070 | they only maintain 2 releases at a time | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | they also get major upgrades of key pieces of the system | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | like kernels | Dec 28 18:48 |
| Ender2070 | F11 and F12 right now | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | Ubuntu doesn't | Dec 28 18:48 |
| Ender2070 | this is why I think fedora is better | Dec 28 18:48 |
| Ender2070 | if I wanted to run "stable" i'd use debian | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | you can build your own kernel | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | it may be a support nightmare though | Dec 28 18:48 |
| DaemonFC | I've done it before | Dec 28 18:48 |
| Ender2070 | I wouldn't use fedora on a server though | Dec 28 18:48 |
| Ender2070 | for a desktop its fine | Dec 28 18:49 |
| DaemonFC | make-kpkg is nice | Dec 28 18:49 |
| DaemonFC | much nicer than just tossing it in manually, independent of the packaging system | Dec 28 18:49 |
| Ender2070 | hey have you seen Sidux ? | Dec 28 18:49 |
| DaemonFC | and crossing fingers | Dec 28 18:49 |
| DaemonFC | yes | Dec 28 18:49 |
| Ender2070 | debian sid + kde and latest kernel | Dec 28 18:49 |
| Ender2070 | i might try it out | Dec 28 18:49 |
| DaemonFC | I hate Fedora just because of their packaging policies | Dec 28 18:50 |
| DaemonFC | and the fact that every new version leaves Nvidia and ATI potentially not working for months | Dec 28 18:50 |
| DaemonFC | changing the subject a little, but I was looking at wired routers the other day | Dec 28 18:51 |
| DaemonFC | it's actually cheaper to get wireless and turn the wireless part off | Dec 28 18:51 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Wikimedia blog: Dear museums, help me to help you. http://davidgerard.co.uk/notes/2009/12/28/dear-museums-help-me-to-help-you/ | Dec 28 18:51 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: David Gerard » Blog Archive » Dear museums, help me to help you. .::. Size~: 12.09 KB | Dec 28 18:52 |
| DaemonFC | I decided wireless is overhyped, god forbid you should have to run a cable when the wireless signal can make it through ONE WALL at least half the time | Dec 28 18:52 |
| DaemonFC | til you turn the microwave on in the kitchen | Dec 28 18:53 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 18:53 |
| Ender2070 | <DaemonFC> F11 works with nvidia | Dec 28 18:54 |
| Ender2070 | upon release too | Dec 28 18:54 |
| Ender2070 | F12 introduced nouveau as default and it works, its open source | Dec 28 18:54 |
| Ender2070 | xorg 1.7.1 has issues with nvidia | Dec 28 18:54 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: What's scary is that the government is now saying they don't need a warrant to enter your home if you have a wireless router turned on | Dec 28 18:54 |
| DaemonFC | they can come in "to inspect the device" | Dec 28 18:55 |
| Ender2070 | yes | Dec 28 18:55 |
| Ender2070 | FCC dude | Dec 28 18:55 |
| Ender2070 | wireless is stupid anyways | Dec 28 18:55 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, it's pretty unreliable | Dec 28 18:55 |
| Ender2070 | and not secure at all | Dec 28 18:55 |
| DaemonFC | I just need a router to connect all my devices through ethernet cable | Dec 28 18:56 |
| DaemonFC | I'm trying to figure out the very cheapest way to do that | Dec 28 18:56 |
| Ender2070 | if you're really paranoid think about this | Dec 28 18:56 |
| Ender2070 | quantum computers, in your life time | Dec 28 18:57 |
| Ender2070 | even if your safe now, someone can be capturing your packets for the sole purpose of cracking them when those computers exist | Dec 28 18:57 |
| DaemonFC | I don't want the security problems of the router, the connection problems of wireless, or the FCC insisting that they're above the fourth amendment and entering my home without a warrant | Dec 28 18:57 |
| Ender2070 | another issue with wireless is health | Dec 28 18:58 |
| Ender2070 | physical health | Dec 28 18:58 |
| DaemonFC | they could easily send out one person from the FCC when the police want to search your home | Dec 28 18:58 |
| DaemonFC | use it as a flimsy excuse to get in | Dec 28 18:58 |
| Ender2070 | you're getting a low dose of the same frequency radiation that a microwave gives off | Dec 28 18:58 |
| DaemonFC | EA Games told me to challenge everything, so I challenged their DRM and won :D | Dec 28 18:59 |
| DaemonFC | I love radiation | Dec 28 19:00 |
| DaemonFC | maybe the router will give me super powers | Dec 28 19:00 |
| DaemonFC | or maybe it just sterilized everyone that sits next to one | Dec 28 19:01 |
| DaemonFC | either way, society wins | Dec 28 19:01 |
| DaemonFC | I probably get more radiation from my cell phone being in my pocket than the router would put out | Dec 28 19:02 |
| DaemonFC | :P | Dec 28 19:02 |
| *fewa_ (n=fewa__@c-67-168-200-83.hsd1.or.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 19:04 | |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Yeah, Fedora 11 works with Nvidia and ATI, but I don't want to stay back one version at all times as the punishment for wanting a decent GPU | Dec 28 19:04 |
| DaemonFC | the problem is that the kernel, the X server, and everything else change so fast that the drivers can't keep up | Dec 28 19:05 |
| DaemonFC | by the time they do, they're behind again | Dec 28 19:05 |
| DaemonFC | no stable interfaces is always going to be the problem | Dec 28 19:06 |
| DaemonFC | There's good and bad with going that route, if you don't mind breaking all the drivers every few months and never saying you're sorry | Dec 28 19:07 |
| DaemonFC | lets them fix bugs though | Dec 28 19:07 |
| DaemonFC | Microsoft releases Windows with a stable driver model, but then they can't fix issues that arise with that driver model til the next Windows release, 4-5 years later | Dec 28 19:08 |
| Ender2070 | Fedora 11 still has newer software than Ubuntu tho | Dec 28 19:09 |
| Ender2070 | LOL | Dec 28 19:09 |
| DaemonFC | it means the users never have their driver break for no reason (to them), but in the mean time something like DWM might be leaking memory at an alarming rate and can't be fixed | Dec 28 19:09 |
| Ender2070 | [13:58] <DaemonFC> the problem is that the kernel, the X server, and everything else change so fast that the drivers can't keep up | Dec 28 19:10 |
| Ender2070 | proprietary needs to keep up, we shouldn't cater to them | Dec 28 19:10 |
| DaemonFC | well, FOSS isn't keeping pace with drivers even when they have specifications and support from the manufacturer | Dec 28 19:10 |
| Ender2070 | they still use stupid hacks that they used on windows | Dec 28 19:10 |
| Ender2070 | so they break all the time | Dec 28 19:10 |
| DaemonFC | so that's the flip side of the argument there | Dec 28 19:11 |
| Ender2070 | #nouveau buddy | Dec 28 19:11 |
| Ender2070 | my nvidia card works fine with open source drivers | Dec 28 19:11 |
| DaemonFC | RadeonHD is what I was referring to | Dec 28 19:11 |
| Ender2070 | ati sucks, they're very windows friendly | Dec 28 19:11 |
| DaemonFC | anything newer than late 2007 won't work right | Dec 28 19:11 |
| DaemonFC | so the open source people have specs and support | Dec 28 19:11 |
| DaemonFC | and they are almost two years behind anyway | Dec 28 19:12 |
| Ender2070 | they just got specs last year | Dec 28 19:12 |
| Ender2070 | they have 3d working on some cards now | Dec 28 19:12 |
| DaemonFC | that probably means that my 4670 should start working around this time next year | Dec 28 19:12 |
| Ender2070 | at the same time gallium3d came out | Dec 28 19:12 |
| DaemonFC | Fedora 14 or so | Dec 28 19:12 |
| Ender2070 | a new graphics architecture which will pwn what windows has | Dec 28 19:12 |
| DaemonFC | even though it was released in September of 2008 | Dec 28 19:12 |
| Ender2070 | all 3d drivers need to be re-written | Dec 28 19:12 |
| DaemonFC | so there's a 24 month turnaround to wait for the FOSS driver | Dec 28 19:13 |
| DaemonFC | and no wait to use FGLRX | Dec 28 19:13 |
| Ender2070 | dont use ati then | Dec 28 19:13 |
| Ender2070 | why do you complain when you buy pro-ms hardware | Dec 28 19:13 |
| Ender2070 | and it doesnt work | Dec 28 19:13 |
| DaemonFC | Nvidia isn't helping Nouveau behind saying they won't sue them | Dec 28 19:13 |
| DaemonFC | Nvidia cards will never work right on Linux without Nvidia's driver | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | nouveau is doing clearn room reverse engineering | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | they do work | Dec 28 19:14 |
| DaemonFC | I know | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | im using one right now | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | 9800GTX+ | Dec 28 19:14 |
| DaemonFC | radeonhd is progressing faster, while being two years behind | Dec 28 19:14 |
| DaemonFC | that's what makes nouveua laughable | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | nouveau is rather nwe | Dec 28 19:14 |
| Ender2070 | new | Dec 28 19:15 |
| DaemonFC | *nouveau | Dec 28 19:15 |
| DaemonFC | well, they have the easy stuff down | Dec 28 19:15 |
