Boycott Novell logo

IRC: #boycottnovell-social @ FreeNode: July 2009

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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Wed Jul 1 11:42:33 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovell-socialJul 01 11:42
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged]Jul 01 11:42
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social set by schestowitz at Mon Mar 16 02:04:07 2009Jul 01 11:42
schestowitzHmm...Jul 01 15:00
schestowitz"Please allow me to introduce myself. I am a 22 year old student fromJul 01 15:01
schestowitzIndia. I am a self taught developer studying advanced Physics. I haveJul 01 15:01
schestowitzbeen contributing bits and pieces to the community when I could. SomeoneJul 01 15:01
schestowitzwho found some of my contributions recommended me for an internship atJul 01 15:01
schestowitzthe MS Research labs in Bangalore, India. A few friends and me go toJul 01 15:01
schestowitznearby colleges and advocate usage of Linux and in the previous summer,Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzI got to work at Google, where I was convinced that I should work toJul 01 15:01
schestowitzenhance open source. I organized camps, tutorials, and even spent myJul 01 15:01
schestowitzinternship stipend in setting up an apt mirror for the locality.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzMy ideas and contributions even got me a position in the fabled GoogleJul 01 15:01
schestowitzSummer of Code program, where I am contributing an extension to theJul 01 15:01
schestowitzMonoDevelop project in my /free time/. I strongly considered stayingJul 01 15:01
schestowitzhome for the summer and contributing full time."Jul 01 15:01
schestowitz"Still, in this country, the competition and the desire to go ahead in myJul 01 15:01
schestowitzcareer took me to this company where I work on some interesting researchJul 01 15:01
schestowitzareas dealing with Machine translation. Since I lack a degree inJul 01 15:01
schestowitzcomputer science, this opportunity was seen as nothing less than aJul 01 15:01
schestowitzmiracle. I still contribute to XMMS2 and some other projects in theJul 01 15:01
schestowitzevenings and weekends.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzWhat I am trying to tell you is that if you met me on the street, weJul 01 15:01
schestowitzwould've probably had a good chat about open source, and unfortunatelyJul 01 15:01
schestowitzmy affiliations to my favourite open source puts us on opposite sides ofJul 01 15:01
schestowitza war that I dearly wish didn't exist.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzFollowing the recent developments that you, more than anyone else in theJul 01 15:01
schestowitzworld today are aware of, I felt really hurt because I am part of thatJul 01 15:01
schestowitzcommunity, not just it's supporters. I wrote a rant on my personalJul 01 15:01
schestowitzweblog which I have been maintaining for nearly three years without anyJul 01 15:01
schestowitzstrong opinions or outbursts."Jul 01 15:01
schestowitz"While our opinion may differ, I noticed that you wrote some posts onJul 01 15:01
schestowitzyour websiteJul 01 15:01
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/01/mono-backed-by-microsoft/Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/06/29/microsoft-and-novell-for-mono-net/Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzIn that, a particular phrase "Microsoft staff may openly say "Fuck you,Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzRichard Stallman", but there are rebuttals to this disgracefulJul 01 15:01
schestowitzbehaviour. Stallman was being polite and rational." might lead people toJul 01 15:01
schestowitzeventually believe that my stance is the same as my employers, whichJul 01 15:01
schestowitzit's not.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzI am just a lowly intern working on a small research project somewhereJul 01 15:01
schestowitzin the corner of India. If tomorrow this might lead someone to believeJul 01 15:01
schestowitzthat I represented the company's policy it might affect me harshly.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitz"Jul 01 15:01
schestowitz===Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzSome trouble for him, eh?Jul 01 15:01
schestowitzSuddenly the fear of what one says.Jul 01 15:01
schestowitz"I am entitled to my opinion and you are free to criticize my post andJul 01 15:02
schestowitzcorrect me if necessary. I wrote it on my own time and am not evenJul 01 15:02
schestowitzassociated with the real MS, this is just the research wing. You were anJul 01 15:02
schestowitzundergraduate student too, and if you are in an environment where you'reJul 01 15:02
schestowitzcompeting with millions of undergraduates you do not want to have aJul 01 15:02
schestowitzfalse image of yourself proliferate the internet.Jul 01 15:02
schestowitzPlease do not read me out of context. I am not contributing as part ofJul 01 15:02
schestowitzmy day job, I only contribute in the evenings. I have already got intoJul 01 15:02
schestowitzsome issues with some people who noticed the article."Jul 01 15:02
schestowitz===Jul 01 15:02
schestowitzI reckon MS may have contacted him somehow? Maybe folks in their community....Jul 01 15:02
schestowitzOops.Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzWrong person...?Jul 01 15:15
schestowitz==Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzWell the lawyer is correct, it's a huge public service to keep court information safe and available for researching and learning.  You've done a great job!Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzBut I do have a correction for the article about DHS and Janet Napolitano.Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzUnless I read it wrong, it looks like the headline and article are saying she is -or was- a Microsoft employee.  But, unless they've hired her very recently, I don't know when she could have worked for MS, because, until she was appointed to DHS by Obama, she was our governor, here in Arizona. Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzIf she has a history with Microsoft, it might be good to mention when and in what capacity she worked for them. Jul 01 15:15
schestowitzOther than that, I'm still busy reading BN and catching up on all the newest articles this morning (it's a little after 7am here)...need more coffee now.Jul 01 15:15
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schestowitzPage corrected now: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/01/janet-napolitano-on-ddos/Jul 01 15:23
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schestowitz"Yup, that's MUCH better!  Janet's not my favorite person.  I'm pretty sure she'd be tickled pink to schmooze with Microsofties whenever they ask, so she'll definitely need watching.  But I'm glad we caught that mistake before the trolls found it.  :)"Jul 01 20:15
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:G_3/08&diff=299300613&oldid=298440170Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz===========Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz   +  Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz== EPO forbids links? ==Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitzThis kind of link:Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitzhttp://documents.epo.org/projects/babylon/eponet.nsf/0/B89D95BB305AAA8DC12574EC002C7CF6/$File/G3-08_en.pdfJul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz  + Jul 01 22:57
schestowitzbreaks. The EPO seems to want to protect this kind of document to be indexed by search engines or be referenced by bloggers. Do they understand the internet?Jul 01 22:57
schestowitz===========Jul 01 22:57
schestowitzhttp://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:G_3/08&diff=299306491&oldid=299300613 "[zoobab] Wikipedia User GDallimore removing my comment about EPO links: http://bit.ly/t1afQ"Jul 01 22:57
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trmancoOT: http://www.copyblogger.com/blame-canada/Jul 01 23:27
schestowitzHappy Canada Day BTWJul 01 23:28
trmancoI guess I can say, I'm proud to be Canadian, even though I'm not currently living thereJul 01 23:28
trmancoI cannot say the same on being Portuguese thoughJul 01 23:29
schestowitzhttp://blogs.technet.com/openchoice/archive/2009/07/01/eu-tamb-m-repudio.aspxJul 01 23:35
schestowitzAnd here comes the smear campaign from the Microsoft guy, Marcos Santos (bigJul 01 23:35
schestowitzguy in Microsoft Portugal):Jul 01 23:35
schestowitzhttp://blogs.technet.com/openchoice/archive/2009/07/01/eu-tamb-m-repudio.aspxJul 01 23:35
schestowitzI also reject...Jul 01 23:35
schestowitzIt's been sometime since I last wrote, but I have been quite up to dateJul 01 23:35
schestowitzwith current events. In fact I have read more blogs and not had so muchJul 01 23:35
schestowitztime to write in mine. I'm back because I was reading the newspaper todayJul 01 23:35
schestowitzwhen I noticed the following title:Jul 01 23:35
schestowitz"ANSOL rejects Microsoft's lack of scruples"Jul 01 23:35
schestowitzhttp://www.destak.pt/artigos.php?art=34040Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzThe what? Lack of what? I want to believe this isn't an action from ANSOL.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzYes, because free publicity based on some news that wish to smear the imageJul 01 23:36
schestowitzof another organization isn't something any organization wants to beJul 01 23:36
schestowitzassociated with, right? In my humble opinion, I think ANSOL should be 1stJul 01 23:36
schestowitzpage of newspapers, for their projects developped in Portugal, for theJul 01 23:36
schestowitzcontribution to national development or for the pioneer projects they carried.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzWell, once again this situation is unfortunate, first because the accusationJul 01 23:36
schestowitzin itself is not based upon facts, but a personal opinion. The fact some goodJul 01 23:36
schestowitzor service has a cost, does it mean that the organization selling it is anJul 01 23:36
schestowitzentity without scruples? Evidently not...Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzOn the other hand, it's important that much that it is talked about, attackedJul 01 23:36
schestowitzfor, but in reality the whole process was legal and transparent and so theJul 01 23:36
schestowitzaccusations don't have any fundament.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzIn short, nothing new, but I'm always attent...Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzFiled under: "Fighting lies", Current Events, AttacksJul 01 23:36
schestowitz1.«The fact some goodJul 01 23:36
schestowitzor service has a cost, does it mean that the organization selling it is anJul 01 23:36
schestowitzentity without scruples? Evidently not...»Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzNo, it's not that which is criticised. What is criticised is the huge expenseJul 01 23:36
schestowitzcharged for such a crappy service.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzEffectively, it's like stealing candy from a child.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitz2.«In my humble opinion, I think ANSOL should be 1stJul 01 23:36
schestowitzpage of newspapers, for their projects developped in Portugal, for theJul 01 23:36
schestowitzcontribution to national development or for the pioneer projects they carried.»Jul 01 23:36
schestowitzI remember January 16th, first page of O Público, thanks to the "credibility" ofJul 01 23:36
schestowitzMicrosoft and the "quality" of it's know-how, which is well reflected in Base.Jul 01 23:36
schestowitztrmanco: write about this maybe. I don't have time. It's endlessJul 01 23:36
trmancoI've seen thatJul 01 23:37
trmancohttp://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20090701175132339Jul 01 23:37
trmancoI don't think I have enough "critic spirit" to write something good about thatJul 01 23:38
trmancorms (pt) should write something soon about that pr trollJul 01 23:38
schestowitzHe probably willJul 01 23:39
trmancohe is more into that stuff than I amJul 01 23:41
trmancoheck, he is the president of ANSOL for a reason :-)Jul 01 23:41
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5VRbY8US_g&feature=relatedJul 02 06:04
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MinceRoh, it's mutex.Jul 03 11:47
MinceRtoo bad i've lost my op.Jul 03 11:47
trmanco:|Jul 03 11:56
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MinceRbtw BobSprite is from bigpond too :>Jul 08 13:09
trmancowhat is bigpond?Jul 08 13:12
MinceRthe ISP mutex usesJul 08 13:14
MinceRand so far everyone coming from there was suspected of being mutexJul 08 13:14
MinceR(it's an australian isp, by the way)Jul 08 13:14
trmancooh okJul 08 13:17
trmancoschestowitz, should be around here soonJul 08 13:17
oiaohmIprimus has own link out MinceRJul 08 13:28
MinceRwho or what is Iprimus?Jul 08 13:29
oiaohmISP IprimusJul 08 13:29
oiaohmIn australia.Jul 08 13:29
oiaohmThey also are primus in the USA.Jul 08 13:29
oiaohmSo even that I am in Australia sometimes I trace to a USA IP.Jul 08 13:30
MinceRoh, i seeJul 08 13:30
MinceRthen you obviously don't show up as mutex, that's not an issueJul 08 13:30
MinceR(also, you have a registered nick and a cloak)Jul 08 13:30
oiaohmDid that to save confusion.Jul 08 13:30
oiaohmWith my where ever IP address.Jul 08 13:31
oiaohmThey also have a another ISP in england.Jul 08 13:31
oiaohmLot rarer to get one of those IPs.Jul 08 13:32
oiaohmLot of ISP's in australia by space from telstra/bigpond.Jul 08 13:36
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MinceRso they even get reverse DNS that points to bigpond?Jul 08 13:39
oiaohmYepJul 08 13:55
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MinceRis "i'm OS-agnostic" m$-trollspeak for "i'm using windows but i act like i know gnu/linux"?Jul 09 14:34
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schestowitz<anon> Alexander Schmehl is missinformedJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> I can assure you D-I pulls the gnome meta-package in *by default*Jul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> there's a checkboxJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> which is checked in by defaultJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> user can uncheck itJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> but that's itJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> I found a very interesting quote in this old pro-Mono article (http://www.osnews.com/story/5746/Commentary_The_Upcoming_GNOME_Monarchy_of_Mono)Jul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> "In my conversations with Sun executives the last few months they kept re-assuring me that no C# will ever enter their JDS or Solaris default installations."Jul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> I spoke with AlexanderJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> he just got the wrong info.  he said he'll correct itJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> http://robertmh.wordpress.com/2009/07/04/what-does-rand-mean/Jul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> btw, RMS gave a talk at GUADEC todayJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> http://www.grancanariadesktopsummit.org/node/239Jul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> I can't find the content, but I guess he talked about .NETJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> wow Roy, you gotta see this oneJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> http://np237.livejournal.com/24790.htmlJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> you and I are now "toxic", along with VargheseJul 10 00:51
schestowitz<anon> and he got a response already: http://mono-nono.com/2009/07/06/livejournal-debian-fail/Jul 10 00:51
schestowitzMono was the big news...Jul 10 00:52
schestowitzAnd mig21 (Miguel) got excited by his colleagues at MicrosoftJul 10 00:52
schestowitzSomeone mailed me this rubbish. boycottnovell.com" is worth $202,472 USD http://www.valuatemysite.com/www.boycottnovell.comJul 10 01:16
schestowitzSites put up big number for people to link to some stupid "what's my site worth"Jul 10 01:16
schestowitzThere are even fake numbers and fake trade in some sites like FacebookJul 10 01:17
schestowitzVirtual moneyJul 10 01:17
schestowitzAlthough I have been on a break for a week, I did follow the Mono development.Jul 10 01:17
schestowitzMy mail client messed up totally though, so I can't catch up properlyJul 10 01:17
schestowitzWe need to find the LSE videos...Jul 10 01:20
schestowitz">> Remember that video link I sent you about the man waxing lyrical aboutJul 10 01:20
schestowitz> dotNET and the LSE. Do you still have it? Do I still have it ?Jul 10 01:20
schestowitz>Jul 10 01:20
schestowitz> It was on the MS site only in WMP format ???Jul 10 01:20
schestowitz>Jul 10 01:20
schestowitz> Someone at the LSE bet his career on the move .. :OJul 10 01:20
schestowitzBam! First thing I thought: Doug d/led this thing! Yes? No?  "Jul 10 01:20
schestowitzWe could add captions to ridicule that disaster deploymentJul 10 01:21
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9rGhUFJhWY&feature=relatedJul 10 05:51
fewaschestowitz, yeah i saw it beforeJul 10 06:00
schestowitzOh, cool. New to meJul 10 06:01
schestowitzpart 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHmQZwP-cBQ&feature=relatedJul 10 06:01