| Ender2070 | yeah | Dec 28 19:15 |
| Ender2070 | well they have no documentation | Dec 28 19:15 |
| DaemonFC | if all you want is faster 2d, nouveau is obviously better than nv | Dec 28 19:15 |
| Ender2070 | my next gfx is gonna be intel | Dec 28 19:15 |
| DaemonFC | several tiems faster on 2d, but no 3d support at all | Dec 28 19:16 |
| Ender2070 | I would like to see both nvidia and ati make their drivers open source | Dec 28 19:16 |
| Ender2070 | not make us do it | Dec 28 19:16 |
| Ender2070 | intel makes open source 3d drivers | Dec 28 19:16 |
| DaemonFC | I still can't see it behing any use to anyone with a card newer than 6000 series | Dec 28 19:16 |
| DaemonFC | if the card is so old that it never has any hope of playing a game ever again, go for it | Dec 28 19:17 |
| *Python1320 has quit ("Undeantiabnormal termination.") | Dec 28 19:17 | |
| DaemonFC | Intel is also a convicted monopolist that pays hardware makers to not use Nvidia or ATI | Dec 28 19:17 |
| DaemonFC | or AMD processors | Dec 28 19:17 |
| DaemonFC | netbook makers get $20 off Intel Atom netbooks if they use Intel graphics and not Nvidia | Dec 28 19:18 |
| DaemonFC | the FTC added that to their complaint against Intel the other day | Dec 28 19:18 |
| DaemonFC | $20 each for millions of netbooks makes a huge pile of cash | Dec 28 19:19 |
| DaemonFC | why give your customers the better performance of Nvidia when you can take Intel bribes and stick them with a pile of shit that's half as fast? :) | Dec 28 19:19 |
| DaemonFC | you're paying to be downgraded to cheaper, slower hardware | Dec 28 19:20 |
| DaemonFC | the only good argument for using Intel graphics on a netbook is to be more Linux compatible without relying on outside drivers | Dec 28 19:20 |
| DaemonFC | cause it surely doesn't perform as well | Dec 28 19:20 |
| DaemonFC | if I had a netbook or some cheap budget no name laptop, I'd go for the Intel card for that reason I guess | Dec 28 19:21 |
| DaemonFC | errr, chipset | Dec 28 19:21 |
| fewa_ | DaemonFC, http://www.gmabooster.com/ | Dec 28 19:22 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Welcome! .::. Size~: 1.38 KB | Dec 28 19:22 |
| DaemonFC | integrated GPU is like the Special Olympics | Dec 28 19:22 |
| fewa_ | it makes intel 3X as fast | Dec 28 19:22 |
| fewa_ | so by your metrics it would then be better than NVIDIA | Dec 28 19:22 |
| Ender2070 | AMD stopped their anti trust complaint after being paid, so they arent any better | Dec 28 19:23 |
| Ender2070 | Intel puts more money into linux than amd | Dec 28 19:23 |
| fewa_ | ARM | Dec 28 19:23 |
| fewa_ | ARM is superior anyways | Dec 28 19:23 |
| *Python1320 (n=Python13@unaffiliated/python1320) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 19:24 | |
| DaemonFC | AMD is also the reason you're not using 32-bit Intel CPU with PAE | Dec 28 19:24 |
| DaemonFC | which is what Intel had in mind | Dec 28 19:24 |
| fewa_ | itanic | Dec 28 19:24 |
| Ender2070 | AMD did fine, till Phenom | Dec 28 19:25 |
| Ender2070 | and now they dont have the money to keep up | Dec 28 19:25 |
| DaemonFC | Phenom II never had the TLB bug, so I'm good | Dec 28 19:25 |
| fewa_ | ARM quad cores will kick ass | Dec 28 19:25 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: They just got a billion dollars | Dec 28 19:25 |
| Ender2070 | ill give cudos to amd for pushing x86_64 | Dec 28 19:26 |
| Ender2070 | but they've suffered since they bought ati | Dec 28 19:26 |
| DaemonFC | I didn't think the ATI purchase was a great idea | Dec 28 19:26 |
| DaemonFC | I still don't | Dec 28 19:26 |
| Ender2070 | i agree | Dec 28 19:26 |
| Ender2070 | they would have the money to properly compete with intel if they didnt have a battle on two fronts | Dec 28 19:27 |
| DaemonFC | ATI is just like AMD, they can't beat Intel and Nvidia, so they jsut sell their processors and GPUs below cost | Dec 28 19:27 |
| Ender2070 | Intel ripped off phenom's arch with i7 | Dec 28 19:27 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, Core 2 Duo and Core 2 Quad were horrid | Dec 28 19:27 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Carl Sagan + autotune = WIN http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSgiXGELjbc | Dec 28 19:27 | |
| DaemonFC | Macs still use them I think | Dec 28 19:28 |
| Ender2070 | actually | Dec 28 19:29 |
| Ender2070 | core 2 duo pwned x2 | Dec 28 19:29 |
| DaemonFC | Apple will never use AMD because Intel is bribing them too well I'm sure | Dec 28 19:29 |
| Ender2070 | and core 2 quad, beats amd too | Dec 28 19:29 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Nope, the Quad is not all that great | Dec 28 19:29 |
| Ender2070 | it beat the phenom clock per clock | Dec 28 19:29 |
| DaemonFC | it fails to outperform similarly clocked Phenom IIs | Dec 28 19:30 |
| DaemonFC | you need an i7 to do much better than a fast Phenom II | Dec 28 19:30 |
| Ender2070 | phenom 2's compete with i7's | Dec 28 19:30 |
| DaemonFC | that's obscenely expensive for no better than the i7 performs | Dec 28 19:30 |
| Ender2070 | phenom 1's compete with core 2 quads | Dec 28 19:30 |
| DaemonFC | Phenom II is more of a match for a Core i5 | Dec 28 19:30 |
| Ender2070 | dude | Dec 28 19:30 |
| Ender2070 | i worked at a computer store where people had the money to spend on insane intel gaming rigs | Dec 28 19:31 |
| Ender2070 | I benchmarked them and they were always faster than their equivalent amd counterparts | Dec 28 19:31 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, I'm not going to triple the price to eek out 20% better CPU performance | Dec 28 19:31 |
| Ender2070 | people are willing to spend the money | Dec 28 19:32 |
| DaemonFC | Intel's lead is too narrow to justify their extra cost | Dec 28 19:32 |
| DaemonFC | to me anyway | Dec 28 19:32 |
| Ender2070 | why do people buy BMW's when everyone has to drive the same speed | Dec 28 19:32 |
| DaemonFC | cause they're assholes with too much money and nothing better to spend it on I suppose | Dec 28 19:32 |
| Ender2070 | exactly | Dec 28 19:33 |
| Ender2070 | but these same people buy quad sli systems | Dec 28 19:33 |
| DaemonFC | the CPU is not really as important as it used to be | Dec 28 19:33 |
| Ender2070 | they want highest end possible | Dec 28 19:33 |
| DaemonFC | if you have to choose, get a better GPU and more/faster RAM | Dec 28 19:33 |
| Ender2070 | I'll give you this | Dec 28 19:34 |
| Ender2070 | AMD is a better value for price/performance, but Intel is faster but more expensive | Dec 28 19:34 |
| Ender2070 | I can agree with that | Dec 28 19:34 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but if all I want is something that performs very well, without breaking $200, I'm not going to buy Intel | Dec 28 19:34 |
| DaemonFC | right? | Dec 28 19:34 |
| Ender2070 | I agree with you | Dec 28 19:35 |
| *ThistleWeb has quit ("Lost terminal") | Dec 28 19:35 | |
| Ender2070 | im just saying intel is faster, Im not about to spend 1K on a cpu | Dec 28 19:35 |
| DaemonFC | same point I was trying to make | Dec 28 19:35 |
| DaemonFC | I'd rather just get 80% of the performance for 33% of the price | Dec 28 19:35 |
| Ender2070 | I only have an i7 920 because i got it for under $200 | Dec 28 19:36 |
| DaemonFC | that's what you get going with Phenom II over Core i7 | Dec 28 19:36 |
| Ender2070 | w/ vista and win7 licenses | Dec 28 19:36 |
| Ender2070 | from intel directly | Dec 28 19:36 |
| Ender2070 | a retail edge program | Dec 28 19:36 |
| DaemonFC | kickbacks | Dec 28 19:36 |
| DaemonFC | you know I love 'em :) | Dec 28 19:36 |
| DaemonFC | if you jerk off Microsoft, we'll give you our processor real cheap | Dec 28 19:37 |
| DaemonFC | is what that was | Dec 28 19:37 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 19:37 |
| Ender2070 | i couldnt get it without windows | Dec 28 19:37 |
| DaemonFC | figures | Dec 28 19:37 |
| Ender2070 | but man, vista and win7 are worth more than $200 | Dec 28 19:37 |
| DaemonFC | they both win | Dec 28 19:37 |
| DaemonFC | less business for AMD, less notice of other operating systems | Dec 28 19:38 |
| DaemonFC | and they both still make a profit | Dec 28 19:38 |
| Ender2070 | I either get a free cpu, or a free vista and win7 license | Dec 28 19:38 |
| Ender2070 | either way u look at it | Dec 28 19:38 |
| Ender2070 | i paid $180 Candian or something | Dec 28 19:38 |
| DaemonFC | I'd take the CPU and buy Windows | Dec 28 19:38 |
| DaemonFC | did it have to be Ultimate or anything? | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | well, it was "buy this cpu cheap-cheap, and get vista ultimate" | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | and then they said it was eligible for win7 upgrade coupon | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | but | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | they sent me a fully licensed new oem copy | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | not an upgrade | Dec 28 19:39 |
| DaemonFC | giving you Vista is like saying "Buy our processor and give your computer AIDS and another 400 pounds to carry around" | Dec 28 19:39 |