fewasome time after i watched Bill Maher's ReligulousJul 10 06:02
schestowitzIs he...?Jul 10 06:10
fewaits sort of a a satire of religionJul 10 06:11
schestowitzAh, OK!Jul 10 06:14
fewahave you not watched he show before?Jul 10 06:15
fewaIts sort of a interview/chat style show on HBOJul 10 06:15
fewaReal Time with Bill MaherJul 10 06:16
schestowitzI know the show, not this part thoughJul 10 06:17
schestowitzHere is a favourite from him: http://vodpod.com/watch/38271-the-secret-government-the-constitution-in-crisis-by-bill-moyers-google-videoJul 10 06:17
schestowitzOh waitJul 10 06:18
fewaIt was a movie, not part of the showJul 10 06:18
schestowitzNot the same dudeJul 10 06:18
schestowitzBut Maher's show I watcj sometimesJul 10 06:18
fewaand that is someone elseJul 10 06:18
schestowitzDemocratJul 10 06:18
fewaLiberalJul 10 06:18
fewacalls out the Democrats on being excessively weak and centristJul 10 06:19
fewahttp://www.hbo.com/billmaher/new_rules/index.htmlJul 10 06:22
schestowitzI've only seen him on YouTube like 10 timesJul 10 06:23
schestowitzNo Yank TV here...Jul 10 06:23
fewayeahJul 10 06:23
MinceRschestowitz: yes, i've lost my op -- my ISP disconnects me once per week to make sure my ip address changes, which happens to be on fridaysJul 10 06:54
MinceRi knew this and i should have thought of it.Jul 10 06:54
schestowitzThey didn't last foreverJul 10 06:55
MinceR(it might move around but the last time i've lost connection for another reason was on friday, so since then it does the weekly disconnect on fridays)Jul 10 06:55
schestowitzIt could be worseJul 10 06:55
MinceRit could -- i remember seeing adsl that disconnected dailyJul 10 06:57
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MinceRit's friday :>Jul 10 09:03
schestowitzLast day at work.Jul 10 09:28
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schestowitz"Christopher Hoff earlier this week arrived at the Stratford clinic stark bollock naked, provoking a fit of the screaming abdabs in the female receptionist. He then legged it, later to be confronted by police at his house." http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/10/dental_appointment/Jul 10 15:45
schestowitzDetainees Were Also Murdered at Bagram in Afghanistan < http://www.truthout.org/062509A >Jul 10 16:29
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schestowitzDarnJul 11 16:53
schestowitz"The px07378 pdf isn't the one I thought it would be.  It's the one with all the complex graphs and such.  Much of it is unreadable as-is.  So, I'm going to get some help with this one.  I'm pretty good at deciphering these kinds of badly scanned images of badly photocopied documents, but it will take some time to do it.  I'll see how much of it I can get done over the weekend.  I have a friend that might help out if they doJul 11 16:53
schestowitzn't already have other plans. Jul 11 16:53
schestowitzIt would be great if we could get this whole thing into a clean and readable state. Jul 11 16:53
schestowitzI'll do the easy text first, so you'll have that part at least. Jul 11 16:53
schestowitzThen I'll see if I can't get you some clean images of the graphics inside the pdf.  "Jul 11 16:53
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trmancowhy are some gnomos harassing RMS? I really don't get itJul 12 16:10
schestowitz"Lefty" started a flamewarJul 12 16:17
schestowitzLike he did against meJul 12 16:17
schestowitzhe hates RMS and all that stuffJul 12 16:17
schestowitzSo now they go against FSF/GNU/SFLCJul 12 16:17
schestowitzThey should rename to NOMEJul 12 16:17
schestowitzOr NOMOJul 12 16:17
trmancothey should burry themselves and let real people "manage" gnomeJul 12 16:26
schestowitzToo lateJul 12 16:35
schestowitzDe Icaza was thereJul 12 16:35
schestowitzbblJul 12 16:35
trmancodoes anybody here use MUC?Jul 12 21:01
trmanco* DCC RECV aw.dll to MasterBot aborted.Jul 12 21:07
trmanco* DCC RECV blnmgr.dll to MasterBot aborted.Jul 12 21:07
trmanco* DCC RECV blnmgrps.dll to MasterBot aborted.Jul 12 21:07
trmanconot againJul 12 21:07
trmancostupid spam botsJul 12 21:08
schestowitzMasterBate or MasterBot?Jul 12 21:09
trmancoboth :-PJul 12 21:11
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sun Jul 12 23:59:24 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovell-socialJul 12 23:59
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged]Jul 12 23:59
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social set by schestowitz at Mon Mar 16 02:04:07 2009Jul 12 23:59
schestowitz> I am getting ready to send you px07378 as text...plus a few images. Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> You probably won't want to post the cleaned-up PowerPoint imagesJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> publically.  I have an old family friend that's an attorney, we had aJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> visit yesterday.  I take care of his computers for him (yes, they runJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Windows...sigh), and often discuss moving him away from Windows some dayJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> (soon, I hope).  He found our Comes v. Microsoft project quiteJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> interesting...and now he's reading the exhibits himself :) Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Anyway, he *did* think that my attempt to replicate those powerpointJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> images *might* be taken as copying copyrighted materials.  So, I added aJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> disclaimer to the bottom of each of them. Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> I considered not sending them at all.  You had indicated that most ofJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> the powerpoint stuff was just junk.  But I found them to be quiteJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> informative, as far as understanding how MS saw their future and whatJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> they were most afraid of.  So, since I've already got four of themJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> finished, I'm going to go ahead and send them to you, accompanied by theJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> text versions.  Even if you don't use them on BN, they still might comeJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> in handy for something.Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> I know you asked me not to put page breaks into the text versions, butJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> on this exhibit I *did* add markers showing where the images are placedJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> in the original.  I made the markers bold and red so you can find themJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> easily if you need to delete them, or place the image text there. Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> I didn't put all the text versions of the images into the main body ofJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> the px07378 text, I figured you could add them in if you wanted them.Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> I'll send them separately. Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> I'm sorry if I did this one all wrong.  I worried that I was just makingJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> more work for you.  But I honestly did my best with it.  I hope it'sJul 13 00:12
schestowitz> helpful. Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> Jul 13 00:12
schestowitz> The emails will be heading your way very shortly.Jul 13 00:12
schestowitzThanks, this is brilliant. I'd need to post this properly because we have one go. It ought to take a few hours.Jul 13 00:12
schestowitzQUOTE: I've been keeping a low profile but I've been following the latest of the "Lefty" (aka Dafty) saga.  Now that Dafty is threatening to sue, I've read some of the threads in the Ubuntu development mailing lists.  I've also seen the latest IRC log where "twitter" expresses his opinions.Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: My opinion of "Mark Fink" has not changed at all.  I believe that he was actually working against you by doing such a poor job of advocacy and constantly linking to your site.  On the other hand, I disagree with "twitter" and find that, while Dafty often responded in an abrasive manner, he was at least accurate in what he said (including the quoted article on the GPL.)Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: I also disagree with twitter's speculation that Dafty is somehow working for Microsoft.  I may question his free software credentials, but I wouldn't go so far as "twitter" did.  Where Dafty has gone wrong was in making the false association between "Fink" and yourself.Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: I'm honestly of two minds about Dafty.  The part of me that gives him the derisive nickname says that he really doesn't know much at all about evidence and proof if he honestly believes that the e-mail he quotes from "Mark Fink" is proof of anything more than that you vaguely approve of something that "Fink" has done. Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: It does not at all prove that you "put Fink up to it", as Dafty contends.  I am also very curious that he is so quick to let "Fink" off the hook and go after you on this flimsy bit of evidence.  Perhaps, since he claims to know Jeff Waugh, he sees himself as putting on the Superman cape and "doing him justice."Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: The other part of me thinks that, while Dafty is abrasive and aggressive (i.e. the stereotypical "type A" American personality), he is also intelligent and expresses himself well.Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: What makes me dislike him and distrust him is that he has a smug air of superiority and, despite his protestations of being very familiar with legal matters, he really does not seem to understand that his alleged proof of your complicity is nothing ofJul 13 06:35
schestowitzof the sort.  In short, he stikes me as a hypocrite.Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: Here's hoping that this dispute will not become a legal matter.  After all, it's one thing to "have a hobby" and another thing to push a legal case.  For example, see this article:Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/696289.stmJul 13 06:35
schestowitzQUOTE: where someone spends 3 years in British courts prosecuting a libel case.Jul 13 06:35
schestowitzI think someone is DDOSing BNJul 13 10:25
trmancoagain?Jul 13 10:33
schestowitzNot sureJul 13 10:54
schestowitzLT FP tooJul 13 10:54
schestowitzThese antitrust exhibits are great: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/13/microsoft-linux-fud-presentation/ The lady who helps with them has more coming :-)Jul 13 10:55
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schestowitzAll done :-) "Ms. MARKOVA has asked me to mail these as proof regarding case 1719/2009/MAM. Please reply to confirm receipt."Jul 13 12:21
schestowitzThe Commission is gonna get a lot of trouble.Jul 13 12:21
schestowitz:-pJul 13 12:21
schestowitz"I'm glad to hear that you talked with Schlesinger and have apparently worked it out amongst yourselves.  The only thing I have to add is that, if he chose to go after you in court, you could have counter-sued him for defaming you with the false statement that "you are responcible for Mark Fink's tirades and other anti-social actions."  Once again, I'm glad it won't come to that.  If there is one lesson to learn from, for exJul 13 13:07
schestowitzample, the SCO Group, it is that lawsuits can be long drawn out nightmares even if you are well enough funded to defend yourself."Jul 13 13:07
trmancomaybe they would love to be mass hacked some timeJul 13 13:15
trmanco:-PJul 13 13:15
trmancomaybe bbc can lend me there botnetJul 13 13:17
schestowitzHeh. The BBC is immune to criticismJul 13 13:19
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trmancowho is nastymicrosoft from diggJul 13 15:45
trmanco?Jul 13 15:45
trmancoIt might be astralknightJul 13 15:45
schestowitzThe trolls say soJul 13 15:47
schestowitzI don't speak to it. Crazed one...Jul 13 15:47
trmancoit? who?Jul 13 15:48
schestowitzAll kinds of names of thereJul 13 15:48
schestowitzThat komrad person from FSDaily seems calmJul 13 15:49
schestowitzBut I have no idea who those people areJul 13 15:49
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schestowitzNice explanation of 4D: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9KT4M7kiSw&NR=1Jul 14 00:07
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7jqlKuFf84&NR=1Jul 14 00:24
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schestowitzload average: 30.88, 20.74, 11.08Jul 14 12:27
schestowitzDDOS almost for sureJul 14 12:27
schestowitzThere was one earlier tooJul 14 12:27
trmancoare you sure it's a ddos?Jul 14 12:30
trmancoor just a large spike in traffic? :-PJul 14 12:30
trmancomaybe some other account sending mass emails? :-PJul 14 12:31
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schestowitzThere is no other accountJul 14 12:44
schestowitzIt's too slow for me to access logsJul 14 12:45
trmancooh okJul 14 12:47
schestowitzI've rerun iptablesJul 14 13:05
schestowitzWait.Jul 14 13:11
schestowitzmaybe it is not DDOSJul 14 13:12
schestowitzNot sure yetJul 14 13:12
schestowitzWe get huge number of reqs for http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/13/microsoft-linux-fud-presentation/Jul 14 13:12
schestowitzLike one every second!Jul 14 13:12
schestowitzMaybe Digg or something..Jul 14 13:12
trmanco:-pJul 14 13:15
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schestowitzZanranCrawler/0.2 (helpdesk@zanran.com)Jul 14 13:16
schestowitzWhat is this?Jul 14 13:16
schestowitzload average: 2.82, 11.53, 16.12Jul 14 13:17
trmancoLOLJul 14 13:19
trmancoC# botJul 14 13:19
trmancoZanRan LtdJul 14 13:20
trmanco(Information Technology and Services industry)Jul 14 13:20
trmancoDecember 2006 — January 2008 (1 year 2 months)Jul 14 13:20
trmancoDeveloping a Web Crawler in C#, using the HTTP classes in .NET. The crawler was:Jul 14 13:20
trmancohttp://www.webmasterworld.com/search_engine_spiders/3937863.htmJul 14 13:21
trmancosomething to do with amazon's cloud :-PJul 14 13:21
schestowitzBastardJul 14 13:37
schestowitzHammered on the serverJul 14 13:37
schestowitzGood riddanceJul 14 13:37
schestowitzload average: 23.05, 11.32, 6.57Jul 14 14:15
schestowitzAgain..Jul 14 14:15
trmancoI just wrote an article on how the ubuntu filesystem smacks windows xp em 7 in the ass :-PJul 14 20:00
trmancoI wrote it yesterdayJul 14 20:00
schestowitzEnglish?Jul 14 20:10
trmanconopJul 14 20:13
schestowitzI'm SO behind todayJul 14 20:32
schestowitzToo many comments and postsJul 14 20:32
schestowitzI hope to catch up by AugustJul 14 20:32
schestowitzThen ComesJul 14 20:32
trmancoaugustJul 14 20:34
trmancowowJul 14 20:34
schestowitzComes heapsJul 14 20:37
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Chips_B_Malroy_Hi Roy everyoneJul 15 00:18
schestowitzYo!Jul 15 00:21
schestowitzDDOS was likely occurring todayJul 15 00:22
schestowitzI have not found other explanationsJul 15 00:22
schestowitzBut load on the server was very highJul 15 00:22
Chips_B_Malroy_yes, you already know who I think that was from the txt file I sent long agoJul 15 00:25
schestowitzYou know he's in #bnJul 15 00:25
schestowitzRight?Jul 15 00:25
schestowitzI don't want to annoy himJul 15 00:25
schestowitzHe's crazyJul 15 00:25
Chips_B_Malroy_YESJul 15 00:25
Chips_B_Malroy_YESJul 15 00:25
Chips_B_Malroy_more than u think tooJul 15 00:26
schestowitzZealot/racist/etcJul 15 00:26
schestowitzSometimes uses bad words in IRCJul 15 00:26
schestowitzBut kickbanning him would be troubleJul 15 00:26
Chips_B_Malroy_he might also have been shot in the arm outside an convence store in New EnglandJul 15 00:26
Chips_B_Malroy_and know you have your reasons to not ban him yetJul 15 00:26
Chips_B_Malroy_which are not for me to know, or want to knowJul 15 00:27
Chips_B_Malroy_but he is here to damageJul 15 00:27
Chips_B_Malroy_I ignore him, and will not respond directly to himJul 15 00:28
schestowitzI knowJul 15 00:30
schestowitzHe has agendaJul 15 00:30
schestowitzAnd the other trolls use his bairJul 15 00:30
schestowitz2 hours ago a Microsoft troll said  I don't say what language I preferJul 15 00:30
schestowitzWho asked it? The troll in questionJul 15 00:30
schestowitzThey cooperate, I reckonJul 15 00:31
schestowitzMake friends,attack Mono, then pretextJul 15 00:31
Chips_B_Malroy_they seem to be in clusion for sureJul 15 00:38
Chips_B_Malroy_you take your pick, MS, mono coders, Novel shills, linuxsux (most likely they are MS trolls)Jul 15 00:39
Chips_B_Malroy_The Debain guy I might give some slack to.  Depending, as I have not heard him yetJul 15 00:40
Chips_B_Malroy_its simple, MS has the most, the most shills periodJul 15 00:40
schestowitzI know.Jul 15 00:42
schestowitzGroklaw taught how to handle themJul 15 00:42
schestowitzand balzac, doug others tooJul 15 00:42
Chips_B_Malroy_if you would like me to, I would talk with the ddos guyJul 15 00:42
schestowitzI made a mistake by replying to/messaging obvious trolls like "fink"Jul 15 00:43
Chips_B_Malroy_ask him why he slanders this siteJul 15 00:43
schestowitzThey trapped to cause troubleJul 15 00:43
schestowitzI could set a ban while he's awayJul 15 00:44