| Ender2070 | i sold vista for like $100 | Dec 28 19:40 |
| Ender2070 | so in essence i got the cpu + win7 for $80 | Dec 28 19:40 |
| fewa_ | sell vista 7 too | Dec 28 19:40 |
| DaemonFC | hmm, I'd sell Windows 7 and basically get $20 and a free processor | Dec 28 19:40 |
| Ender2070 | i might sell vista 7 but I want more than $100 | Dec 28 19:41 |
| Ender2070 | its ultimate | Dec 28 19:41 |
| fewa_ | you mean not as crippled? | Dec 28 19:41 |
| Ender2070 | yeah | Dec 28 19:41 |
| DaemonFC | you mean the same as all of them with the feature crippling turned all the way off? | Dec 28 19:41 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 19:41 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 19:41 |
| Ender2070 | win7 and vista use the exact same disk for all versions | Dec 28 19:42 |
| Ender2070 | the license tells it what to unlock | Dec 28 19:42 |
| DaemonFC | Vista doesn't install all the features it's not letting you use though | Dec 28 19:42 |
| DaemonFC | 7 does | Dec 28 19:42 |
| Ender2070 | its funny too | Dec 28 19:42 |
| DaemonFC | so they're there and the only difference is which license code you have | Dec 28 19:42 |
| Ender2070 | you know all those Phenom X3's ? | Dec 28 19:42 |
| fewa_ | you can turn them into X4s | Dec 28 19:42 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, 1 bad core, so they disabled it | Dec 28 19:43 |
| Ender2070 | AMD told me, they are defective quad cores with a core disabled | Dec 28 19:43 |
| DaemonFC | you can turn some of them into an X4 | Dec 28 19:43 |
| Ender2070 | sometimes they arent and can be turned | Dec 28 19:43 |
| DaemonFC | the ones they disabled a core on just to make more X3's | Dec 28 19:43 |
| Ender2070 | yeah lol | Dec 28 19:43 |
| Ender2070 | intel has core 2 duo's which are defective quad cores | Dec 28 19:43 |
| Ender2070 | some of them | Dec 28 19:43 |
| DaemonFC | just like you can overclock the Intel CPUs that were underclocked to make more cheapies | Dec 28 19:43 |
| fewa_ | uggh | Dec 28 19:43 |
| DaemonFC | been like that for years | Dec 28 19:44 |
| fewa_ | horrrible power consumptoipon i bet | Dec 28 19:44 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 19:44 |
| Ender2070 | lets see | Dec 28 19:44 |
| Ender2070 | the Q6600 series | Dec 28 19:44 |
| Ender2070 | the cpus in that range were all the same | Dec 28 19:44 |
| Ender2070 | they speed binned and sold at whatever speeds they could hit | Dec 28 19:44 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: I got an old Celeron up quite a lot higher than it was sold as | Dec 28 19:44 |
| Ender2070 | eventually they got them hitting any speeds | Dec 28 19:44 |
| DaemonFC | sold as 800 Mhz, I got it to 1.2 Ghz without any problems | Dec 28 19:44 |
| fewa_ | power efficiency is more important | Dec 28 19:45 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: Should I toss my XFAIL 360 on Craigslist or eBay? | Dec 28 19:46 |
| DaemonFC | I'll keep the wired controller though, that works with my PC games | Dec 28 19:47 |
| DaemonFC | it's the most useful part of the whole f-----g console | Dec 28 19:47 |
| fewa_ | usb? | Dec 28 19:48 |
| DaemonFC | yes | Dec 28 19:49 |
| fewa_ | nice | Dec 28 19:49 |
| fewa_ | works with linux? | Dec 28 19:49 |
| Ender2070 | intel has good power efficiency | Dec 28 19:49 |
| DaemonFC | sort of | Dec 28 19:49 |
| fewa_ | hmm, what about ps2 controlers? | Dec 28 19:49 |
| Ender2070 | i wouldnt touch an amd laptop | Dec 28 19:49 |
| Ender2070 | lol | Dec 28 19:49 |
| fewa_ | they are cheaper and less bulky | Dec 28 19:49 |
| DaemonFC | fewa_: There's a kernel module for the xbox 360 controller | Dec 28 19:49 |
| DaemonFC | the triggers don't work though | Dec 28 19:49 |
| fewa_ | http://www.open-pandora.org/ | Dec 28 19:50 |
| *Tallken has quit ("Leaving") | Dec 28 19:55 | |
| DaemonFC | 3 flashing red lights of happiness | Dec 28 19:55 |
| DaemonFC | E71 - Go Hug a Kitten | Dec 28 19:55 |
| DaemonFC | E74 - Your mommy dresses you funny | Dec 28 19:56 |
| schestowitz | http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/28/world/middleeast/28yemen.html?_r=1&ref=global-home Obama4peace? Doesn't look promising... like a 3rd war front "By ERIC SCHMITT" | Dec 28 20:08 |
| Ender2070 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdX9xM5Et8o | Dec 28 20:08 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The New York Times > Log In .::. Size~: 9.78 KB | Dec 28 20:08 |
| schestowitz | http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/351907/shuttleworth-linux-developers-should-shut-the-f-k-up made the list... http://www.pcpro.co.uk/features/354355/the-funniest-it-quotes-of-2009 | Dec 28 20:09 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Shuttleworth: Linux developers should "shut the f**k up" | News | PC Pro .::. Size~: 39.11 KB | Dec 28 20:09 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: The funniest IT quotes of 2009 | Analysis | Features | PC Pro .::. Size~: 42.02 KB | Dec 28 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Mark will not tell debian devs to hurry up anymore | Dec 28 20:10 |
| schestowitz | !google shuttleworth release schedule debian | Dec 28 20:10 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Shuttleworth Offers Canonical Employees to Debian | http://www.osnews.com/story/21970/Shuttleworth_Offers_Canonical_Employees_to_Debian | Dec 28 20:10 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Shuttleworth wants Debian/Ubuntu co-operation - Computerworld Blogs | http://blogs.computerworld.com/14499/shuttleworth_wants_debian_ubuntu_co_operation | Dec 28 20:10 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Mark Shuttleworth » Blog Archive » Conflicting goals create ... | http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/56 | Dec 28 20:10 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Slashdot Technology Story | Shuttleworth's Take On GNOME 3.0 ... | http://tech.slashdot.org/story/09/07/13/0820238/Shuttleworths-Take-On-GNOME-30-Coordination-with-Debian | Dec 28 20:10 |
| schestowitz | > Re: OpenSuSE v Ubuntu .. | Dec 28 20:10 |
| schestowitz | > While I was a OpenSuSE user, or at least while I could still login to | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > the site, I noticed two things. While there was for more users on the | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > Ubuntu support forum the replies were of low technical quality. The | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > ones on OpenSuSE while less in number were of far superior quality. | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > Makes me wonder why Novell didn't push OpenSuSE at the time and make | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > it as successful as Canonical did. Well we all know the answer to | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > that, they were too busy promoting XP on the desktop ... | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > You posted a link to an article about what eventually happens to | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > companies who 'partner' with MS, this is a classic case .. can't find | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | > the article. MAybe you should make that a new catagory ... | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | Especially for him: | Dec 28 20:11 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Companies_That_Lost_GNU/Linux_Focus_After_Microsoft_Deals | Dec 28 20:11 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Companies That Lost GNU/Linux Focus After Microsoft Deals - Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 18.71 KB | Dec 28 20:11 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: You figure it's safe to buy from a merchant on Amazon? | Dec 28 20:12 |
| DaemonFC | What does Amazon do if you get cheated? | Dec 28 20:12 |
| Ender2070 | not sure | Dec 28 20:13 |
| DaemonFC | I can save a few bucks on a new Wii i fI buy it from one of their merchants | Dec 28 20:13 |
| DaemonFC | Ender2070: The Internet Channel is free now right? | Dec 28 20:24 |
| DaemonFC | can you watch Flash videos within it? | Dec 28 20:25 |
| cubezzz | Flash is the scourge of the internet | Dec 28 20:27 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] No internet sex please, we're Indian. Web firms observe new law | Technology | The Guardian http://tinyurl.com/yc68oym | Dec 28 20:27 | |
| cubezzz | maximum cpu use with minium results | Dec 28 20:28 |
| schestowitz | Push-polling: http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/opensource/?p=1155 | Dec 28 20:28 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: TechRepublic Blogs: For IT professionals, by IT professionals .::. Size~: 76.85 KB | Dec 28 20:28 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: Flash is that thing that assumes you can't just play lousy AVIs and MPGs | Dec 28 20:29 |
| schestowitz | I remember reading about cross-platform Web-based media player from Google | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Around 2004 | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | I was stunned by the idea | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Then In saw in dvorak.org some embedded YouTube | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | The idea od mashups became very appealing | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Until then Linux and multimedia was not an easy thing on the Web | Dec 28 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Embedded reaplayer and wmp | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Inside Web pages! | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Like NBS | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | And also, I neede to store my videos on my own server | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | YouTube and other services changed all this and Flash turned from useless junk to necessary nuisance | Dec 28 20:31 |
| cubezzz | I want the file, not the flash version | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | No Flash, no video | Dec 28 20:31 |
| schestowitz | [not strictly of course] | Dec 28 20:32 |
| schestowitz | I used to think the videos were truly embedded, not encapsulated, in the WWF | Dec 28 20:32 |
| schestowitz | *SWF | Dec 28 20:32 |
| cubezzz | it needs more cpu for the same thing though | Dec 28 20:32 |
| cubezzz | which is stupid | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | .fla->.swv | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | It's just some Flash proprietary info for video controllers | Dec 28 20:33 |
| cubezzz | and wasteful | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | The rest is enclosure of a video file | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: and less portable | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | It's a feature to "content providers" | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | That you can't save what you see | Dec 28 20:33 |
| cubezzz | youtube is fine so far, I can get the file, that is what I do every time now | Dec 28 20:33 |
| schestowitz | http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/happy-birthday-linus#100 | Dec 28 20:33 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Happy Birthday, Linus | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 54.84 KB | Dec 28 20:33 |
| cubezzz | hmmm, 386DX had no co-processor | Dec 28 20:36 |
| DaemonFC | flv is usually MPEG-4 AAC for audioand H.264 for video | Dec 28 20:37 |
| DaemonFC | it's just a container | Dec 28 20:37 |
| cubezzz | video permformance on older hardware is slower in the browser, full stop | Dec 28 20:38 |
| cubezzz | very noticeable | Dec 28 20:38 |
| cubezzz | it could work fine in mplayer and lousy in the browser | Dec 28 20:39 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Why does the Against Monopoly site publish #IntellectualMonopoly advocacy/defence? http://ur1.ca/inc8 | Dec 28 20:41 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Against Monopoly .::. Size~: 25.53 KB | Dec 28 20:42 |
| cubezzz | boy did Freedman look bad in court | Dec 28 20:42 |
| cubezzz | there was _no_ way he was going to come out of that looking good | Dec 28 20:43 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: http://rawstory.com/2009/12/protesters-stop-iran-hanging/ | Dec 28 20:43 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Video of protesters stopping Iran hanging hits Internet | Raw Story .::. Size~: 23.51 KB | Dec 28 20:43 |
| cubezzz | so many court cases | Dec 28 20:44 |
| cubezzz | "What did you mean by smear sheet?" | Dec 28 20:45 |
| cubezzz | answer: I didn't call them smear sheets | Dec 28 20:46 |
| cubezzz | "What about this emal that says you used smear sheets?" | Dec 28 20:46 |
| cubezzz | answer: ummmmm | Dec 28 20:46 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: What usually happens at this point? The regime grows more desperate to maintain control and starts butchering its own citizens to try and scare the rest into line. | Dec 28 20:48 |
| cubezzz | and now he's on the internet forever :) | Dec 28 20:48 |
| DaemonFC | I really wish them luck in overthrowing their government though, it needs to go | Dec 28 20:49 |
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| cubezzz | could be DaemonFC | Dec 28 20:51 |
| cubezzz | when an iron fist doesn't work some people use a bigger iron fist | Dec 28 20:51 |
| DaemonFC | well, it's said that a government can't rule without consent of the governed | Dec 28 20:52 |
| DaemonFC | governments have all come up with tricks to distract and confuse though | Dec 28 20:52 |
| cubezzz | what kind of government does Iran have anyway? | Dec 28 20:53 |
| DaemonFC | well, basically a Muslim theocracy | Dec 28 20:53 |
| DaemonFC | there's technically some constitutionally guaranteed seats for Christians in their parliamentary system, but not enough to realyl have any meaningful voice in the government | Dec 28 20:54 |
| DaemonFC | everyone else gets nothing | Dec 28 20:54 |
| DaemonFC | you can't be president unless you have the ayatollah's blessing | Dec 28 20:54 |
| DaemonFC | then they rig the elections anyway | Dec 28 20:55 |
| DaemonFC | the Iranian office of President really has no power because he can be overruled | Dec 28 20:55 |
| cubezzz | stuff like this makes me want to study history | Dec 28 20:56 |
| DaemonFC | I think the constitution recognizes their president as the head of government, but not the head of state | Dec 28 20:56 |
| DaemonFC | the head of state is the ayatollah | Dec 28 20:56 |
| cubezzz | like a King basically | Dec 28 20:56 |
| DaemonFC | more or less | Dec 28 20:56 |
| DaemonFC | so he's more like a figurehead and manages the day to day stuff, but the ayatollah can step in on any matter and overrule him immediately | Dec 28 20:57 |
| cubezzz | according to wikipedia: theocratic republic | Dec 28 20:58 |
| DaemonFC | the republic part is a sham | Dec 28 20:58 |
| DaemonFC | there's no power in any elected office | Dec 28 20:58 |
| DaemonFC | the ayatollah's word is law | Dec 28 20:58 |
| DaemonFC | he's basically a dictator that lets the stuff he doesn't care about get handled by the elected officials | Dec 28 20:59 |
| DaemonFC | kind of like George W Bush saw himself | Dec 28 20:59 |
| DaemonFC | only much moreso | Dec 28 20:59 |
| DaemonFC | Bush was not elected, he used proclamations and executive orders as laws......hmmm | Dec 28 21:00 |
| DaemonFC | spent his whole presidency trying to contrive some kind of legal framework out of them | Dec 28 21:01 |
| DaemonFC | The most defective part of the US federal government is that the President is Commander-in-Chief of the military and can therefore start wars before requesting that Congress declare war and issue funding | Dec 28 21:02 |
| DaemonFC | by the time Congress declared war on Iraq, Bush had already started bombing them and there were firefights on the ground and everything | Dec 28 21:03 |
| DaemonFC | it was days before Congress made it official | Dec 28 21:03 |
| *ThistleWeb (n=gordon@unaffiliated/thistleweb) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 21:04 | |
| DaemonFC | cubezzz: I'd like to see someone audit that Iranian Linux distribution, Parsix | Dec 28 21:04 |
| DaemonFC | find out if there's any spyware or anything built into it | Dec 28 21:04 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Now running Chromium build 4.0.284.0 - new build! Time to put it through its paces #chromium #google #foss #free | Dec 28 21:04 | |
| DaemonFC | it doesn't exactly go to great lengths to advertise that it's from Iran | Dec 28 21:05 |
| DaemonFC | they say "a gift from ancient Persia" | Dec 28 21:05 |
| *sebsebseb (n=3seb@unaffiliated/sebsebseb) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 21:06 | |
| sebsebseb | hi | Dec 28 21:06 |
| DaemonFC | apparently their government is backing it as a replacement for all the unlicensed copies of Windows floating around | Dec 28 21:06 |
| DaemonFC | including on government computers | Dec 28 21:06 |
| sebsebseb | what's this I just joined | Dec 28 21:06 |
| DaemonFC | Iran is extremely dependent right now on cracked copies of Windows on almost all its government and civilian PCs | Dec 28 21:07 |
| DaemonFC | they couldn't buy it even if they had the money and wanted to because US law wouldn't let Microsoft sell it to them | Dec 28 21:07 |
| sebsebseb | DaemonFC: what's all this? I just joined | Dec 28 21:07 |
| cubezzz | well, that's good if they stop using doze | Dec 28 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | discussion of Iran | Dec 28 21:08 |
| sebsebseb | Iran can't buy legal copies of Windows ? | Dec 28 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | cubezzz: Makes me think of Red Flag Linux though, the Linux sponsored by the PRC Chinese government | Dec 28 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | that logs you in as root and looks like XP | Dec 28 21:08 |
| DaemonFC | sebsebseb: No, they can't | Dec 28 21:09 |
| DaemonFC | Microsoft could give them a billion free copies though | Dec 28 21:09 |
| sebsebseb | DaemonFC: They can't buy legal copies why? | Dec 28 21:09 |