Chips_B_Malroy_we all have made that mistake.  They pretend to be something else to trap you.  Then they quote you out of context or twist your words, or even outright lieJul 15 00:44
Chips_B_Malroy_expect more ddos when u do, is the most probably outcomeJul 15 00:44
Chips_B_Malroy_do it when u have the least amount of traffic and the less newsJul 15 00:45
Chips_B_Malroy_after a few more warnings about bad language, hahaJul 15 00:45
schestowitzI see you changed the debateJul 15 00:48
schestowitzFrom Microsoft shill spinningJul 15 00:48
schestowitzTo demise of MicrosoftJul 15 00:48
schestowitzGood moveJul 15 00:48
schestowitzThat's why I blocked commentsJul 15 00:48
schestowitzThey changed topicJul 15 00:49
schestowitzTo difuseJul 15 00:49
schestowitz*ffJul 15 00:49
Chips_B_Malroy_Gerad was right of course, they were spamming the post and would rather have us talk about their shillness, than the fact that bling is a failureJul 15 00:50
Chips_B_Malroy_I rubbed it in enough about the shill's lack of ethics, in order to humilate MS someJul 15 00:51
Chips_B_Malroy_As a poster in the comments, I can say things that you could not and get away with them.  Like I did in MS Watch.  I never use bad language, and try to back up facts as wellJul 15 00:52
schestowitzYesJul 15 00:55
Chips_B_Malroy_Wilcox is a real slimball, but I would never say that in public or your other IRC channelJul 15 00:56
Chips_B_Malroy_*slimeball, if I could only spellJul 15 00:56
Chips_B_Malroy_shills only attack, they cannot defendJul 15 00:57
schestowitzWhat did he do?Jul 15 00:58
schestowitzGoblin told meJul 15 00:58
Chips_B_Malroy_Joe Wilcox defends Andre Da Costa as a Windows fan, onlyJul 15 00:58
schestowitzWhen did he turn nasty?Jul 15 00:58
schestowitzPerosnal blog?Jul 15 00:58
schestowitzI see...Jul 15 00:58
schestowitzWilcox has Microsoftr agendaJul 15 00:58
schestowitzThroughout his careerJul 15 00:58
schestowitzCNET, Jupiter, etc.Jul 15 00:58
Chips_B_Malroy_on his site, I sent the email to GoblinJul 15 00:58
schestowitzZiff Davis gave him the sackJul 15 00:58
Chips_B_Malroy_I was happy they did tooJul 15 00:59
schestowitzAyeJul 15 00:59
Chips_B_Malroy_but cannot say that in publicJul 15 00:59
schestowitzSame with Seattle P-IJul 15 00:59
schestowitzAnd othersJul 15 00:59
schestowitzMicrosoft loses press gripJul 15 00:59
Chips_B_Malroy_yesJul 15 00:59
schestowitzAlong with the empireJul 15 00:59
schestowitzNo income, no fans with schwagJul 15 00:59
Chips_B_Malroy_dell and ms running their blog now, and nobody is commenting thereJul 15 01:00
Chips_B_Malroy_www.joewilcox.com    is his site.   I have not, and will not post there, everJul 15 01:00
schestowitzEverJul 15 01:00
schestowitzI never comment in blogs nowJul 15 01:00
Chips_B_Malroy_not going post on his site, made that promise to myself.  My flames, which are truth, only increase his readership.  But maybe, I am too generous to myself.Jul 15 01:01
Chips_B_Malroy_Billybob still posts thereJul 15 01:02
schestowitzhttp://www.pcworld.com/article/165179/boycott_novell_site_suffers_ddos_attack.htmlJul 15 01:03
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/17/comment-in-other-web-sites/Jul 15 01:03
Chips_B_Malroy_I will post it here in this site, as I would not want it over there, it reveals myself for one thingJul 15 01:17
Chips_B_Malroy_http://www.mepislovers.org/forums/showthread.php?t=22074Jul 15 01:17
Chips_B_Malroy_they good people on this distro's forum, so I found it surprizing that some thought Chome OS would hurt LinuxJul 15 01:18
Chips_B_Malroy_and corrected thatJul 15 01:18
Chips_B_Malroy_I don't need M$ spamming my email or anythingJul 15 01:18
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Chips_B_Malroy_I going run, great job all of you.Jul 15 01:45
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schestowitz"Based on Dafty's latest tirades and authoritative sounding statements that Mono is safe to use, I became curious as to whether he is a lawyer.  A search on the State Bar of California's Web site shows that there is only a "David Schlesinger" licenced to practice in San Diego.  I doubt that he is the same as the one who trolls your Web site, since I understand he lives quite a bit farther to the north (more than 500 kilometrJul 15 08:24
schestowitzes.)  I think, like usual, he is blowing hot air although sometimes, in rare intervals between puffs, he has a somewhat of a point."Jul 15 08:24
schestowitzSome curious reader. Why do they bother...?Jul 15 08:28
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schestowitzWe lost no-oneJul 15 13:03
schestowitzthe #wordpress channel had a sliptJul 15 13:03
schestowitz*splitJul 15 13:03
trmancoyeahJul 15 13:06
trmancowho is jeff relf?Jul 15 13:37
schestowitzTrollJul 15 14:18
schestowitzOld oneJul 15 14:18
schestowitzDon't touch itJul 15 14:18
schestowitz> Hi, Roy,Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> Here's an example:Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/15/mono-moonlight-novell-intersection/Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> See how lefty and eet attack?  In each and every reply you make, youJul 15 14:24
schestowitz> could have had a relevant link.  For example in the last one to leftyJul 15 14:24
schestowitz> saying he doesn't like the GPL, a link to a recent article prasing GPLv3Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> could have been used.Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> You have tons of *good* links.  Be selective about which ones you use,Jul 15 14:24
schestowitz> but do use them.  I suggest posting no more than one link per rebuttalJul 15 14:24
schestowitz> but never any rebuttals without a supporting link.Jul 15 14:24
schestowitzWhat do you think?Jul 15 14:24
schestowitzI'd rather ignore them.Jul 15 14:24
schestowitzI'm wasting time replying to trollsJul 15 14:24
schestowitzThey can't be filtered out of my viewJul 15 14:24
schestowitz"I couldn't find a place to comment on http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/14/paid-microsoft-astroturfer-wong/ "Jul 15 14:25
schestowitz"I notice that you forgot to mention Wolfram Alpha and mentioned instead Bling, or whatever MS' copy is called.  Drawing attention from or even forgetting about Wolfram Alpha would be one of the 'Softers primary goals."Jul 15 14:25
schestowitz"Maybe setting your spellchecker to suggest "Wolfram Alpha (http://www.wolframalpha.com/)" whenever it encounters "Bing" might help."Jul 15 14:25
schestowitz"I can say from experience, both my own and watching Twitter, that MSFTers back off if you include links to their competitors or other embarrassing material in *each* and *every* comment or post."Jul 15 14:25
schestowitz"Saturate, diffuse and confuse can be countered with simple Skinnerian conditioning.  Every time "Bing" is brought up, so is Wolfram Alpha."Jul 15 14:25
schestowitz===Jul 15 14:25
schestowitzJose says the same thingJul 15 14:25
schestowitzTo post links to stuffJul 15 14:25
schestowitzTime consumingJul 15 14:25
schestowitzJust more advice from readers...Jul 15 14:26
schestowitzI'm still learning..Jul 15 14:26
schestowitz"I figured that.  So that means that any and all diminishment of Bing and highlighting of Google or Alpha is effective at this momement."Jul 15 14:26
schestowitz"Above, "Twitter" meant the person using the handle 'Twitter' on BN and on /."Jul 15 14:26
schestowitz"As far as specific tactics or strategies, there are often a few links one can choose from when posting.  Some are often quite good.  Post the almost-best link in the comment or article.  Then if things are quiet for a day, post a completely new comment in another thread with the best link.  Thus getting better exposure."Jul 15 14:26
schestowitz"However, if things are not quiet, then within an hour or so, post the 'best' link in the follow-up keeping to the absolute straight and narrow path of the topic and ignoring barbs, jabs and flamebait.  Then dig up either 1) more on that topic or 2) equally tough material on a related topic."Jul 15 14:26
schestowitz"Works for me."Jul 15 14:26
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schestowitzHere is a goodie that needs doing (short): http://boycottnovell.com/comes-vs-microsoft/2009-exhibits/PX00891.pdfJul 15 15:18
schestowitzRe ignoring the trolls: "That works, but next week or later this week, if they act up again, try the one-link-per-post method in your rebuttals."Jul 15 16:23
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MinceRzilog is mutex, isn't he?Jul 15 18:57
schestowitzIs he??Jul 15 18:57
schestowitzDon't knowJul 15 18:57
schestowitzLook up IPJul 15 18:57
MinceRall i could tell is that he's from bigpond.auJul 15 18:59
MinceR(which is not a lot)Jul 15 18:59
schestowitzThans!Jul 15 19:05
schestowitz*ksJul 15 19:05
MinceRnpJul 15 19:25
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trmancohttp://jpobst.blogspot.com/2009/07/banshee-as-platform.htmlJul 15 23:02
trmancobanshee to replace yastJul 15 23:02
trmancohow wonderfulJul 15 23:02
trmancohttp://tirania.org/blog/archive/2009/Jul-15.htmlJul 15 23:03
schestowitzThey caught mononucleosisJul 15 23:05
schestowitzMay they rest in piece (of s*)Jul 15 23:05
oiaohmThat was always going to happen trmanco.  gobject developers and .net developers will get into bigger conflit.Jul 15 23:07
trmancohttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/15/novell-promotes-mono-in-gnome/Jul 15 23:20
trmancoincredible postJul 15 23:20
schestowitzYesJul 15 23:22
schestowitzGrrr.Jul 15 23:42
schestowitzFamily asks the most idiotic questions...Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzit's like they can't use a computer without asking others...like it's a kidJul 15 23:43
schestowitz=====Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzDell is sending me a replacement computer for this 3-year-old Dimension 5150Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzmodel.Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzThe story is … I had a power supply problem (the computer would not turnJul 15 23:43
schestowitzon).Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzAfter about a dozen phone calls, they sent a technician to my home andJul 15 23:43
schestowitzchanged almost every part except the Hard Drive and that included a newJul 15 23:43
schestowitzmother board and power supply, of course. All was O.K for a month…then theJul 15 23:43
schestowitzproblem returned.Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzAs to the power supply problem, I found a fix myself; I did a Restore (2Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzweeks ago) going back about 100 days and everything is now working as goodJul 15 23:43
schestowitzas new.Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzI was always careful to back up everything I can think of on an ExternalJul 15 23:43
schestowitzDrive, still I am wondering why take a Replacement computer and go throughJul 15 23:43
schestowitzall the work of restoring programs and all the rest when all the parts areJul 15 23:43
schestowitznew in this one. If my hard drive fails in a year or two, I can worry aboutJul 15 23:43
schestowitzit at that time.Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzI am thinking of calling Dell tomorrow to abort them sending a replacement.Jul 15 23:43
schestowitzWhat do you advise?Jul 15 23:43
schestowitz===Jul 15 23:43
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*Chips_B_Malroy (i=4731c09d@gateway/web/freenode/x-486b14aca8c4840c) has joined #boycottnovell-socialJul 16 00:42
Chips_B_Malroyso this is publically logged as well?Jul 16 00:42
Chips_B_Malroyguess I should have read that b4 running off my mouth the other dayJul 16 00:43
Chips_B_MalroyRoy, if you there, I have some info for Goblin and maybe youJul 16 00:44
Chips_B_Malroymaybe I go to the other channelJul 16 00:44
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schestowitzNopeJul 16 00:46
schestowitzI don't feed DavidS. He seems deranged.Jul 16 01:21
schestowitzSo many trolls todayJul 16 01:21
schestowitzLike 200+ commentsJul 16 01:21
**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 16 01:31:04 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovell-socialJul 16 01:31
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged]Jul 16 01:31
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social set by schestowitz at Mon Mar 16 02:04:07 2009Jul 16 01:31
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDBkB_0xdz4Jul 16 01:37
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=at8kdzJdrjs&NR=1Jul 16 01:46
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MinceRi advise not buying dell crap, ever. but i guess i'm late with that. :>Jul 16 06:39
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trmancoddos?Jul 16 09:53
trmancobn is a little slowJul 16 09:53
schestowitzYes, I noticedJul 16 09:53
schestowitzGive it timeJul 16 09:54
trmancohttp://www.milw0rm.com/exploits/9160Jul 16 09:57
trmancowow, on exploit to rule them allJul 16 09:58
trmancoone*Jul 16 09:58
trmancobut here is the catchJul 16 09:58
trmancoPatch availability :Jul 16 09:58
trmanco~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Jul 16 09:58
trmanco- Mozilla : Fixed in Firefox 3.0.5 and 2.0.0.19Jul 16 09:58
trmancohttps://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=460713Jul 16 09:58
trmanco- Apple iPhone&iPod : patchedJul 16 09:58
trmanco- IE : No patch for IE5, IE6, IE7, IE8 until IE9Jul 16 09:58
trmanco- Webkit : Patched in r41741 - https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23319Jul 16 09:58
trmanco- Chrome : Patched, unknown which version)Jul 16 09:58
trmanco- Opera : Patched after version 9.64Jul 16 09:58
trmanco>> - IE : No patch for IE5, IE6, IE7, IE8 until IE9Jul 16 09:58
trmancohahaJul 16 09:58
schestowitzMicrosoft to deliver the only patch that takes down WindowsJul 16 09:59
schestowitzFans unable to boot up their Wintendo boxes after a forced UpdateJul 16 09:59
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MinceRit's pretty mean towards Nintendo to call winblows boxes thatJul 16 11:24
schestowitzI know, I know...Jul 16 12:10
schestowitzThey can sue meJul 16 12:10
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trmancoLOLJul 16 13:16
trmancowintendo is not a trademark, is it?Jul 16 13:16
schestowitzHeavy load...   Jul 16 14:00
schestowitz  1:59.18 puppetd            Jul 16 14:00
schestowitz 6376 apache    16   0  252m  36m 4608 S  6.0  3.6   0:43.12 httpd              Jul 16 14:00
schestowitz 9474 apache    15   0  249m  34m 3504 S  6.0  3.3Jul 16 14:00
*fewa has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out))Jul 16 16:33
schestowitzSorry to hear about wallc having probs with Ubuntu. Well, it's statistics. Probability of Windows going AWOL is higher.Jul 16 21:23
schestowitzThe trolls might scoop that up to use against UbuntuJul 16 21:23
schestowitzYou'll seeJul 16 21:23
schestowitzUSPS goes open-source with tracking system http://gcn.com/Articles/2009/07/13/Update2-USPS-open-source-Product-Tracking-System.aspxJul 16 21:35
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schestowitzServer not respondingJul 17 12:15
schestowitz,  load average: 24.42, 13.55, 6.1Jul 17 12:15
fewaeekJul 17 12:16
schestowitzCould be anything. it's stablising nowJul 17 12:19
schestowitz"I am Not Afraid..." :-)Jul 17 12:19
schestowitzLike the bannerJul 17 12:19
schestowitzWe keep growing. Some days over 10k unique IPsJul 17 12:21
fewatry htopJul 17 12:21
fewahttp://htop.sourceforge.net/ also integrates strace with sJul 17 12:22
trmancoI use thatJul 17 12:23
fewaand tree with 't'Jul 17 12:23
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schestowitz> Roy, you mentioned donations to help with BN expenses...Jul 17 15:05
schestowitz> > Jul 17 15:05
schestowitz> > What about putting some BN things on cafe press or zazzle? Jul 17 15:05
schestowitzI don't know if it pays. I could ask Pam..Jul 17 15:05
schestowitzShould we maybe do this?Jul 17 15:05
schestowitzHow about if we said, "support the boycott of Novell... buy and wear the tshirt"Jul 17 15:06
schestowitzTrademarks asideJul 17 15:06
schestowitzWe can get around thatJul 17 15:06
trmancofan t-shirts -PJul 17 15:07
trmancohahaJul 17 15:07
trmancothat would be niceJul 17 15:07
schestowitzShall we do it?Jul 17 15:07
trmancowell, I'm saying that we shouldn'tJul 17 15:08
trmancoI'm not*Jul 17 15:08
trmancobut would other people think about thisJul 17 15:08
trmancomaybe a pollJul 17 15:08
trmancoto see who is really interestedJul 17 15:08
trmancobut what would*Jul 17 15:08
trmanco;)Jul 17 15:09
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/02/08/ms-sins-and-offences/Jul 17 15:11
*tacone (n=Adium@151.82.24.127) has joined #boycottnovell-socialJul 17 15:12
taconeit may put you under accuse of writing just for moneyJul 17 15:12
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schestowitzI knowJul 17 15:12
taconeunless you do it completely free and can prove thatJul 17 15:12
trmancoyes, there are always these downturnsJul 17 15:13
trmancothat's the problemJul 17 15:13
schestowitzIn theory, although I make no money, this is not illegalJul 17 15:13
schestowitzPeople who are activists against bad things can find ways to pay billJul 17 15:13
taconeso, if you plan to make money, even if just to support the site, be prepared to be backslashedJul 17 15:13
schestowitz*llsJul 17 15:13
schestowitzLike GroklawJul 17 15:13
taconeif you do it free and can prove it, be prepared just to the usual round of liesJul 17 15:14
schestowitzYou could say that donations and sales come from SCO critqueJul 17 15:14