| DaemonFC | US law doesn't say you can't give them something, it says you can't export things to them for money | Dec 28 21:09 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] @_Goblin 283's been good so far, compiz bug hasn't manifested | Dec 28 21:09 | |
| sebsebseb | DaemonFC: why not? | Dec 28 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | they're embargoed | Dec 28 21:10 |
| sebsebseb | what does that mean? | Dec 28 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | have been since the Islamic Revolution in 1979 | Dec 28 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | means you can't trade with them | Dec 28 21:10 |
| sebsebseb | Iran, but other counteries as well? such as? | Dec 28 21:10 |
| DaemonFC | North Korea | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | Cuba | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | Syria I think | Dec 28 21:11 |
| sebsebseb | well I didn't know this | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | maybe a few others | Dec 28 21:11 |
| sebsebseb | I thought it was just basically starter edition for developing world and that | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | Cuba is different though | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | it's illegal for a US citizen to travel to Cuba for any reason | Dec 28 21:11 |
| DaemonFC | you can travel to Iran though | Dec 28 21:11 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Simple Minds "Celebration" LP: "wow, I have a Roxy Music album, it's 'fab' 'gear'!" | Dec 28 21:11 | |
| sebsebseb | DaemonFC: US citizens can't travel to Cuba? even though Cuba is quite near really? | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | one way to get to Cuba if you're an American is to go to Canada and hop a flight from there | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | but don't let the US government find out you went | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | nope | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | it's a crime | Dec 28 21:12 |
| sebsebseb | why? | Dec 28 21:12 |
| DaemonFC | Kennedy embargoed them in the early 1960s | Dec 28 21:12 |
| sebsebseb | what does embargoed mean? | Dec 28 21:13 |
| DaemonFC | and set up a naval blockade to stop Soviet ships from carrying nuclear missiles there | Dec 28 21:13 |
| DaemonFC | well, more than they already had | Dec 28 21:13 |
| DaemonFC | we called it a "quarantine" because the blockade would have violated international law | Dec 28 21:13 |
| cubezzz | I think Cuba born Americans are allowed to go to Cuba | Dec 28 21:13 |
| DaemonFC | yeah | Dec 28 21:13 |
| DaemonFC | they can't spend more than $300 a day there | Dec 28 21:14 |
| sebsebseb | uh | Dec 28 21:14 |
| sebsebseb | a rule/law for how much money they can spend their as well | Dec 28 21:14 |
| DaemonFC | personally, I'd vacation in Cuba | Dec 28 21:14 |
| sebsebseb | I suppouse they can spend as much as they want, as long as they don't go back to the US? | Dec 28 21:14 |
| DaemonFC | where I wouldn't go is PRC-occupied China | Dec 28 21:14 |
| sebsebseb | there's a guy going to be put to death in China soon | Dec 28 21:15 |
| DaemonFC | I'd go to Taiwan instead | Dec 28 21:15 |
| sebsebseb | unless that's changed already, found out about that last night | Dec 28 21:15 |
| DaemonFC | the ROC is the legitimate government of China, in exile pretty much | Dec 28 21:15 |
| sebsebseb | on the BBC News | Dec 28 21:15 |
| DaemonFC | we sold them out finally in the 70s | Dec 28 21:15 |
| DaemonFC | in exchange for cheap PRC-made imports, we promised not to recognize Taiwan as its own country | Dec 28 21:16 |
| DaemonFC | we still sell them munitions though :) | Dec 28 21:16 |
| DaemonFC | their military's stated goal is to hold back a PRC invasion until help can arrive from the United States | Dec 28 21:17 |
| DaemonFC | I wonder if we'd actually really help them or let the PRC slaughter and conquer them | Dec 28 21:17 |
| DaemonFC | basically everything you buy that says Made In China, is one more PRC missile pointed at Taiwan | Dec 28 21:18 |
| DaemonFC | or more troops ready to invade them | Dec 28 21:18 |
| sebsebseb | DaemonFC: not sure what your on about at the moment | Dec 28 21:18 |
| DaemonFC | meh, horrible regimes | Dec 28 21:19 |
| DaemonFC | the ones that should be embargoed if we really cared about human rights violations | Dec 28 21:19 |
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| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @davidgerard Your'e behind! its 284 now! ;) That bug I believe was fixed around Xmas day...what it did on mine http://www.twitpic.com/uq3o9 | Dec 28 21:29 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Chromium bug 31038 - window resizes on its own. on Twitpic .::. Size~: 7.93 KB | Dec 28 21:30 |
| *_goblin has quit ("Ex-Chat") | Dec 28 22:02 | |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: yes, fragile regimes do that | Dec 28 22:08 |
| schestowitz | Like when Stalin murdered his opponents | Dec 28 22:08 |
| schestowitz | They would all clap for his endlessly in parliament for fear of being to stop, so they have to ring bells | Dec 28 22:08 |
| schestowitz | But that empire too eventually collapsed.. a tyranny | Dec 28 22:08 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, too many cultural differences within the Soviet republics themselves too | Dec 28 22:09 |
| DaemonFC | they really had nothing in common besides a central government | Dec 28 22:09 |
| DaemonFC | there was no cohesion | Dec 28 22:10 |
| DaemonFC | like a bad marriage that goes on for years really :P | Dec 28 22:10 |
| schestowitz | That's why multi-party states are needed | Dec 28 22:12 |
| schestowitz | Iran does not seemt o truly have that | Dec 28 22:12 |
| DaemonFC | there's a wide range of thoughts, opinions, ideas, attitudes among the people in any country, the brutal dictatorships all try to squash that | Dec 28 22:13 |
| DaemonFC | it ends up going underground instead | Dec 28 22:13 |
| DaemonFC | when you repress that many people, it may work for some time, but eventually they'll see that people in other countries have the freedom to do basic things, like move around without "papers" | Dec 28 22:14 |
| DaemonFC | that's when that government is in trouble | Dec 28 22:14 |
| DaemonFC | *moving | Dec 28 22:14 |
| DaemonFC | people start wondering why they give so much to a system that treats them so poorly | Dec 28 22:15 |
| schestowitz | I can't seem to get server load below 5 | Dec 28 22:15 |
| DaemonFC | morale and productivity go down | Dec 28 22:15 |
| DaemonFC | riots | Dec 28 22:15 |
| schestowitz | Isn't it holiday for most people, still? | Dec 28 22:15 |
| schestowitz | I think the search engine bots are just pounding | Dec 28 22:15 |
| DaemonFC | some people, schestowitz | Dec 28 22:16 |
| schestowitz | They block people from reading pages | Dec 28 22:16 |
| DaemonFC | some places shut down between Christmas and New Years | Dec 28 22:16 |
| DaemonFC | my dad used to be off work for like 3 weeks every August cause of a plant-wide shutdown | Dec 28 22:17 |
| DaemonFC | he was salary though, so he still got paid | Dec 28 22:17 |
| DaemonFC | that's when we usually went on vacation | Dec 28 22:17 |
| *_goblin (n=goblin@94-193-188-104.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 22:18 | |
| schestowitz | YAhoo! shut down | Dec 28 22:20 |
| schestowitz | Except server operation | Dec 28 22:20 |
| schestowitz | But it's unpaid and they tried to lower expenses, say some sources | Dec 28 22:20 |
| tessier | huh? | Dec 28 22:20 |
| schestowitz | !google yahoo shut down christmas :-) | Dec 28 22:21 |
| phIRCe-local | [1] - Telangana issue: TRS calls off 48-hour shutdown due to Christmas ... | http://in.news.yahoo.com/139/20091224/816/tnl-telangana-issue-trs-calls-off-48-hou.html | Dec 28 22:21 |
| phIRCe-local | [2] - Happy Holidays from Shutdown Corner! - Shutdown Corner - NFL Blog ... | http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Happy-Holidays-from-Shutdown-Corner-%3Furn%3Dnfl,210807 | Dec 28 22:21 |
| phIRCe-local | [3] - Yahoo shutting down for the holidays | Relevant Results - CNET News | http://news.cnet.com/8301-30684_3-10420320-265.html | Dec 28 22:21 |
| phIRCe-local | [4] - Yahoo to shut down most operations for a week to cut costs ... | http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-yahoo23-2009dec23,0,5719862.story | Dec 28 22:21 |
| schestowitz | The first time I saw it ([3,4]) I thought they were taking the site offline or something | Dec 28 22:22 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] lol, thanks to LinuxPower a command you cannot live without..... apt-get moo .... have you mooed today? #linux #foss #bash #cli | Dec 28 22:22 | |
| schestowitz | tessier: did you see the load issues on the server BN sits on? | Dec 28 22:23 |
| schestowitz | I think it's caused by robots | Dec 28 22:23 |
| schestowitz | top - 14:16:16 up 118 days, 4:36, 2 users, load average: 17.51, 14.53, 9.45 | Dec 28 22:23 |
| tessier | No, had not noticed. | Dec 28 22:23 |
| schestowitz | We had that happen before, I don't know what causes the surge and I did look at some stats | Dec 28 22:23 |
| schestowitz | All I could find was some bots pounding, mostly Yahoo! and MSN I think | Dec 28 22:24 |
| schestowitz | I don't have good analysis tools to see what goes on on a statistical basis | Dec 28 22:24 |
| *Balrog has quit () | Dec 28 22:25 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] I hope they remake Chocky...a great Wyndham series...brings back memories of my youth! #dayofthetriffids | Dec 28 22:27 | |
| schestowitz | tessier: is there an option to exclude bots with a script temporarily? | Dec 28 22:28 |
| DaemonFC | suddenly feeling sick, I about puked and then didn't have to when I got to the toilet | Dec 28 22:30 |
| DaemonFC | hope I'm not coming down with something | Dec 28 22:30 |
| tessier | schestowitz: robots.txt is the best way | Dec 28 22:34 |
| schestowitz | If the bots recheck it often enough, I guess. They seem to come in bursts, leading to spikes | Dec 28 22:35 |
| schestowitz | I'm not even sure it's bots | Dec 28 22:35 |
| schestowitz | I just looked at tails of the logs and assumed it would be something not legitimate that's clogging it up, but I don't know.. | Dec 28 22:36 |
| *_goblin_ (n=goblin@94-193-188-104.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 22:38 | |
| schestowitz | It seems like a lot of bots | Dec 28 22:39 |
| schestowitz | Yahoo, Yandex, MSN..... | Dec 28 22:39 |
| schestowitz | Clogging up the thing | Dec 28 22:39 |
| tessier | How many actual pages are there really? | Dec 28 22:40 |
| tessier | Bots crawling can blow out your cache | Dec 28 22:40 |
| tessier | You want to be googleable but you don't want them constantly hammering. | Dec 28 22:40 |
| schestowitz | About 9000 pages | Dec 28 22:40 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] NewsTechnica: iPhone apps to singlehandedly revive British economy http://newstechnica.com/?p=983 | Dec 28 22:40 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: iPhone apps to singlehandedly revive British economy | NewsTechnica .::. Size~: 38.6 KB | Dec 28 22:41 |
| tessier | 9000 pages and each page is fairly cpu intensive to generate. I wish I knew more about php/wordpress as I am pretty sure our caching is still not very effective. | Dec 28 22:41 |
| schestowitz | IIRC they can be told to slow down | Dec 28 22:41 |
| schestowitz | Not just in sitemap xml | Dec 28 22:41 |
| schestowitz | Some time ago it caused issues when people log in | Dec 28 22:42 |
| schestowitz | Basically, queries that should not be cached got cached | Dec 28 22:42 |
| schestowitz | What's mysterious is that what happens today does not normally happen and I still don't know what causes it, either | Dec 28 22:43 |
| schestowitz | tessier: Thanks | Dec 28 22:44 |
| schestowitz | Sorry for the trouble | Dec 28 22:45 |
| tessier | No problem | Dec 28 22:45 |
| schestowitz | It's calming down again. It happened just twice or 3 times that I noticed earlier | Dec 28 22:46 |
| MinceR | possibly there are OVER 9000 pages ;) | Dec 28 22:48 |
| schestowitz | Yes, dupe URLs | Dec 28 22:48 |
| schestowitz | WordPress makes comments pages like that | Dec 28 22:49 |
| DaemonFC | hmmmmm | Dec 28 22:49 |
| schestowitz | It's over 10k including all the peripheral pages, mostly static | Dec 28 22:49 |
| DaemonFC | I about stuck a refurbished Wii in my cart until the other customers reviewed them and almost everyone was missing something, one guy said the remote was beaten up, and someone else said the Wii Sports disc in it was scratched up | Dec 28 22:50 |
| DaemonFC | who the hell is doing those refurbishings? | Dec 28 22:50 |
| DaemonFC | didn't "refurbished" used to mean factory restored and like new? | Dec 28 22:50 |
| DaemonFC | I wonder if Nintendo has Genghis Khan and an army of Mongols on the refurbishing line | Dec 28 22:51 |
| DaemonFC | Damn Mongolians! Always tearing down my shitty wall! | Dec 28 22:54 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 22:54 |
| MinceR | :) | Dec 28 22:54 |
| *_goblin has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) | Dec 28 22:54 | |
| MinceR | "Mongorians" | Dec 28 22:54 |
| DaemonFC | ahhh | Dec 28 22:54 |
| DaemonFC | to make it even worse, you only save like $20 to get it refurbished (Someone's broken console that had the shit beaten out of it) and they charge you $10.82 for shipping, whereas the new unit gets free shipping | Dec 28 22:57 |
| DaemonFC | so you don't even save a whole $10 to gamble and probably get a bad console | Dec 28 22:58 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Psystar to Focus on #GNU #Linux for Desktops http://ur1.ca/ini0 also in China http://ur1.ca/ini1 | Dec 28 23:04 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Psystar halts sales of Mac cloning tool, will peddle Linux PCs .::. Size~: 139.16 KB | Dec 28 23:05 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #IBM 's Irving Wladawsky-Berger (Emeritus) Explains the Company's #GNU #Linux Reasoning http://ur1.ca/ini3 | Dec 28 23:05 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Irving Wladawsky-Berger: The Evolution of Collaborative Innovation .::. Size~: 40.63 KB | Dec 28 23:06 |
| *gargoyle-grin (n=randerso@gentoo/contributor/gargoyle-grin) has left #boycottnovell | Dec 28 23:07 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Heaps of #GNU #Linux Games Suggestions Published http://ur1.ca/ini7 http://ur1.ca/ini8 http://ur1.ca/ini9 http://ur1.ca/inia | Dec 28 23:09 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Mixed feelings so far in respect of Day of the Triffids..Quite good so far...changed a little from the original though.... | Dec 28 23:09 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Syntensity | FOS Games .::. Size~: 27.79 KB | Dec 28 23:10 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: AssaultCube - An awesome FPS game for Linux. | GHABUNTU .::. Size~: 101.68 KB | Dec 28 23:10 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: TuxArena: 3 Wonderful Open-Source Games to Install After Installing Ubuntu .::. Size~: 108.74 KB | Dec 28 23:10 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #ATI Closes Another #Linux Year, Linus Turns 40 http://ur1.ca/inie http://ur1.ca/inig | Dec 28 23:11 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: [Phoronix] ATI Linux 2009 Year In Review .::. Size~: 21.57 KB | Dec 28 23:12 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Happy Birthday, Linus | Linux Journal .::. Size~: 59.5 KB | Dec 28 23:12 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Command Line-based Applications Secure a Place in #Linux http://ur1.ca/inim http://ur1.ca/inin | Dec 28 23:12 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: No, terminal apps are not dying « Motho ke motho ka botho .::. Size~: 58.64 KB | Dec 28 23:13 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] New Themes and Artwork for #Docky and #KDE http://ur1.ca/inip http://ur1.ca/iniq http://ur1.ca/inir http://ur1.ca/inis | Dec 28 23:14 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: OMG! UBUNTU!: 2 Gorgeous New Docky Skins .::. Size~: 85.42 KB | Dec 28 23:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: 12 Awesome KDM Themes For Your Linux | Online Blogger .::. Size~: 33.39 KB | Dec 28 23:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: How to customize your KDE desktop with KDE-Look.org Make Tech Easier .::. Size~: 45.51 KB | Dec 28 23:15 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: digiKam 1.1 Splash-screens: call to photographers ! | digiKam - Photo Management Program .::. Size~: 16.18 KB | Dec 28 23:15 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Mandriva Developer Speaks of the Diversity Derived from the Distribution http://ur1.ca/iniw | Dec 28 23:16 | |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #RedHat Gains in the Middle East and Sees Business Surging http://ur1.ca/iniy http://ur1.ca/iniz http://ur1.ca/inj1 | Dec 28 23:18 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Savvytek lands the first Red-Hat Linux virtualization implementation project at MEPS | Savvytek | AMEinfo.com .::. Size~: 35.53 KB | Dec 28 23:19 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Red Hat promotes virtualisation adoption in Middle East through partnership with WorldNet | Red Hat | AMEinfo.com .::. Size~: 35.38 KB | Dec 28 23:19 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: nbbusinessjournal.com - Linux software is rebounding: CEO | Dina Bass - Breaking News, New Brunswick, Canada .::. Size~: 31.16 KB | Dec 28 23:19 |
| cubezzz | I use a lot of command line stuff | Dec 28 23:23 |
| cubezzz | wget, curl, lynx, and tons of bash scripts | Dec 28 23:23 |
| schestowitz | Some people do | Dec 28 23:25 |
| DaemonFC | it's no wonder the XBOX sucked so bad | Dec 28 23:25 |
| schestowitz | Usually those who are very close to UNIX, I think | Dec 28 23:25 |
| schestowitz | The new users come from Windows | Dec 28 23:25 |