trmancoit's sorta like the pirate bay t-shirts :-PJul 17 15:23
schestowitzBut they did something illegitimateJul 17 15:25
schestowitzFile-sharing of some copyrighted contentJul 17 15:25
schestowitzBN is not the sameJul 17 15:25
trmancoyeah, but I wasn't referring to that partJul 17 15:27
taconeon the other handJul 17 15:27
taconesome funny t-shirt would be niceJul 17 15:27
taconenothing like boycott this or that+Jul 17 15:27
taconefind some nice joke.Jul 17 15:27
taconeM**nlight. Eat it well, it's good for your character is pretty cool.Jul 17 15:27
taconethe trademark may be worked around with asterisks or alternative spellings.Jul 17 15:28
taconea MoNoooo! t-shirt may also be cool.Jul 17 15:28
trmancom00nlightJul 17 15:28
fewasatire is a protected actJul 17 15:37
taconeonly when it doesn't refer to virginJul 17 15:37
taconevirginsJul 17 15:37
fewatrademarks only cover when your product may be reasonably confused with anothers product, or otherwise water down their trademarksJul 17 15:37
taconewe all know it's the virgin joke that keeps girls to contribute to the open sourceJul 17 15:38
fewahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_v._FrankenJul 17 15:39
fewaFox News Channel, the plaintiff, sought to enjoin Al Franken from using Fox's trademark phrase "fair and balanced" in the title of his then-forthcoming book, Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them: A Fair and Balanced Look at the Right.Jul 17 15:39
fewaIn response, Franken joked that he had trademarked the word "funny", and that Fox had infringed his intellectual property rights by characterizing him as "unfunny."Jul 17 15:40
MinceRhow did they allow fox to trademark "fair and balanced"?Jul 17 15:59
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fewathat very question was asked by the judgeJul 17 16:25
MinceR:DJul 17 16:26
fewawhich is one of the reasons they dropped the suit so quickJul 17 16:26
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schestowitzSomeone says: "putting a small "donate" button somewhere on your site might help a little too. "Jul 17 17:52
schestowitzI doubt people donate much these daysJul 17 17:52
taconeme tooJul 17 17:53
taconebut it could have less backslashes than the t-shirtsJul 17 17:53
schestowitzBMW to ride in with 115-mile range e-scooter? http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2009/07/16/bmw_preps_e_scooter/Jul 17 18:03
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schestowitz"When they try the 'saturate' phase or personal attacks, you know thatJul 17 19:12
schestowitzit's time for more links like you did in this comment:Jul 17 19:12
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/17/vista-7-is-vaporware-admission/#comment-70432Jul 17 19:12
schestowitzI see some more churn about Bing but can't find the old article aboutJul 17 19:12
schestowitzhow the claim on increased use was an bunch of sock puppets blowing airJul 17 19:12
schestowitzabout a small spike.  Wolfram Alpha's success must really be twistingJul 17 19:12
schestowitzBill's tail."Jul 17 19:12
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Fri Jul 17 21:56:36 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovell-socialJul 17 21:56
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged]Jul 17 21:56
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social set by schestowitz at Mon Mar 16 02:04:07 2009Jul 17 21:56
*You are now known as schestowitzJul 17 21:58
schestowitzDid I miss anything here or the main channel?Jul 17 21:59
schestowitzThere was a system crash. Haven't check the causeJul 17 21:59
trmancohere noJul 17 22:25
trmancosystem crashJul 17 22:26
trmancowowJul 17 22:26
trmancoI haven't had one of those since 7.10 and it was XJul 17 22:26
schestowitzI had one last month (GPU)Jul 17 22:30
schestowitzNo idea if it's the GPU again. Cursor movedJul 17 22:30
schestowitzEevrything else did nothing. Just curosr hoveringJul 17 22:30
schestowitzSo similar to last timeJul 17 22:30
schestowitzNo overheat in GPUJul 17 22:30
trmancosomething to do with XJul 17 22:30
trmancomaybe running too long :-PJul 17 22:31
trmanco300 days?Jul 17 22:31
schestowitz Not reallyJul 18 01:04
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trmanco"I can only imagine the violent anti-FSF reaction and hate this will generate (or is probably already generating?) on various forums.Jul 18 09:25
trmancoAnything that RMS or the FSF says is usually grounded in solid logic. Everybody would be wise to at least consider it.Jul 18 09:25
trmancoAs for me personally, and the businesses I am involved with, I would avoid Mono.Jul 18 09:25
trmancoWhich really saddens me because I like Mono. The language is better than Java, the implementation starts faster, it feels more lightweight, it supports static compilation, etc.Jul 18 09:25
trmancoI have been on the receiving end of an IP-related lawsuit and it is an experience which one never forgets."Jul 18 09:25
trmancohttp://lwn.net/Articles/341947/Jul 18 09:25
trmancohttp://lwn.net/Articles/341771/ here is the articleJul 18 09:27
trmancohttp://discuss.itwire.com/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=14637Jul 18 09:27
trmancosee thisJul 18 09:27
fewa<HivenGlaven> is MutexJul 18 11:33
fewaCPE-143-238-84-56.nsw.bigpond.net.au.Jul 18 11:34
fewablock 143.238.*.*Jul 18 11:35
fewaschestowitz,Jul 18 11:35
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fewaschestowitz,Jul 18 12:32
fewaguess he left....Jul 18 12:32
schestowitzJust got backJul 18 12:40
schestowitzI'll back himJul 18 12:40
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trmancolittleyoy is from bigpindJul 18 20:47
trmancobigpond*Jul 18 20:47
trmancoschestowitz,Jul 18 20:47
trmanco[littleyoy] (i=8fee5438@gateway/web/freenode/x-3eb721dcb662728a): CPE-143-238-84-56.nsw.bigpond.net.au/143.238.84.56Jul 18 20:48
trmancotangles is him againJul 18 20:50
trmanco[tangles_] (i=8fee5438@gateway/web/freenode/x-aa15f97b293654e0): CPE-143-238-84-56.nsw.bigpond.net.au/143.238.84.56Jul 18 20:50
trmancoexactly the same ip adressJul 18 20:51
trmancoaddress*Jul 18 20:51
MinceRindeedJul 18 20:51
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*cftysdfg is now known as fewaJul 18 21:14
fewayou have to block *@143.238.*.*Jul 18 21:15
MinceRalso *!?=8fee????@*Jul 18 21:15
fewaschestowitz,Jul 18 21:16
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schestowitzDavid contacts me. Jul 19 04:05
schestowitz"Hi David,Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzLet me keep it short because it's 4am here (upgraded the Web site and tired now)...Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzI swear to you that I did not send anyone to get you. That's just a fact.Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzThe whole thing has taken in vain a lot of of time (yours and mine) and the culprit that initiated this lied shamelessly to get off the hook.Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzI've no interest in exchanging punches online; trust me, I don't. I was falsely accused from the start and it went downhll from there.Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzWhat do you want to do? None of us will benefit from more waste of time."Jul 19 04:06
schestowitzJust threatsJul 19 04:06
schestowitzPlaying tough, still...Jul 19 04:06
*fewa (n=fewa@97-126-29-73.tukw.qwest.net) has joined #boycottnovell-socialJul 19 05:03
schestowitz"I'm still logged into the BN IRC.  Been checking it periodically to catch up on the conversation.  What a hoot. Jul 19 08:58
schestowitzAnyway, I didn't want to bother you when you and tessier were doing the upgrade, but I saw you ask earlier for help with the "Troll" wiki.  Is there anything I can do to help? Jul 19 08:58
schestowitz"Jul 19 08:58
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schestowitz==Jul 19 11:11
schestowitz"Thanks for the recent java post. MS is having lots of proxiesJul 19 11:11
schestowitz> really push C# in an apparent attempt to drown out discussions whereJul 19 11:11
schestowitz> Java is the obvious choice."Jul 19 11:11
schestowitz"> My account for Boycottnovell wiki does not work with the wordpressJul 19 11:12
schestowitz> interface and I see no links on the wordpress interface to create a newJul 19 11:12
schestowitz> account."Jul 19 11:12
fewahttp://slopsbox.com/readJul 19 12:40
trmanco"Microsoft Windows tcpip.sys IGMP local stack buffer overrun (July 2009)Jul 19 13:13
trmanco---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Jul 19 13:13
trmancoIn the shape I post this here there is no privilege escalation at all, but itJul 19 13:13
trmancoseems there must be something wrong in the IP stack implementation of ms windowsJul 19 13:13
trmancoso I just want to inform you.Jul 19 13:13
trmanco"Jul 19 13:13
trmanco"The attached code will crash any windows system, means XP, Vista andJul 19 13:13
trmanco2000 with a Blue Screen."Jul 19 13:13
trmancololJul 19 13:13
schestowitzWhat's the secret packet?Jul 19 13:14
schestowitzBack to winnuke.exeJul 19 13:15
trmancololJul 19 13:16
fewaniceJul 19 13:43
trmancoit's local for nowJul 19 13:44
trmancobut it might get remote :-PJul 19 13:44
trmancoand you have to be admin, where windows in normal cases always gives you an admin accountJul 19 13:44
fewao_OJul 19 13:44
fewathen not big dealJul 19 13:45
fewahave you seen the vista 7 kill videosJul 19 13:45
fewaif you can execute code on vista 7 you can trash the systemJul 19 13:45
trmancoyes it is, you see, if someone were to use some privilege escalation exploit and then use this one or an evolution of this exploit then it will be really badJul 19 13:45
trmancofor those people who have non admin accountsJul 19 13:46
trmancohahaJul 19 13:46
trmancoit's always like that, same with vistaJul 19 13:46
trmancoI remember crashing vista with simple keyboard shortcutsJul 19 13:46
fewalots of security theatre, little securityJul 19 13:48
schestowitzVista 7 is VIsta wrt securityJul 19 13:56
schestowitzSame engine/sJul 19 13:56
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fewawait...Jul 19 15:56
fewawhy are binaries copyrightable?Jul 19 15:57
fewathey are not creative express, like source code isJul 19 15:57
fewathey are purely functionalJul 19 15:57
schestowitzYeah.. see EPO satireJul 19 15:59
fewaand creativity is those things that only a human can doJul 19 15:59
fewaif a computer can do something (and not mearly by chance) it is not creativeJul 19 15:59
schestowitzNothing is ceativeJul 19 16:00
schestowitzCreation is a better wordJul 19 16:00
schestowitzAssembling ideas and matterJul 19 16:00
fewa"creativity"Jul 19 16:00
schestowitzMehJul 19 16:00
schestowitzaka constructionJul 19 16:00
fewastil that is what defines copyright lawJul 19 16:00
fewaactuallyJul 19 16:01
fewaonly "respective Writings"Jul 19 16:01
fewaits only copyrightable it is a "writings"Jul 19 16:01
fewaor patentable if it is a "discovery"Jul 19 16:01
fewa(in the US)Jul 19 16:02
fewahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_ClauseJul 19 16:03
fewalink on satire?Jul 19 16:06
schestowitzFunny how David links to the gang of libeling Microsoft trolls from COLAJul 19 16:28
schestowitzhaha. He found friends...Jul 19 16:28
schestowitzALso in LinsuxJul 19 16:28
schestowitzLet David speak... :-) He makes a fool out of himself, for the logJul 19 16:47
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taconewho's lefty ?Jul 19 17:01
trmancoschestowitz, foeJul 19 17:28
trmancoschestowitz's*Jul 19 17:28
taconelolJul 19 17:28
taconelet them talkJul 19 17:28
taconenobody feds them.Jul 19 17:28
taconeexcept me, i replied 2-3 times for good reasonsJul 19 17:28
taconeI just want the logs of this thing.Jul 19 17:29
*tacone has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))Jul 19 17:47
trmanco...Jul 19 17:48
fewaHivenGlaven == _Mutex_Jul 19 18:15
trmancoyeahJul 19 18:16
trmancoteddy1Jul 19 18:16
fewamannaged to get on another netblockJul 19 18:17
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fewaso stupid to keep an old nick....Jul 19 18:17
tacone?Jul 19 18:18
fewahe used the HivenGlaven before, _Mutex_ that isJul 19 18:18
fewaso many trolls....Jul 19 18:20
fewamake it a zooJul 19 18:20
taconetrolls are less afraid when they troll in groupJul 19 18:21
fewabut they make themselves look like idiotsJul 19 18:21
fewagroupthinkJul 19 18:21
taconei'm gonna post the logJul 19 18:22
taconewell i'm still thinking about thatJul 19 18:23
fewawe need a admin to be aroud while schestowitz is goneJul 19 18:38
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trmancowhere can you get a cloakJul 19 18:45
trmancounaffiliated <-Jul 19 18:45
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desu#freenodeJul 19 18:46
trmancothey just give one to you?Jul 19 18:47
desu_yes, ask for a cloakJul 19 18:48
desu_<fewa> we need a admin to be aroud while schestowitz is gone <--- i agree :/Jul 19 18:49
desu_lefty is trolling the fuck out of that chan :/Jul 19 18:49
trmancobut it's only for freenode right?Jul 19 18:49
desu_muttley should stop feeding the trolls D:Jul 19 18:49
desu_trmanco: yes...Jul 19 18:49
trmancook thanksJul 19 18:49
desu_for other networks, generally /hs request <vhost>Jul 19 18:49
trmancoI currently don't need one, I was just askingJul 19 18:50
trmancohs?Jul 19 18:50
desu_hostservJul 19 18:51
desu_kinda like nickserv and chanservJul 19 18:51
fewadesu_, thats a client shortcutJul 19 18:51
desu_fewa: nopeJul 19 18:51
trmancoahJul 19 18:51
fewathe actual command is /msg hostserv requestJul 19 18:51
desu_that's an actual server-side commandJul 19 18:51
desu_try it on the networks which have a hostservJul 19 18:51
desu_do this:Jul 19 18:51
desu_/quote hs helpJul 19 18:51
fewahmmJul 19 18:51
desu_or try this on freenode:Jul 19 18:51
desu_/quote ns helpJul 19 18:52
desu_someone REALLY needs to tell muttley to stop feeding the trolls ¬_¬Jul 19 18:52
fewai didJul 19 18:54
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Chips_B_MalroyHello allJul 19 19:11
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trmancomaybe assin por ops to the channelJul 19 19:48
trmancoassign*Jul 19 19:48
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taconeschestowitz: here ?Jul 19 19:49
trmancono there ->Jul 19 19:49
trmancohe might be here to, but he is active on the other sideJul 19 19:49
fewai think MinceR should be opJul 19 19:52
fewa*troll saberJul 19 19:52
fewa(if he wants it_Jul 19 19:53
fewanot pwr seeking _Hicham_Jul 19 19:53
taconeschestowitz: should the happening be blogged about ?Jul 19 19:54
fewaWTW?Jul 19 19:54
trmancoohJul 19 19:54
trmancohiven glaven another trollJul 19 19:55
fewayarpJul 19 19:55
fewa_Mutex)Jul 19 19:55
fewahe hasnt said anything for a whileJul 19 19:55
trmancobe he was blabbering crap when lefty was thereJul 19 19:56
trmancobutJul 19 19:56
trmancohe probably fell asleepJul 19 19:56
fewanahJul 19 19:56
schestowitztacone: he'd claim we provokeJul 19 19:59
schestowitztrmanco: yes, several of themJul 19 19:59
schestowitzThey are bottom-feedersJul 19 19:59
schestowitz40 people in the channel on a  SundayJul 19 19:59
taconeit's not about him claiming, but about the legal situationJul 19 19:59
schestowitzSOme from his buddies at linsuxJul 19 20:00
taconewould that make things worse for you ?Jul 19 20:00
schestowitzHe barksJul 19 20:00
trmancowof wofJul 19 20:00
schestowitzNo bite, and I would countersue if he triedJul 19 20:00
trmancogrrrrrr!Jul 19 20:00
schestowitzHe tried this on others beforeJul 19 20:00
schestowitzLegal intimidation to manipulateJul 19 20:01
schestowitzThere should be laws against itJul 19 20:01
fewathere areJul 19 20:01
fewawell...Jul 19 20:01
fewaSLAPPJul 19 20:01
taconei'll still think about it, and maybe blog some bit, then.Jul 19 20:01
fewathats when its actually filedJul 19 20:01
fewahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_lawsuit_against_public_participationJul 19 20:01
fewaschestowitz, moreover, if there was a law against it, how would you go about enforcing it?Jul 19 20:17
fewalaw against legal threatsJul 19 20:17
schestowitzThat's the thingJul 19 20:21
schestowitzLitigious societies are poison, as are psychopathsJul 19 20:21
schestowitzThe Web is increasingly being filled witht hemJul 19 20:21
fewaand anti-SLAPP laws protect you from such threatsJul 19 20:21
fewaalong with the first amendmentJul 19 20:21
fewa(i know you are not in the US)Jul 19 20:22
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trmancochildish actsJul 19 21:51
trmanco...Jul 19 21:51
trmancoschestowitz, linxer is himJul 19 21:52
trmancoI thinkJul 19 21:52
schestowitzSee IPs in hexJul 19 21:53
trmancoso he nymshifts now aJul 19 21:53
trmanco?Jul 19 21:53
trmancohex?Jul 19 21:53
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schestowitztacone1: Jul 19 23:45
schestowitzServer not responding at allJul 19 23:45
tacone1?Jul 19 23:45
tacone1i seeJul 19 23:45
schestowitzJust minutes after I had banned the trollJul 19 23:45
schestowitzNo idea if it's relatedJul 19 23:46
tacone1ehehe, wondering the same thingJul 19 23:46
tacone1of course it's impossible to proveJul 19 23:47
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schestowitzCan you do me a favour?Jul 20 00:18
schestowitzI'm going to sleep, but tessier (the admin) will probaly pop in cause I paged him. Tell him the site (server) is downJul 20 00:18
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schestowitzPlease tell tessier to fix it when he shows up. Might be out somewhere, but I paged himJul 20 00:29
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trmanco"Dear Reader,Jul 20 08:17