| DaemonFC | "The scariest thing was a bunch of fifty-five year old men, who have never played a game in their lives, decided they’re gonna do a game console and then start talking about the specifications. This is like a group of men designing tampons or something. It’s a very bad idea." -Seamus Blackley | Dec 28 23:25 |
| cubezzz | schestowitz, Unix is a text based system | Dec 28 23:26 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: Windows is a test system | Dec 28 23:26 |
| MinceR | that's nothing, those people also worked for m$ | Dec 28 23:27 |
| MinceR | and we know m$ guys can't design stuff that doesn't suck | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | UNIX still has the same fundamental problem it did in the 80s | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | What is it? | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | Who defines it? | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | Where do you get it from? | Dec 28 23:27 |
| MinceR | that it's better than anything else we've come up with? | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | Why aren't they all compatible? | Dec 28 23:27 |
| DaemonFC | if Microsoft dangled around Windows source code like AT&T did, you'd eventually have 20 incompatible operating systems all trying to call themselves Windows | Dec 28 23:28 |
| MinceR | we'd also have a wine that works better | Dec 28 23:28 |
| DaemonFC | and each one has features that are a little better than all the others | Dec 28 23:28 |
| MinceR | and so we would be forced to use that crap less | Dec 28 23:28 |
| cubezzz | I don't use doze | Dec 28 23:28 |
| cubezzz | it's that simple | Dec 28 23:29 |
| DaemonFC | dangling around operating system source code has proven dangerous | Dec 28 23:29 |
| cubezzz | I port to embedix from GNU | Dec 28 23:29 |
| MinceR | some users are held hostage by their apps | Dec 28 23:29 |
| MinceR | yes, dangerous to m$ | Dec 28 23:29 |
| cubezzz | or Linux or BSD | Dec 28 23:29 |
| DaemonFC | look how many stupid forks you get for all the dumbest reasons | Dec 28 23:29 |
| MinceR | you don't have to use all the forks | Dec 28 23:29 |
| cubezzz | do you understand that we can port everything from one *nix to another? | Dec 28 23:29 |
| DaemonFC | no, pick one and deal with its particular quirks and incompatibilities | Dec 28 23:29 |
| MinceR | and criticize them all you want, they still do more innovation every day than m$ has ever done in their whole existence | Dec 28 23:30 |
| DaemonFC | you don't have to use all of them | Dec 28 23:30 |
| MinceR | everyone can choose the set of quirks they prefer, instead of being forcefed one by ballmer or jobs | Dec 28 23:30 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR: Then I would argue "Why can I still not use gamepads, webcams, tv tuner cards, some video cards, most any USB wireless antennas....." | Dec 28 23:30 |
| cubezzz | that's rubbish | Dec 28 23:31 |
| cubezzz | I'm doing that already | Dec 28 23:31 |
| MinceR | so am i | Dec 28 23:31 |
| DaemonFC | it's like half the things you want to do are only half-implemented | Dec 28 23:31 |
| MinceR | DaemonFC: that sounds like winblows | Dec 28 23:31 |
| DaemonFC | or they seem to always write a driver for every model that I don't have | Dec 28 23:31 |
| DaemonFC | and skip mine | Dec 28 23:31 |
| MinceR | and there's of course the console that's less than half-implemented, as it RRoD-s more than half the time | Dec 28 23:31 |
| DaemonFC | yeah, but they still sell for a decent amount on ebay | Dec 28 23:32 |
| MinceR | DaemonFC: so basically your argument is "windows is great because hw manufacturers have chosen to write drivers for it"? | Dec 28 23:32 |
| MinceR | that's bullshit rubbish | Dec 28 23:32 |
| DaemonFC | I'm thinking about ditching the SOB while I can still get most of my money back | Dec 28 23:32 |
| cubezzz | I don't have a driver problem | Dec 28 23:32 |
| MinceR | especially if we bring into the picture the _quality_ of those winblows drivers | Dec 28 23:32 |
| DaemonFC | no, I said I use it because the drivers are there | Dec 28 23:32 |
| cubezzz | SOB? | Dec 28 23:32 |
| DaemonFC | cubezzz: Son Of a Bitch | Dec 28 23:32 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] very unlike me, but had 2 heated debates / borderline arguments on IRC tonight, makes me think I'm the problem tonight. Bad night I guess :/ | Dec 28 23:32 | |
| DaemonFC | I actually kind of liked the first XBOX in some ways | Dec 28 23:33 |
| DaemonFC | it had some good games, they subsidized the hell out of everything | Dec 28 23:33 |
| DaemonFC | you could mod it to run Linux easily | Dec 28 23:33 |
| DaemonFC | that all went away with the 360 | Dec 28 23:34 |
| DaemonFC | suddenly everything costs a fortune, games go up $10, you can't really mod it, and they overheat more than they work | Dec 28 23:34 |
| cubezzz | DaemonFC, a question | Dec 28 23:34 |
| cubezzz | which OS are you using? | Dec 28 23:34 |
| DaemonFC | right now, booted into Windows 7 | Dec 28 23:34 |
| MinceR | like a true m$ fanboy | Dec 28 23:35 |
| DaemonFC | I had Vista for about a month and then they sent my the Windows 7 disc in the mail | Dec 28 23:35 |
| cubezzz | everyone's free to use what they want | Dec 28 23:35 |
| DaemonFC | Vista was the reason I used Linux exclusively from 2006 to a few months ago | Dec 28 23:36 |
| cubezzz | new Unix is basically stuff like OpenSolaris | Dec 28 23:36 |
| cubezzz | I didn't really like it though :) | Dec 28 23:37 |
| MinceR | new unix is GNU/Linux and the ones that are trying to catch up with it | Dec 28 23:37 |
| cubezzz | to be honest | Dec 28 23:37 |
| DaemonFC | I just couldn't believe how bad it was til I loaded the Vista disc I tricked them into sending me onto my laptop | Dec 28 23:37 |
| cubezzz | yeah basically I am a GNU/Linux person | Dec 28 23:37 |
| DaemonFC | laptop runs XP fine and Vista was basically cement | Dec 28 23:37 |
| MinceR | Windows CEMENT? | Dec 28 23:37 |
| DaemonFC | I threw the Vista disc out | Dec 28 23:37 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR: Yes | Dec 28 23:37 |
| cubezzz | but I consider Linux to be Unix like, not Unix | Dec 28 23:38 |
| MinceR | cubezzz: that's only because "The Open Group" owns and mismanages the trademark | Dec 28 23:38 |
| cubezzz | I still mostly use GNU/Linux, it's what I prefer | Dec 28 23:38 |
| DaemonFC | it was so slow, and it was dogging the processor so much that it killed my battery in half the time, the fan was always running, the case was so hot you could fry an egg | Dec 28 23:38 |
| DaemonFC | it was just all wrong | Dec 28 23:38 |
| MinceR | they deserve to have it genericized and taken out of their control | Dec 28 23:38 |
| cubezzz | MincR, I ported some of my old Unix System V code to Linux without much trouble | Dec 28 23:39 |
| MinceR | they basically only let those who throw a bag of money at them to use the Unix name, but beyond that they have no requirements | Dec 28 23:39 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR: There's a test suite, no? | Dec 28 23:39 |
| MinceR | there's probably some sham test suite | Dec 28 23:39 |
| cubezzz | the big three are Solaris, HP-UX, and AIX | Dec 28 23:39 |
| MinceR | but it's clearly only about money-grubbing | Dec 28 23:40 |
| cubezzz | hence my testing of OpenSolaris | Dec 28 23:40 |
| DaemonFC | why would Apple pay to certify it if the certification means nothing? | Dec 28 23:40 |
| DaemonFC | or anyone else for that matter | Dec 28 23:40 |
| MinceR | if it wasn't, they'd test and certify FLOSS unixes at no cost | Dec 28 23:40 |
| MinceR | DaemonFC: because they're marketroids | Dec 28 23:40 |
| MinceR | and the dickwaving appeals to them | Dec 28 23:40 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: CEMENT7 | Dec 28 23:40 |
| DaemonFC | heh | Dec 28 23:40 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: Windows CE, ME, and NT | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | I know | Dec 28 23:41 |
| cubezzz | NT wasn't that bad | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | "Vista sucks" video | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | blip.tv | Dec 28 23:41 |
| MinceR | yes it was | Dec 28 23:41 |
| MinceR | they took the design of VMS and raped it | Dec 28 23:41 |
| DaemonFC | NT 4 was horrid | Dec 28 23:41 |
| DaemonFC | Windows 2000 was the closest they got to good | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | NT stands for New technology. NOT! | Dec 28 23:41 |
| DaemonFC | by being passable | Dec 28 23:41 |
| MinceR | and dressed it up like that OS/2 look-alike GUI on top of stolen CP/M-86 code | Dec 28 23:41 |
| cubezzz | ok, I just thought it was better than win95 :) | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | .NOT came later | Dec 28 23:41 |
| schestowitz | NONONONO! | Dec 28 23:42 |
| *ThistleWeb has quit ("Lost terminal") | Dec 28 23:42 | |
| *Tallken (n=f2f93bf5@93.102.51.42.rev.optimus.pt) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 28 23:42 | |
| MinceR | win95 at least let you set the 0th palette entry | Dec 28 23:42 |
| schestowitz | .MONO | Dec 28 23:42 |
| cubezzz | win95 was the OS I hated the most | Dec 28 23:42 |