trmancoIn 48 hours, the anti-sec movement will publicly unveil working exploit codeJul 20 08:17
trmancoand full details for the zero-day OpenSSH vulnerability we discovered. ItJul 20 08:17
trmancowill be posted to the Full-Disclosure security list."Jul 20 08:17
trmancoLOLJul 20 08:17
trmancothat's from the anti-sec movementJul 20 08:17
schestowitz"movement"Jul 20 08:19
schestowitzReliable source?Jul 20 08:20
schestowitzIf not, then it's a whisper campaign, or FUDJul 20 08:20
schestowitzBeen done before (blob vendors calling openssh "commie" and stuff)Jul 20 08:20
trmancofrom the people that "hacked" imageshackJul 20 08:27
trmancobut it also might be a fakeJul 20 08:28
trmancosome dummy is faking anti-sec messagesJul 20 08:28
trmancothey are against full disclosure but they are going to release a 0-day exploitJul 20 08:28
trmancoin 48 hoursJul 20 08:29
trmancoit's for openssh <=5.2Jul 20 08:29
trmancoso, all versionsJul 20 08:29
schestowitz"Sect"Jul 20 08:29
schestowitzImageshack was not a zero-day as much as a site design flaw AFAIKJul 20 08:30
schestowitzLike hacking some Windows server... not being the same as finding a bug as much as using an off-the-shelf exploitJul 20 08:30
trmancoyeah, I knowJul 20 08:31
schestowitzI'll do COLA posts shortlyJul 20 08:32
schestowitzBeen kept busy by the intimidations mudJul 20 08:32
schestowitzNot the first time, eitherJul 20 08:32
schestowitzIf you get to them, then the flatfishs of the world stop harassing youJul 20 08:33
schestowitzLike mailing your bosses, threatening without actually doing anything, saying that "horrible things will happen'Jul 20 08:33
schestowitzBeen like this for 3 years...Jul 20 08:33
trmanco:|Jul 20 08:35
schestowitzActivists FTWJul 20 08:36
trmancobblJul 20 08:39
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trmancobackJul 20 12:12
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schestowitz"Great work keeping on top of everything.  You might want to add links toJul 20 13:11
schestowitz Rhythmbox and Digikam in this article:Jul 20 13:11
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/19/f-spot-banshee-dep/Jul 20 13:11
schestowitzShow the real deal each time the Amherst blankets are offered.Jul 20 13:11
schestowitzMight want to configure the spellchecker or something else as anJul 20 13:11
schestowitzautomatic reminder."Jul 20 13:11
schestowitzI always forget to suggest some remedies. It's time consumingJul 20 13:11
trmancouse both wordpress' spellchecker and firefox'sJul 20 13:21
fewa"Monopoly corrupts. Absolute monopoly corrupts absolutely."Jul 20 13:25
fewa:PJul 20 13:25
trmancotacone, just registered myselfJul 20 13:26
trmancoI prefer email to forumsJul 20 13:26
trmancoa mailing list would be better IMOJul 20 13:26
taconetrmanco: maybe some plugin to watch threads may be goodJul 20 13:27
trmancorss feed to email? :-PJul 20 13:27
taconei should say bbpress is very nice as a forum. less bloated and more functional of phpbb, vbulletin and othersJul 20 13:27
trmancoI prefer smfJul 20 13:28
trmancoeven though it's not really "free software"Jul 20 13:28
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schestowitzfewa: sounds familiar. :-)Jul 20 14:40
schestowitzBTW, David is a bully with history. Former victims of his sent me evidence. He is like a racketeer, so please don't reply to him.Jul 20 14:41
trmancoschestowitz, how did he get that email of you and fink?Jul 20 14:44
trmancoI always wondered thisJul 20 14:44
schestowitzMaybe it was a baitJul 20 14:44
trmancothe one he exposedJul 20 14:44
trmancoyeahJul 20 14:44
trmancoI though about that tooJul 20 14:44
schestowitzHe excluded contextJul 20 14:44
trmancothought*Jul 20 14:44
schestowitzDuhJul 20 14:44
trmancoyesJul 20 14:44
schestowitzDaemonisationJul 20 14:44
schestowitzLike RMSJul 20 14:45
schestowitzI am flattered to be one among two, the other bring RMSJul 20 14:45
trmancobut the question still remains, how the heck did he get the conversation between you and "Fink"Jul 20 14:45
schestowitz*beingJul 20 14:45
schestowitztrmanco: thretened to sue himJul 20 14:45
trmancofink?Jul 20 14:45
schestowitzThat's his antics on he InternetJul 20 14:45
schestowitzYesJul 20 14:45
schestowitzMegalomaniacJul 20 14:45
trmancohe also threatened you tooJul 20 14:45
schestowitzThat's what mental patient institutes should be forJul 20 14:46
schestowitztrmanco: not just meJul 20 14:46
schestowitzMany peopleJul 20 14:46
trmancoI seeJul 20 14:46
schestowitzFloods my E-mail with 'love letters'Jul 20 14:47
trmancow00tJul 20 14:48
trmancodo you make you emails publicJul 20 14:48
trmanco?Jul 20 14:48
trmancoI would love to read some :-PJul 20 14:48
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schestowitzNot nowJul 20 14:52
trmancookJul 20 14:54
schestowitzWowJul 20 15:00
schestowitzYou should see those E_mails...Jul 20 15:00
schestowitzOne day you will.Jul 20 15:00
trmancoLOLJul 20 15:02
trmancoreally? how? :-PJul 20 15:02
schestowitznmJul 20 15:05
schestowitzHe made death threats to peopleJul 20 15:10
trmancowowJul 20 15:13
trmancowhat does "nm" mean?Jul 20 15:13
trmancoshort shorter for "nym" :-PJul 20 15:13
schestowitz"never mind"Jul 20 15:25
trmancookJul 20 15:26
trmancoit would be nice to show the comment count in the rss feedJul 20 16:12
trmanco:-PJul 20 16:12
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schestowitzI think we're DDOSed nowJul 20 17:43
schestowitzIt's DDoSJul 20 17:56
schestowitzBugger them.. still trying to silence usJul 20 17:56
schestowitzDying out a bitJul 20 18:08
schestowitzI should say it off the record, but this is emotionally exhausting. Thanks guys for encouraging the work on this site. I do it because I care about loyal readers and it is far from easy with all the abuseJul 20 18:09
trmanco:)Jul 20 18:09
schestowitzFreedom of speech  is a joke when one gets harassed for exercising itJul 20 18:14
schestowitzThey make running a blog feel like warzone.Jul 20 19:07
schestowitzYou ought to have seen COLA in 2007.Jul 20 19:07
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trmancoschestowitz, please upgradeJul 20 20:40
trmanco2.8.1 has a security flawJul 20 20:40
trmancoin the comment system, XSS attack btwJul 20 20:40
schestowitzAh, so this is seriousJul 20 20:41
schestowitzDoes it require disabling all plugins or whatever?Jul 20 20:41
trmancoI've upgraded my 2 blogs without a glitchJul 20 20:43
trmancoall plugins *should* work without a problemJul 20 20:43
trmancojust go to tool and upgrade automaticallyJul 20 20:43
trmancotools*Jul 20 20:43
trmancobut back up first :-PJul 20 20:43
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schestowitzwhen tessier is back we'll do itJul 20 20:55
trmancookJul 20 20:55
schestowitzautomatic upgrade needs FTP workingJul 20 20:55
schestowitzDoes work for meJul 20 20:55
trmancohe better come back fastJul 20 20:55
trmancoTHe vuln exploit hasn't been published yetJul 20 20:56
trmancobut it might soonJul 20 20:56
schestowitzI can do it myselfJul 20 20:57
schestowitz3 blogsJul 20 20:57
trmancoit goes very smooth :-PJul 20 20:58
schestowitzOnly if you do autoupgradeJul 20 21:03
trmancoyeahJul 20 21:03
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schestowitzhttp://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2009-07-20-017-35-OS-CY-0004 "That amazes me, too. I posted a single comment on BoycottNovell and between 8:24AM and 2:39PM I got 18 emails in my inbox, all from a guy named "Lefty", who is one of the worst astroturfers on BN."Jul 21 09:49
taconeomgJul 21 09:53
taconei can't believe that.Jul 21 09:53
taconei guess he talks about comment notifications, not direct emailsJul 21 09:53
schestowitzDirectJul 21 09:55
schestowitzThe guy at hand is psychoticJul 21 09:55
schestowitzDeath threats and allJul 21 09:55
schestowitzArmed and dangerousJul 21 09:56
schestowitzDr. Stallman was warnedJul 21 09:56
schestowitzNot by meJul 21 09:56
schestowitzBeen doing this since 1994Jul 21 09:56
schestowitzThanks a lot. In a couple of days, assuming no trolling, we'll be back on track with rapid posting pace.Jul 21 10:04
schestowitz*Sigh*Jul 21 10:05
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schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccReLF6M62YJul 21 12:51
trmancowhat it the 3 E's?Jul 21 13:04
trmancowhat are*Jul 21 13:04
trmancoembrace,extend,extinguish?Jul 21 13:05
trmancoor extend,embrace,extinguish?Jul 21 13:05
MinceR142434 < trmanco> embrace,extend,extinguish?Jul 21 13:05
MinceRthat's the oneJul 21 13:05
trmancoah, okJul 21 13:11
trmancothanksJul 21 13:11
MinceRnpJul 21 13:11
trmancohttp://codemonkey.org.uk/junk/hv.diffJul 21 13:19
trmancoand there you have itJul 21 13:20
trmanco"Given the numerous cleanup patches that already exist, is there any reasonJul 21 13:21
trmancoto not just post the cleaned up drivers ?  It would certainly be moreJul 21 13:21
trmancoreviewable than the current pile."Jul 21 13:21
trmancomessy code as usualJul 21 13:21
trmancono wonder their software is pure shitJul 21 13:21
MinceRwhy even consider adding code that's specific to one hypervisor?Jul 21 13:22
trmancoI have no ideaJul 21 13:22
trmancoit's part of microsft's plan to embraceJul 21 13:23
trmancothen, extend and extinguishJul 21 13:23
schestowitzAye]Jul 21 13:23
schestowitzPost about it coming... :-DJul 21 13:23
schestowitzJust been harvesting supporting opinions for a day ! Jul 21 13:24
trmancoschestowitz, you will be called a anti-Microsoft zealot for thatJul 21 13:24
trmancoyou'll seeJul 21 13:24
schestowitztrmanco: no...Jul 21 13:24
schestowitzThat's why I wait for others to speakJul 21 13:24
trmancoahJul 21 13:24
schestowitzSo I can show it's groupthinkJul 21 13:24
trmancogroklaw has a good pointJul 21 13:24
schestowitzI told InfoWorld about itJul 21 13:24
schestowitzGently.Jul 21 13:24
schestowitzBecause they do respect my take on it and I don't want to be seen as "hard-liner'Jul 21 13:25
trmanco:-)Jul 21 13:25
MinceRthen they'll accuse the groupthink of zealotryJul 21 13:25
schestowitzNoJul 21 13:28
schestowitzI have infoworls supportJul 21 13:28
schestowitzKeneddyJul 21 13:28
schestowitzKennedy Jul 21 13:28
MinceRm$ zealots call anyone who disagrees with them zealotsJul 21 13:28
MinceRthey believe this way they can somehow avert attention from their zealotryJul 21 13:29
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trmancoYou must be logged in to post a comment. :|Jul 21 15:00
trmancosee -> http://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/21/microsoft-linux-v-patch/#comment-71018Jul 21 15:01
trmancoeven though you waited, you still get attackedJul 21 15:01
schestowitzYes, but I monitor his behaviour. He knowsJul 21 15:06
schestowitzSo they are more restrainedJul 21 15:06
schestowitzWatch what happened to Lefty's 3 nymsJul 21 15:06
schestowitzAfter two bans he became politeJul 21 15:06
taconethis is total out of my headJul 21 15:11
taconetotallyJul 21 15:11
taconebut why should a troll become polite ? they either insult or leave.Jul 21 15:11
taconeunless they have some kind of incentive to stay and keep commentingJul 21 15:12
trmancololJul 21 15:48
trmancowong posted something on colaJul 21 15:48
trmancohttp://armchairtheorist.com/2009/07/21/the-curious-case-of-boycott-novell/Jul 21 15:48
schestowitzWell, COLA had MS employees there before but I don't know about TEsJul 21 15:49
trmancopinguin pete isn't in irc is he?Jul 21 15:51
schestowitzHaha.Jul 21 15:51
schestowitzLinks to Linsux for supportJul 21 15:51
schestowitzHe only publicises usJul 21 15:51
trmanco...Jul 21 15:53
trmancotrolls can't distinguish them selvesJul 21 15:53
schestowitzHehe.Jul 21 15:53
schestowitzMicrosoft employees confronted /us/Jul 21 15:54
schestowitzNot the other way aroundJul 21 15:54
schestowitzHe came to our territoryJul 21 15:54
trmancosee the commentJul 21 15:54
trmancoit has trackback from twitterJul 21 15:54
trmancosJul 21 15:54
schestowitzMany attempts to delegitimise us recentlyJul 21 15:56
schestowitzSame with the FSFJul 21 15:56
schestowitzBecause they stand in their wayJul 21 15:56
schestowitzI am not replying to our main troll anymore. If you don't support my judgment never to reply to him again, holler. :-)Jul 21 16:12
trmancololJul 21 16:18
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Diablo-D3oh haiJul 21 20:59
Diablo-D3schestowitz: name microsoft blogsJul 21 20:59
desuand that one comment i made to piss off lefty is now back to bite my ass >>Jul 21 20:59
desu*>.>Jul 21 21:00
Diablo-D3name lots of themJul 21 21:00
Diablo-D3I have the urge to piss in someone's cheeriosJul 21 21:00
schestowitzdesu: don't feed himJul 21 21:01
schestowitzHe's dangerousJul 21 21:01
desuyeah, i guess so...Jul 21 21:01
schestowitzTrust meJul 21 21:01
desuhe's a regular at another IRC network i'm on, though...Jul 21 21:01
Diablo-D3schestowitz: dude, you're dangerousJul 21 21:01
Diablo-D3why else would microsoft give a shit what you sayJul 21 21:01
schestowitzI'm friendlyJul 21 21:02
Diablo-D3not to them you're not :DJul 21 21:02
MinceRthe truth is dangerous to themJul 21 21:02
Diablo-D3ergo, give me microsoft oriented blog urlsJul 21 21:02
schestowitzYou don't know what I meant by "Dangerous"Jul 21 21:02
Diablo-D3I have some cheerios to piss inJul 21 21:02
schestowitzIn the literal senseJul 21 21:02
schestowitzDiablo-D3: enough, pleaseJul 21 21:03
Diablo-D3schestowitz: I do not have a criminal record.Jul 21 21:03
Diablo-D3You should not imply I have one eitherJul 21 21:03
schestowitzI never didJul 21 21:03
Diablo-D3then how do you mean dangerous in the literal senseJul 21 21:04
schestowitzHonduras, Washington and Latin America: Doctor Jekyll and Mr. Good Neighbor < http://upsidedownworld.org/main/content/view/1978/1/ >Jul 21 21:06
schestowitzNot you, Diablo-D3lJul 21 21:06
*Diablo-D3 facepalmsJul 21 21:07
Diablo-D3schestowitz: you need to learn how to use irc.Jul 21 21:07
schestowitz<Balrog> please don't use '/the/ Ukraine' ; the 'the' isn't necessary, and those of us who are of Ukrainian heritage don't really like it.Jul 21 22:08
schestowitzI didn't knowJul 21 22:08
Diablo-D3english sorta requires it thoughJul 21 22:25
Diablo-D3"I'm from Ukraine" doesn't work right in English.Jul 21 22:25
MinceRworksformeJul 21 22:45
trmancohey heyJul 21 23:36
trmancolook what I've foundJul 21 23:36
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trmanco   From:     Jim AlichinJul 21 23:38
trmanco   Sent:     Wednesday, January 07, 2004 8:40 AMJul 21 23:38
trmanco   To:       Eric RudderJul 21 23:38
trmanco   Subject:  EW: losing our way...Jul 21 23:38
trmancoFyi: In the spirit of sharing my deep concerns, etc. Please don’t forward.Jul 21 23:38
trmancojimJul 21 23:38
trmancoFrom: Jim AlichinJul 21 23:38
trmancoSent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 8:38 AMJul 21 23:39
trmancoTo: Bill Gates; Steve BalimerJul 21 23:39
trmancoSubject: losing our way...Jul 21 23:39
trmancoTftis is a rant.           I’m sorry.Jul 21 23:39
trmancoI am not sure how the company last sight of what matters to our customers (bothJul 21 23:39
trmancobusiness and home) the most, but in my view we lost our way.                      I think our teamsJul 21 23:39
trmancolest sight of what bug-free means, what resilience means, what full scenarios mean,Jul 21 23:39
trmancowhat secur~ty means, what performance means, how important current applicationsJul 21 23:39
trmancoare, and really understanding what the most important problems are customers faceJul 21 23:39
trmancoare.       I see lots of random features and some great vision, but that doesn’tJul 21 23:39
trmancotranslate tnto great products.Jul 21 23:39
trmancoI would buy a Mao today if I was not working at Microsoft.                      :f you run theJul 21 23:39
trmancoequivalent of VPC on a MAC you get access to casioally all Windows applicationJul 21 23:39
trmancosoftware (although not the hardware) .                 Apple did not lose their way.       You mustJul 21 23:39
trmancowatch this new videc helow.               I know this doesn’t show anything for businesses, butJul 21 23:39
trmancomy point is about the philosophy that Apple uses.                     They think scenario.  They thinkJul 21 23:39
trmancosimple.      They think fast.          I know there is nothing hugely deep in this.Jul 21 23:39
trmancotttp: //www. apple. oom/ilife/videc/ilifeO432C.htm.lJul 21 23:39
trmancoI must tell you everything in my soul tells me that we should do what I called planJul 21 23:39
trmanco ~b) yesterday.           We need a simple fast storage system.            LH is a pig and I don’t seeJul 21 23:39
trmancoany solution to this problem.                If we are to rise to the chsllenqe of Linux andJul 21 23:39
trmancoApple, we need to start takrng the lessons of “scenario, simple, fast” to heart.Jul 21 23:40
trmancoI~Jul 21 23:40
schestowitzOldJul 21 23:40
schestowitzI have it in BN (Wiki)Jul 21 23:41
schestowitzThere's more from AllchinJul 21 23:41
trmancoah crapJul 21 23:42
trmancowhich ones haven't you seen?Jul 21 23:42
schestowitzSee the WikiJul 21 23:43
schestowitzUnder Apple for exampleJul 21 23:43
schestowitzI have hundreds moreJul 21 23:44
trmancoyeah, seen itJul 21 23:45
trmancohttp://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/Microsoft_recommends_AppleJul 21 23:45
MinceRallchin talks as if they ever cared or knew about performance or securityJul 21 23:47
MinceRthese idiots really eat their own hype?Jul 21 23:47
trmanco           Our WeaponsJul 21 23:50
trmanco ̄ Windows XPJul 21 23:50
trmanco ̄ MPXPJul 21 23:50
trmanco ̄ Movie MakerJul 21 23:50
trmanco ̄ Plus!Jul 21 23:50
trmanco ̄ EtcJul 21 23:50
trmanco° etcJul 21 23:50
trmancomovie maker, wtfJul 21 23:50
MinceRplus! wow, what a weaponJul 21 23:51
trmancohttp://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011607/7000/PX07000.pdfJul 21 23:52
schestowitztrmanco: is it in the wiki already?Jul 21 23:54
schestowitz"Friends don't let friends use Real"Jul 21 23:54
trmancodon't knowJul 21 23:54
schestowitztrmanco: it's here: http://boycottnovell.com/wiki/index.php/RealNetworksJul 21 23:55
schestowitzI knew it was familarJul 21 23:55
trmancohaJul 21 23:56
trmancoI see they really like javaJul 21 23:56
schestowitzComes has high PageRank in BNJul 21 23:56
schestowitzYes, so much that they want to "piss on" itJul 21 23:56
trmanco"steal java"Jul 21 23:56
trmancodo  you have that one schestowitz ?Jul 21 23:57
trmancoI can't copy itJul 21 23:57
trmancohttp://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011107/PX_2768.pdfJul 21 23:57
trmanco"screw sun", "steal java", "cross platform will never work", these people are/were insaneJul 21 23:59
schestowitzNo, too saneJul 22 00:01
schestowitzAnd evilJul 22 00:01
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_Hicham_wwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahJul 22 00:45
schestowitzCatharsisJul 22 00:48
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trmancoanybody know who crazyjoefriday is?Jul 22 11:45
taconenoJul 22 11:46
taconetroll ?Jul 22 11:46
trmancodon't think soJul 22 11:46
schestowitzI /might/ know who that isJul 22 11:47
schestowitzBut the IPs don't alignJul 22 11:47
trmancowho?Jul 22 11:48
trmancowong?Jul 22 11:48
trmancoit isn'tJul 22 11:49
schestowitzNopeJul 22 11:54
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trmancohttp://edge-op.org/iowa/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011607/8000/PX08592.pdfJul 22 14:46
trmancoahJul 22 14:46
trmancosee itJul 22 14:46
trmancomicrosoft loves linuxJul 22 14:46
trmancothey even try to "debunk myths" and compare it with there stuffJul 22 14:47
schestowitzI have it in BN as textJul 22 14:56
schestowitzAround Jan09Jul 22 14:56
schestowitzsearch site for "08592.pdf"Jul 22 14:56
trmancoah okJul 22 14:57
schestowitzOlive is a lossless leader in digital audio < http://blogs.ft.com/techblog/2009/07/olive-is-a-lossless-leader-in-digital-audio/ >Jul 22 15:02
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trmancowho uses moc to play audio? :-PJul 22 18:36
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schestowitzWhat’s to like? http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2009/07/12/whats-to-like/Jul 22 18:39
schestowitztrmanco: how much RAM d'ju have?Jul 22 18:39
trmanco1 GBJul 22 18:40
schestowitzUbuntu is almost 5. Wow. http://tuxarena.blogspot.com/2009/07/3-years-ago-ubuntu-dapper-drake.htmlJul 22 18:44
schestowitztrmanco: use guiJul 22 18:44
schestowitzxmmsJul 22 18:44
trmancoyeah, I use audaciousJul 22 18:44
trmancowas just trying moc outJul 22 18:44
trmancoyou never know when you can be left in a console mode onlyJul 22 18:44
schestowitzI use use global shortcuts (keyboard)Jul 22 18:49
schestowitzAmarok gobbles 250MBJul 22 18:49
trmancokde has better integrationJul 22 18:50
trmancoyeah, because of it's mysql backendJul 22 18:50
schestowitztrmanco: new:Jul 22 18:51
schestowitzComplete Shell Audio Player for Linux Based on Ncurses: CMus [WOW!] <  http://webupd8.blogspot.com/2009/07/complete-shell-audio-player-for-linux.html >Jul 22 18:52
schestowitz[seen seconds ago]Jul 22 18:52
trmancothey look very similarJul 22 18:52
schestowitzMaybe same codebaseJul 22 18:57
schestowitzLots of reuse underneathJul 22 18:57
schestowitzGPL powaJul 22 18:57
trmanco:-)Jul 22 18:58
schestowitzSlow Firefox 3.5 start up time < http://www.h-online.com/open/Slow-Firefox-3-5-start-up-time--/news/113757 > Is this true?Jul 22 20:16
trmancoyes, on windowsJul 22 20:20
schestowitz:-DJul 22 20:20
trmancoI usually optimize my *.sqliteJul 22 20:22
MinceRtrmanco: Meta-Object Compiler can play audio? :>Jul 22 20:22
trmancoyeahJul 22 20:22
trmanconoJul 22 20:22
trmancowaitJul 22 20:22
trmancoit's not called that is it?Jul 22 20:22
trmancomusic on console MinceRJul 22 20:22
MinceR:)Jul 22 20:22
MinceRi know the Qt moc and no otherJul 22 20:22
schestowitzSlow for some people :-( http://synergenerator.blogspot.com/2009/07/pclinuxos-phoenix-test-run.html (PCLinuxOS Phoenix Test Run )Jul 22 20:24
trmancoschestowitz, how did you add threaded comment to you theme on bn?Jul 22 20:45
schestowitzPlugin.. Chinese oneJul 22 20:48
trmancohttp://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/wordpress-thread-comment/installation/Jul 22 20:48
trmancothis one?Jul 22 20:48
trmancowordpress has it's own threading since 2.7Jul 22 20:49
schestowitzNot compatible with the plguin I reckonJul 22 20:56
trmancookJul 22 21:19
schestowitzThe Pointlessness of Google’s Chrome OS < http://www.internetling.com/2009/07/22/the-pointlessness-of-googles-chrome-os/ >Jul 22 21:19
trmancotwitter is getting on my nervsJul 22 21:47
trmanconerves*Jul 22 21:47
trmancostupid site is slowJul 22 21:47
trmancocan't they a least get a better infrastructure? geezeJul 22 21:48
schestowitzI wonder the sameJul 22 21:51
schestowitzDigg lost me when they got messed up with errorsJul 22 21:51
schestowitzNot just the trollsJul 22 21:51
schestowitzI would have still submitted otherwiseJul 22 21:51
schestowitzIt's fixed nowJul 22 21:51
schestowitzToo lateJul 22 21:51
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trmancooh geezeJul 23 11:11
trmancowhat a lie -> "These are folks who will berate you for buying a piece of software or owning an iPod"Jul 23 11:11
trmanco"I say enough is enough. We should put our collective feet down as far as strident demands from complete non-participants in the community go. We should say "no" to Faux FLOSS Fundamentalism, and people like Roy Schestowitz, Sam Varghese, "Penguin Pete", "Jason" of mono-nono, and the like, as well as the assortment of associated and sympathetic trolls who post endless anonymous comments to blog postings they dislike and start up flame warsJul 23 11:13
trmanco on development lists."Jul 23 11:13
schestowitzHypocrisyJul 23 11:14
schestowitzAre Speakers for FOSS Actually FOSS Supporters?   http://ping.fm/I29DgJul 23 11:14
trmancohttp://opensourcetogo.blogspot.com/2009/07/real-floss-community-and-faux-floss.htmlJul 23 11:15
trmancoI'm sure you have laid an eye on this, right?Jul 23 11:15
trmancohere is a reasonable response -> http://opensourcetogo.blogspot.com/2009/07/real-floss-community-and-faux-floss.html?showComment=1248296876100#c4914824465767079710Jul 23 11:16
taconei'm getting sick of himJul 23 11:22
taconehttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/23/coming-out-of-the-closet/Jul 23 11:23
schestowitzNovell and Microsoft people in his comments. Haha.Jul 23 11:24
trmancothey say "we" don't go to conferences, hell, if I lived in a damn place where conferences were naturally common, I would be thereJul 23 11:25
trmancobtw, I might go to Debian day here in Portugal :-PJul 23 11:26
trmancohttp://opensourcetogo.blogspot.com/2009/07/real-floss-community-and-faux-floss.html?showComment=1248334803532#c1878621060386614308Jul 23 11:27
trmancotacone, is there any, "discuss mono problems" list?Jul 23 11:44
taconetrmanco: http://mono-nono.com/bbpress/Jul 23 11:46
taconei think that's the best place for now. it's a forum, but a light and fast one.Jul 23 11:46
trmancoyeah, I'm already registeredJul 23 11:46
taconehttp://lunduke.com/?p=730Jul 23 11:52
schestowitzSame bunchJul 23 12:05
schestowitzanti-RMS from the start (ages ago)Jul 23 12:05
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trmancowhere?Jul 23 13:33
taconebn irc channelJul 23 13:48
tacone2:38 PMJul 23 13:49
trmancoah okJul 23 13:52
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schestowitzSee http://nowwhatthe.blogspot.com/2009/07/about-akademy-2009.htmlJul 23 14:32
schestowitzAh!!Jul 23 14:33
schestowitzThank goodnewssJul 23 14:33
schestowitzNo elephant in the room, as the saying goesJul 23 14:33
schestowitzFolks, you should see the E-mails I'm receiving.Jul 23 14:33
schestowitzThe trouble's backJul 23 15:22
schestowitzWTF: http://my.opera.com/BoycottMicrosoft/blog/Jul 23 15:25
schestowitzTHis due puts a Windows Swastika in there. Makes us look like radical groups.Jul 23 15:25
schestowitz /sue/dude/Jul 23 15:25
MinceRschestowitz: can't you just kickban these trolls?Jul 23 15:33
MinceRat least 2 have revealed themselves already.Jul 23 15:34
schestowitzI'll give you op when he gets bored and sods offJul 23 15:34
MinceRhe won't get bored, he's a troll or an astroturfer.Jul 23 15:35
schestowitzMinceR: he's not being abusiveJul 23 15:45
schestowitzWe can't ban him yetJul 23 15:45
schestowitzI'll op you, but don't do anythingJul 23 15:45
MinceRhe started being abusive long ago.Jul 23 15:45
MinceR165253 < lefty_> kiss my ass, Mincer.Jul 23 15:46
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schestowitzWait till next oneJul 23 15:47
taconelefty again ?Jul 23 15:48
taconei'm starting to think he likes you, royJul 23 15:48
taconeMinceR: ignore himJul 23 15:49
MinceRi'd use the op's ignore, but schestowitz seems to want to keep him around.Jul 23 15:49
taconewasn't him banned ?Jul 23 15:50
taconeschestowitz: why don't you ban him ?Jul 23 15:51
schestowitzJust throw him outJul 23 15:51
MinceRso should i ban him or should i not?Jul 23 15:51
schestowitzHe's starting to do the intimidation spielJul 23 15:51
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schestowitzInteresting claims http://www.stefanoforenza.com/interesting-claims/Jul 23 19:34
schestowitzI have the DownloadSquad leader trolling me now repeatedly.. https://twitter.com/grobertson/status/2802818404Jul 23 19:44
schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/grobertson/status/2790208897Jul 23 19:45
schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/grobertson/status/2784545859Jul 23 19:45
schestowitzhttps://twitter.com/grobertson/status/2784515643Jul 23 19:45
schestowitzI'm not even talking to this guyJul 23 19:45
schestowitzIt's the same with some Microsoft people...Jul 23 19:45
fewatwitter has a block function for a reasonJul 23 20:12
schestowitzNo, no... these are funny to see and ignore. Sometimes the OOXML goons speak among themselves like schools girls about mischievous things and then ping my accountJul 23 20:20
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schestowitz<parolang> I have to stop reading stupid blogs.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> But, there are extremists in the free software community, and people are painting all of us in that color.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> And I'm worried that maybe I'm supporting the wrong movement.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> parolang: the extreme blogs can be ignoredJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> so_solid_moo: Well...what about that lefty guy on planet gnome?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> what about him?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> "But, there are extremists in the free software community, and people are painting all of us in that color."Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> He is one of the guys doing the painting, to the GNOME developers.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> Anyway, I think there are enough people who care about freedom.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> is he using GIMP to do the painting?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> But, the extremists worry me.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> heh, no ideaJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> It's like that boycottnovel guy, he's a wackoJul 23 22:43
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schestowitz<sdubois> how so?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> How is the boycottnovel guy a wacko?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> yeah, what's his name?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitzparolang> Are you disagreeing with me or do you not know about him?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> i don't know anything about himJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> parolang: even if you don't like his opinions, calling him a wacko is a bit unfairJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> Roy SchestowitzJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> so_solid_moo: Are you saying that it's always unfair to call anyone a wacko or that it's unfair to call *him* a wacko?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> parolang: not always, but usually. It's a very easy way to dismiss people's opinions.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> My opinion is based on considering his views and finding them delusional.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> parolang: hiJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> parolang: can you give me an example of him being a wackoJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> his site is kind of clutteredJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: hi, didn't realize that you're hereJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: Please, stop being a wacko :)Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> Lefty is anti-FSJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> Look back at historyJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> They smear FS people... RMS tooJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> I agree the guy is a demagogue and he's continuing on way to long with this.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> But, I don't see him being anti-FS.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> He bombards my blog with commentsJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> Over 100/day soemtimesJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> ObsessionJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: And you need to stop with the paranoia and the conspiracy theories and the insinuations.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: There are a few things you say that I liked, but they are getting fewer and fewer.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> Examples, please?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> Examples of things I liked?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<popey> hi so_solid_moo :)Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> o/Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz* so_solid_moo passes the popcornJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<popey> *chink*Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: I liked when you talked about GNU users trying to defend their own territory.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: Because that's exactly what it is.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> And that's why we're afraid of Microsoft.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: But here's the difference.  I'm not *anti-Mono*.  I'm anti Microsoft and anti proprietary software.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: I think de Izaca does believe in free software principles.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> Mono empowers MicrosoftJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> It represents a threatJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: I think he's mistaken, but that's a difference of opinion.Jul 23 22:43
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schestowitz<jemarch> re gnudistsJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> see mono-nono siteJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<so_solid_moo> just in time for fun, jemarchJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: mono-nono is a lot more sober than you areJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> parolang: he doesJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> But he's misledJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<jemarch> so_solid_moo: mono fun?Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: Well, he need to have a little more empathy for people whose hearts are in the right placeJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> eh, sorry if the rest of you consider spamJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> *this spamJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> schestowitz: thanks for all the [News] in comp.os.linux.advocacy :PJul 23 22:43
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schestowitz<so_solid_moo> speaking of spam :DJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> i don't mind itJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> it'Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<sdubois> s just, a lotJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> sdubois: ywJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: A greater threat to the free software community than Microsoft's patents on mono technology is this false antagonism that creates a divide *within* the community.  We're all on the same side here, even if we disagree on how to advance the cause.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> There was always frictionJul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: I'm *afraid* that the users of Ubuntu and GNOME are going to find out the hard way, but that doesn't mean I have anything against the Ubunutu and GNOME people, or the developers.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<schestowitz> That's nothing new; intensity may varyJul 23 22:43