| DaemonFC | cubezzz: I used Windows 95 OSR 2.1 for a long time | Dec 28 23:42 |
| schestowitz | They get the shiny icons and give Miguel a monkey | Dec 28 23:42 |
| MinceR | so the background flash in WinQuake actually didn't look like shit on win95 | Dec 28 23:42 |
| DaemonFC | I kept my OEM disc off an old Packard Bell | Dec 28 23:42 |
| schestowitz | What an insult | Dec 28 23:42 |
| MinceR | as opposed to NT | Dec 28 23:42 |
| cubezzz | yeah I think everyone was suckered into win95 | Dec 28 23:42 |
| schestowitz | They treat rivals like primates | Dec 28 23:42 |
| DaemonFC | formatted over Windows 98 with it | Dec 28 23:42 |
| DaemonFC | formatted over Windows Me with it | Dec 28 23:42 |
| MinceR | osr2 was a funny kind of malware | Dec 28 23:43 |
| DaemonFC | I was still using Windows 95 until like 2004 | Dec 28 23:43 |
| cubezzz | MinceR, when did you switch away from Microsoft? | Dec 28 23:43 |
| schestowitz | It's telling, like the 3 monkeys.... won't listen, watch, or speak | Dec 28 23:43 |
| schestowitz | Just carry on aping Ballmer | Dec 28 23:43 |
| MinceR | cubezzz: i don't remember exactly, but i switched from Win98SE to Red Hat 7 | Dec 28 23:43 |
| schestowitz | Same here\ | Dec 28 23:43 |
| DaemonFC | my favorite feature of Windows was always Exit to MS-DOS Mode | Dec 28 23:43 |
| DaemonFC | :) | Dec 28 23:43 |
| DaemonFC | there I ran my video games | Dec 28 23:43 |
| MinceR | i preferred booting to real m$-dos | Dec 28 23:43 |
| schestowitz | SE stands for Second Exorcism | Dec 28 23:44 |
| DaemonFC | MinceR: You could change Windows 9x to boot to DOS | Dec 28 23:44 |
| DaemonFC | and start Windows by typing "win" | Dec 28 23:44 |
| MinceR | i know | Dec 28 23:44 |
| schestowitz | Just win95, I think | Dec 28 23:44 |
| schestowitz | And prior versions | Dec 28 23:44 |
| schestowitz | Never tried with win98 | Dec 28 23:44 |
| cubezzz | I always thought Unix was better, it's funny how it didn't have more of the market | Dec 28 23:44 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft still used BIOS | Dec 28 23:45 |
| schestowitz | Linux leapt ahead | Dec 28 23:45 |
| schestowitz | cubezzz: it did in servers | Dec 28 23:45 |
| schestowitz | And SUN made superior workstations | Dec 28 23:45 |
| cubezzz | that's true | Dec 28 23:45 |
| schestowitz | Just overpriced and not enough crime like Gates and his Gang | Dec 28 23:45 |
| schestowitz | Even in 2006 SUN had looking glass | Dec 28 23:46 |
| DaemonFC | my bank still uses Slowlaris | Dec 28 23:46 |
| schestowitz | Looking Glass was made just prior to AIXGL/XGL | Dec 28 23:46 |
| schestowitz | I got the first acronym wrong. | Dec 28 23:46 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: Probably some slow contrived piece of crap written in JAVA | Dec 28 23:46 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: that's a good thing | Dec 28 23:46 |
| DaemonFC | taking 500 megs of RAM all to itself | Dec 28 23:46 |
| MinceR | they still were the first :> | Dec 28 23:47 |
| DaemonFC | not really | Dec 28 23:47 |
| DaemonFC | Looking Glass was more of a tec demo than anything | Dec 28 23:47 |
| schestowitz | In Windows, cracker takes 50000RAM all for himself | Dec 28 23:47 |
| schestowitz | *50,000 MB of RAM | Dec 28 23:47 |
| cubezzz | CMS had some good ideas too | Dec 28 23:47 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: yes, Jonathan Ponytail did a demo of it | Dec 28 23:47 |
| schestowitz | But it did introduce some ideas | Dec 28 23:47 |
| schestowitz | Later to be imitated | Dec 28 23:48 |
| schestowitz | Like Apple's Duck [sic] | Dec 28 23:48 |
| schestowitz | With the shadows | Dec 28 23:48 |
| DaemonFC | I'd like to see someone put out a Linux distribution where there are no funky errors | Dec 28 23:48 |
| DaemonFC | where every bit of hardware you have works | Dec 28 23:48 |
| DaemonFC | and where apps don't segfault with no further explanation | Dec 28 23:48 |
| cubezzz | I'm there already | Dec 28 23:49 |
| cubezzz | FC1 | Dec 28 23:49 |
| cubezzz | with my own mods | Dec 28 23:49 |
| DaemonFC | my god, the last time I saw errors that were that bad was when Windows 98 started throwing you hex codes and memory addresses | Dec 28 23:49 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #GNU #Emacs Picks #Bazaar http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2009-12/msg00812.html #bzr | Dec 28 23:49 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: GNU Emacs is on Bazaar now. .::. Size~: 5.53 KB | Dec 28 23:49 |
| MinceR | i'd like to see someone put an OS where there are no funky errors, where every bit of hardware you have works and where apps don't segfault with no further explanation | Dec 28 23:50 |
| MinceR | (at least the default apps) | Dec 28 23:50 |
| cubezzz | you can always seg fault if you run out of ram though | Dec 28 23:50 |
| cubezzz | it's always possible | Dec 28 23:50 |
| MinceR | application bugs can always exist, but it would be nice to have a default set without bugs | Dec 28 23:51 |
| MinceR | but this is all a pipe dream today | Dec 28 23:51 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] BBC: "Battery life on Linux is in excess of 10 hours, for Windows rarely more than three." http://ur1.ca/inkj | Dec 28 23:51 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: BBC News - Technology changes 'outstrip' netbooks .::. Size~: 56.72 KB | Dec 28 23:51 |
| cubezzz | windows programs never exit prematurely? | Dec 28 23:52 |
| MinceR | that sentence is about some random ARM/Core 2 dell craptop | Dec 28 23:52 |
| cubezzz | sorry, it's possible no matter what OS you use | Dec 28 23:52 |
| MinceR | they often do | Dec 28 23:52 |
| MinceR | i know | Dec 28 23:52 |
| MinceR | it's just that it does affect the user experience | Dec 28 23:52 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] GNU- and Linux-powered #Nokia #N900 Now on Sale in the UK http://ur1.ca/inkn http://ur1.ca/inko | Dec 28 23:52 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Nokia N900 Already Available at Carphone Warehouse - In stock, with Vodafone plans - Softpedia .::. Size~: 48.49 KB | Dec 28 23:53 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Snowtter Snowflakes + Twitter on Nokia N900 .::. Size~: 66.37 KB | Dec 28 23:53 |
| cubezzz | the programs I write are extremely small, use little memory | Dec 28 23:53 |
| cubezzz | as a result they have never faulted | Dec 28 23:53 |
| MinceR | mine tend to be very small too, but there's no web browser, email client or spreadsheet among them :) | Dec 28 23:53 |
| cubezzz | I've never had a problem with most GNU programs either | Dec 28 23:53 |
| MinceR | they tend to fail according to the GIGO principle | Dec 28 23:53 |
| MinceR | which is fine for my personal use | Dec 28 23:53 |
| cubezzz | it's not a big deal unless they bring down the OS | Dec 28 23:54 |
| MinceR | (Garbage In, Garbage Out) | Dec 28 23:54 |
| MinceR | they never did | Dec 28 23:54 |
| MinceR | well, except for the fork bomb i coded up one day at class, when i was bored | Dec 28 23:54 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Amazon 's Best Selling Item is a #Linux Gadget http://ur1.ca/inks http://ur1.ca/inkt | Dec 28 23:54 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Amazon Announces It Sold More Kindle Books Than Physical Books On Christmas... But Doesn't It Mean Rented? | Techdirt .::. Size~: 99.57 KB | Dec 28 23:55 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Kindle is most gifted Amazon item, ever | Business Tech - CNET News .::. Size~: 156.83 KB | Dec 28 23:55 |
| cubezzz | if I really want to know what's going on I can use gdb | Dec 28 23:55 |
| cubezzz | but you really really don't know for sure unless you wrote the whole thing | Dec 28 23:55 |
| cubezzz | this is my main box: | Dec 28 23:56 |
| cubezzz | http://cubeman.org/linux-hardware.html | Dec 28 23:56 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Linux Hardware .::. Size~: 0.77 KB | Dec 28 23:56 |
| cubezzz | everything works | Dec 28 23:56 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Battle Between #GNU #Linux Sub-notebooks That Connect to Online Services http://ur1.ca/inku http://ur1.ca/inkv | Dec 28 23:56 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Can Jolicloud Win In A Chrome OS Netbook World? - washingtonpost.com .::. Size~: 92.63 KB | Dec 28 23:57 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Google Chrome netbook specs leaked? .::. Size~: 23.1 KB | Dec 28 23:57 |
| cubezzz | I did research on all the hardware first | Dec 28 23:57 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] A Short Review of #VideoLAN Movie Creator http://www.the-source.com/2009/12/videolan-movie-creator/ | Dec 28 23:57 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: VideoLAN Movie Creator « The Source.com .::. Size~: 24.02 KB | Dec 28 23:58 |
| cubezzz | if you are dilligent it's not difficult | Dec 28 23:58 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Drupal #CMS "Thrives in Taiwan" http://asia.cnet.com/blogs/the-neon-rush/post.htm?id=63015618&scid=rvhm_ms | Dec 28 23:59 | |
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