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schestowitz<parolang> schestowitz: Well, you have to distinguish between the uncompromising approach of RMS, playing "bad cop" and often winning, and making out that everyone who isn't for us is against us.Jul 23 22:43
schestowitz<parolang> Anyway, gotta go, afkJul 23 22:43
schestowitz===Jul 23 22:43
schestowitzgfrom #gnuJul 23 22:43
schestowitzLefty's smearsJul 23 22:44
oiaohmAs I had said he has tunnel version.Jul 23 22:47
MinceRvisionJul 23 22:47
trmancothat was lefty?Jul 23 22:48
schestowitzNo.Jul 23 22:49
schestowitzBut he's looking for dirtJul 23 22:49
schestowitzDon't feed him, everJul 23 22:49
trmancohe is just another guy with his opinionJul 23 22:49
schestowitzTrying to kill others'Jul 23 22:50
trmancoso what about microsoft's results?Jul 23 22:50
trmanconothing?Jul 23 22:50
schestowitzWhat do you mean?Jul 23 22:51
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2009/07/23/microsoft-results-analysis-09/Jul 23 22:51
trmancoI've seen it on colaJul 23 22:52
trmancoyeah, that was itJul 23 22:52
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fewadell only has 1 ubuntu-running computer in dell outletJul 23 23:08
fewaa few weeks ago they had at least 100Jul 23 23:08
schestowitzTiago Manco < relative?Jul 23 23:47
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trmancoyeahJul 24 00:03
trmancomy cousinJul 24 00:03
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schestowitzJust got this long message:Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz"Okay, a lot has been said on this blog, and there is some that I approve of, and a great deal that concerns me, and all of it brings up a lot of thoughts about my own feelings and loyalties.  People are not the same, and have opinions that are all across the spectrum.  But what concerns me most right now is how one person in particular seems to be painting a lot of us with the same brush, and more importantly, how there migJul 24 14:58
schestowitzht be a kernel of truth to it.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitzLet me tell you about myself.  I call the operating system GNU/Linux out of pride and respect for the GNU Project.  I call it "free software", because I believe it is exactly the freedom component of this operating system that makes it special.  And I have a great dealJul 24 14:58
schestowitzof admiration for Richard Stallman and for what he has been able to accomplish.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitzAll the same, I think that in the free software community the lines between advocacy and zealotry are often crossed too easily.  I find many of the conclusions that Roy here jumps to hasty, and this concerns me.  And this only serves to support many of the things that critics has been saying, and puts me in a position where I don't know if I dislike what they have been saying because the statements are false or because I wisJul 24 14:58
schestowitzh they weren't true.  But first let me put up a few points of agreement."Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz"DEGREES OF SEXISMJul 24 14:58
schestowitzApparently, a lot of this controversy started due to a poorly performed joke that RMS made at a conference to GNOME and KDE developers.  I think the details of this joke, and why it has been found offensive, have been nit-picked to death, so I won't get into it here.  But calling RMS sexist, or even continuing to insinuate that the man is sexist, I think really requires some perspective.  In fact, lets begin a list starting Jul 24 14:58
schestowitzfrom the most sexist thing you can do to least, and see where RMS's joke belongs on this ladder.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  1.  Rape and physical abuse of women.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  2.  Instituting laws and rules that take away the rights of women.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  3.  Discrimination as an employer or leader of an organization.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  4.  Misogyny.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  5.  Emotional abuse or tormenting of women.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  6.  Acting on sexist stereotypes.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  7.  Treating women as physical objects (e.g., of lust).Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  8.  Mean-spirited jokes directed at women.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  9.  A poorly worded joke said at a conference that makes women feel uncomfortable.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz  10. Using the words "he" and "his" as a gender neutral pronoun.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitzSo, where does RMS fall in this list?  By a lot of the comments I've been hearing, I would get the impression that RMS has made an offense somewhere near the top of this list.  But actually, I'd put RMS at level 9 of sexism.Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz"Jul 24 14:58
schestowitz"Now, contrary to what Roy and others have said, I actually don't scorn critics at all for speaking up about this.  If they believe this was a serious lapse of etiquette, then it is their right to speak up about their feelings on the matter.  And if women are offended by this because they are women, then I think they should also speak up.  That's fine, but so long as you see it as a violation of etiquette rather than somethiJul 24 14:59
schestowitzng worse.  Again, you need perspective.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitzAt best, I would consider the event embarrasing for the free software community.  But there are other messages out there that are saying that he free software community needs to move on, or that we should abandon free software principles and endorse the apathy of LinusJul 24 14:59
schestowitzTorvalds.  Well, I disagree.  But if I'm embarrassed by the event, why would I still admire this man?Jul 24 14:59
schestowitzDEGREES OF SUPPORTING THE CAUSEJul 24 14:59
schestowitzTo understand, lets look at another list, this time in the reverse direction.  We all support the free software movement, don't we?  If you don't, then none of this should matter to you.  But here are ways of supporting the free software community in order to least effective to most effective.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz  10. Chatting about "Linux" on IRC, twitter, blogs, and web forums.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   9. Installing GNU/Linux on your own computer, and telling others about it.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   8. Helping other people install GNU/Linux.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   7. Writing fixing bugs and contributing documentation to the community.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   6. Helping new users install and run free software on their computes.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   5. Working on a minor free software application and contributing it to the pool.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   4. Working on a major free software application and contributing it to the pool.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   3. Working on a high priority application and contributing it to the pool.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   2. Starting and leading a major free software desktop project for the purpose preventing the free software community depending on a proprietary toolkit being used by a competing project.Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz   1. Quitting your job, starting the GNU Project, begin working on the basic free software needed fJul 24 14:59
schestowitzor the development of an operating system, establish the legal foundation for free software by writing the licensing, start the Free Software Foundation to give the community a legal backbone, stay true to your principles, never compromise, never give in, and take abuse from members of the community for doing exactly what it takes to win."Jul 24 14:59
schestowitz"Okay, so I'm biased.  Number 1 is obviously RMS, but for the sake of the cause that *I* support, there is no one more deserving of that slot.  But notice who Number 2 is?  Come on, does anyone remember their history?  That's right, the leader of the dreaded Mono projectJul 24 15:00
schestowitzwas also the instigater of the GNOME project.  In fact, even before GNOME, Miguel de Izaca was a GNU developer and contributed GNU software like the Midnight Commander.  Then, while developing GNOME, he started a company developing and supporting free software.  Now why would he have gone to all this hassle if Miguel didn't care about free software principles?  Come on, people! when a contradiction is staring at you square iJul 24 15:00
schestowitzn the face, admit to it!  Reason with it!  Learn from it!Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzI don't know de Izaca personally, but in all probability he likely *still* believes in free software principles.  But, you ask, how is this possible when Mono is this huge threat to the free software community?  First, remind yourself that Mono software is all distributed under free software licenses.  Even now, working for Novel, Miguel is writing free software.  Could it be, just maybe, that Miguel disagrees with the patenJul 24 15:00
schestowitzt situation?"Jul 24 15:00
schestowitz"WHERE WE STANDJul 24 15:00
schestowitzAnd that's the thing, people have the *right* to disagree.  But even more importantly, *consult your lawyers!*  This is, fundamentally, a legal question, and one that people uneducated in law should stay out of.  I trust the opinion of the SFLC and the FSF, they have been theJul 24 15:00
schestowitzlegal backbone of the free software community from the beginning. And, I know that Canonical has consulted their lawyers, and Red Hat has consulted their lawyers, and so on and so forth.  That's what everyone should be doing.Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzBut in certain respects, patent problems isn't anything new to the free software community.  They are a huge problem because the patent process rewards the person who first patented the idea at the expense of your average free software developer who doesn't care about gettingJul 24 15:00
schestowitzan intellectual monopoly over a particular technique.  So the .NET framework isn't anything new in that respect.  If all else was equal, this would be just another case of crossing the bridge when we get there.Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzI'm as worried about Microsoft as the next GNU/Linux user.  But *hatred* of them is simply foolish at this point.  There is nothing personal about Microsoft.  They are a company in search of profit, and they are using everything they can to achieve that goal.  This makes companies remarkably predictable in this respect."Jul 24 15:00
schestowitz"But there are a few things we know about Microsoft.  We know that free software is a direct competitor to Microsoft software.  We know that free software has already cost Microsoft an untold amount of money. We know that the GNU/Linux system commoditizes the products thatJul 24 15:00
schestowitzMicrosoft is trying to profit by.  We know that the free software community is on their crosshairs.Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzIt's one thing to be paranoid, it's quite another to *know* they are out to get you.  But we shouldn't be fanatical.  We shouldn't be afraid.  We should just...*breathe*.  We don't have to fight Microsoft.  All we need to do is to continue working with the GNU project, the Free Software Foundation, the GNOME and KDE projects, and all the other wonderful free software projects out there to create a more perfect system.  BuildJul 24 15:00
schestowitz a solid foundation and no one can break you."Jul 24 15:00
schestowitz"KNOW WHO THE ENEMIES AREJul 24 15:00
schestowitzBut what we don't need here is this *false antagonism* that is being spread around, from blog to blog, dividing the community, creating animosity between people writing software under the same set of licenses.  *We're all on the same side here.*  Aren't we?  The MonoJul 24 15:00
schestowitzteam isn't the enemy here.  If Mono turns out being patent encumbered, then we will learn we just can't use their software.  The free software community has dealt with worse before.  I'm not going to encourage the use of Mono myself, but if other people have differentJul 24 15:00
schestowitzlegal opinions, and believe they are safe from Microsoft, then I hope they're right!  But know who our enemies really are: Microsoft and proprietary software.  *Not* free software developers!  Even if you think their lawyers aren't as smart as your lawyers :)Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzI know a while back there was this meme on Planet GNOME that said "I'm not afraid of people writing code" and because that meme spread widely that is pretty sad, really.  It's a consequence of this false antagonism that I'm talking about.  Be honest.  Be sincere.  Be true about your feelings, and you won't have any opinions worth spreading a meme about:Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzI'm afraid of software patents and Microsoft."Jul 24 15:00
schestowitzENDJul 24 15:00
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trmancohttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/24/on-linus-and-free-software/comment-page-1/#comment-635Jul 24 19:24
trmancoit's still awaiting moderationJul 24 19:25
trmancoI don't really do comments, but this was an exception :-)Jul 24 19:25
taconeuntil it get approved we can't see it :)Jul 24 19:28
trmancoyeah I knowJul 24 19:30
trmancowan't my cookieJul 24 19:30
trmanco?Jul 24 19:30
trmancoit might work :-PJul 24 19:30
taconepaste it on a pastebinJul 24 19:31
trmancohttp://open-mania.pastebin.com/m61bbd6c6Jul 24 19:33
trmancoI have a private one :-PJul 24 19:33
taconepft :)Jul 24 19:36
taconelemme readJul 24 19:36
trmancowhat do you mean?Jul 24 19:36
taconepft for the "private" pastebinJul 24 19:37
taconenice point. well, it's easy to find reasons to hate microsoft btw :)Jul 24 19:37
trmanco:)Jul 24 19:37
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fewaMinceR, kick _Mutex_Jul 25 07:34
fewawe need more ops...Jul 25 07:35
fewawhy the hell isnt *.nsw.bigpond.net.au banned?Jul 25 07:38
fewa<Trials> is _Mutex_Jul 25 08:19
fewa* [Trials] (n=teddy2@CPE-58-164-16-203.nsw.bigpond.net.au): ttfJul 25 08:19
oiaohmBecause nsw.bigpond.net.au could block me from connecting when I am down south fewaJul 25 08:43
oiaohmie nsw is a complete state of australiaJul 25 08:43
schestowitzfewa: yea, we have to judge by style, not just ISPJul 25 08:46
schestowitzHe has a very distinct tasteJul 25 08:46
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trmancoschestowitz, have you updated wordpress yet?Jul 25 12:53
schestowitzYes, last nightJul 25 12:53
schestowitzManuallyJul 25 12:53
trmancoah okJul 25 12:54
schestowitzI've also caught up with news, so I'm delighted. I will do Comes shortly.Jul 25 12:54
trmancobecause the exploit has been released to the wildJul 25 12:54
schestowitzI can imagine.Jul 25 12:54
trmancohttp://www.milw0rm.com/exploits/9250Jul 25 12:54
schestowitzStacy 3monkeys has been crackedJul 25 12:54
trmancowhat's that?Jul 25 12:55
schestowitz[boycottn@boycottnovell ~]$ uname -aJul 25 12:55
schestowitzLinux boycottnovell.com 2.6.18-128.1.10.el5xen #1 SMP Thu May 7 11:07:18 EDT 2009 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/LinuxJul 25 12:55
schestowitztrmanco: old buddy from DiggJul 25 12:55
schestowitzBack when I was a 'star' in Digg (2006) he was there tooJul 25 12:55
trmancohmmmJul 25 12:55
schestowitzWe still speak sometimes. He'sin DZone nowJul 25 12:55
schestowitzLooks like DDOS exploitJul 25 13:00
schestowitzFrom a cursory lookJul 25 13:00
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fewa<oiaohm> ie nsw is a complete state of australiaJul 25 16:23
fewaahhJul 25 16:23
fewanew south walesJul 25 16:23
fewanew sourth wales/telstraJul 25 16:24
fewa<Guest123> is in new sourth wales/telstraJul 25 17:48
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trmancohttp://bluwiki.com/go/Ipodhash/TakedownJul 25 18:04
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schestowitz"Update: It seems I'm not the only one connecting the dots here. Note the numerous trolling comments at the end of the article by someone called "Lefty", repeating over and over his favorite quote from Torvalds. It seems we may have victim number three: Sam Varghese."Jul 25 20:11
schestowitzhttp://thebeezspeaks.blogspot.com/2009/07/free-open-source-software-evangelist.htmlJul 25 20:11
schestowitzhttp://penguinpetes.com/b2evo/index.php?title=the_beez_nails_it&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1Jul 25 20:11
schestowitzPeople see what's up[Jul 25 20:11
schestowitzhttp://discuss.itwire.com/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=14668&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=77 "I would add to David's previous comment that any post that attempts to slander or defame any person's character in these forums will be deleted in whole or part. Calling someone a pathological liar for instance is not acceptable on this site. The offending poster will be warned and if the behaviour persists, the poster will be prevented from postinJul 25 20:20
schestowitzg directly to the forum."Jul 25 20:20
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schestowitzpwnage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5INo7W2P-Jk&NR=1Jul 25 23:11
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQHR-z3anio&NR=1Jul 25 23:18
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trmancohey look -> http://torrentfreak.com/bittorrent-behind-the-scenes-btjunkie-090725/Jul 26 20:21
trmancoubuntu is thereJul 26 20:21
trmancowowJul 26 20:30
trmancoway to go bingJul 26 20:30
trmancoit gives 0.33% of my visitsJul 26 20:30
trmancowhile google gives me over 67%Jul 26 20:31
schestowitzBda bingJul 26 20:33
schestowitzANd Bing is just MSN/LiveJul 26 20:33
schestowitzRenamed in a wayJul 26 20:33
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schestowitzFan mail:Jul 27 11:43
schestowitz"To my friend, Roy,Jul 27 11:43
schestowitzYou, Shane and Slated, amongst others (Stallman, Perens, Raymond, Ken Stark, the list is long), have been an inspiration to us, (the boots on the ground) *** has filled me in a quick email which has gone in a round-about fashion to get to me since where I'm at, no electronic communication is currently available. Currently, we're in a small celebration due to a private battle of sorts against a logging company which was tryinJul 27 11:43
schestowitzg to clear forest land in ***'s hometown.Jul 27 11:43
schestowitzOur small group (*** and myself) of militants or activists, for want of a better description, have access to each other's email so I ask *** to forward this to you. We are poor in material things, but rich in comraderie and substance. We are the people the main stream press forgets until we get in the way of so called progress. Nevertheless, we live what we believe in and expout.Jul 27 11:43
schestowitzYou, Shane and Slated's blogs opened up, like a gateway, areas of knowledge and information that we would have never found out about (it reminds me of the movie Matrix-the blue pill vs. the red pill). According to *** your website is under attack (DDoS and trolls) for saying what wrongs, abuses and criminal acts are being committed by corporations and main stream media. He also says that a possible paid troll may tie your weJul 27 11:43
schestowitzbsite and yourself in litigation.Jul 27 11:43
schestowitzYou must be doing something right when you're attacked in such fashion.Jul 27 11:43
schestowitzBut this is the crux of the message intended for you. No matter what happens, you have our complete support bar none. Please do not think this is just talk, we're willing to put our money where it can be useful. I've offered before and will continue offering without attribution, just knowing amongst ourselves that we did right where a wrong was inflicted is good enough for us."Jul 27 11:43
schestowitz\______   \ ____ ___.__. ____  _____/  |__/  |_ \      \   _______  __ ____ |  | |  |Jul 27 13:17
schestowitz|    |  _//  _ <   |  |/ ___\/  _ \   __\   __\/   |   \ /  _ \  \/ // __ \|  | |  |Jul 27 13:17
schestowitz|    |   (  <_> )___  \  \__(  <_> )  |  |  | /    |    (  <_> )   /\  ___/|  |_|  |__Jul 27 13:17
schestowitz|______  /\____// ____|\___  >____/|__|  |__| \____|__  /\____/ \_/  \___  >____/____/Jul 27 13:17
schestowitz         \/       \/         \/     Jul 27 13:17
oiaohmPitty ascii art does not live threw the font I am using.Jul 27 13:19
MinceRi think this isn't only a font issue -- what i see is pretty messy tooJul 27 13:29
MinceReven though i use a fixed-width fontJul 27 13:29
MinceRand i see no tabs (which don't work in irssi)Jul 27 13:29
schestowitzSOmone made this last yearJul 27 13:32
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trmancolook greatJul 27 14:22
trmancolooks*Jul 27 14:22
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schestowitzSomeone mailed me this:Jul 27 17:53
schestowitz"I find this hypocrisy revealing, since he accused you of deleting posts, etc..Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzHaving read Lefty's posts on his own blog the only way I can reconcile my views with his is if I totally ignore everything Microsoft has done in the past as meaningless, and turn a blind eye to everything Microsoft and its proxies are doing now as they continue to attack Linux and FOSS. Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzDoing that, and viewing Microsoft as only a "publicly owned company", and ignore that  I then can join Lefty in praising all things MONO/Microsoft.   Of course, by adopting that attitude I could have also viewed Exxon and Dick Lay in the same light.   Of course, "publicly owned" does NOT equate to publicly run. Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzMicrosoft is not a democracy, and while Ballmer reports to the significant stockholders (those who control the votes) he runs the company as he sees fit.   He and Gates created the "Technical Evangelists" gang, headed up by James Plamondon, and they continue to support that gang, even if they've obscured its membership by calling all their sales reps by the same name.Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzHere is the breakdown on who owns Microsoft: http://finance.yahoo.com/q/mh?s=MSFT At 739 million shares (about 8%) Bill Gates holds twice that of the next largest holder, Barclays Global Investors UK Holdings Ltd, at 340 million shares.Jul 27 17:54
schestowitz"when they post msgs that disagree with his opinions.Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzI found "Lefty"'s page because Hans Bezemer referenced it in his defense of RMS and his questions about the safety of using MONO:Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzhttp://thebeezspeaks.blogspot.com/2009/07/free-open-source-software-evangelist.htmlJul 27 17:54
schestowitzand now "Lefty" has taken up the task of attacking Hans with the usual accusations and diatribes.Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzOn Lefty's blog they are having a "love feast" self-congratulatory postings over what Linus said, even though Linus wasn't talking about MONO.   Their arrogance is astounding as they equate their views as "sophisticated" and those who oppose them as "haters" of whom Lefty says "need to be made to stop it, by all appropriate means".Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzNice way to get rid of opposing view points -- classify them as "haters" when they remind people Microsoft's past and present corrupt activities, then demand they be muzzled, especially from Microsoft's point of veiw."Jul 27 17:54
schestowitzSee the comments and updatesJul 27 17:55
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schestowitzBlyk goes bye-bye < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/27/bye_bye_blyk/ >Jul 27 20:49
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schestowitz"I see some interesting comments there.  Here is one from "John Dragoon":Jul 28 07:17
schestowitzhttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/27/novell-comments-on-microsoft-contributions/comment-page-1/#comment-749Jul 28 07:17
schestowitzI wonder if he is the same one who posts as "JohnD" on BN."Jul 28 07:17
schestowitz"Also, here is a much earlier post which is a responce to Dafty:Jul 28 07:17
schestowitzhttp://mono-nono.com/2009/07/12/and-the-knives-come-out/#comment-277Jul 28 07:17
schestowitzI had not read this before and it gives some insight into why Dafty has decided that Jason should be lumped in with the "Mark Fink brigade."  It's the same story as "Penguin Pete".  He posted asking for support, he was rebuffed and, voila, he then smears the one who refused to support him.  Also, it shows that Jason had some juicy items in his moderation queue which he decided against posting on grounds that he was "...quiteJul 28 07:17
schestowitz honestly scared to even start researching"."Jul 28 07:17
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fewa<BlackDog> is telstraJul 28 09:20
fewa* [BlackDog] (n=teddy2@121.213.206.105): ttfJul 28 09:20
fewaand same nicknameJul 28 09:20
fewaschestowitz,Jul 28 09:24
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schestowitzTUend out the stove is out of order probably because of a blown fuse only. I hate cold food :-|Jul 28 20:01
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fewasomebody needs to work on this: http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:WhatLinksHere/Microsoft_Open_Specification_Promise&limit=500Jul 29 09:06
fewaThe shills spend alot of time spamming patent FUDJul 29 09:07
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schestowitzThe troll carries on attacking FSF/SFLC: http://opensourcetogo.blogspot.com/2009/07/microsoft-gpl-and-nonsense-from-folks.htmlJul 29 13:01
schestowitzFrom the comments: "Lefty, I don't need standing to point out that the terms of the GPL were violated. The terms of the GPL are clear. You are spreading bad information."Jul 29 13:01
trmancoyeahJul 29 13:02
trmancoI lad of mine (portuguese) pointed it to me earlierJul 29 13:02
schestowitzHe's obsessed with BNJul 29 13:02
trmancoI only read a couple of paragraphs thoughJul 29 13:02
trmancoskipped to the commentJul 29 13:03
trmancohttp://twitter.com/#search?q=Microsoft-YahooJul 29 13:04
trmancomicrhoo it part of the twitter trendJul 29 13:04
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schestowitzhttp://thebeezspeaks.blogspot.com/2009/07/free-open-source-software-evangelist.html "Update: Although he comes from "a family of lawyers", "Lefty" admits breaking the law by publishing Richard Stallman's emails. In short, his daddy might have some pro deo work on his hands in the near future if RMS decides to sue him. Go get 'em, Dick! "Jul 29 20:15
schestowitz"RMS told me in email he isn't even interested in speaking about any of this 'sexism'/emails controversy, he says it will only draw more attention to it."Jul 29 20:23
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schestowitzHmmmmm :-)(Jul 29 20:57
schestowitz"I'm unable to log in to BoycottNovell's Wordpress.  I've even triedJul 29 20:57
schestowitzresetting the password.Jul 29 20:57
schestowitzI'll look into it in what little additional depth I can tomorrow.Jul 29 20:57
schestowitzKeep up the great work and always remember to give a nod (URL) to theJul 29 20:57
schestowitzoriginal technologies that M$ wants to drown out."Jul 29 20:57
schestowitzMaybe I suspended the wrong accounts... highly improbableJul 29 20:57
schestowitz"I have had not much time as of late, I´m sorry I dont comment too much in BN but vote on the posts and give them thumbs up. Seems the pro-microsoft had a better place to try to get the facts right (conrol of information) and is the mono-nono.com site."Jul 29 22:41
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Jul 30 08:24:00 2009
*Now talking on #boycottnovell-socialJul 30 08:24
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social is: Communication about anything, including Microsoft, Novell, and Free software [publicly logged]Jul 30 08:24
*Topic for #boycottnovell-social set by schestowitz at Mon Mar 16 02:04:07 2009Jul 30 08:24
schestowitzSwedes miss Capri after GPS gaffe http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8173308.stmJul 30 08:30
fewahttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ol5IrnYIfI0Jul 30 09:13
fewaThe Billboard Liberation Front today announced a major new advertising improvement campaign executed on behalf of clients AT&T and the National Security Agency. Focusing on billboards in the San Francisco area, this improvement action is designed to promote and celebrate the innovative collaboration of these two global communications giants.Jul 30 09:13
fewa"This campaign is an extraordinary rendition of a public-private partnership," observed BLF spokesperson Blank DeCoverly. "These two titans of telecom have a long and intimate relationship, dating back to the age of the telegraph. In these dark days of Terrorism, that should be a comfort to every law-abiding citizen with nothing to hide."Jul 30 09:13
schestowitzCute picture; http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/200x/2009/07/30/Prairie-DogJul 30 09:30
fewaThere are tons of those thing near Devil's Mount National Monument, aka a close encounter of a third kindJul 30 09:48
schestowitzthird kind=LSDJul 30 09:48
schestowitzHallucinationsJul 30 09:48
fewathe movie featured the placeJul 30 09:48
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1MuT_KSOo4Jul 30 09:49
fewahttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devils_Tower_National_MonumentJul 30 09:49
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schestowitzbblJul 30 15:15
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schestowitzI am going to move into an apartment with better view and higher away from pollution in 3-4 weeks :-)Jul 30 17:39
tacone1that's good for youJul 30 17:39
trmancomicrosoft plants more shit in Portugal - http://www.jornaldenegocios.pt/index.php?template=SHOWNEWS&id=380216Jul 30 17:52
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trmancohttp://tek.sapo.pt/noticias/negocios/aliancas_da_microsoft_decididas_em_portugal_1009160.htmlJul 30 17:56
schestowitzWhat dos it say?Jul 30 18:00
trmancoit says that microsoft is going to create a unit of global alliances with HQ in portugalJul 30 18:02
schestowitzThanks.Jul 30 18:06
schestowitzMI5 website vuln builds mountain out of molehill < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/07/30/mi5_website_vuln/ >Jul 30 18:13
schestowitzOne Stimulus Response: Fake News < http://www.prwatch.org/node/8478 >Jul 30 18:48
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fewakik cjJul 31 00:52
fewapersonal attacks deserve kickingJul 31 00:53
fewa<cj> haha.  if you visit http://www.linux-mag.com/cache/7439/1.html and forward-search for "ass" you find a reference to schestowitzJul 31 00:53
fewamwh, your choiceJul 31 00:54
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schestowitzWe have stalkers: http://verofakto.blogspot.com/2009/07/what-wacky-web-we-weave.htmlJul 31 10:18
schestowitzAlso this: http://verofakto.blogspot.com/2009/07/what-lies-beneath.htmlJul 31 10:19
taconealias elektroshock ?Jul 31 10:19
schestowitzCould this be an attack blog from who I think it is?Jul 31 10:20
schestowitzCause he used to have many anonymous attack blogsJul 31 10:21
schestowitzAgainst other peopleJul 31 10:21
schestowitzSo there's history here.Jul 31 10:23
taconebelieve its leftyJul 31 10:25
taconejust a guess.Jul 31 10:25
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trmancooh linux.comJul 31 12:52
trmancoon*Jul 31 12:52
schestowitzWHat about it?Jul 31 12:56
trmancoI marked as spam a guy who criticized you, accidentally. His post was hosted on linux.comJul 31 13:09
schestowitzWhich guy?Jul 31 13:10
schestowitzTrackback?Jul 31 13:11
schestowitzThere is one BN hater who writes in the linux.com blog thingJul 31 13:11
trmancojon reaganJul 31 13:12
trmancohttp://blog.jjtcomputing.co.uk/2009/07/29/arch-linux-2009-02/Jul 31 13:14
trmancoI might change to this distroJul 31 13:14
trmancoit's more up do dateJul 31 13:14
trmancoit's how i like thingsJul 31 13:14
trmancobleeding edge I guessJul 31 13:14
trmancothe next snapshot should be here soon, right?Jul 31 13:15
trmancomehJul 31 13:15
trmancowrong channelJul 31 13:15
schestowitzRegarding that attack blog, I hear that "it has the ring of [that person], def.  someone else is also working on it though, its collaborative, IMHO.  he always has little toadies and flunkies, though."Jul 31 13:33
trmancohttp://www.securitytracker.com/alerts/2009/Jul/1022630.htmlJul 31 13:42
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schestowitzWe might have some leaks on VMware soon:Jul 31 22:21
schestowitz"Well, I don't know what you can do with so little I provided but I'm in a process of getting together more information as they completely failed to address unjustified firing in my case."Jul 31 22:21
schestowitz"I'm still waiting for a response from one lawyer to see if they'll do anything at all. They re-offered me a separation agreement twice since January. One month pay is too little for 9 months of mental torture under incompetent bully boss, my long hours on Christmas day, New Year when I was covering for a coworker on vacation, and other issues. Not enough to keep my mouth shut. So chances are you'll hear from me some more."Jul 31 22:21
schestowitz"For now let's keep it anonymised and later perhaps we'll be able to use some names. I still have connections back in the company and am even exploring a possibility to start a website where people could post anonymously or include any documents exposing fraud that they turned out to be."Jul 31 22:21
fewahttp://wikileaks.orgJul 31 22:23
schestowitzI know.Jul 31 22:24
fewathey know what they are doingJul 31 22:25
schestowitzIt's VMwareJul 31 22:26
schestowitzThe Microsoft-dominated oneJul 31 22:27
fewajust look at the first screen-shot http://www.vmware.com/products/ws/screens.htmlJul 31 22:27
fewaso obviously put there by a microsoft personJul 31 22:27
fewahttp://www.vmware.com/files/images/screens_workstation/snapshots_large.jpgJul 31 22:27
fewawell not completely obviousJul 31 22:28
fewabut trying to take attention away from browser anti-trust stuffJul 31 22:28
schestowitzUnlikelyJul 31 22:37
schestowitzJust Windows being ubiquitous, one might argueJul 31 22:37
fewabut why the browser thing being centerpiece?Jul 31 22:37
fewajust first thought?Jul 31 22:38
fewayeah ur prob rightJul 31 22:38
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